A conversation with Larry Summers and Ray Dalio | Politico 15 Conversations

Much in the world has changed since POLITICO launched in 2007. What will we confront over the next 15 years? In the first installment of our Conversations series, focusing on finance and competition, former Treasury Secretary Larry Summers sits down with Ray Dalio, the founder of hedge fund Bridgewater Associates and author of several books, including his latest Principles for Dealing with the Changing World Order.
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[@AssaultPlays]

Ray Dalio is undoubtably an expert on the macro dynamics being discussed in this interview. I learnt a lot from his books and it's the same material that's being reiterated here. It really is the simplest of concepts that he rationalises and swears by - which block out the noise... Human nature is largely limited; history rhymes.

[@jerrylococoj.d.2119]

About the same story repeated over and over again in the Old Testament. Dalio's work is great

[@WorldReserveCurrency]

This is just precious. The honest money manager that still cares about the american dream talking with crony policy maker that spent his years influencing the dismantling of Glass Steagall to support his crony bankers and refused to regulate CDS for Mortgage Backed Securities. I love how he addresses a concern by proposing another concern like a good sociopath. Only one of these two spent quite a bit of time with Jeffrey Epstein. Guess which one. And one of these men knows everything about the other, you an see it in his eagle eyes looking at the liar that doesn't seem to get it. Show less

[@billytheweasel]

@@jerrylococoj.d.2119 Very true. Many forget the socialist, even communist, message of Jesus.

[@loriemmons1964]

It’s really great to see two people of different political persuasions, sit down and discuss like adults. We need Congress and both parties do the same and compromise. Dalio has been preaching this since 2015.

[@mlinganimatiwane]

But guys Dalio and Summers aren't all that different politically

[@billytheweasel]

"Hope is not a strategy" -Dalio Correct, hope is a coping mechanism.

[@johngammon963]

Ray Dalio can relate to anyone. A very rare billionaire with a common touch.

[@JusticeBurpees]

Right, I think very few billionaires like Bill Gates are like Ray Dalio. He has a KZbin channel and while people say all sorts of stuff against him, whether in Amazon review section or KZbin comments section, he's still a hell of a guy and someone I wish I knew personally.

[@cocoanutte]

What a great discussion. Each person listening to the other made it informative. Ray has the facts in a straight line... Larry prays the USA still has what it takes to pull through the biggest crisis that we've created for ourselves.

[@chrisdodt]

I gotta feel that Summers doesn't pray at all.

[@9thirty5]

Agreed: Ray is straight forward honest, and Larry is spinning like a politician.

[@billytheweasel]

Ray was very decent here, much respect. Humility on wheels.

[@adiwidjonarko2229]

This is useful and so good. We should be paying for this type of knowledge and quality. Thank you Politico for sharing.

[@darrenwendroff3441]

In these times, we need a person like Ray dalio who has an awareness of consciousness and human nature and history but also understands the financial aspects to change things, we need a person like this for president, but of course we will never have a person like this because this country is trapped in identity politics. It's a shame, as much as Ray dalio sees a way out, human nature will never allow it.

[@johnkru1295]

Human nature, of stupid humans.

[@bharatkamboj6028]

@Rob Littel gods are outdated, keep up boomer

[@Cici1791]

These two are fantastic, love listening to them. Wish they had more decision-making power and the ability to shape policy.

[@oddvardmyrnes9040]

You are forgetting who Mr Summers is. The man is the main architect of the mess we are in. He was working for Obama during the 2008 crash. Ray Dalio is a gambler. He does not build an economy. YOU do.

[@KLKMedia]

@@oddvardmyrnes9040 obama was not in power during 2008 crash

[@oddvardmyrnes9040]

@@KLKMedia .. True, but he was responsible for the recovery. The policy Mr Geitner & Mr Summers got Obama to agree on, was the most erosive policy ever conducted by any government anywhere. Obama killed the Democracy in the U.S. and turned it into an oligarchy.

[@maryw1778]

Larry Summers is the architect of wealth divide and Ray Dalio makes money predicting every time you get poorer.

