Pinion Snubbers Explained

To snub or not to snub. The How's and Why's of Chrysler's most traditional traction device, with insight from F.A.S.T. Racing's Superstar Dave Dudek.
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[@johnrivinius4873]

Best video as of yet Tony. I won many street races back in the 80s with that exact setup. I remember I got the idea when you wrote about it back then, in one of your common sense direct appoach tech articles..

[@bertilthuresson5964]

keep them coming Tony, Super info

[@slimshady2777]

Rapidly became one of my favorite channels .. tech like this and your quadrajet/thermojet vids .. fantastic .. But also that video on your mates $1600 4dr amc rambler .. loved that u see more than just performance when it comes to this hobby ..

[@halleffect1]

nice to see an old car like this without 20in wheels

[@j0lel666]

@@lamaridelbridge9601 they arw ugly as fuck 19 is max

[@victorpelini5995]

Its dumb to put big wheels slim tires on these cars. They werent designed for it. Unless you buildin a full blown race car with custom suspension you shouldnt put wheels that are too big It'll ruin the handling and wont improve things at all... It'll look dumb too

[@garyvisser9129]

AAAANnnnnnd you put those funky wheel spacers in to make the wheels clear and you put a load on the bearings and change camber that was NEVER designed to be there in the first place and you end up being a dumbass......... Any ?.......…

[@garyvisser9129]

And that's just what happens when you mess with the front end....,

[@1marcelfilms]

No you should put smaller wheels on it and increase the tire size.

[@twomontess]

Tony I just happened upon your vids. I’m thinking who the help is this guy? But your knowledge is overwhelming!! Keep up the great vids

[@UncleTonysGarage]

Thank you

[@Justin_03svt]

Wow always understood the snubber but never thought about the sidewalls of the tires! Makes so much sense!

[@jamesharris5232]

Always wondered if there was a reason behind the snubber aside from keeping the u-joint binding up against the floor of the car if that angle is met. Can say I learned something new!

[@joshuafinishes]

Tony. Your a national fucking treasure. I sure hope you mentor someone. When all you guys are retired every classic car will get swaps only.

[@phill903]

That's a lot of information I didn't know about till now pinion snubbers interesting!!!

[@dartvader9939]

Don't stubb your pinion all the time!

[@tobiaswillson5900]

take care of your knees , also under hard acceleration you want the ring and pinon , and drive shaft , and trans tail end to be in a straight line . angle shim the diff down and some times angle shim the engine and trans up . it takes time to find the angles.

[@Sebastian_Dinwiddie]

Damn! Where were you for my quantum physics course in college? I would have gotten better than a 50!

[@richardturk7162]

I used an adjustable snubber on my 1971 Dodge Demon 340, and my1965 273 stick Formula S Barracuda back in the 70's Both cars hooked extremely hard. Got my carb tuning tips from Ed Hamburger at MOPAR and the info he gave me on the Cater thermo quad was invaluable for my 71 340. It made that carb work like a charm.

[@Really-AintBuyn-nit]

I had one of those 71TQ's that was a 4 speed model. Sold it cheap because none of the jets, and metering rods in my strip kit would fit it. I bought it for $7.50 at a Chevelle show.

[@Daniel-Weaver]

Uncle Tony spitting raw knowledge. Feel free to mix in dubious at any time.

[@lyfandeth]

The things I never knew. Wow.

[@randymekalet4244]

I used on my 71 Demon. It worked great. Never knew about soft/stiff sidewall tires entering into the equation

[@richardprice5978]

i kinda know about tires being a spring / can change spring rates and shock settings and this is why on 60s mopars " hard rubber band " ( ie something like 255 / 35 / 20 ) are garbage and don't help you go faster

[@robertcorrea8161]

Tony , excellent information keep it coming .correacuda Robert

[@Imnotyourdoormat]

for me...nothing left the line like the big mopars of the early 60s...nothing... i was under the impression they actually did very little over stock. like you said tony...unclamped the rear spring binder on super/stock springs and shocks and a top quality or custom-made snubber adjusted to a T.. some cars had 6-popper torsion bars and 90/10s but some were stock....the whole car would stand straight up, leave tall and straight down the track. stand up again at gear changes too....nothing else like em at the digs..they seemed almost, catlike...for me, what else really is there as far the proper way to lauch a car?...cause man do those cars launch.

