Precision Rimfire Stuff Nobody Talks About

[@sebastianfedorowicz6967]

So far your Channel is the Best out of Any 22 lr rimfire World. Great co tent. Agree with all you Say. You are explaining it very well. Keep it up

[@22guru]

This channel is awesome!! Well done ✅💯🇺🇸

[@nunyabidniz2868]

Your post reminded me of the long lost 22World website (forum) devoted to all things rimfire. It's been over 20 years and I still miss it. RFC [Rimfire Central ] picked up the slack and is still going strong, but I'm not a fan of their most recent revamp: prettier facade, but harder to keep up w/ the content.

[@daveneal456]

Thanks, very informative. In my 60+ years of living I’ve learned that purchasing anything mechanical in nature is always a roll of the dice. When I was younger automobiles were not nearly as reliable or consistently good as they are today. We never purchased a car built on a Monday or Friday and prayed we got a good one. My theory on barrels is in a perfect world I don’t want the first few or last few cut, but we can’t control that unless we are making our own. I’ve been in both ends purchasing rifles/optics being lucky sometimes and not so much sometimes. I was skeptical of high end optics until I purchased a leupold mark iv a few years back, the clarity is amazing even with my old eyes. Competitive shooting is much like automobile racing in that you can buy a certain amount of speed and handling but somebody still has to know how to drive it.thanks for the video.

[@torqueguy1]

Great channel, good vid. I had a boss when I was young that said “the price of the scope should equal the rifle”. Said you would never wear a suit with sneakers

[@wowguy3562]

I used Tascos from Kmart on my hunting rifle all the time, a 500 dollar rifle with a 38 dollar scope. Scopes have come a loooooong way, back in the day it was hard to find a 500 dollar scope at k mart, lol

[@rt66rc86]

@@wowguy3562 I recall using a 3-9x Tasco on a 7mm Mag in 1977. Hard to pass up these japanese made scopes that worked so well and very reliable for 40 bucks! Pulling green chain @ $3.65/Hr., pulling a $500.00 scope out of the budget was pure fantasy...

[@user-jv4ic8rh4d]

General rule of thumb, not hard fast rule. I have $3500 scar with a $1600 nightforce. I also have a $238 savage 22 with a $700 leupold. Rem 700 sundaro $1500 with $400 arken. The arken tracks very well takes the recoil of 30o RUM without issue. 550-600 rounds now. Spare me the sub $50 tasco. Ok, fudds. Let me guess you still got 12 rounds of the only 20 round box you ever bought when you got the gun. Of course the tasco "works" you sighted that gun in back in 19 ought 70 and gone deer drinking ever since. Never pull it out case let alone shoot it. Yes the scope doesnt need to be high priced but sub $50 tasco 😂

[@rt66rc86]

@@user-jv4ic8rh4d Perhaps you weren't around back in the 70s, living in the country, buying guns/ammo/scopes from small town country hardware stores like some of us were! All of the equipment that spoils children like you today and provides you with the arrogance and ignorance to make the comment you did, wasn't even thought of back then when we were shooting and earning our skills, not buying the majority of them due to technology! And many of us have grown up to become wise old men with considerable skills that we don't even mention on social media... Feel free to keep talking and making it very clear, what you are.

[@leetskeet4476]

​@@user-jv4ic8rh4dbased comment

[@jamesbasile9586]

Last time I shot, I experimented with stock torque settings.I was amazed at the difference in accuracy that 5 inch pounds makes.

[@joshuagibson2520]

Glad to hear someone finally say it out loud.

[@Too_Many_Hobbies_UT]

Your honestly and straight-forward way of discussing these topics is refreshing. You are a breath of fresh air in a world of so many KZbinrs who are clearly pushing corporate or their own interests only. Keep up the exceptional work, Josh!

[@Ably1972]

If you want to do a part 2 Josh I think you might want to explain rifle fit and it’s importance length of pull cheek riser etc would help alot of us newer shooters achieve better results,also shooting bags/rests and their proper use would help too. Thanks again for sharing your knowledge and excellent content.

[@anniebooo]

Thank you for your honest and straight talk. As a female competition shooters, I am forever tired of hearing men talking about equipment when they are shooting high end ammo like Eley or Lapua, and nice gear, and you can clearly see that technique e.g. follow-through is off. And please guys, don't give "good advice" to us girls when we are shooting. Happy to hear afterwards, but when I have shot nice 9 and 10s, and a guy is standing there and saying, "don't rip it now, don't rip it... blah blah" that's not fair, because ofcourse you will rip a 2 or 3.

[@Jdelta22nc]

Sir you used my favorite word “consistency” everything you discussed I have experienced as well. Case in point many people state that Norma rimfire is not that good but I have come into some lots that shoot very good out of a Vudoo but shoots a little tighter out of my stocked Bergara BMR Carbon barrel. I am talking 15 and 20 shots groups at 1/2 to 3/4 inches at 50 yards consistently, and /12 an inch and less out of the B14R with a Remington 700 trigger and an SRS chassis with Norma TAC22. Great video, always learn something new. Thanks.

