Polyrhythms by Virtual Riot BLEW MY MIND

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#virtualriot #polyrhythm #musicproduction

[@EDMTips]

Hope you enjoyed this one as much as I did! Has this opened up some inspiration for you, too??

[@simonminay5177]

So this is basically a pendulum wave form over the selected notes. I've been saying there needs to be a plugin which can do this easier. I believe there is a guy working on this, whether it will become a vst plugin is another matter, but I found his channel explores this musical device in great detail: www.youtube.com/@LucidRhythms

[@MrBrownAlliance]

saw this last week on the tube, think VR took inspiration from another producer...

[@EDMTips]

I think, so@@MrBrownAlliance - and such is the nature of inspiration! A wonderful phenomenon

[@CM-xr9oq]

@@simonminay5177 I was this on kzbin.info/www/bejne/b4W8XpykmNWlmdU as well

[@Poetic-Culture]

You never emailed me

[@hjiraoussama776]

My mind stopped when VR dropped that track

[@EDMTips]

Super nice, right? 🤯

[@NullScar]

Same..

[@flykrathedogkinvr]

Polyrhythms are so hard to make but are so satisfying

[@EDMTips]

Couldn't agree more :) There are several ways to make the process easier (as I've been told in the comments)

[@NonJohns]

there's a video called "How to make a Pendulum Wave Sequence" recreating the VR video with a pretty neat technique, and VR made a comment saying that's exactly what he did now... if VR used the technique... surely its a good one

[@EDMTips]

Thanks for sharing, I will check it out

[@myrcyrofficial]

How r they hard to make

[@zebraforceone]

I wrote a script to make them if your comfortable using the CLI and TS I'll share it

[@raksipulikka]

With little programming knowledge this can be easily automated ;) Less than 20 lines of python code will do the trick. Following code will create a midifile with similar effect. from midiutil import MIDIFile # MIDI note numbers, C major notes = [60, 62, 64, 65, 67, 69, 71, 72] offset = -0.01 # modifying this will change how fast the timing diverges sweeps = 100 noteduration = 0.1 # midifile midi = MIDIFile(1) # track, time, tempo midi.addTempo(0, 0, 100) for j in range(sweeps): for i, pitch in enumerate(notes): # track, channel, pitch, time, duration, volume midi.addNote(0, 0, pitch, j * (1 + i * offset), noteduration, 1) with open("arpeggio.mid", "wb") as output_file: midi.writeFile(output_file)

[@EDMTips]

Great, thank you for sharing, I am sure someone will find it helpful 🙂

[@Kioselis]

@@EDMTipsThe most polite, thanks, but i aint fucking with that i've ever seen.

[@KayButtonJay]

This is really simple python. You could learn how to run it and import results like… 10 minutes

[@CHJ_3]

As a Computer Science minor, I found this code very easy to understand.

[@TwinTailsRyu]

polyrhythms are so damn satisfying man

[@EDMTips]

100% man! You can't help but feel immersed when you're listening to them!

[@flyoverfredusa]

VR is just next level

[@EDMTips]

Hell yeah! 🙌🏻

[@jonas8732]

ckeck out Mir Bill and Encanti in case you dont know them

[@hi_its_jerry]

one of the most creative minds in edm for sure

[@JDDavid]

I have to say, while I might not go make a piece like this, I am glad I watched. It was so fun watching how stoked you were getting while making it (after the tedious part). That's a big lesson right there: savor the joy of experimentation and discovery! Or more generally: don't forget to have some fun along the way. Thanks for sharimg your delight; it goes so well with the knowledge bombs.

[@EDMTips]

Absolutely! Enjoying the process is the key 🙂🙌🏻🙏🏻

[@Raylative]

Well said.

[@judgeedwards6511]

Awesome video and explanation Will! When I saw the original my mind was blown, but it actually seems decently simple!

[@EDMTips]

Glad you enjoyed! :)

[@manueldupuy3701]

Excellent job, the sounds are on point, and even the weird reverb and detune effect he did when switching beats. Can't stress enough how much I liked this video. Much love from Mexico

[@EDMTips]

Ah, cheers! I am really glad you liked it 🙂🙌🏻

[@Juno_Leigh]

Thank you so much for your exceptional explanation of this concept. I'm going to put this to very good use I hope :D

[@EDMTips]

Love to hear that! Really glad it was helpful! Good luck! :)

[@hoaisontran8566]

it's so cool man. Just nomal sound become all of the rythyms of all track. I f*king loveeee itt

[@EDMTips]

Indeed! haha It's just so cool to hear the patterns change over time! Glad you enjoyed it!

