What do you do when you realise modernity is ending? Dougald Hine with Jonathan Rowson

[@fs9298]

10:50

[@Sharpy7562]

I steered the story myself from a working class impoverished area ignored external events . Set personal goals . Lied to get pay increases job to job stating paid more than I was , travelled world saw culture belief systems for myself didn’t rely on media with all its propoganda ,, selected friends and family wanted in reality dismissed rest didn’t communicate with them , was frugal consumed less went for minimalism after having everything I needed big car etc , joined no clubs religious or otherwise and worked less , now feel nothings changed in my ress as city I’m still growing more fulfilled and still doing service as I feel fit for others who genuinely I feel are in need otherwise I don’t care for others . I’ll see my reality out till I die as it’s static and positive ,

[@khaledadams4329]

This is such a fascinating subject, I hope you don't mind me sharing my personal opinion. Simply put, I feel humanity is caught up in several feedback loops caused by individual fear and insecurity. Most issues are solvable, we just don't have an infrastructure to coordinate and plan our actions in a way which bypasses central leadership. This is a necessary component for humanity to achieve peace, and a level-up. The following is not a recruitment pitch, please hear me out... As a Baha'i I have seen how our voting infrastructure provides an elegant, and truly democratic system of "bottom-up" governance. I am not saying anybody needs to subscribe to the Baha'i Faith, or even believe in God, for that matter. I am testifying, this system of governance is something that could be adopted quite easily, sidestepping current party-politics and legacy leadership clubs, and allowing humanity to take back control locally, regionally, nationally, and globally, without having single leaders, or anyone who profits or benefits, for that matter. This also engages everyone on a community level.

[@khaledadams4329]

A local community can be created if a group of nine or more people (=/>Voting age) want to form their own "assembly". (Small village, neighbourhood, apartment building) An assembly is simply a nine-member delegation, voted by the members of the community. Each member has equal say on matters of governance within their community. There is no payment of material benefit in any way, to serving on the assembly. (a sort of honorable burden) Local Assembly members vote for a nine-member regional delegation who govern matters which the local assemblies defer to a regional level. (less localized, more universal governance) Regional members vote for national, and so on. The main differences being: A nine-member delegation with no party politics being more robust, and more difficult to corrupt. No profiting or individual positions of authority to be exploited. I am sure this sounds over simplistic to anyone reading it. I get excited about it because I have witnessed how effective and simplistic it is. More than anything else, it gives me hope because it is a way to transition peacefully from our current systems of governance, which do not appear to prioritize the best interests of humanity.

[@kensears5099]

If this "modernity" as a kind of orientation, a stance on reality, what it's "there for," what we should "do" with it and what it means we "are," is expiring, and if it was an essentially unreflective and opportunistic collective impulse--you might simply say the most immediately productive expedient--then what is the danger of an impulsive, expediency-driven, opportunistic leap after an unreflectively cobbled-together and largely politically driven (meaning power-lust-driven) "post-modernity"? Logically, ANYTHING after "modernity" is "post-modernity," just as my whole life after adolesence is post-adolescent, but that is a neutral sort of logic that will not satisfy those who are intent on putting the stamp and imprimatur of their sociopolitical and, dare I say, religiously cherished values, on an "orthodox" postmodernism AS an "ism." How is it possible to navigate around that appallingly predictable human dynamic?

[@evanhadkins5532]

Good to see Illic get a mention.

[@jonn_esternon]

Haven't read it yet, but The Oxford Handbook of Decadence might give us some ideas on how to navigate modernity's decline. To be 'decadent with elegance' might be one the answers but I'm not so sure.

[@siyaindagulag.]

Will the only future role for the Dark Tetrad adherents be that of... Comedian ? Given their destructive potential ? (the question as attended to in at least one of Ian's many talks) Well ! you're the ones got me thinking ahead. Seriously though, Esther poses a very real point which you extend upon with your wounds and scars analogy, namely: Event the conception of great transformation becomes impossible if one persists in constructing monumental bulwarks against one's vulnerabilities. I'm not sure but is this not the source of neuroses ?

[@bremlquan]

Can anyone succinctly summarize this discussion for me?

[@TheLucanicLord]

That would involve listening to it. Probably that there's too many atheists and women should be permanently pregnant.

[@willgiorno1740]

❤

[@davidbates9358]

A 'nice' discussion by two semiconscious talking heads who seem to believe that the 'dissociated' sense of reality we call rationality, can solve the myriad problems our communication biased 'level' of consciousness has created. Johnathan likes Dougald because he 'feels' the other is convivial and together they enjoy the 'religio' (binding) nature of CONCERN, using the religio-binding nature of LANGUAGE to fill the we-space with the peculiarly human phenomena of MIND-SIGHT. Our species experiential blindness, whereby we seeing, see not, hearing, hear not, and neither do we understand our own reality, to paraphrase the ascension philosopher from Nazareth. Please, try to 'awaken' from the dissociated sense of reality inherent in our behaviorally adaptive capacity for language, through the adaptive realization that we can name anything with any words we care to imagine, without altering the reality of what our eyes are seeing. How people like Johnathan can read the opening lines of TMWT's chapter 3 on PERCEPTION and not get its implications for 'how' we see ourselves and the world around us, is staggering. Are we so 'automatically' driven by our nervous system's non-conscious orchestration of ALL behavior, the we are literally sheep-talking and sleepwalking our way into the Abyss, to paraphrase McGilchrist. Johnathan talks about the 'inner-life' of the future, yet I would wager that what he actually knows about the inner reality of his nervous system is, as an Australian aboriginal friend of mine would say, "3/5ths of F*#K All." Please stop winging it with a disingenuous use of terms like 'auto-pilot,' 'automaticity', and other such terms like systems, souls, society, and educate yourself about the unseen reality of your body and how your nervous system orchestrates your life, beneath a language created dissociation from reality. The make-believe, 'as-if' sense that we really know reality, especially our own, because we can 'name' it with the REPRESENTED, as Iain McGilchrist argues, sense-of-reality we call language?

[@SpenderDebby-x6n]

Martin Eric Taylor Michelle Lee Gary

[@jimbopeebles8210]

I get the distinct feeling in 10 years we will all be saying things like “remember when everyone thought society was ending because it was hard to buy cheap made garbage goods?”

[@bremlquan]

"the reason we're all feeling tired" looool

[@ronjohnson4566]

bs