Predator 212 Stock Muffler VS Disc Muffler VS Robertson's Torque Tube VS Side Header

[@SendItJonBoats]

Great video. Thanks for taking the time to put that together. I loved my old 212 with the torque tube, always sounded awesome.

[@MudMotorsMax]

I really appreciate that I’m trying to do better with quality and so more tests to come

[@hillwooky]

I think that the fact that the engine is inside the garage would make it appear more loud to the decibel meter because it is also "hearing" the sound that is reflected from the walls. If the motor were outside and not near a big hard surface, I think the motor would seam more quiet.

[@MudMotorsMax]

You are correct I just could not test it outside because it was crappy weather but yeah it is a bit quieter outside not so many sounds reflecting

[@modernmountaineer]

I wish I left the stock muffler on mine lol. I robbed the flange off it to make an exhaust with a little threaded farm equiptment muffler

[@clayton203]

The best video I have ever seen on sound difference, on these type engines thanks man

[@MudMotorsMax]

I’ve got more coming just timing bro

[@clayton203]

@@MudMotorsMax your getting a ton of views from this as well👍🏻

[@MudMotorsMax]

Yes but I can’t get traction like that anymore it seems like I don’t know what’s happened

[@clayton203]

@@MudMotorsMax just a little lull, No worries

[@MudMotorsMax]

@@clayton203 It’ll be good

[@billyhighfill]

Awesome. Thanks for sharing 👍👍

[@donduck6195]

Very beneficial video for me. I thought the Robertson tube might be an annoyance on my gx390 13hp but it doesn't seem much louder than stock. Deeper grumble as well. I was going to keep it stocked just because I didn't want it loud but it looks like I'm going to need an intake and new Jets as well. Thanks for the video

[@MudMotorsMax]

I was hoping it was going to help people. That Robertson torque tube night and day difference for you guaranteed! You will wonder why U hadn’t had it the whole time. The low and mid range torque it gives you is just incredible!!!

[@MudMotorsMax]

Just add a disc Muffler on the end And it will be plenty quiet while giving you great torque

[@donduck6195]

@@MudMotorsMax ok. Thanks for the quick response. My long tail is being delivered today and last night I was able to get the pump separated from the engine on the pressure washer it's been attached to for 10 years. It was Bob brand new a decade ago and probably only has about 10 hours of run time on the GX390. It's free to me so I figured I would hop it up a little bit but trying to keep it reliable. Probably just an intake/exust/ Jet. Might remove the governor but we'll see

[@MudMotorsMax]

@@donduck6195 heck yeah never let a good engine go to waste especially with the uncertainty of the future… we may have to be using rivers again for our transportation like the old times when roads were non existent. These long tails would be perfectly suited for an uncertain future

[@donduck6195]

@@MudMotorsMax it's definitely going to turn some heads up where I'm at in Ohio. I spend a lot of time on a lot of different little rivers and lakes and I have never one time seen anybody with anything other than a standard outboard. Everybody gets on the river and then floats down to fish because there are too many trees and shallow areas between 8 in - 1 ft that will tear an outboard right off of your transom. Even in my canoe with a little 2.5 Suzuki the river was too shallow. I can't wait to see the look on people's faces when I blast by them going up River to places probably never fished before.

[@koljag5]

Exactly what I needed, thank you.

[@MudMotorsMax]

More to come!

[@clayton203]

My top choice would b the torque tube with either 4 or 6 discs,,sounds good and not to loud

[@MudMotorsMax]

I’m there with you 100%

[@alvinjayv5829]

awesome best video I've seen on comparison. where can I get the stock muffler or a quiet muffler for my son's 212CC OHV go cart. sorry I'm new to this just want something quieter so neighbors don't complain. thank you!