[@marktracht7782]

Hey Josh, thanks for another great video. As the casual non competitive shooter I agree with everything you said. Still find that even though I don't compete I still want a rifle that does as well as it can and maybe on a good day even as well as Josh does. That being said another thing you can get with a custom barrel is OUTSTANDING CUSTOMER SERVICE. I bought a Lilja barrel for one of my 10/22s and got only so so performance from it. Something in the .75 to 1.0 inch at 50 yards. I contacted Carson and told him of all the things I had done to try and improve the performance, different stock/chassis, different receivers, different bolts and always the same results. He said to send it back and he would take a look at it. I sent it back and he just sent me a brand new barrel, end of story. Oh, the new barrel shoots .3 to .4 which for this shaky old man is all I can expect. Not sure many other companies would treat someone like that. Lilja, a name you can trust.

[@crtxdistortion657]

Point of diminishing returns never comes as fast as when you're not spending time on the rifle. Good vid. 👍

[@CopperStarPrecision]

Great video! The type of competition will also dictate the level of investment needed to be in the running. There's actually a pretty big gap between NRL22 clubs that only do Option 1 (100 yards or less) and Option 2 (up to 200 yards). Then there is another jump to PRS Rimfire or NRL22X matches. Benchrest is a whole different beast. Typically, when you're chasing more performance what you're really chasing is consistency and even more so repeatable consistency. Any decent rifle can shoot sub 0.300 C2C with the right ammo and conditions, but can it do that over multiple groups on different days, or in different environments? One thing I will add that wasn't discussed in the video is the fire control group. There are a lot of gains over factory offerings by going with an aftermarket high-quality trigger and even experimenting with headspace with bolt and/or barrel shims. Getting consistent trigger feel and ignition of the rounds does wonders and isn't a huge investment.

[@jasonwernli422]

Totally agree... and...Love your channel too!

[@chaguie07171959]

I commend you for your honesty, I purchased a LILJA barrel for my CZ-457 MTR that did not shoot as accurate with my factory CZ MTR barrel. I am debating getting a Mullerworks barrel since they are the top of the CZ-457 aftermarket accuracy barrels but again there are no guarantees that it is going to be more accurate than the factory MTR's. I think that if you have a factory MTR barrel that consistently shoots in the .4 groups or less@ 50 yards then you should spend your money or getting match ammo. Practice, practice, practice your shooting form and trigger time.

[@allanschmitt1572]

There is a guarantee with the Mullerworks barrel. If you install it correctly, it will definitely be an upgrade.

[@f143744]

Like you, I have a new CZ457 MTR. Looked at purchasing a Mullerworks 26” everything back ordered, settled on and purchased a Bartlein 26” supposedly shipping within a month. I recommend having the barrel lot tested before shipping, as close to a guarantee that I can find. Protects you for a nominal fee, plus you get to see actual data at 50 and 100 yards. Also, you can bulk purchase the best Eley or Lapua lots for that barrel. Just my 2 cents…

[@Tablet-p8l]

Use stock until it's worn out. Don't overthink it. My 8 year old daughter can hit sub moa at 150yd and 1moa at 200 with a savage mark ii, no upgrades and original poly stock. Ammo is going to be your best bet, but Lapua lr and slr are hard AF to find.

[@chaguie07171959]

@@f143744 I went and purchased two Muller Barrels; a 21" and a 24" inch one. Both are extremely accurate. The average with SK Rifle Match is .3's and with Eley Team .1-.2's @ 50 yards. I just got them and have only shot about 150 rounds through each barrel. I am so glad I got them. I think I hit the jackpot with this Mullerworks barrels.

[@chaguie07171959]

@@allanschmitt1572 I went and purchased two Muller Barrels; a 21" and a 24" inch one. Both are extremely accurate. The average with SK Rifle Match is .3's and with Eley Team .1-.2's @ 50 yards. I just got them and have only shot about 150 rounds through each barrel. I am so glad I got them. I think I hit the jackpot with this Mullerworks barrels.

[@Ballistol22LR]

I think this could be the most useful video you’ve ever made Josh. It does a really good job explaining the constituent parts of the accuracy enigma. I see many people who have a totally unrealistic expectation based on the fact that they’ve thrown money at a particular aspect thinking it will guarantee a giant leap forward in performance only to be sorely disappointed. I don’t mean that in a derogatory way, we’ve all made purchases chasing improved performance but the law of diminishing returns can and often does come into play.

