POST OFFICE SCANDAL: Ex-tech chief outfoxed by prosecutor

[@Bert-hy5ek]

Another highly paid executive who was in a safe job and took no responsibility for his failures. Unfortunately innocent people were punished or have died because of his incompetence,

[@noelfleming3567]

Strip all pensions

[@classicraceruk1337]

@@noelfleming3567Nah strip their freedoms.

[@Dee-l2g]

How often do we see this in day to day life?. People going to work just trying to earn a living and their lives being made miserable by bosses being paid too much and simply not giving a toss.

[@andydudley1775]

these people belong in a salvation homeless shelter on benefits .instead they walk over people better than them and know it.

[@Roger-Mellie]

Ex army….pension….ex copper…pension…..ex post office ….pension. These big shots are only interested in their own pay offs….. You will never get an ex pig to admit he’s in the wrong…….might affect his pension.

[@snapdragon1194]

I wonder how many little people in the post office would have been sacked instantly if they had this level of incompetence in their work. The top level people should all be prosecuted for gross incompetence and mismanagement.

[@dahamsta]

You can't prosecute for just random stuff. Otherwise you could be prosecuted for "uninformed commentary".

[@philiphartley1782]

"I was a senior post office executive, how on earth was I supposed to know what was going on?"

[@getahanddown]

These guys are the best in the world when negotiating pay but also not able to do anything in their role!?

[@billkosses3808]

Just because we were in charge doesn't mean we are responsible 😂

[@andrewmackay1350]

you should have had an inquisitive mind and made it your business to see what was going on if you had the slightest inkiling

[@noelfleming3567]

​@andrewmackay1350 these people are only there for d money

[@Bert-hy5ek]

@@philiphartley1782 That sounds like a poor excuse for not doing your job properly and accepting a high salary. Executives are supposed to question any repeated discrepancies.

[@Ian-mj4pt]

All deny accountability and deflecting the blame on everyone else but themselves.

[@Steven-h1e]

Just following orders

[@andydudley1775]

a borris could write a book on this.

[@Liverpoolboy01]

“I don’t recall “

[@FnRenner]

This man is full of it and trying to ride both sides of the fence. Makes one wonder about how poor of a police officer this fool was. Seems like he has spent his life helping his bank account more than people he was charged with serving.

[@claudgurr431]

I hope he was never called into active service as part of his military background. I wonder how many miscarriages of justice he had a hand in in his police career?

[@adrianvassallo5630]

The bottom line is they lie they all know what they doing ex police man for God sake !!

[@NnNn-yr7mu]

Claude thank god they abolished the death penalty , those these clowns want to bring it back.....

[@scarlet4237]

Happy to take the salary for a responsible position but takes no responsibility for anything. He should pay back his salary!

[@gregdiffenthal2384]

Like every single politician all over the World.

[@MickeyMouse-ul2zs]

He should actually be in jail. Along with a whole lot of other Post Office managers, HR department creatures and all those connected with the Horizon software. End of.

[@scottwalker2619]

I wonder how many unsafe convictions came about when he was a copper?

[@RuinInScotland]

The original constable Savage 😂

[@mcfcguvnors]

@@RuinInScotland You arrested a Mr Winston Kodogo for having thick lips & curly hair & for wearing a loud shirt i a Built up area - Constable Savage why did you arrest this man ? Hes a Criminal Sir

[@jeangenie5807]

Unlikely because he was not part of that team doing the prosecutions. There were failings, but in the day to day running of the system and the problems, there were many staff in lesser positions who were closer to the issues and should have been flagging problems they knew were happening. Others in different sections the business knew there was something wrong, but their managers were not doing anything about it or flagging it higher!

[@molemarden5188]

He took the salary now take the responsibility

[@AC-13]

🎯🎯🎯

[@bluzrokluvr]

It's as clear as day that to qualify for a management job in the post office, being an evasive, odious creep helps immensely, and is no doubt seen as a virtue by their superiors.

[@Truthfully3]

Facts!!

