Pre-Historic Trinity of Female Rage

[@kirstenpaff8946]

Comparative mythology: 30% literary analysis, 30% linguistics, 40% conspiracy theory boards with thumbtacks and red string.

[@randomname1251]

Bingo!

[@tconnolly9820]

I'm Irish and you have just perfectly described the Morrigan, the Celtic Goddess of war and fertility. Yes, it is not news to me that so many ancient gods and beliefs have common roots and have migrated and evolved over the millennia as different people's migrated and interacted with others and became unique cultures and reworked the original mythologies to suit their current situations. And the Norse Goddess of war and fertility is Freyja.

[@MrNyathi1]

I also thought of the Morrigan. Kali, Freyja, the Morrigan, and Athena are all associated with peoples speaking Indo-European languages. The Hittites were a very early Indo-European civilisation in Anatolia, near the Semitic regions were Anat was worshipped. They may have adopted her and passed her on to other IE peoples.

[@pinky6758]

Freya has no war-like aspects. Freya and her brother Frey represent beauty/fertility/spring. In one of the norse myths, Freya is basically given away in a political marriage to the god of sea/storm (forgot his name).

[@MrNyathi1]

@@pinky6758 Freyja was goddess of love, fertility, battle, and death. Having said that, our records of Norse mythology were written by Scandinavian Christians a few generations after the old gods had ceased to be worshipped, so they probably got some things wrong.

[@davidweihe6052]

⁠​⁠@@pinky6758 The Sea/Storm god was Njord, a member of the Vanir. Nerthus was his German name. I do not know his proto-Germanic name. He also was the father of Frey & Freya, and Freya took half of the warrior dead that most of us expect would go to Valhalla, so I doubt your marriage story; I do remember her being afianced to a Jotunn until Thor dressed up like her and killed the Jotunn guests.

[@dimman77]

​@@pinky6758Freya was absolutely a war goddess. To the point where she got half of the noble warriors upon death. Only half went to Valhalla with Odin. The other half went to Folkvangr with Freya.

[@ziizification]

The likely thread here is probably Ishtar from Mesopotamia! There is pretty compelling evidence that Aphrodite was originally an Ishtar cult, as the earliest representations of Aphrodite celebrate her as a WAR goddess, highlighting her role as city leader and militant protector. It wasn't until much later that we get the more classical flightly sex and beauty goddess we're more familiar with. Highly recommend Overly Sarcastic Productions' video on Aphrodite for more on this, as it's fascinating to me to see the way female goddesses evolve over time. Tiamat is another great example.

[@digitaljanus]

Statues of Aphrodite Areia ("Warlike Aphrodite") in Sparta and other poleis as late as the 2nd century CE, depicting the goddess in armour, suggest this interpretation of the goddess persisted much longer in select areas.

[@rumpeltyltskyn]

They were talking about Athena though, no?

[@Nanamka]

But Aphrodite seems to be more fitting. Or we need more information on why Athena. ​@@rumpeltyltskyn

[@rumpeltyltskyn]

@@Nanamka I see.

[@adedow1333]

Aphrodite was also a Titan rather than a goddess in the truest sense. As she was born out of nature rather than birthed in a more traditional sense as were Zeus, Hera, Poseidon, and the rest.

[@AkshadaJoshi-w2f]

indian hindu here! the myth of kali goes as follows. there was a demon who got a boon that he could not be killed , because if a single drop of his blood fell on the ground, a clone would rise up from that. he obviously started wreaking havoc and the gods were unable to defeat him. so they went to Shiv,, who told them to pray to Shakti( basically the ultimate godess, personification of the very energy that operates the world). a form of Shakti was Parvtai, Shiv's wife. she agreed to help them and took on the Kali Svaroop. Kali battled the demon, but drank each drop of his blood before it touched the ground. but her violence didn't stop when the demon died. she went on a rampage, killing everyone in her path and drinking their blood from a bowl fashioned out od a skull. she wore nothing but a skirt and garland made out of their bones. finally, Shiv lied down in her path, and when she stepped on her husband she came out of her trance and turned back into Parvati. her standing on her husband"s body id the image we worship. interestingly, Parvati is otherwise the mother godess, the ideal wife ,the domestic form of Shakti( literal translation of which is energy). shakti has many forms, and so every woman is seen as a part of her. Shiv is the ideal husband, their son the ideal son.