[@MudMotorsMax]

You can order a stock muffler or you can go ahead with the disc muffler but I’ll tell you it’s gonna cost you about $200 you have to get the Robertsons torque tube the disc muffler and then the resonator to achieve what I have around $230

[@alvinjayv5829]

@@MudMotorsMax u happen to have any link to the stock muffler? thanks men really appreciate it 🤙

[@MudMotorsMax]

@@alvinjayv5829 Yeah I’ll find the link and post it to you… This will give you the quietest set up if that’s what you’re looking for

[@MudMotorsMax]

@@alvinjayv5829 www.amazon.com/Parts-Camp-Muffler-Exhaust-Assembly/dp/B06WVC6H5M/ref=asc_df_B06WVC6H5M/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=198068984819&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=15360201525272181461&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9021211&hvtargid=pla-349062348150&psc=1 Here you go! Make sure and buy some gaskets just type in predator 212 stock exhaust gaskets on Amazon

[@alvinjayv5829]

@@MudMotorsMax thanks brother I appreciate it very much

[@fatbuddycat]

Super cool review brother!

[@MudMotorsMax]

Well thanks man I appreciate it

[@justinherdman87]

what would you recommend for a clone-200' twister, with stage 2-3mods? For most power, and not too loud? p.s where did you get the disc' style muffler? thanks!

[@gonetoheck]

I was watching an episode of "North Woods Law" where the DNR officer fined an ATV rider $70 for having an exhaust that was louder than what the stock muffler would have been. I've been wanting an exhaust that's quieter than stock on my 196cc Coleman mini bike engine...have tried a few things, but haven't found anything quieter than stock. With upgraded engine parts, the local mechanics say that I'd be restricting the performance too much if I try to keep the stock muffler or try to attach a slip on motorcycle or scooter muffler. I don't mind loosing a few mph top end or in torque gittyup as long as I can go on night time rides and not make my neighbors jump out of their beds due to my noise. Just curious to see if you've tried anything that was quieter than stock ???

[@MudMotorsMax]

If you have the supertrapp original or clone disc Muffler with four disks and then get yourself a resonator it’s only 4 dB louder than the stock muffler but you have way more performance with a Robertsons torque tube, Pretty much all around at least in the Mud Motor realm. I’m almost sure you’ll get more performance because all that EPA crap that just chokes and subdues your engine… I also run a Tillotson PK1-B carburetor But it’s a little bit bigger engine I run the wildcat to 223cc now (70mm bore 58mm stroke) I love it best engine so far! Lots of torque and power! I find the if I just stick to a stage one performance upgrade (air filter, Robertson‘s Torque Tube Looped Header, Tillotson carburetor) I have good power torque and reliability. Great look, sounds great & is not that loud. I love that it no longer sounds like some sort of lawn more on my boat, it also doesn’t vibrate or get hot like like it did stock because it was choked it runs smooth.

[@hillwooky]

What would it sound like if you clamped the stock muffler onto the end of the Robertson's torque tube?

[@MudMotorsMax]

Would not make much of a difference unfortunately these engines have valves and so unless you can put some kind of enclosure around the engine it’s going to always be loud. After you put include her on the engine you would then have to figure out how to cool the engine

[@MudMotorsMax]

Not to mention all that extra wait unless you had a bunch of reinforcements you’re gonna snap off the weld

[@dustinjohnson2116]

Where do I get the loop

[@johnnelligan4847]

Hey I was hoping to pick your brain. I have a pred 212 that i want to put on my homemade vacuum/material collection system that i have on my tractor. The stock muffler sticks out on the shaft side about an inch which interferes with the blower cover. Most aftermarket exhausts do the the same. Do you think i could get one of those straight pipes (cheap one from amazon) heat it up, and bend it so its flush with the shaft side?

[@MudMotorsMax]

Give it a try man is all I can say. I guess I’m having a hard time picturing it

[@aminemansouri4903]

What is the advantage of the robertson compared to the stock ?

[@MudMotorsMax]

Really noticeable Gains and low in mid range Torque. Also excellent TopSpeed basically all around performance gains. it’s definitely my biggest recommendation for anybody

[@honeybadgeractual5734]

