Reactions to CES Letter - Jeremy Runnells Pt. 3 - Mormon Stories 482

[@wendybesse90]

"Learn something today that you didn't know yesterday. Alleviate the suffering of others."

[@haika7499]

"God of the lost keys." Excellent. Thank you Jeremy Runnells. I have never heard that expression before but now I will never forget it. It succinctly distills what I've thought for so long.

[@georgesquires5526]

The Keys of the Kingdom were never lost. Everyone presumes this without looking to the obvious source.

[@craigthomas6205]

George Squires Oops that went past you with a jet pack, watch the video and you'll see what they were talking about.

[@georgesquires5526]

Craig Thomas Yes, he is talking about praying to God to find his lost keys. I moved the point to LDS claim of the "Lost Church." No problem. Thanks.

[@andreadiamond7115]

Haika love it too! ❤️

[@Volleyball_Chess_and_Geoguessr]

Prayer is something I have trouble understanding because God knows everything and can do anything so why would you even need to pray about finding lost keys? The only thing I've got is that God just wants a relationship, so it's about the praying mostly, and trusting in God even if it's his will for you not to find the keys or not do anything just because you prayed. And he does allow very bad things to happen in this world. From what I've heard, some of deceived with the prosperity gospel, that being righteous will give you great things in this life. That seems obviously false.

[@damonm3]

If every Mormon was 10% as curious and skeptical as this man there’d be no Mormons 😂😂❤️❤️❤️

[@markh.harris9271]

No. The reason being that mind, emotion, and behavior control (the hallmarks of cult) prevent it; the mormon indoctrination heads off "exits" until the skeptic's shelf cracks (or even breaks). The second reason is the mormon mission movement... more mormons are reached every year to more than offset the exit of skeptics.

[@damonm3]

Mark H. Harris it’s a business and they know the numbers. I guess that’s the way a business has to be run ya? It’s all about the money and power

[@markh.harris9271]

@@damonm3 Yes. Well, its a billions $dollar holding company that is "posing" as a tax exempt church! The damnable organization has not only hi-jacked Christianity, and ruined countless families and individuals world-wide, it has defrauded the federal government hundreds of millions of dollars in tax revenue. Its really enough to make somebody really angry.

[@damonm3]

Mark H. Harris you mean billions in tax.. over the years they’re evading the govt just like the Christians. Most notably the Catholics

[@josephzillo3751]

There would still be Mormons, it would just be different

[@rachellekafton8534]

I grew up in the LDS church but wasn’t active going to church. somehow after not going to church, I realized that something went wrong in the church. Later in life, I’m not In shock finding the truth about the church because I knew that somehow it wasn’t true but I couldn’t put my finger on it. I’m still in the process of escaping and finding my faith in Christ. I live with my grandma and she criticizes me for not going to church. One way the other, I’m sharing the truth about the LDS church even if they don’t believe it. The people in the church are blind to see it what’s happening and they have to open their eyes and hears.

[@elgavilan7731]

I was a true believing Mormon just yesterday

[@MrBaiLiE7]

How are you doing now? I've painfully transitioned out about 2 months ago

[@sandramccroby1863]

I’m on my journey to get out it’s so hard and painful

[@markh.harris9271]

All of my folks are Temple Lot people (Independence). I find that the CES letter is the right entry point for skepticism even for them. My bias these days is born again Christ follower; seminary graduate (Bethel Sem St Paul: MATS, MDiv)

[@skyjust828]

Oh my God you just explained so much!!! When I left the church in 1978 there was no such thing as the matrix this is why so many young people call themselves atheists y'all have become disenchanted I got to take (along with family values, no smoking/drinking/caffeine policy) I got to take Jesus & the Holy Bible thank you so much!! I have children your age (not brought up in any church) I feel as though I may be able to communicate better with them now thank you🤗😊👍

[@randallwall2745]

Truth is always Godly...

[@megharte]

Even Buddhism has been fucked up by extremism. Look up the modern history of Myanmar/Burma for some yikes.

[@heatherharvey9091]

Why if truth is truth wouldn’t you want everyone to know?

