The Question that Stops Christians in Their Tracks (Greg Koukl Response)

[@roy1701d]

"How to Use Tactical Dishonesty to Prove How Honest You Are." 🙂

[@pmtoner9852]

Aka- tricking people into Christianity

[@furious32ninja]

Yes Phil and all whilst avoiding the answer you don't want to give as it will make you and your religion look abhorrent!

[@rubenalbrecht3066]

Especally dishonest to himself. Maybe he doesn't want to convince anyone else in the first place or distract them from an asshole truth, but rather himself?

[@katarinatibai8396]

😂😂😂 - 💯

[@rubenalbrecht3066]

@Shelby Larouche ?

[@huepix]

Classic Christian. "If I'd told the truth, people would have got the wrong impression". So bearing false witness is the "tactic".

[@skwills1629]

That's not what he said.

[@RetroBackslash]

@@skwills1629 What did he say then?

[@therawkhawk64]

@@skwills1629 He may as well have said that. It was certainly the meaning and intent behind the words.

[@skwills1629]

@@therawkhawk64 - No, it wasn't. I actually Listend to what he said. Its the Meaning and Intent You and other Atheists Like You want him to have. It confirms your Bias we're supposed to Think You don't have. You want to see Christians as Dishonest so You twist it. But all He's saying is, sometimes People ask questions with the intent of making You look bad. He is not saying to Lie for Jesus, or that Honesty is the wrong approach, He's saying that You should be Careful because giving a Plain Answer to a Trap Question can Lead to People distorting what You said to make You sound like a Bad Person. In a perverse wy, You've all Proven him Right as well since that's exactly what You're doing here. You are twisting what He said in order to make Him out to be a Bad Person. Yuthen use this to bash all Christians.

[@therawkhawk64]

@@skwills1629 Are you really sure? If he's worried about "giving the wrong impression" by giving the "correct answer" to the question, then what does that say to you? Especially when he then says "Here's how to avoid giving that answer by asking ambiguous questions with unclear terms that will trick you into saying what I want you to say." There's a problem here, and I don't think it's the viewpoint of the atheist that is the issue. I listen to his words and examine the meaning (as Paul demonstrates in the video), and something definitely doesn't add up. This isn't a "bias", nor is it to "make him look bad". It's just looking at the meaning of the words and the intent behind them. If an atheist did the same thing, I'd call them out too. It's not about making the other side look bad, it's about having an intellectually honest discussion. What meaning I "want" there to be doesn't matter. What matters is the meaning and intent behind the words, and I sense intellectually dishonest and disingenuous intent to dodge a question that should be a simple "yes" or "no" answer. Both sides of this discussion through the ages are guilty of "twisting words". Some atheists I know twist the words of Christians, and Christians I know twist the words of atheists. It's up to everyone to keep everyone else honest, otherwise the discourse falls to petty bickering and name-calling instead of an honest discussion where both sides present arguments based on evidence, which both sides discuss said evidence.

[@Arnisboy]

Greg Koukl deserves some sort of award for managing to make Deepak Chopra look reasonable and intellectually honest in comparison

[@skwills1629]

You do Know Pastor Paulogia of Your Ii Have no Religion Religion Lied about what Kaukl said, Right? Of course You do. But you prefer the Lie to The Truth.

[@deuslapis5247]

@@skwills1629 it's impressive that your comment is so impossible to read even after editing.

[@skwills1629]

@@deuslapis5247 - Why do Atheists need to Call People as Stupid or other names or Insult them instead of Actually Addressing what They say?

[@deuslapis5247]

@@skwills1629 It wasn't meant as an insult. I had no clue where you were going with that. Its hard to respond to your arguments if I cant understand them.

[@skwills1629]

@@deuslapis5247 - No, its meant to be an Insult. And I am Sick of it. Especially since its not Just Me. Your most Respecter "Not-Pastors" like Owen Morgan AKA Telltale Mocks People for the same General Reason. If You have an Accent he finds Funny he Ridicules You as Stupid and says he can't Understand You. One Typo and a Christian is an idiot. Not to Mention all the Times You Lot call something a Christian says Word Salad. It gets Old.

[@timothyhicks3643]

“I’ll pardon you if you agree to believe I killed my son” -an insane judge

[@atheistechoes9594]

Best analogy ever

[@pandora8610]

"my son who is also myself"

[@allenanderson4911]

I committed suicide, because I require murder, and got tired of having you murder animals for me.

[@Greyz174]

"that I didn't even kill permanently"

[@UnconventionalReasoning]

@@pandora8610 therefore suicide must be acceptable in christianity...

[@BushcraftingBogan]

So if telling people what you actually believe “makes you look bad”, maybe the problem has nothing to do with the questions being asked. Maybe?

[@commonsense5494]

That's why they're called "apologists". SOMEBODY has to apologize for this nonsense.

[@sarahotto6006]

I remember in high school, a classmate of mine committed suicide. Another classmate made a statement along the lines of "I hope God grants him mercy but he'll probably go to hell." My response was along the lines of "if that's what you believe, that God would condemn a 16 year old to hell for one action, then you can take your self-righteousness and your version of a loving God and shove it." The teacher, who was a the psych teacher, told my classmate that maybe she should keep her opinion on something no one can know for sure to herself since it wasn't helpful to those grieving.

[@davidschneide5422]

Oh, you're definitely going straight to hell, pal...not for what you said, but because of your screen name. Might as well write "anti-christ"

[@BushcraftingBogan]

david schneide LOL! :D

[@placebo4121]

@@commonsense5494 Why does "God"need apologists anyhow? Why does he need imperfect middle men/women at all?

[@fedos]

Wow, he basically admitted that his tactics are disingenuous.

[@xoqvuz]

Sounds like Islamic Taqiya

[@DemonicRemption]

@fedos Yeah he's lying in the name of God, so it's all good. :p

[@chetwalker9193]

In what way?

[@shinywarm6906]

not just disingenuous, actively dishonest

[@BinaryLizard]

The sad thing is, he doesn’t realize it, because he’s so busy praising himself for his awesome tactics that are going to pull the wool over every gullible listener’s eyes .

[@RetroBackslash]

- The Question that Stops Christians in Their Tracks - The Comments Disabled that Stops Questions in Their Tracks

[@galacticbob1]

This comment needs more likes 😄👍

[@ChrisFineganTunes]

The number of times I've been incandescent with rage at some horrific apologetics video only to hit the 'comments disabled' wall! To be honest it's probably saved me from myself on occasion.

[@fly_8659]

@@ChrisFineganTunes I feel you. Once upon a time KZbin had a video response system built in. The system was axed via blog post "So long, video responses..." Aug 27th 2013. Now days, apologists curate a walled garden, with comments off or if they're active channels, multiple pages of pin'd comments before the first negative response can be seen... betraying the lack of confidence that their flock's ability to interact with dissenting opinions. I've been surprised by TikTok's inclusion of a response format. The app also provides greater opportunities for dissenting opinions on all sides, based on the user's individual preference for novelty, gauged by TikTok's machine learning algorithm. Although a content creator can control comments (or turn them off), anyone can create a response video. Responses feel far less like screaming into the wind. They feel more likely to be bubble up in front of the eyeballs of individuals who might be having doubts and are receptive to new perspectives.

[@skwills1629]

@@ChrisFineganTunes - Bing enraged is why they are disabled. You don't want to have a Reasonable dicussion. You want to feel Anger and Hatred then use that to justify Hatred of Christains. It makes You feel good to Hate.

[@ChrisFineganTunes]

SK Wills I love having reasonable discussions. I made it clear that the videos in question were, in my opinion, 'horrific'. i.e. Not reasonable. I think I made it clear in my comment that I don't consider my anger to be necessarily useful or fruitful. And I don't think you can, in good faith, read my comment as evidence of a hatred of Christians. Many Christian doctrines, however, are deeply hateful and destructive and I'll rail against them until the cows (or the sheep and the goats) come home.

[@llwpeaches]

The fact that a person has to jump through so many hoops and utilize so many manipulative tactics just to defend their faith suggests that it's probably not a faith worth having.

[@Damnitjim7]

Don't let someone whose terrible at math, sway you from being interested in math.

[@llwpeaches]

@@Damnitjim7 That's a rather nonsensical analogy that completely misses the point of my original comment.

[@jmurphy2404]

Double wow: "I would have answered correctly, but would have given the wrong impression.". Better to deceive them gently into the knowledge they'll burn for eternity.

[@placebo4121]

It's all about putting notches on his belt.Bang bang!Pow pow!

[@johnjordan3314]

Nailed it!

[@johnjordan3314]

placebo and money in his pocket

[@ericvulgate]

deceive them into deception

[@NovaSaber]

And he still managed to leave a bad impression in the process anyway.

[@Emymagdalena]

“Do you think homicide should be punished” “Yeah, sure.” “And have YOU ever done anything bad?” “I’ve lied to my mom.” Ah I see, we both deserve a life sentence.

[@curiousnerdkitteh]

And this is how children who had a fight with their sibling confess this terrible sin to the holy Catholic priests who molest children. I'm pretty sure the way these creeps justify it is by saying "all sin is equal before God" and hey when we get to heaven God will heal all suffering so I guess it's ok to be a monster because everything is about the next life anyway. 🤮 (That argument about this life being meaningless and only the next life counting is what I hear from Christians all the time).