[@jolness1]

@@oddvardmyrnes9040 Obama wasn't president until 2009... the crash happened for reasons outside of his Presidency.. since you know, he wasn't president. There are legitimate criticisms of Summers but this isn't one LOL.

[@LaBoricuaOG]

Ray Dalio had most of the right answers. Larry Summers, just a few. I do wish we could have such different minds be able to sit down and have a civilized discussion as they did, though. That's certainly the first step our society needs to make to start moving in the right direction PS. STOP EDITING such great conversations, POLITICO!

[@eduardozambrano6941]

Thanks for this wonderful video with this two great experts.

[@sunnygee3712]

Great talk! As a person growing up in China, I totally agree with Larry on the view of China not being an external threat. China, like Soviet Union, will only be a fleeting power. The success is not begetting success but has been leading to failure. The reality of Lack of human rights and rule of law is not easy to change.

[@day2148]

Sorry but Larry's comparison of China with the USSR / Japan doesn't make any sense. Soviet surge in the early Cold War was powered by cannabalizing the industry equipment they captured in Europe, and recovering from their own horrific war losses. It was more of a "bounce back" effect, so of course it was temporal. Japan surge in the 80s was the result of them having one of the largest bubbles in history, when the land of the Japanese Imperial Palace was worth more than the entirety of New York, and the government did nothing to control it. To make it worse, the Japanese lacked monetary sovereignty, and signing the Plaza Accords just totally killed them. Neither of these scenarios even come close to matching China (i.e. the de-leveraging of debt has been ongoing since 2014), and Larry's lack of history background shows whereas Ray's studies on the topic are just amazing. China has it's own system of "rule of law" called Legalism, which forms one of the two central pivots of Chinese government. Legalism is inherently anti-human-rights because it is an amoral system that believes in Absolute Meritocracy -- that results are all that matters. It is what allowed one of China's most brutal kingdoms, the Qin, to grow so powerful within 150 years after the Shang Yang reforms that it unified China by steamrolling its opponents. The fact you do not know any of this makes me question if you're Chinese at all, or just an ABC who never learned anything about China.

[@sunnygee3712]

@@day2148 I understand every factual points you mentioned here and unfortunately I don't agree with the conclusions you draw. Your use of Ad hominem fallacy here also discredits your arguments, sadly. Only time can tell!

[@day2148]

@@sunnygee3712 Make generic statements that say nothing of substance, provide zero details of your own for backup. And accuse other side of ad hominem when they spent 3 paragraphs detailing the counterargument and only 1 sentence calling out the fact you can't even present the basics. Great argument! You should become a US politician!

[@rr-ricky]

Sunny Gee dont listen to these ignorants. Dalio is a china-bull, most of his investments are chinese companies. funny, that today he finally sold most of his shares of these chinese companies; he is finally aware that china is in decline. Larry is correct that rule of law and freedom will always trump tyranny and autocracy.

[@zzbeasley]

We'd all like to see a panel debate/conversation between team Dalio-Summers and the Vinklevloss twins.

[@nancylamott8088]

Thank you Ray so much.

[@sunflower-oo1ff]

Simply love Ray Dalio !!!Thank you for this , awesome discussion ;)

[@meilinliu4387]

THANK YOU ☺️ for this insight conversations, May the force be with you, blessed day, God 🙏 bless

[@MrGheller]

"I see how successful restaurants try to expand into other cities and the vast majority don't succeed at expanding....." The reason has been studied and the variables have been identified. It's called Pareto Distribution probabilities of success. And serendipity and randomness play a more important role than commonly attributed. Long but interesting topic.

[@LaBoricuaOG]

it's also because, most times, they assume the recipe for success is the exact same in every single place. Wrong. So many cultural nuances they don't take into consideration, that's why they fail (many times).

[@walkdontrun6578]

Ray is brilliant!!! I bought all his books

[@commercialrealestatephilos605]

It’s not confidence. It’s Trust. Government has earned 0 trust.

[@kreek22]

It's not a problem of government, it's a problem of the ruling class as a whole.

[@nyse9999]

Where is the full interview? Why did they cut off Ray's response on China?