[@nokturnal886]

As soon as I experienced VR's video for the first time my mind was blown, hadn't heard of polyrhythms like that before. I even put the song on repeat while elevated and slept with it on lol Seeing you recreate it was such a fun watch, I love your enthusiasm and was smiling for pretty much the entire video 🤣 11/10, thank you for showing us the process!

[@EDMTips]

You're welcome, I am glad you enjoyed this one! I certainly had fun making it :)

[@HexxedOfficial]

yeah, this was beautiful dude. Love it!

[@EDMTips]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@lunchbaux6248]

Amazing work man

[@EDMTips]

Thank you so much for the support!

[@stormywaveonyoutub]

Thank You for the video, the demonstration, the explanations ^_^

[@EDMTips]

You're welcome, hope you enjoyed it! 🙂

[@jellycoding]

This was a big thing in the Reason community for like 15 - 20 years ago. And I remember I saw a video for about 10 years ago when someone did this in FL Studio. I think the FL Studio guy created a poly bar with the right length for every note and then just duplicated the bar. He just wrote how many copies he wanted and hit Enter. If I remember correctly.

[@andreasnyman2839]

Usually I'm sort of annoyed how most things are explained as arpeggiator, now IT IS a simple arpeggiator with (possible) an extra parameter... and it's gets a whole dang video. Amazing.

[@EDMTips]

Thank you for the comment!

[@sketchywav7741]

Virtual riot is truly a genius with music production and sound design. He’s on a whole other level.

[@EDMTips]

Couldn’t agree more! 🙂

[@gankie1956]

I saw that video and thought of you man lol Crazy that you made a video on it now

[@EDMTips]

Haha pleased to know you thought of me! Here it is!😁

[@lioplimusic]

love this

[@EDMTips]

Cheers, glad you liked it! Have you seen the original video by VR?

[@aidanviets7286]

Nice thanks!! So much potential behiend this! Expacially in psytrance

[@EDMTips]

I agree!

[@V_A_N_C_E]

You can use the midi stretch handles at the top of the piano roll to do this a lot quicker

[@EDMTips]

Appreciate the input!

[@Grant82gc]

and this is how it is actually done by VR

[@you-know-its-dog.]

This video is really cool. The Polyrhythm is crazy.

[@EDMTips]

Thanks! Yeah, it was really fun to just hit play and tweak the settings :)

[@you-know-its-dog.]

idk you could probably do it on FL Studio, too thats what i use @@EDMTips

[@EricHanuise]

I got a feeling that polyrhythmic piece would be easier to setup using a modular synth. Single note, with LFOs and delays to generate the chords and vary the offsets maybe?

[@EDMTips]

Oh interesting approach! Great input!

[@jenssieckmann]

Great video. Isn't that the pentatonic scale? I often used that for woodwind runs in my orchestral works but I found out that it also works very well for synth arps in EDM.

[@EDMTips]

Thanks! I suppose technically it is a pentatonic scale, yes

[@Sigmaairav]

This method of polyrhythm is fascinating. I actually incorporate polyrhythms in my music frequently

[@AdventureDriver]

Thanks. A slightly faster way is to change the order in which you make the polyrhythm. 1. First complete the lines in an octave/chord. 2. Select all those lines and copy to new octave. 3. shift right the new octave the number of notes in the chord. 4. select the first notes and shift left the number of notes in the chord. 5. repeat from 2.

[@EDMTips]

Great tip, thank you for sharing!

[@kenrain404]

What setup do you use to be able to use headphones? It never sounds great for me.

[@davidgildegomezperez4364]

You can generate the midi patterns just by writing a little bit of code and that way you save a lot of time...

[@EDMTips]

I wish I could code but I had to do it the old school way 🙂

[@astrofreq]

BRILLIANT! My nerdy brain loves this. It would be cool to transpose the whole sequence mid song.