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

Death will take you away. God made a way to escape but you're too full of condemnation like Satan hating truth to hear.

[@Aliali-vc3pk]

What nonsense paganism drug your taking😅

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

​@@Aliali-vc3pk You been hurt in life, so we all have. Jesus risen again to lift you up but the choice is yours to stay in a mud pen like a pig slinging dirt. Your dirty preaching is worthless slop to me.

[@loganleatherman7647]

@gemmeerobinson1803 More like the fragile human ego made up God as a means to attempt to escape death. You have no proof of a God or an afterlife, so what are you on about?

[@nathanjasper512]

Has he ever considered that the reason he would have looked bad if he answered correctly was because his belief IS bad? Of course not. Amazing unawareness.

[@JayMaverick]

They don't get paid to be aware.

[@Julian0101]

They get paid to not be aware

[@SanjeevSharma-vk1yo]

does misleading sophistry qualify as "giving false witness"? Or would it have, when "giving false witness" was allegedly written on tablets (Leviticus or Exodus?)

[@MegaeffinGarchomp17]

Lol

[@markhackett2302]

You mistake it if you think his beliefs are bad is, to him, a thing he wishes was not true. He WANTS them to be bad, just in the way he believes them.

[@muskyoxes]

This would have been an easy escape even without help. "Should bad things be punished?" "Yes" "Have you done bad things?" "Yes" "What will happen when you're called to account for those things?" "Something far less than perpetual torture, i presume."

[@skwills1629]

Repeating The Atheist Exp3irnce Infinite Punishments For Finite Crimes Garbage only Proves You are not Serious.

[@goldencalf13]

@@skwills1629 how so?

[@colinriches1519]

@@skwills1629 Proves? Explain how that "proves" anything.

[@skwills1629]

@@colinriches1519 - You don't Think for Yourselves and don't Understand Christianity. You also Out No Effort into understanding Christianity, as The Reasons saying Things like Infinite Punishment for Finite Crimes is Misrepresentative of Christian Beliefs is not difficult to Discover for Free online. As much as You lot Lie about having studied Christianity, it is Obvious You simply Repeat the Garbage Anti-Christian Atheists said about it and don't Try to Understand Christianity. You don't even do basic Fact Checking. Instead of Demanding an Explanation You Will ignore from me or Dismiss with the other Christians Disagree You don't Speak for All Christians 45 Million Denominations Routine, Try doing some Actual Fact Checking. Skimming a Webpage to Find a Sentence to back up what You want to beleive is not Fact Checking.

[@richmondvand147]

Tbh serving a trite, jealous, murderous, simpleton being for eternity sounds just as bad lol. Being a slave for the rest of eternity sounds awful

[@Camerinus]

When Deepak, of all people, can be used against apologists... Christianity is in trouble.

[@tomnanD3]

I thought the same thing.

[@Ric885]

@S Gloobal actually it's dying xD people are leaving in waves

[@HDTbyENOCK]

​@S Gloobal The reason why there are SOOOO many christian sub-religions is because the bible ISN'T clear at all. You just said "christianity is growing" then went back on it when you were challenged about that claim, and at the end tried to claim something else in order to justify your error, like come on dude, you're are CLEARLY not in any position to make any claims.

[@Camerinus]

@S Gloobal You wrote: "Christianity continues to grow" ─ Which Christianity? There is only one kind of Christianity that is growing in a few parts of the world, and that's the mega churches. Are you a member of a mega church? Are you supporting a pastor who uses his tax-exempted status to build a business empire? Are you being defrauded of your money to finance your pastor's gated villa? If so, keep on giving to the smiling pastor. Soon he will be able to afford his private jet! There's actually another sect of Christianity that is growing, and that's Catholicism, simply because of the increase of population in the underdeveloped world ─ Mexico, the Philippines, much of sub-Saharan Africa, etc. etc. Almost everyone is taught his parents' religion at an age when critical thinking is not yet developed. That's why Christianity is growing.

[@robertkaslow3720]

Barney the Dinosaur could be used against the apologists who need to go salesman/politician to answer the question in the video being reviewed.

[@paulnolan4971]

Look how pleased Greg is with himself about his deception of the gullible. mmkay

[@TheKyrix82]

The answer to the Colombo tactic is to tell them: "Stop dodging the question, I'm not going to let you change the subject, answer me." I run into this on a regular basis. They think I'm mean.

[@miboogaroo]

Yup I get this all the time...

[@letsomethingshine]

I usually say "You are just changing the subject because you can't answer it to any satisfactory way...that's OK, if you need to do that we'll do that" it means you are highlighting that your arguments won the previous point unless they want to stop changing course and go back on track... In which case, they can't avoid the reasoning. Sucks that people are often automatically disengenous enough to favor ignorance, but C'est la vie. "Let's move on to a new strand because your argument lost in that previous strand" often comes of as less "mean" than nagging then into staying on a topic that is hurting their heads with cognitive dissonance. Remember to jot down the points moved away from because ignorance and forgetting are a coping mechanism to keep our previous biases.

[@emmanuelpiscicelli6232]

We call it the Socratic method, but, well.

[@skwills1629]

@@emmanuelpiscicelli6232 - Its not The Socratic Method though. It is simply being Belligerent. The Socratic Method has at its core the intent of finding a Truth. You and Your Fellows have as the objective to tear down and discredit Christianity regardless of Truth.

[@skwills1629]

If You say "Stop dodging the Question, I;m not going o let You change the subject, Answer Me":, You will be confirming that You are only concerned Attacking Him, and His Beliefs, and that You simply wish to find an excuse to use to Claim He is Evil. He did not Dodge the Question. Nor is He changing the Subject. Its not like Someone Asked Him Why We need Jesus to be Saved and if We go to Hell if not Christian only for Him to talk about the Moon Landing. You did not, of course, listen to what Koulk actually said. You didn't even pay attention completely to Pastor Paulogia of The Atheist Religion You follow. (And yes I Know, Atheism is not a Religion yadayadayada...I didn't say it was, but You have made a Religion out of being an Atheist.) Koulk said You do not give a direct Answer, but instead ask them a series of Questions which is then used to gain their admission of how they agree on the acceptance of certain premises, then to have them Draw the Logical Inference from those Premises. He is still discussing the Need of Jesus in Salvation from a Christian Perspective. He is simply allowing the Petitioner to arrive at the COnclusion and hopefully gain an appriciation of why it is so, instead of giving a direct Answer which will be Twisted to beat Him over the Head with. Saying He is Changing the SUbject may fit the Image of how He is DIshonest and is advising other Christians to be Dishonest, but in turn, it is a DIshonest way to depict what He is saying.

[@JosephJamesScott]

Basically Greg is saying here that "My actual belief system is so monstrously damning if you actually examine it I've come up with a work around so we can trick people into agreeing with us."

[@DjVortex-w]

At least I appreciate his honesty. He is, essentially, saying "don't bother trying to explain things rationally and with actual arguments, because you will just lose; instead, resort to these underhanded conversational tactics like dodging the question, reversing the burden of proof, turning the question back at the other person (rather than, you know, answering the question), moving goalposts, and so on." You know, because the important thing is not to give valid arguments, the important thing is to feel that you have won the argument, and everything is allowed in order to achieve that goal.

[@stevedriscoll2539]

The christian theists have had thousands of years of practice at this style of engagement. Now, the western world is full of hardcore leftists (or rightist) idealogues that use these types of tactics. We all do this on a daily basis (some less than others). We are all influenced by the people and circumstances around us. Some people just get sick of being part of the lies being perpetuated and get sick of lying to themselves, and begin to try to find something that is actually true. I think whether they find some form of truth or not, they tend to stand out to those around them.

[@skwills1629]

That is how Atheists like Pastor Paulogia of the Atheist Religion Argue. Ironically,l You have to Lie about what Kaullk said.

[@skwills1629]

@@stevedriscoll2539 - If Yiu were sick of Lies You;d not be a Part of the Modern Atheist Movement.

[@DjVortex-w]

@@skwills1629 That's the most amazing projection I have seen in quite a while. His videos are _full_ of logical arguments. Can you point out where he's dodging questions, reversing the burden of proof, etc?

[@stevedriscoll2539]

@@skwills1629 I am not an atheist by an stretch of anybody's definition...I have the courage to be forthright and say I believe in the God of Spinoza..nor am I allied in any way with atheists or any sort of movement

[@TheAsaoirc]

"it's very belligerent of you to point out I believe the vast majority of humanity is going to be subject to, and presumably deserving of, eternal torment."

[@iwasjustintrance]

How dare you get what we believe correctly!!!

[@thejudgmentalcat]

Thereby proving my theory that fundamental religious folks are all sadists at heart.

[@pacifistnuke6111]

Yes, especially the people who have never even heard of Jesus and thus are doomed to hell by no fault of their own without even having the opportunity to be saved.

[@GapWim]

Now, behold my righteous indignation as I use dishonest conversation tactics to weasle my way out of this!

[@anchorthesun3438]

Why do you believe you deserve eternal paradise for merely existing ?

[@whysoserious8666]

“... I have no intention of answering the question you asked.” Pretty standard apologist tactic.

