Optimal Force Feedback Settings for Le Mans Ultimate | Backed by MoTeC Data!

[@ElroyBartnig]

Great video! I always had the feeling that the FFB was off in LMU. Now I know why! I'm going to try this 🙌🏼

[@GSSimRacing]

Let me know what you think when you try the settings.

[@EdsonSouzaSimraceChanel]

Excellent video, enlightening and this will help a lot, thanks for the content.

[@GSSimRacing]

Your very welcome, and thank you for the kind words.

[@fan2hd277]

I‘ll be damned! When i started sim racing with my Simucube 2 Pro I had it set at 15NM and adjusted in game based purely on the feedback i got from the wheel. Then by diving into settings etc I subscribed to the 100% FFB wheelbase side but I could never get an overall satisfying FFB as some spikes were just too hard to control. Now I know my guts feeling was the way to go! Thank you for this analysis!

[@GSSimRacing]

I am glad that you could see and feel it for yourself. Hopefully, you have gotten a FFB that you like now, and that makes sense.

[@tonycarapetis7485]

Thanks man! Great vid. I've always wondered about this

[@GSSimRacing]

Let me know if you try the settings and how it feels. I'd be interested to see if people notice a difference.

[@CaptainCrunch99]

Excellent analysis, great work !

[@GSSimRacing]

Thanks mate, appreciate it.

[@Italocroo]

really interesting! I bought an R9 just a few months ago and I'm kind of new to Nm and stuff, so this was really insightful. happily just subscribed to the channel :) thanks for the vid!

[@NWA_1919]

Keep in mind that r9 you probably want to use 100% of the 9nm. He has 25nm, that is way too much if you have it set to 100%

[@Italocroo]

​@@NWA_1919 yeah but I think the principle he showed us applies to all types of bases, isn't it? Break this "rule" of putting 100% FFB in your wheel setting to get the most power in-game. I had my wheel setting at 100% and 45% in LMU, and yesterday I changed it to 65% in both settings and it felt a little better

[@NWA_1919]

@@Italocroo yes if the 65% is enough torque output for you, then the principle applies. For me i have an r16 and i use 100% from moza software, and 57% from game. If i lower output from the software, i feel like i don't get enough torque output from the wheelbase. And if i increase the game ffb, i start to get really close to clipping. But it is personal preference, how much torque you like. The main point is that you don't have the game set to really low, like 30%, and the software set to 100%. But using 100% from base, and 50-60% from game, is completely okay

[@GSSimRacing]

Thanks mate. With 9nm, crank the wheelbase up. I'd be interested to hear your settings and how you find it.

[@Throttler]

Great analysis, thank you. I was wondering, once you get the game output correctly, if you target a specific peak torque output -using the drivers setting- based on your personal preference, or if there is a certain behavior of the wheelbase that provides the dynamic performance and resolution. For instance if there is a sort of headroom amount for peak, while having sufficient holding torque, when lowering the driver setting below a certain point.

[@GSSimRacing]

So it seems that the 55%-60% range in LMU is avoiding almost all clipping, even in very high load corners. So my preference would be to set it there, and then look to the wheelbase to adjust the overall strength to your liking.

[@francescohelsing5031]

I will try with my Simagic Alpha U, thank you for the info

[@TenorPhan23]

I would be super interested in the results! I will also try it later.

[@GSSimRacing]

Very interested to hear your results.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@TenorPhan23 Let me know how it went.

[@francescohelsing5031]

@@TenorPhan23 I have done some testing and i find a good detail with 13.6NM and in game 55% with set 13.5NM capability. i think the DD is more detailed than the simagic Alpha U, ur graph is more detailed than mine

[@TenorPhan23]

loving this video but I am jealous of how quick your UI is. My UI in setup screen inside LMU takes like 10 seconds to respond each click

[@GSSimRacing]

Are you on the pub-share branch?

[@TenorPhan23]

@@GSSimRacing what is that?

[@GSSimRacing]

@@TenorPhan23 It is an alternative branch of the sim for people with AMD cards...likely you do not have it. Try doing a steam file verification too. This can help if something is corrupted or not installed correctly.

