Props-In (Standard) vs. Props-Out (Reversed) | WHICH IS BETTER?

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Props-In (standard direction) vs. Props-Out (reversed direction). Which is better? It might surprise you to learn that there definitely is an answer.

[@AndyRCchannel]

something that no one ever talks about is that grass is almost always wet where I come from or you can be flying and it can start to rain. props out throws the water into the usb port to the point where iv had an FC die using props out. id rather a smudge on the lens than a dead FC. conformal coat a usb connector wont work... just sayin. Props in for the win.

[@walterunt]

There are some USB covers you can use. Look for them on ebay and aliexpress. I use the piece of a magnetic micro USB cable.

[@jamesordwayultralightpilot]

Gorillatape to the rescue!!!

[@afrog2666]

Waterproofing son! ;)

[@AmpHibious]

i wish companies would supply USB cover plugs in FC packaging. if you ever bought a computer graphics card they usually ship with similar plastic plugs for HDMI ports.

[@AndyRCchannel]

@@afrog2666 waterproof a USB port?

[@daemn42]

It's not just about "bouncing off", but I find I can fly "through" stuff (bushes and small tree branches) that used to take me down.

[@ChristopherPunton]

Agreed!

[@Baba-yz3kp]

I prefer dirty lens on turtle mode than dirty lens mid flight.

[@1kleineMax1]

Yeah that is the big thing. When i need to turtle i oft even want to chek if everything is fine, so i fly back to me and can clean the lens when i want. I run revers direction a while now ony my 5'' and yeah i felt that i can catch the quad easier on dives...maybe... but what sold me was the scragle avoidence. Its like magic! You fly close to a tree and didnt see a little twick: With standard rotation... you were often grounded, but with reversed rotation the quad just shakes a little bit and you keep flying. Tommy (ummagawd) did a great video about the aerodynamics, that ade me switch.

[@SilkyWayFPV]

So true

[@jimpratt9520]

Joshua, this donation does not even come CLOSE to what it should be for all I have learned from your videos. The BetaFlight series alone was worth a bundle! Thanks for all you do.

[@jasons7044]

I put on my props on backwards and just take off with the quad upside down🤯

[@WilkieaSt]

then turn controller upside down and it all evens out

[@fullthrottlefpv5616]

@@WilkieaSt No way, I actually do that. Lol

[@WilkieaSt]

@@fullthrottlefpv5616 hahaa

[@hanzalapatel703]

@@WilkieaSt infact that is how I fly my quad

[@ziontsui9656]

Have you solved this problem?

[@TokeyFPV]

I could never pin point what the performance difference was but, since doing it some time ago I always felt my quads flew better with them reversed on 5". I guess you basically just explained why. There's definitely a difference to the feel on how it flies to me and I always wondered why now I know. The benefit of bouncing off scraggle was my number one reason for doing it and it has saved me from a ton of potential walks of shame when turtle mode isn't an option and i have noticed minimal to no issues with stuff being throw into my stack. Thanks for the explanation.

[@MagicFPV]

Such a good video. After nearly 4 years in the hobby this finally makes sense 👍

[@PaneInTheGlass]

YO Props out for life! lmfao. I've been running props out on 5 inch for a while now. I remember when I 1st switched I felt a difference. I haven't change back since then.

[@davidtilvikas8883]

HardTimeZFpv yes same

[@AdrianoCasemiro]

@@davidtilvikas8883 Does it change anything in tuning?

[@davidtilvikas8883]

Adriano Casemiro nope

[@davidtilvikas8883]

Adriano Casemiro well you can change the P for yaw for your liking

[@reboot110]

Same

[@shelterfpv6761]

I've been running props out since winter. I got sick of my cam fill up with snow every time I went to take off. So the advantage of props in is you can be lazy... lol. Another great video, much love JB.

[@larrydelceg2406]

I'be been waiting for you to address this topic for a long time. Thank you Joshua! The detailed info was insightful!

[@jukkaismi]

great info as always!! thank you Josh!!! your channel is really really reeeeeally helpful!!!!