[@robertprado5125]

Nick Nack 😂

[@robertprado5125]

Republican playbook

[@brettmciver432]

I find Atheist do it all the time especially when i ask this one question , how many blind chance chemical evolutionary (abiogenesis) changes are required to go from mud to life , and how many genetic changes (evolution) are required to go from first life to man in the 4 billion years since the process(es) began. i either get ignored or abused for challenging them , for this question challenges their religious faith in blind chance flying spaghetti monster god of the gaps blind faith that does not exist. also a related question how does natural selection work when at the beginning there was nothing to select from?

[@nolanpowers191]

just because you think that the question you asked is a yes or no question doesn’t mean it is necessarily.

[@brettmciver432]

@@nolanpowers191 huh?? My question is not a yes or no answer! 😒🙄🤔

[@MetaphorUB]

Should I be punished for doing “bad things?” Okay. Have I committed any finite, worldly crimes deserving of eternal damnation? Yeah, I wanna say no.

[@inyobill]

THat's my standard reply, too. What could I have done that would cause a benevolent god to codemn me to reternal torture? Come on, get real.

[@matthewsubramani]

That’s why he wants to save you from sin! Because that leads to hell because he loves you too much to leave you on the path that doesn’t lead to the best of what he has in store for you! God bless

[@Nyma6000]

@@matthewsubramanican’t he just turn the devil back to a good angel, or remove evil and sin from humans, since he’s an omnipotent god? not trying to attack you or anything but that never made sense to me.

[@matthewsubramani]

@@Nyma6000 then we wouldn’t have a choice. God would be removing free will: one of his greatest gifts. It’s like if a person had a liking towards a person, if they truly love them, they would give them a choice to choose between them or what they think is going to satisfy them. God is the same way, he knows what’s best for you but he wants to let you choose. He wants to show you that he loves you and he wants to build a relationship with you. I appreciate the question though and if you have any more, feel free to ask. God bless brother

[@Nyma6000]

@@matthewsubramani thank u for the respectful reply, i really am just genuinely curious, im not trying to attack ur religion! So then my next question is: then couldn’t he make it like that AND give us free will? Since he’s omnipotent and can do anything, he could make it possible for us to live without evil and have free will?

[@Never-mind1960]

Nothing stops apologists. Whenever their "arguments" get debunked, they just straw-man the debunking. (Note the apologist trolls in the comments below if you don't believe me.)

[@catelynh1020]

So you say "the science says that earth is old"? I'm gonna tell my friends you think that adam and eve lived for 60 million years and laugh at your foolishness --edit just in case-- Not being serious

[@chaseharrison5469]

I’ll be interested to see if any apologetics channels or Greg himself respond.

[@Krikenemp18]

Quite possibly the strongest evidence that they are just desperately trying to keep a falsehood alive.

[@bskec2177]

@@catelynh1020 Does the bible say anything about how much time elapsed between Creation and The Fall? Maybe God created the world 4 billion years ago, but Adam didn't eat fruit until about 10 000 years ago. Maybe I shouldn't put these ideas out there, some Christian might take them seriously.

[@catelynh1020]

@@bskec2177 that would be a new interpretation of the bible, which is supposed to be their truth and self-evident. If they accepted that, then they'd have to accept that they don't understand their book, which would be a huge problem for the faith. On the other hand, since god said be fruitful and multiply before they ate the apple, you'd think there'd be a lot more humans around and they'd be pissed AF that adam and eve got everyone kicked out of the garden. Damn, i really need my bible on hand. I had one at some point but lost it and never cared to look for it. I only ever used it to look up the weirdest things anyways

[@fred_derf]

Greg: "If you answer truthfully and honestly you're going to be in trouble, so here's how to avoid doing that". So much for the ninth commandment there, Greggy-poo.

[@tim57243]

@Scartoons You are probably talking about the version of the Ten Commandments in Exodus 34, which does say not to boil a goat in its mother's milk. www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus%2034&version=NIV&interface=amp But the numbering of those commandments is unclear.

[@tim57243]

@demigodzilla Right. It is about perjury. Lying while proselytizing is apparently okay. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thou_shalt_not_bear_false_witness_against_thy_neighbour

[@fred_derf]

@demigodzilla, writes _"The ninth commandment doesn't prohibit lying."_ Really? That's what you're going with to justify this asshat's lies?

[@FakingANerve]

@@fred_derf you might want to reread his second comment...

[@DemonicRemption]

@Fred Derf Hey Lucifer himself was once an angel, so I'm not surprised. :p

[@frankguetta9529]

Paulogia, you certainly have found a unique approach at dealing with creationists claims. Every episode is unmissable.

[@kevinconrad6156]

His done his research. Go Paul Go!

[@johnjordan3314]

Fact check: True

[@skwills1629]

this is not a Creationist Claim. I Do not Know if the Bloke in the Video he responded o is a Creationist, but the subject had nothing to do with Creationism.

[@skwills1629]

@@kevinconrad6156 - Paul said the Argument froM Embarrassment is only in Biblical Studies. He has not done his Research as that is simply not True.

[@TheAsaoirc]

@@skwills1629 he addressed that in his bury: the evidence video, and has amended the statement.

[@pmtoner9852]

I'm glad this guy finally admits that apologist main job is to gloss over some of the more difficult points of Christianity

[@JeremyTaylor]

"Do you think people who commit moral crimes aught to be punished?" "Hmm... if someone said my name in vain and refused to believe I was real, I wouldn't want them to be punished for all eternity"

[@cdreid9999]

You like most christians dont k ow what that means. It means dont claim to speak for god. You can imagine why none of the false prophets teach that

[@JeremyTaylor]

@@cdreid9999 if someone falsely claimed to speak for you, would you want that person to suffer for all eternity? Most sane people wouldn't want that.

[@inyobill]

@@cdreid9999 How do you know that is the valid interpretation of the injunction?

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

God doesn't either but man teams up with Satan against life. Satan is firing you up to curse life with burning hatred. You not too bright.

[@jackbutler2446]

Let him without sin cast the first stone

[@eliot451reade5]

I once had a Christian ask me that very same question, "Do you believe people should be punished for wrong actions?" I answered no and I gave this example. Once one of my 6th grade students took two cookies from me when he was only entitled to take one. I let the "theft" slide because I loved the student, I knew he had been working hard and I saw no real harm in him taking that second cookie. This threw the Christian off balance. It was a true story by the way.

[@utubepunk]

Wait, the student that "stole" the extra cookie wasn't a prosecutor?? A very unbelievable story! 😁

[@skwills1629]

Not only bunk, but not a good story. You are OK with less than Moral conduct.

[@eliot451reade5]

I'll tell you what I'm not OK with, lying to children. In America most children are taught that our big buddy the Invisible Sky Daddy will whisk them away to cloud coo coo land. Is it any wonder so many of us can't understand simple scientific facts? Religion rots minds and destroys lives.

[@skwills1629]

@@eliot451reade5 -You aren't Angry that Children are being Lied to. After all, You just Lied. Religion does not Rot the Mind, and belief in God does not make understanding Scientific Facts Harder. But calling God an Invisible Sky Daddy does. Its Misrepresentation. Its also something You didn't come up with, so the whole idea that religion tells You what to think and Atheists are Free thinkers who come to their own Conclusions isn;t True either. Atheism is not Science. And God is not an invisible Sky Daddy. And You do not think for Yourself s this Invisible SKy Daddy rubbish is something Your Pastors of Your Religion told You. Just classifying Peoplkes beleifs as Lies then calling them Liars is itself a form of Lying. And We all Know Atheists like You say You have no Burden of Proof as Atheism is not a belief bu a lack of belief, so its not like Your willing to Prove Your Claims are True. Instead You Lie again, and say You made no Claims, even tough calling God an invisible Sky Daddy is done specifically to say God does not exist and You are an idiot for believing in God. You also call Atheism the "Default Position" so it can't actually be a lack of belief in a god. After all, a lack of belief van[t be a position, either. Or a Null Hypothesis. You have a Religion You want to shove down everyone elses throats. No I did not call Atheism a Religion. And saying an Atheist like You follows a Religion is not the same as :Atheism is a Religion" either.

[@rosheacarrington1604]

@@skwills1629 a thiest a saying athiests are unwilling to provide evidence is the funniest thing I've ever heard have you ever talked to one and athiesm isn't religion buddy do your reserch though that might be asking to much from a person that thinks an invisible man will take you into the clouds when you die because you read it in a book somewhere and athiests may not know every thing but they are sure willing to tell give more evidence than any thiest ,"You have a Religion You want to shove down everyone elses throats" that's funny because that's exactly what thiests do and guess what most athiest dont even care if your into religion its just you guys are always slandering us and pushing your religion in our faces and all we do is point out its errors , and if you still think athiesm is religion we don gather on a specific day to sing songs about math equations and pray to our imaginary friend , in fact as athesits our lives the only thing our lives are led by are our morals rules not ones tht we given to us by some book written over a couple thousand years ago that not ever the creator them self doesn't follow and most of us don't belittle any one who believes in religion we only take offence when you try tell people and children that they well suffer for eternity just because they don't believe what you do and just so you know athiesms means lack of belive in or disbelief in the existence of god does that mean we have 100% evidence hes not real no but at the same time you can't exactly disprove the existence of the flying spaghetti monster can you we might not have every piece of evidence but were sure willing to give up 100 times more than any evidence thiests have .good by sir this i me being genuine i have no care for religious bs so i you want an actual conversation im all ears

[@a.j.hernandez3537]

@4:23 Hi, Paul. I'm a lawyer. Leading questions are not considered dishonest. They are not allowed to be used during direct examination (questioning your own witnesses) but leading questions are not only permitted, but actually encouraged on cross examination (questioning opposing witnesses). There is a time and place for leading questions. But to say they are dishonest or not allowed in court is not accurate.

