Rebuilding a ProFurl Sailboat Furler (and YOU can too!) | E021

[@forgetn]

Unreal..."So I called the guy who invented the grease, he's called Bob" Are you kidding. This is another level. By the way, using greases that were invented in the past 20 years on old gear is a very good idea. Fascinating, and probably the most instructional video on refurbishing furlers. Thank you. Also stay away from kitchen tools...

[@livingforsail]

Haha. Yeah, I’m 100% serious. He’s a cool guy and probably has also invented the best bilge pump switch that you can get too. Thanks for the feedback! Glad you liked it. Cheers! 🙏👍🙌

[@peterorrs6359]

Using your drill press as a bearing press... brilliant!

[@livingforsail]

It works great! You just need to know your limits… thanks! 🙏🙌

[@sailing_Reimagined]

I usually get in trouble for taking the kitchen funnel. lol 😂

[@livingforsail]

Haha. Yep… been there too 😂

[@Shirrif]

I haven't realized that you are a competent mechanic as well. Thank you for a proper video.

[@livingforsail]

Thanks a lot. 🙏 I appreciate that! 🙌👍

[@lozazapataalejandro7082]

Very good video !!! perfect to understand the internal structure of de system. Thanks !!

[@livingforsail]

Merci! I appreciate that. 🙏👍🙌

[@gmoose777]

thanks for the informative video, just a suggestion for future seal face repairs there is a product called "speedi sleeve" it is a very thin stainless tubular shin that will press over the damaged seal face giving a brand new seal face if you apply a little loctite bearing retaining compound it is a permanent repair much better than jb weld.

[@livingforsail]

Thanks. I considered those too. I wasn’t sure that I wanted to marry a stainless sleeve to the aluminum spindle. It might have been hard to get it all the way on to both sides of the bearing with the slightly larger diameter under the bearing for the interference fit. It’s certainly an interesting idea. I wonder if it would have increased the stiffness of the rotation with the extra pressure on the oil seal… 🤔 🙏👍

[@gmoose777]

@@livingforsail I have used them for years they don't increase the friction by any discernable amount you press the bearing on first the the sleeves the green loctite or tefgel will take care of the rest

[@kirkstable]

Thanks I’m now an expert after watching this once sped up..

[@livingforsail]

Haha! That’s great! Thanks for checking out the video! 🙏🙌

[@petrospapapanagiotou]

Great video. Complete guide for all of us wanting to preserve our old gear (and save a good chunk of $$$) Would've been nice to give it a spin afterwards to let us hear the sound of silence that (I assume) the new assembly makes 😉

[@livingforsail]

Thank you!🙏 Yeah, haha. Not much to hear at the end. That would have been a good clip though to add. Oh well. Maybe in 10 years when I’m rebuilding again 😆👍🙌

[@petrospapapanagiotou]

Hahaha... 😂😀

[@geoffwright7110]

Great descriptive and clear procedure and also well detailed on the use of tools and oven. Tried and true maintenance practices. well done

[@livingforsail]

Thanks very much. 🙏🙏. I appreciate you watching and sending your input. 🙌👍

[@joeldelamirande5792]

Smart idea with the drill

[@livingforsail]

Thanks ! 🙏👍🙌

[@alanmcn17]

Excellent video I love these long form repair blogs.

[@livingforsail]

Thank you! I’m happy to hear that! 🙏👍🙌

[@mickey1299]

Took the words right outta my mouth with this video . I've been doing this for the last two years , with a vehicle overhaul i've been working on , a twenty year RV . If something has been assembled , then logic dictates it can be disassembled , and so can be overhauled . Extremely good advice my friend , and one i wholeheartedly endorse .

[@livingforsail]

Right on! Thanks for the feedback and good luck with your continued work! No furlers on the RV but the principal is the same 🙌👍🙏

[@mickey1299]

@@livingforsail No there ent however , i started on boats , and likely could return in the very near future . Keep up with the rebuild , and keep them videos coming . I know it's hard work at times , but it's very much worth it .

[@tylerhenderson6432]

Very informative! I have an LC 42 that I may be doing this to later this year. Thanks!

[@livingforsail]

Great! Hopefully this helps. My LC42 was in surprisingly good condition. If you get in BEFORE it’s rusted seized I think it can keep giving you reliable service with the rebuild. Keep us updated! Cheers. 🙌👍

[@TheCorsair]

Well, that's a great tutorial. Despite my rigger not being fond of profurl, you have demonstrated its possible to give them new life.