[@jacquipope6222]

That's far closer to the truth than the drivel incessantly spewing from the mouth of all involved in this tragedy.

[@robertgallacher7214]

I think that goes for management in many UK companies today, too many hubristic people educated beyond their intelligence that can't comprehend they might be wrong and the bolshy facade disappears once they know they have made a mistake only to be replaced with their true snivelling lying self.

[@kiddcapri1711]

I wouldn't say it's a management job in the post office. Working for a number of companies over the years, it's a case of.... if your face fits you're in, if not you'll stay where you are regardless of your skills, qualifications and experience. Which is or has what has happened here.

[@knightlautrec4311]

Let's be fair to the man, that goes for pretty much most management jobs, not just the Post Office!

[@paulkopp3634]

As usual no one is ever actually responsible for anything that goes wrong. Sickening.

[@andydudley1775]

no one left poor anough to blame that no noe cares about .

[@callumturkington5856]

Promoted well beyond his abilities and competence

[@jimrichards3916]

You can't blame me because although I'm a senior manager I'm not responsible for anything!

[@halfbakedproductions7887]

It was the same where I used to work. Middle management ran on plausible deniability and if there was a problem, it was always our fault. The more junior staff doing the work never got any support while the work was ongoing, straight under the next bus if it went wrong for any reason. Not much credit for a job completed or well done either.

[@Mikados_Advark12]

Weird comment - no one is blaming you. It’s the PO management at fault

[@ukdave57]

@@halfbakedproductions7887 Same with the company I work for. I am convinced British "managers" attend the same ACME school of management and came out with the same mind set, basically chancers. Gone are the days when the manager would have worked their way up from the ranks. I work for an engineering company where most if not all managers have ever had any experience in the field they are supposed to be managing and have no idea how to talk with staff.

[@ilricettario]

In my experience, they are just a complete waste of space.

[@johnbarham7718]

Especially in the larger government contracts.

[@FlbcImp]

The ability of the Post Office to employ incompetent and inept managers is truly staggering.

[@highlandcow4765]

Local authorities/councils are even worse.

[@coderider3022]

No, competent people doing a massive coverup. Few people like Sewell etc are useless but they signed up to take the hit but I return kept no records and got paid huge salary and bonus. Enough that retirement was next.

[@brian.7966]

yes but they take the money.

[@TheStevenWhiting]

They ran on and they appear to still run on the Peter Principle.

[@ianyoung5619]

@@highlandcow4765especially here in Suffolk.

[@brianweekes1]

He’s blaming others. He IS responsible. Ever day these liars collect their pensions and don’t go to prison, another post office master/mistress is nearer death without justice

[@1949cr]

No he isn't. His description of how information flows up to the board is correct. To send a report damning an internal consulting project up to board level is very unusual unless it's totally supported by more than one senior management. If you think otherwise you have clearly no corporate experience.

[@robertframpton7865]

@@1949cr I don’t think it’s about board experience - it’s about having morals, and a sense of what’s right and what’s wrong

[@robertframpton7865]

@@1949cr which you don’t seem to have in all your apparent wisdom

[@grumpyoldefarte5430]

It's time this was put to sleep... POST OFFICE, YOU'RE GUILTY, PAY UP NOW. PEOPLE ARE SUFFERING. ENOUGH.

[@arthurrytis6010]

@, grumpyoldefarte. That is not enough. These people need prison time.

[@grumpyoldefarte5430]

@@arthurrytis6010 I totally agree. We'd be locked up without hesitation, and all possessions confiscated to help recompense.. but not these 'people'

[@peterk2455]

Throughout all of this, it seems that no one has bothered to bring FUJITSU, and their managers, to answer for their actions. It appears they knew of the problem, but lied to over it up.

[@StellaAsh]

It seems that not one single staff member at any level is responsible for their actions - ever -

[@psuk2319]

Yet they were all happy to take the 'responsibility and oversight' part of thier wages. sadly this is typical of the weak management skills in many UK professions.