[@scambammer6102]

It's also widely misunderstood what a leading question is. Any question that can be answered equally yes or no is not leading. A leading questions suggests the answer, like..."Isn't it true that...." The example Paul gave was not a leading question.

[@andrewmandrona7891]

Thank you for this. Asking my pastor, and later my parents, "Do all non-Christians go to hell?" is what eventually lead me away from the church. There's just no good answer, and previously it was a question I just ignored. As soon as they answered things got either confusing or dishonest, which got me thinking about the rest of it.

[@cdreid9999]

@Kevin Chevalier whoever told you that was making shit up on the fly. i know of no religion/sect who claims that

[@inyobill]

@@cdreid9999 "Making shit up ...", it's all about back-fitting the story to fit the dialogue.

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

Non Christians go to Hell because they reject Jesus who came to save them from Hell. He paid the fine to be set free from Satan that condemns. Don't make any sense to pass up this offer then curse the giver.

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

Yes non Christians will go to hell for rejecting God's Son who paid the Sin debt. God's love would not be complete without His wrath against Sin. Jesus trusted God through the storms of that all things work together for the good that love the Lord. Sounds like you were in a cult that didn't know the true Jesus.

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

Jesus who gives life yet rejected will indeed go into outer darkness with burning memories of loved ones you preached a lie. I pity you.

[@puckerings]

How could anyone watch that video and not come away with the impression that he's being incredibly dishonest?

[@88marome]

Because he's an authority figure people will think: "it sounds dishonest but he has studied this more than we have so he must be right."

[@theodorevibritannia7988]

@Marilyn Newman I would argue that he was being intellectually dishonest, so the actual fools are the one still following his words.

[@cyberwiz979]

Those who are desperately holding on to their faith will buy into Greg's rhetoric, and ignore the irrational. Confirmation bias is strong with them.

[@flogginga_dead_horse4022]

you'd think so but the comments always say otherwise :P

[@ramaraksha01]

That's the crazy thing for me & yet they can come on TV and parrot out that religion preaches morals while lying and cheating and promoting Nazi ideas of hate and division And not one educated person in the media or philosopher calls them out!

[@naturadventur7425]

Me: do people who don't believe in your God deserve to go hell? Apologist: let me ask you a question. Me: please answer my question

[@kenbee1957]

A simple yes or no question Dude made a whole video about it

[@2tonetony319]

FoolishlyFoolishFool Yup. A persons ability or inability to answers a question, either correctly or incorrectly, has no bearing WHATSOEVER on what another person is claiming to be the case.

[@fred_derf]

My thoughts exactly. "Sure you can ask me a question, just as soon as you've answered my question. That's how conversations work".

[@naturadventur7425]

@Jim Merrilees great idea I'll use that

[@skwills1629]

Actually its a False Premise. For one Thing, Classical Christianity doesn't Think only Christians, or perhaps other Abrahamic Religions, worship "The True God", but Think other Cultures have n Idea of God. This is why The Jesuits never told The Native Americans to abandon The Great Spirit, or that The Great SPirit was a false god, and worship The True God, they understood The Great Spirit as the same God, but that The Natives had Limited and Imperfect Understanding of Him. Also, Christianity doesn't Tech that Belief in God is what Saves You. Even in Evangelical Protestantism. In Evangelical Protestantism, it is Trusting in The Sacrifice of Jesus, not simply believing it happened or is Real, but actually Turning Yourself over to Christ, and Repenting of Your Sins, that Saves You. So believing in God doesn't Save You unless You mean Specifically that. Believing God exist doesn't Save You, even believing Christianity is True doesn't Save You. Jesus saves You. While there are some disagreement, al Christians do share the Jesus saves You perspective. So, the uestion You asked is not Really Valid as it is baed on a False Premise.

[@naturadventur7425]

An apologist admitting he is dishonest and dodged a question he didn't want to answer and then teach people how to answer that question dishonestly.

[@naturadventur7425]

@T 2020 I know shocking that a religion with a God who approves of slavery and slaughters thounsands of people could be immoral.

[@naturadventur7425]

@Joseph Polanco lol doctors are slaves. Show me a slave who drives a Mercedes. Your God is more dispecable and cruel than the worst human beings. No human comes near his cruelty, thank God, (joke intented) he doesn't exits.

[@skwills1629]

Thats ot ehat he said, but I'm use to Militant Atheits twisting Things.

[@skwills1629]

@@naturadventur7425 - Actually Slaves in The Ancient World were often wealthy and quiet frequently had positions of Power. You won't beelive me, but You also won't look it up. Also, the I Am more moral than God rouine is getting Old. Its not ;ike You have a Real Reason to say that. You won't talk about Yourself at all and will just call God a Murderer who prfered Genocide and whatnot without Understanding Motives.

[@RetroBackslash]

@Joseph Polanco What has your post got to do with the original comment? You're like a Trump supporter screaming, "But Obama!" every time someone mentions something stupid/bad that Trump did.

[@MrRezillo]

If you ask someone a question, and they counter with "let me ask you a question" they're trying to manipulate you, every time. Don't fall for it! Stick with YOUR question, not their question.

[@dimbulb23]

It's so easy to win arguments when you're in charge of both sides of the dispute.

[@dimbulb23]

@Stefan Dingenouts He was born with that talent.

[@utubepunk]

Ben Shapiro uses this tactic frequently. Whenever he says Let's say... you know he's setting up an easily winnable argument in his favor.

[@acsoosub]

I love how he just baldly admits that sidestepping questions is the recommended tactic

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

Without Jesus will land you in forever torrent because you preached torrent is the way to go. You not bright.

[@loganleatherman7647]

@gemmeerobinson1803 Buddy, you have yet to make a single coherent comment on this video. You are the last person to accuse anyone of not being bright. All you have is a facile assertion and you can’t even convey that clearly.

[@glennp2640]

If you end up speaking with a Christian apologist, and you ask them: "Is Christ the only way to salvation?", and they say "Let me ask you...?" I would simply tell them, "I will answer your questions, after you answer mine." Hold your ground. It's a simpler approach, and the "salvation" question just requires a yes or no answer. Don't play their game. As a Christian, It's interesting that Koukl has no trouble with deception, given that it's a synonym for lying.

[@ericmacrae6871]

I'm a Chrisian and so many thing that I see from my Christian brother and sisters disguss me

[@inyobill]

@@ericmacrae6871 So, is Christ the only way to salvation, and I will be condemned to eternal torture because no god has seen fit to reveal itself to me? I am certainly no evil person, and no other conceivable act of mine would justify eternal torture in exchange for this blink of an eye existence.

[@ericmacrae6871]

@inyobill well let's clarify something when I say that I am Christian I am not saying that I am a Protestant, Roman catholic or EO. I'm actually a LDS Christian and the way I define Christian is anyone who tries to follow Jesus teaching and have faith in him. That being said as LDS we don't believe that you will suffer eternal agony because of your sin of unbelief. Rather you will inherit the terrestrial Kingdom where you will have a life that is beyond measure.

[@BandiGetOffTheRoof]

When you start seeing religion from the outside, you start seeing how horrible existing anywhere forever would be... it's a hard concept at first, but even forever in a heaven is horrifying. Luckily, we won't have to experience it.

[@curiousnerdkitteh]

When dealing with Christian arguments the most valuable lesson you will learn besides skepticism and fact checking is to hold your group and broken record. Repetition. Keep asking the question they keep dodging. I've noticed atheist call in show hosts often do that, though they should do it more.

[@TheLithp]

This is why I NEVER blindly agree to a question during an argument. There's ALWAYS a hidden trap.

[@austinconner2479]

Eh then you're not really having an argument anymore, you're just shutting down the conversation without actually engaging (if this is your goal, then sure). If you want to discuss something with someone in good faith you sometimes need to let them take you where they want to go. If they really are wrong, they cant trap you, and you will have every opportunity to point out the problems in their reasoning when they arise. If you from the outset don't even let your opponent try to make a point, this makes your position look weaker, not stronger. The only "positive" outcome from this is you may appear stronger or more correct to someone who isn't really paying attention, including yourself. If you care more about feeling correct than being correct, go right ahead.

[@Rain-Dirt]

There CAN be a hidden trap, just as it CAN even be unknown to the one asking it. Discussions and arguments should not be about winning or losing, but about getting to the truth. This works best if the (biased) judging done is reduced to a minimum, imho.

[@mattt9187]

The tactical guide to lying while trying to sound like you are not lying. Got it 👍

[@fredbloggs7131]

The first thing that came to mind when he asked his question was 'What is a moral crime?' Who defines it? I can guarantee that he would list stuff I don't consider a crime.

[@Alina_Schmidt]

But maybe he would list some believes that would be a moral crime to follow.

