Porsche TIMING CHAIN RATTLE caused by failing CHAIN TENSIONERS?!

[@allahjoseph]

Lodrt. Mine is developing. Time to start binging on your content again

[@HelpMeDIY]

+ALLAH JOSEPH lol bring it. About to do my cam guide rails… 😬

[@jtocher685]

When I did the IMS Solution on my '04 (three chain) I locked the cams on the side where I removed the tensioner. I didn't lock the other side since I wasn't removing the tensioner under the A/C compressor. Locking that side isn't bad at all...good luck!

[@HelpMeDIY]

+John Tocher can it actually mess up the timing (or anything else) if you don’t lock it though? 🍻

[@jtocher685]

@@HelpMeDIY Well, thinking about the forces in there I think it's possible for the timing chain to jump a tooth. If you've ever rotated an installed camshaft you know that there will be one or more of the lobes pushing a valve down and there are parts of the rotation where there's a spring force trying to rotate the cam one way or the other...if you remove the tension on the chain under those conditions it could allow it to jump...what the odds are of that happening I don't know but why take the chance? It's just not that hard to do...the hardest part is pulling those plastic cam dust covers off! That said, you might want to try that lifter additive first...that would be the easiest possible solution...if it works!

[@Travel.drone87]

I think the noise that you have in the video is from the exhaust shields, not the actual chain. Was the sound gone after this operation?

[@HelpMeDIY]

[e-mail]87 I think that was part of it, but yes, most of the noise was gone after this.

[@petersutcliffe9840]

My Boxster S has a slight chain rattle that disappears after a few seconds on startup. I changed the 3 external tensioners on my 5 chain engine but it didn't make much difference.

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Peter Sutcliffe drat. If I find the same, the next step I think will be removing the cam covers and replacing the guides I can reach without tearing down the engine.

[@stefanshapiro1245]

Your lifter lubrication passages are clogged. Use a lifter additive (such as Liqui Moly 20004 Hydraulic Lifter Additive). Common misdiagnosis.

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@stefanshapiro1245 Could be! Thanks

[@thevictorylife702]

Started hearing a rattle for a brief moment upon startup. It goes away after a second or two. Any clue what that may be? Would love your opinion

[@HelpMeDIY]

+@thevictorylife702 chain tensioners?

[@stevenelson9795]

Great video. Can you tell me what brand your rear spoiler is and where you found it?

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Steve Nelson thanks! Joe Toth. Tell him I sent you 😉. I have another video on it if you search for it.

[@mattymatt3654]

Do these timing chain issues occur on a 2009 2nd gen Boxster 987.2?

[@HelpMeDIY]

+@mattymatt3654 yes

[@jdkroh]

this has been on my mind as well. curious as to what you find out!

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Jeremey Kroh stay tuned!

[@pjay3028]

I thought that getting brown plastic bits in the filter indicated that it was the Variocam guides that were bad. The guides for the longer chains are black aren't they?

[@HelpMeDIY]

+p jay no, brown. They may also make black ones I suppose.

[@pjay3028]

@@HelpMeDIY well I'm not saying I'm definitely right, but I'm pretty sure Jake Raby has a different opinion to yours. And if you look at pictures of replacement parts that seems to confirm it. Might be worth double checking?

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@pjay3028 Jake is the one that told me I need to replace them 😆. I just pulled up the part on google and it’s brown. Assuming we are talking about the same part

[@pjay3028]

@@HelpMeDIY what I can find says "IMS chain guides are black, all other guides are brown". Presumably that may mean that the crank to IMS guides and the Variocam ones are brown? But ALL of the IMS guides I can find are black?

[@pjay3028]

@@HelpMeDIY is it different between the 3 chain and 5 chain engines?

[@peterbrown216]

Recently changed the tensioners on my 5 chain 986S. Locked the motor in TDC and also locked the cams. Tensioners are expensive but installation of 2/3 very easy. Top tensioner was more difficult. A MUCH bigger problem is the plastic chain guide rails. When they wear you can also get some chain slap. About to try and replace the chain rails with the engine in. Good luck with your latest project!

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Peter Brown sounds like you are just ahead of me! Wish you would have made a video 😝

[@Drumheros]

How do you manage to replace the rails with the engine in?

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@Drumheros I’ll find out in the near future when I do it :)

[@Drumheros]

@@HelpMeDIY looking forward to it! Subbed

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@Drumheros ❤️

[@johnkirkpatrick8386]

Where did you get the repair manual from?

[@HelpMeDIY]

+John Kirkpatrick I think I need to provide the .PDFs to all my channel members… 🤔

[@sgttombailes3380]

My '99 996.1 ( 58K) after several days of sitting, the tensioners rattle a bit at start up. But, when I daily drive it there is NO noise at start up. My car is well sorted w/ IMS, AOS, Water pump, clutch etal. @ 51K. What say you about this noise?

[@HelpMeDIY]

+SGT Tom Bailes sounds exactly like my situation

[@rwabe]

Did you check your camshaft deviations? If they are greater than 4 degrees, this would indicate the VarioCam chain wear pads should be replaced. Porsche recommends replacing them at no great than negative 6 degrees. Plus the brown bits you have in your oil filter are from the wear pads.