[@jlarson42]

I run reversed props on my micros because they feel better flying to me. I just finished my 5 inch build, it's standard rotation right now. Once I get used to it I may try reversed see how it feels. I like the idea of it bouncing off of scraggle vs grabbing it. Thanks for the information. 👍🤓

[@sigvaldithor]

Props out all the way. Flying in the rain without the lens filling up. When you fly in the rain the part that throws the most water on the lens is when you arm the quad. I always had to clean my props before arming. After reversing them i can just fly. So what if you get water on the lens after using turtle mode? If you just crashed you have to inspect thre quad anyway and maybe even replace a prop.

[@davidjimenez1595]

I’m real new to the drone hobby and I’ve learnt a lot from your videos. Thanks man. I’ll be referring to these when I look at builds and reversing my whoop

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Welcome to the hobby!

[@mathieuf.2788]

I really liked this video, the reasons and advantages to either direction was good but what I found most interesting was the impact on micros. Thank you!

[@schnizzzla5407]

Running props out on a 5" since months. I didn't notice any difference in flight and I didn't think about the dirt in turtle mode and by then the lens is usually dirty already. I noticed though I get less often stuck in trees and can mow the lawn :) both of which happen more often than using turtle mode... Also when it's really necessary to fly on a rainy day ;) rain drops on the props when lifting off are not thrown on the lens.

[@fpvskyfall]

hey from portugal ty for all the help ,you the best ty,keep up the good work

[@IanBeaty]

I have been running props out on all my quads since beginning 2017 when I first started hearing people talk about it around the time when the first 2 inch quads started showing up. I mostly fly 3", 2.5", 2", and 1,5" so I have felt that props out really benefits what I fly, but I also did it to help with bouncing off of things like you mentioned. Great video - now I can refer people to it too! Thanks!

[@FPVGeedee]

You rock the word,i just had thé benefit of in one of my last vids🤣🤣

[@cpfpv6410]

VERY interesting info here!! I always keep 3" quads around too and I might switch everything 3" and below after seeing this. ...and then decide later about 5"

[@MaxBeamer]

Lookin crispy Bardwell ☀️ ✌️

[@Chretze]

4:36 with props in it's gonna be the rear outer motor maxing out, with props out it's gonna be the front outer motor in the exact same way. Your quad doesn't suddenly weigh less because your props spin the opposite direction, the only difference is which one of the motors on the quad is doing how much of the total work. In the case of props out it's the front outer motor pushing the most air, with props in it's the rear outer motor. Haven't experimented with the difference, but if props out gives you better cornering authority in small quads, consider that it's more about which motor is generating the most force instead of a limitation of one of them maxing out.

[@xymaryai8283]

yeah, i found this strange, there is no authority increase, because the force still has to add up, it just shifts which motor is maxing out. Props out might give you better pitch forward authority, but that's basically it, in a full tilt scenario (which is ridiculous, no one could handle that acceleration) for props out turn, the front inner motor is idling, while the front outer is maxed trying to yaw and roll, but it's balanced by the fact the rear 2 motors have another half range of authority, theoretically equal to the full range the front inner motor does (but can't use). it's literally the same as props in, just shuffled around. you don't gain any authority, but your pitch authority does change. you can pitch back more with props in, and you can pitch forward more props out. it's ridiculous to use that argument though, because no one is going full tilt in all 3 axes. you could argue that the PID would use it (stop holding the quad in autolevel), or underpowered motors, either way it doesn't increase authority, just changes which direction you can still pitch in a full tilt turn.

[@Vousie]

@@xymaryai8283 I feel the same about this idea about back motor maxing out... But still - lots of people say whoops (which are already much lower-powered) often have that wash-out issue, and that props out fixes it so I'm still confused over why that is.