[@danielsnyder2288]

As soon as God shows up in the courtroom and confirms: he exists; he isn't the immoral monster described in the old testament; and how in fact he has been "hurt" by us not following him in blind obedience - happy to have a discussion

[@Captain-Cosmo]

There is one question which I have never had a Christian answer. When a Christian claims that their god "spoke" to them, I like to ask whether they heard the voice in their ears or in their head, adding that if they heard it in their ears did anyone else ever hear the voice with them, and if they heard it in their head how did they distinguish it from their own inner voice. Although the reactions vary, the question itself is never answered. Some get angry, some end the conversation, but most simply deflect with questions or proclamations of their own. It's not a "gotcha" question, however, as much as it simply strips naked the absurdity of their own claim. Many times I have felt like a bully afterwards, even without such intent.

[@bigskye606]

Interesting that he has no problem telling his fellow Christians that what they believe makes them look bad, but is unwilling to admit it to a non-believer. If you are unwilling to defend your beliefs honestly, maybe just keep them to yourself because you are obviously not proud of them.

[@Antis14CZ]

I'm 3:30 in and already the believer has managed to dig himself so deep it's actually quite incredible.

[@stevewarren4813]

As a non-believer I have had believers say, "It is too bad that you are going to hell. You seem like a good person." My internal response, "You aren't a good person."

[@Meh......0]

Thanks!

[@Paulogia]

Welcome!

[@Tentaisei]

So he lied and uses misdirection to not answer the question so he doesn't have to affirm whatever one knows.

[@skwills1629]

No. he did not Lie. He also did not Misdiret. Instead of Blindly accepting that Paulogia told You was the truth, Try getting the other side of the Story here.

[@Tentaisei]

@@skwills1629 yes he did.

[@skwills1629]

@@Tentaisei - No. He did not. Paulogia Lied about what He said.

[@skwills1629]

@@Tentaisei -Sayin Sure Sure and putting Laughing Emotacons behind it is not a Logical, Evidence Based Argument. Its a Dismissal done in a Childish way.

[@Anson_AKB]

lol around 14:30 ... we can simply reverse the "if you know you are guilty, you are more open to an offer of forgiveness", turning it into "if you know that you can get an easy offer of forgiveness, you are more likely to commit deeds that make you guilty" (especially when you are also told that you are guilty of something, anything and everything anyway) --> sin first completely uninhibited, when you can repent later and be forgiven ?!?!

[@AlDunbar]

I actually knew a guy who admitted, with pride, that he does not have to worry about doing something wrong because all can be forgiven just by asking.

[@unluckipox1932]

“The question” I ask Christians is- Who decided the wages of sin is death? If it was god, is he really loving and gracious? If it just is because it is, doesn’t it imply that there’s a higher power than god?

[@robbiebobbie2011]

Unluckipox I don’t get the last part of your comment

[@ThePapser]

@@robbiebobbie2011 If he is thinking of it like I do then he is saying that if God was not the one that established that rule, then someone or something else did create that rule and if God is bound by that rule, then it is an entity more powerful than God.

[@neiloflongbeck5705]

Is the wages of righteousness also death?

[@DenisLoubet]

The Question I like to ask is: If you could go back in time and successfully rescue Jesus from the crucifixion, would you do it? Let the squirming begin!

[@ThePapser]

@@DenisLoubet I think the easy out on that would be to say no because, who are they to mess with God's plan.

[@fepeerreview3150]

This was an excellent video. I hope you do more like this, focusing on how these people attempt to manipulate and how we can resist it, keeping the discussion on a more honest, rational track. It's also common that they try to turn things towards emotionally stressful thoughts. People are easier to manipulate when they are stressed. Talk of sin and punishment raise people's stress this way. Then they step in with the "solution to our problems", the problems they created for us.

[@rogerroger5649]

Tactics: A Game Plan To Honestly Be Dishonest When Discussing Your Christian Convictions

[@djixi98]

A simple question I would have to ask when presented with his first question is, "are we talking about *infinite* punishment for *finite* crimes? Edit: unfortunately his whole spiel was, as someone once said, "a Pascal's wager that took longer to say", nothing more.

[@davidschneide5422]

Belief in absolution resulted in mass pedophilia within the church. It's not the infinite punishment they care about, it's the unconditional, unlimited forgiveness.

[@jackwilmoresongs]

You assume that crimes are finite and stop once one dies. Since you have yet to experience physical death you don't really know that your sinning will actually terminate with your death. Then locked in perpetual rebellion you would also be under perpetual punishment. Since you do not KNOW that this will not be the case, it is better by far to receive Christ as Lord and savior forever. Or look at it this way. If you die and are in a realm in which you know Christ's final judgment is coming, you may be compelled to cast your lot in for the one who is opposing Christ at every turn so that He will not return - Satan the Devil. How do you know that you won't die and find yourself rooting for God's perpetual enemy - the Devil? Being in Satan's corner hoping for Satan's success to stale and postpone Christ, you will share Satan's miserable eternal destiny. It is better to receive Christ immediately NOW as Lord and Savior forever.

[@GuitarDog_atx]

@@jackwilmoresongs If you accept jesus as "lord and savior" because you are afraid of eternal torture, then your god will know this and reject you anyway. He's petty and insecure. But he's also incompetent and made NO effort to give his message to the people on the other side of the world. None whatsoever. So this is the 'god' you think we should worship? You are a pretty disgusting individual for endorsing this perpetual punishment. But he's an evil monster and I'm not bowing to any deity who is less moral and has less common sense than I do. Your god is the father of satan.

[@FakingANerve]

@@jackwilmoresongs No. No, we don't "assume" crimes are finite. We observe that. They don't fit the definition of infinite. You're obfuscating in order to squirm out of a clear problem with the concept of eternal damnation, which I AM assuming is included in the faith to which you ascribe.

[@jackwilmoresongs]

@@FakingANerve Yes, eternal life and eternal punishment are both things which I believe. But I read through the Bible carefully. And I expect to be surprised and even shocked by how wise, loving, and good God turns out to be. You expect, I suppose, to be shocked it the Bible turns out to be true. I expect how the Bible will turn out to be just the tip of the iceberg on God's wisdom and perfection. But yes, there are matters difficult for me to fully understand or explain to doubters. I don't mind having some difficulties in discussion. I do remember that out of the same mouth which proceeded the most comforting words of mercy and forgiveness ALSO proceeded the the sternest words of warning. It musts be so, I think.

[@QuintarFarenor]

Regarding the first "leading" Question: "Should moral crimes be punished?" Answer: "No. They should be rehabilitated"

[@imjessietr29]

Yeah it’s weird God has as little imagination as human law enforcement

[@QuintarFarenor]

@S Gloobal Especially then one should feel that way, what must have happened that one random guy killed another random guys mother? How, what did he do, what did she do, there is too much to consider and maybe he wasn't even in full comprehension of what he did. Who knows really. A penal system is always the worst of all choices.

[@QuintarFarenor]

@S Gloobal Basically, yes.

[@QuintarFarenor]

@S Gloobal I know what you try but yes, punishment will not help them or others. They need to be healed, they are sick, ill in the mind. A prison will only damage these poor bastards further and won't help anyone but a poor guys need for revenge, nothing else.

[@HeyHeyHarmonicaLuke]

@S Gloobal It sounds to me like you are appealing to your taste for vengeance and bloodshed. Then assuming everyone shares it, and trying to appeal to their violent sides. Even if people share your intuitive desire to hurt people that do things that bother them, many people can look beyond it, and see it as unhelpful, primitive, animalistic. Undesirable when considered rationally. You are going down the wrong path to try to support what you want to support. Appeal to reasons, not emotion. If someone pissed me off, and in my angered state of mind I say that I want them to be punched in the face? That wouldn't support that they "should be punished". But that's all you are going for.

[@DanielRisacher]

I learned recently (during my divorce trial) that leading the witness is allowed on cross examination, just not on direct or re-direct. That is you can’t lead your own witness but you can lead a hostile witness.

[@milkenobi]

“If I’d answered the question correctly I would have given a negative impression … so I sidestepped the question” Talk about saying the quiet part out loud …

[@trevorbrooks7816]

I love how he repeatedly mentions Deepak belligerence as a central point throughout the video and it isn't even true

[@jonhanson8925]

Yeah. It's really quite fascinating that he's so set on making Deepak look bad, all for the supposed sin of phrasing his question in a way designed to make Greg look bad. This is the sort of hypocrisy that we are all susceptible to, I know I'm often less charitable than I should be, but it's striking hearing it from someone who is clearly so focused on argumentation and rhetoric.

[@HuxtableK]

Greg is a liar. That's what he does.

[@inyobill]

They tend to be quite sensitive about getting asked the difficult questions, of course they blame the questioner.

[@zemorph42]

"I would have fulfilled a really negative stereotype..." If the shoe fits...

[@DemonicRemption]

@zemorph42 He fulfilled another negative stereotype by being intellectually dishonest... But I was in his shoes once. I felt I had to be able to give an answer for every religious dilemma atheists had. Because not doing so would make me look foolish and be considered a fool. I killed that notion recently because it hampered my pursuit for wisdom.

[@Sherrilynn27]

Hearing people like Greg try to defend a conflicting stance makes me grateful that I wasn't raised in religion.