[@hhazze]

Brother Jake would also have been part of the movie?? Oh man that would have been great. So bummed it's not happening now.

[@Rypaul5217]

Footprints are easy to find that lead one to understand what is false, but its the fingerprints that ultimately proves them to be of deliberate intent.

[@MrMemyselfandi415]

Mmmm....Deist humanist. I've been there myself. It's like...some of this religious stuff doesn't seem right...but I know there's this deeper meaning and purpose because everything points to that....and my heart can express and feel that....soo....??? I wish religion didn't exist...and it was a simple love of each other...kindness...respect....loving your neighbor as yourself etc. And...do your best. sigh......

[@RicardoGarcia-mp4mp]

The things you enumerate are exactly what true religion is! I fail to see how you can not see that! Look at all the good that religious people are doing for the poor, the sick, the father and motherless! It is only found amoung those that believe in God and His goodness! Do not blame evil on true religion! However, there is much that is not true religion. Anything that is good comes from God! That is true religion! Your comments seem to confuse this point!

[@Iamth6dad]

You would have loved John Lennon. I do.

[@hollycomish6138]

You both mentioned there is no reference to the Melchizedek Priesthood !!!! DEBUNKED !!! ONE whole chapter is enough for me !!! Now I need not rehearse the matter what I have said May suffice. Behold the scriptures are before you if you will wrest them it will be to your own destruction !!! No I AM not a member of the lds church... Just as history has been changed/history has been changed !!!

[@littlebird3393]

Stop buying greasy pizza’s and share a bowl of rice with a kid in Sri Lanka. Love thy neighbor. The new commandment via Jesus Christ ( the God who intervenes).😉

[@twd8489]

I don't believe he is trying to deceive anyone. There is not much to gain. He walked away from a movie idea. I can spot sincerity just like I spotted that the church is a big mess a long time ago. It is great to hear his feelings as he transitioned away. I was so scared of damnation - what if I'm wrong afterall, scared of family finding out, scared of running into church members, scared someone will see through my clothes, scared to pick up the phone, petrified when someone asks you if you have a calling, & feeling guilty as hell, but what else would you feel if you are a Mormon? It took me a good 15 years to be comfortable in my own skin. Now if that isn't the result of cultish indoctrination, I don't know what is. If you are a current member, there's no reason to reply because you too are still indoctrinated. You don't even know it, but you have no ability to think on your own. I am SO happy I "escaped" so I could live the rest of my life in this amazing world, without guilt & shame, never being good enough, & being in fear of the wrath of God because you know - he will come like a thief in the night so you better be ready at all times. They speak out of both sides, that God loves his children so so so much more than you could imagine, while at the same time - teaching essentially what a punitive God he is!! I'm sorry, but the "Be ye therefore perfect" mantra isn't possible. So, all the members out there, listen up. Not a single one of you lives what they say is needed to attain the "kingdom" because it is impossible, so you should enjoy this life without the chains of someone dictating your every move.

[@teresajgregory]

T WD Thank you for your comment.

[@Volleyball_Chess_and_Geoguessr]

The new testament has a much lovelier gospel of salvation. You don't live in fear with the truth of the bible. Catholicism has the same problem it seems.

[@iansamuelson3666]

Thank you. I feel like Im waking up after a long sleep. I never dared to question anything. Im starting to ask the hard questions.

[@andreadiamond7115]

How can anyone not believe this man’s journey?

[@bethsallay6555]

I am a fan of the CES Letter and was curious about the author. He's very inspiring, it's hard to break out of the mold you've grown up with your entire life but he really did the work to know for himself. Thanks for the interview.

[@mintd8365]

Richard Holmes So why does FAIR (and mormon apologists in general), agree or confirm much of CES content?

[@dalipgupta8275]

I also read the CES letter and its a trash 🗑️

[@markh.harris9271]

Yes, test your testimony; this is not a new thought-- "The unexamined life is not worth living" --Socrates

[@scottsorenson1608]

Thank you both for your honesty, sincerity and integrity.

