MTG's "We Hate Poor People" - One Year Later

Happy Anniversary of the Anniversary Product, that none of us bought!
This video is brought to you by Cool Stuff Inc! Pick up MTG singles and sealed product from Cool Stuff Inc - use the code KENOBI at checkout to get 5% off your order! Check them out here: www.coolstuffi...
#MTG #MagicTheGathering #wotc

[@TolarianCommunityCollege]

Calling this a product seems disingenuous.

[@skiks3562]

I still think about how you asked people what they would spend $1000 on instead of proxies, and you got a bunch of responses about paying off debts and giving kids an amazing Christmas.

[@untrustworthyshelfing9953]

They could have cooked up an ultra-premium product for the niche that wanted it, but the cynicism of this product is beyond anything. "We know you want this, but you still can't have it, even though we are remaking it. Happy Anniversary!"

[@joshuadempsey5281]

@TolarianCommunityCollege I think the proper term here is “Late Stage Capitalistic Product” lol

[@TheRedKnightOfPain]

it should have been sold at a 1993 original price point for extra good feels, and it would have sold so fast Hasbro would have gotten whiplash, but they choose the only path to piss off the disparate parts of the MTG community, and have them all fight against WotC/Hasbro

[@Jlizard27]

​@@B1gLupupeople always simp for capitalism and then don't understand the mental gymnastics they need to go through to defend the idea that every aspect of necessary regulation is to protect from the fact that capitalism is completely antithetical to humanism.

[@janmelantu7490]

I maintain that if they made a “draft pack” of 3 boosters and sold them for $50 each, they would’ve made a killing off of people who wanted to try a Beta draft with some friends.

[@JoeyDCote]

Even for the chance to get some "offical" proxies of the rares like dual lands people probably would have been willing to shell out a bit.

[@petermalaspina756]

The just needed to reprint unlimited booster packs, with all the reserve list cards put in as different backed proxies and the non-RL cards as playable versions (with the old art), and sold them for 10 a pack. It would have made a killing, and not enraged people. They could then do a similar reprint ever year or so, going through all the classic sets.

[@RetireandGo]

There are so many options they could have gone with Even a full set for $500 They would have made a fortune Now, if I proxy these, who is to say they are not “real proxies”? Haha

[@dough4prez]

Ahh... 30th anniversary boosters, the celebration MTG players deserved.

[@jamescruz8678]

$50 packs of proxies hell no man I don't wanna live in this timeline

[@GrahfGames]

I still sometimes imagine a world where Wizards did the sensible thing and released these as regular priced boosters that were printed however much. Taking the angle of "while it's not going to be tournament legal, you and your friends can relive what a Beta draft was like" would've made sense for the anniversary, and probably sold pretty well.

[@alexandercastleberry480]

World Champion Decks are prime examples of cheap meaningless fun for people who just want to play.

[@Donovarkhallum]

No it doesn't make sense. If you can't play it in a. Tournament you might as well print it yourself.

[@giocommentary]

@@Donovarkhallum so playing with people and friends has ''no value'' to you? therefore it doesn't make sense? there are loads of reasons the product would have succeeded at a lower price point. experiencing the game also has value or something... they would be great collectibles. it would be a lot of fun to draft such older formats. they could be used as proxies for Commander or Vintage/Legacy tournaments so people could keep their card in a case whilst still playing the card. because well value.. i have the real duals myself and i still think it is disaster purely because of the price point. selling proxies is fine! keep the promise of not reprinting them tourny legal. but then atleast allow your actual average playerbase access to the focking product..

[@Donovarkhallum]

@@giocommentary your actual player base can access the product. Go to a kinkos and get them printed. They don't need too buy something they can't use in a tournament. Get outta here reserved list defender they should just print the real fucking cards. The only defendable. Point is drafting at home and even then I still don't agree that you should pay them for a card that doesn't at least have the possibility of playing in a tournament. And you're wrong you can't use proxy in vintage or commander. Tournaments. Even if printed by them it's technically just a fake card at the. End of the day for that reason . I can print fake cards myself for way less cost Soo that's just stupid. But sure stand on your soapbox for wizards. Lube up Soo you don't get burns from riding their dick so hard

[@subzero308]

​@@Donovarkhallumexactly these r pieces of card board that people love and wanna play and not printing cards we need for legacy and vintage just so a bunch of 40 year olds don't cry cause their expensive card board is being reprinted is so dumb... And honestly prices wouldn't drop on the OG stuff because birds of paradise is proof of that.. I don't mind having expensive printings of cards as long as they print reasonable priced copies too. I just love playing magic i don't care about the prices of my cards reprint everything and tank the market... I would honestly use counterfeit cards and proxies if they were legal in tournaments. Magic just needs to go back to being a game again and not peoples retirement plans.

[@TheZak6969]

Sales guy wasn’t lying to you. I think about 100 were made. The version that’s expensive now it the Neiman Marcus Edition, which is funny because the trim package it comes with is different from the movie version. Also the Z3 displayed on the promo poster for the movie is left hand drive.

[@AC3handle]

It still go fast!