[@twigwonderkid]

Yet another guy with zero IT experience in a high position and well paid that had no idea what he was doing and no grasp of IT management or service delivery How do these guys or girls get promoted to high extremely well paid positions but have no IT competency Why are these people getting these positions and why not actual IT people who understand code and bugs. It’s not like there aren’t thousands of senior IT competent people out there !

[@brianlopez8855]

The NHS Central Government and Local Government is FULL of them

[@MacWarble]

Because senior management (or even middle management) do NOT get asked technical IT questions. At a certain point the 'interview process' is based on 'standard questions' based on management level - NOT on technical ability

[@DecimusValerius]

Exactly - someone with experience of any sort of transactional system would have gone..."hang on..multiple updates are clearly not enclosed in one transaction ( begin/commit) and are leaving the system in an inconsistent state... that must mean the developers do not understand ACID principles - therefore we have frightening major issue"

[@MrButtonpresser]

In my experience, recruitment at senior level is done during a game of golf. Nothing more.

[@priscillaroberts7945]

It's who you know not what you know. Same old story. Old school tie .

[@MrGavinBoyd]

How many of those responsible will face a criminal trial and prison?

[@FnRenner]

None. This is the UK. Justice died more than a decade ago.

[@leso204]

Thats the six million dollar question or should i say pounds .....

[@Upemm]

Zero

[@greenpedal370]

None. But they will be tried

[@bobgorman9481]

Absolutely none, the funny handshakes and jiffy bags full of used notes will take care of all that.

[@paulinereid5226]

Oh, Good Lord!! The deceit and obfuscation, the buck-passing and hand-washing - the 'it wasn't me, honest guv' mentality of ALL these people is SO DISGUSTING!!

[@adenwellsmith6908]

What's the betting the cost of the inquiry exceeds the damages to the victims?

[@Pamela-df5wr]

Those poor people how they suffered and still suffering

[@allisonstandley2573]

I do think Sir Wynn will do the right thing, he’s incredibly clever and quick on the uptake. I know this has taken a long time, I recently started to watch the personal stories in phase 1 and cried. Those poor, poor people. Shame on these so called executives.

[@Liverpoolboy01]

Should not keep interrupting, cor participants . It about the victims they represent! Another appointment!

[@allisonstandley2573]

@ I’m not sure you understand what Sir Wynn’s job is here. He is gathering information to make recommendations. It’s not an endless opportunity for the KCs to showcase their obvious skills.

[@johnclarke-vs9qe]

Another one who said "I was working really hard", that should be a "given" considering the salary, but just how effective were you in achieving any sort of success and recognising that Horizon wasn't actually reliable? You were a "Tech Expert"!

[@streetlegal008]

This chap thinks he's on Call My Bluff.

[@johncooper3392]

Wilfully negligent.

[@UpnorthHere]

Isn't that the same as "reckless"?

[@michaelhemple371]

Nothing to do with me !!!

[@Wilkins_Micawber]

When you come into focus, blame everyone else. Mr Young, you were a member of the board, you have collective responsibility.

[@UpnorthHere]

His tap-dancing abilities, when shown his own contemporaneous emails, was quite revealing: "this doesn't prove I was more responsible than everyone else who knew!"

[@michaelgriffiths5723]

Being a senior executive in the Post Office seems the ideal job. Big pay with zero responsibility for anything.

[@jackiem6841]

He’s not as clever as he thinks he is!

[@mpellatt]

He's not clever at all. He wanders off and, effectively, blames the processes and procedures (I suspect he's one of these slaves to ITIL, from the way he talks). Clearly those policies and procedures (assuming they were being correctly followed) were in failure while he was responsible for them. Which is enough to make him responsible.

[@antonywilliams5703]

Another one lying through their teeth.

[@UpnorthHere]

Probably wouldn't even admit on the record that those are HIS teeth.

[@stevefletcher7531]

Passing the buck at its best

[@garyh1572]

Too many chancers in high positions in the UK. It holds the country back .

[@alanskyrme9048]

Prison and severe penalties for the top execs.