[@eurograterol1824]

I am fascinating how bright this guy is and how he say things and point of view. I agree with h in most. At the end i like how he points out not to judge others believes but also let them know to question their faith to truly test if their time, money, and devotion is worthy to a religion that cannot deliver truthfulness. John i hope you bring him back on camera. I want to hear from him again. I aslo think being in a religion for simply convinience is wrong! No matter how appealing or helpful might be. I think honesty must start within, being mormon amd attending to mormon meetings for good companionship or good whatever is totally the wrong approach. Back in the days when i was mormon i put all in amd kept it like itfor a very long time till i realized in why doing it. Glad i m out of this cult.

[@MegaJohn144]

Now, with the benefit of hindsight, we see that the church has not changed. Runnels and Dehlin are no longer members. Looks like the reign of terror is continuing.

[@andreadiamond7115]

What a wonderful, fascinating, thought provoking interview! Thank you both.

[@andreadiamond7115]

THE BEST MORMAN STORIES SERIES EVER FOR ME. Thank you gentlemen.

[@SuzanneTheBossBabe]

I am watching this in 2024 and 6 months into my Mormon deconstruction. All I can say is that it was painful and shocking to read the CES letter. (I am a convert of 26 years and lost my first husband to cancer). My 2nd husband doesn't want to be married to an apostate and refuses to understand the things the church sugarcoated for so long! But it's ok...I'm excited for my new life!

[@rccarter7576]

I remember soon after my mission I worked for the Church and was very concerned with the notion of long term employment because I feared to lose the affordability of leaving the Church or forced unemployment by the Church, consequently with gratefulness my employment was short lived.

[@richardromer4676]

Watched all 3 parts of your interview tonight--didn't intend to but just couldn't turn it off! Your demeanor and your knowledge are both so compelling. I hope that in the years since you did this interview that things have worked out for you and your family. I have since modified my beliefs from God of Keys to Alien Key Abduction instead but I still believe in my Parking God!

[@SilentThundersnow]

🤣👍Does your parking God help you find places to park, or help you find where you parked?

[@certainlyitis]

Thanks for this great interview. The CES letter did not break my shelf, the church's topic essays did that all on their own. Jeremy's letter was just an interesting read after the fact for me. But I think he is sincere and accurate. Thanks again John and Jeremy!

[@davidharrington95]

certainlyitis m

[@robertcame]

Rough stone rolling" - Richard Bushman; "An insider's view of Mormon origins" - Grant Palmer; "No man knows my history" - Fawn Brodie; "In sacred loneliness" - Todd Compton; "Leaving the Saints - How I lost the mormons and found my faith" - Martha Beck; SOME BOOKS FOR YOU TO KNOW FACTS ABOUT MORMONISM, THE MORMON CORPORATION, ETC

[@ashleyingoldsby]

Rough Stone Rolling was a resource that strengthened my testimony more than any book aside from scripture. Really find it interesting how different conclusions can be drawn from the same text.

[@mikespage0123]

@@ashleyingoldsbyit’s good that you are here though, investigating truth outside the church shadow

[@leroy4471]

"If the Church doesn't change, society's gonna change it." A True Church wouldn't change under pressure!

[@avaree2271]

A fair church wouldn't prohibit blacks from receiving the priesthood / being sealed in the temple.... sorry bout it. If anything be glad that they changed their rules (so late in the game...) because if the church still upheld these ideologies, then it would be getting a lot more shit than it is getting now. (not to mention lgbtqia+ community but let's not get started on that).

[@MatthewWeldon]

Didn't Abraham plead with and change Gods mind on Sodom?

[@hsavage2899]

The point is that it isn’t a true church.

[@lorrettacrowley5922]

@@avaree2271 please look up the REAL reason why the mormom Church backed down on black people being allowed into the priesthood. Had they not agreed the then president vowed that not only would they lose tax free charitable status! But would also have to pay back taxes. Then the church released a statement claiming God had now forgiven them.....

[@cc-mk2hp]

@@daveyjones9930 If you are referring to Jeremy Runnells , you are quite mistaken!