[@lindseyhunt1090garageb]

keep them coming. love watching them. im not even a muscle car guy lol. just great presented knowledge

[@johnstarnes9499]

I wish I could have known you 40 years. I would have been a better racer. Dart GTS forever!!!

[@thomasanderson507]

Excellent video, I have a E body that gets used in town more than the track.440 car,what would be the best of both worlds for the suspension set up? Thanks for all the great info !!

[@MrLangleylad]

I have learned sooooooooooo much from watching your videos ! Thanks Uncle Tony !

[@BadAssEngineering]

would FART be Factory Appearance Race Tire ??

[@martentrudeau6948]

MANN that's rocket science, the Devil is in the details.

[@jeffnorbert1871]

Made me laugh my ass off that Alphabet Inc played an ad for the 2019 Ford Fusion at the end of this video. But, but, a car is a car right?

[@dewreckdeberjack9618]

Happy Thanksgiving

[@stevelindsay3643]

That was spot on. Awesome detailed tidbits of knowledge. Thanks, Tony.

[@Moparmaga-1]

Thank you tony

[@UncleTonysGarage]

You're welcome, Korie.

[@UncleTonysGarage]

I'd leave them alone and try it, they may work just fine the way they are

[@charlesmiller5078]

When I watch this, Im thinking how many things we did wrong, back in the day. We did good, but apparently we were clueless.

[@willefixit]

wow just wo w my b body has 90 10 front air in rear came that way loop too good track knowledge here. thankx not quite sure of springs 83/4 came with want danna 60 its use to have can see where it tore out and nice repair,kind of drag car surviver ran connecticut dragway bunch kill stickers in pop out rear windows. engine strap to frame out of 1/4 stock.rf neg camber. sounds like your the guy to ask advice. on which way to go.fund to low rite now selling stuff may next summer . thankx again

[@h.r.puffnstuff8705]

Dana 60 is nice if that's how it come but if you think a 8 3/4 is weak you better take a look at what's underneath 60s Top Fuel cars. No Dana60 here. 3000hp with the drivers man bits resting on a 8 3/4 mopar housing.

[@stevelindsay3643]

Getting a Hot rod To Hook and not gobble up the power due to improper pinion angle, the wrong spring tension, or position, the wrong shock setups, the wrong front end geometry and floatation, the center of balance compared to the rear suspension, and transferring the power to the rear tires without burning the tires off can be a real challenge. Tire size, air pressure, the gear, the stall, the suspension, everything equates to hooking or spinning. Mopar made leaps and bounds in that area tweaking the suspension, pinion angle, front suspension till they got it right or real damn close way back when the factory 4 high-performance big players were battling it out. Many young guys give it no thought, and even more, want to burn rubber, so hooking isn't what they are after. BUT on race day you better be well set up or you have lost the day out of the gate or should I say Off The Line. I'm rebuilding my 35 Chevy again, not for more power, but a better suspension to utilize the power. I've gone from seeing nothing but the blue sky to nothing but rubber smoke and have to dial it in. I don't want to add ballast, so I'm reworking the suspension from front to back, and still using the original 1935 Chevy front straight axle. It takes a lot of learning to get it right and video's like Tony's help more than one can imagine until they face these issues and have to think it through ten ways from Sunday adding all the prior attempts gaining more insight and having a feel for what will get the job done. Tony is one of those guys who have been down this road and knows how to not only explain it in laymen's terms but puts the rubber to the road down and dirty in real time. It's those Tid Bits of information that can make all the difference in the world. Thanks again, Tony.

[@danohstoolbox]

in one of my playlist I have some pictures of the cars I used to work on if u care to take a look thank you brother

[@kennethfillmoreCoolCatKen]

I had mopars and did not know what a Snubber was I seen them on the rear ends but did not know that info great information

[@crazylarryjr]

Here's a little twist to confuse the issue, modern grudge and radial cars actually use a lifting type of rear suspension. A fellow Tuber named John Doc has a racing 4 link, with essentially a torque arm that mimics a pinion snubber, in that it raises the chassis and drives the tires into the track. They do this specifically to limit the upward movement of the front and put as much weight as possible (without a huge wheelie), into the rear tires. We are also talking about guys, that are running something like 1500-2500 HP in a street appearing race car, with computers that can do minute changes as needed to control the car as well. This is a cool thought on it though, nice vid

[@bluejack644]

Classic UT. Reminds me of the John Houseman scene from The Paper Chase when Kingsfield says "You come to me with a skull full of mush, and you leave thinking like a lawyer."