[@CatholicSatan]

Another utterly incurious executive at POL. Horizon was a major system, it was receiving great interest in the press - what other computer system receives this (adverse) publicity? There were interminable complaints by SPMs and he, as head of the tech side of POL, should have been aware of the _totality_ of reported incidents - not just some arbitrary major incident. It's a shame the lawyers in this inquiry do not have technical expertise sitting along side to clarify the BS spouted by POL (and Fujitsu).

[@renszatrapp9639]

I knew all about the sub pm's injustice by 2011, through radio, and campaigning journalists and I have no connection with the Post Office or computer systems at all. Its inconceivable that they were unaware.

[@ianwood4868]

They all start with the stammering when caught out

[@ataxpayer723]

What did this witness do all day in his role at the PO?

[@oesypum]

I doubt very much that his service in whatever arm or branch it was, placed him anywhere near a frontline. No doubt as a copper, he omitted evidence that would weaken his case, just so he could gain "brownie" points with his peers. He wasn't in the least concerned that people were being wrongly accused. A "don't-rock-the-boat" mentality. He left the ship, solely to save his own skin. This appears not to have worked, as he now needs to answer for his actions, or lack thereof. His attempt to control the situation he finds himself in is risible, and lays bare his level of education, and intelligence. This would appear to be par for the course, and shines a very dim light on the education standards required for employment by the PO.

[@JeanRinger]

Totally incompetant😮

[@anaitali8256]

Yet another crook!

[@jimloveday2836]

That is annoying to watch. Clearly a bare faced liar.

[@pemj7360]

These post office chiefs should be in a criminal court not a waste of money enquiry

[@chrislambert9435]

If there is no prosecutions it would be a scandal

[@Kevin-mx1vi]

The enquiry is long-winded and expensive, but not a waste of money because we have to be utterly certain where the guilt lies. Remember, this whole scandal is about the most serious miscarriage of justice in British history, so we CAN NOT compound it by prosecuting the wrong people for it. I just hope that once it's over, those who were responsible receive the maximum punishment. This is a watershed moment in British justice so we need to be patient.

[@pemj7360]

@Kevin-mx1vi you do have a very valid point. But what do you reckon the chances are of any these people getting taken to a criminal court

[@pdxxtqhf]

​@Kevin-mx1vi Things like this are happening every day in Government, Civil Service, NHS, BBC Local Government and our major companies. One very high level person claims "it was never on my desk", "I wasn't involved". The higher they get, the bigger their pay and the bigger the lies to protect themselves.

[@Kevin-mx1vi]

@@pemj7360 Well, I would hope that it's very high. The post office/horizon scandal has shown what happens when the higher management of a business are not held to account or answer to anyone but themselves. The public outcry has made it clear that enough is enough, and we expect those responsible to answer for their crimes. Also, the reputation of legal profession itself has been dirtied by the behaviour of the post office's lawyers, so I would expect the judiciary to try to restore that by bringing their full weight to bear upon those responsible.

[@yetidodger6650]

We live in a post truth world where the utter ridiculous is accepted as fact.

[@sarahwinfield3989]

Another one than thinks he is clever. But not so he is being found out.

[@markhattley2032]

The Establishment serves The Establishment 🐷

[@nobbyclarke9298]

Yet another Arrogant individual 🤦‍♂️

[@cobbler40]

A dishonest policemen shock horror !

[@georgecarlile652]

That wasn’t necessary. EX policeman!

[@darthwiizius]

I'm not to blame, I only gave orders...

[@UpnorthHere]

Also, "I'm not to blame because someone ELSE should have stopped me or told OHERS about the problems that I consistently failed to notice, let alone deal with", knowing that such others would have been promptly sacked as trouble-makers.

[@dall61]

Another crook exposed

[@damianleah6744]

What’s missing is someone at post office taking responsibility and making decisions. All that’s happened was a pass the parcel of blame.