[@showtime-qc-2034]

Nice video im gone try simagic alpha last setting 100 on the wheel base and 50 in the game

[@GSSimRacing]

Let me know how it goes. You can run the game up to around 55% without any clipping in Eau Rouge it seems. Even 60% in game had minimal clipping in my other testing.

[@TheDoK666]

Very usefull and always great to keep track of why we do things. We say go 100% in driver and go down in game because it will work with 99% of ppl's setup. My 12nm La prima is at 100% in driver and 35% in game and both graph are on exactly on each other on MoteC so it only applies on 20+ nm wheelbase I guess. So yes it's false but it's accurate enough for 99% of the player

[@GSSimRacing]

Yeah, once the FFB makes sense and the driver can feel the full dynamic range of the FFB - this is the main thing. It is most dynamic on the output side at a point just below clipping. Once the FFB feels right, this is all that matters. I am fortunate that on the DD2 there is a small screen that shows the FFB output torque in real time as well as the peaks for the preceeding 5-10 seconds. So I can manage to get it almost 1:1 from wheelbase to the game to Motec.

[@AL.farmlife]

thanks i will try ❤

[@mallablurt]

...did you miss me lad?? 🤣🥃 Just wanted to thank you, was struggling to get new wheel right. You know how it is, first DD😂 Your videos are well put together, I'm like 85% there with the set now. But happy 😊 You should set up an Assetto Corsa lobby all subscribers should have that?? Get some practice in the 919. I've been sliding round spa just perfecting the ffb 👍👍 It's obviously different for everyone but I think the term 'red lining' when playing music came to mind. Old vinyls used to be recorded at different levels so adjust accordingly using gain or faders... 😮😮 Sorry for rambling on 😂😂 I owe ya a Guinness or 3 pal 🍻

[@GSSimRacing]

Glad that you found it useful. Yeah I remember when I went DD for the first time, I'll never forget my first time up Radillon in ACC, I was like 😯. The level of detail was insane, but then I went down the rabbit hole of trying to perfect what it had to offer. It's never ending, sure even last week I was adjusting my brake load cell, just to eek out extra feel and hopefully laptime. And yeah I'll take you up on the Guinness, AKA holy water 😂🍺

[@radekpol1242]

Very informative and technical video. Just a question. Did you consider to lower steering torque capability in game to 13,8Nm when you set maximal torque in Fanatec driver to 55% (=13,8 Nm)? I am wondering if it has any effect on FFB.

[@GSSimRacing]

I did consider it, but never tried it. Once the rack force and the FFB output kind of lined up...I thought we must be in the right ball park. Strangely, at 55% in game and 55% on the driver side, so the game thinks its 25nm, the driver is setting 12-13nm, so the actual output should have been 13nm X 55%, so what, about 7nm peaks. However, the actual wheelbase was peaking at 13nm of actual motor output. So it could be a case where these percentages are no more than sliders without lining up to the actual output figure. This surprised me.

[@radekpol1242]

@GSSimRacing I dont see anything strange about it and I do not think it is a coincidence that you found out that by setting 55% in game and 55% in the driver you measured 1:1 ffb. The game certainly counts with wheelbase torque capability (it is set in .ini files now). My assumption is that ffb in game does not have to be set 55% to have full dynamic 1:1 range. It can be whatever. The important is to have the same FFB strength percentage both in game and in the wheelbase driver. From your measurement, from my subjective testing and from the logical point of view only this setting gives you uncompressed 1:1 FFB without clipping. It was a gamechanger for me. No more numb feeling in low speed corners. Now it is quite difficult to loose a car but in a good way. It looks very promising but I need to test it more.

[@GSSimRacing]

Yeah that makes sense, looking at it from that perspective. I find the ffb incredible. I'm able to react and catch some serious snaps, just given the instant dynamic range I'm able to get. Validated that you notice the same too. 🙂

[@Bego666]

That's interesting I tried something similar a couple of weeks ago, usually I have on the base side the ffb strength on 100% and in game 65% (Simagic Alpha 15Nm) , than i tried the opposite and had huge clipping and after that I made it back to 100% ffb for the base and 65% in game, so what would you suggest for my base then to try ?