Im sorry to say man but I read your remark in the video about a predator (4 stroke) engine needing back pressure, and that's a common fallacy thats been passed on to many people from the days of old 2 stroke engines. The muffler/flame arrestor on these engines is purely for 2 reasons, to reduce noise output, and remove the chance that the engine produces an open flame from the exhaust port under throttle, load, or deceleration pop (extra fuel escaping exhaust and detonating, which isnwhy you hear that pop pop pop noise without the muffler) 2 strokes need back pressure for efficiency and functionality. Also the reason your engines running changes with the muffler is because the fuel and air flow changes with addition or removal of restrictions in the intake and exhaust. If you added a velocity stack to the intake and upped the jetting slightly richer, you could run no header all day without much issue except the block over heating a bit since there isn't anything to carry the flame away from the cooling fins, so hot air runs over hot parts. If you want to make the e gine quieter you'll want a few things, the longest pipe you can achieve with a wider diameter, and a couple more sections with "disc supressor" or flat baffle mufflers that allow the exhaust gas to flow as freely as a stock exhaust or slightly better, but will create a lot of turbulence and absorb harmonic vibrations. Thats why road cars have exhausts that go the length of the underside of the vehicle, and also why most motorcycles also pipe the exhaust as far as they can away from the engine. Also a catalytic converter from a dirt bike exhaust situated just after the header will help eliminate emissions and deceleration popping.

[@honeybadgeractual5734]

Im still gonna like the video, though I disagree with the statement about backpressure.

[@honeybadgeractual5734]

Side side note, restraining the exhaust with vibration absorbing mounts will also help significantly with the noise output.

[@MudMotorsMax]

I have to say trust me just blowing the exhaust out of an open pipe does make you lose torque and power I have videos to prove it I’ve been doing this for a long time I appreciate the comment but trust me water is 800 times more dense than air and as soon as you put on the store tube you have much more torque and power I went from pushing 500 pounds up forever struggling to pushing 800 pounds of river what’s the torque tube was not nearly as much throttle I’m telling you there truly is a difference

[@OoheavysackoO]

Correct. Backpressure is never a good thing on a 4 stroke. The goal is to find out exhaust pulse width and make a tube of the right length and diameter that correctly scavenges the exhaust. AKA long tube headers on cars might not make a lot more HP but the TQ curve through the RPM range goes up a ton.

[@OoheavysackoO]

@@MudMotorsMax First off love the video and the data is greatly appreciated. I would like to say that I think you have backpressure mixed up with exhaust scavenging. Yeah you pull the exhaust completely off of any car or most any 4 stroke it's gonna run like crap. That's because the flow of the air out of the exhaust creates a vacuum to help pull the burnt fuel/air mixture out of the cylinder. These go in pulses, the trick everyone wants to learn is pulse length and optimal width for their exhaust. Lots of R&D in this, F1 is a great example.

[@cliffordc9497]

Hey man quick question, what's the pipe diameter of the loop exhaust?

[@MudMotorsMax]

I’m going to have to look that up

[@cliffordc9497]

Thanks man! After watch a bunch of your videos I'm doing the same with a mud motor and a canoe. But fund are running low, so I'm going to make my own exhaust and disk muffler.

[@MudMotorsMax]

@@cliffordc9497 Oh yeah there’s definitely some improvements look up Resonators I was figuring if there was some sort of steel wool inside of the Resonator but it would help as well. Let me get back to you though I’m at work

[@MudMotorsMax]

@@cliffordc9497 I’m going to have to call the guy at Robertsons I can’t find out the diameter

[@cliffordc9497]

@@MudMotorsMax no worries man. I'm planning on using 1" emt conduit and for the resonator lol... I'm going to drill a lot of ⅛" holes into the end of the conduit. Then a soup can welded onto the conduit exhaust and a mixture of fiberglass insulation the stuff packed into boilers and steel wool. Then to top it off hahahaha I've been looking into disk mufflers and diskes lookes again like soup cans but the cheap ones with rounded bottoms not the crimped ones. Then a ¼" bolt to keep it all together

[@foot8sativa]

Where did you get the disc muffle setup from? cheers

[@MudMotorsMax]

I’ll provide a link let me update it. Dusk muffler from Robertsons torque tube. But then I had to buy a resonator from supertrapp

[@bbailey7821able]

You shouldn't need more than 3, at most, disc's, for that displacement engine. I run these on several vehicles, including my mud boat. With my homemade long exhaust and a 4 disk/resonator setup like yours, it's about as good as it gets for performance with minimal noise on a boat. Thanks for the video, good job!

[@MudMotorsMax]

@@bbailey7821able Thank you yeah I will try at three do you know it really bums me out they quit making the resonator

[@knowledge15king]

Welll done!