[@erin-williams-vj8]

This all feels very similar to the increase in NFTs we saw a while ago. They were worthless to begin with, some people bought it, realized they were worthless, and had to start trying to get rid of a toxic asset before everyone else realized it was worthless too.

[@jasonsavory9748]

Don’t forget them lying to themselves so hard they blinded themselves at a party

[@Syne111]

My NFTs are still doing fine. I've been getting ready for the next cycle.

[@jasonsavory9748]

@@Syne111They 100% rely on the 'Greater Fool' Fallacy, as long as you're not left holding the bag

[@Suspinded]

$193 market for 30A Savannah is averaged against sales data. There are a total of 4 NM copies sold in the last 3 months : 218, 192, 144, 138, with some madman snagging an LP one for 70. Getting 30A and holding it was a financial death sentence. Nobody actually wants them.

[@badgerchillsky535]

Yeah, nobody wants to be holding the bag, but there’s also the sunk cost fallacy of losing money if you sell for too low. But I do think down the road they could actually have some value of their own. Just for their place in magic history and the fact that they are extremely rare. Having a complete set of 30A is likely to be an extreme rarity.

[@adammorin2955]

@@badgerchillsky535 I doubt it. Collectors the people who pay 1000s on a card to be able to say they have it want the original card not a proxy or some not legal card that the company who make the cards. Some Collectors want all the same card but different art but never seen one who want a reprinted version over the original.

[@AC3handle]

@@badgerchillsky535 You'd have to be fxing nuts, and fuxing rich, post malone rich, to be able to make a set like that, and WANT to do it.

[@badgerchillsky535]

@@AC3handle you’re not wrong. But there are people willing to shell out big money. Alpha Black Lotus still moves from time to time. And maybe they don’t hold the supposed value they have now. Maybe they eventually go down a little and serious collectors will start seeing them as worthwhile. I’m just saying I think they’ll eventually have a real value of their own.

[@yummines]

It's funny to think that an entire year ago the biggest scandal WOTC had was selling overpriced proxies. Now with the whole deal with the Pinkertons it makes that seem quaint in comparison.

[@39Lords]

And the DnD Licensing issues as well.

[@Itachi45481]

talk about a rollercoaster year @@39Lords

[@RafitoOoO]

What?

[@AC3handle]

@@RafitoOoO Which 'what' are you asking about? The Pinkertons or the D&D licence?

[@RafitoOoO]

@@AC3handle Plinkertons, Idk what it is. The D&D licence fiasco I'm aware of haha.

[@Barracius]

I think a critical element of the failure of this product is that it was a *randomized* product. I think that if it were basically that Collector's Edition product they did however long ago, but still at $1000 it might have sold okay. But this still was one of the worst Magic products ever conceived and I am glad it failed.

[@Syne111]

Maro: "We are unwilling to reprint Reserved List cards at normal card size regardless of border or back."

[@alexanderwaller7354]

Imagine if Magic 30 was a self-contained vintage cube with different card backs. They would've sold out even at $1k MSRP.

[@RudeKeyser]

This could have been the greatest product WotC had ever released... if they had given it out to LGS's for free or for a minimal cost, for use in store events. Imagine, celebrating Magic's 30th anniversary by gathering at your local game store to play draft or sealed Beta...

[@vinnythewebsurfer]

Imagine if we lived in the timeline where the reserve list didn’t exist/got dismantled early on and Wotc could just milk ancient sets and cards like normal the same way Konami re-releases its oldest yugioh sets every couple years for THEIR anniversaries and don’t feel the need to charge 200$ bucks per pack for these things

[@ArclinusCastoral]

Old Yugioh cards are also usually terrible compared to newly printed cards and not especially competitive. Competitive cards are also generally reprinted much more liberally, but kudos to Konami for having healthy reprint philosophies despite having a horrifically power crept game.

[@DuncanHarbison]

And maybe Legacy or Vintage would actually be formats that people play.

[@alexandercastleberry480]

The reserve list was already legally dismantled when they made changes to it without receiving any pushback or legal challenges. They can do anything with it whenever they want. They thought they could use it to sell $1000 proxies. They are just figuring out how stupid it was to double dip and compete with their own distributors and LGS. Secret Lair Alert. Secret Lair Alert.

[@subzero308]

Yeah that would be amazing i don't care about the price of my cards and i have alot of modern decks and other expensive cards.. I just care about playing the game but sadly counterfeit/proxies aren't tournament legal.

[@xolotltolox7626]

​@@ArclinusCastoraloriginal LOB printings of cards still go for quite a huge amount of money And YuGiOh for its 25th anniversary which was this year, among other products, released a "Rarity collection" which is essentially just a box full of reprints of tourney staples, with all cards being available in different levels of foil treatment, simultaneously putting out cheap copies of powerful cards into the market AND creating high value treatments of the cards, such as quarter century secret rare ash blossom going for more than a box of the set retails for And it is a set of 24 boosters each 5 cards for 100€/USD, all foil, and high quality foil, not MtG pringles foils

[@CDour]

Epson is where I procure all of my proxies, and at a far cheaper price. I don't even need to pay for shipping!