[@ScottWorthington]

"I would have answered correctly but given the wrong impression". Love it. What is the correct impression?s

[@aarias99]

it is very refreshing to see how apologists put their own foot in their own mouths with out any effort

[@TheIronicRaven]

I usually enjoy going down a set of leading questions. From what I've experienced, the person asking the questions has a script that they feel is logically correct. I prefer to let them get to the end of their questions, then show the holes in the logic, most don't see the holes. It also helps to keep the conversation friendly if you come across as willing to play ball.

[@Redtornado6]

as a dumb person, people helping me find holes in my own logic is very helpful. thank you for your work.

[@killershrew1]

Paul: I LOVE your videos... I can't get enough of them... very well thought out and thought provoking... please keep going!

[@Paulogia]

Wow, thank you

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

Satan agrees.

[@loganleatherman7647]

@gemmeerobinson1803 Your Satan is just as fake as your God and your Christian narrative

[@alwayslearningtech]

It's funny thinking back to when I was still deconstructing and occasionally watching your videos... Now, I owe a lot of my deconversion to you, among a few others.

[@sachinaraszkiewicz785]

Congratulations, and welcome to the sane side of the Force :-)

[@miniclip1162]

That is not an easy feat! Well done!

[@johnjordan3314]

Not easy or comfortable. Kudos!!!

[@Complimnt4u]

If you're saying you once believed and you don't anymore, then you're belief/understanding was very shallow, you really didn't have the real deal in the first place. You never,never came to a place of 'knowing', or starting to 'know'.

[@sachinaraszkiewicz785]

@@Complimnt4u Oh, and you know it... how? I was a devout Christisn for 30 years, studying, praying, attending masses, going to spiritual retreats and defending my tradition in countless conversation. Who are you to tell anyone what was in their hearts and minds? I swear, the arrogance of theists should have stopped shocking me long ago, but somehow it still does.

[@WadelDee]

That story about the easily defeated unbeliever reminds me of the time when I converted someone to Pastafarianism. I was like: "The world was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster." And she was like: "That sounds ridiculous." And I was like: "So what? Many things sound ridiculous. Just because something sounds ridiculous doesn't make it false! Our ancestors would have laughed about what we have found out about bacteria and planes and the internet!" And she was like: "Wow, you're right! How could I have been so blind?! There is a God and He is a Flying Spaghetti Monster!" You're right: It's to make it look like one has won a debate. Do you find this story hard to believe? Good.

[@davidkeller6156]

When I was a Christian there were a lot of questions I never got satisfactory answers to. This was one of them. Eternal punishment was another. I went through a short period of atheism before finding a different set of ideas about God that answered most of my questions to a more satisfying degree. I’m still exploring those and other ideas about God. Btw, I found your channel through interviews you did with Bart Ehrman. Even though I left Christianity I’ve had an interest in the history of the Bible and find his books fascinating and informative. Thank you!

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

You never was a Christian but hypocrite.

[@jcondron]

I am always amazed when apologists proudly explain the tactics they use to sell their lies. They are shameless!

[@sweettalkinghippie]

I find it very telling that apologist videos almost always have the comments turned off and often have the like/dislike counts turned off but I've yet to see an atheist channel do this.

[@denysbeecher5629]

Here I was saying to myself this morning "I haven't heard from Paul in a while"

[@mikehrabar7999]

Denys Beecher: It's a miracle! lol

[@thejudgmentalcat]

Me too. Which is why I just subbed.

[@Rfc1394]

I liked how, at the end, Paul used Koski's own words against him. Very devasating and an excellent response to "bait and switch"-style questions.

[@Zummbot]

Shouldn’t we also point out that in this courtroom analogy, the “judge” created the “law” and punishments for breaking the “law” based on nothing but his own rage to prosecute “defendants” he created himself and who never consented to be held liable to his fabricated “law” in the first place? Isn’t that a show trial being run by a madman?

[@skwills1629]

This is why I Gav p on New Atheism as an Intellectual Movement. God did not Create The Law just to His Own Rage, and Realistically Law Codes aren't something People "Agree to" Anyway. I Know this is a Democratic Age and all but, not only is God not a Democratically Elected Leader, not only does that not prove how bad He is since Our Values aren't some Universal Standard of Truth,. but if God exists and is what is Claimed, then God Literally Created Everything so I Don't see why God Governing is some sort of Evil Act of Tyranny. Gid isn't some conqueror who just took over. Also, Atheist like You actively seek to depict Christianity as either stupid or Evil. Maybe this comes off as a Show Trial because You chose to Frame it that way rather than Realise an analogy is only there to help understand a Concept, and decide to not address he Concept but instead decided to alter the Analogy to make God into a Monster. Its like when Matt DIlahunty proves Atheism is a Lack of belief by using The GumbalL analogy. as if An Anaalogy proves Reality. He also confuses qualitative and Quantitative Statements. The Existence of God is more akin to if there are Gumballs in the Jar, not if there is an Even or Odd Number of Gumballs, as Even or Odd Numbers are Quantity, not Quality.

[@RetroBackslash]

@@skwills1629 "but if God exists and is what is Claimed, then God Literally Created Everything so I Don't see why God Governing is some sort of Evil Act of Tyranny. " So you're arguing that if someone or something creates something then they have absolute control over it and can do whatever they like with it and that whatever they do can not be regarded as tyranny or evil? That seems like a poor argument. Where does free will fit in that argument? Does the created thing have no rights or say or... anything? PS, you seem to have a problem with your capitalisation?

[@Zummbot]

@@skwills1629 God didn't create the law out of his own rage? Let's review: Eve ate some fruit, this made God angry. Instead of simply forgiving Eve, having a constructive chat and moving on like any sane parent would do when a child does something naughty, he demands that all future generations of humans pay him a blood debt. Refusal to pay or ignorance or this debt will be met with infinite torture (for a finite crime, I might add). Oh he also sent his son (which was him) to die for us, because somehow this will help us to pay the debt that we owe... to him. And the fact that God KNEW Eve would eat the fruit (if he's omniscient) makes this even worse. All of this is of course mythology, but if it were true, God would clearly be a madman.

[@Porkey_Minch]

Reminds me of the classic motherly saying of "I brought you into this world and I can take you back out of it!"

[@skwills1629]

@@Porkey_Minch - That was actually ROman Law. A Father or Mother could Kill their Child, even an Adult Chuld, shold they deem it fit, as they wer the progenetors.

[@paulnolan4971]

Since WHEN did one need a strategy for the truth. FFS

[@xoqvuz]

Sometimes you do, if listeners are dishonest, like quote miners.

[@BlacksmithTWD]

I would consider the scientific method to be a strategy to come to truth. Perhaps you mean something else when using the word 'strategy' though.

[@paulnolan4971]

@@BlacksmithTWD Nope, my statement stands in context.

[@BlacksmithTWD]

@@paulnolan4971 Statement? you formulated it as a question, I provided an answer. Since you didn't provide a context, how can my answer be out of context?

[@paulnolan4971]

@@BlacksmithTWD Do you SEE a question mark lol

[@kca_randy]

So his tactic is to be dishonest ?? That is dirty pool.

[@PhoenixHinds]

He is honestly dishonest? How does that moral entanglement get worked out?

[@Jeremy-ql1or]

i love how William Lane Craig is admitting it is not about getting to the truth but about tricking the other guy.

[@bitcoinweasel9274]

I read Tactics. There was some generally good advice on how to have a conversation, and even some of the hypothetical conversations were decent examples, but many of them made me almost yell at the book with "No one would defend their position like that".

[@cdreid9999]

ya strawmen are fun arent they?

[@bitcoinweasel9274]

@@cdreid9999 Yeah...

[@TheAlchaemist]

​@cdreid9999 yeah, they are the inflatable dolls of logic ;)

[@freeluigi4444]

THIS IS AWESOME!!! Where was this video when I needed it so many times before???Especially as somebody raised in a non-Christian religion and been confronted by these kind of people more times than I can count

[@pineapplepenumbra]

17:11 "Encourage the other person to clarify himself." Um, yeah, I sometimes have a *lot* of trouble getting religious people to clarify themselves...

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

They have but you will never accept because Satan your Father will never accept.

[@starfishsystems]

​@@gemmeerobinson1803 You seem to be suffering from delusion. Seek professional help.

[@ellisv75]

Rule Rule 611(c) of the Federal Rules of Evidence, lists the situations in which are appropriate, which include on cross-examination, when dealing with preliminary matters, when there is difficulty eliciting testimony from a witness, and when a hostile or adverse witness is being .

[@sam9242]

Amazing the lengths people will go to to prove their beliefs when there is zero evidence.

[@cyberwiz979]

Yeah. It's all mental masturbation, which Greg is a master of. You could call him a *_master-debator_* . 😀

[@MrLaughingcorpse]

Just like evolution theory. lol

[@degaussingatmosphericcharg575]

@@MrLaughingcorpse Wrong , evolution is a fact, please look into this if interested. It has been directly observed, among massive amount of other evidence...

[@MrLaughingcorpse]

@@degaussingatmosphericcharg575 I keep hearing people repeat that over and over but they never say what exactly was observed. It's almost as if everyone is afraid to mention Finch beak sizes or peppered moths or bacteria resistance which are NOT evolution examples. And the word evolution is being thrown around and used interchangeably with natural selection, which again is not evolution nor does it result in evolution. It only results in variety in a species, working on/selecting from existing genetic info. There is zero evidence that anything evolved into a totally new creature with new complex features not in that species.