[@amwill8929]

I don’t think ray wanted to respond to that. Ray made it clear: the Americans shall focus on solving their own problems which he believes are huge and dangerous. Make America great again, and forget about China for its own problems.

[@cksun1987]

Enjoyed the video. Very thoughtful. Couldn't agree more on their assessments of current events.

[@wanluz277]

Great dialogue!

[@joangentili8484]

Wonderful conversation gentleman keep them coming from 🇦🇺

[@tasd5673]

Joan 🇦🇺 here. Just wanting to ask what’s your take on Australia ATM. Have u got any good financial channels for Australia ect cheers

[@husseinbazzi4659]

What a great discussion

[@kennyli888]

I can't stop admiring Ray for his passion and dedication of sharing his,knowledge. Just comparing to Larry Summers, Larry seems still arrogant to changes in the world and probably underestimated the uprising of China at the same time of potentially the largest US recession. In a scenario of stagflation, it would only drag the QE and Money printing issues further which usually would drag the economic downturn longer and recovery harder.

[@nancylamott8088]

More resources into the Public Education and teachers is a GREAT INVESTMENT in our future generations, and help families so all children have opportunities......

[@Squeezedorange89]

Fantastic video thank you!

[@seanmorgan2678]

We don't need higher taxes. We need less spending.

[@whatnoway728]

Ray Dalio is brilliant. Summers, to me, doesn't bring much to the conversation. I find his career is part of the elite problem. I wish Ray was talking with someone better.

[@josephmartin1543]

Agree , Summers has been at the center of the worst mistakes by Washington DC the last 30 years , he is a total failure.

[@javibaldrich6649]

Interesting, I found Summers to be the only one worth listening here lol

[@Dedicated_.1]

@@javibaldrich6649 Seriously ?

[@kreek22]

They're a couple of normie boomer Leftists. Of course, this talk is for public consumption, so what they really think....Who cares? Not a single original or contrarian idea was here expressed.

[@philsimmer]

Really great content. Long format, expert conversations should be a fundamental component of education. Just as it was in Plato's time. Keep it coming!

[@dr.justovillela3742]

Disfrute mucho de la entrevista, muchas gracias !

[@johnbaker7102]

God we need Ray Dalio for President. He’s rational, precise and coherent. We need less of this political division garbage from both ends of the spectrum and focus on data and evidence

[@jayhearnley8253]

ABSOLUTELY... wouldn't an INDEPENDENT thinking person be a wonderful change. The big problem would be getting the 2-parties in Congress to cooperate with the good proposals that he would put forth from his "mixed staff appointees". WHO KNOWS... if Donald Trump got elected ... "anything is possible"

[@oscar7646]

A noticeable difference I observe in watching these two have a conversation is the following: Despite both being incredibly intelligent and having incredible schooling education, Ray is very much a pragmatist and rational thinker, whereas Larry is much more relying on institutional theory to guide his thinking. Hence the difference in the largest hedge fund built by Ray, versus Larry being a public servant economist at the highest level of government, meant to reinforce the notion sold to the masses.

[@thelifeofpaladin]

wow thats a great observation

[@samcan1000]

You're 100% correct! One is a and freethinker the other is a indoctrinated learner. I'll make it clear for those who don't understand. Ray thinks and grows the other is told how to think.

[@jeroenbklyn]

Great conversation! I would like to hear more, specially about their views on climate change, which in my view is the 4th big force.

[@DocDanTheGuitarMan]

Ray: society needs to earn more than it spends. Larry: how much more does the government need to spend?

[@chrisdodt]

well read and said. Summers sucks up the koolaid daily and spews it out in his tired lefty lingo. sad.

[@amwill8929]

Exactly. Larry has no clue what Ray is talking about. These 2 guys are not on the same level of intelligence.

[@WhySilverWhyNow]

Every problem discussed circles back to printing worthless paper to pay for an ever expanding government. Replacing productivity with money printing can only end one way.

[@1923825]

That is financial capitalism for us.

[@leslieaddai5071]

How does this not have 1m views??

[@iankamau222]

Larry needs to be more concise.. long rambling points and several attempts to not have Ray jump in

[@tuckerbugeater]

ray is a broken clock

[@wanluz277]

Great, informative and candid dialogue!