[@jameswatters9592]

the system is such that nobody actually makes a decision and the reason actions go forward is that nobody who is signing off on it actually has the guts to say stop, I know after working for both the NHS and the DTI as a contractor its how we managed to get our money from what was basically a system run by simpletons and the reason I left was because I realised that it was MY money that was being spent.

[@markrfoster]

That’s is there core business right, one would hope they could pass the parcel effectively and efficiently? 😉

[@allisonstandley2573]

@@jameswatters9592it’s terrifying but true.

[@mvubu6823]

These hearings are like sad, criminal versions of YES MINISTER. The stupidity and absurdity is in the reality. You think it's a joke, except it's not.

[@Nellb-u2w]

They were caught out. What they did was disgusting enough. To try and cover it up is beyond disgusting. Vile, vile corruption at its very worst.

[@tinydancer2607]

“Who can I throw under the bus to help my case….”

[@marinman3551]

Talk about not taking responsibility and passing the buck....what a worm of a man!

[@garrymasters8994]

Lock him up

[@robertallardice8119]

Typical Post Office/ Royal Mail management, saw them come and go in my time as an engineer in Post Office, Royal Mail and ROMEC, the engineering arm of Royal Mail!

[@RichardReid-l3c]

This has gone on for far too long , this enquiry needs to be wrapped up and these lying crooks should be answering the same questions in a Criminal court , these proceedings are giving them far too much opportunity to spin an even deeper web of deceit.

[@markhattley2032]

Billy Smarts Circus. Coco the clown

[@ianholt7284]

Can we just take a step back, then in comes Mr Hindsight and then the buck is passed, Executive overlay corporate speak

[@RobMorrison-vf2is]

What amazes me is how slippery these people are. They do not take responsibility for anything or for the misery they have caused. It is quite obvious that they knew about it for ages and did nothing about it, shame on them. I hope that at the end of it all the people who are responsible face some consequences for their actions or lack of them.

[@leberlin]

Talk about ducking and diving, who appointed this ex copper? Who appointed the very “unreverened” Vicar to run one of the biggest company’s in the UK? It’s obvious they had no experience in industry of any kind but managed to get this very highly prestigious and important position? This is what happens when you put monkeys in charge of the zoo, no accountability or responsibility and shifting the blame around like a chess game. Sadly this scandal goes on and on. Does any one believe that an ex copper or a Vicar will ever be held accountable for these obvious fraudulent cover up crimes? Sad to say I don’t!

[@roydavis5613]

These 'executives' just trying to now muddy the waters, and dance around their responsibilities, instead of just admitting that they f'd up !!!

[@patrickmckay8444]

Another “ not me guv” chancer😅

[@arnesaknussemm2427]

When will the punishments be handed down?

[@neonwind]

Memory loss, lessons learned etc, and so on. No criminal charges.

[@M.Cunningham]

From a purely layman's point of view this witness is not credible and fails to take any responsibility for his role.

[@markhattley2032]

I've met ex Page 3 birds that are more clued up and more honest than this lot😂😂😂😂

[@andydudley1775]

New ones too.

[@davidlane180]

Any phone numbers at hand.

[@jeremyroberts39]

And hold onto your Pension....... shameful 😮

[@ianfarnborough7619]

Why the hell is this still going on? pay the compensation, and sack all those responsible.

[@mrentertainer47]

I can't believe that this scandal is still in court session? Downright disgusting for all victims! I hope those at the top get their just deserts - jail time!

[@john-y7z]

wonder how his police career was? fit up after fit up?

[@mikeellis4345]

All defence via defiant bluster and no real answer at all .. what a disgrace

[@miguelmonteiro7942]

Lock him up! That guy was in a senior management position but can't write proper English 😂😂😂

[@russellingham2069]

A.another lier, moving to Spain !😂😂😂take away his PENSION, silly LITTLE boy and a lier.

[@batcollins3714]

"LIAR"

[@MrButtonpresser]

I wasn’t my job Guvna! I just took the big dosh and went to the posh lunches!