[@msshellm8154]

Part of that story reminds me of Sekhmet - the lion [not lioness] headed - goddess of Egypt. It's a small similarity, but the thread is there. Sekhmet was Daughter of Ra, sent down from heaven to punish humans for straying away from the gods. But She became consumed by Her bloodlust. The gods came to Ra because She was destroying ALL of Their followers. Ttogether, the gods came up with a plan. They poured an enormous lake of beer, stained with pomegranate juice, to resemble blood. Sekhmet came upon the lake, and in Her thirst for blood, drank it dry, and passed out, drunk. When She came to, She regained Her senses, and heeded the wishes of Her father, sparing the rest of humanity. Originally a goddess of vengeance - of Ra upon humanity - she later had many more positive associations, magic, healing, protection. She was eventually folded in under, Bastet, and/or Hathor (who wears the same 'crown'/headdress.) And, along with Bastet, is possibly one of the oldest gods of Egypt - with Hathor and Isis being later, iterations, and the popularity of different cults rising and falling over the centuries.

[@AkshadaJoshi-w2f]

@@msshellm8154 that's pretty interesting. i think all ancient cultures have had extremely violent female figures, who are revered for the very fact that they are violent. but then we also see them having milder counterparts, like you said. Shakti as i mentioned has numerous forms and bc she is the personification of energy, it's like the gods made the universe but had no idea how to operate t so they had to call upon the very being of nature, Prakriti( another form of Shakti, she's the nature itself that nurtures and destroys)

[@adedow1333]

This is really cool, guys! Thanks!

[@AkshadaJoshi-w2f]

@hemantjain2387 oh yes that too! Her being unclothed shows her untethered personality. she's not meant to be a part of this world, she was called upon to save it.

[@ninaschust3694]

Shiva is also the first yogi and Pavarti the first student of yoga. And she is referred to as consort.

[@ninnusridhar]

To the blood soaked goddess of death idea, i think there is another answer that does fit occams razor. BLOOD SOAKED GODDESSES OF DESTRUCTION WITH A HUMAN SKULL BELT ARE FREAKING AWESOME! Nothing screams "Boy i brung you into this world. I can brung you right out" better than godess who's whole shtick is to rip spines apart That being said cultural similarities in myths and their connected origins are one of the most fascinating things in existence. Like, so many freaking cultures have the great flood as a mythical event. Be it the great flood that caused the god vishnu to take his fish form in hindu mythology, or Noah's ark, or the chinese flood myth about the guy who built mountain homes, or even some native american myths to that effect.

[@macman1469]

The reason for similarities in the Great Flood story is because early man lived on flood Plains .

[@ninnusridhar]

@@macman1469 That is a very logical explanation. Thanks!

[@macman1469]

@@ninnusridhar you're welcome .

[@electricorcagaming]

Was not expecting pre Indo-European reconstruction from elizabeth wheatley . Not upset about the video was good.

[@angelwolf23]

That is really interesting. Thank you for that. I have never heard of Anat before, just Baal.

[@msshellm8154]

Kali and Sekhmet have a connecting thread - the blood drinking/being overcome by it. I think people forget how cosmopolitan the ancient world really was.

[@bluephoenix6322]

The skulls Kali wears are not of her enemies but of her past incarnations. Kali is not a calculated murder party hostess she's literally a last resort when everything else fails. She's kind of like a berserker in terms of the way she fights . She doesn't spill blood for the sake of it. It was one demon literally that has association with essentially cloning himself through his own spilled blood on the earth so nobody could do shit and she decided to drink his blood so he can't clone anymore.

[@KatieCottingham]

Thank you! I relate Kali more to Hecate in her many forms and being more of a goddess of last hope and desperation to preserve humanity.

[@Nanamka]

Fun fact, Olga, the queen of Kiew, is said to have invited the killers of her husband for a feast, then locked them up in a sauna and burned them alive. She also put burning cloths to their pigeon messengers and set their hometowns on fire that way. She might have known some old myths )))

[@nabra97]

I also thought about it! I mean, either it is actually the same basic myth (if it's a myth) or it's possible that she could really be inspired by the myth (if it's true

[@LordJazzly]

Thank you for sharing this! The belt of skulls is quite specific and unusual, and - I'm sure the full conversation _was_ fascinating, because that's a solid enough point of comparison to actually dig into competing theories from. Nice! 👍

[@LordJazzly]

(I am tempted to go and dig into a whole mountain's worth of mythology books to write more specific things _about_ that comparison. But I have to make dinner and do work and stuff)

[@nikoletta_]

An interesting origin story for Athena is that she was born from her father Zeus's head -and thus she is the goddess of wisdom. The Greek fertility goddess is Demeter and not Athena, however. Haven't heard of a story about Athena, where she goes completely mad due to lust for blood and revenge. She is generally considered a reasonable goddess amongst the other crazy ones of the ancient greek pantheon!