[@Gattsu65]

If I buy proxies I pay less then $1 per card. So that's what the 30th Anniversary cards are worth. If this was going to be successful they needed to either be normal priced packs in the $3.99-9.99 range. Or have them be real cards. Personally I think making the packs cheap would have been the right move. Most of the people who have playable revised list cards are either keeping them to play with, keeping them for investments, or are currently trying to sell them. And most of the people who want them can't afford them or have better things to spend their money on. A cheap wotc printed proxy would fill that void for casual players who like playing with powerful cards.

[@syndicate5357]

Where can we get said proxies?

[@ItMeYaGril]

​​​@@syndicate5357the website I've used is called "Printing Proxies," but there are a couple of different ones online. They all seem to use a pricing model that makes it cheaper per card as you order more proxies. To get $0.75/card, you need to order 200+ cards.

[@subzero308]

​@@syndicate5357i used to find alot on etsy they were amazing too looked and felt exactly like the "real" pieces of cardboard... Smh i hate the fact that we have real and fake pieces of cardboard its so stupid... These r for a game not someone's retirement plan smh. I just wanna go back to where cards were affordable. Even reprinting everything would still keep the prices of the older stuff birds of paradise is proof of that.

[@Jlizard27]

​@@syndicate53575 cents from your local library per sheet of paper, possibly more if you use cardstock

[@TheHamgamer]

It's such a popular product that my LGS still has their single unit of the product sitting up on the shelf since they got it.

[@orangegalen]

I’m surprised your LGS a) even has one since it was an online order item b) has the gall to even display it in any fashion outside of a paperweight or doorstop.

[@ianlittlefield8448]

​@@orangegalenGame stores were gifted 1 box for free as part of the anniversary.

[@orangegalen]

@@ianlittlefield8448 Ah, thank you for clarifying. Now that you said that I remember they did that - gave a bunch away for free to try and artificially hype it up.

[@TheHamgamer]

@@orangegalen it's like high up on the top shelf to the point where you have to actively look up to really notice it. Lol

[@timbawden2577]

Wow this means its been a year since ive bought any magic product. This product ruined my desire to buy anything Magic from Wizards

[@frostace8057]

I still feel that they could just do it like the collector’s edition back in Beta. $50 for a whole set. Mass produce it, sell it like hotcakes

[@Syne111]

Maro: "We are unwilling to reprint Reserved List cards at normal card size regardless of border or back."

[@joebrownstone6746]

Hey thats Red Dwarf! Thats such a good show!

[@serithraz2255]

Red Dwarf and MST3K, quality comedy

[@Whitewingdevil]

Love me a good Red Dwarf reference, one of the greatest sci-fi comedies of all time, if not the greatest.

[@kxe665]

PK just gained a lot of my respect for the Red Dwarf reference - keep up the good work :)

[@berenerchamion4998]

I am honestly becoming tired of Magic products. There are SO MANY & the prices are ever rising. I use printed proxys in some decks, & feel no shame about it. It is not a healthy pace.

[@subzero308]

Man F nobody should be ashamed for playing with proxies its a game have fun... I spend ALOT of money on magic singles for my modern decks but i would never tell someone they can't play because they didn't waste money on pieces of cardboard like me.. magic players need to be more welcoming to proxy players as long as it is a legal card in the format isf if someone whole deck is proxied. Just have fun and play.. I think proxies should be tournament legal because the point of magic is to see who's the best not to see whos band account is bigger.

[@Syne111]

Yep, proxies are fine until the cards are worth keeping long-term because they appreciate in value.

[@jimshotfirst4887]

@@subzero308yep, not being willing to play against proxies is just saying “I don’t want to fight your skill, I want to fight your wallet.”

[@nfortin24]

Basically for a product like this you need to see the price trends not as a gauge on the market, but rather on how much those who bought it are willing to lose...

[@jevonp]

it was just wotc testing if people would be more upset about the prices or proxies

[@Tvboy777]

That's what "price" is. It's a seller's prediction of how much money people are willing to give up to own a thing or receive a service.

[@JD-gk7eh]

Collector's Edition cards are legal in Old School formats (Eternal Central, Atlantic, and Swedish if they're allowing reprints, which most do). The 30th Anniversary cards are not.

[@syndicate5357]

Around here and elsewhere in the USA they've told me in old school that m30 IS allowed

[@JD-gk7eh]

@@syndicate5357 The retro frame ones would be but the new frame ones are not. That's far less helpful since the retro frame ones are extremely expensive, way more than CE versions, and much more rare.

[@SyxxPunk]

I still can not believe we live in a timeline where Konami did their 25th Anniversary box better than WotC/Hasbro did their 30th Anniversary.

[@xolotltolox7626]

I mean, Konami actually reprints cards and doesn't have something as utterls stupid as the reserve listx that is still clung onto for some god forsaken reason

[@lowelltan2711]

Watching this made me wonder about how the McDonald's happy meal Pokemon cards, we are currently having in my country are going to end up after it ends.

[@Chocolate83Bunny]

I have some old yu gi oh McDonald's cards from the 00's. They are worth about 2-3$. Nothing to start stealing from kids for.

[@alexandercastleberry480]

At about $2.50 a pack

[@gododoof]

​@@Chocolate83BunnyI never need a reason to steal from children.