[@EDMTips]

Why not! haha Glad to hear you enjoyed it! :)

[@undergrads]

This is unbelievable.....!!!!!!!!! 😯😯😯😯😯

[@EDMTips]

It's truly mind blowing!😁

[@RedCloudServices]

if you have to do all this by hand then what does the plugin do?

[@threeMetreJim]

Parts of that remind me of: Origin unknown - valley of the shadows. Must be the saw-wave synth.

[@EDMTips]

Classic

[@musicforthemind3421]

Its from a sample cd called Future Music. The Valley of the shadows sample starts of a normal bell type sound, then this effect comes in. Maybe the original programmer did loads of different delay speeds to get that effect back then?

[@threeMetreJim]

@@musicforthemind3421 Thanks for the information - I should have known, having downloaded that cd some time ago ! It just caught my attention as being quite similar when Will was playing around with the sound.

[@DenTube619]

Yeah it blew my mind as well. The guy is a master.

[@EDMTips]

Indeed he is!

[@5-OTT.s-ON-A-KICK]

someone else found a way to make the midi by using the warp markers its on yt somewhere Pendulum Wave Sequence by foxfall

[@EDMTips]

Thanks for the tip, I'll check it out!

[@juschu85]

@@EDMTips I also saw that video. And that's the "right" way to do it (even though it has one mini "mistake"). What we see here is the "wrong" way. Doing it this way, you have no control over how long your track will be. Doing it with the method of the other video, gives you back that control. The other method is based much more on the concept of what polyrythms actually are. You have a time window w and you want n+0 times that note, n+1 times another note, n+2 times yet another note, ... Of course, its still a polyrythm when with n+x you skip some values for x. e.g. n+0, n+2, n+3, n+5, ... Yes, this sounds pretty mathematical, but there's a reason you often hear that music is math. The other method is about how often you want a certain note in a certain time frame. That's the whole idea behind polyrythms. This method is more about the drift between the different notes. It still leads to a "correct" result, but in a more uncontrolled way.

[@Foxfall]

I actually tried it the same way initially with copying notes and the spaces, but ran into the same problem of the notes not lining up at the end of the sequence. So yeah I ended up reading a bit of theory on it and that was the next best thing I could think of

[@Reinhardt_Wilhelm445]

When I first listened to that original video, I thought my brain was melting

[@EDMTips]

😁 I know the feeling

[@giganooz]

I must imagine virtual riot probably did this by coding a program that just spits out a midi file. Would be a pretty simple task.

[@EDMTips]

Maybe for them but since my coding knowledge is non-existent, I went a different way :)

[@hockinghillsalive3624]

Uh, YUY. I put that track on repeat for 4 days. 😯😯

[@EDMTips]

Oh dear!

[@barryvan]

Wouldn't it be easier to have multiple stacked MIDI items which loop, with each item being a different length?

[@EDMTips]

I think so….That was the second way I was going to do it

[@Sangejzer]

Isn't there a way to do this quickly with new live 12 piano roll midi tools?

[@EDMTips]

Probably yes!

[@simonbrich4108]

Notes at the end are curved because the timing difference between note 1 and 2 is the same as the difference between 2 and 3 and so on. It can be fixed if you generate the midi file with some python code: from mido import * barLength = 120*4*4 numOfBars = 57 lastTimeToPlay = barLength * (numOfBars - numOfBars/114) # = 57.5 noteLength = barLength*3/16 # Here you can Modify which notes are Played for example 59 and is B2 is played 114 times within the 57 Bars. # 57 is 2 semitones lower so A2 and is played 113 times. noteIncidence = [(59, 114), (57, 113), (55, 112), (53, 111), (52, 110), (50, 109), (48, 108), (47, 107), (45, 106), (43, 105), (41, 104), (40, 103), (38, 102), (36, 101)] notesTimings = [] for (note, incidence) in noteIncidence: for k in range(incidence): notesTimings.append((note, (k * lastTimeToPlay) / (incidence - 1), True)) notesTimings.append((note, (k * lastTimeToPlay) / (incidence - 1) + noteLength, False)) notesTimings = sorted(notesTimings, key=lambda note: note[1]) track = MidiTrack() timePassed = 0 for (note,time,b) in notesTimings: delta = round(time-timePassed) if b: track.append(Message('note_on', channel=0, note=note, velocity=80, time=delta)) else: track.append(Message('note_off', channel=0, note=note, velocity=80, time=delta)) timePassed += delta track.append(MetaMessage('end_of_track', time=round(barLength*numOfBars))) newMidiFile = MidiFile() newMidiFile.tracks.append(track) newMidiFile.save('polyrhythm.mid')

[@phillipturner]

ooooooh I'm glad I hung on ...amazing!!!!!