[@belaytriks]

My history of cultures teacher called that universal myths like the flood or the travel into the death lands.

[@PlatinumAltaria]

Flood myths are very far from universal, their universality has been pushed by christian theologians for some time though.

[@JoeytheWitchyUnicorn-fq8if]

@PlatinumAltaria While flood myths aren’t entirely universal, there are many ancient cultures that included flood myths like the Babylonians, Greeks, Indonesians, Hindus, etc. that seem to predate accounts from the Bible.

[@mormacil]

​@@PlatinumAltariaThey're pretty universal, they're from every major river. That covers the majority of North America, South America, West Asia, East Asia, India, West Europe, Australia, West Africa, North Africa. What place must they also appear before its universal to you?

[@PlatinumAltaria]

​@@mormacil So an Egyptian myth of how seasonal floods fertilise the land is somehow the same as a Hindu myth of a god fighting a giant monster... because they both have floods? That's really silly. Christian apologists have falsely claimed that these myths are universal to make their religion seem more impressive, when in reality this flood myth originated in Mesopotamia and has spread exclusively within Europe and Central and South Asia. Santa Claus has more universal spread.

[@mormacil]

@@PlatinumAltaria Who is claiming that? The claim was that flood myth, myths about floods are universal. That doesn't mean they're identical, merely they're all about floods. You seem to confuse the worlds similar and universal. World ending floods in mythology are not limited to Europe, West, Central and South Asia. World ending floods are also a common motive in North America, South America and East Asia. There is a single place on the planet with almost no flood myths, subsaharan Africa.

[@christopherlyons5900]

Could be still earlier versions, of course, lost to history. We shouldn't assume that the same story can't occur independently in different places--I can tell you for a fact, it happens in fiction today--but the belt of skulls is pretty specific. And there's not that much geographic separation involved. God/Goddess pairs were a very important part of many if not all all ancient religions. The Celts had that as well. The idea is, the male and female have to be united in purpose, even if their agendas don't always align perfectly--they quarrel, things go badly--they reconcile, things go well. Telling these stories is at times a way of trying to balance out male and female agency, in societies where women have a lot of influence, but men still have most of the overt power. Monotheism forced that underground--even though very early Christianity showed more respect for women than most other religions of that time (many scholars believe it was Mary Magdalene who spread the idea Jesus had risen from the dead, and without her, the cult would have died off). Sadly, that didn't last once it became a dominant religion, therefore a source of authority in itself. Basically, once people can get power from belonging to something, the people who crave power get interested, and it gets corrupted. The Sheep start something, the Goats take it over. Still, many women--as you've mentioned---joined Catholic orders not to bow before patriarchy, but to escape it. To find a place where they could have some agency of their own. In a weird sort of way, St. Francis and St. Clare were a god/goddess pair, though they'd blanch at the thought, and were not romantically involved. She was going to be forced to marry a man she didn't love, and she followed in his path to achieve what she saw as freedom to be a force for good--and he respected her more than any man. Something similar happened between John of the Cross and Teresa of Avila, who connected on a spiritual level, seeing things most people could never understand. Great story. Wouldn't really work as a romance novel, though. ;)

[@NerdlyBee]

First one here! I was sent one of your Book Goblin shorts by my book club friends, and I've been following you for a few months now. I love your work!

[@YourAverageTherianBookworm]

I also found her from her book goblin videos!

[@the_almightyone]

I love how you talked about wading through blood and making belts from skulls but still said "unalived", KZbin's policy is wild

[@laotrairene]

YES!!! Tell us ❤ I love to hear about forgotten or not so known goddess. And also, poor medusa😢

[@Xebelan]

It's Baal Hadad specifically, lord of storms and friend of mankind (as there are many Baals). Anat is also Egyptian, where there she is married to Set, who is also called Reshep the archer, who is Rudra to the indus valley. And Rudra is Shiva.

[@julietbyrne577]

Many can say the same about Aphrodite and Ishtar. Love mythology vids😊

[@briantanner1068]

Anat, the goddess of war and fertility; a new take "Anat giveth and Anat taketh away. "

[@elihinze3161]

Anybody who's interested in this should read the Ba'al Cycle! Also, Ishtar/Inanna is THE primo goddess of bloodlust and warmongering, in my eyes 😍

[@razorflossrazor2937]

that is fasnating and i would love to hear more.

[@KerraLong]

Same here! Videos in this vein of discussion would be quite interesting. Mythological originations and the similarities between the myths is fascinating.