[@wildnorthadventures]

That was an absolutely brilliant way to explain the barrel thing! I think a lot of us kinda know that but just can’t put it into words. Thanks Josh

[@ronmartblog]

You hit on the reason why I have trouble spending the next $1500+ for a new scope or chassis for my 457 Varmint MTR - I can consistently stay sub MOA out to 200 yards. Sure I might get the occasional MOA group at 50, but most are in the .3’s and .4’s. I can clear the KYL at 200 yards even with Tac22 with a single mag, and I don’t compete, so it’s only my ego and perfectionism that drives me to continue spending for that minor performance bump. Good ammo and my armageddon game changer bag were definitely better investments for what I do. The Arken was a good compromise for me too

[@trevorfarlette9996]

Sure bud

[@ronmartblog]

@@trevorfarlette9996 just to clarify - I’m not getting.3 & .4’s at 200y - those are 50 yards groups. I’m staying under 2” at 200y. Thanks for calling me out on that.

[@kimlangley759]

Really enjoy your channel - and have learned quite a lot on 22LR precision. Started my 22LR "quest" with a RPR Rimfire - shot it for maybe a year 1/2 and decided to build my own CZ-457 system. Bought a regular 457 just for the action - ordered me a Lilja 22" barrel - dropped that into a KRG Bravo chassis and topped it with a Nightforce 15-55 Competition - My normal range is only 50-100 yards I'll shoot 3rd groups. I'll play with a mix of ammo Eley Match - Norma Match - SK Rifle Match - Those particular ammo give me some real consistency - // Keep up the good work!!

[@GummeeH3]

Having listened to Cortina's podcast with Krieger, barrel blanks aren't all the same and have different compositions within barrels.. Made for interesting listening. My stock Varmint isn't what's holding me back from winning matches so I'll keep shooting it till it is. ...as tempting as it is to buy a bit of accuracy

[@gregorygardner1719]

Something else you don’t hear about or get with most pre fit barrels. Rimfire barrel chambers have to be approached in a much different manner than a centerfire chamber. Rimfire barrels must be slugged. The chambers must be polished and bullet jam must be set properly. Headspace is another really important topic. Depending on the desired ammo choice this can vary. Button rifled barrels must be taper lapped or should be. You must know where that lapping begins and ends. Cut rifled barrels can be really good but they must be perfectly demential from chamber to crown. Pins and slugs are the gunsmiths only way to know. Another really important step is to clock the muzzle runout. I’ve often wondered how most prefit suppliers accomplish this? If the thread starts in the same place from action to action it would be simple to achieve. However after chambering many many rimfire barrels I know this isn’t the case with every manufacturer. You must be patient with a rimfire chamber to get the most out of the barrel. Not everyone agrees. I can assure you this to be a fact. Gotta love the craft and a good mentor is a must!!! I sure love the craft! Lee Gardner Precision.

[@EagleEyeShooting]

I concur with everything said here. Valuable insight into this craft from expirence

[@wowguy3562]

I think the biggest savings is in ammo. I shoot 3.50 a box thru my Vudoo vs the premium 20+ dollar stuff. Also consider centerfire at 1-2 dollars a round. Thats my main appeal for 22lr. You are left to spend money on optics and barrels and premium rifles, the actual cost, if you shoot a lot, is the ammo. If you shoot less than 500-1000 rounds a year, it may not be worth it, unless you just want the best, at that time. Better stuff comes out all the time. I agree with your points brother. Edit- shooting 9k round of premium ammo would have cost me 3.6k, the same amount of cheap stuff 600 bucks, the ammo savings in one year bought my Vudoo rifle. Best investment in my opinion is some surveyors tape, if you read the wind correctly, you will hit your targets much more

[@levihale3267]

I LOVED this format. I learned a ton and it was entertaining the whole time

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

Glad to hear it, thanks

[@Whispertactical]

I ordered the 26in x 1.000 Lilja barrel…when I spoke to her she asked me what I was putting it on and I told her I was conflicted because I have 2 cz457s but one of them with SK match will put up 0.3in groups at 50 yards all day and stay around .75in at 100 yards with the right ammo…I told her the best group I had ever shot I couldn’t even measure it because 4 rounds went thru the same hole at 50 and then the 5th round barely broke the hole and it was gonna be such a small group no one would have believed me so I just talk about it to people I know that belive me lol…she told me that I should not put their barrel on that gun because sometimes you get that 1/1000 off the line that just runs and you can’t make it shoot better than the perfect tolerance stack from the factory…she talked to me for 45 minutes so I still ordered the barrel and I’m gonna slap together a custom build with it or just put it on my 457 jaguar

[@randomidiot8142]

The little group thing is a trap, monkey on a typewriter kind of thing. If you shoot enough you'll find those, but you'll also find those super wide groups. 1 little group doesn't mean much, and it sucks to have to dismiss those red herrings as flukes.

