osu!mapping: hollow wings & creative maps

generalizing hollow wings's most notable mapping contributions and how different ways of mapping fare in the ranking process
next week is a supervideo
twitter: / pishifat
patreon: / pishifat
maps referenced: (not including the 1000 intro maps)
Stereopony - Tsukiakari no Michishirube by Namki: osu.ppy.sh/s/7...
android52 - anime no groove 420 by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/s/7...
Rohi - Kakuzetsu Thanatos by NatsumeRin: osu.ppy.sh/b/2...
Pegboard Nerds & NGHTMRE (feat. Krewella) - Superstar by handsome: osu.ppy.sh/s/5...
TRUE - Sincerely by Doormat: osu.ppy.sh/s/7...
Hagumi Nishizawa - Monobeno no Uta by Kencho: osu.ppy.sh/s/7...
NANA - sail to a new world(game ver.) by Shad0w1and: osu.ppy.sh/b/1...
Syoko Hoshi (CV: Satsumi Matsuda) - Zettai Tokken Shuchou Shimasu! Hoshi Syoko Solo Remix by Shirasaka Koume: osu.ppy.sh/b/1...
LiSA - ASH by SrSkyPrayer: osu.ppy.sh/s/6...
cYsmix - Behind the Walls by imbor: osu.ppy.sh/s/7...
senya - Zetsubou no Fuchi by -Mo-: osu.ppy.sh/s/6...
Halozy - Sentimental Skyscraper by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/1...
Akiyama Uni - The Grimoire of Alice by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/1...
Halozy - Genryuu Kaiko by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/1...
A.SAKA - Nanatsu Issenzakura by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/2...
ESTi - HELIX (Edit ver.) by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/1...
Halozy - Deconstruction Star by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/b/6...
Ocelot - TSUBAKI by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/b/8...
Halozy - Kikoku Doukoku Jigokuraku by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/4...
Ocelot - KAEDE by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/6...
yuki. - Spring Signal by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/s/7...
U2 - Ningyou Saiban by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/4...
Nekomata Master+ - Funny shuffle by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/9...
Shoujo - Reminiscing by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/1...
paraoka feat. haru*nya - Manimani by Yales: osu.ppy.sh/s/7...
IAHN - Transform (Original Mix) by Monstrata: osu.ppy.sh/s/4...
Miki Sayaka vs. Miki Sayaka (fw. Miki Sayaka) - squartatrice by soulfear: osu.ppy.sh/s/4...
Akiyama Uni - Odoru Mizushibuki by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/1...
FUJIN CLUB - Travel & Ferry by Xilver: osu.ppy.sh/b/1...
Akiyama Uni - Chi no Iro wa Kiiro by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/1...
ISHIDA YOKO - COLORFUL BOX by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/s/6...
CLIFF EDGE feat. Nakamura Maiko - The Distance by handsome: osu.ppy.sh/s/5...
nano.RIPE - Azalea by Mir: osu.ppy.sh/b/1...
Rise Against - The Good Left Undone by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/s/3...
Camellia - Exit This Earth's Atomosphere by rrtyui: osu.ppy.sh/b/1...
Coda - BLOODY STREAM by handsome: osu.ppy.sh/s/6...
Akiyama Uni - Sky of Scarlet Perception by Hollow Wings: osu.ppy.sh/s/9...

[@hypercyte]

very good circles

[@YeahImRose]

*click*

[@hypercyte]

👀

[@thenecromancer7487]

*well circles

[@kirbi7336]

circular circled circles

[@anonimowyosu]

@Emilio Orion stfu

[@hellcat7177]

The thing about hw is that although the maps are hard and frustrating to play, one get addicted to playing them

[@this_too_shaII_pass]

So true, and once you actually break the mindblock and start hitting those wierd patterns it feels sooooo good

[@absurddive]

Each map is a different challenge. *You have to be 100% focused to pass the maps* and ditto on cat's comment, they are highly addicting

[@facespkz_osu]

it's like a next generation KIRBY Mix

[@bmrabbit]

Yes thats why i hate and love deconstruction star at the same time

[@owoleya]

the most inspiring thing about hw is her dedication to mapping tbh. like if i was a surgeon working in china few hours a day and came back dealing with bns saying my map isn't rankable or trash. i would easily give up. imo hw is one my favorite mappers just because of how much effort she puts in her maps(bg,storyboard and the map itself) if only we had more mappers with the same mindsets :(

[@bananya6020]

well no one complains about that now really (or at least there stay enough people to rank his maps) and hw just likes mapping regardless of whether his maps get ranked or not so

[@philipphoehn3883]

her*

[@bananya6020]

@@philipphoehn3883 he said on his askfm that he is a guy

[@crunkky8736]

bananya why do people say her?