[@p0ursp0rt50]

Props out because I am always bumping into stuff. 🤪

[@Steven2063]

I did props out a a week ago on my Ldarc 115 v2, I can sure tell the diff in corners, flies much better, Great videos, i have learned alot from your videos Thanks

[@dustysmith826]

thank you for all your work to help i love to gain knowledge and through you is how I'v learnt on a tyro 99 from eachine the diy kit and I'm currently buying pieces one at at time for my own custom build I'm currently saving to replace the stack i wrecked and destroyed damn its killing me not being able to take to the sky being unemployed on the hunt for a job is holding me back here and there my fingers are crossed that things change for the better asap lol but I'm slightly self employed for now til things do get better so I'v been spending a lot more time gaining knowledge from your content on things I'm still learning so thank you bro!! It has gave me a big leap from my newbie position to surpass the path of the amateur in a more timely fashion but I am one of the dudes that run props out and i am mostly just a freestyle pilot some of it is laziness like you said the reason why is because the first quad i bought was the 85 mm mantis rtf kit and that is why i originally started running props out, so much love and support to you and the rotor riot crew. -Dusty Hexx

[@haroldseaman4243]

Thanks for the videos!!! I'm a noob and it's been so fun learning to fly FPV. I started out with a DJI P4P and quickly discovered FPV while watching videos for camera drones. Im learning with the Emax Tinyhwak freestyle 2 RTF kit. Unfortunately I crashed and had to buy a replacement Tinyhwak bnf and just watched your video on prop installation Thanks you!!!

[@federicosagun4615]

Thanks for the enlightenment JB

[@frasersteen]

Props out! people who run props in are basically just evil puppy killers. #facts

[@PaneInTheGlass]

😂😂😂 so true!

[@eaanon01]

Haha

[@OldYellertoo]

Good thing I only kill kittens...

[@theflyinggreek6329]

Perfect timing. My new 6" I am setting up as a camera rig and found that it is just a little smoother with props out.

[@ryaneickmeyer6191]

Joshua, in regards to props in/out when possibly flinging debris into your camera. I would argue that you are only on the ground for two reasons, during a crash(uncontrolled decent) and during a landing(controlled decent). So, doing quick numbers, lets say you crash a lot...50% of the time you touch the ground it's because of a crash and the other 50% of the time you are landing controlled. When you land controlled, you land upside up. When you crash you can be upside down AND upside up. The times that you are on the ground and upside up you may also be flinging debris into your camera. If we assume you have a 50-50 chance of crashing upside-up and up-side down then you are upside up roughly 75% of the time that you are on the ground. So it may be better to use props out...if we use my simple numbers, you crash a lot and you don't use a landing pad. Love your videos! Keep being awesome!

[@EderNucci]

Thanks for this awesome explanation!

[@skippyfpvexperimentalrc6755]

Awesome video I always learn from every video

[@idohagin330]

man I just love to hear this voice of yours. might try to go to sleep with it tonight

[@Luke-zu4xg]

I did learn something ! Thank you

[@terminalpsychosis8022]

This man has a talent for describing stuff. Shaking his head around like Steevie wonder gives me vertigo, but he speaks clearly, so I can look away and still understand. Also, you need to just take 2 weeks vacation and set up a production line. ALL the quads must run props out (reverse? no, THAT is standard now.)

[@bobbin69]

Yay, new video!

[@runpuppyfpv5744]

Great content like always

[@inoc805]

Props out on my Hyperlow CG6. I noticed a big difference in tight proximity flying and split S maneuvers over tall obstacles. It feels like I can hug the apex of vertical obstacles a lot closer and still have control to either shoot the gap or bail out.

[@chrisshf]

I used to fly at a spot with a bit longer grass, so my lense often got dirty as soon as I armed the quad, thats why I changed all my quads to reversed props and I just sticked to it

[@imager09tube]

Thank you! Josh.

[@menne-fpv5128]

Thanks JB!

[@manski209]

Great lesson.

[@mr-jon]

Wow, I really did learn something today 🤣

[@StevenLemessurier]

I was just wondering this!

[@rickjames8897]

It definitely keeps me out of trees! IDK but turning feels tighter. I also have a pvc and pool noodle gate, I bounce off all the time

[@califpv]

Turning should feel more precise because in reverse rotation, your front motors are doing more work & the front air is cleaner. Props in, the rears are doing more work, but you have dirtier/more turbulent air that your catching from the front. Make sense?

[@Tavdog]

Very concise and informative.