[@RetiredFE]

I agree pretty much with everything you said. I'm a serious plinker, if there is such a thing. I enjoy shooting KYL targets at 50-100 yards with my CZ 457 MTR. I also enjoy shooting steel at 200 yards. I'm about to turn 70 years old and will never shoot competition. But I really enjoy shooting. Thanks for your channel I really appreciate it. Was also wondering, I have a TriggerCam also. Could you tell me about your setup? Thanks. Appreciate it.

[@Tantrum791]

I shot my first PRS 22 match this past weekend and I asked guys about their optics they were using, the guys using more budget friendly optic all complained about depth perception. So when competing we were jumping from 150 to 175 for example in the same stage and they said it can get difficult to tell the target apart based on depth of view. The guys with higher priced optics did not have this issue.

[@carmeloerodriguez7570]

This is my opinion about rimfire precision shooting, “you are as good as your equipment”. I enjoy shooting 22lr, I do not compete with others just with myself, have been moving up on equipment gradually, started with a Ruger a Vortex and CCI SV, then moved to a Tikka T1x a Bergara B14, Vortex FFP, Norma, then moved to CZ 457 MTR, Athlon Chrono, SK Stand +, now I am at a CZ 457 MTR Chassis (24”), Athlon Chrono, Sk Match and every now and then Lapua Center X. Yes I haven been improving from state to stage, because my equipment have been improving, at this last stage I am very happy, doing very acceptable groups at 200 yards. Not sure if I will move to the next level, I still enjoy going back to the previous equipments or set ups, they are still a good challenge. Just tried to do what is call a CCI SV challenge at 50 yards with only CCI SV ammo with a Ruger, a Tikka and the Bergara, it was a lot of low expensive fun.

[@GaryKim-id1lv]

Glad to see this video Josh. I hope this means you and your family are OK and the storm didn't tear up your home or range.

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@@GaryKim-id1lv we are and thanks!

[@TroyBayham]

Excellent and well timed video. I have been researching for some time to find the right spot between $$$$$ and performance. I just can't quite determine if I should go with a CZ, Tikka, or Begara and upgrade components or just get a Vudoo to start with. Thank for taking the time to make this one. Always enjoy your vids.

[@bobburgess8143]

Great conversation. I would have liked more information on the barrel lengths and the twist rate of those barrels. Keep up the great work.

[@allenbuellrider7701]

But, but, there is this huge rabbit hole i fell into. I dont think it has a bottom.

[@charlesmckinley29]

It doesn’t turn back now if you can’t! You have been warned. Insert evil Vincent price laugh here.😎

[@cliveward7562]

Hi Josh. Some of the most sensible information on KZbin. I would just say that shooters waste their money on equipment if they are not willing to put in the effort to practice (or are not very good at their chosen discipline) to maximise the investment. Great video. From the UK.

[@tonytillman3953]

Josh, yet another great video. Keep up the good work!

[@wille3303]

Perfect way to explain barrels. It's why I'm trying to squeeze all the accuracy possible from my two factory rifles before I consider upgrading the barrels on them

[@BROTUNED]

Well done this video is great thanks for sharing your knowledge about this subject

[@beyondtwominutes]

Your advice is solid and backed by really world experience. From talking about ammo to scopes. You can get it done on a "budget" and be competitive but their will come a point where something about that budget rifle will be a limiting factor. My comp setup is currently an MPA Matrix Pro Rimfire. They use a vudoo 360 degree action. It's topped with an NF ATACR 7-35. I haven't owned a cz, tikka, rpr. Etc. I started out with a rimx before a lot of people were using them. Had a Leupold MK5 on it was limited with the parallax no going below 70ish yards. Great optic but didnt work the best for rimfire. My opinion has always been leave no doubt in the gear so I know when that miss is me. For me to achieve that in my mind is the cost is high. Doesn't necessarily mean that for the next guy. Though I have seen guys start out with rprs or 22s not cut out for precision. I'm not saying you can't get a solid shooting rpr are etc. But it's a hit and miss. Then they move to a cz or tikka. And it shoots more consistent. They in turn have more confidence. Another factory for me is balance. So many new shooters under rate balance. It's a big factor in being stable on barricades. Some factory rifles and staying in base class means you have to sacrifice balance. So I've never considered base class an option for me. But hey get out and have fun. Shoot what you want. Make no excuses. For me fun is hitting targets and making it look easy hopefully. 😂

[@thewildmanable]

I really enjoyed this and I think you were upfront about everything. The only thing I might’ve mentioned is the fact that Moto cam or Desert precision will send you a target with your barrel so you do know where you’re at.

[@mikemcallister9091]

Well I just got back from the range - shot my CZ 457 with Eley Team - Match- Tenex.. Hands down Team had stupid great groups. Cant explain but no BS I just did this too funny. I have even had Tac-22 shoot crazy good on occasion. I try not to be the guy who spent big money on golf clubs but still sucked at golf lol. Keeping my 457 stock for now as I am still learning and focus on fundamentals. Great video Josh it heled me a ton. I am working towards competing lol

[@bart_maliszewski]

You mentioned about everything! Good video. I'm glad you said about what you can get and what not... It is all about just this particular piece of equipment.