[@Trazaeth]

They should have ripped off the bandaid and just made them tournament legal and the set would have sold like hotcakes.

[@JStack]

And also collapsed tre secondary market, the only think propping up Magic and so as a result Hasbro lol "set our company on fire for a novelty product," a little shortsighted. There is the option they could be less predatory as well Lmao

[@antoniomromo]

​​@@JStackremoving cards from the reserve list has not significantly impacted their value on the secondary market. The older printings still hold value. The idea that the reserve list is necessary, is a myth. Like anything else, scared people that use magic as an investment vehicle will bail out of fear, but they will stabilize. This will then force wizards to focus on gameplay instead of investing.

[@Enja_Near]

The profit margins in the face of lawsuits for removing the reserve list wouldn't be worth it.

[@brandonbrooks779]

​@@JStackthe secondary market is fpe people who don't shower, it is a joke. LGS are gross and most are just as predatory as WOTC

[@antoniomromo]

​​@@Enja_NearThe lawsuits would likely be won by wizards, as they would only be able to rely on promissory estoppel. Wizards gets around this by simply saying that the list exists, but they simply remove cards from it and can add them as they see fit. (They never promised to not edit the list). It would be an expensive one off court case and some bad press, but it would give them the legal certainty.

[@robert8984]

@PleasantKenobi Those BMWs are called "Z3 Limited 007 James Bond Goldeneye Edition" The car featured a commemorative "Specially Equipped 007" dash plaque, 007 floor mats, a beige interior and of course the "Bond Blue-Gray" (Atlanta-306) color. They x/100 serialized.

[@PleasantKenobi]

Amazing! Thank you! HE WASN'T LYING!

[@clayvision]

the sad thing is, if this was a 30 dollar product, even if it only had 1 pack in the box, it might be hailed as one of the BEST products of all time...

[@JakeTheJay]

It's almost comical how WoTC thinks we're made of money and can keep charging more ridiculous prices for cards, not realizing that people can't or don't want to spend 12$ on a booster pack that will likely be absolute garbage. You could almost buy Skullgirls for that money and you are more likely going to enjoy that than a single booster that's rigged to give you trash cards 90% of the time. I'd rather buy a Yugioh pack than Magic even if I haven't played Yugioh in awhile since I am somehow more likely to get something good from a yugioh pack on top of the pack costing more than 50% less than the Magic one. Absolute insanity

[@subzero308]

People still buying sealed product is crazy to me... Only way sealed product is worth it is for drafting other then that singles 100%.

[@Giraplatina]

For the James Bond car, I know from other general collector youtubers that stuff that flops tends to be the stuff that gets quite valuable, but it's something that happens over time. If you release a collector's item in limited runs, the secondary market price tends to go up immediately because the demand is high now. But if you overproduce (even if it's a limited or smaller run), and most people aren't interested, it's reasonable to assume that most copies of the item won't be put into card sleeves and frames or nice garages, but just be used, get lost or end up destroyed in some other way. Or the owner never cared about the value, so won't easily sell. So the price remains low, but once the primary market stops the supply, the secondary market will be the only place to get them, and they will be very rare. And then the price does have a chance to increase, if there's something that gets people interested.

[@rathlord]

The 30th Anniversary stuff will be worth something because it's a product for MTGFinance bros and that's who bought them and that's who's selling them and that's the only people who will ever buy them. No player who actually wants to play Magic or gives a fuck about the game as a game bought the original product or will buy it on the secondary market. It's just a bunch of finance bros trying to speculate on prices trading them back and forth, and that artificial value will probably always be around to some extent, but I see it as entirely disconnected from the game of Magic. WotC should have just sold it on wall street and never even told players. The actual impact to the game and all of us would have been exactly the same.

[@ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh7072]

Worst ever product so far

[@hearmth6618]

It's not a product. It's a travesty 😡

[@jcbillman]

I know not your point but ask the sales guy for the VIN and do a VIN lookup on the Z3 and you’ll find out whatever you want to know. If the first digit is an S, it’s a LHD car made for England. If it is a number 1 to 4, it’s a US market car. If he won’t give it to you, never buy a car from that person, it’s a scam.

[@scott898586]

People should remember before buying this that WoTC literally threw this set and Unfinity into landfills as trash. No one should pay anything more than like $50 bucks for this imo. If there is scarcity, it is because WoTC made it scarce by destroying their own product.

[@Snow_Fire_Flame]

This is much less meaningful than you think it is. It's standard practice to make an order slightly above what you think you need to ship (just in case of returns, lost shipping, etc.). The cost to WotC per unit of some cardboard is very low, so slightly overprinting and tossing the rest isn't considered a problem. It's only an issue if the overprinting was wild, like if they printed twice as much Unfinity as they needed.

[@moomantle8061]

The thing is, it's not even a cool product either. Why would I want the OG cards with modern borders. They just look stupid

[@unamusedrowlett6303]

Right!? It's like they thought the nostalgia mtg collectors might have for the old cards translate to how fans of Yugioh or Pokemon see Charizard or The Blue-Eyes White Dragon.

[@pbg2025]

Yes absolutely. As an old head I was repulsed by the modern border. Like I still don't understand who this product is for.