[@jb-fpv7384]

I like props out on my race quad, it keeps me from getting stuck on the gate cloth. My freestyle is on reverse too, simply noticed a smooth HD video result when its very windy. Actually tested this in many flight recordings, my footage is cleaner. But Joshua, it would be fantastic for you to show all us a wind tunnel test. WOW!

[@kennkeck1963]

Thats amazing wow, nvr took that into cnsdration. You rock

[@BigAlFPV17]

I always run props in on all my quads. Even though grass & dirt will get onto the camera, it wont get into the USB port when you hook it up to Betaflight. Excellent video Joshua!!

[@fpvwing]

I got some dirt cheap silicone USB stoppers

[@kailin1462]

Haha just was setting up a new kwad and saw this! Thanks!

[@diabolicallydan]

Racing props out! Most people I race with have fins on the rear of the kwad to keep the rear props out of the grass... Thus most flipping done with rear props... Then when you re-arm lawn clippings will stay out of your lens. Love your videos JB... Hope you get a chance to fly up here in Canada soon!

[@StarLiteNL]

I changed prop rotation on my 5" ers because I kept breaking the same props. I had like 20 props that were all CW (or CCW, can't remember exactly). I changed prop direction on all my quads and slowly but surely I got through the backlog of those props. I now have a small surplus of the other props, so I will switch back to normal rotation in a month or 2 😉 I haven't noticed and performance benefits, but I did notice that my lens stays a lot cleaner while flying

[@Vousie]

Huh. I have a tiny toy quad (it's about 1/4 the size of a 65 mm whoop) which broke all the props of the one direction... Have no idea why this happens. Do you know?

[@Mediamarked]

@@Vousie Toy grade plastic props will do that too, had the original Hubsan x4, the props that came with it was part of a bad batch, popped apart at the hub, sometimes mid flight. If that tiny quad is the same as the Estes nano quad, that might be the case.

[@Vousie]

@@Mediamarked I just thought it really strange that only the one direction was breaking. If all of them were breaking a lot I'd think it's a bad batch, but it's just the one direction that was... Or do you think the two directions were separate batches?

[@KrotowX]

Props out for 2 years already in all my quads since I realized that it keep my camera lenses clean. Help to bump away from tree branches too - less chance to stuck between branches with props out. Converted even all my micros to have same settings everywhere. Only later realized that it help to handle micros better as well :)

[@marty3469]

I'm going to swap mine now that you said it works best for micro up to 3in , since that's the size range I mostly fly ... I've learned today, thanks JB 👍

[@madpoet]

Dude! Thanks for posting. As always well put together opinions, love how you finish with the how to, just in case. Personally I get little benefit from turtle mode, unlike your fields mine are mostly uncut. The grass is already too long now. Unfortunately the topper is down for repairs and we're giving the fields a rest from grazing. Turtle mode ends in a stuck green mess. (I still enable it to assist in getting out of trees.) I tend to fly sub 250 AUW, this season I am loving a UL 4". Props out!

[@MachineManGabb]

Hey hey, nice video Barwell

[@LO_FLI]

Props Out - You can fly straight through trees! (if ur lucky and don't squarely nail a branch). Also I used to get a lot of grass and water on my lenses, last season we were racing mostly at a farm with longer than average grass so any time I went a little too low on a split-S it would be green vision from there on. But also you don't have to hit the ground to cause stuff to hit your lens, clipping leaves or anything else like that would also smear the lens in green.

[@carlosfpv]

I've been running reversed props for a while now on all my setups. I think it makes the quad fly just a little better. But, if definitely makes the quad more stable if you hit something. There are just more advantages then disadvantages even though they are small. So why not it’s so simple to switch.

[@daslolo]

that's what i noticed, the quad just bounces off like nothing happened plus tight turns are easier

[@jasonwaits88]

Props out all day. I love that I bounce off trees more often than get stuck in them since switching over. That's reason enough for me.

[@FrequentFlyerRC]

Hey Josh, one thing I have found that maybe you can test is that in the small 2S Whoop class props out causes yaw washout and pitch back when doing deep dives! I noticed that the Mobula 7 comes props in and all the others come props out and all the others do yaw wash and pitch back on steep dives. So I switched my Beta75 Pro 2 and my Eachine Trashcan to props in and that eliminated both problems! 👌🏽

[@propsoff]

Man, you bring up some great points. My 3" (1206 motor) handles better props out, now I learned something 😉.. Me? Props-out for the low to the ground racers (3-5 inch). Props-in for my big long haul stuff like 7" (wind and dirt in the barometer ain't no good).