[@Omi-7k]

Appreciate you brotha. Love to listen in and be a sponge of your knowledge.

[@crossedrifles6005]

Best video yet for me. Just getting into this world, lots of good info that made sense.

[@stevewahner4591]

Well said and explained!

[@Silasssssssss]

Hey man, Anschutz has recently released a line of rifles called the 'APR' line which are PRS focused rifles. Are you going to do a review on these?

[@fredshebester-wg4vb]

Very informative! Always enjoy watching you shoot

[@frankammirati3385]

I Just picked up a Ruger 10/22 Davison’s edition with a Ruger cold hammer forged stainless barrel , with the goal in mind to get out past 100 yards with no hold on accuracy and not break the bank , I achieved that with this rifle at 600 bucks out the door , my groups are tight enough at 100 yards for varmit control without giving me worries of flyers or over penetration from a high power cartridge .

[@danieldunham9978]

I would say he is spot on because the same transfers over to racing that last dollar is minimal gain.

[@oldguysrockon]

Great commentary. Your explanation should be easy enough to understand for everyone. This applies to every type of man made product also. Thanks.

[@wadesaunders583]

Nice topic...recently came to the conclusion of diminishing returns myself after spending quite a bit of money...on the cartridge side...center X works best for me..😢

[@wisco_guy]

I’m glad to see someone finally talking about the cost of performance and realistic expectations. I’m willing to pay for quality and performance, but more importantly, I’m paying for something that meets MY requirements within MY budget. I’m just plinking or hunting, so spending a lot of money for .1” more accuracy doesn’t make sense. My T1X UPR was expensive, but does everything I want without mods.

[@nelsonm5032]

Stocks are my question on diminishing returns. i want a new stock for my CZ 457. ive looked at the KRG Bravo, the MDT XRS and the new MDT Field Stock for the 457. here in canada the bravo and XRS are around 700.00 all said and done. the MDT field stock can be had for 400.00! just wish there was more reviews on the field stock... kinda new so i understand. but, thats my dilemma. Cheers josh, excellent video.

[@buckshotaaa]

Josh really nails these presentations (And his mate Chris). They're way up there. Regarding the diminishing returns, everyone has a different plateau when is comes to "bang for your buck". Here's mine, I just shoot interclub and in club comps at 25m, 50m and 100m and i have worked up to a Bergara B14R (steel barrel with a Timney 2 stage match trigger set at 8oz). I think the only thing that would improve my shooting is squeezing the trigger more frequently! My optic at the moment is an Optisan EVX 6-24x56i SFP which i bought nearly new off a mate of mine. My ammo of choice is SK Standard Plus, as i have tested most SK ammo and found the Standard Plus actually shoots equally as good (if not better than the more expensive SK offerings). It is super consistent in my barrel so i didn't bother experimenting any further. I have a Harris SLM bipod (bought 2nd hand) and as far as i'm concerned i don't need a more expensive package at the level i compete at. I guess i've got about £1500 in my set up all in and i am more than satisfied with it. I would like a FFP scope in the future but i'm not pulling my hair out for one. Anyway i'd be interested to hear of anyone's setup in a similar price bracket, (up to £2000). All the very best from the UK.

[@BillRogers-jh8pp]

Sounds to me like a great plan, and I'm right there with you! I had a MG-B for decades - one of their ad campaigns was "More Fun Per Gallon". An appropriate approach to many things!

[@sgtlt]

Really great information, especially the barrel info, for my needs I am going stick with the MTR barrel, thanks

[@ronmartblog]

I’ve noticed a lot of people don’t fully appreciate the huge difference between the 457 Varmint and 457 Varmint MTR - that MTR barrel is a totally different quality

[@jeffkalina7727]

Very helpful, thanks. Keep up the good work!

[@barelyoutdoors1817]

I haven't seen you in a while. You have come a long way. Excellent vid. I bought an MTR because of your channel. Arken EP5 testing ammo. Works well. Thanks for taking the time.

[@stephenanderson3700]

Great episode. My fac are all rimfire's and air, indoor 457 awesome. Outdoor an anschutz 54 with a match barrel, 50 yards stacked but 100yards I'm still Tring to find the right ammo. 11/4" best group so far. The more expensive ammo did no better than the mid range. Best so far sk standard plus.

[@joelclark2130]

Well spoken my friend. Expectations definitely are subjective .you will never know until you spend the money

[@jerrylocklear3959]

Hey Josh, it’s ok to say the word Burris. 😂. Those scopes are outstanding.

