Oral Microbiome Tests #8 and 9: Serratia marcescens Is Still A Problem

[@solverapproved]

I have 2 suggestions: - Adding low doses of Sodium Citrate to your mouthwash, inspired by the paper: Diminishing the Pathogenesis of the Food-Borne Pathogen Serratia marcescens by Low Doses of Sodium Citrate - Eating only cooked food, including the greens. Serratia marcescens has been found in raw vegetables in some production lines maybe the brand of one of ur raw veggies is infected in their warehouse or something, the bacteria is inactivated at 90deg C, go all cooked for one test and see what happens

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Interesting, thanks for the paper @solverapproved, I could try that! Maybe that's the reason why Serratia is lower with sodium bicarbonate is in the mouthwash, because of the sodium content. Almost all my veggies are cooked, except for carrots and peppers

[@PestisNonSapien_GMO_exHuman]

My last test had 55.6% serratia liquefaciens. Google is making me think it might be from the mildew in my shower. Guess it's not a good idea to rinse your mouth in the shower.

[@Jenny-fv6go]

To be quite honest, this bacteria is at this point harmless to you, but it would be fatal if you would bite somebody, they would most likely have to get a tetanus shot

[@jackbuaer3828]

I still vote for a 4 day 100% xylitol experiment. After each meal, water pik, after water pik, 1 tablespoon of100% powder xylitol, let it dissolve in your mouth, swish for five minutes in between your teeth, around each gum area, under tongue, gargle. Repeat randomly if you wake up at night. If it does not move the needle in four days on the test, then you can cross xylitol off the list as a potential treatment. I understand that the studies that you read suggest 1-5% and suggest perhaps no benefit from a greater %. I am suggesting that you forget the studies and just go 100%, and test. You don't have much to lose.

[@tommyortiz6623]

Xylitol has been linked to tumors in high dose/long term so this ruled this strategy out

[@jackbuaer3828]

@@tommyortiz6623 Anything in extreme amounts is harmful including water. Too much water will kill you. Too many carrots will kill you. In the mice / rat studies where they saw problems, they were giving the mice the human equivalent of 12 to 15 pounds of xylitol a day. What do you think would happen if you drank 12 to 15 pounds of water per day? According to a KZbin Video released by The American Chemistry Society, it takes about 13 pounds of water to kill a 75kg person. In terms of xylitol, to my knowledge, there is no evidence whatsoever that 3-4 tablespoons per day will cause tumors.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Great idea, I might try that, thanks @jackbuaer3828

[@jab5444]

Also try disinfecting the tooth brush daily

[@tommyortiz6623]

@@jab5444 how to do this? Hydrogen peroxide 3%?

[@jamesgilmore8192]

Have you ever had a dentist use a flash camera to check for cavities? It can expose issues not otherwise seen on x-rays or examination.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hmm, probably not. I did have a cavity in the region where Serratia likely lives, though (upper right corner). The cavity was cleaned out, so the question is, was the cavity caused by the region where Serratia is likely living, or vice versa?

[@espinosalexis]

What do experts suggest? Which foods can have spores of Serratia? Which foods can have spores of good bacteria? Can Serratia live in the nose, in tonsils, in your family, your dog, your bed, your apartment, your bathroom, your fridge, your neighbourhood, your pool, your supermarket?

[@tvmcrusher]

Have you considered taking oral probiotics after brushing and following up with prebiotics directly into the mouth? HMOs, FOS, GOS? I really like the 'Oral Health Probiotics' from Naturewise, it contains two different strains of S. Salivarius, it also has L. Reuteri and some others. Usually the key to reducing pathogenic species is a combination of crowding them out with good guys and fasting from their preferred food source.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I took Streptococcus salivarius for 1 test, no effect. For the last video in this series, I attempted to increase the "good" oral bacteria that could crowd out Serratia. No luck with that approach, yet.

[@tvmcrusher]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 Have you tried Human Milk Oligosaccharides? Taking a mix of 5 of them called 'SuperHMO' from the company Layer Origin Nutrition has solved all of my remaining microbiome woes, oral or otherwise. At times I take a scoop of the powder directly into my mouth and swish it around after brushing + oil pulling + oral probiotic.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

Maybe you could start testing mouth pH or other markers? pH strips are fairly easy to get but not sure what else is available specifically for saliva.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I have pH strips at home-my oral pH is almost always on the neutral-alkaline side, not acidic.

