Psychedelics: Can They Help Us Reconnect with Nature? with Sam Gandy

Dr Sam Gandy is an an ecologist, independent researcher and a collaborator with the Centre for Psychedelic Research at Imperial College London, with a research interest in nature connectedness.
I had the pleasure of meeting Sam in person at the recent ALPS conference in Switzerland, and so I am very happy to be able to bring him on the show and continue our conversation. Here we discuss what we mean by "nature" and why it is a reoccurring theme of these psychedelic experiences.
Sam's talk at the ALPS conference - • Psychedelics as nature...
Here is a link to Sam's research and publications - www.researchgate.net/profile/...
Sam's twitter profile - / samwisegandy
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[@julianhappen]

I actually met Sam and his friends at the Boom festival in 2008, and they all left a very good impression. I have always flagged him as one of the most up and coming people in this world.

[@crono3339]

Out here in Kentucky hiking the creeks looking for geodes, bones, Coral fossils and other curiosities while listening to y'all! Perfect haha.

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Happy hunting!

[@crono3339]

Hey man, just wanted to say it's fascinating that we are communicating across the planet at the speed of light about these concepts. Eating mushrooms in nature 15 years ago my brothers and me thought we were crazy. Parodelia entities were communicating those mysteries that psychedelics do and this was all happening before I ever had a real clue the psychedelic community existed. I learned a lot from reading erowid and then became a festival goer haha.. Psychedelics in nature can be profoundly beautiful for a spiritual or even a very rational materialistic person.. Those personality identity badges just fade away as the trees, clouds, stones and sounds of nature fractalize into a singing chanting goddess of magic haha.

[@AdventuresThroughTheMind]

I love Sam's work. Great one, AP!

[@AdventuresThroughTheMind]

@ 42:00 This issue with respect to connection is something I have had an episode on, a Psychedelic Cafe, and Sam was a part of it. Listeners who enjoyed your interview here might enjoy this one too. kzbin.info/www/bejne/o3bEomWfnJ2Aedk

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Cheers brother 🙏

[@SpliffingIda]

Was für ein spannender Redner!

[@phoenixreborn21]

AM does that definitely. It got me out into the forest, and now I am such a forest bathing lover.

[@dignan193]

Thank you for doing this for us. I'm enjoying the talk. You're a good interviewer, letting your guest really get into it.

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@MegaDanielgrant]

Hope everything is fine with you 🙏 Missing you vids brother 😢 Peace and love to you and yours ❤ 💙 💜 💖

[@tombham85]

My learning from this is to think about 'the polarity of approaches'. I've been guilty of hunting optimum experiences and not considered that settings may yield a diversity of outcomes. I guess set and setting does mean that difference can happen within the diversity of experiences with psychedelics.

[@findtheothers]

Love your podcasts, man. I appreciate your thoughtfulness.

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Thanks!

[@forcemajeure1731]

fantastic guest, thanks

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@alkeryn1700]

couldn't make it to this year's ALPS but i definitely plan to come next year !

[@SpliffingIda]

Danke!

[@nathanwilde2452]

I'm enjoying these long form podcast style video's Rob! Thank you!

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Cheers Nathan 🙂

[@eduardonigma9985]

Maybe you could do like Joe Rogan, and after some of this interviews get mini videos of the highlights and important concepts. More monetization and easier to watch that some 1.5-2 hour video. (I too like the interview style, but I don't always have that much free time) Anyway, I will try to watch it asap

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Hey Eduardo, yes you are right I have thought about doing that. It’s mainly just a case of finding the time to chop them up.

[@eduardonigma9985]

@@AdeptusPsychonautica yeah you are right, it seem like a little long work. We will be waiting patiently ☺️ it was just a little idea

[@manslaughterinc.9135]

With regard to Google dosing their employees with DMT, the computer science field is rife with microdosing for creative output. In fact, microdosing may not even be on the map without silicon valley's input.

[@mr.randomh2o232]

Let's gooooo

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Oh for sure.

[@manslaughterinc.9135]

Something else about the clinical setting, it's built for a 1 size fits all setting. We can't exclude the benefit of settings that are designed with specific purposes in mind. The nature setting for nature connectedness is one example. A trippy setting for mind expandedness focus. Temples and shamanic lodges for mystical experience focus. I don't think you can facilitate those experiences if psychedelics are relegated to only a clinical setting, and I doubt we will see those provably beneficial experiences facilitated in a clinic.

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Also its deliberately "not challenging" which can be a good thing, but we need to acknowledge that some people are really looking to push the boundaries of their experience.