[@shelley131]

Would you ever consider using a longer barrel, for example like a 27 inch barrel like Remington used in their 513T Matchmaster rifles used for training? If not, could you please explain why? Thank you, enjoy your videos very much. BTW I use my Remington 513T with Redfield sight at 200 yards all time using shoot NC targets as my old eyes can see them at that distance . Your advice is very sound especially with the scopes. I use a Bushnell Forge I bought at 50% off on my Ruger 10/22 still more expensive than my Ruger but a ton of fun to shoot at 200 yards.

[@ScottWimmer]

The higher end rifles are indeed diminishing return, but they are so much fun to own and operate... And the joy it gives others when they have a good day & happen to beat you. "I beat so & so and he had a Vudoo!" Good clean fun

[@bfox87]

Well said, lots of good knowledge and costing me money damn rabbit hole😂

[@Ubirds22]

Always great content Josh. Keep it coming brother.

[@turtlex5994]

Would like this barrel but find CZ 457 with factory barrel, MPA chassis and YoDave trigger with Eley Tenex can hold its own or better against Vudoos, Lilja barrels etc in the 50 meter benchrest match.

[@nelsonm5032]

i hear you. my MTR barrel is very good! i won the barrel lottery on this one. a lilja would be nice but is it worth it when you have a great shooting factory barrel...

[@keithruf-nu3gs]

I would suggest when getting a new custom barrel check twist rate if it's supposed to be a 16 t it should be exactly that. Great topic love the content

[@jeffreypelletier7247]

I think what your purpose is plays a big part.. I have the CZ VPT with the 16.5” barrel an bought a 23” lilja well the lilja definitely out shoots the factory out to about 150 yards but shooting Long gong at 300 is what I primarily do well the factory barrel for some reason definitely outperforms the lilja idk why.. I have a few theories but not certain

[@David-mz3or]

Kenyon triggers were big for the Winchester 52. Some of the bigger ammo jobbers would allow you to buy a box or 2 out of every lot they had on hand. When you found the lot you purchased 10,000 rounds. Ah the good old days. Unertl and Weaver T scopes ruled.

[@TexasTrained]

You're right about the CZ457 being as one as one needs.Ive it abd I justcwanted to build a Custom and I did.My custom shoots a little better. It's a Stiller 2500XR with a Lilja 3 Groove 27.5 inch barrel in a Manners TCS stock with Arca Rail and Brass weights and a Delta Stryker 5-50x56 in MOA. I had a Zeiss S5 in MIL. it's a real strait shooter. With the right ammo I believe I can win a match with them.At thus point it call comes down to Environmental Conditions and Shooter Skill and tge right ammo.

[@TreRichie]

Great information, I’m brand new to the precision world and I learn a lot from what you share, look to being able to speak to you at some point

[@tahohemafarm8901]

Josh, why are you leaving out Bergara? You talked CZ/Tikka then jumped to Vudoo/RimX.

[@erikvan357]

Great point, I'm currently debating a T1X / 457 + chassis or going with the B-14R & shooting it as is. Both options will cost $1500 + tax (Canada), and while this video made alot of excellent points I am no closer to my desicion! Regardless, thank you

[@LHB33]

As always great review!!! 👍

[@jimblackbird5678]

I agree! I’m shooting a CZ 457 Varmint 20.5” factory gun. An Athlon 6-24 ffp and federal bulk ammo. I shoot a KYL target at 25 or 50 yards. I’m as happy as can be. I’ve shot SK and Wolf ammo and shoot better because of the ammo but why? Either way, I’m having fun.

[@elendal]

Looking forward to 7-35x DNT/ Arken scope review.

[@badxrine]

Great job. Very informative.

[@chrislang5659]

At least you're being honest! I personally know it's not always about how much you can spend as to what you get. Sometimes, luck comes into play. My advice is always, make sure you are as good as you can be before spending a ton of money. Cash can not buy experience! Or happiness!😅

[@timnowak7749]

Hey Josh We have noticed Eley match Tenex have random rounds consistently 30 fps slow through different rifles. Out of 12 different lots just this week 10 lots were terrible with random slow round. We check groups at 200 at same time sd and es numbers Two lots were at 5.7 sd es 14 and group well at 200. Beginning of spring I bought 8 lots found two lots that were good unfortunately a case of ammo doesn’t last all season . Have you noticed match ammo quality is declining?

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

I haven't actually lot tested in months so I haven't seen anything like that myself. I do need to get back on it though

[@ebikes2xs159]

Most people don't take 22's seriously, their loss. My requirement is a mobile rifle that I can bench shoot and take into the field. I'm loving my stock Tikka T1x in a Boyds At One stock. It shoots great and looks beautiful for not a lot of money. I still find it fascinating taking things to the limit and some of those things apply to any rifle.