[@SoleiLilyn]

@@crunkky8736 she had a cover of some song (i forgor)

[@PeterEU]

Thanks for calling my map not creative at 0:14

[@Nitsuga-lb5br]

wich one?

[@CookiebakerLP]

The one at 0:14

[@h0rcrux774]

Peter Well too bad hah

[@АкакийБензолов]

deal with it

[@Wisoven]

dude. you have like 500 maps even a demo map... But really, it's not.. wrong.

[@Mylksix]

Oof that 'wow I'm creative!' slider was such a mood

[@Yotanido]

Next week's video will be an hour long? Oh boy, I'm getting excited!

[@ilya2468]

Oh boy, I'm getting sleepy!

[@DaftPVF]

I chose the map that he showcased at 7:54 in a multiplayer lobby and most people just left. Really shows how much people dislike change.

[@LAvocat]

Creative mapping is a good thing for experienced players. As a relatively new player (less than a year on osu!), i barely learnt rythm mechanics (doubles, triples, 1/4 beats or sliders, streams....) and it's hard to play "creative maps". I guess that i'm not the audience of such maps, but it's something to keep in mind : a big part of the community is bad at the game and just can't have fun playing these maps, despite their potential. As always, nice video !

[@kayineo201]

L' Avocat Being new to this game doesn't mean that you aren't the main audience. You should definitely give a try to mapping, and enhance your ear capacity. I'm nowhere near a good mapper, but I still try, mapping 20-30 seconds here and there, if I find an interesting song one day, I want to be able to map it, and put my ideas over through sliders and circles (my first ranked map will be a tech map, mark my words)

[@BarniHedgeturtle]

He meant that technical maps aren't for him since he has yet to git gud, therefore he sticks to generic ranked maps.

[@LAvocat]

BarniHedgeturtle Yeah, that's right, but he was not wrong tho.

[@asmylia9880]

You don't need to be a good player to be a good mapper. Pishi already made a video about that.

[@LAvocat]

Living Flower that's not the point, i am talking about why a big part of the community can't play these maps, leading them to say it's "garbage".

[@MrAlexsfs]

Hell yeah, one full hour of pishifat next week!

[@polyhedra7258]

The thing about HW’s maps is they are not only really cool to play, but also very pleasant to listen to. Genryuu Kaiko for example is so awesome, that sometimes I can play only for 30 min just to listen to it. The same goes to Kikoku Doukoku Jigokuraku, those insane sliders are placed exactly the way that makes you dive into the song!

[@ferryhmm]

I love Hollow Wings maps, finally you made a video about it :o

[@neonzada]

1 HOUR OF PISHIFAT LETS GO BOISSSSSS

[@lCharles445l]

7:32 RIP that set (and my guest diff lmao) Also that social experiment copypasta is really good

[@huanpham9024]

that feeling when u pass one of HW's map is really good i already passed Deconstruction Star Tsubaki Kaede and i'm really proud of myself hopefully there'll be more maps like those one in the future

[@Kachulu]

hello there o/

[@fishywishyfishfisk]

no u

[@sn0w0]

Why do you have 2 times less likes than some commentaries, only 2 answers, but still #1 commentary .-.

[@g2h5j3]

BySn0w hes a wizard

[@meta04]

2:48 highly-spaced fourth-beat circles... isn't that just that one part in the Insane difficulty of the Flaklypa default map? kzbin.info/www/bejne/oWOam6tpaMadq6s (Warning: my video. If you want to watch it (just me playing that map with/without HD) then ok. But don't use it as a music video)

[@atypicalcomplextimesignatures]

Big cursor

[@citriphos]

did he assume hollow wings' gender

[@roundpotato5837]

I found the edit button yesterday (I started yesterday) and now all I do on osu is map :) I will try to be creative as well btw.

[@YOLOgamer-yq8yf]

oh, the only map made by Hollow Wings I knew was Kikoku Doukoku Jigokuraku

[@justaleaf6711]

notch hell *or these words*

[@marcsebaaly4400]

but what if I have an idea and im stupid enough to just not be able to do it? explaining it is weird but consider it like a play field. you imagine all these great things you can do/put/play with yet you do none because you just don't know how to do it correctly? how can that be possible? idk but i've been feeling that way ever since I clicked on the edit button for the first time. it seems all weird to do thankfully tho you have been a great help to understand better

[@jadekick289]

4:45 I THOUGHT YOU ZOOMED IN, THE CS IS THAT BIG

[@antalpapp6467]

at least mappers doesnt map the same song over and over and over and over and over again :coughs:13 ranked harumachi clover maps :coughs: 9 ranked hitorigoto maps :coughs: im less than a year in osu! but im seeing a pattern here i know that my comment isnt really related to the video but i think that im not the only one realising this

[@災厄-b9o]

Antal Papp What is problem with mapping same song multiple times?