[@gregorhirschfeld6293]

Do you have history of chronic rhinosinusitis? It may be that you eradicate serratia efficiently in your oral cavity, but if you have a nasal reservoir, serratia may recover rapidly.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Fortunately, no history of chronic rhinosinusitis. Chronic halitosis, though, for a long time

[@ChessMasterNate]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 You could look for tonsil stones. They can harbor bacteria that causes bad breath. They can easily be hidden behind the tonsils or in the folds of the throat.

[@newdata]

can try oil pulling with coconut oil or olive oil. must be some truth to the 1000 year old tradition

[@tommyortiz6623]

I think this maybe the better result

[@RobC1999]

Yes, seems oil pulling might help. I use olive oil with a bit of clove extract.

[@bergenresident]

I have this bacteria in my bristle tear as well. I had my doctor give me ciproflaxin antibiotics. In my case my lips were getting painless blisters and the medication reduced the symptoms. I need to retest and I have another round of antibiotics but I’m taking a break so I don’t deplete too much good bacteria. This has been a struggle for over a year now. Apparently this is one of the hardest bacteria to kill according to research I have read. Very curious on your outcome. Also bristle says this is rare for someone to have were curious on my update. Again I need to reset but my case my lips haven’t been the same.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hey @bergenresident,sorry to hear that you have Serratia, too. I'm confident I can get rid of it, it's just a matter of time. I may add sodium chloride (salt) and/or sodium citrate to the homemade mouthwash-someone in the comments suggested that based on published data, as a means for reducing Serratia.

[@waggawaggaful]

You might want to consider your toothbrush as a possible culprit. I have serratia m. growing in and around my sink. Noticed my gums and roof of mouth were slightly inflamed and starting to get infected. Realized the bacteria on the sink was probably migrating to my toothbrush.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

The toothbrush has been the same for all 10+ tests-if it was that, Serratia should always be present, but that hasn't been the case...

[@philmartz]

Much thanks for your work! I hadn't recalled that Serratia was an issue in test #1, where here you are reporting test #1 as 88.3%, but in the test #1 video Neisseria and Rothia were the dominant species at a combined 32%. Did Bristle update their testing during this time, and how did you get an update later that indicated Serratia was 88% in test #1. Serratia was not even listed as present in the test #1 video.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hi Phil, I detailed that in the last video in this series... kzbin.info/www/bejne/gaPKdIGspt6ip7s

[@philmartz]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 Ah, got it! Looking at my Bristle results I see that they are reporting both relative abundance and percentile. The % you are showing is relative abundance of the entire microbiome. I have a different Serratia, Serratia liquefaciens relative abundance 0.1813 and percentile 71.43%. I know your mouthwash is designed to promote the good (or less harm), while inhibiting the bad. If you get another poor result, I'd consider a different tack to at least wipe out the Serratia: Standard CPC or Chlorine dioxide mouthwash with 1:3 diluted hydrogen peroxide (i.e., 3%) mouthwash is supposed to disproportionately inhibit bad species with less impact on the good. If I recall the hydrogen peroxide dissolves biofilms which the bad species are more dependent on.

[@peanutnutter1]

I haven't seen your previous biome videos but intend to soon, forgive me if the following is redundant... As a counterpoint to lowering serratia, perhaps providing a positive environment for other bacterium so that they get a foothold and don't get crowded out by the serratia. Something I've heard of is that certain bacteria are favored when you chew leafy greens multiple times a day, these bacteria will help with nitric oxide production, it's possible you have reduced them down with the regular mouthwash protocol, so I suggest cleaning your teeth morning and night only and perhaps experimenting with other, less destructive mouthwashes, plus the leafy greens.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hey @peanutnutter1, that could be possible, however, Serratia as a replacement for other "bad bacteria" (P. gingivalis, T.forsythia, F. nucleatum, etc, whcih are linked with AD) isn't good news, either My diet includes ~400g of greens/day (collards, lettuce, parsley), so it's not likely that I haven't used store-bough mouthwash (which contains alcohol, a destroyer of the oral microbiome) in decades

[@peanutnutter1]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 I see, well good luck in solving this, still it seems to me that promoting the growth of the bacteria that you want to see is key. I look forward to seeing you solve this little conundrum.