[@44hawk28]

I think he may have been peddling the car for not having us number, and didn't change the the way in which he peddled the car when it had this number on it. That will quickly lose you a 10th to 10th and 1/2. Great explanation, however I have seen people increase their quarter mile times by softening their launch

[@boarzwid1002]

Glad to see you happy you remind me of Phil Robertson when he is duck hunting, we salute you mopar commander 🐗

[@claytonstoolbox]

Has anyone ever tried a pinion shock?

[@DeanHayley]

Thank you for that explanation, that was really informative.

[@michaelconner204]

I broke the pinion snubber bracket at the welds on my 72 charger 440.

[@Vergil598]

So what would be the traction set up for a hard side wall tire? No pi ion snubber like you said, but do you still want soft leaf springs or stiff ones? Do you still want to unclamp the springs behind the wheel and perform the same set up to the front of the car?

[@UncleTonysGarage]

Dudek uses those soft Satellite springs. Not sure if they are clamped or not. As for the front set-up, no..nothing changes

[@Moparmaga-1]

Dave dudek is the dude k

[@darrenbrisson4336]

Everybody knows you adjust your snubber an inch from the floor

[@aj06bolt12r]

Question for Uncle Tony. My v8 stick shift 8.8 rear swapped s-10 wheels hops like a motherfucker. I mean anytime you floor it in the 1st three gears that bitch is hopping violently... anything not tied down ends up in the floor, radio and gauges fall out of the dash, you cant see where you are going kind of wheel hop. It sucks ass! I despise the look of slapper bars and I'd prefer not to spend the money on a legit set of caltracs... Any suggestions that are not caltrack or slide a link expensive besides slapper bars? Iv'e tried clamping the leaf springs together and it helps but the ride is so bad its not worth it.... I daily the truck 60 miles a day.

[@UncleTonysGarage]

You could try fabricating some sort of pinion snubber and see how that works. I think you really need to hit the S-10 forums for your best answers, though

[@nophdcoyote2891]

Probably keep the snubber on an open road car. Old school Plymouth is hard to catch out on the open road.

[@jeffcarr2652]

That's a cool car love the old slots good stuff that's realistic unlike the shows on mototrend

[@bobkanno6797]

Not mention is that you can get the pinion snubbed to hit so hard, that you may have to reinforce the floor pan in that area.

[@todds5956]

I ran one of these for years on my Ford just from the frame down. Still awesome traction idea

[@briritter5488]

Never apologize for showing power. I know with my 96' Impala SS (turbo charged) and my 71' GP I don't.

[@ericheine2414]

You rock...

[@nickbruni8041]

No Chevy snubbers .. I think? :/

[@michaelgiglio1571]

Good knolage Tony, that does take 40 years to learn. Tnx mate.

[@kencohagen4967]

I'm getting ready to build a Gremlin. I'm hoping to find an 8 3/4 rear end so I can use a pinion snubber, even if I have to build a crossmember for it to work on. Also, AMC's have biased leaf springs like Mopars so that's a big plus. The guy I'm buying the Gremlin from also has some 2dr Ramblers, and the springs are just one inch shorter than an A body, so I could theoretically use Mopar Super Stock springs by moving the spring mounts, and maybe a relocation kit would work on that. I'm not sure if that would work on the Gremlin, and being a hatchback I can't put the battery in the trunk because it doesn't have one. But if I end up using a fuel cell I'll have to make a box for it to keep the fumes out of the car, so making it large enough to hold a battery or two 6 Volt group 1's in series it should fit. I even thought about running two fuel cells, one with pump gas and the other with race gas for those weekend drags. Then I could adjust the timing and boost if I'm running a Newcomer stoker 6 cyl. He built one that made 664 hp, and I'd settle for 550 or so. Then I'd name the car Having Six. What do you think?

[@todds5956]

You have to set the distance. It can’t be tight. We tested for years with these

[@allmarinemaintenance3714]

Uncle Tony you remind me of my uncle kirk he was a Mopar guy with endless amounts of knowledge and the fastest 70 roadrunner in town it had a 440 with a 671 blower. Also had a 78 runner,68 satellite and roadrunner and a 68 rs camro and piles of parts from complete 340 and 360 6 pack engines several sets of small block heads. But he was known for his 440's they where everywhere he horde them I'm talking about a whole building full ... I can remember going in their tripping over engines because I was staring at the pistol grip shifters hanging on the wall she had several of short, medium, long.