[@damonm3]

This man has done some amazing work! What a person 🍻🏆. Hope his life is great!

[@cheltseaswensen8670]

Thank you thank you thank you! I'm a little behind the curve getting to this but better late than never! 😍

[@marshal1963]

that was good. I knew all this back in the 80's.

[@mattmahoney9815]

I am watching this in 2022, and Jeremy’s speculation on the direction of the church is pretty spot on.

[@zombieslayer2961]

appreciate your honesty. It’s a huge temptation to be dishonest with yourself and be fake to others. Truth should be loved and valued above all else. What else is there after all.

[@LoVeLIFE-ur8yd]

First time is a mistake. Second time is a pattern. Third time, Am I gonna let you do that to me again??? No I’m not. Thanks Jeremy

[@delta932899]

Thank you Jeremy for all the hard work that went into the CES letter

[@renaebodine1029]

Agree but the true believers are told not to google or look into anything like this that it’s not true I have been a Mormon my entire life but inactive for years I am now finally no longer a Mormon but my point is I never ever heard of any of this thank you So much for this podcast and for speaking the truth ♥️🙏🏻♥️forever grateful -

[@whfowle]

The only answer to Jeremy by LDS is excommunication. They have no answer to any of his questions. In fact, they don't even try. It seems to me that belief in God is a personal relationship with God and not any church body. That is what counts for eternity.

[@dalipgupta8275]

There is an answer to his letter you can Google it CES letter reply by Jim Bennett

[@tipfertool5457]

​@@dalipgupta8275 Nothing from CES, let alone the LDS Church, however.

[@mikespage0123]

@@dalipgupta8275 so glad you are here investigating the truth about the failed truth claims of the LDS church. Stay for more!

[@JS-zy6pw]

Thank you, Jeremy

[@ptyler3]

Great job John and Jeremy! It takes courage to be truly honest, but it feels great doesn't it?! The church could learn a lot from both of you. Maybe someday.....

[@andreadiamond7115]

Watching this again for about the 12th time ❤️

[@dalipgupta8275]

Why don't you read "faithful reply to CES letter by Jim Bennett" and you don't have to read it 12 times. Just read it once 😊😊😊

[@dalipgupta8275]

Just like I read CES letter only once and got to know it's a trash 🗑️ may be others treasure but a trash for me

[@andreadiamond7115]

@@dalipgupta8275 ….have you started critical thinking yet? I don’t read any religious stuff any longer as I’m now a never-mo atheist and a cult watcher. Learning about cults had me looking at my Methodist faith and seeing all the wacky stuff they believe in just Scientology, JWs and Mormons among many others. I hope you embrace the truth about your church.

[@dalipgupta8275]

@@andreadiamond7115 i know the truth by myself

[@mikespage0123]

@@dalipgupta8275it’s great that you are investigating truth outside the church! Keep going!

[@susiekathryn8570]

2024…. Thank you Jeremy. You have opened our eyes as we continue our deconstruction and reconstruction.

[@thetiler]

Around 10:00 it is interesting Richard Bushman is trying to encourage honesty in how the book of mormon was translated "stone in the hat" seems reality and the plates seem fantasy, But of course when I was active it was always that the library had ONLY the plates but NEVER the "stone in the hat :(. To me this is MAJOR. And Scott Lloyd calls that good in his quote below is beyond me. His quote seems all inclusive, that that Jeremy and John are bad which tries to bring truth to an organization which couldn't be further from the truth as for as plates vs stone in the hat are concerned ! You can't call it good to be told they were only plates !!!!!

[@YogiTheBearMan]

7:25 good on his dad. It's shocking when the opposite happens and people put ideology over family, or even friends or community, it serves no purpose

[@Kurt843]

So awesome and inspiring! Way to go Jeremy!

[@scottbrandon6244]

Gospel Topics Essays at 4:42. These were supposed to be announced by bishops back in 2013. Many wards and members never saw a memo. The essays are not easily advertised on the church website.