[@HelpMeDIY]

+rwabe not yet. I have a Durametric so I need to learn how to do that!

[@rwabe]

@@HelpMeDIY I have the durameteic too. Get into actual values and enable camshaft position 1&2 deviation. Please post your results. If you find they are over negative 4, that would be a great project to replace the variocam pads as I’m in the same boat. I’m trying to decide whether to do it myself without having to remove the engine.

[@rwabe]

Before you get your readings be sure get your car to operating temperature and then take your readings. One thing to point out to everyone is to minimize wear stop driving the car too easy. Easy driving keeps the VT arrangement in the loaded position at all times and increases the forces these wear pads see. Cost to replace VarioCam pads is around $1500 by an Indy without removing engine. I’m referencing Jake Raby of Flat 6 Innovations the guru M96/97 engine rebuilds.

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@rwabe thanks!

[@Chon-c]

@@rwabe 1500 is for the complete variocam tho. Not just the pads on it ,right ? Because I was looking to see if the pads /wear guides could be replaced without buying the complete variocam.

[@Anil-bg5se]

I have a 99 red Boxster like yours with 120k miles. Mine is way worse than yours. First, I am planning to replace oil pump spring and metal thing that stays on top of it since it regulates oil pressure. I also get rattling if I do the following: drive on the 5th gear and speed up until 3000 rpm and then give little bit gas that will still slow the car down but not as much. Rattling happens until rpm comes down around 2000 rpm. Curious if yours do this at all. Many people don't recognize this because the engine is closed. If you drive with the panel behind the driver open then you find out all the problems with the engine.

[@HelpMeDIY]

My rattle would go away after several seconds

[@juliank911]

I just replaced my bank 1 tensioner a few weeks ago. I didn't have noisy chains but my POR2.0 diagnostic doohickey was telling me that my bank 1 cams deviation was different to bank 2.... By a decent amount. Looking into it, one of the potential issues was the chain guides already being destroyed it the timing chain tensioner dying. To check for destroyed guides I took off the sump plate to look for big bits of plastic, didn't find any. That's when I purchased the tensioner. I only locked the crank at TDC (think it was 5/16, not 5/8) figuring there's no reason why you should need to lock the cams if there's no possibility the chains can come off or move. You aren't taking the covers off. Just tensioner out and tensioner in.

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Julian Kenny now see, that’s exactly what I thought. But I can’t find any “official” statement of not needing to, just fellow people saying “I figure you shouldn’t need to” like me 😂

[@juliank911]

@@HelpMeDIY we should probably wait for Jake raby to reply :)

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@juliank911 I just sent him a message. Now we wait... :)

[@Chon-c]

@@HelpMeDIY what did Jake tell you on that ? I’ve got parts in hand today (finally because of delivery issues & having to file a complaint with PayPal & order another lol it’s taken 2 weeks longer 🤦‍♂️)

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@Chon-c I talked to him on the phone and I got the "you should"...

[@emilcaballero7487]

My mechanic didn’t lock the cams when replacing the rubber seals and the washers, it worked fine. Bt you do leave yourself open to messing up the timing. I would like to see you try without using the tool, it can be done

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Emil Caballero 🤔

[@chevyracing1080]

How many miles do you have on her now?

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Tanner Needs Tacos 77,xxx

[@JoseGuerrero-w9o]

Amigo mi porsche boxster seme apago vinie do del trabajo ya le cambie la bomba de gasolina y el sensor del sigueñal y nada que me quiere prender me puedes ayudar

[@HelpMeDIY]

Sorry man I don’t speak Spanish 🤷‍♂️

[@matty74123]

Yes definitely lock the cams, better to be safe than sorry

[@EddieG9000]

Anyone done one on a 981?

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Eddie Geez not sure. Maybe someone will chime in

[@streettunner]

Definitely lock the cams it will eliminate any chance of them moving and coming out of timing

[@HelpMeDIY]

+Easier ways so it IS a must then?

[@streettunner]

@@HelpMeDIY not locking everything you can is asking for trouble. If you have the kit why not lock it. Especially if you're seeing pieces of the rails in the oil..just trying to help 😁

[@Anil-bg5se]

Here the Porsche mechanic mentions that you don't have to lock the cams. kzbin.info/www/bejne/fIDGYmxqhbxjpLs

[@HelpMeDIY]

That makes sense to me

[@richardcalon3724]

I took from this video that the cams on the 1 to 3 bank need to be locked to do the IMS bearing which requires removal of chain tensioner for that bank. He said it wasn't necessary to lock cam on 3 to 6 bank but he wasn't as far as I can tell removing that chain tensioner. It is always a good idea to lock cams, you might get away with not doing it but why risk it. I made my own cam lock plates as I find Porsche tools hideously expensive and overkill for most shade tree mechanics.

[@johnpoo1662]

Now I need to find your twin who has a 987 :)

[@HelpMeDIY]

+John Poo 😂 😂 😂

[@garyfoley8547]

⚠ Of topic ⚠.. Is there a 987.2 workshop manual like the 101 projects book??. Excellent work as normal 👍🏻, very well presented and explained.

[@HelpMeDIY]

@@garyfoley8547 thanks! Not that I’m aware of but 🤷‍♂️

[@johnpoo1662]

@@garyfoley8547 id also like to know that ! :D