[@manslaughterinc.9135]

@@AdeptusPsychonautica Oh absolutely. Part of the experience can sometimes be the challenge. Now there are high dose ketamine trials related to PTSD in vets going on here in the states, and I suspect that those are absolutely challenging, but you have to expect that they are challenging in an entirely different way. There are entirely non-drug related psychedelic experiences known as ordeals. McKenna spoke about those a lot. Sensory deprivation, fasting, and sweat lodges are examples. Even ayahuasca, with it's tendency to cause one to purge can be classified as an ordeal. Hell, trying to take a dump on LSD is an ordeal. But beyond that, just the ordeal of trying to maintain a semblance of sanity in a public setting like a party or music festival is a challenging experience. And that's another aspect that you touched on but didn't dive into. Taking psychedelics in a social/group scenario can be very beneficial, with or without any spiritual context. Of course, when you are dealing with strangers, it's definitely a different situation than taking it with your friends. As you both said, limiting these experiences to a clinical setting is a disservice to humanity.

[@seekingsomethingshamanic]

10:20 my first adult experience my being split and i saw myself from the top down instead of through my eyes, i saw how i was a liar and a cheat and a theif and how i was just sickened to be around this person id become. since then ive worked to change myself

[@tombham85]

I really enjoyed this talk. A local psychedelic chapter, count me in. I've set up a Meetup in my city for psychedelics. It's challenging as the social elements are easy to manage however in the UK due to drug legislation it means that sourcing etc is illegal and the group would be shut down or at worse someone could get into trouble which I'd hate. I have to moderate the group which means censorship is part of the communication and this brings in other issues and non egalitarian challenges. It's sad as people are there to get help, want to build a community and want to take psychedelics but I worry about the risk of the group also. Any thoughts Rob ?

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Yeah I can imagine its very challenging in the UK, I live in Switzerland where it is a bit more relaxed, but still treading on thin ice. I also face similar challenges moderating comments here on KZbin and also on my Discord server, because it only takes a few naughty comments to turn a well intentioned community into a drugs marketplace - which obviously increases the risk of having it shut down. I think the best advice I can give is to be over cautious and keep any "hot topics" in DM's rather than as open posts within the community.

[@tombham85]

@@AdeptusPsychonautica thank you. I always feel like I'm a gatekeeper and I get a feeling that individuals attending feel I'm being too serious on the matter of not breaking the law. I've advised people that I can't get involved and if a discussion needs to be had in can be done in DM's and not attached to the group. Some (what felt desperate people) wanted to go liberty cap picking so I asked them to do it away from the group and I shared some identification videos and tips. It still felt a little close for comfort even doing that. I pay for the Meetup membership so perhaps it's a little on me more so ? But yes, I love your recent thoughts on psychedelic pubs and collectivism rather than individualistic thinking to move this movement forward. I'm with you there x

[@daisuky2693]

Really enjoyable and interesting talk :)

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Yeah he is a great guy. I hope to catch up with him again at some point

[@daisuky2693]

Would love to see that happening and will look forward to that @@AdeptusPsychonautica

[@garyklanders8402]

Great video thank you! I have a question, how much DMT do you need to vape (e-mesh) to reach hyperspace? tia :)

[@kurinchikabilan226]

Can you reccoment any orally active acacia species for making pharmahausca ?

[@emanuelhenao719]

do you know if I can use white benzene as the solvent for dmt extraction?

[@emanuelhenao719]

I have a question, what ways can you consume syrian rue other than the tea in order to take dmt?

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

You can just eat the seeds, or you could do an extraction to get the harmalas out of them

[@Cubinze]

Do you have a podcast?

[@willmarshall2977]

Hello, I’ve been looking for help regarding mushrooms, the first time I had a big dose I didn’t even know what ego death was and so I fought this feeling of forgetting myself for about 2 hours, possibly the worst night of my life, now that anxiety carry’s over to the point where I’ve had panic attacks almost instantly after eating it, how can I curb this feeling because I do want to experience breakthroughs but as it is I don’t even want to touch the stuff

[@TurboLazer007]

Just spend few months researching psychedelic trips on youtube. Mushroom, DMT, Ayahuasca etc. Whatch/listen a lot of Terrence McKenna and Joe Rogan guests. Research Paul Stamtes or read/research book "DMT: The Spirit Molecule" by Rick Strassman. Keep watching/reading, watching/reading,watching/reading non stop, eventually it will sink in and you will know when you're ready.