[@leahtheanimationfan40]

Yeah. I definitely didn't know they existed until I was watching ExMormon KZbinrs during my faith crisis. Then they mentioned these "gospel topics essays" ON THE CHURCHE'S WEBSISTE and I was like "wait, what?" And it took a little persistence for me to find them but I read "Polygamy in Kirtland and Nauvoo" and I was angry! I took a CHURCH HISTORY Institute class a couple years ago and through my 22 years of life as a Mormon, I was never taught about all these issues. The church has known this stuff all along and intentionally continue to keep it hidden from the members. Absolute deception and betrayal

[@soulure]

Love the footage of the jump after 35:00 thank you for adding it.

[@TheRobblue]

Wow...thank you Jeremy...fantastic.

[@kristyndecker3585]

Jeremy, I adore you and your thinking! You are very astute, guided by your soul and really listening! Thank you! Namaste

[@amj20007]

Hey I investigated this church, still a member, because this institute consists of 2 parts: one a spiritual one and two a business one. They don't tell you this, because the money must come rolling in.

[@tat2185]

I thought the CES letter's purpose was his personal search for answers about the church to send to his father's friend at the CES to answer, not to save marriages per se.

[@marthashepherd341]

Jeremy is so thoughtful and articulate. A True Soulful Spiritual Gentleman 🙏❤...

[@joejorgensen747]

I hope I’m around to see what happens to the church in a few years.maybe I should see temple square again before it’s gone ! 😎

[@tat2185]

Does Jeremy think that the apostles are good people with good intentions? That contradicts the dishonesty he claims is not present in the church.

[@christinejackson8542]

This may be a stupid question .,.but if u read the bible how can one thing Baptism of the Dead is even right or holy. Gives me the creeps.

[@wlknonsonshine]

I believe when they refer to the Bible...it may be the Joseph Smith translation.

[@dalipgupta8275]

Baptism for death for those who did not get an opportunity to receive the gospel in this life .. like in my country it's idol worship so they would get an opportunity in next life to accept or reject the gospel

[@RoheAmar]

Thanks to you both Jeremy and John for your work may you both continue to enlighten those who are searching for truth.

[@iwantcandy2]

My loss of faith was slow, over a period of years, and I don't really remember a crisis of faith. Instead, it was more a "realization that I can live in full color outside the church" and a slow discovery of everything I've been missing, so that I never missed the church. However, I have faced bigotry from my family, being equated with pedophiles because I love people of varied genders, and so debunkings like this provide me with a sense of relief. It's just like... a nice reminder that all those years I had to bite my tongue and choke down my feelings as my parents talked about how disgusting and perverted the gays were, how proud they were to be homophobic, was literally just baseless bullshit made up by some guy that plagiarized a highschool textbook. I at one point decided it would be better to burn in hell then to never be allowed to live the way I wanted (since according to doctrine, I would somehow be mindraped out of my orientation in the next life), but I now breath easier knowing there is no afterlife at all. The weapons of my parents were never going to stop me from being who I was in the long run, but all the same, it makes life a little easier to take those weapons away.

[@alonsomiguellozanoaumne5668]

Never knew joseph smith plagiarized. This correct ?

[@ldscyclist]

Not seeing the interview with Brad Kramer and Jay nc Wright. Is it uploaded yet?

[@coffeemachtspass]

The God of Lost Keys. OMG! That one killed me.

[@bettye4003]

I am just learning about this. Than you

[@seanmathews957]

Who else is watching in Oct. of 2021 ?

[@wendybesse90]

Absolute truth is absolute. Period.

[@erpthompsonqueen9130]

Thank you. Watching from Alaska.

[@valeriegriner5644]

If all Christians would read and study the Bible and leave off the "extra-Biblical" bits, everything would be solved. You need no "quad," or "catechism" or any of that stuff to believe that Jesus Christ is the WAY, the TRUTH and the LIFE. There's a reason why the Holy Bible is the best-selling book of all time. It is TRUTH...directly from the one, true GOD.

[@glossypots]

There is one God, he/she constituents are: Christian’s, Muslims, Buddhists, Sikhs, Jews, pagans, no pagans don’t worship the devil they are attuned to nature, and all different sects that spin off from all these faiths. It’s about belief, it’s about goodness, it’s about DO NO HARM.