[@taylor_green_9]

Athena is neither a murderer nor a berserker, though. She's the goddess of wisdom and craftsmanship as well as war. She's a tactician and a skilled fighter. Medusa's head, which she put on her shield, was an offering from her half-brother Perseus as thanks for her guidance during his adventures

[@Dragonmoon8526]

Very possible. Obviously many stories across. Cultures have similarities. It's not surprising to find an intricate web of connection.

[@RoonMian]

Are you sure that it's Athena that is connected to that? Because when you talked about Anat as being the goddess of war and fertility, that immediately reminded me of Ishtar and the one in the Greek pantheon connected to Ishtar is Aphrodite.

[@Wednesdaywoe1975]

Always thought the Greeks split their goddess into pieces. Aphrodite and Athena together make one Ishtar.

[@Eared-robot2-0]

This tbh NGL I feel these goddesses may be connected to Ishtar/Aphrodite rather than Athena, Ishtar is kind of a very big deal.

[@kikidevine694]

Aphrodite doesn't have that duality of sex and death. Once you get to the Greeks, they liked to separate the aspects more.

[@RoonMian]

@@kikidevine694 She didn't have that at the end. She absolutely had that at the beginning. Aphrodite too did meddle in wars like in the Illiad.

[@jean-rockdion7960]

@@Wednesdaywoe1975 yes it is and Innana is the same as Ishtar but older Sumerians/Akkadian

[@fortunatecookie]

You probably know this too, but for a lot of “fertility goddesses,“ it’s believed that they originally had nothing to do with fertility, and early Christians just rebranded them because “fertility” was the only thing that was appropriate to be associated with femininity

[@Nanamka]

In early cultures femininity was fertility. Being healthy and fertile, birthing healthy and strong new humans.

[@kathleenwoods8416]

@@Nanamka I'm not quite sure about that, I mean even Mars was originally an agricultural deity, which seems kinda weird if its always been that flat. While the metaphor might be Idealized now, the biological fact of ovum wasn't known & as such a woman's influence even on herown participation in life was debated a lot more back than. Being the vessel is not giving the water. The vase is not the well & neither the field the seed. So yeah, fertility might be something that's easy to apply later even if it wasn't the only possible association, & yeah, later societies might be at fault for that misinterpretation. Like for one, sinking an agrarian deity like Mars with Ares so that the lower classes take to your interfaith fangirling better.

[@PlatinumAltaria]

That seems unlikely given there are dozens upon dozens of non-fertility goddess across European mythologies. Like did they just forget Athena?

[@kikidevine694]

​@@Nanamkaand also taking souls to the next world.

[@mormacil]

I dunno, having the wife of the chief/war leader be in change of fertility is pretty common. And the link to wife of the war god's physical representation to taking on war properties yourself is a small step.

[@lizsmith1018]

Looking forward to that Medusa video!

[@VAitken1]

Please do a video on Medusa! She is an original case of woman blamed for the terrible things men did to her.

[@PlatinumAltaria]

When I'm in a rampant misogyny competition and my opponents are the ancient greeks:

[@mormacil]

Not true, Gorgons as monsters predate Medusa as a victim by centuries. Medusa as a victim has a single source known for making stuff up for his own goals. Not saying it's not a good story but it's a later alteration.

[@jonathangardner6296]

A quick correction: Anat was not a fertility goddess. In fact, she probably wasn't the goddess of sexuality either. Nor was she Ba'al's wife. In most references to her in Ugaritic texts (the only ones she's mentioned in; nowhere to be found in later Phoenician, Hebrew, or Aramaic texts, let alone anything from post-Bronze Age Mesopotamia), she's referred to as Ba'al's sister and, more importantly, the "young girl" or "virgin" (depending on how one translates the word btlt; probably the former). She had no husband or children and acts as, to quote Dennis Pardee, "the tomboy goddess," inverting feminine-masculine roles. The possible maintaining of her virginity combined with her violent nature does make an interesting parallel with Athena. Interestingly, the best antecedent for Anat is from Amorite Mari, Hanat, and it would seem that her veneration was adopted by the Hurrians, an Indo-Europeon group that migrated from eastern Europe through the Near East and on to India, connecting them with Greece, Ugarit, and India, lending some credence to the theory of a single origin for all three. Anat also became later venerated in Hyksos Egypt (interestingly, Egypt is the only source of verified images of Anat). There are other violent war goddess in the Near East that share striking similarities. Sekhmet, the Egyptian lion-headed war goddess similarly went on a blood rampage that had to be quelled by the gods getting her passed-out drunk. Ishtar and Anat do exactly the same actions against the father god in separate myths and are both known for their violent and unpredictable outbursts, although Ishtar was much more venerated. In all these cultures, there is a common theme among their pantheons in war being personified by violent and unpredictable women.