[@EDMTips]

Thank you so much for your comment! Happy to hear! :)

[@aarondavidson6409]

Just attempting to recreate the track requires some serious patience and brainpower

[@EDMTips]

100%! It's worth it though!

[@upSIDEdnMedia]

I hope to see someone speedrun this in a short like one of those hip hop beats

[@EDMTips]

Great idea! I might attempt it :)

[@akaSVAT]

Weird but interesting. Same effect can be achieved by arpeggiator, which speed is automated. Am I wrong? Anyway thanks for the video.

[@EDMTips]

Not quite the same (unless there's a technique I don't know), as with an arpeggiator. the time between each note in whatever sequence it's playing is the same.

[@pirds102010]

Can't you do it with arpeggiator and record midi?

[@migats2160]

The reason why Virtual Riot used multiple channels for the polyrhythms is because Serum only has a polyphony of 16 channels (8 in your case). Otherwise it just cuts the first note when another note is played

[@EDMTips]

Interesting, thanks for sharing!

[@grenkobeats1075]

That's fireeeeeeeeee

[@EDMTips]

You bet! Cheers man! :)

[@volsteh]

can do it on my groovebox (deluge) easily, got track length per "note row", so if you can emulate this in your daw...

[@AiBoru]

A MIDI Effects Rack with multiple chains of unsynced arpeggiator with rate control mapped to a single macro adjusted to a different range for each chain could have made the job easier.

[@EDMTips]

Thanks for the rip! I wanted to do it the hard way :)

[@DylanriDylanri]

Danm nice man

[@EDMTips]

Cheers mate!

[@Thefi5thdnb]

Can you download polyrhythms midi files anywhere? Ta

[@hockinghillsalive3624]

13:38 I am totally freakin' ZONED OUT. 🥴🥴

[@EDMTips]

As nature intended 😁

[@Hogboy345]

Wouldn't it be easier to do one clip with say 100 notes then one with 99, 98, 97 and so on. Then just stretch them?

[@bassemsaad5017]

This might literally kill some people on the dance floor iykwim😂🔥

[@EDMTips]

😆

[@tylergillespie6888]

Idk about Ableton but I imagine you could do this pretty easily in FLStudio with the python integration.

[@EDMTips]

So I’ve been told! Haven’t used FL Studio for quite a while so I wouldn’t know

[@forwardever]

Anyone else having trouble downloading the project file?

[@EDMTips]

If you can’t get the project file, please email [e-mail] and we’ll get it sorted for you!

[@LG-Musique]

Imagine how many kids this would confuse on Ibiza dance floors 😂

[@EDMTips]

😂

[@itstobitan]

🎉

[@EDMTips]

Cheers, hope you enjoy! 😊

[@AlohaXChicken27]

What program do you use

[@EDMTips]

Great question. I use Ableton Live

[@BoPunk]

Wrath of the Math. I've pushed it to the Abel Prize people... adding a time element to advanced mathematics creates a whole new level.

[@EDMTips]

Hell yeah!

[@lostartone]

Fajnie. Najbardziej mi się podobało jak koleżanka nawet w gorących źródłach scrolowała komórkę 🤣 Pozdrowiom ✌️

[@arctwosix4331]

there really is a faster way of moving the midi notes.. - Select all the notes and drag the little warp markers at the top.. doing each colum of noteas differently..

[@arctwosix4331]

Check out Lucid Rythyms - www.youtube.com/@LucidRhythms - These Polyryhtyms are out of this world good, with visuals too. as an ADHD I find this guys videos sooo healing.

[@320cam]

I’m going to be incredibly pedantic (and just want to say this is definitely not a criticism because this technique is wonderful providing so many possibilities), but this technicality isn’t a Polyrhythm as the different patterns aren’t confined to the same bar length. It’s also not a Polymeter as that’s two or more ideas within the same tempo but different meters/time signatures. I think the best term would be Polytempo as every note occupies a different tempo. Either way, this idea is beautiful and such a great job describing it!!