[@jkmo3285]

Excellent...I agree 👍

[@stevenjulia4730]

It is interesting how after listening to long form un edited conversations you can tell when something is heavily edited. I love both of them but I am stopping listening due to the cuts of hearing the full thought of a person. This is why you, Politico, only have 110k subscribers. Put the whole thing up in the future.

[@navketan1965]

Sir, My strategy is based on end of day closing prices of forex(multiple pairs daily). Standing Orders are entered with the daily trend & placed at distance of 70% of daily ATR(distance D), away from closing price with take profit of 50% & stop loss of 50%(of distance D)--win or lose, no manual interference. Next day new orders are entered based on end of day closing prices. All previous day's unfilled orders are cancelled(but no manual interference with executed but open orders).Based on option probability theory/ Brownian motion, the SYSTEM should make money, if trader SITS & does not fool around using his brain. Your wisdom & thank you

[@user-wr4yl7tx3w]

For a company that prides and espouses radical transparency, why has it turned off comment feature on its own KZbin channel?

[@kapilbalani1982]

Two legends here.

[@shazenbroek]

Coming together is a beginning Staying together is progress and working together is success Henry Ford

[@Leto2ndAtreides]

A lot of people's predictions might be more dependable if we weren't rocking the boat so much. From 2008 to Trump to Covid to Russia, if the basic system doesn't stabilize you have far more opportunities for people to be making unpredictable and thus bad decisions. There's no good holistic management system - especially not one that can account for the dynamics of the world at the level where you're talking about properly managing the future of entire countries.

[@masterchinese28]

Wow, two people who make sense having a civilized discussion about the big issues. I could hardly believe how fast that half hour of discussion went by.

[@DIYDaveT]

People who think these guys are anything but con men are living proof that their is a sucker born every day and twice on your birthday.

[@thelawgameplaywithcommenta2654]

So this beginning part is interesting. When asked about specifics regarding weather or not this soft will landing will be achieved, Dalio repeats his theory, but doesn't answer the question, while Larry responds by saying it would be an issue for the fed to take the middle road and that the best option will be to address the problem early by taking the hit to the real economy temporarily. Dalio seems to agree.

[@petekdemircioglu]

👏👏👏👏👏💚💜💚💜🦄

[@manolotaylor3664]

I am glad to meet you here you look so adorable How are you?

[@grantmitt3167]

amazing

[@D-Dog1976]

Dalio is the teacher, Summers is really the student

[@maddoxbromley6426]

Tax on property or labor is immoral. Especially when that tax is misused as Politicians always have and always will do. They should earn a tax increase by first proving that they can use it more wisely. Sales tax is the only fair tax bc it allows one some freedom to how they are taxed as opposed to opening your check and seeing that money has been skimmed off the top of your labor or paying perpetual rent on property you worked hard to accumulate.

[@mindunwind1]

“To the alien's eyes, all humans look the same. We only know how different we are from each other by virtue of our perspectives.” ― Sukant Ratnakar

[@andy_ppp]

I wish there was a way for Ray to become president, maybe the system is really broken when someone who really could make thing better for everyone can probably never be elected.

[@rosh3478]

Really enjoyed thar very human perspective on complex economics. Wisdom shared with sincerity. Thank you!

[@russeljones1464]

I would be willing to give more to government if they actually spent it well, if they didn’t waste it. Most everything the government does it done poorly and inefficiently, so until you as the government learn how to tell the truth and learn how to be good stewards, don’t ask me for more

[@agent-8699]

You don't have to be willing, they will take it either way, and you won't have any power over how it's spent.

[@netterdrachen1687]

I am from China and I believe that the US has to find a way to live with China in a constructive way. The US has to acknowledge that it cannot control the whole world for ever and has to make spaces for other major powers instead of constantly seeking conflicts to maintain its current position as the only super power.

[@jeffandjodifilms2896]

Ray Dalio has given us, the US the compass to sail thru extremely rough seas.

[@DeOmnibusDubitandum76]

You can become complicit in the near destruction of the Western economy and as a reward become an administrator at Harvard university. This is the kind of world we have made for ourselves.