[@fredericapanon207]

@Johnathangardner6296, honestly, I see the other Greek virgin goddess, Artemis, Goddess of the Hunt and the Moon, as a better fit. She had more violent tendencies than Athena, considering her reaction to Acteon surprising her at her bath.

[@TBoring]

I’m not sure if I buy the Athena connection. War goddess aside, Athena’s divine wrath more seems to lean into the ironic than the violent. Arachne thought she was a better weaver than the goddess of crafts, so Athena turns her into the first spider so her and her descendants will weave forever (which feels more like a punishment for us). Or when Ajax the Lesser violates the sanctity of her temple during the sacking of Troy and all the Greeks who have just spent a decade away from home now had extended their trips home, if they ever made it back at all. Mind you it’s been a minute since I really did a deep dive into Greek myth so I might be misremembering.

[@loryoly2662]

The Spiders are doomed to weave perfectly, but see their creations being destroyed over and over again because no one appreciates them. Also Athena hated violence and killing.

[@TBoring]

@@loryoly2662I might’ve appreciated them more if I hadn’t accidentally walked into one every other day growing up and if spiders themselves weren’t made of darkness and nightmares

[@digitaljanus]

Aphrodite's a more likely candidate, there's significant scholarly consensus for the theory she was adopted from Inanna, the Sumerian/Akkadian goddess of war and fertility.

[@nilsjohnson2636]

Fascinating! Thanks for this video, it’s introduced me to your channel! Subscribed!

[@studio._.z]

my favorite type of mythology!! (also persephone is semi similar- scholars suspect that during the greek "dark" ages three goddesses meshed to gether an became the godess we know as persephone/kore)

[@naymeequillo]

I'm learning so much more from stuff like this than from school... this is so much easier to digest, process and internalise!

[@Meanne77]

What I find interesting is how often we have one goddess for both war & fertility. Never heard about Anat but I'll keep it in mind for a future pet (I give god(dess) names to my cats, usually of war/death/etc. Anat would be a good fit XD)

[@VereskVeil]

I'm not in romantic genre at all, but every time I see how intelligent and well-spoken you are, I want to buy your books.

[@Hrafnskald]

Great discussion topic. Are you familiar with Red from OSP's work on tracing myths? I find the subject fascinating, and it's great to hear from different voices and perspectives.

[@universalqueenfern]

Poor Medusa: victimized then villainized

[@AquaMoonMaiden]

Ummmm, Medusa as a victim was invented by a Roman poet pissed at being exiled, so he made up the story to portray the gods (read: authority figures) as tyrants. It’s one of the few myth versions we actually have a date for, since it only shows up in Ovid. Prior to that Medusa was a full on monster. Like, chimera, hydra, mares of diomedes, etc type monster. I’m not saying the Ovid version isn’t valid, or a good metaphor for abuses of authority or victim blaming. But she was a villain first, that got defanged to being a victim, not a victim that got villainized.

[@ziizification]

It's so interesting to me that our first mentions of Medusa have her as a natural Gorgon with monstrous siblings and yet the 'tragic victim' narrative which literally comes from ONE DUDE drowned that out so effectively. So much Greek myth is a guy who decided to write down his version of disparate folklore to serve a personal agenda and the more I try to chase done a 'real' version of a myth or deity the more I realize that we've lost so much nuance because of who got to write the 'official' versions.

[@photon4076]

So it is the other way around in the development of the myth: villainized, then victimized

[@MentalBloopers]

Vilified

[@AquaMoonMaiden]

@@ziizification I don’t personally think there is a “real” version of any one myth or deity. This was a living religion, yes, but not a centralized one. There was no equivalent of the Bible, and every area had it own versions of the major stories, alongside any local legends. You’re not wrong about one guy or another writing down a particular version to suit an agenda (see Homer specifically saying Aphrodite doesn’t belong on the battlefield in the Iliad, when there was a war goddess version of her prior to that point in Sparta). But a lot of religion was transmitted orally, so it changed a lot across time and distance. That’s what makes it fun, I think. Also something new.

[@rockjock3]

What about Sekhmet? Any word on the female Cat goddess of Egyptian War? Is she related there too? I mean, she shares the same portfolio as the other three and she's closely tied to the same region as most ancient civilizations that sprang up in that part of the world. So, I was just wondering if ancient scholars might have looked her way or hopefully didn't overlook her.