[@mlone7]

When it comes to scopes I have tried different high dollar scopes on friends rifles. I have to go from mine to the other to actually see the difference in glass quality which is minute. You remarked about seeing the bullet. I dont have the best eyesight but I can see the bullet through my Arken ELP4 consistently and it doesnt matter what color of the bullet. I like the Arken and have 4 of them but I also have 3 of the Athlon Ares ETR's and I just ordered a Match Pro to try. I dont look at saying I have a 3 or 4000 dollar scope as much as I look at what I need to get the job done. I dont compete but I also dont think that thought would change, if I did. I started with Ruger RPRR with a Shaw barrel. I wasnt on it for long before I realized CZ is way better. The Ruger would be a good squirrel getter, being light, and reasonably accurate but I wouldnt look at it for competition if I was in to that. I'm building a 457 that will have a 26" L x 1"D Hart match barrel on it. Im waiting on a PDC custom chassis for it. I have a 455 with a 24"x1" Hart match barrel in an Oryx chassis that shoots lights out and doesnt seem to be ammo picky. Even though that chassis is not state of the art it does what I want it to do and the total rig is awesome. Its fun to stack rounds in one hole but if I were to evaluate "cost" and what is the most draining playing with this stuff, its ammo. When you get your guns right where you want them, you are done. Ammo is never ending and can run into thousands of dollars. As far as Vudoo or RimX or any of those high dollar guns, they are great guns and I dont take anything away from them but I have seen too many competitors, with high dollar guns, get their lunches eaten by a CZ. Lets face it, there is a lot to be said for talent pulling the trigger that cant afford those high dollar rigs. Sorry for the long wind but in my opinion everyone needs to evaluate their goal and money and practice more on sharpening their skills than who owns the most expensive rigs.

[@edwardsimeral9432]

Hey Josh great video again! Any idea on when your merch might be shipping out? Thanks again for all you do.

[@davesharp6965]

One thing that you don't talk about when using different brands of ammo ,is the grease on the bullets and how it takes about 10 shots to stabilize the barrel .I find a different point of aim with the different grease that the different companies use .just my 2 cents

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

That's a very real situation but ive also seen it impact all my barrels differently. Some need 10, some 2.

[@ClintFawson]

Talking about consistency, I knew a competition shooter several years ago that would only shoot cheap bulk ammo. He would simply weigh each and every single loaded bullet and sort them by weight. I was struck by his logic, but to my surprise, It worked well for him.

[@jwschroeder804]

PDR is how I got into the sport $, had to. You are right-on. A little more for the scope bumped me out of base class but a treat for older eyes. 🤓 YoDave kit a yes, but custom barrel not so much, more Xs not higher scores and less forgiving with ammo. Now the question…. I know where you stand on Boyd’s stock, but do you think a $ chassis will improve scores over a AtOne? Had to ask. 😊

[@DannJernigan]

Love your content thanks for all you do. What are your thoughts about using a magazine vs a single shot adapter for bench rest shooting where I do not have a requirement for quick follow ups. I have the CZ 457 MTR and I have gone back and forth and this question fits well with your theme today. Thank you!

[@John-uo1qf]

For NRL22 my choice to upgrade the barrel had more to do with balance than barrel performance

[@KevWilOG]

Great video! The return of common sense!

[@josephdantonio5245]

You've talked a lot of benchrest, sand bag, and bipod type shooting. I'm a competitive shilouette shooter, all my shooting is offhand. What information would you pass along in gun, technique, and equipment?

[@David12005]

Great channel. Thank you.

[@michaelthrelkeld212]

Do you think you can competitively compete in PRS with a 457? May customize it some

[@ericrumpel3105]

.....for what its worth, lot of guys I have asked said yes, that said, I shoot one, but, if i had to do over I personally would go Anschutz, which most would disagree with, but then, a guy is only left with RimX or Voodoo, & they are just not for me, & I am not meaning anything degrading by that, just not for me is all.....if that helps at all, hopefully Josh will chime in.......

[@EagleEyeShooting]

I personally think the CZ457 is top choice, the reliability is unmatched compared to current custom actions. Something much needed to compete at top level. Anchutz are nothing but a glorified CZ457. They also do not like custom shops modifying their priducts as their ego believes they make the best 22lr.... Having currently set records at both Lapua Test centers, a CZ457 (threaded custom builds) hold the 100 meter record.

[@michaelthrelkeld212]

@@EagleEyeShooting nice. Thanks man. Love your content too brother.

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@@michaelthrelkeld212 my custom 457 will shoot with any of my rifles. It's a very potent little rifle that can do anything you need it to with the right parts.

[@michaelthrelkeld212]

@@PursuitofAccuracy thanks man! Love your content. Just wish they would make that particular 457 more available.

[@krumple8560]

Good advice Josh. As a casual shooter that sometimes participates in club matches I can't bring myself to spend the $$$ necessary to squeeze that last little bit of performance out of my equipment. Some of the guys I shoot against have a ton of $$$ tied up in their rifles and that makes a difference in the match scores. I think its called "Pay to Win".