[@fingers68]

Interesting, I have always went 100% on my DD1 and adjusted in sim. I have not setup Motec, but do you think the LMU 55% sweet spot might be the same for all wheel bases? i have went for 55% and 85% on base, was on 45% and 100% on base. Might set motec up to confirm the sweet spot but it does feel a little different. I know in RF2 if the FFB in SIM was to much, a lot of detail was lost.

[@fingers68]

PS Have you tried any of the COOP races?

[@GSSimRacing]

So above 55-60% on the game side, there is a small bit of clipping in high load corners, very small. You can go as high as you like on the wheelbase. But it seems like 55% on game side is the perfect number for a dynamic range from the games FFB signal. With a DD1, you also have the torque available where you are not forced to up the game side FFB value to have it clip.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@fingers68 Have not tried any co-op events yet. May do the race later on...weekly event I think.

[@jamesb4054]

Very useful and makes sense. However, I have not used Motec in ages and am just getting back into this. Can you suggest a good video on how to select the parameters that I need to review, I can't remember how to do it! I have the DAMplugin working and motec and I can find the log files but how do I select the correct data set to review, i.e max ffb etc

[@GSSimRacing]

The channels are in a RF2 workbook I got off one of the old RF2 forum posts. It is FFB and steering tourque. Basically create a group (time series channel I think it is called) and add the data channels to this. I may do a little vid on motec.

[@YpowT]

Hi! Great video and really insightful, as I am no expert with FFB and have previously been someone that just searches for the "best settings" and then just deal with them and / or adjust them. I've just tried this exercise myself with my CSL DD 8nm (i.e. Boost Pack), and the sweetspot I found was at 100% FFB strength on the Fanatec end and 65% in LMU where I could get both lines to track. However, no matter what I do I still experience some clipping e.g. I ran Spa like you, and in my Motec data at Raidillon / Eau Rouge the Steering Shaft Torque way exceeds the FFB Output. Is that just because my wheelbase is inherently on the "weaker" side? I'm also struggling to get rid of this really light, limp feeling when turning in - not sure if that is FFB strength related or not - but I have really struggled to get my wheel feeling the same as it does in rF2 with respect to turn in!

[@GSSimRacing]

@@YpowT above 60% game side it will give some clipping in Eau Rouge. With a stronger base, you can run lower game settings so as not to clip, and increase the wheelbase. But even 65% game side should be fine for most cars and tracks. The key thing is to see the ffb dynamically shift with shaft torque. It will never track exact on the same scale. But it should move by a similar amount. This is what I try to do.

[@bennergaard7766]

Hey, mate. Great video! How do you access the ITM tab, because i cant see mine?

[@GSSimRacing]

It is in the fanalab, turn off itm and select the motor output torque display (assuming you are on DD1/2)

[@bennergaard7766]

@@GSSimRacing thx. I got the DD Pro so thats maybe why.

[@Sabsterjoon]

Thanks for this video! Are you still modifying the saturation levels in the dd2 preset file? Also, wouldn't it make more sense to match the in-game max steering torque with the limit that you set in the drivers, rather than your potential max of 25nm?

[@GSSimRacing]

@@Sabsterjoon hey, in theory yes. It seems the ffb setting percentage is the limiting factor. I'm not sure what the nm setting ever done. And my presets files haven't been touched. The file itself is probably one month old, I'd recently done a fresh install, as I'd learned they messed with ffb a short while back.

[@Sabsterjoon]

@GSSimRacing do you know why they removed these variables from the menu? Many people are able "dial out" ffb numbness/ bumpiness with these. Btw, I noticed the biggest improvements by combining the advice in your first ffb guide with the advice here.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@Sabsterjoon They said they no longer done anything. I set my collision strength to 28% in the setting menu...I think this affects crashes and any high frequency stuff like kerbing and bumps. It would likely tone it down a bit. I used to do this in RF2 (Jolt)....and I think this is the same thing.