[@adedow1333]

I've also heard arguments that the fairytale of the beauty asleep or imprisoned comes from a single universal tale. Snow White, Sleeping Beauty, Rapunzel, Ethniu, Brünhilde all follow such a similar vein that the likelihood seems strong.

[@mormacil]

Most of those come from the same rough cultural sphere so that's almost to be expected. They're all from the Northsea area.

[@СарраКарагозян]

Fascinating! Would love to see the Medusa video!

[@KitKat_Kamaro521]

As I'm reading the comments, I'm seeing many people from many different cultures describe their female war/love deities and how they all seem very similar. It's interesting to note that these cultures all seem to be connected by a common thread: namely that of Indo-European language and culture. Even the civilizations that were not Indo-European linguistically would have had interactions with proto-Indo-European peoples (like the Canaanites would have) or established Indo-European societies (like the Egyptians would have) leading to similarities in pantheon and myths. This video also reminds me of an interesting fact I read in Jo Marchant's "The Human Cosmos" which is a really good book; namely that in around 50 separate cultures worldwide, from the Greeks to North American Indigenous Tribes, a myth appears called the "Celestial Hunter." The myth of Orion from Greek mythology is a good example of this kind of tale. The story is, across all cultures, used to explain a constellation of a hunter being there, hence the title for the archetype being "Celestial Hunter." "The Human Cosmos," again, is a really good book for learning about humanity's religious, cultural, and scientific relationship with the skies, and for further information on Indo-European linguistics and culture, as well as etymology and linguistics of all kinds, I would recommend the channels NativLang, Langfocus, and Etymology Nerd. Learn Hittite also has a great set of videos about the Proto-Indo-Uralic Theory and Indo-European things in general, which are both fascinating topics.

[@funtimefoxy6699]

I love that she properly pronounces the name Ba'al.

[@katendress6142]

I've never heard of Anat before. It's interesting to wonder about whether there is a common origin, or if the myths arose from a common fear of female fury.

[@mormacil]

I think we should not underestimate the impact of the priest king and his wife leading the local cult. He does war, she does fertility. Over time as the wife of the guy in charge of war she takes on war aspects. And nature is full of mother animals protecting their young to the death.

[@cyntiakamillevasquezpena5973]

Yessssss ❤❤❤❤❤ love this type of analysis ❤❤❤❤

[@humanbeen985]

This is really cool to think about and I love Greek myths and Athena especially so this is really cool

[@rakhelhartz-alvarez739]

Wow, just, Wow...I'm still mourning the sacking of Carthage

[@chryblsmflwr]

I love this kind of history! There's a similar theory about flood myths in the Middle East. The Sumerians, Persians, and Egyptians all have a flood story similar to the flood myth in Genesis (Noah). A lot of ancient historians theorize that there probably was a devastating flood throughout the Middle East that, because of the largely flat and featureless landscape of Mesopotamia, would really appear to cover the whole world.

[@darkdaygirl]

I’m curious if you’ve ever read my favorite book series so far which is the Black Jewels series. It’s the one with Saeten, and his sons Lucivar and Daemon, and they’re all waiting for the ultimate Queen to appear, Janelle. Have you read it and what do you think of it?

[@LLorax0]

Isn't The Seven Sister also one of these stories that share a proto-myth sometime in pre-history? Also based on when all seven stars in the associated star cluster was easily last seen it gives a rough time for when the story was first told. Well I know what my rabbit hole for the day is.

[@WolfHeadedDragonQueen]

You're right and it's big. I am a Shakta "Possessor" of Kali, which means I am possessed by her, and so I understand them intimately. Kali is the Dark Mahadevi and this is a primordial magnetic field, which is sentient (because the Universe is sentient). She is older than time and is not bound by words as she is transcendental and words do not transcend time. She has infinite faces and forms and she is in fact they you mention, yet also Sekhmet of the Egyptians, and Fenrir of the Norse, when unbound. Fenrir is Chhinnamasta when bound, Kali when unbound, and they are of Shakti, which is Power. The root came from primordial Romania, pre-Neolithic tribes of Wolf-like beings called Proto-Getae, intensely sovereign with strong internal identities which are wordless and not bound by context. These tribes migrated around the whole world and became the Indo-Europeans as well as Canaan, and other adjacent. I am a descendent yet a bit more than that because we are born, live, and die endlessly, 1:1, different bodies yet internally not changing, eternally. Yet we did suffer blindness for a time. If you're interested in knowing more about the Dark Mahadevi, hit me up. I'm friendly. I use spectacle to make the world reject me, to keep myself pure for Kali. Unfortunately spectacle has worked a bit too well, haha. Big changes are coming for Lokabrenna!! I'm so Sirius.