[@shanshanzhang5736]

Maybe one day Ray Dalio would become a president of USA.. such a brilliant mind to have!

[@richwatchvideos]

Washington has indebted my children and grandchildren.

[@hwccheng]

Very insightful conversation from two of today’s greatest minds. As long as great mind keep thinking, talking and we learning; there may still be a chance it will turns out okay.

[@天成陈]

ray is good

[@chrism.1131]

Sounds to me like a great time for these two guys to get together and create a third party somewhere closer to Center.

[@masterchinese28]

Yes please. So many of us would like to have a choice of common sense and policy instead of hysteria and hyperbole.

[@patrickpontee7985]

one can boil inflation down to simply over printing fiat money, all this long winded discussion is just confusing the real issue!

[@manolotaylor3664]

How are you doing?

[@richardmillward8200]

“ Are you a fighter or a compromiser, can you wait 50 years to make a profit in stock market “?. We go to College to become well rounded, but our society should remain so lopsided in all ways? Production isn’t rewarded, hence Economic Theory remains a shill for those connected only. Worry is for those who fear.

[@Sarah-vh4wt]

A lot of great information. Conversation, dialogue, discussion etc. has to be had! Politicians need to strengthen business growth and strategy skills. Duplication isn’t often sustainable. I could go in so many nuggets!

[@melsanfran911]

Great

[@We_Reddit]

There are people who know what needs to be done to make America a better place for everyone. But when you have politicians like Mitch McConnell and Nancy Pelosi who work (for DECADES) for the rich and big corporations and not interested in bipartisanship and reform, and only interested in bolstering their respective political parties... well, we are where we are because of this.

[@Dedicated_.1]

This interviewer is not getting Ray at all. Ray Dalio Is chicken little telling him the skies falling down and this guy doesn’t understand !

[@hayden1770]

1. Can the US Federal government run a surplus this year as well as several years in the future to reduce the national debt? 2. Can the Democrats and Republicans become less polarized with each other? Can the wealth and income gap shrink? 3. Can the US and China learn to get along better, considering that China is rising sharply while the US is declining? Can the US act gracefully as China surpasses it?

[@thetruth6955]

Sadly the answer to all those questions is no.

[@paulo7200]

I learned from an Argentinian ski lift attendant that "corporate greed" has been the perennial government explanation for persistent inflation in Latin America.

[@johenderson7786]

That is probably true for most nations in the world....corporate greed and government greed...I wish our governments would learn to live within their means.

[@neokorteks2009]

Follow Luke Gromen. He was explaining this in detail a year ago.

[@coreycefail6704]

7 percent 🤣… Let’s be serious people ray

[@junaidarif9932]

Ray is realist. Telling harsh truths. Larry was always a biased economist. Always an optimist. Unable to look beyond his biases.

[@GN0M1X]

I would give all my wealth for an opportunity to meet with Ray Dalio.

[@MrKirknel]

Why not just read his books and watch his interviews?

[@hayden1770]

@@MrKirknel LOL yeah

[@negochristian1]

@@MrKirknel probably because they cost more then his wealth and he doesnt event know how to pirate them

[@brettricia1]

Is "Monopoly power" causing a distortion to inflation? Is lack of "compettion" an accelerant to the current economic situation? Artificial/transient supply shocks? etc. etc. etc.

[@sivi9741]

Debts creates Inflation.It’s that simple . But Americans think the rich and corporations not paying taxes is a good thing 🤦🏽. So they creates more debt and increases their trouble 🤷🏻.

[@brettricia1]

@@sivi9741 Add misalignment of C-Suite compensation Capital Efficiency for stockholders not building Company Equity. Largest US companies in 2021 have seen the highest levels of stock buybacks in our history, at $850 billion paid out to shareholders rather than investing in workers, productive capacity and resilient supply chains ($850 billion worth of stock buybacks is 4% of GDP).

[@evilzzzability]

Dalio's calls from 1-2 years ago on rejecting bonds and diversifying with some gold are now beginning to look very good -- and plenty criticised him for it at the time as it didn't seem to be playing out on a short term basis.