[@wearywolf727]

I just realized that I loved all of the maps that I knew that he mentioned, probably my favorite mapper ^w^

[@SirPablito]

5:04 Spring Signal :oo

[@yumeiraosu]

I LOVE spring signal and I found out you made it.... Thank you a lot........

[@LwL_]

There's one thing about HWs maps that would to me be the general "style", at least for the ones where I've actually paid attention to the mapping itself - they're consistent to a fault. The mapping is always the same, planned out to work that way, unless the song changes (even subtly). And I'm fairly sure that level of consistency is part of why they were able to rank those controversial maps in the end, because while people might not understand the reasons behind the mapping, they are very obviously not random. The average ranked map is consistent, but it has far more minor variations. Also they said they map all their maps in a single day which is probably why this is possible.

[@jan_asuli]

hey, i found a way around the 4x slider multiplier limit while tinkering with the editor, not sure if you knew about it: open your map's osu file, switch the "mode" to 3. this will make it mania but still save your notes. set your timing point up to 10x save your map then reopen your osu file and switch to mode 0 now you have a timing point with 10x or whatever.

[@mataznuiz]

no u

[@fishywishyfishfisk]

no w

[@BebxOfficial]

Bunch Berge Skip.

[@fdnt7_]

yes i

[@hiendlxxl]

Yeah 1hr video hype

[@o_s2232]

3:35 weeeeeeeee

[@CasperRaserbil]

One good very easy step would be to show off the highest rated maps in a certain timespan instead of the most played maps on the homepage. This would give more exposure to good maps and make rating maps more attractive (probably).

[@KartonRealista2]

The most creative maps are often the most controversial, so it would essentially display the most bland, inoffensive maps.

[@CasperRaserbil]

karton realista it already does that so it can't get any worse, right? :')

[@KartonRealista2]

Casper Röseby I thought you wanted to solve the issue not recreate it with different, but still boring maps.

[@CasperRaserbil]

karton realista thats the point but we happen to disagree on the effects that my proposal would have?

[@shime1956]

why are ppl angry at maps, like wtf?

[@kayineo201]

Shimemem Osu Creativity always had 2 sides. Sometimes you do something that looks cool to you but everyone hates it (except for the few in the back) That's just the case for HW's maps, he has been unlucky. Are you a mapper or a player? Or both, cause sometimes I get angry to a map because I feel like the map is completely undermapped, the song has more to offer than what the mapper gives, tho I keep my thoughts for me, and I'm not angry against the mapper either. Never got this feeling?

[@absurddive]

Some players say that HW's maps are "overmapped" and completely unplayable. (PP obsessed players used to stuff like osu.ppy.sh/s/444335) Some players are angry at HW because he/she often refuses to change the map in order to make it "playable", therefor creating drama. "if you can't pass a map, blame yourself not the map/the mapper" - HW (The quote was deleted from the user's page)

[@shime1956]

N1nj4 its *she* btw, and thanks

[@shime1956]

KayINeo im a player but ive testplayed some random maps and modded friend maps(like helping improve stuff etc). And to be honest, I love maps like these that standout from the rest. Its like a new experience. I dont and never will hate a map. Even if its pp map or a map by some contriversial player(because some reason i dont even get), as long its well map, its good.

[@Mattheus368]

Because people care too much about things that isn't supossed to be cared at all

[@bananya6020]

I think hw and other mappers want to "break" the ranking process, i.e. make maps that are great but never got ranked rankable by giving people a reason to say "hey, hollow wings did it, I can do it too" to diversify

[@awoolensleevelet]

hollow wings makes some of my favourite maps

[@バカロン]

if this kind of maps doesn't get ranked, it won't be that bad as some might think you still can play them as unranked/loved maps, and experience something new also this kind of maps doesn't give pp, because it's not Sotarks, and pp system is outdated by years so to me maps' status doesn't matter, but the map itself does, and does a lot. nice logical (!) conclusion: Hollow Wings is the best std and ctb mapper

[@maddafakka7783]

ITS FINALLY HERE LOL (remember i asked you to make this like an year and some ago xd)

[@bananya6020]

I think that maps with gimmicks like HW should "ease" you into the gimmick- make the gimmicks, you know, playable and fun to play as well as creative.