[@OutiRikola]

​@@conqueragingordietrying123But do you chew the leaves or just gulp them down in the smoothie etc?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks@@peanutnutter1. Ha, I'll either conquer Serratia, or I'll die trying...

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

​@@OutiRikola Gulped. Whatever's in the leaves that could act as an antimicrobial would be expected to be secreted into the mouth via saliva, after being absorbed into the blood.

[@jenn1663]

NAC is a biofilm disrupter. It would taste gross but I wonder if you could brush your teeth with a paste with NAC powder added?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @jenn1663. Someone in the comments suggested sodium chloride has efficacy against Serratia, so that's the next experiment...

[@startingtoday4663]

QUESTION. It would seem that destroying the Serratia is just half of the solution, wouldn't you have to introduce the preferred type(s) of bacteria and conditions needed to recolonize. That is... if you destroy 99% of the serratia but don't replace with "good" types then the 1% will quickly re-populate the environment. So my question is what are the preferred types of bacteria and what are the foods / condition that will help them grow? Also could it be that your mouthwash solution is eliminating them as well ? (maybe you can determine the answers to these questions using in-vitro testing?) Thank you for providing this excellent channel.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @startingtoday4663. For the 2 tests that Serratia wasn't there, I had a "normal" microbiome, filled with lots of nitrate-producing bacteria. I detailed that in this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gaPKdIGspt6ip7s

[@bridgepoc]

It sounds like the clove oil was helpful? why not try increasing the clove oil or try holy basil extract which also contains eugenol

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hey @bridgepoc, it could be. Repeating the experiment with clove oil is definitely on the list, as Serratia was 0, but it was only 1x.

[@MorningClarity]

I recall reading a message a while back re: your thoughts on trying chlorine dioxide. Did you ever try this? I don't see that you did(?). I have been using a stabilized version in a widely available product called CloSYS, once a day for three months now and have noticed aarked decrease in plaque and an improvement in general gum tightness against my teeth, lack of swelling, etc. No tests, just believe it has improved my oral health.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I've considered using ClO2, but haven't yet. All options are on the table...

[@alanmunro5068]

What kind of dosage?

[@lf1899]

Do you use flouride toothpaste? Do you think changing to hydroxyapetite toothpaste would preserve the good bacteria to fight off the bad bacteria naturally. Also, do you incorporate your Nitric oxide levels into your data and see how it correlates. Also what are your thoughts on gentle brushing and no mouth wash preserving biofilm and promoting healthy balanced microbiome.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Unfortunately, there's no evidence that any of the components in my toothpaste impact Serratia My diet is nitrate rich-average daily beet intake is 250g/d. That's not sufficient on its own to eliminate Serratia.

[@lf1899]

Do you think using antibiotics to reset the microbiome would be beneficial in your case? Ive heard from medical professionals say that its the best way to get control over runaway amounts of bad bacteria.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I don't, unless I could get a phage to specifically kill Serratia without affecting the rest. Unfortunately, any antibiotic that I take will be swallowed, which will directly negatively impact the gut and only indirectly impact the mouth. Even worse, antibiotic-resistant Serratia is a nasty bug.

[@elmiramegens9764]

​@@conqueragingordietrying123 there are apparently phages who where used against serratia in food. Not in clinical trials yet

[@RDenielOlivo]

Are you get your gut microbiome? There are might be a serratia?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I've done the gut microbiome 4x, no Serratia, but it's been a while since the last test, probably time to retest.

[@larsnystrom6698]

It wouldn't surprise me if salt has an anti-bacterial effect. I have been using salt to remove the stain on tea in my tea mug. A pinch of salt and moisture it a little, but not enough to spoil the christaline structure. Then rub with a finger. It's surprisingly effective. I haven't checked if it's chemically or if the salt crystals are just hard enough to do the job. But the mugs do get pristine clean! And I've never seen anything else work on this! I resently began salting my toothpaste, and I quite like it. It wouldn't surprise me if it worked on stained teeth as well as it does on stained tea mugs. The idea is to moisture it but not dissolve the salt. So, I think it wouldn't be the same if the toothpaste contained the salt. Just idle rambling!