[@xymaryai8283]

Props in? nah Props out? nah Props off? apparently ^-^

[@J_46]

Thank you so much 💜💜💜💜

[@meltonenterprises6761]

Thank you good sir!

[@ofiasdfnosdf]

Since I’ve gone props-out I’ve had flights where I’m bouncing off scraggle like a pinball without ever crashing.

[@pyroman590]

I've run props out for some time now. I do it for a couple of reasons, I almost never take off and land from a hard surface, and I've drastically reduced time spent fishing a quad out of a tree. I can only think of one time I've been treed since going props out.

[@HalfChrome]

Thanks. Great video. I have wondered if it did have any real advantages.

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

Bro it's the shit, keeps outa trees, helps get outa trees and w proximity and no sandblasting the lense, disappointed in bardwell for this one

[@rsutherland106]

been running props out since mid 2017 - we were mainly flying from a fairly sandy patch, and the sand blasted lenses had a short life span - changed to props out and no further problems.

[@postalbyke]

Props in for laziness... That's the gospel truth right there! 😁 I have thought about props out on and off, but I haven't done it because if I'm holding my quad, I'd better be about to fly.

[@guy2507]

I knew you could do it but never really thought about it, something to think about,though I do use turtle mode,great video by they way as usual

[@LovemyDrones]

You've certainly got me thinking about my Micro's now! When I was originally setting up my Batman220, I tried to reverse the motors, it didn't work out so well, it only reversed one of them (4 in 1 ESC) so gave up, I was too anxious to fly!

[@RCOverKill]

I run props out mostly because of the camera, and the fact I like to fly low, and cut a lot of grass, also I fly around trees, and it does eject it more often than not. As far as handling I can't tell too much, but I can distinguish minute changes much better in the last couple months, so I'm going to swap one back to props in to see if I feel any difference. Thanks JB!

[@selvan8057]

yes i do run reversed flight in my 5 inch qwad , but that happend because of the same laziness you experienced, when i soldered the motors for the 1st time it was reversed so i left that like, and just checked the reversed option in betaflight, am a beginner in fpv am still learning so i couldn't tell whether i have a superior control over my qwad !, thanks for all your videos am from india and you are my qwad mentor 😅🙌

[@revd13]

Props out on everything here. Where I fly there is typically lots of tall grass and i like to skim the ground. Takeoffs and landings were also awful for my cam. I was constantly cleaning the lens and getting things stuck on it.

[@SuperAeromike]

Another great video, just to add though ideally you also need to swap the motor with props out so that the tendency for the direction of tightening the prop is optimum ie tightening in the opposite direction to the prop rotation. I have used props out but I prefer props in, cheers

[@CrashNBurnRacing]

I have been running props out since it was an option using the CLI command. I first did it to help keep my camera clean but then soon realized it helped me bounce of gates,

[@MrSmithFPV]

Which cli command?

[@WoodRite1]

I’m running props out on my Acrobrat. It definitely helps with ghost branches and keeping the lens clean but what it helped with the most and the reason I tried it is prop wash. I was getting a lot of prop wash and someone said that props out helps with that and it did. It is a 3” so I don’t know about 5”.

[@robbinkoot2154]

Yesss this is gonna be a good vid

[@avpr1c]

Went props out because I wanted the iflight F4 2.1 battery wires to face backwards. Of course had to do reverse MOTOR in CLI as well... your vid on throttle_limit helped to tame the little 98mm beast

[@daleleblanc8115]

Thanks Josh! I can say props-out is waaaaay better in reduced broken props and fewer fried ESCs/motors. I'm just pissed I was in this hobby for almost 2 years before I learned about it. 3 words of advice: Reverse Your Props!