[@deso2]

nacht 100

[@emilyddeer]

wow straight to the point

[@septclues]

deso z this obviously

[@imeverywhere629]

There is a really unknown mapper you should check, his name is Ambrew. You really gotta check at least one of his maps out.

[@PhilipHubbe]

It's crazy to think that he was sitting on those sliders for 3 years!

[@Doggo420]

I think its like music and ranked maps are songs on the radio 😄

[@cycopton3673]

Turn on captions 3:35 weeeeeeeee

[@clem5858]

An hour-long video? I look forward to it ;o

[@hifumindesu6784]

1:53 1:58 2:08 2:11 2:33 2:38 3:07 3:46 3:52 3:57 4:13 4:29 4:38 4:52 watch till the end.

[@RummyLPs]

Hey pishifat! I am very interested in playing more maps that aren't as generic. Do you maybe have a list of a few mappers that have unranked maps that are very creative? Because I don't know where to look for them since there are also so many just bad maps if you try to look through all maps instead of just the ranked ones.

[@abjoern]

Ramy Hmaid the loved category is a good place to start

[@RummyLPs]

Thanks! Especially with the recent increase in loved maps that should give me plenty of maps to play!

[@FLarezzedits]

Ramy Hmaid not an expert on this but a lot of maps i have been playing for a while are getting loved recently so i can give you a start. -Neilperry -Handsome -Professionalbox -Ameth Rianno -Cassu2 -Sing -Denosaur -LowcomboFC -Pritti (he stopped mapping though) -xLolicore -Kevincella -Taku -Mir -Evilelvis ( he changed his name tho) -rrtyui -Rustbell -Midge -Alumetorz -Mel -09kami -RLC -akali -Nathan -Zer0- -SionKotori -Nerova Riuz GX -Suzuki_1112 -C00L -Halgoh

[@RummyLPs]

I saved your comment for future use. Thanks so much!

[@fabbae215]

Search for Akali! :D

[@macchiato_1881]

now his mapping style will be the new meta :D

[@UmCaraNormalnumPlanetanormal]

very good mapping

[@elo3624]

Hollow Wings has a weird but a great mapset, really HARD to play

[@ivebeangood4091]

How would you find some of these weird songs to fit creative techniques and stuff

[@Mr.Coincidence]

I just think that the editor itself needs to support creative mapping in the first place. 2b and such would open the flood gates to creative mapping being taken seriously in rank. The rules themselves don't need to broken. But a couple of restrictions could be bent in our favor.

[@tarragon112]

i think mapping is more of an artform nowadays

[@TheCassual]

Mfw I thought you were going to hover the cursor over my map at 9:32 (the one below handsome's) but you didn't FeelsBadMan

[@ImLlaver]

Hour long video hypeeeee

[@Grimpep]

But Sotarks is alive......

[@OtterSou]

3:35 “weeeee” (captions)

[@cavemann_]

Ok, you helped me make my mind. I'm gonna do it, I will go with this ridiculous idea. I WILL PERFECT MY IDEAS!

[@cavemann_]

I didn't manage to perfect my ideas, it was the wrong solution for the wrong problem I have however managed to achieve a part of what I set out to do

[@l1mi13]

HW sure is an important mapper that made plenty of good maps, cant argue against that. Some days im even in the mood for a map that butcher the rhythm of a song with either super long and fast sliders or just one big stream. But.. in general I prefer the easier HW maps. (not impressed by SV x10)

[@fr3fou]

I'm confused, didn't hollow wing's newest map get ranked? (You stated that it got disqualified, unless I went big brain mode)

[@pishifat]

video was written while the map was qualified, so covered both possibilities

[@fr3fou]

oh, I see. Thanks for the answer! Didn't expect the man himself to reply :D

[@qingishida4777]

wait is that the two witch in evenicle 0:56 god I love that game towa best waifu

[@CamelliaFlingert]

wish i could mapping good, but i don't have any creativity and my head completely empty, i'm spends 1-5 hours to add 5-10 notes/sliders in my map, my brain working absolutely awful, i have troubles with any rhythms and music, every time when i'm trying to mapping something it instantly turns into some terrible unplayable slider tech garbage, just because i don't understand how to create any patterns and want to make tech map with fast and long sliders and so on, like Minorsonek (Sakuraburst - dragonlands) or what pishifat shows in video (pegboard nerds - superstar), and so on, i just can't even put easiest and simplest things (like jumps on obvious rhythm) it's just turns into some random circles everywhere, i'm just hate myself and my useless brain, can't learn anything anywhere, can't learn how to write music, can't learn how to draw and now can't learn how to mapping.