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I've added salt to the homemade mouthwash to test that hypothesis: 1st at 4%, then 2%, data coming soon!

[@AydinMiaze]

Hello. I’m curious how you are managing chronic halitosis on a day to day basis, given that it’s so difficult to be constantly aware of this when you’re working, going out and about to meet people. Also, what is your daily oral care routine to control serratia? My oral micro biome is very high on serratia too and I’m suffering from the same problem. It has been almost 2 years and nothing I’m doing is solving this.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hi @user-rm9uw2rn5o, sorry to hear about your Serratia, too-I detailed my approach in the above video.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

Are these being tested before or after teeth brushing? I would be testing on waking before food and brushing. You could also consider testing after meals and brushing or in the late afternoon.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

1hr after toothbrushing, flossing, and mouthwash (or water if the mouthwash wasn't in the approach). At the same time of day for each test (9-10AM), and 2-3h since eating.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 Have there been any changes in toothpaste across all these tests? Perhaps your community is sensitive to toothpaste.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 With the restricted eating window you use, its probably more representative to test on waking. That may give you some idea of what's happening overnight without all these biome interventions. Maybe the protocol could be 10 min after drinking water on waking. If its comes back the same as the current testing approach, OK move onto other possibilities.

[@Jenny-fv6go]

What about dental cleaning, you never reported if you had any dental cleanings between tests? Would that bring seratia to 0? If most people dont have it, and you are in the 1% that does have it, could it be some genetic predisposition you have, since you live an exceptionally clean life unlike most people, and yet you have the worst results?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Even if it is genetic, for 2 tests it was 0%, so there is a recipe to get rid of it, I just haven't discovered it yet... I go for a cleaning 1x/yr-it's unlikely that has any effect on Serratia, though I had a tonsilectomy as a toddler, that could contribute. Also, I've had a cavity in the region where Serratia may be living in my mouth, so that could also be a factor I may have the dentist clean out the inside of that tooth upon my next cleaning, but that would only slow down Serratia growth, not likely completely eliminating it

[@roblim1767]

Dont you think about Silver nanoparticles or even low hydrogen peroxide? And using this mouthwash recipe more as a good "prebiotic" to counteract and repopulate the beneficial microbiome that could have been lost with the more potent bactericide?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

If there is published evidence for their specific efficacy on Serratia, I'm open to it. I don't think destroying the whole biome and then trying to repopulate it is a good idea, especially from studies on the gut microbiome, which show a slower recovery over time the more often that antibiotics are used. I was able to have 0 Serratia for 2 tests, the fun is discovering what's behind that...

[@ChessMasterNate]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 I see no reason that concern about nuking the gut microbiome, should have anything to do with resetting the mouth microbiome. Kiss one person and it is all back.

[@Kefomak]

To increase the oral microbiome you should apply some saturated fat in the mouth after brushing the teeth, like coconut oil. The results are awesome.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I've considered that, but there's no published evidence that CO's main FAs, lauric or myristic acids kill Serratia...

[@bestenliste-diebesten...8786]

Try it!

[@tvmcrusher]

You can also mix in some sesame oil to add a saponification effect to the mix, the oils are great at seeding the probiotics of the oral microbiome. I personally use a mix of coconut, sesame and blackseed oils, I also add a drop of thyme, oregano and clove oil.

[@tvmcrusher]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 It is not about killing Serratia in this case, it is about feeding the other probiotic species.

[@Always-xl9db]

I make L.Reuteri probiotic yogurt myself, highly fermented (36 hours) I wonder if that could help

[@mime454]

Have you tried stopping fluoride toothpaste? Are you eating anything else with antibacterial effects?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I'm considering changing the toothpaste, good point. Lots of antimicrobial stuff in the diet-fresh garlic and ginger, cinnamon, cardamom, cloves...