[@davidhower7095]

I like getting printed versions with the updated Oracle text. No issue with the modern border personally, though it does make some older card art look wacky

[@PandaXs1]

well that's why they also printed them with the old borders lol

[@moomantle8061]

Only 1 per pack :(@@PandaXs1

[@anthonydelfino6171]

I think there's a cohort of commander players who will, ironically, be fine with players using non-tournament legal card that was officially printed by Wizards (think like a gold border Gaea's Cradle) who aren't okay with proxies you printed out yourself. And as long as there's a sizable amount of those players, these cards will have value. They'll be more on board with your official proxy of volcanic island, but not with the one you ran off yourself. This is why that example of the gold border Gaea's Cradle still holds a value of around $150

[@alicepbg2042]

These type of people are so dumb...

[@nicks4802]

Im one of the players. If it was THAT easy to “just” print whatever cards i want to play with, The game would die. You NEED to buy actual cards to play with. If everyone did it, the game would die. Point being, that makes it inherently unhealthy for the life of the game. If you want another 30 years of magic, you need to buy the cards. Be it new or used, from the LGS or from somebody in the community willing to trade or sell it to you. Rare cards need to stay rare. Taking away the rarity by using your printer is a cheap (im not speaking financially) way to try and act like you’ve got powerful shit in the game. Either you can obtain it by paying for it, by trading for it, Or by getting the official proxy for X$$$. And you wonder why wotc does the crap they do to make money…. Cheapskate players are actively trying to kill the game by not paying for it….. Might as well just shoplift some cards…. But people don’t have the balls to rob their LGS. Maybe the local Walmart, but not the LGS, because you’re scared of hurting the stores bottom line. The stores bottom line is hurt when you try to hurt wotc’s bottom line. Printing cards instead of buying them is, essentially, NOT supporting your lgs. Again, you may as well stoop a little lower and shoplift some cards if you don’t care to support the game or the shops you’d buy cards at. “But those cards aren’t available at my LGS!” You will cry. To that, I’ll simply refer you back to my paragraph about keeping rare cards rare and not being a cheapskate who wants to kill the game and the LGS (even if you don’t realize thats what you’re doing)

[@dreadgray78]

@@nicks4802 That's extremely gatekeepy and comes across like you and don't want others to enjoy the game unless they share your mentality. Not wanting to spend $1k on crap is not the same thing as being a cheapskate or wanting to kill the game. I completely agree that players should support LGS and if you can afford a commander precon or a few $5-20 staples then yeah it's probably better to buy those at your LGS and not print them out. AND I agree there's a lot of value in owning the real cards, and by that I mean the actual tournament legal reserve list cards, I just spend 200 bucks on a Serra's Sanctum. That said I also have a friend who the only way he's even able to play magic is by printing off most of his cards cause the guy doesn't have the money for a fairly expensive hobby. I think the best solution is just to not play with people who are gatekeeping, there's plenty of people who won't do that to new or less wealthy players.

[@dreadgray78]

I think the solution is just to not play with gatekeepy players and to have a rule 0 conversation about proxies vs. no proxies and also about power level. If there's a power level issue that has nothing to do with proxies it has to do with the deck you brought to the table, whether it's made up of crappy printouts or blinged out w/ alpha and all the most expensive foils. Either way if you bring a cEDH deck to a pod of precons, wth are you doing, and why are you playing?

[@alicepbg2042]

@@nicks4802 if you payed 1000$ for a few official proxies, you are just bad with money. Stop being so gatekeepy. This hobby is very expensive and people can't usually afford to pay all the money required for the cards. If it's not an official tournament, let people try stuff out with cheap proxies while they get the official cards over time.

[@smsamurai93]

I don't play MtG, I play YGO, but I keep tabs on the community because it's always interesting to see how different the reprint policies are. Konami just wiped out our secondary market by reprinting every staple in 7 different rarities and it's such a successful product, every store in my area is sold out you literally cannot buy the set physically anywhere after release weekend. Values for cards 'investors' bought into NOT EVEN IN THE SET have been wiped out because the rarity, not the card, has been cheapened. Literally 0 people are mad, it's a gloriously cheap time to get into the game right now. Makes the MtG reserved list look hella cringe tbh

[@hectormorales4090]

I will just say this... My printer can produce stuff that is not tournament legal and is not as expensive as that shyte certain company and some individuals are trying to seel it for.

[@demoncushion9600]

A big reason why the Team Rocket cards are so $$$ is because it was ONLY available through Japanese Pokémon Center stores, 1 per person, and had a very short pre-order window. I remember when it came out, you basically had to find a person who lived in Japan who didn't want it, pay them the 15,000 ¥ +shipping and wait. Problem is the amount of Japanese people willing to buy this item, and ship it back state side isn't that high. Mix that with the 1 per person, and it became a nightmare for anyone outside of Japan to get their hands on. The Rocket cards had high demand, it was just nearly impossible for us to get at the time. Not the MTG 30th anniversary set... no one wants and the people who did invest want to see a ROI, I don't blame them, so they are refusing to sell for lower prices. Some of those people are starting to crack and are selling

[@BCWasbrough]

Is it worth *something*? Yes. Should it be worth much? Absolutely not.