[@mattraymond2935]

Props out FTW if you turtle your kwad you already messed up and chance burning motors. I also conformal coat and put tape over sd and USB

[@emilyhamilton4551]

Agreed. I put an extra set of standoffs on top of my stack so i could wrap the outside with tape. Haven't gotten stuck in a tree either and ive come close too many times

[@omgwtflmaololrotfl2368]

Props in FTW!! Cause everything is hype in this hobby and I don't follow the hype nor do I like the douche bag community.... Points fingers at you!!!

[@ducpao]

Thank you for this video! I'm pretty sure that I made the mistake of not changing my prop direction in BL Heli. My mob7 has been grounded for weeks!

[@walkershot92]

I've been running reverse props since pretty much as soon as you could do it. So I am not sure if there is a handling difference. As far as keeping your lens clean on turrle mode, I use a fin which normally keeps the rear motors up in the air, so the flight controller spins those rear motors to flip it over. So normally it is not going to get your camera dirty anyway.

[@fullthrottlefpv5616]

I run props out... A friend told me I should set my kwad up that way when I got into the hobby, and I've been running it ever since.

[@OberFreak83]

I´m on props out since my first try, and have never tried props in, on all my quads from whoops to 5". The bounce back and tree shredding effect is almost godlike.

[@hrhodes2768]

but how could you compare if you never tried props in?

[@ODonFPV]

All reverse rotation on all sized kwads. More for the not forgetting thing. But I do like the way RP feals. Guess I should finally set up turtle mode lol

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

Only takes 1 crash on tall roof for turtle to pay big ;)

[@cyrilirene397]

You are our lagend😊

[@TheKawasaki500s]

I run reverse prop rotation because, in an even of a crash, the lens of the camera becomes dirty almost all the time because of the grass, and if you cannon turtle mode then when you pick up the quad the lens is dirty and also there is the benefit of better handling and cleaner air from the prop wash sometimes I notice

[@ShahZahid]

Whished this video was released earlier but shurely learned something

[@g36pilot92]

Props out on everything. OG & brushless Whoop classes for noticeably reduced washout. 5" & 6" props out for scraggle/obstacle contact- don't notice a handling difference. 7" props out for consistency with rest of the fleet as I move into this class for the first time.

[@CarbonGlassMan]

I should have glanced off a twig on a tree one time but I was running stock props in. Not only did it pull me into the tree. The branches also got ahold of several wires and ripped them lose. I've been props out ever since.

[@turbomaniafpv7416]

Props out... seems like a no brainer if you fly around tree's. Less lens pitting also.. great video JB

[@leeit2me]

Was a innie.. but converted to a outty.. many moons ago.. LOL.. less hassle of dirty lens when taking off from grassy fields.

[@fantasticphil3863]

Thanks!!

[@vonn_fpv3414]

First! Hey jb. Thanks for everything

[@Krashcan]

Props out all the way, I used to run normal then I tried it on one build and ended up changing all my quads to props out, think about how you swim arms out :) but for real my main reason was keeping grass off the camera and if I bump a tree it sorta kinda helps push away rather than suck me into that evil tree. 👍

[@kampkrieger]

it makes such a big difference if hitting obstacles from the front. if you hit stuff use the good rotation direction. On the other hand i start to move sideways more and more, so i dont see where i fly, probably i will switch back to the wrong orientation sort of thing

[@BetterIntegra]

I never knew about the authority issue. I figured it was all about your first 2 points. And I find it funny that when I switched my 70mm I made a while ago, I had replaced the motors and accidentally reversed them and noticed that it flew a little bit smoother. It was almost the effect of like props in made it feel like it was in a bowl and with props out if felt more like a flat plane. If that even makes sense. For example. With props in when pitching forward, it would accelerate rapidly and then slow to a cruise and with props out pitching forward felt much more linear. I might just be imagining it though

[@MagicFPV]

1:30 just blew my mind! 🤯 I’m so happy 😁

[@NordicBlueRC]

Always props out for me. Been running props out from the start of my first custom quad. It would reverse for me on forgetting if I had some out and some in.

[@Jamesn-js1zp]

I once ran props out on all my quads, however after damaging three FC's and one 4-1 ESC, I'll never go back. It's much easier and dam lot cheaper to clean lenses than replace damage parts.

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

Silicone conformal coat that shit bro