[@christobalgonzalez3529]

How much HCl harmine do i take for a pharmahuasca effect

[@adrumasahead2815]

Hello! I had some questions, on your video about dmt-infused vape juice, How did you get yours? Darknet? Made it yourself? (Sorry if you already told it in one of your videos, I just didn't find it in that case)

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

I extract my own

[@adrumasahead2815]

@@AdeptusPsychonautica Can you give me your instructions on how you do it?

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

@@adrumasahead2815 kzbin.info/www/bejne/e4OkeXiFpt6Mprc

[@jtwilliams4208]

Are you doing another video on leo soon and how hes gone so off the rails lately?

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

I have thought about it but I don't think there is much new I could say about the situation. I already stated two years ago that I think he is delusional, all that has happened is its become more obvious that I was right.

[@jtwilliams4208]

@@AdeptusPsychonautica Fair enough. It was a great video. So true. If it weren't for the fact that he's a completely cocky dude who thinks he's some sort of spiritual elite, he'd maybe have a chance to calm down and see how completely outrageous he's been.

[@bigtripper35]

Does anyone else's tongue burn from harmala/harmaline extract?

[@hereforthelove159]

Hey Rob.. has dmt ever stopped working on you???

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Nope, its been pretty consistent in its ability to dissolve my reality 🙂

[@alister_kroulenko]

Trip setting it's like being under dome. Perception its like food of mind, mind generate thought based on perception. When your in natural environment all borders are created by god. Your ceil are sky or stars. You free to do anything under laws of physics. When you in artificial environment - you are in space of rules created by other people. Private territory, social status, money, technologies, open or closed access. People are not just naked monkeys if you are in artificial environment. Lot of symbolic behavior in set of rules. People becoming like a programs. I attend psychedelic festivals a lot of times. Organisers combine natural borders and artificial technologies to create space where people will do that organisers expected, mostly are for commerce reason. Even if you experience feelings of tribe, its artificial programmed by creators of party. Psychedelic open air is beetween natural and artificial. City its like big festival with mostly artificial laws. Mass media its like music that create emotional context. You not are searching food gifted by nature - you do something expected by others for tokens that you exchange for food. So if in your trip a lot of artificial context - you will experience something based on other people narrative created by architecture, symbol system and behavior of others.

[@neillewis82]

Have you got an email I can reach you on?

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

[e-mail]

[@neillewis82]

@@AdeptusPsychonautica thanks

[@nolandderlugner1351]

anyone from switzerland know how to meet fellow psychonauts?

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Im in Switzerland, near Zurich

[@julian9898]

You ok, mate? We havent seen you in a while…

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

I'm taking some time off to deal with some real life family stuff. I'll be back! 🙂

[@julian9898]

@@AdeptusPsychonautica I hope everything is alright, or turns out that way! All the best to you, mate!

[@ATHiR0N]

I think you are the messias

[@AdeptusPsychonautica]

Just everyday people talking about extraordinary experiences 🙂

[@sammyray5239]

"promo sm"

[@phoenixreborn21]

since we go back into childhood - talk therapy is not really a good match with psychedelics, so I see a problem there as it is a left-hemisphere approach. I think that Richard Schwarze's Internal Family systems coupled with some form of Nervoussystem bottomup therapy (Somatic Experiencing Sensorimotor) are good matches for psychedelic assisted therapy. Allan Schore has written a whole book about RIGHT-BRAIN psychotherapy, if we are highly stressed, the right hemisphere is dominant, NOT the left hemisphere. Empathy is right hemisphere too. So there you go. kzbin.info/www/bejne/ooqaiYKrZd6cY6c I think shaman's have naturally a very right-hemisphere approach, because they have experienced it, they KNOW. Funny how the western mind always tries to pick apart things, when I think, it is the WHOLE environmental CONTEXT is what is so healing with ayahuasca ceremony. Nature for sure has a very regulating effect in itself, Japanese have a term for that: FOREST BATHING. But in itself, it never has SUCH A DEEP IMPACT as in combination WITH THE SHAMAN and the AYA. But YES as Sam says, we are FROM EARTH, and we can so thoroughly connect back with EARTH. For me with EACH OF THESE SUBSTANCES, in some aspect, it was always imagery of EARTH.. :) However, I see an issue too in a highly controlled, clinical environment. To me who grew up in a dominant, highly controlled environment, this is triggering. And exactly, as you say: what does that imply? That we need to be so controlled (left-hemisphere), that we are immature, to work with these substances ourselves? I think it is a given birthright to explore your own consciousness, in fact, we all own a right hemisphere, it is inside us, not outside - that is nobody's business. I prefer to sit in the driver's seat and decide on the setting. What music. And no eye shades.