[@verv5737]

Alternate theory on the proxy Savannah price. Speculators with these 30th anniversary proxies put them on sale for high prices hoping someone will buy it and all the sales have been to people buying them by mistake who thought they were buying real cards.

[@powerplayer1000]

Got to say, i remember this because its relativity close to when i stated playing ( start of the pandemic) and i did get two of the count down kits because i think there neat... and the cards are LEGAL

[@MattCorrales]

As someone who is trying to eBay some of my late dad’s old action figures, I’m tossing a lot of stuff that has theoretical value on eBay but, when you look at the actual recent sales, isn’t moving. Same thing is going on here.

[@syndicate5357]

The economy is also kinda down

[@MTGUnpacked]

This could've been a home run product at a tenth of the price, but apparently greed overruled commonsense!🤦‍♂️

[@califkids3]

For the best example of how these are going, look specifically at the quantity shifted for each of them. Revised savannah shifts multiple copies a day, anniversary shifts multiple copies a MONTH. (In fact, there was only one sale on tcgplayer for them in November)

[@samcates5308]

This was a great video as always, but the Red Dwarf reference is what made me slam the like button

[@jorjor500]

From what I understand in my different MTG sales groups/finance groups I used to frequent (so these are the equivalent of rumors take it with a grain of salt) there’s basically a small subset of people that bought into this product that are basically trading/buying between each other. Most people weren’t interested in the product, so the people that bought them initially are the only ones interested now as well. They’re basically all just changing hands between a super specific group

[@jacobkuhn9072]

Happy I meet u in Madison . the free pizza was great, and your use of red drawf is top shelf

[@brennanclement8582]

Couldnt tell you about the BMW, but during my visit to the UK I saw an Aston Martin with the driver's seat on the left side which I thought was funny. Either someone had their car customized to have it drive on the opposite side, or they had a formerly-exported car imported back.

[@jonnyWisconsin]

Thank you for including the red dwarf clip. Great show! Great bit too. What's your favorite episode?

[@MrSuperdude6]

I was waiting for the NFT point because it feels so bang on. With NFTs you're buying buying "ownership" of an image which doesn't really mean anything when you can just right click and save an image. Similarly with the Magic 30 cards, you're buying "ownership" of an official Magic proxy which doesn't really mean anything because I have a printer at home.

[@gkiyo]

I was sure this notification was going to be about Aftermath, but you know - you're right.

[@hopposai787]

I really liked aftermath. I like cracking packs but as I pass 50k non rare bulk cards. The idea of opening 15 card packs of pure bulk is unappealing. It was a high power set with the bulk cut out. I loved it.

[@UnreasonableOpinions]

I would never believe that scammy gits are wash trading the terrible cards they tried to hold and got destroyed on to try and recover anything. Wait, no, the opposite of that.

[@Terracronz]

$1,000 for a random assortment of proxies, what a joke

[@Red_Mag3]

Love the Red Dwarf cut in

[@andrewvance6549]

I remember watching the advertisement for this. At first I thought....wow, are they just printing neo-beta? that seems unlikely...oh different backs, right, so it's a new CE? For a thousand bucks, I might by a CE....oh it's in boosters, so not a full CE, you just get like, the duals and the power 9 and... randomised? 3 boosters of beta for a thousand bucks, and they have ugly backs? Oh, my, no thanks, wizards.

[@D4ddi0G4m3r]

Loved the Red Dwarf reference. It's one I still quote to my wife today.

[@Pandahboymtg]

I said this a year ago when 30th anniversary came out and I'll say it again now that if WotC sold the 4 pack bundle for $100-$150 people would have bought the hell out of it and it would have been a home run product. Imagine if they did it as a booster box for $300 to $400 and you could have a draft with the packs. There were so many directions that they could have gone with the product but they chose to do it this way.

[@RickHardpack]

Ah yes, Savannah. Definitely the most sought after Dual land

[@PleasantKenobi]

No one said it was. Weird comment.

[@PandaXs1]

I think I remember seeing someone compare this to Summer Magic, which isn't tournament legal either. just scarcity combined with novelty.

[@kevinelrick6605]

It’s interesting to compare MTG 30th anniversary with Warhammer’s 40th anniversary. They both reprinted an original product from their first edition (alpha and rogue trader respectively) and yet Games-Workshop came off looking a lot better because their product was a $65 rule book that you can use to play Warhammer Rogue Trader (expensive for a rule book but in line with current GW prices) instead of $1000 for cards you can’t legally play with.

[@Mox_Normandy]

I mean GW gave players value for their purchase. One book and you can play a whole game with friends. WOTC sold players something that was less than worthless and charged ubsurd prices for something that had no value.

[@bobconway5958]

I am a gamer and I by products as game pieces. Not only do I not want any game pieces other than the standard pieces, the premium pieces are of lesser value because they are more difficult to use (mostly through slowing game play).

[@benjiboy1337]

That last comment is basically my thought - M30 is Magic's NFTs. This is a Savannah printed by WotC. It's not a tournament playable version, and you can never exchange it for a tournament playable version, but it is most certainly a card printed by WotC and you most certainly do own it, and it most certainly is a Savannah in all respects except for the fact that you can't play it in a tournament.