[@degaussingatmosphericcharg575]

@@MrLaughingcorpse They do , possibly not the people you have heard, state what has been observed. Evolution only means life changing slowly over time, it does not mean one species turning into another. And. yes, there is actual evidence of "macro" evolution. Just look this up right now online. if you are actually interested in the facts of biological evolution, perhaps read a few books, take a few free courses, watch documentaries, etc...From what you stated it is obvious you do not understand what evolution is and that is it still occurring.

[@thethreeedgedsword7253]

Just found your channel. Liked, subscribed, and I hit the bell. As someone who grew up in a Christian cult, I really appreciate your effort and work.

[@curiousnerdkitteh]

Same.

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

Cults have a fake Jesus that they created. True Christians have the true Jesus.

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

You preach using the word cult but don't know the true meaning. How old are you kid?

[@Wise__guy]

I had trouble I understanding the term “cognitive dissonance” until I met a Christian then it made sense. Because I learn by example.

[@docmychedelic9153]

As someone pretty new to this it blows my mind that apologetics exist. Christianity is so bogus it requires an entire marketing/propaganda department to deal with anyone who starts to think logically. I started not believing when I posed the “Who made God?” question to a nun at like 7.

[@5avan10]

Putting myself in the position of the imaginary interlocutor, even if I answered nothing but "yes" to both the question of whether people should pay for doing bad things and whether I had done bad things, it's an enormous leap to assume that I stand in judgement of Hell. First of all, I've never done anything bad enough to warrant any punishment remotely that severe. I can't imagine any situation in which I could do anything bad enough to deserve eternal torture. Second, who's to say I haven't already sufficiently paid for the things I've done? When I realize I've made a mistake and behaved in a way that isn't consistent with my values, I rectify it immediately with an apology and then I do my best to make it right again however possible. And third, just because I may feel that justice ought to be fulfilled, there is no evidence that the universe cares one whit about what I think ought to happen. I also think that cancer shouldn't exist. Yet, there it is.

[@CeramicShot]

Exactly, yes. Non sequiturs, suspending one's own sense of proportion, and relying on magical thinking are fundamentals of religious thought.

[@dennisbast743]

Is lying for Yeshua and/ or Yahweh a core tenet of Xianity or merely a negative stereotype?

[@think-islam-channel]

A core tenet of Paulianity The religion of those like Paul and not Jesus. Paul admitted to using deception

[@xoqvuz]

Sounds like Islamic Taqiya

[@ctogive]

Oh yeah it's Paulogia time.

[@drdovaqueen]

Cas Geven The best time of the day.

[@hollyhartwick3832]

I would answer “no”. Punishment doesn’t help. Reform and rehabilitation make things better. Punishment destroys, damages.

[@SanjeevSharma-vk1yo]

Koukl's answer: evade, dodge, attack & hope they don't notice you evaded, dodged & attacked.

[@mrcombustiblelemon2902]

Dodge, duck, dip, dive, and dodge.

[@cyberwiz979]

Apologists always approach these discussions as if they were a verbal boxing match.

[@brgulker]

On their old blog, years ago, I asked Greg if he had ever actually persuaded a non believer or even a more liberal Christian. He never responded, and I wonder to this day. He doesn’t seem interested in actually talking to another person as an end in itself. It’s always a debate with a winner and loser.

[@bloccoaspirale1867]

Every religious apologist reminds me of a shopping channel salesman trying to convince me that I need a steam cleaner in my life.

[@monsterguyx]

Your response was more thoughtful, nuanced, and logical than the question itself, and certainly more so than what it was intended to provoke.

[@Zheeraffa1]

Is it a part of Greg's Columbo tactic to talk about characters nobody has ever seen? Is God just another Mrs. Columbo?

[@Zheeraffa1]

@Brandon Neifert Excuse me?

[@Zheeraffa1]

@Brandon Neifert Birth and death certificate? Where? Do you mean the accounts written by a handful of mostly anonymous authors dozens of years after the supposed events? And even then, if Jesus said he is god, doesn't mean he was. On the other hand, there are contemporary written records of Washington and other Founding Fathers, even from Brits, and Washington's own writings. His birthplace and tomb exist to this day. There are also records of his family even before they traveled to America - not written _after_ the fact.

[@wownewstome6123]

@Brandon Neifert Sorry, per the Bible, Jesus is not God. Also per the Bible, Jesus cannot be the Messiah because he failed to meet a long list of requirements. The Messiah, per the Hebrew Bible, will not be a human sacrifice and he won't be God incarnate. By Hebrew Bible, I mean the Old Testament in Hebrew, prior to mistranslations. Scripture regarding Jesus is not God: Isaiah 43 : 10-11 "10 “You are My witnesses,” declares the LORD, “and My servant whom I have chosen, so that you may consider and believe Me and understand that I am He. *Before Me no god was formed, and after Me none will come.* 11 I, yes I, am the LORD, and there is *no Savior but Me."*

[@wownewstome6123]

@Brandon Neifert I'm not trying to sound condescending. I've seen first hand how religion harms, so if I can help open a few people's eyes to the falsehoods of religion, I see it as a positive.

[@utubepunk]

@Brandon Neifert What exactly did Jesus sacrifice? Not like he stayed dead. Jews didn't consider him the messiah. You're just post hoc rationalizing your religion on the back of someone else's religion. The whole OT & you have to twist an ambiguous passage in Isaiah to make it fit Jesus.🙄 apikoris.blogspot.com/2018/01/the-7-things-christians-ignore-about.html?

[@hzoonka4203]

the mental gymnastics that goes on with G.K. is mind blowing.

[@scambammer6102]

Just insist that he answer YOUR question and don't let him change the subject.

[@BrennahAdrianna]

So if he told the truth it would hurt his cause ... lol 😂

[@christjerky2320]

Alternative facts....😈

[@PiRobot314]

"Have you ever done any wrong things?" - Greg Koukl Um yeah, actually. There was one time where I believed in a god who commands child sacrifice, endorses slavery, and only cares about their own glory. I even convinced myself that all this was good and loving, so yeah... I've done "wrong things." (Genesis 22:2) (Leviticus 25:44-46) (Exodus 20:1-3, Matthew 22:36-37)

[@circulationsolutions9149]

When the correct answer makes me look bad, I need to reevaluate the question.

[@gemmeerobinson1803]

We all are lost in ugly sin. Truth that you will reevaluate to twist truth into a lie. Satan your Father has trained you well.

[@CatTheRoundEarther]

Imagine being intellectually out maneuvered by Depok Chopra, a man whos writings could best be described as a Markov chain having a mental break after being fed a self help book written by two white people after a trip to India and a primer on quantum mechanics.

[@1970Phoenix]

One thing that Paul's videos continually remind me is just how incredibly weak the arguments are that apologists use. There is no way on earth that these apologists would accept their own arguments if used by someone else to argue for a different god or some other supernatural-type explanation.

[@skwills1629]

If Evidence Matters, as Your name says, You would not say Paulogia;s Video reminds You of how Weak Apolagist Arguments arel He lied about what Koulk said, and Koikl made no Arguments, He simply gave Advise on how to speak to those who come to You in order to use an Answer as an Attack.

[@1970Phoenix]

@@skwills1629 Please demonstrate that Paulogia "lied" by quoting Paulogia exactly (or provide a timestamp). Also, spelling and grammar are things.

[@skwills1629]

@@1970Phoenix - My Grammar is FIne. I am Dyslexic. Also, I don't have to rewatch a Video to give a Timestamp. All I have to do is reference the Lie. You after all saw the same Video. And I did show where He lied. His Case is built on saying Kaulk is setting a Trap in order to trick his interlocutor into the Kingdom, presumably. But, this itself is a Lie, and is in the Description. Kaolk is not setting a Trap, He is giving advise on How Christians can Handle those who seek to Trap them. Pastor Paulogia is reversing the Situation as if this is an Evangelistic Method, and Kaulk is saying Christians should use this to Win Converts. In the Video He claims Kaolk dodges the Question and avoids Answering it. This is a Lie. He does Answer it. He simply Answers it in a Manner that is designed to diffuse Hostility by deescalation. Instead of giving a Direct Answer to a Confrontational Person who came to Attack you with Your Answer, You can instead ask them a series of Questions to establish a Common Ground of Understanding and which allows them to understand the Concept in Question, such as why Jesus is needed for Salvation in Christian Thought, without causing them to simply reject it out of Hand and Creating a Confrontational Situation. Direct Answers are not Always complete Answers, as to fully Understand some Ideas One must First also Understand what they are based on. If Someone is not Interested in Actually Understanding an Idea but simply wishes to Find Ammunition to Fire at a Rival, Asking a Direct Question can be done in the Hopes that the Answer can then be Used to support a Narrative of how Wrong or Evil someone is or their belief is. We see this all the Time in Politics. A Political Actor will Ask a Politicial a Direct Question, and then when the Politician Answers it, siezes on the Answer, and Spins it in order to discredit or VIllify the Politician by Framing it in a way that will fit His Constituents Frame Of Mind and Baee of Understanding. Incomplete Knowledge is often More Damaging than complete Ignorance.

[@hawaiisidecar]

@@skwills1629 You don't have the time to find a time stamp but you do have the time to type a text wall of bullshit. Is your dyslexia the excuse you give for capitalizing random words?