[@tulatoiletandsepticllc81]

Horses for courses. Had a buddy had a dart with a 440 auto he tried everything to get to hook up. He was a Chevy guy. Basically did everything you explained and he was so mad at me when the damn thing pulled a nice wheelie LoL.

[@darrenbrisson4336]

Air shock or imperial and pinion snubber an inch from the floor

[@351cleavland]

Will using one of these work for my traction issues with my Unicycle?

[@garyvisser9129]

You know Tony loves trolls!!! But he still loves ya!

[@jeffchan8247]

Pinion snubbers are a crutch for weak leaf springs. If you have axle wrap, you need a stronger front segment like a Mopar Super Stock spring. They also limit suspension compression travel to zero. Do not use on the street.

[@UncleTonysGarage]

That's not true. Properly used, the snubber transfers initial torque reaction to a downward push on the axle

[@cindytepper8878]

@David miorgan Actually when the snubber hits, it removes torsional stress from the tubes. Without a snubber the tubes are anchored by the leaf springs and they are keeping the pumpkin from twisting. The force going upward originates on the inner pinion bearing so the snubber is in almost the perfect spot

[@richaranzullo9915]

Lol. Need more Boulder to balance out the weight LOL

[@carlholm7867]

I've got a '63 2dr post car! Unfortunately my progress is slower than anything, but I've already got the /6 torsion bars in the car! Got new SS springs for the back. But I didn't now about removing the upper bump stops! Will def. look in to that. I just need to throw out the 7 1/4 rear end and get the motor running as I want it for any hard launches to be reality. Hi compression 360 with a thermoquad!

[@rainyfrost4313]

Uncle Tony I need you're brain if you don't mind.I found a 92 Z 28 5.0. cheep I mean cheep the guy says it sat for a while and he changed the gas tank and fuel pump. tells me it only needs an oil change and tune up. now me being a Chevy fan like mopar these motors are hard to kill. I'm sure it needs new seals for the t tops and hatch and doors. he only wants $ 1.200 for the car. do you think it might be worth it ? Oh and paint the clear coat peeled. Thank You. rain

[@mikesr3407]

Voodoo explained , thanks Tony ! Only problem is that old adjustable pinion snubber rattles like an old Chevy truck with shock mounts gone ! Seriously !

[@franksauer21]

Did he say it ran a 9.8 on stock tires or didn't I hear that right?

[@UncleTonysGarage]

Yes you did...and he does that often

[@thomasmulhall4873]

My pinion snubber is nicer than yours. Pure pinion snubbery!

[@slippery396]

I remember seeing at the drags those rear springs split apart .... always puzzled me what was going on ...I guess now I know ... sure looked weird though.

[@moeshouse575]

back in 1968-1969. Chrysler had racing teams that toured putting on what they called "supper car clinics" i won a Sox and Martin jacket at on. you cant buy them.

[@glengabruch4664]

Awesome explanation, Tony. 👍👍👍👍Thanks.

[@EASTSIDE-313]

I'd give a pinky for Dudek's roadrunner anyway...mopar was ahead of the game with the pinion snubber.

[@rongravel4585]

Just a wealth of mopar knowledge. Love you tony I’m a chevy guy but my dads is a mopar Guy. And now that I’m older. I love the old mopars.

[@derekwalker7831]

Do traction bars apply the same concept?

[@darrenbrisson4336]

How the hell is a road runner 4,000 lbs

[@JA-sm9zf]

Great stuff Thank you for sharing

[@hotrodray6802]

Stops axle wrap but does not stop right wheel lift... That puts a lot of pressure on the SureGrip clutches.

[@hotrodray6802]

Thats why we clamped the leaves or ...😬fugly slapper bars

[@jamiejohnson1200]

This is some deep s***

[@georgespangler1517]

Leaf spring truck,,,I built a roadster with 4 link and used 7 degrees,

[@jerryjohns1]

Well snub my pinion and call me sally

[@Megacatares]

sometimes i play your show when I need to take a nap. Your knowledge is great the topic is simple but neat and your tone lulls me to sleep haha.

[@rodneybrand8521]

You are the mopar master.. Cheers friend 🍻🍻🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

[@TonyGeneseo]

Always wondered why rear leafs were so much shorter on the front. Sucks for taller tires but makes sense.

[@stevehart2665]

You are incredibly full of knowledge. Thanks for sharing.