[@bk1ll]

Props for the red dwarf clip.

[@Jeramiahstool]

Thank you wizard for both kicking yourself in the ass while also legitimizing the proxy market

[@kennydarmawan13]

I think the final nail in the coffin is when Yu-Gi-Oh! celebrated their 25th anniversary. It wasn't much, but new packs of the first sets in a box and in separate packs? And two different sets celebrating 25th anniversary, one for last year's sets and another for staples? It may not be the best thing, but Konami did something MUCH better than Wizards of the Coast. And that's bad news, if you ask me. Goes to show the many things Yu-Gi-Oh! does better.

[@mrpoparq]

It’s probably a bit of both columns, there’s some amount of value in them, and that allows people to inflate the perceived value for profit.

[@kyletucker3811]

I'm a Digimon player, I saw something similar a little while ago with a tournament legal card. They released a new mechanic support card for a fan favorite deck, Diaboromon. Well at first they were priced around $8.99 pre-release. Which made sense, the pre-release for alt-art ones coming out in a few months are $24.99. After release, a few unscrupulous sellers instantly shot the price up to $20 to try and artificially inflate the median listed price and sell them for that much. So far as I can tell, they didn't, and eventually the price fell back down to around $14, still a bit high in my opinion, but more reasonable. The hilarious part is despite being a fan favorite, Diaboromon has been criminally neglected for support, and so this addition just isn't enough to make it playable, so it's still mostly a waste of money right now. There's supposed to be a set next year coming out that will have actual support.

[@Atmatan]

I put my collection into a box and tried to sell it several times since then, once even to you, over email. Some of us have self respect, others bend the knee and slober the shaft of any corp who once bestowed on them something shiny.

[@erikedelkamp473]

I’m holding out for the official WotC proxy full art/extended scrubland

[@royceflores23]

Not to weeb, but do you see the curvature of that Jessie? I can see why there is interest in that pokemon promo given how the secondary market seems to treat full art lady support cards in pokemon. Wild! Maybe if they had made their fax moxen equally as curvy wizards would have sold some more proxies for 1717717161 dollars. M30 was the biggest trash tier move wizards has made in recent memory.

[@gnomersy1087]

I think that even with them being proxies they're going to hold some value just like the tournament deck versions hold some value because an official proxy feels more legit for commander than a printer copy but not anywhere near the value of the original unless you're planning on making a museum display of WotCs biggest fails

[@RedbeardKINI]

We have one sitting on the shelf and collecting dust at our LGS

[@GoobertownHobbies]

ahhh, memories 🙂

[@hellNo116]

Collecting expensive stuff is inherently irrational. Those things have value because we say they do. That is nuts to an outsider. What happens probably is that people want wotc prints of this cards for their collection and their cubes. Those people trading are either "investors" (I hate this term) or simply wanting those cards for their power cube basically straight up whales. The funny thing is that since most of the reserved list is not even played in legacy even if they overcharged for proxies like 20 a pack I know that people would still go nuts over them. Basically cedh would become accessible and power cubes with only official cards would be a thing again. I doubt I would grab black lotus myself since if that was the prize of the pack the card would go for 120 plus, but I would consider my abzan duals for sure. Because I play commander and commander is basically the new legacy or vintage with the upside you can play stupid stuff that are not powerful in the right pod. So I am certain casual commander players would go nuts for such product. However that would kill the secondary market value of many reserve list cards and wizards didn't won't that I bet they prized that thing in a way that the proxies wouldn't be much cheaper than the original as to not upset the collectors...

[@jasonrhome710]

That all tracks. The only other people I can think of who would want to buy those sets are the tourney players who own the original printings that are in sorry enough shape that they are proxying them anyway. Still ludicrously expensive though, especially for not being officially legal for competitive play.

[@SpellboundTutor]

The best thing that came out of the 30th Anniversary product was promoting the legitimacy of proxies.

[@elijahdprophet]

Amazing how this product completely ruined the reputation of some formerly beloved content creators who spent time shilling for it.

[@T4NK09]

I came here for the Magic meme and was served a healthy Red Dwarf meme, unexpected but appreciated

[@connorhawkins315]

I remember reading an article about 30th anniversary when it was first announced, i got so excited when I heard that i might be able to draft an alpha set with my friends, and even thought to myself "yeah, id say thats a good use of $50, so ill grab some when it comes out," before scrolling down and seeing the price. I havent bought a single card since and just proxy everything now. If non tournament legal cards are worth more than my entire collection, why should I even bother with buying actual cards?

[@ConiferCreates]

In maybe 5-10 years I could see these actually be a certain level of collector piece, even if just as part of something like the museum of failure

[@mbarker_lng]

This is like when a really bad car was made, cancelled after 2 years, then 20 years later they are rare collectors items. (PS:I typed this just before he got into the BMW story)

[@asgads]

I think the reason it didn´t went up so far is that the msrp is insane. what is a full box? 10x1000 USD? as a product it can gain value, same as the oversize lotus and the goldframed cards. as "game pieces" they have no value

[@KomradeKrisis1701]

I'm honestly still surprised that WotC *didn't* try to make 30th anniversary NFTs 🤣🤣🤣

[@badgerchillsky535]

I think at some point they will be worth a substantial amount for the shear fact that it is part of Magic history, and infamous. Add on top of that, they’re more rare than the actual cards. Having a complete set of the 30th anniversary is likely to be about as rare as having a complete set of Alpha.