[@livingforsail]

Thanks for keeping an open mind ! 😆🙌 Yeah, the design is interesting. A carbon steel bearing… out to sea… in one of the wettest possible locations on the boat… 🤔 I think if it is maintained it will do a great job of rolling the sail under any load. The torlon bearings that others use can deform I understand but I supposed if sized correctly… What are you running on your rig?

[@TheCorsair]

@@livingforsail I’ve owned two Cabo Ricos, a CR38 and now the 56. Both came with ProFurl furler and I replaced them all with Harken Mark IVs. To be fair the ProFurl furling units never failed but the grub screws on the foils would back out which would prevent me from being able to drop the sails; a very dangerous condition indeed.

[@livingforsail]

@@TheCorsair Yes. That is a potentially dangerous situation... I know exactly what you're talking about too... My staysail was hanging up on a partially backed out screw when I was decomissioning the rig a while back... Red loctite is supposed to help but out there, anything can happen...

[@TheCorsair]

@@livingforsail you can only use the red loctite so many times.

[@miadog2008]

A couple of years ago I repaired my NC32 but using much cruder tools in the wild. Used the PVC trick and some short wood stock to help remove/install new bearings. I used sealed bearings rather than open ones as replacement. Stuffed the innards with as much bearing grease as i could. So far all works well. It’s a simple system and the bearings and oil seals can be obtained inexpensively. When putting back together make sure to coat any disimilar metals with lanacote or similar compound. I had a hard time taking the bolts off to disassemble the lower unit. You don’t want to damage those bolts, they are expensive and hard to come by. Great step by step for upper and lower parts removal and install!

[@livingforsail]

I’m glad to hear that yours is still giving good service! Yes, those titanium bolts tend to seize up. I used heat and penetrating oil and they eventually broke free under quite a lot of leverage. Cheers. 🙌👍

[@evewilkinson9653]

Brilliant Jon, good instruction video. 👍🏻👍🏻

[@livingforsail]

Thank you! 🙏 🙌👍

[@sergioep9649]

¡Gracias!

[@livingforsail]

Thank you very much! 🙏🙏🙏

[@RappinIggyG]

Excellent. Well done cir!

[@livingforsail]

Thank you! 🙏🙌👍

[@andrewmoylan6295]

G'day Jon, I love it mate great work really informative..

[@livingforsail]

Thanks! 🙏 I’m glad that you enjoyed it! 🙌👍

[@andrewmoylan6295]

@livingforsail I'm sure you know this, but you can also put the bearing race in the freezer as well as heating up the housing...old 2 stroke crank bearing replacement trick..😉

[@tarivard]

awesome Jon. During the journey, I was thinking that sealed bearings might be a good option. Watching you put it together, I now see that it not necessary. Good job.

[@livingforsail]

Thanks Tim. I wondered about that too… I think that could also work. It would have been an interesting experiment. 👍👍🙌🙌

[@jvodan]

cheers that was excellent

[@livingforsail]

Thank you! 🙏👍🙌

[@markchodroff250]

Great video, next time tell Everyone which way the snap rings go , the flat side is for pressure

[@livingforsail]

Thanks! 🙏 I meant to include that! Like he said! 👆

[@SVMatcha]

Good stuff! Seeing the process start to finish was very satisfying 👍

[@livingforsail]

Right on. Thanks for the feedback. I’m glad that you enjoyed it. 🙏👍🙌

[@fransdriesen1311]

well explained and well executed overhaul..

[@livingforsail]

Thanks 🙏. I appreciate the input. 👍🙌

[@MichaelSellery-k6o]

Wow - impressive rebuilds!!!

[@livingforsail]

Thank you! 🙏🙏🙌🙌

[@WoodenBoatBen]

Fantastic!

[@livingforsail]

Thank you! 🙏🙌👍

[@qvaka]

Thanks for sharing the info and advice! Let's see how I do with my furler.

[@livingforsail]

Keep me posted on how it goes! I’m happy to help. 👍🙌 Thank you also for the “Thanks” $$$ (more specifically €€€). That is mighty kind of you! 🙏🙏🙏

[@nutsandbolts432]

30 or so years out of steel bearings is hard to argue against. I’ve often thought that ceramic bearings would be the way to go on a boat. So, I did some digging. Steel bearings in this size have a static load over 11,000 lbs. Ceramic bearings of the same size have a static load of 884 lbs at 5x the cost. Generally speaking they should last 10x longer which would justify the cost if you needed 300 years of service life. Other documentation I saw said ceramic bearings should handle loads at 80% the rated value of steel bearings, but in my 30 seconds of extensive research, I couldn’t find a manufacturer to back up that claim. Curious about your thoughts. I have a specific design that requires bearings to operate under water, and I always thought ceramic would be the way to go.