[@skwills1629]

@@hawaiisidecar - I Don't Capitalise Random Words.

[@JustErics101]

Chopra was just asking a basic question about something that a lot of Christian’s actually believe. If that sounds harsh, it’s because the belief itself is harsh and honestly evil. On some level I think some of these people know Christian exclusivity is unjustifiable.

[@Riftsrunner]

My first reaction to his "can I ask you a few questions" line was "first answer the question on the table". We cannot have a conversation if you try to sidestep answering my questions. And if he continues to try to go to his tactics, I bring him back to the question on the table until he answers the question. In other words, I refuse to answer anymore of his questions until he answers mine.

[@skwills1629]

You say that Now. But its because Koiulk is a Christian and Paulogia suppose3dly exposed how Dishonest He was. But He did not Sidestep Answering the Question. And sometimes asking the other Party questions is useful or even necessary to establish Understanding what You say from their own base of Understanding. ir You say "No, dion;t sudesoetr=teo,m just answer the Question", what You;re Really saying is, " I want an Answer to this question I can use to depict Your beliefs as Terrible. I don;t want to Understand them. I want You to look bad." Ironically, I';ve been called Dishonest for demanding Atheists like You stay on Topic, and somehow Koulk is dishonest when he stays on Topic but simply asks some questions First since You misrepresent this as Changing the subject.

[@inyobill]

@@skwills1629 If you can't answer the question inb a positive light, what am I to make of it? Is not about "terrible" or "wonderful", it's about truth. Very, even extremely, rarely is the appropriate response to a question another question. Majority of the time, it's a tactic to avoid a subject.

[@skwills1629]

@@inyobill - The Thing is, its the Question, not The Answer that's the Problem. You see, the way You Militant Atheist's Depict it, Kaukl is saying an Honest Answer would make Christianity Look bad, but that is not what He said, He said the way The Question is Phrased would. And He did say that. Here is Him saying it is The Question, not The Answer, that makes Christianity Look bad. " Now some people have said if you’re careful how you push the question, you could win any argument. And the problem here is that this was a question about the exclusivity of Christ. A critical issue in Christianity, but it was put in a way that made me look really really bad. " This is what is called a Loaded Question. The way The Question is Phrased is Designed so that Any Answer would carry with it certain Assumptions that may or May Not be true. It is a Classic example of saying You may Only Answer Yes or No, then Me Asking You if You have stopped beating Your Wife. If You say Yes, it means You use to beat Your Wife, and if You say No, it means You are Continuing to Beat Your Wife. Or at least these are assumed to be so by the way The Question is Phrased. And what Kaukl said is ow Other Sites suggest You Handle this Situation. You see it as some sort of Evil merely because he is Christian. Not because his Advice was bad or Admitted Christianity was Awful. The Irony is, pastor Paulogia's Hate Sermon here is doing exactly what Kaukl is Talking about. He is Misrepresenting Kaukl, and Quoting Him does not mean You are being Honest with what He says.

[@inyobill]

@@skwills1629 Gee, I'm sorry the hard questions bother you so much.

[@skwills1629]

@@inyobill - You just Lied. For One Thing, this is about what Koukl said, not Me. For Another, its not that the Question was hard, its that it is a Loaded Question that Carries Unjustified Assumptions. And You Know it. You just don't want to Admit that You are an irrational Bully Who just wants Excuses to badmouth Christians and make them look bad. And yes, I Know Christians don't Need You to make them look bad, they do that All by themselves. We've all heard that before. You Mindless Atheist Drones never say Anything Original and its all just a Gagle of Excuses and Hate and Lies.

[@hd-mot]

Nothing stops a Christian in their tracks, they're off the rails!

[@johndemeritt3460]

You might try a few of these lines: - Nobody can take the punishment of others: God doesn't allow it. - Jesus doesn't fall into the bloodline Mesiach is supposed to come from. - Mesiach is supposed to usher in peace across the world when he appears. Since Jesus' time, there's been no peace. So nu?

[@jackwilmoresongs]

@@johndemeritt3460 Three short reasons why your explanations I'd reject: 1.) Nobody can take the punishment of others: God doesn't allow it. In real time Christ made Himself an offering for sin according to Isaiah 53. When He prayed to His Father "Father forgive them for they do not know what they are doing" (Luke 23:34) the only way the Father could not refuse that request of the Son was to accept His crushing in place of the world's sins. "But Jehovah was pleased to crush Him, to afflict Him with grief, When He makes Himself an offering for sin." (Isa. 53:10) God hears the request of His Son always. 2.) - Jesus doesn't fall into the bloodline Mesiach is supposed to come from. Jesus was in the blood line of David through His mother Mary not through her husband Joseph. The Son of David born of a virgin was blood related to David through the mother Mary. 3.) - Mesiach is supposed to usher in peace across the world when he appears. Since Jesus' time, there's been no peace. So nu? The intervening two thousand years Christ has been securing quality of followers matured enough to co-reign with Him in His second coming as overcomers. The long intervening time between His first coming and His second coming was not just to secure quantity of people saved, but to secure a remnant minority of high quality obedient ones who will be co-kings with Him. The number is accumulating as the years go by until a critical mass of overcoming ones is ready to reign WITH Him. Re-read for example the story of Gideon's victorious minority army of 300 (Judges 6:1-8:32).

[@johndemeritt3460]

@@jackwilmoresongs, I respect that you've made an honest attempt at civil dialog; however, I'll stand by all my responses. In the case of Jesus taking on the sins of others, Jews are quite adamant that it can't be done. Furthermore, Jews hold that Christians consistently cherry-pick Hebrew Bible verses to support their interpretation of Scripture to justify Christianity. In other words, taking verses out of context, like the ones you cite from Isaiah, doesn't work because those verses have specific meanings in context. On the second point, Jews count descent through the FATHER'S bloodline. Since God was allegedly Jesus' father, Mary's bloodline doesn't count. If you try following Joseph's bloodline, you come to a line of David's household that was cursed, so that won't work. On the third point, Jesus simply doesn't meet any of the tests of Mesiach Jews have identified throughout the Hebrew Bible. None of the Hebrew Bible prophecies have been met, and so while Jesus may have been a wise teacher, he was not the Messiah (to use the Greek word) foretold in the Hebrew prophecies. And given the number of people who had either been declared Mesiach by others or had declared themselves Mesiach, Jews were well acquainted with validating or denying claims about people who were supposed to be the one foretold in prophecy. One Rabbi I know put it this way: Mesiach is supposed to fix the world on his only visit. Jesus, on the other hand, is like calling for an electrician in the middle of the Super Bowl and having a workman show up who hustles into your house, does a lot of stuff, and then tells you that the plumbing is working perfectly now. You may now have great plumbing, but you need electricity on so you can watch The Big Game -- especially with all your friends over. It's not what you needed and it's not when you needed it -- the electrician won't be in until next week. I respect that Jesus taught people to live in peace and to be truthful. I agree with Gandhi: to paraphrase, I like your Christ, but I often question Christianity. I have a feeling you're not likely one of those Christians who I'd object to, but I feel more affinity to Judaism's understanding of the Hebrew Scripture than I do Christianity's treatment of the Old Testament.

[@samuelcalderwood1379]

That's because God's confirms in the Christian heart that they are correct so therefore water off a ducks back, isn't that wonderful 🦆💦😁💪

[@jackwilmoresongs]

My experience is that when you allow Jesus Christ to come into your heart and you give Him the right over your whole being - then quite a few obstacles are raised up. The Father allows them to be spaced out over time to test the reliability of Christ living within you. It is like a curriculum of ever deepening crises. It could be anything and just about all things as potential stoppers of your faith. Through this "program" your enjoyment of Him grows. And you learn that your faith is not in the wisdom of men but in the power of God who raises the dead. And some do reach a plateau and are stopped in their progress. But He Himself never leaves you.

[@probablynotmyname8521]

Tactical technique to avoid answering a question truthfully. Sounds legit.

[@RaistlinMajereFistandantilus]

My favorite question is "Who told you the Bible is inerrant?" If it was God in a dream, or an angel coming down to give you a vision, fine. But if it was a human, are you really believing in the inerrancy of God? Or are you taking it completely on the errant word of a human being?

[@imjessietr29]

The Romans thought Jesus was bad so they correctly punished him 😀

[@rb2321]

I really believe if this character Jesus was alive at one point he was a cult leader maybe he knew how to do some tricks but you know back then they didn't have the intelligence maybe to figure out that these are a little common tricks and so he impress them and they started following he begin to take money and offerings and talk nonsense that's if he did actually exist as a human being

[@rb2321]

Sorry voice texting LOL

[@JosephKeenanisme]

Remember the character of Jesus never existed. Judea was rebelling against Rome and a made up mystery man or warrior can do wonders to recruit people to the People's Front of Judea instead of the Judean's People's Front (freaking splitters).

[@themousethatroared3371]

@@rb2321 Unfortunately, today his followers still dont have the intelligence to figure it out. 😒

[@placebo4121]

Hell was introduced by Jesus to the Jewish population.I know Rome didn't care about this sort of preaching,but scaring the beejeebers out of people can get you a large following,especially with a few "miracles"thrown in to back you up.Rome did care about that.