[@EDMTips]

Thank you, and thank you for the criticism, I've taken this onboard :)

[@paulthomann5544]

The VR track starts with all of the notes on 1, and ends that way again. You could keep the pattern going, and you'd have all notes on 1 in regular intervals of time. It's just a really long "bar".

[@voreshbo7031]

A M A S T E R P I E C E ❤

[@EDMTips]

Appreciate it! 🙌🙏

[@captain_crunk]

I wonder how quickly this could be accomplished in Cubase using the logical editor. I don't think any other DAW has a similar feature, and once you wrap your mind around the crazy power of the logical editor it becomes very obvious that Cubase is head and shoulders above the competition vis a vis editing midi. Unfortunately the learning curve is annoyingly steep. But whatever, I switched to Bitwig and haven't really looked back.

[@EDMTips]

DAW is a personal choice! Use the one that you're the most comfortable with :)

[@mvmnt.]

*Revisits James Holdens back catalogue*

[@EDMTips]

Rock on! 🤘

[@Nimpp]

1:37 this immediately reminded me of PPAP

[@EDMTips]

Nice!

[@SomeOne-mw8zl]

made all this in my private when YT wasnt a thing at all.

[@EDMTips]

Nice!

[@jaelbird4726]

with a dune 3 it sounds pretty insane .....

[@EDMTips]

Hell yeah!

[@LVNARESENCE]

cool video just a quick note move your phone or anything that emits electrical signal away from your interface. that's what the weird buzzing is when you speak. all round great video though keep it up!!

[@EDMTips]

Thanks for the advice! I squally leave my phone outside the studio when I record :)

[@vincentscholtes]

Hey will i have my computer clean up and Ableton runs good 11 Good video

[@EDMTips]

Happy to hear man! Keep it up! :)

[@hockinghillsalive3624]

2:18 is the entire song in fraction of a second lol.

[@EDMTips]

Cheers!

[@invntiv]

you can probably programmatically generate the midi using python

[@EDMTips]

If I knew python :)

[@Luckzdj]

tenho certeza que ele fez isso em Fl Studio! kkkk

[@donnercrasher9887]

VR is the king of kings

[@EDMTips]

He's an astonishing producer for sure!

[@treelibrarian7618]

faster way: duplicate the chord across the entire desired length of the track. delete from the final few chords leaving 1,2,3,4,5... of the notes (for descending sweep at the start, leave all of the top note and delete [number of notes in the chord - 1] of the bottom note) select each note across the entire track, and stretch to fill the same time, without quantization or grid in effect. the DAW does the math for you.

[@EDMTips]

Great tip, thank you for sharing!

[@shoppingcart238]

Theres a video by Foxfall called how to build a pendulum wave in ableton, it *could* be the inspiration for the song?

[@shoppingcart238]

i was too slow lol

[@shoppingcart238]

+ i was wrong

[@Foxfall]

It was the other way around ;)

[@shoppingcart238]

[@EDMTips]

Thanks, I will check it out!

[@Gainn]

Just ends up sounding like a messy version of Origin Unknown - Valley Of The Shadows.

[@EDMTips]

Thanks for the feedback, Gainn!

[@jhm8614]

RIP for Will doing this by hand, that’s dedication. Could have been done way easier though

[@EDMTips]

Oh how should I have done it instead? 😄

[@nicholast315]

Yes, please tell!

[@PabloSpacebar]

VR probably used a midi script to render the notes, cause math 😊

[@novadoes]

he commented on a video about using that method, is like 2 or 6 minutes to do it depending the length

[@cecilia_mackie]

So chill! Shall we connect?

[@EDMTips]

So chill indeed!

[@MutleeIsTheAntiGod]

Someone did a video, he just duplicated the initial pattern out far, then duplicated the very bottom not out another 8 meausures, then the next 7 measures and etc.....and didn't extend the top at all. Then selected the bottom note and stretched it DOWN so that all the notes fit within a loop (8 or 16 bars I think). Repeat with all the below notes, then shrink the note lenghts down to 1/8 or whatever and VOILA they're spaced out already. A bit faster than this

[@jacquesterrier4700]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/b4W8XpykmNWlmdU

[@EDMTips]

Perhaps, but I never choose an easy way 😁

[@GrenOulio]

I think the original was probably done with an AI that outputted the midi file for him to pop into his DAW.