[@stefanwehinger1235]

Thx for the video. I just changed from the Fanatec dd2 to a simucube 2 pro. I wonder if the same applies here too.

[@GSSimRacing]

In theory yes, the FFB trace is from the game. So at 55% FFB output (game side), the game doesn't clip its signal. 60% would also be fine with a great dynamic range. And then from there, adjust your wheelbase to get the overall strength/feel you desire.

[@stefanwehinger1235]

@GSSimRacing bdw: the default intensity setting on most Fanatec profiles for the dd2 is 60%, which seemed wired but make sense now.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@stefanwehinger1235 Just to he clear, the 55-60% clipping (or starting to clip) is on the game side. But yeah, middle settings on driver and game seems to be best.

[@elisabethmilne9192]

The graphs seem clear,, though I still quite wrap my head around the idea that(for example) 50% (wheelbase) x 55% (game) is not equal to 100%W x 27.5%G. I’ll certainly give it a go though. How would you apply these ideas to settings in iRacing?

[@ScalinoCorleone]

check your maths mate... it is equal :) (because multiplying by 100% means multiplying by 1, in practice ;)

[@GSSimRacing]

Not sure on iRacing. But yeah the maths don't check out for some reason on the wheelbase side. Like, when I set 55% on my base, it was telling me in Fanalab I would have 13nm of torque, or something like this. This actually peaked to 14.7 or so when driving. And remember, in game we reduce intensity, the signal itself still managed to stretch to 100%.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@ScalinoCorleone The FFB signal from the game, although reduced to 55%, still managed to hit the 100% output on peaks. So you are correct in what I think you are trying to say...I think.

[@ScalinoCorleone]

@@GSSimRacing my comment was strictly about the arithmetics of the percentages' multiplications. (but I think I got what you mean too... :)

[@NWA_1919]

I think i run 57% from lmu, and 100% from moza software. I have a moza r16v2 wheelbase. The ffb is really good on the hypercars, but the lmp2 feels like it lacks alot of the small detail. Feeling of low speed oversteer/understeer is the biggest difference for me between lmp2 and hypercar.

[@GSSimRacing]

The LMP2 seems to have a tyre warming up issue I find, so all corners, but particularly slow corners have a risk of understeer. This is contributing to the light feeling I would bet.

[@layingblacklines]

I probably need to look at telemetry. I'm using a VRS wheel at 100% (20 Nm) and like a heavy wheel. I've been using 75% in game, thinking that was avoiding clipping. So it's interesting to see some clipping already at 55%. Might have to try it at 60% for a bit and see how I like it. Otherwise I guess just accept some clipping to get the steering weight.

[@GSSimRacing]

Yeah, the key thing is to get it set up in a way that feels right for you. If you're getting the correct level of detail, car control, and overall feel, then there's no need to change it. Some clipping during high-load situations is probably fine. At those points, the car is fully loaded, so missing out on minor details won't have a significant impact. What matters more is getting the small and mid-load forces dialed in properly, as those are what we experience most of the time. If those are detailed enough, you should be good to go.

[@carlosangalang]

What about AMS2 and AC? Similar exercise tweaking in game and base instead of 100%? I have a logitech G Pro DD. Tho Logi suggests 100 on the base for their recommended settings for games

[@GSSimRacing]

It purely depends on the torque of the base in terms of what you need to run the game at. Letting the FFB signal breath (as opposed to compressing it) is preferred. Logi wheel has 8nm I think, so this will almost need to be 100% on the base side. From there you can set the game FFB to suit. However, at 60% and above, there is minor clipping in Eau Rouge for example. The higher you go on the game side, the more clipping gets introduced.

[@PedroOliveira-sz7rd]

Great content, can you share this workspace or just steering shaft?

[@JAMESuk0007]

Yes you have a link to the workspace. Bc i added the channel and I don't see the Red line just mine steering shaft torque

[@PedroOliveira-sz7rd]

@@JAMESuk0007 I didn't find the link to download the workspace, can you give it to me?

[@JAMESuk0007]

@@PedroOliveira-sz7rd I don't have it. I'm hurting for it too..

[@GSSimRacing]

Sorry gents, I will link it at some point today.