[@Nanamka]

Athena is the opposite of love or fertility. But why not Aphrodite? In the earliest mentions she used to represent love AND war and had a temper similar to Kali.

[@claressalucas8922]

I choose to believe that a woman avenged her loved one's murder and, being one of the Vinca culture who were headhunters, made a pretty belt to warn others not to annoy her, which was so badass that we've been talking about it for the ensuing twelve millennia.

[@dancelep]

I'd be jazzed for a Medusa video.

[@SimplyManda]

It’s interesting that there all these goddesses of war pre-monotheism. If I remember my mythology even Persephone was down right terrifying and considered worse than Hades. it wasn’t until monotheism that women were seen as weak creatures

[@PraiseJ-Pope]

There are SO MANY goddesses in all pantheons all around the world who are both goddesses of fertility/women/birth AND war/murder/death and not just the silent/poison/old age but standing in the front row screaming and shaking weapons thirsting for blood. COINCIDENCE? I DONT THINK SO!

[@1TakoyakiStore]

It sounds like there's a bit of Tiamat in there. A mother goddess who flies into a dangerous rage due to the death of a child or husband being slain.

[@Halfway3]

I really thought Anat was a different word at first. I should go to bed.

[@douglasphillips5870]

There are two ways of looking at similarities in mythology. One is that two similar myths have a common root. The other is that separate cultures shared stories which were later adopted into their mythology using their own gods.

[@zapacunotres59]

Please do a Medusa video. I'm working on a book about Medusa and I need some info.

[@abispanner3957]

Classicist here - One of the things I find fascinating about Athena is that her role in Greek mythology as a brainchild of Zeus (quite literally) is to reinforce patriarchal values not dismantle or challenge them because one of the reasons she is a goddess and not a god is that she upholds Zeus' authority (in most cases - very few exceptions) instead of challenging them as a potential usurper which is what Athena would have done if she were a god

[@ronjones1414]

It seems that there is a goddess of war archetype, and our brains develop similar stories.

[@oli-oopsy]

The Medusa video is not a want it’s a NEED. The true story of Medusa so interesting, since it wasn’t just her being a bit silly with Poseidon it was way worse

[@brindlebriar]

And the root myth goes back to my ex-wife. Clearly, she travelled back in time.

[@koshwik]

could you make a video on romance genres discussing menustration

[@timstoomanybooks]

Is the Caananite pantheon the one with the extremely successful storm god?

[@johannageisel5390]

Yes and no. The Israelites fused Jahweh with elements from another Canaanite god, El, but Ba'al (the Canaanite warrior storm god) was a direct rival to Yahweh. Yahweh was the Israelite warrior storm god, if I remember correctly, but if you are really interested in the details, I can recommend the channel "Esoterica". There are two videos: 1. "Who is Yahweh - How a Warrior-Storm God became the God of the Israelites and World Monotheism" 2. "How did Yahweh Become God ? The Origins of Monotheism" I watched the first one a while ago and do not remember what it all entailed, but the second goes into detail about the Canaanite pantheon. Edit: I just found out that the Israelites emerged from a subgroup of Canaanites, so I guess Yahweh was part of the Canaanite pantheon from the beginning. Though I'm not sure how the other Canaanites thought about that.

[@ellisebrooks4341]

Astarte? Neither? Sehkmet? I'm such a myth nerd.

[@gengis737]

Kali and Anat are goddess of violent death, while Athena is goddess of military thinking, the unbounded violence of war being the god Ares. Imagine a female war chief who used the head of her ennemies as trophy, so violent that her memory have been passed on to historic time (and men have fled her all the way from Central Asia to India and Syria).

[@Ravi9A]

Extremely common perennialism win.

[@naniedesbois3891]

Do you think there is s link between Anat and Ishtar ? She is too à goddess of fertility and war...

[@NormanEvans-y7f]

And y"all still haven't got over it.......

[@Canuovea]

That's fascinating.

[@marklogan8970]

I would have thought Anat would be more closely linked to Inanna.

[@cernstormrunner7263]

I'm from Pittsburgh and everytime I hear you say "Anat" i keep think you're saying "N'at"

[@ForeverMe217]

As a Christian I wholeheartedly believe every single myth in the world is related. Every last one of them and it’s fascinating to draw this parallels. (The reason I added ‘As a Christian’ is because some people believe we hate the gods of other religions 💀)

[@maybenaught]

You're coming across cultural-linguistic families and the uptake of cultural elements from pre-established cultural powers. It's reasonable to believe that Indo-European cultures have some base shared mythological elements, and certainly those that settled in proximity to the middle east would have felt the influence of the cultures there. It's fascinating.