[@EDMTips]

Perhaps! I decided to go the long way :)

[@fallenleaf24]

you can generate poly rhythms MIDI online xD

[@EDMTips]

Ohhh the more you know! haha

[@djkpb]

Music can be produced from anything bro..

[@EDMTips]

I never said otherwise

[@Cliporium]

This would take 2 minutes to do in a 3d software... we need a plugin to play 3d geometry as midi notes!

[@EDMTips]

Maybe you can develop one? 🙂

[@Cliporium]

​@EDMTips nice coincidence, I was wondering about exactly that... I'm no python wizard but AI could do most of the code heavy lifting... 🤔... Would be extremely cool! ... Maybe I'll publish a blender plugin at some point! :) Cheers!

[@EDMTips]

Go for it, Cliporium, sounds like a great idea!

[@user-xj6xf5bf3j]

pretty sure he just used one of the 100s of polyrhythm m4l devices but still cool

[@EDMTips]

I like doing it the hard way! 😁 Thanks for watching and supporting, really appreciate it!

[@user-xj6xf5bf3j]

i can see that! youre an animal!@@EDMTips

[@Dubsteppah]

Awww ya didn't color yours like VR. The colors made it look even more crazy

[@EDMTips]

Can't deny that but it was time consuming enough already haha

[@chazwozza2662]

I recommend you go and watch some of Virtual Riots tutorials

[@EDMTips]

Which one in particular?

[@CompetitiveWormsArmageddon]

Virtual riot is the best there is.

[@EDMTips]

He is an astonishing producer indeed!

[@ElectrixTunes]

He showed me it before it released it and I recommend aquawave for the name but I guess he didn’t go with it lol

[@EDMTips]

Who did? Virtual Riot? Aquawave sounds cinematic!

[@ElectrixTunes]

yea I met VR and I saw him make this at my music school@@EDMTips

[@EDMTips]

Nice!

[@marcocordero6166]

I LOVE U

[@EDMTips]

Cheers!

[@subhaan7861]

Hi mate as you cover mostly Dance Artists Talks and What not i got a perfect Dance Artist For you to talk about like Cover the Evolution History Of UK Dance Artist Called Example Aka Elliot Gleave. He's a Singer/Rapper from the UK Who Does Mostly Dance Music but allso Raps. He's like a UK Eurodance some of his stuff relates to. His Known For His Hits Like Changed The Way You Kiss Me and Kickstarts Changed The You Kiss Me and Stay Awake are his 2 Number 1 UK hits. Shame he wasnt much big outside the UK. I grew up listening to him really huge fan met him in person aswell. Please cover his History and how he fell off the charts after 2014. Would love someone to do special Tribuite to Example.

[@EDMTips]

Cheers for the suggestion, I will check him out!

[@dalkont222]

He use a different method there is another video on the pendulum pattern

[@EDMTips]

Yes, he does!

[@spencerrobinson780]

I love this black midi style production. Reminds me of Yannis Xenakis, Conlon Nancarrow or some gnarly Zappa. Love it ❤

[@spencerrobinson780]

I forgot to mention, a cool addition to this method is to map different FX to serums pitch. Then as the midi cascades the fx will shuffle and slide around

[@EDMTips]

Great tip, I will try it in the future!

[@webdev_am]

VR got maaaad skills. Where did he learn that? He just read manuals and experiment or what?

[@EDMTips]

I think he mostly just experiments like no one else. Combine that with intelligence and talent and you're there. :)

[@tamer27antepli]

I think he programmed the midi in python or something instead of manually adjusting all the notes

[@High.on.Life_DnB]

Is this where producing meets math?

[@High.on.Life_DnB]

If you have extensive knowledge of how to make midi files, you could make a formula that would do this automatically, but what would be more time consuming.... ??? No clue....

[@EDMTips]

Someone suggested one can do it with a bit of code so I say it's possible :)

[@lydianlights]

god when is ableton gonna add a grid for arbitrary tuplets. so dumb that any modern midi editor would be missing this feature.