[@livingforsail]

That’s a really interesting idea. I’ve never played with the ceramic bearings. It makes sense for an application like this. Thanks! 🙏🙌👍

[@toni9913]

so helpful!!!

[@livingforsail]

Great! I’m glad to hear that! 👍🙌

[@silvanocometta9760]

It looks so easy... if you know how to do it. Nice job! I learned a lot. Thanks.

[@livingforsail]

It’s not too bad. I’ve done a few of these now including tearing down a few spares that I found seized up. I think getting to them BEFORE they are seized is the key to success. Once they are really rusted up the shaft can get quite pitted like I showed on that one example. Cheers. 🙏👍🙌

[@grabasalad5945]

Excellent informative and educational content… Bravo!!!

[@livingforsail]

Great. Thanks! 🙏 I’m happy to hear that you enjoyed it! 👍🙌

[@robertgold2643]

Amazing…. Love how you go about this refit and out the videos together 🤙

[@livingforsail]

Thanks a lot for the feedback! 🙏🙏.

[@jimscheltens2647]

Really good info. Thanks

[@livingforsail]

Thanks for the feedback! Much appreciated! 👍🙌🙏

[@YouCampICampWeCamp]

Nice job… 😎👌🏻

[@livingforsail]

Thank you! 🙏👍🙌

[@YouCampICampWeCamp]

@@livingforsail I am a civil engineer. This allows me to see your perfection in building and constructing. That's why I like your videos so much and you inspire me when I buy a ship in future. :)

[@livingforsail]

@@YouCampICampWeCamp Very cool. I think I could have had a good time as a civil engineer... Thanks for watching and all the best with your future boat plans.

[@mr.e7022]

Why do I have a burning desire to buy Hawk Epoxy? i did something similar on our Simpson Lawrence windlass . SL didn't make the seals or bearings so after measuring the old rusty leaking ones I found new ones at 1/10 th the price that the marine supplier wanted. Great video.

[@livingforsail]

I use Hawk epoxy on everything now. I don’t recommend it on your breakfast cereal but otherwise it’s great stuff! 😂 Way to be resourceful on your windlass rebuild! Your feedback is appreciated. 🙌👍🙏

[@robertscholz4486]

That seems like a great price for the rebuilds ... considering the price for a replacement units. That problem you had with the pressure pushing the seals back out is not uncommon -- I've had the same thing while installing new slides during brake jobs -- nice solution to the issue though.

[@livingforsail]

Thanks! 🙏 I think at that price it’s definitely worth a shot. I scratched my head for a bit on the seal pressure issue. I guess the good news there is that indicates that they are in fact sealing well so hopefully I water getting in for a long time. 🙌👍

[@patrickfitzoot]

Well done rebuild. I had heard these furlers were not serviceable. Obviously they are. Glad you covered grease zerks. I was thinking the same, however grub screws instead of zerks, then zerks just moment of greasing. Fwiw I for have a 20 ton press and a big old drill press, never considered using the drill press for such a thing, but will now, as hydraulic press is a slow set up. One last thought, is the little pin possibly there for pressure relief during manufacturing, so that the seals can be installed? Because I don't understand it's purpose otherwise..

[@livingforsail]

Thank you 🙏. They are certainly serviceable! I’d say the sooner the better. I wouldn’t want to push past 10 years or the water starts to corrode the anodized aluminum. You’re correct about the pins! 👍🙌

[@martyb3783]

Great video. What software did you use for your bearing cutaway illustration? That helped a bunch. I will check out the Tef-gel. I have not used that before. I normally use Superlube. I have to service my winches soon and might give it a try. Thanks for another awesome video.

[@livingforsail]

Thanks! 🙏 I use sketchup for the modeling work. It used to be free… for your winches you’ll want a really light lube on the pawls. Tef Gel might not be what you want on everything. I’m planning on rebuilding a bunch of Lewmar wave grip winches in an upcoming video. 🙌👍

[@scottcates]

Would it be a good idea to drill and tap the Profurl outer body to accept a grease/zirk fitting? This way, a sailor could simply pump some grease into the bearing cavities to force lubricant outward, through the bearings. Always fresh grease that way? EDIT: You read my mind and already addressed it! Too funny.