[@ZeldaMstr109]

pishi, i remember one time in axarious' stream he was talking about hw maps, he said that genryuu kaiko uses overlapping streams... idk, thought i'd point it out.

[@MoriPika]

Holy moly that's my osu account at 1:24

[@phamdinhhoang1998]

Could you do about aleph-0?

[@venix42]

mm...... isn't Hollow Wings a girl?

[@qwuzzy]

this guy didn't watch the ending

[@venix42]

ye i commented when i was watching the video so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@hypercyte]

He's just trying to be creative

[@razetime]

I thought hollow wings was a guy

[@Sickliff]

There are no girls on the internet.

[@nao__channel]

hw is the best mapper to ever touch osu

[@davidwu3076]

Best way to map is to map by the music and its mood. Fuck farm maps. All my homies hate farm maps.

[@rokadee7603]

I hate subconsciously restricted ideas Edit: that's it Imma fan of Hollowings now.

[@ZeldaMstr109]

someone plz respond with hw quote that's saying "you're too weak" or something a;wut hpawe otuhaw

[@Lucina77]

One hour pishifat ?! GachiGasm

[@shoopy9842]

why did i have 10 of the 16 maps on that starting scene?

[@yamatonoke2928]

Click the circle

[@fuwameanssoft]

So, if you’re a new mapper, and you try something relatively creative, it won’t get ranked? Well, I can kiss Nippon Manju goodbye...

[@Vullifer1074]

first 20 seconds and i agree with his viewpoint on ranked maps. honestly to me most of them are not nearly as fun as unranked maps. Unranked is where the diversity is which allows for more fun gameplay. but most ranked maps are boring and very similar

[@Menolifee]

hollow wings is the best mapper of all time

[@wolfetteplays8894]

1:54 HOLLOW WINGS IS A GIRL

[@feliceclefie8450]

Since when he's a girl? He stated in ask fm that he was never a girl. Sorry bad grammar and replying to a 1 year old comment lol

[@ToeNail190]

The fact u sound like the tutorial voice

[@Knowth1ng]

He is He voiced him

[@existenceispain2099]

>disagrees with no creative ranked maps uses some loved maps LUL

[@asmylia9880]

existence is pain technically, those maps got *_ranked_* as loved. So....

[@lol-mu1hv]

hey pishifat! how do you add kudosu to a map?

[@PluginArtz]

her*

[@yonath5619]

If your map isn't made to be played, why even try to make it ranked?

[@bgfighter2166]

ask akali LUL LUL LUL

[@hosti4051]

hello reason 3

[@leshuarez2881]

Make an episode on Tech maps Please

[@ScubDomino]

He already did

[@brunosh]

hey your skin is private? if not can you put it in the description? plsssssssssss :333

[@deathbringer2000]

How do I make 2009 style maps? Asking for some maps I wanna make :D

[@Knowth1ng]

Try to make it like less cool looking or modern or just search up like the 2009 maps in osu and find a song made in that time Might help you a bit Also use the 2009 maps as a reference on how it should look like or should not look like

[@astrisk7380]

What is the song at 0:40?

[@mendozerosu3041]

9:27 ;)

[@kecHik445]

>Hollow Wings >Creative maps Choose one only

[@ClassicMist360]

*in patricks voice* WHAAATS THE DIFFERENCE?

[@x_Aroma]

Celektus lies here triggered about pishi calling HW "his" before the vid ends R i p

[@shaami8622]

i blame sotarks for ranking generic and easy and making pp maps

[@nitrous1001]

I used to make less-generic maps. What ruined me are the modders. I had nothing to back myself up in the past and all I had is "it felt like this so it had to be this". Since I was desperate for ranking earlier on, I stuck on with the generic style mindset. Now I regret it.

[@rem7450]

high bpm sliders = truly innovative

[@Buizie]

HW is ♡

[@petersndergaard9674]

she*

[@John-zy3ko]

Innovative... ahem *me & u*

[@anhedxnia]

I do not comment about gender

[@CreativeWorkflowHack]

btw clusterfck sliders are NOT creative.

[@joelmcguire3136]

some people are mapping anime songs like they make money off of it...

[@Josde_]

Map at 4:33? Cant find it in desc D:

[@polyhedra7258]

Just type in “notch hell”, its ranked

[@Josde_]

No, I meant the one that pops up between 4:33 and 4:38 for a sec, song is really catchy and it isn't in desc I think :(

[@mmelloe]

how come he told us not to comment about gender and calls HW a "he"? does pishifat know something about HW that we dont

[@Nikindo]

I need the skin ;D

[@VictorHugo-kf8px]

ADAMAS VETO