[@mime454]

i studied evolutionary biology in grad school. My opinion on this (watched the other videos too) is that you have reduced alpha diversity which is making S. Marcescens take over your mouth because it’s the only thing surviving some kind of attack on the microbes in your mouth. Fluoride is antimicrobial so that seems most obvious to me. But I think the other types of antimicrobial foods might have an effect too (less likely)

[@HarryJensen-kr4qz]

Perhaps 1 teaspoon of apple cider vinegar in 8oz water as a mouth rinse.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Acid is bad for the mouth, especially cavity formation...

[@HarryJensen-kr4qz]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 Good point. I used as gargle to avoid tonsillectomy 50 years ago, cleared everything up. If I ever use again, I'll follow with a rinse of baking soda 👍.

[@AdventureTrust]

Is there an effect from garlic and ginger on the oral microbiome?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Both are in the diet, so unfortunately not at their current intake (~6g/d together)

[@jamesgilmore8192]

Does bristle report a total number yet (or anything similar) or just proportions?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Proportions

[@espinosalexis]

Also, what does your dentist say? You may have some pockets in your tooth-gum spaces.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Dentists have little training in microbiology.

[@contentviewer7]

Don't think I've seen anyone say so I'll at least proffer it: a basic search says it's commonly found growing in bathrooms. I'd look to see any mysterious red marks in there or anywhere near oral hygiene related items. Also I'd look to see if it's prevalent in my area. Unfortunately, seems it might grow fine in the presence of soap, too. Such a huge and sporadic increase (ignoring measurment error) should only really be explained by an established source/reservoir providing occasional and heavy exposure. All the best. (also that alien carvings guy is a scam artist, hope you're not involved in his profits)

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hey @contentviewer7, fortunately no red spots in the bathroom or anywhere else. There's a corner of my mouth where a Serratia biofilm may exist, as that's been a rancid-smell spot for a while. Why do you think he's a acsm artist? There are literally thousands of those rock carvings, I find it unlikely that someone has the time and craftsmanship to carve them that quickly, bury them in the ground, and even use ingredients that have been carbon dated to > 9,000 yrs old...

[@contentviewer7]

​@@conqueragingordietrying123 I suppose the search continues. I'd probably still experiment with cleaing my toothbrush with bleach or something (myself, I regularly wash it with soap and it makes me wonder if that may favour S. marcescens or a similar bacterial colonisation). I watched the video a bit ago so I'll be going from memory but there were a few reasons, some minor, some major: It is precisely that there are thousands that indicates fabrication. At our point in human history, it is a global fortune if we discover novel ancient artefacts (like the Dead Sea Scrolls), let alone thousands of a very novel category so suddenly (on historic scales). The motive to make them is for profit, in fact, after watching I did a little digging and saw the shop he runs and multiple Ebay accounts selling (ostensibly distributors of the same source) these objects for absurd prices. Some were identical to objects shown, others just similar, but all were being sold multiple times as if they were fabricated. The carbon dating can be faked at a few stages, I know it's quite easily done in the painting forgery world. Ultimately, I'm not an expert on radioisotope dating to make a detailed case, but the other discrepancies make me not hold my breath on this particular detail. Also, the fact they're _all_ so pristine, despite purported age, is quite suspect. The main set of reasons that reveal it all as obvious forgeries is more in the carvings themselves. The iconographic content is comically syncretic across very distant cultures (in both time period and physical distance), especially when considering they're all derived from the same place. It reads clearly as a 21st century American who flicked through all the most popular ancient cultures from their vantage point and made no effort to understand them per se. In whatever strange world the objects purport to live in, they neither contribute to new understanding of the cultures they steal from, nor do they use the symbols and mythemes consistently with how the source cultures do. What I see is that different cultural substrates were arbitrarily picked from and had an alien narrrative awkwardly foisted on them. I also found the complete absence of eastern Asian cultures funnily convenient. The use of fake writing systems on them was also quite excessive; they were neither consistent in themselves nor mutually with the other fake writing systems. Writing was a huge innovation for humanity each time it developed, and wherever it developed it did not have other systems independently and commensurately developed alongside it. It's so unnecessary, writing is for communication, everyone in a culture would adopt the same system for widest reach. Only after, would divergences emerge as people grow apart (e.g. semitic writing systems and Phoenician-based european writing systems). As a broad overview, the artefacts are explained cleanly as forgeries filling a contemporary appetite for a kind of lore in the broad alien/UFO proto-religion that's so preponderant in America. Honestly, without speaking to the existence of aliens, or even whether we've contacted them, the interest for it would be all but gone if people (re)discovered the meaning of their lives.