[@GSSimRacing]

OK, so the link here is to the plugin: forum.studio-397.com/index.php?threads/damplugin-for-rf2.49363/ And I have updated the shared folder in the description, here is a link. In the RF2 folder there is the motec stuff. This link should work 1drv.ms/f/s!AoNBQy810qp6jtQBEyrA8STH00tWWQ?e=PE5NMl

[@nicolopastore28]

Great Video! Could you specify if you have the FFB in game set to Linear or not?

[@GSSimRacing]

Hey, thank you, and apologies for the late response, I must have missed this. I run ffb at peak in the fanatdc driver. I had a video out today that shows my ffb and fanalab settings.

[@nicolopastore28]

@ hi thanks, but what about the in game FFB? On the FFB setting you can set it to liner too, but on this video you don’t scroll all the way down, so we can’t see. Thank you!

[@chrisracing81]

I think you get it lined up because of 55% ingame and 55% driver. But I am using VRS wheelbase with 100% driver and 55% ingame. I don’t want to reduce FFB so what could I do better now?

[@GSSimRacing]

Hey, so the game output is where the clipping will occur. Think of it like an overly saturated output signal to the USB port. Once this is around 55-60%, it seems to avoid clipping in most cases, so from my testing this is the best range for full synamic FFB without risk of clipping. On the wheelbase side, you can go as high as you like. If you need to increase the FFB from the game, then go ahead, it may introduce some clipping in very high load situations only above the 60-65% range.

[@remcobosgoed9284]

can i use your fanatec settings with my cs dd 12nm base? i use the fanalab profiles from maurice in fanalab

[@GSSimRacing]

Try my settings, you should notice more detail at once. Feel free to turn up the wheelbase output to adjust if needed. Let me know how it goes.

[@remcobosgoed9284]

@@GSSimRacing do you use dynamic damping in fanalab? i feel that there is a lot of wight in the center when i use the profiles of maurice

[@remcobosgoed9284]

@@GSSimRacing i used your settings and much detailed but in game i use 55% FFb and max torque 12nm and smooting in game is 4 in the base it self i use 85% of ffb 100% is to strong are these settings correct?

[@GSSimRacing]

@@remcobosgoed9284 They thing to take away here is that above 55-60% game setting will start to clip its signal. The wheelbase is not the problem. So 55% in game and then 85-100% on the wheelbase is fine. I personally use the wheelbase to adjust the overall strength. Smoothing at 4 will reduce some detail and add a small bit of latency. But if you prefer a smoother wheel and you are used to it, then this is totally fine.

[@remcobosgoed9284]

@@GSSimRacing and do you use this settings for every car in the game?

[@dave_camz]

So all you need to do now is buy a VRS base and do again pls lol. I run mine 75% base and around 35 to 40 in game. Would you suggest base lower game higher a tad.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@dave_camz yeah, the game is good up to about 55% output and will only kiss the clipping zone in very high load situations. On the wheelbase driver then just adjust the ffb output to suit. On the game side, if you go too low, you lose dynamic range. Go too high and get clipping. This is what the MoTeC data suggests and what I could feel.

[@dave_camz]

@@GSSimRacing always did wonder this and the stats don’t lie. I will give it a go more in game less on base. Good vid mate

[@GSSimRacing]

@@dave_camz thanks mate. Yeah, maxing the wheelbase only to kill the game ffb output "volume" and range. And not to mention, if the wheelbase decides to spaz out at 100%, your gonna have 20nm-25nm hand remover spinning in front of you 😂. Be interested to get your feedback with the changes.

[@murfenator82]

Ok I watched the whole video lol. I was used to the 100% on the wheelbase side and adjust in game, because others have said you are compressing the range otherwise. I guess Motec may be the best way to tell for sure, but i can do some quick testing by feel. Ive got a 5nm Moza so my results will probably be a lot different than yours. With a 25nm wheelbase you have a lot of dynamic range and obviously you won't be running 100% on the wheelbase. When I had a VRS I would do the same, run like 60% on wheelbase and then adjust in game.