[@lukelondon1]

The Post Office and Fujitsu should have all manned up and taken the hit paid back any expenses they can and taken time in prison. They should serve extra time for delaying the matter…

[@gwangjuboy1]

"Yes, I was one of several senior figures who could have escalated this but it's not my fault because nobody else did"

[@THEOUTCASTSCREATIVE]

Another person who should be behind bars

[@MrSmriley]

So arrogant, not an ounce of remorse for his terrible crimes.

[@HenryBartlett-b1l]

Nauseating, nobody is willing to take responsibility for anything.

[@fitness6681]

Wow -how many people were involved in this cover up. It seems endless.

[@guessundheit6494]

"They didn't do their jobs, so it was okay for me not to do mine." People with ethics would have blown the whistle and gone public. He chose to protect his pension.

[@collier8931]

Strange how no one was responsible for this complete abortion of a company.

[@Learnandgrow-n3o]

Oh dear. "Wasn't me Guv". Awful and trying to wriggle out of this and blame others. I wouldn't trust him in a tight corner to watch your back. He would be too busy plunging the knife in to save himself

[@petergoose8164]

"And did we tell you the name of the game, boy? We call it riding the gravy train" Pink Floyd - Have a cigar

[@andrewwilson8317]

Guilty of covering up, saving his ass and gross incompetence.

[@keithnaylor1981]

Sadly when all this is sorted those people who suffered mentally and psychologically, and imprisoned, and lost everything, will no longer be here along with their immediate descendants, and maybe even their descendants. And will any of those responsible for all this suffer any hardships at all? I doubt it.

[@hens_ledan]

I think he said (paraphrased) 'Fujitsu owned the code... so I didn't need to know (or take action).' and (paraphrased) 'It failed in testing but we thought it was probably going to be okay in live anyway.' and (paraphrased) 'I assumed it was a previous bug.' and (paraphrased) 'I wasn't the principal route for IT issues to the board.' Hm. Did they say this gentleman was the IT Director who was accountable for Horizon and the IT Department? So, he wasn't really an IT guy, and wasn't really doing a Director's role either. What a weird set up.

[@kgarrett1404]

Pass the blame enquiry.

[@leso204]

Doing the politicians sidestep/swerve

[@helainewilliams8253]

This. Is how it has always worked at the top in this country and everywhere else, he , like others will still have his millions and fine things, and won't give this a second thought!

[@tedmartin83]

A major incident would not be raised. This a known errors and problem management.

[@ataxpayer723]

Its all about processes and procedures, and nothing about taking control.

[@thenortherner3890]

He is right about a Major Incident (MI) being raised, Somebody, possibly Fujitsu didn't flip the MI switch and the POL forced the line 'it's only happening to you' to the Sub Post Office Masters. POL are guilty because once the number of people being prosecuted expanded expendably, they should also have called an MI - trouble is neither Fujitsu or POL wanted to admit there was a fault. When are these people going to have a knock on the door and prosecuted?

[@jeffschroeder4805]

It clearly was not that important to investigate problems with Horizon because Mike Young's paychecks were still being deposited regularly and he was not personally being required to make restitution for false claims against him. Was he merely a political appointee or was he expected to actually perform some real function as "chief of technology"? I don't expect he took out the office trash or brought tea and snacks to meetings. What exactly did he do all day?

[@greentombdive]

Howe & Co. Chap has so improved in terms of focus when questioning.

[@RichardFox-nr3hj]

Can’t believe his Freemason mates haven’t got him out of this one - presume he wasn’t at GMP as they’d have sorted it for him

[@davidsedlickas8222]

Corruption is unavoidable.

[@christhody7112]

Inept, arrogant and deceitful.

[@captain007x]

A pandemic of selective amnesia among PO hierarchy.

[@petercolledge2236]

Honest responses certainly.

[@bv3bv334]

This guy sits in his big house, with his big car on the driveway, eating his big lunches, on his big fat pension. Meanwhile, people have committed suicide. People have been imprisoned. People's lives have been utterly destroyed. We live in a wonderful World.