[@contentviewer7]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 Response or not, I don't mind. But I really hope you weren't involved in the scam.

[@barrie888]

yes mouthwash ,anipulation of the salivary ph measured by test strips may be useful . . ok also any tonsillar of dental reserviors for serratia ie tonsillolith . Anyway interesting stuff Sir , tks,, edit this stuff already in comments i see

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

My tonsils were removed when I toddler, so that's not a factor

[@kb030303]

Why not try amla? Why delete my last post (link was to citation)

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Is there published data that it impacts Serratia? I don't delete posts, YT deletes links automatically, there's nothing I can do on my end

[@rhyothemisprinceps1617]

I guess you're very sure of the validity of these test results? Seems like an unusual problem for a generally very healthy person. Perhaps the Journey to the Microcosmos community could provide useful input - lots of very enthusiastic microbiology & microscopy buffs. ~ Iodine-based mouthwashes look interesting; iodine seems to work as a disinfectant against Serratia when used for medical equipment.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Bristle said that 1-3% of their users have Serratia in their oral microbiome. Why mine are so high, I'm not yet sure.

[@rhyothemisprinceps1617]

The only things that come to mind are your low thyroid and allergies. Low thyroid function is sometimes due to iodide transporter (sodium/iodide symporter; SIS) issues. SIS are located in salivary glands. There is a test for SIS defects that involves injection of radioactive iodine and measuring salivary / serum iodide ratio - if low, it indicates decreased SIS efficiency. I was wondering if perhaps low salivary iodide is permissive to Serratia overgrowth.@@conqueragingordietrying123

[@pyrgakis]

This happened while you were still using daily the mouthwash recipe of "1000 mL water 10g xylitol 10g baking soda 2 drops peppermint oil 2g potassium nitrate" ? :D

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

S. marcescens has been > 88% of all bacteria for 8 of 12 tests, so yes, even in the presence of the list above In terms of a video update, I'm about 3 tests behind (I have data for tests #10-12), and I'm waiting on data for #13, where I used 1% vanillin (in water, nothing else added) to try to eliminate Serratia Also, Test #14, with 0.5% vanillin will likely be mailed this week

[@monnoo8221]

amazingly persistent, these bugs... particularly scary is that they are naturally resistent against many antibiotics.... your series develops into a full-blown microbial experiment... perhaps you can more quickly test using agar in your experiments, instead of your mouth :) do you know the home remedy for sore throat, lukewarm saturated solution of simple table salt? Intermittent flushing with 5% h2o2 might help to get the ecology back... In your series, clove oil may be the hottest candidate. Interestingly, quote, "Serratia marcescens is a Gram-negative bacterial species that can be found in a wide range of environments like soil, water and plant surfaces, ..." , so i conclude that the raw vegetables you consume is the source. Maybe, flushing the veggies with hot water before chewing them helps.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I've applied topical h202 via a Q-tip to a region in my mouth where Serratia may live, with no success. Yep on its AB-resistance, not good...

[@monnoo8221]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 q-tips are not precisely flushing, though 😉. They are simply everywhere in the mouth, there is not sth like a single spot. But, really, besides that, I think that you provide a constant flow of serratia through raw food, such like carrots and mushrooms. Other potential remedies are oils from lemon shell... You can chew them, is delicious, and has positive effects on the body as well, or thyme tea as "mouth wash"

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Ah@@monnoo8221, there's a spot in my mouth that's generally stinky, so it's likely in a spot.

[@monnoo8221]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 sounds like Actinomycosis ... not good if that prevails

[@livetwiceforyou]

Tooth flossing can be bad for gums and facilitate infection….

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

If that were true, I'd expect to see relatively high systemic inflammation. In contrast, hsCRP has been < 0.3 mg/L for > 10 tests in a row

[@livetwiceforyou]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 a low CRP level does not always mean that there is no inflammation present