[@GSSimRacing]

No, it appears that in LMU (and RF2 was sort of similar if I recall) that anything above 55-60% of game side FFB would show clipping of the signal at extreme loads (as given from the game/car). The main point is to have the game FFB high enough that the low end signals have a more dynamic range, but not to the point of clipping in normal driving. As you can see, at 55% the signal just touched the clipping output for a millisecond or so. If I was to run the game FFB at say, 70%, we'd see more clipping across the board. So it seems like 55-60% is the "ideal" output from the game side, and then adjust the wheelbase driver from there. However, if the wheelbase is very low output, say a G29 etc, then the user will have no choice but to max out the game side...this is why lower wheelbases end up clipping the signal, purely because the game side gain needs to be set so high. Think of it like a overly loud audio signal that begins to break up.

[@murfenator82]

@GSSimRacing I edited my comment after watching the entire video. I'll do some testing

[@GSSimRacing]

@@murfenator82 on the 5nm base, crank that up all they way. Then, set your game output to suit. At 5nm,im guessing the game output is going to be over 50-60% for you. The main issue is clipping on the game output side, not necessarily the wheelbase side.

[@murfenator82]

@@GSSimRacing Thats right where im at. 56% in game, 100% on base.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@murfenator82 so 56% is perfect for the entire game side ffb range. And then at 100% to allow the full 5nm of total force on the wheelbase.

[@doot6516]

so im on fanatec csl 8nm. i copied settings but left ffb strength higher. it feels so good but for some reason im getting a lot of noise "that nasty gritty feeling" on the straights. what could be causing this? switching the profile to something else gets rid of it

[@jamesb4054]

OK, played with Motec and got back into it. I have a simagic Alpha Mini, at 10NM wheelbase, FWIW I found that my sweet spot seems to be 95% in game and 60% in the driver software if it helps anyone.

[@GSSimRacing]

At 95% in game the signal will clip a lot. Try 55-60% in game and go as high or low as needed on the driver to get the weight you want. Remember, the game output signal is what appears to clip according to Motec.

[@jamesb4054]

@@GSSimRacing I will mess with this more but I wonder if there is not some more complexity going on here depending on wheelbase or driver because at those settings Motec is showing clipping at only the biggest spikes and only for around 4-6 hundredths of a second which as you say in your video you will never notice. I did test at 100% in game and it seemed that I had to come right down to 40% ish to eliminate clipping in the driver, but at only 95% in game the clipping was gone at 60% in driver. This was all on one cct so maybe I'll try some other combinations. I will do as you suggest though and see if I get any better feel from the wheel at more mid range settings in game.

[@GSSimRacing]

@@jamesb4054 I'd be interested to hear the results. From what I can see (and RF2 was the same), there is a lot of clipping at high game FFB settings. RF2 and LMU FFB is very active, so there seems to be a lot of signals going on, which seems to allow some clipping. But the question is, how noticable will it be, maybe not much and likely nothing really to worry about. I think people with higher strength wheel bases would benefit most from this video, as usually, they run the driver at 100% and have to go with a much lower FFB setting which appears to compress the signal quite a lot. And even at this, personal preference will still play a part in what people prefer.

[@jamesb4054]

@@GSSimRacing Played around some more yesterday. I only selected one additional figure to work with of 75% in game, after running several Motec tests I found that 72% in driver gave me 100% feedback but again with negligible clipping. I think this is useful however. It probably means that those of us with lower powered wheelbases probably have a wider spectrum of settings which will not cause issues. Happy to send you some log files if they are of any use to you. At these settings I could not tell the difference between my previous ones, that's not to say there were none, just that I could not feel them! This has however been a very useful exercise for me personally as when I started looking at this after watching your video and re-installing Motec, I certainly found that my settings were not ideal as I had them at that time and were clipping badly. Motec is certainly a fantastic analytical tool as I found years ago using it in GTR2

[@velouriumcamper0753]

@@jamesb4054 could you please share the rest of your ffb settings? I have an alpha mini too and my ffb feels grainy and just overall off.

[@JesusG-rd5mt]

This game sucks

[@GSSimRacing]

Why do you think so?