[@tamarapinegar695]

2 heros

[@jackloganbill605]

The church may still be growing in South America and in Africa in the Philippines but the financial strength of the church comes from the United states, end of paragraph! when that dries up that could be the end although of course the church is sitting on hundreds of billions of dollars tax-free....

[@alvarob2443]

i love the reflection of jeremy .. i was born in the church and still have this personal fight and anger for the sensation of been trick .. even though i was born in the church .. its not easy to just leave the church .. let it go and not feel something .. after all it was a very important part of my live and the way i lived it .. all my friends .. that i use to have first love ... that feeling that you where doing right and that if i had a problem it didnt matter because after this life everything was going to be ok ... its sad .. but im happy that i realiced and found out by my self this lie .. i feel identify and greatful for people like jeremy who had been in the same situation

[@RicardoGarcia-mp4mp]

Alvaro, you sound like you are angry with God and not necessarily with the LDS Church. The miracle of the resurrection is real, not a trick. The love of Jesus Christ for all of us (not just LatterDay saints) is real, not a trick or a deception. These principles and hope are not a "Mormon thing" . They are the hope of every follower or Jesus Christ. Yes, we may feel and experience pain and sorrow but the Bible and the Book of Mormon testify that there is hope. If Jesus had to suffer horrible things to bring us back to the God that created us why should we not experience some of the same when we are but imperfect?

[@goodgirlkay]

+Ricardo Garcia What proof do you have that the resurrection is real?

[@goodgirlkay]

Ricardo Garcia​ The Bible is just a compilation of religious writings (beginning around 1000 B.C.E.) of ancient Israelite myths which were taken from older oral traditions of other races such as the Assyrians and Babylonians. It is just ink on paper. There is absolutely no proof that the super natural claims in the bible are true. If you must have "faith" to believe these writings then you are starting off with a bias which you then confirm with a feeling. This is called CONFIRMATION BIAS: You want these things to be true, so you pray about it and get the answer you want.

[@goodgirlkay]

Ricardo Garcia​ As to the Book of Mormon, all actual evidence points to it being a 19th century work. Not any ancient scripture. There is no evidence that any Israelites migrated to any part of the Americas -- either North, Central or South -- and started a civilization.

[@goodgirlkay]

Ricardo Garcia Sorry. I had to stop reading. ALL EVIDENCE IS NOT SUBJECTIVE! Gravity is an undisputed fact on planet earth. Anywhere in the world, anyone can see the effects of gravity. It requires absolutely no faith. It just is. Stop spewing cult lingo dude. All Mormons use the same lines. It is quite sad. You know almost NOTHING about the origins of the bible. Yet you are telling me you KNOW it is true. You need to develop critical thinking skills. I hope you are young enough to find your way.

[@bratmamma]

An amazing man!!

[@StevenCobble]

Much Love!

[@scottlloydfamily]

In a way I'm glad this has been posted and I'm grateful for people like Jeremy and John who share their beliefs. There must be opposition in all things, without it you will never appreciate the good with out the bad.

[@mintd8365]

Scott Lloyd So true, without deceptive religions like Mormonism we would never have the experience of dismantling a fraud and feeling spiritual autonomy.

[@ashleyingoldsby]

As an believing and active LDS member who is familiar with the issues outlined in the CES letter, can someone unpack why the rock and the hat is so problematic for people? Is it because it is different than many church paintings/videos etc.? I think the Urim and Thummin is an equally fantastical claim, and I just don't understand why this particular thing causes people concern. If he used one stone and a hat or two stones and a breastplate, to me it is the same (??). This is a sincere question, I am not looking to argue.

[@mormonstories]

vm.tiktok.com/ZMdWvc3gR/

[@ashleyingoldsby]

@@mormonstories Thanks for the link.

[@mikespage0123]

It’s great you are here investigating the truth, keep going!

[@skyjust828]

What is the website?

[@valeriegriner5644]

I can't believe that Jeremy said he'd be Buddhist. So very sad.