[@livingforsail]

Haha. Yeah, I will try both approaches. I can see it both ways on that one… there is NOT a ton of room on there for a zerk with the various clips and things… 👍🙌

[@stuartgelinas]

instead of roller bearings, install sealed bearings, then the seal for insurance against water intrusion.

[@livingforsail]

I considered that too… probably can’t go wrong there. I wondered about adding too much friction to the system but it’s probably a rounding error after all that grease and whatnot in the original design… 👍

[@markbowlus2932]

Excellent video - THANK YOU! Quick question - are you able to tell me how much rotational resistance I should expect from a healthy ProFurl upper swivel? I have a B35M that rotates smoothly but with a decent amount of resistance. The fish scale shows 1.5 lbs to rotate it. Does this sound normal?

[@livingforsail]

Thank you 🙏. Since there are two double lip oil seals on that swivel packed with grease, there is some inherent friction even in a newly rebuilt unit. My take on this would be to plan to rebuild before it is obviously “grumbly” as you turn it. By the time the bearings get that bad, you’ll likely have pitting on the aluminum and other collateral damage. I’d probably plan to rebuild them every 10 years or so? Just a guess… That amount of force sounds ok to me 👍

[@markbowlus2932]

@@livingforsail Thanks for the info and quick reply!

[@thedoctor8381]

Just did this on a NC42 system i picked up for $200. Like new now! Only problem is i have everything here to install except furler extrusion tubes, i have the joining sleeves, bearings (the plastic inners) grub screws....but no aluminium extrusion tube! After doing some hunting on the net its going to cost about $2500!!! Which is a ridiculous amount for aluminium tube. Im considering getting the C42 profile custom made which is possible and i can supply other guys who run into the same problem.

[@livingforsail]

That is awesome and sounds like something that I would do! Love it. Is that the extrusion with the single luff groove? I know Profurl discontinued this line a few years ago so those extrusions will get harder and harder to find. Keep me posted about that project and good luck. 👍

[@michaellavin7102]

Hi: love the content. My question: I understand the desire to emulate the original design but if the aluminium housing is too weak why not fabricate it in 316 steel. Remove the need for the bimetallic corrosion sludge which was the degradation issue perhaps initially

[@livingforsail]

Hi. I think you mean the spindle for the staysail which showed quite a bit of corrosion under the bearing… I hadn’t considered getting one made of SS. It’s an interesting thought. I imagine it would be quite expensive… I have not rebuilt that unit yet as I maul over my options with it… Thanks for the input. 🙏👍🙌

[@michaellavin7102]

@@livingforsail no sweat. I’m an architect, not an engineer so the notion of the fabrication of a brand new element like this is somewhat out of my knowledge base. Just seems a shame to reinstall a part which has failed previously. The infill material which you used to smooth out the screwdriver gouges will not last and in 50 years a future utuber will come across the same issue perhaps. If mankind lasts that long . Cheers mate. I’m in London x

[@livingforsail]

@@michaellavin7102 The spindle on the LC42 was in good shape. You are correct though that the JB weld used to fill in some gouges on the other parts will not last forever. I'm hoping to get a few trouble free years... we will see.

[@torstenhansen4308]

Thanks for another fantastic, useful, and well produced video. Another step towards fame and fortune 😊.

[@DeVerm123]

These spacers… you replaced them or installed parts that aren’t there originally?

[@livingforsail]

They are not original. I made the mistake of ordering the same parts I was removing before verifying the depths of the bores. For the N42 and/or LC42, order 80x50x13mm double lip oil seals (with stainless springs if you want 100% OE)

[@markchodroff250]

Holding the assembly in a Vice would be easier and safer

[@livingforsail]

That would have been wise but maybe a bit less suspenseful and entertaining to watch ?! 🤷‍♂️

[@bhartley1024]

I wonder if fully ceramic of hybrid ceramic bearings would work? I only just discovered that they exist, not too sure of the cons.

[@livingforsail]

I suppose with full ceramic bearings you could skip the seals? 🤔 I’m not sure how they handle the high load, low RPM life cycle that these are subjected to, but possibly worth looking into…

[@bhartley1024]

Full ceramic can supposedly run submerged in seawater with no grease! Not sure I like the idea of salt crystalizing in there and being chewed up by the balls though. When steel bearings fail they mostly just get rougher, noisier and stiffer. When ceramic bearings fail, they shatter into highly abrasive bits.