[@poonyaTara]

The Baals are still worshipped in some regions of the world. As a Christian adherent of the jain faith I have to be careful when I'm obliged for any reason to enter a temple since G*d specifically prohibits worshipping the Baals due to the fact that they require child sacrifice. These days temples that allow their worship still accept child sacrifice, but only if the child is terminally ill, initiates the request to be a sacrifice (because solicitation is as obscene as it is illegal), and agrees to die from natural causes while living in the temple. Basically it's like saying, "I'm gonna die soon. May I live in the temple until I do?" Horrific as it sounds, I cannot imagine anyone objecting to it on ethical grounds, provided the best medical care available has been provided first. Still, the idea of accidentally walking into a temple's Baal room as a Christian makes me anxious. If I have to behave disrespectfully in order to avoid an invitation to worship them I will, but I hate the idea of insulting religious leaders of any ilk.

[@raubtierchen8818]

Please do a Video on Medusa

[@heav3n777]

Umm.... Enemies of mother Kaali were demons tho 😬 The demon questioned the authority of the king of Heaven. He was blessed with a boon that no man can ever unalive him. Then mother rose to protect her children. That's the story

[@richarderikssonhjelm8838]

I think that Athena is also sometimes connecte to Teshub and Neith

[@Shayma98]

The only reason I know Anat is Persona 5. 😅

[@yezgarmi]

[@eric2500]

THREE FOLD FEMALE RAGE? yeah that's getting popular among women these days!

[@RavenPeake]

Okay so... I don't think Kali is the same as Sipai Gyalmo? I could be wrong. A fun addition to this could be Sekhmet.

[@Pdpfire]

Video on medusa?

[@jean-rockdion7960]

The Greek at one point started to fracture/fracto/split/divide old gods and godess by attributs!! Before Ishtar (all attributs in one) from Babylonians and Assyrians it was Innana from Sumerians and Akkadians with all the attributs in one godess!!! Now in our time.... they bring back all attributs in 2.... good and bad... next just one!!

[@miyayume_eclectic_dream]

This is new information for me but not a new consept. I belive there is no english translation of Die Sonne war ihr Gott by Zenon Kosidowski [ human history starting from Mesopotamia to 20th century giving explanation how everything is just transformed an not new....like sunday come from God RA ....I think but I read it 15 yeara ago] and also watch the movie Last Man on Earth from 2007. For the sake of the thoughts-experiment in that one I love the movie. Went in blind while thinking it is Alien SF.

[@Akaeus]

Most war gods started out as female if im not mistaken

[@RoyHagan-jh1rp]

So Anat was a goddess of fertility but Ba'al required child sacrifice. How does that work?

[@randomname1251]

People across the world are all human, so it makes sense there would be some similarities in their stories, we tend to think in somewhat similar ways. That doesn’t mean the stories are related. And you have the story of Kali quite wrong.

[@Wednesdaywoe1975]

Most ancient cultures had a goddess of female rage and destruction who was also wise/nurturing/the very root of civilization. The closest the Church ever gave us was St Brigid. This may explain why Im pagan.

[@PlatinumAltaria]

The concept of "pagan" only has value in relation to christianity, there's nothing unifying aside from that.

[@catsend]

Honestly, sounds like The White Goddess connections.

[@ozzugunguy]

Pfft they were nothing, the Ori on the other hand, they were a bit harder to deal with

[@Mailed-Knight]

Interesting.

[@edwardbartoneb]

!?…… nope I am not getting involved with this.

[@347Jimmy]

All of these societies were linked along the Silk Road 🤷🏻‍♂️ theory makes sense

[@lisaw5936]

More. I want to know more

[@ebonyblack7272]

If we're talking female rage I'd say hera or afrodite before athena. She's low-key kind of a pick me since she's on record for punishing women who were raped in her temples. Hera because of all the bs Zeus put her through. Afrodite because she's the helenistic adaptation of Istar. She's also heavily associated with Aries, who's considered a particularly destructive and wrathful diety like Shiva.

[@ebonyblack7272]

@hemantjain2387 I'm always happy to learn more from different mythologies and am not as familiar with the Hindu. Do you have any good book of channel recommendations?

[@ebonyblack7272]

@hemantjain2387 It does thank you!🥰

[@JadetheApolloKid1327]

First? Love the video!

[@johannageisel5390]

I want Ishtar in there, too!

[@christopherpardell4418]

So… men been telling stories about female violence forever.