[@BostonMoose513]

MTG 30 should of been something like: $250/pack Alpha/Beta/Unlimited/Legends/Arabians Nights but junkier stuff removed Bonus Sheet up to Urza or to modern Change the art so its modern to get around the reserved list (and preserve the precious secondary market) It would allow a new generation of players to get into MTG and prevent gatekeeping into vintage and legacy.

[@ImIllITeRaTeAnD]

Make sure to test drive that Z3... twas to my interest too until jumping in the cockpit.... way too tight in there.

[@AK474000]

Wizards wanted to get more in on the money floating around in their second hand market it so obvious. What pains me more is imagine of this was a dedicated draft experience that wasn't legal in standard or elsewhere. Where everyone got to experience what it was like to play with Alpha cards and would be one of a kind for many player who were not even born when these cards were relevant.

[@ruecianbeoulve7770]

I think some nice looking modern proxies for stuff like True Duals is in high demand because people don't want to afford, or physically use the real ones. So when Wizards decided to charge insane amounts for these proxies it was, among the dumbest decisions I have ever seen. No, I think a lot of the more expensive cards in sets like commander masters are also only holding their price because so few people and stores are willing to open the product.

[@STS-qi1qy]

Are they worth *something*? Yes. Are they worth anything near what people are trying to unload them for (let alone what Wizards sold them for)? Fuck no. I'm fine with cool, official proxies if they're sold at prices that reflect that they are, indeed, proxies.

[@Joe-nh8eq]

For what it’s worth, this is a common tactic in collectibles. You price something thats shit very high, not actually expecting people to buy it, but it makes the high priced products you actually intend on selling appear more reasonable in comparison.

[@daseinoseven4514]

Folks drop big money on MTG Gold Border cards and they’re not legal. Pretty similar scenario….

[@xaphan7061]

"Natural supply and demand" gives a lot of credence to the existing market.

[@neimaddamienjackson9256]

A complete set of magic thirty for $1000 , Would have been a lot more appropriate and still very overpriced

[@orangegalen]

“Probably”? Could cut that word out and it’d be more accurate.

[@wonderboy8172]

Those cards are total bulls#it… i wouldn’t touch them with a stick. Also it’s worth noting that the secondary market has really changed over the past few years, it seems « premium » cards, starting at 200/300€ are not selling like they used to… at all! Starcity doesn’t open shitloads of products like they used to, they don’t bother to restock fancy cards in fear of not selling them, we can assume. Stores aren’t buying new sealed products en masse like before, some have been burned with leftovers from whatever set didn’t sell as good as they hoped, etc. The market has changed.

[@CatacombD]

Limited edition products that sell poorly tend to end up being the most expensive collectibles, completely regardless of their individual worth/merit as a product. I fully expect the 30th anniversary boosters/singles to end up being incredibly valuable in the future. Kinda interesting that the poor sales of them resulted in exactly the sort of conditions that financial collectors are after.

[@riddick1128]

the product did one good thing. it made a lot more people a lot more open to proxies

[@peachydls341]

The idea that some random Timmy who had thousands of dollars to spare bought and invested into magic 30 and now believe they are just as cool and important as the OG's is a despicable joke and slap in the face to those who collected the OG cards from Alpha to the urza blocks.

[@Jlizard27]

I mean I agree, but in the same vein people who had the luxury of holding onto their cardboard until it was worth gobs of money is a slap in the face to people who were forced to get rid of them to survive.

[@wintersmonologue]

This product could have been good IF it was released as a nostalgic draft-type booster. Make them proxies sure. But charge a "premium" to let people reasonably draft them like it was 1993. I'm talking like 15-25 a pack. Heck, $100 for 3 is stupid but it's better than $1000 for 4 and I might have bought 2 just to have that cool draft with some friends. This was a missed opportunity especially since we all know they should just do away with the reserve list and print the cards people want/need.

[@gearsfan1549]

i collect enamel pins, have multiple large cork boards and a few small ones on my wall, to someone not interested in them theyre a straight waste of money. the same can be said for almost anything labeled a "collectible". i think as long as its not a required purchase for gameplay, and its just a pretty thing to have on the shelf and look at and say "fuck yeah" to yourself sometimes, its more than fine, id even encourage buying shiny things you like. for normal players who dont want to show off their collection to themselves and anyone who will look, of course they're just going to see whats really there, an expensive bit of card board or enamel that youre unlikely to get a real use out of. but to be fair thats what i was looking for going down the etsy enamel pin rabbithole lmao

[@branwengillen7761]

Very wealthy players and speculators bought Magic 30th and they've set a price to sit on and wait until some sucker pays up. They were never for the average player, they're a shelf ornament for the ultra rich to have so they can brag and show off how rich they are. Like NFTs or gardens or jewels or art collections or that Ferrari that you buy but Ferrari keeps it until you want to drive it but you can only drive it at one racetrack.