[@livingforsail]

@@bhartley1024 right... like everything in life. Pros and Cons... Haha

[@captaindrew3061]

can you use regular tuf gel?

[@livingforsail]

It will probably be a bit too thick…

[@banier1]

This is wonderfully informative video. Thanks for posting. I have one question for my job: were you able to determine the sizes of you bearings, seals and clips by only knowing the model number? I have a Profurl R35, the bottom barrel is struggling to rotate, but I don't wish to remove from boat and dismantle (thus ruining the seals) if I don't have the parts at the ready. Thanks

[@livingforsail]

Thank you. 🙏. I’m sorry that I don’t have the exact details that you need. I think your best bet would be to call Wichard and talk to them to get the part number for the official rebuild kit and a lead on where to purchase it. You’ll pay a bit more this way but you will be sure to get the correct parts. If you do, let us know what the actual seal/bearing sizes are and I’ll post it in this video for the next person that comes along with the same question. Good luck 🙌👍

[@banier1]

@@livingforsail Thanks for the reply. Great Minds,,,, as I already messaged the guys at Winchard in Oz, asking if they know the sizes. Thanks again. Good luck with your project.

[@banier1]

Hi again John. I am having real problem getting my profurl furler off my boat, i.e. sliding the Drum off the luff extrusion. I've removed the 2x set screws then it just won't budge. Any tips or advice? Thanks in advance

[@livingforsail]

​​⁠I’ve had a few that were sticky. They have all just been a tight friction fit (with the two set screws to lock in place). I was eventually able to press the spindle out of the drum using my body weight. You might need to get it on a press to get started. It will go 👍🙌

[@banier1]

@@livingforsail Update: Wichard (France) DMed me, after I wrote an enquiry this morning on their website. A very interesting response and has some questions for you, after I shared a link to this vid. Happy to share with you but not sure best way to DM you on here.

[@abracadabra2852]

Recently did the same thing to my P31 Pro furl, abet with less fancy tools. It worked well. After contacting the agents here in Australia, who informed me that there are no longer spares available and then quoted $2500 for a replacement furler. It cost me $80 for parts from a bearing supplier to revamp mine! The small S/S balls on the outsides, are originally pressed in at the factory after they have filled the internals with waterproof grease and let the excess out, through the small holes there. I simply packed mine solidly with grease when installing the final seal. I used stainless steel bearings on mine, why not? the cost is negligible

[@livingforsail]

Great work! Apparently the stainless bearings can deform a bit under load but will definitely last longer. If it’s not giving you any issues then it’s all good! 🙌🙌👍👍

[@derekhoughton1346]

yep did a P31 years ago and like you i took out the ball bearings on each side, put it all together with lots of Tefgel. the last seal forced the excess gress out and i hammered the small bearings back in place. No feeler guages required and so peace of mind that the seal wouldnt be damaged.

[@livingforsail]

@@derekhoughton1346 Great work. How's it holding up?

[@derekhoughton1346]

@@livingforsail It held up well for the 10 years until I sold the boat.

[@ldno3747]

Fella, did you just use your ladies mascara brush to brush on the tef-gel ? Cause that is what it looked like...

[@livingforsail]

Haha. Well… sort of… that’s what they send with the grease. The main application for Tef Gel is for fasteners and that brush is perfect for that. I don’t recommend stealing your wife’s makeup kit for your boat projects… 😂 🙌👍

[@PondoSinatra680]

@@livingforsailWhy not? You stole her scale.

[@livingforsail]

@@PondoSinatra680 Yeah... fair enough. Haha.

[@MaShcode]

Tef-gel. Teflon. Fluoropolymer. DuPont. ToxicEnvironmentalFiasco. Persistent. Does break down and become airborne. Yea, I’d opt for traditional greased bearing’s. Sorry to be that guy.

[@livingforsail]

Nothing is perfect I guess 🤔. Thanks for the input. I hadn’t really considered that angle. We will see how it goes with this unit. It will be a long term “case study”. I appreciate the feedback. 🙏🙌👍

[@MaShcode]

@@livingforsail Yea, it’s a no-win. Probably a reason why sealed bearing designs have become a popular spec. In marine applications salt water eventually wins.

[@livingforsail]

@@MaShcode I agree 100%

[@tbd-1]

15:39 "...and then you can just-" _DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME!!!_ 😮

[@livingforsail]

🤷‍♂️