[@glossypots]

There’s nothing sad about Buddhists believe me. How very sad for you having such thoughts. Is it because his views are different from yours? I’m glad when people find faith, faith is optimism and all faiths are on the same journey, they deserve your respect.

[@angelasturn]

First of all being a buddest you have to leave your family to deny them (not for a family man) second when a man has an idea for space and ear implants and electricity or internet where do you think that idea comes from? Hunger and world poverty is our problem God gave us tools like internet to help with this issue but humanity is too selfish, too self centered to self preserving to see that, denying yourself and picking up your cross means you transform into his image his likeness and bring heaven here on earth .... the Mormon God is not Gods way it’s mans

[@glossypots]

Where on earth did you get your information on Buddhism please tell. I was brought up Catholic, but I knew more about Buddhism by the age of 12 than you seem aware of. At my very Catholic school we were given the history and facts of all the worlds great religions. It was presented as a history/geography/culture lesson. Wars have been caused by religion one faith against another, tribe against tribe can you imagine anything less godly?

[@mkm1206]

@@glossypots Yup This is why I hate these channels. it’s so much hate and division no one lives a really fulfilled life if they’re constantly arguing about religion ! Just believe in Jesus Christ and his teachings and go out and help the world the best way you can. All these comments are so depressing it makes me just sick about humanity in general that’s why I leave all my questions and all my hope and love and direction to Jesus Christ I’m so done with this.

[@jumpropestairs6129]

He will do down in history. I will sit down anyday with someone and talk about the CES evidence, and then pray and ask if they are true.

[@louccideavon7116]

I really admire Jeremy's honesty. He comes across sincere. Not deserving of the label anti Mormon at all. But having read his letter many times and seeing the great reactions to it, it's really much ado about nothing. There are some good questions in the letter, but most are just recycled anti-Mormon questions that have been debunked. Just because he's not a closed minded antimormon does not mean his questions do not have fallacies in them. His response to the existence of bushmans and givens was not at all satisfying. He didn't explain that away at all. It might be torture for Jeremy to go to church with his understanding of tranlslation but from my interpretation of the evidence it is faith promoting. There is definitely a group that is finding it hard to continue in the church with this newly discovered information, but there are many who have heard the issues, honestly and throughly and does not come away with problems. The assumption that intellectuals must struggle to be faithful is not representative of everyone. There are many intellectuals who have different reactions. There are different interpretations and reactions. Doubt and complete loss of faith is not a necessary reaction and is not representative of everyone

[@bsoup381]

thank you

[@deskjockie4948]

Where is the link to his answer to F.A.I.R.?

[@RicardoGarcia-mp4mp]

If you have just watched this interview you may believe Jeremy Runnells story. I am neither his friend or his enemy since (until a week ago) I have never heard of him nor his "issues" with the LDS Church. It is good to hear and see Jeremy state some of his concerns rather than read some one else's opinion on Jeremy' stand. I was born in Argentina and I had a happy childhood in an all Roman Catholic community. Unlike Jeremy, I had lots of questions since very young, about God, Jesus and the Catholic Church. My questions always met with the same answer from my very loving parish priest "Padre Antonio". "It's a mystery" he would tell me!...by age 14 I had stop going to mass and no longer called myself a Roman Catholic. However, I went along to an Easter pageant held in the streets of my town (Longchamps, a suburb of the then "Greater Buenos Aires). I knew most people in town and I just went along for the show. What I did not expected was to be overcomed by a sense that had I been in Jerusalem at the time of Jesus' crucifixion it would had felt no different to what I was seeing. I believed organized religion was just a sham. Have you ever forgotten somebody's name only to be very relieved when you finally remembered it? In that moment, surrounded by lots of people that were not that spiritual I received a witness of the Spirit that said to me: "it is true, Jesus is the Savior of the world, the messiah! And the atonement and his resurrection from the dead are also true and real!". I did not go back to mass or the parish priest but I continued to ask questions. Three years latter (in 1979) I met missionaries of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and I presented all of my questions to them. No anti-Mormon questions, because I have never heard of then until I met them. Ancient America history was a pet subject of mine and as it turned out I new more about the people of the Book of Mormon that what the elders did! I have just never made the connection until they gave me the book to read. By then I have read the Bible from cover to cover (not a very Catholic thing to do). So when Jeremy says he had questions and got no answers I say: "you did not want to know the truth Jeremy!". I have read your "CES letter" and most of it is just a summary of anti-Mormon stuff that you did not put together as you claim. I will answer some of your questions in my next post... Although in my view you never really wanted to know the truth, really!