[@michaell397]

Sounds like what drag racing has become.

[@jonleone777]

I to cant bring myself to spend that kind of cash on a 22. A good deal of the time its the shooter and ammo. One day at our club i was shooting next to a guy with a voodoo and nightforce scope. If i had to guess this guy had about 4-5 grand in this gun. He was a little pissed when i out shot him with my 10/22 in a Hogue stock with a kidd ultralight barrel and kidd trigger. I had about 500-600 bucks in this gun including the scope. I think it boils down to the shooter and testing ammo,as well as a lot of practice.

[@mmgee]

Nothing more disappointing than spending $200 for a brick of ammo and it doesn’t like your gun 😢

[@ssniadach012]

Thanks for great info as always, a sincere question is how long ( how many rounds should a factory barrel from Savage last ) Mark 2 , Just getting into rimfire and having a blast .Thanks , also have it paired with a Discovery opt HD Gen2 5-30-56 SFIR, Getting great results and want to burn out this barrel before i invest in my next rifle, Going to use this one and keep gaining knowledge , THanks

[@Videos-mk6we]

Just subscribed What scopes would you recommend for 457 MTR 50 yard Benchrest Love your videos Thanks

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@@Videos-mk6we for benchrest i dont have a lot of experience. But you want to be looking at second focal plane with a good amount of magnification and 1/8” clicks

[@Videos-mk6we]

@ Thanks for the quick reply!! So far that’s about as far as I’ve gotten I’m a Leupold guy and most of their Thanks for the quick reply!

[@bep357]

I would love it if you could review a Fletcher rifle the non take down. I’d like to get one just for cleaning ease but no one has done an accuracy test on it in the beyer barrel. Have you shot it? Otherwise I’m probably going to get a super grade Kidd.

[@KC-dx5pf]

Sounds like you’re breaking the sound barrier. How does your ammo handle that as compared to keeping it sub transonic? Airgun competition guy here, I guess I’m just used to staying under 1050 or so even with slugs. What’s your velocity at down range? Does going back through on deceleration give stability issues?

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@@KC-dx5pf the ammo im shooting there is sub sonic. Most match ammo will be subsonic to avoid transinic transition but ive shot some supersonic ammo and it doesnt seem to be a huge deal either.

[@ron8566]

Josh - Great video. I only compete with my 22 a couple of times a year. For the past several years I have been practicing, training and competing at 50 yards. Now, my next competition will be at 100 yards. I’m using a Tika T1X with a Sightron 34x42 fixed power scope. What should I focus on to gear up for the November competition at 100 yards since I have never practiced or trained at anything over 50 yards? Many thanks.

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@@ron8566 reading wind

[@dalepogue5799]

My gun likes Wolf Match Extra or Aguila Rifle Match Competition. Grate video just subbed

[@SVTBansheeman]

What are your thoughts for someone who only shoot cheap bulk ammo? Would a basic ruger 10/22 be ok? 200 yards max. Usually 100 yards and below. A folding stock may be needed to fit in my short safe but I could always aquire that after. Just backyard steel plates and small four legged critters like armadillo up to coyotes to give you an idea on target size.

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@@SVTBansheeman depends on what your expecting accuracy wise

[@SVTBansheeman]

​@@PursuitofAccuracyOK not sure what the 10/22 is capable of nor the Tikka. No one really talks about bulk ammo only accuracy. I do accept I will not be consistent either way with the hulk ammo.

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@ if your just plinking on larger steel out to 200 youd be totally fine. You start wanting to consistently hit 2 moa targets i dont think the 10/22 and bulk ammo would get ya there

[@SVTBansheeman]

​@@PursuitofAccuracythank you for your time. Sounds like I will keep it cheaper and closer in range 👍

[@idahoron]

I would have liked to see your opinion on triggers

[@hjets5387]

Gee, if you need a home for those bad kreiger barrels give me a shout. great video today.

[@jjjerbear777]

Josh .. any suggestions for a precision barrel for a ruger takedown 10/22 ?

[@charlesmckinley29]

Are there many options outside of Volguartsen and Tactical Solutions for the Take Down model? From seeing them on the line at Appleseeds the big thing to watch for is keeping the take down nut tight. I would like to hear what you decide on and how much it improves the accuracy of the rifle.

[@gilbertl9513]

One vote for a Live on this Josh. Also, hope all is well for y’all up there. This hurricane has been pretty devastating. Prayers to those suffering 🙏

[@PursuitofAccuracy]

@@gilbertl9513 this Sunday at 9pm est

[@pevelyhomeowner327]

Great stuff, thank you!

[@chfire2004]

This reminds me of when I played paintball 25 years ago, a 90 dollar barrel on a 150 dollar spyder marker got 90 percent of the performance of the 600-1000 dollar guns.