[@dewrimsirine]

wow you look very young here Ray

[@FLAC2023]

The problem is : Trickle Down Economics... and Wall Street greed... end it and bring this country back

[@poreddyjeevanreddy3002]

Two legends in single frame

[@arodriguez2707]

The biggest issue right now is residential real estate, and it's not just because of lack of new construction. In South florida the level of mtg fraud is stupid, and the level of remote work from other states is unreal, and wall street/Corp investors are really pushing up prices. This work from home crap needs to end, we need to crack down on mtg fraud, and we need to ban corporations from owning residential real estate.

[@orwellhuxley6301]

Love these guys. One is a “casino owner” and the other the “odds maker.” Inflation or no inflation, i- hike or not, they’ll continue to make billions on the backs of the working man. Btw, not only did they assist in the creation of this crisis, they cheered the Fed on with every i-rate cut.

[@DIYDaveT]

Both are cornerstones of the Global Debt Ponzi (GDP).

[@maunykaseburg7969]

Larry Summers was the architect of outsourcing U.S. manufacturing (specifically to China) - how's that working for US now? Thanks Billy Boy.

[@seanmorgan2678]

The government and people both need to live beneath their means.

[@wy2528]

Yes, that is true. Bring back the American dream!

[@kreek22]

There is no such thing as "the" American dream. The Puritans did not dream of moving from a poor country to a coast to coast shopping mall. The Mexicans flooding in today don't dream of settling in an LGBTQ++++ Wonderland.

[@stevemar8027]

We don’t have a tax issue, we have a spending issue. Taxes are too large for producers

[@sTREETcATmICHELLE]

Guess, this combination, financial problem+wealth gap+populism, works in all around the world. Personally, I believed people who are living their normal lives somehow in chaotic uncertainty life and felt behind by the world. Business people are good at money making, and no proper responsibility are existed compared to others. Not try to blame on wealth people or hard working people. I respect what they have done. But that does not mean normal people who have job are deserve to be abandoned or treated lesser than them. Tough question, but important to discuss. People started to realize the systemic flaws in modern society, it's time to unit people and fix the problem, but no body works for that. They are all just angry.

[@billhammett174]

Summers looking at this guy and thinking: I got a PhD, tenure, trophy job in Washington, etc., and I have to pretend that this guy makes sense. Of course, won't be the first time Larry sold out for a nice "honorarium". Davos claptrap!

[@chrisdodt]

LOL.

[@pabloagnesefreire5783]

This is so one-sided that it is a shame. Ray Dalio is so on a different league.

[@abdirahmanbadal781]

Yeah,I get the same feeling.

[@kreek22]

They're in the same oligarchical league. And neither has an idea under 50 years of age.

[@silberlinie]

Do they really believe that the US has a future? I rather have the impression that this is sound and fury.

[@The00Dude]

The new owner of Politico, Axel Springer, has a decades-long record of bending journalistic ethics for right-wing causes.

[@kinghenry100]

A lot of pain is coming our way. Printing so much money was wrong.

[@antoniomanso6816]

Excuses. My English is terrible after stud till 10 tonges ok. Let God Bless You All. Pr. Almeida

[@Bonescratcher]

Larry Summer’s questions are way too long and all over the place. Ray Dalio has a wealth of knowledge and I’ve found that it takes a really good interviewer to get the best out of him. Not very impressed by this discussion

[@bananarepublic1339]

Mr Dalio, you cant talk to Summers like he is a dummy, he is falling asleep.

[@kreek22]

Political differences transcend religious differences in America b/c few people are serious adherents of traditional religions--political religion now has more sway. But, for those who still have real faith, religion remains a very important discriminant in spousal selection.

[@nancylamott8088]

Where is the middle class and such a shrinking divide between the very wealthy and the rest. And also the emergence of the very low wages particularly in the USA for minimum wages.

[@mxw_ai]

The Great cycle of money is too far away to us. We care only the way 2 prepare ourselves to survive the most difficult and dangerous year in the coming decades.

[@maxb5957]

Max was here

[@vasiliospylarinos7393]

dalio should run for president