[@meditationmusic8654]

Ricardo Garcia how very very sad. I converted to the Catholic Church 8 years ago, this was the best decision I have ever made, the sacraments bring so much healing and they all bring you closer to Christ. As for reading the Bible the Catholic Church goes through the major part of the Bible in three years, then it starts all over again, so if you read the mass readings every day in three years you have read the Bible. Another point to consider, Christ gave Peter the keys ( authority) to the kingdom. Christ gave him the keys before he was crucified,, Christ was alive( and through apostolic succession the authority went to Linus all the way up to Pope Francis, so there was nothing to restore cuz there was not a complete apostasy)... Joseph Smith got his priesthood from Peter James and John,,, but they died hundreds of years ago, the Bible​ makes it very clear that the dead don't come back to the living. This means that familiar spirits or demons contacted Joseph Smith, I guess it figures since he was scrying in his hat, and he got the temple ceremonies from the Masons.,,,,,this is very scary, and very serious. I'll pray for you.

[@mkm1206]

I love all good Christians I hate all this division . I love Mormons Catholics all god fearing people . This podcast is so depressing . Divides people .

[@Volleyball_Chess_and_Geoguessr]

I basically put that amount of research into flat earth. He's the kind of person that should look into flat earth.

[@susanhaney3437]

I don't think he would put a lot of effort into something so easily debunked.

[@Volleyball_Chess_and_Geoguessr]

@@susanhaney3437 What debunks flat earth? Nothing because it's true. Tell me a false debunking talking point and I will show you how it fails.

[@RicardoGarcia-mp4mp]

Lets play a little memory game...Until 1979 scholars had declared that the Pre-Colombian american Indians "did not know the wheel or had horses" and therefore the Book of Mormon could not be true since in its pages there were many references to chariots and horses. Many people claimed to have been decieved by the church and left it. Sadly during the 80's lots of Pre-Colombian artifacts with wheels dating centuries before the Spanish arrived started to be unearth and are now placed in many museums around the world (as well as ancient horse and elephant bones). Then in the 90's DNA developments caused many to leave the church... Sadly is now 2016 and the DNA evidence is not as rock solid as was then... And what about the Book of Abraham? Until the Hubble telescope went up into space our knowledge of space and God's creations did not match the teachings of the Book of Moses and the Book of Abraham as interpreted by Joseph Smith junior, scholars told us that there were no other planet that could match the earth or sustain life in the known universe! Sadly, once again we know now what Joseph interpreted was inspired, but wait, how about all the books and videos in you-tube stating that the Egyptian scrolls said something different (according to renowned scholars once again!). It is a fun game! What anti-Mormon claim will fall next? Stay tuned people! 😀

[@susanhaney3437]

Who knows, they may discover alien spaceships? But they have not yet. Show us some pre-columbian chariots and iron swords and then we can talk.

[@MatthewWeldon]

So hes asking everyone to have faith in him and all his research and sources. Sounds like he's trying to start his own church to become a faith leader himself. Trying to be the modern day hip Joseph Smith it seems.

[@susanhaney3437]

He's not asking you to have faith. He is asking you to read the things that Joseph Smith himself wrote, and then think if it makes sense. You can go to the library or the church website yourself and read all that stuff.

[@mikespage0123]

What a crazy take. Sounds like Matthew didn’t listen to this at all. Matthew I invite you to hear the truth, investigate further, discover the real Jesus who saves by grace those who believe in Him through faith and not by works, although good works will naturally flow from faith and are highly encouraged. 🙏