[@ZacLowing]

Just curious, 3:54 stiff sidewall, no pinon snubber, soft sidewall like a slick, pinion snubber. Why did they put them on from the factory when those tires had stiff sidewalls? Seems strange

[@UncleTonysGarage]

The stock pinion snubber only comes into contact with the floor under EXTREME circumstances. The Adjustable or Performance snubber comes in contact with the floor immediately at the hit of the throttle

[@ZacLowing]

@@UncleTonysGarage Ah, thanks!

[@ltomczak92]

You talk a lot about weight above and below the axle center line. And now seeing this video makes me wonder, what does the weight of the front end do when it comes slamming back down and you have the little to no resistance shocks up front as opposed to old solid axle thick leafed gassers? Does that weight that drops below hold under for too long, ending up being more trouble than having a stiffer suspension up front?

[@UncleTonysGarage]

Unless you yank your foot off the throttle, nothing is slamming anywhere

[@ltomczak92]

Uncle Tony's Garage ok. I’ve yet to be in drag car pulling a wheelie so I didn’t know that’s why those violent slams happened. But still when the front end does come back down how much of a difference does that weight falling below the centerline affect ETs

[@scottking2451]

Dude you are old school such a treat to watch u my dad had a couple mopars in the day nothing runs or sounds like a molar

[@CharlieBrown-pb9xn]

On a light cars with slicks and snubbers and hp ive seen a couple people have some bad days cuz even tho pinion cant go higher the housing gets thrown down and separates so far from body because of extreme leverage the pinion angle still goes extremely high and shafts get tossed out. I like superstock springs with extra front leafs. Mine are homemade with 5 regular leafs and 3 more just towards front. This is on a Maverick. A friend of mines 340 4speed 69 Dart has tossed probably 5 or more driveshafts with his standard leaf snubbed 8 3/4

[@UncleTonysGarage]

That's where adjustable Drag Shocks come in

[@frogman8591]

I thought I knew a lot about traction...

[@frankconrad7323]

Very Nice Vid. Lot of points for a driver to consider. For the best performance of his car. Just wondering if Ladder Bars worked the same way or not. And my 68 GTO got the first Hurst Air Shocks that came out. I always thought less air lower back end, more air higher back end. Better traction, or was I just being Stupid?? Thanks for the Video again.

[@UncleTonysGarage]

Ladder bars kinda sorta work on that principal. They're a bit more precise than a snubber with a range of tuning options.

[@retro440]

No matter how hard I try not to, I learn something new with every video, Tony!!

[@halroy9610]

I got one thing I love doing and that's learning at least one thing a day. Thank you uncle Tony. I've learned something today. I may be old but l'm still learning from you.

[@josephtaverna1287]

Great info Tony say hello to Uncle Kathy for me take care my friend

[@brandonpeters6379]

That front wheel/tire setup looks amazing

[@EASTSIDE-313]

It's amazing all of these "car guys" and "mopar guys" praising Tony because he explained a damn pinion snubber LMAO...

[@UncleTonysGarage]

Right????

[@mikebates7234]

where is your smoke ? how can you get this done without one...haha

[@jdsimons6115]

Same concept as a trac bar or 4 link in gm leaf spring setup.

[@alexandertoshich765]

Awesome! Pet the Beagle, the red ones are great!

[@terryschnereger8531]

My 74 Charger with superstock leaf springs with 275 70 R15 tires will never hit the snubber.

[@UncleTonysGarage]

If it's a stock style snubber, then it's not supposed to

[@terryschnereger8531]

Yes, it's a stock snubber

[@terryschnereger8531]

Mopar to ya!👍🏁

[@jacobjarvis8798]

Always throwing shit lol

[@UncleTonysGarage]

I have issues!

[@jacobjarvis8798]

@@UncleTonysGarage lol it's cool makes the video worth watching along with the knowledge u give. I'm 26 and u don't get taught some of the things u show

[@UncleTonysGarage]

That's what I'm here for!

[@jfloyd6334]

What style lug nuts do you run on those aluminum rims?

[@georgespangler1517]

Building a 46 dodge pickup, what pinion angle do you recommend? It's a 8.8 327 gear.

[@UncleTonysGarage]

3 degrees down is about the standard

[@throttleblipsntwistedgrips1992]

*mind blown* and here I was thinking caltracks

[@sunnyray7819]

Reminds me of my ex - girlfriend

[@tonylang7526]

WOW!!! NOW IM LEARNT!!!