Removing Lower Drive Shaft in a Rockwell 28-300 Bandsaw

[@tomellison1463]

Just the video i was needing! The shifter rod was completly gummed up on my recent auction find and i wasn't sure how to disassemble the shaft, your video saved me a lot of head scratching.

[@alaskabearhawk]

That's awesome Tom! I'm glad it helped you out...and I hope your auction find is up and running like new in no time.

[@johnny39302]

thanks for thus video! it must be the only place on the internet that shows how the lower drive shaft comes out - especially (as you mentioned) after looking at the exploded diagram! ive been looking for two days and can now confidently move forward without the quiet fear of doing something i cannot undo-

[@alaskabearhawk]

You're welcome...glad it was of help to you! And good luck on your project. Just take it one step at a time and you'll do fine.

[@timking3085]

Thanks for your video. It was the deciding factor I used to buy the bandsaw I now have from Facebook Marketplace. The guy who had it never took it apart and was told everything inside was missing parts and ruined. He only used it for wood. I took it all apart as per your video and everything inside was perfect except for the low range roll pin. Now I have a full function metal cutting bandsaw. Thanks much. By the way, I know quite a few guys from the local airport who build their own airplanes. Very respected and admired bunch of guys.

[@alaskabearhawk]

Tim King WOW! Great story and thanks for sharing. These saws are incredibly robust and it would be very unusual for one to be missing the parts or to have it ruined. Good for you to bring another one of these great saws back into shape! It will now live on for a few more decades, perhaps longer.

[@alaskabearhawk]

Hi Terrence! Yeah, that lower cover is a bit problematic because of the cut of the gears. I believe I mentioned this in the video. It has been a few years, but I do remember it took a bit of fussing to get it off. Patience and wiggling helps! Most of these saws have never been disassembled since they left the factory, so things are a bit gummed up. If you do need to use a bit of persuasion, be super careful to take the cover off evenly and not damage the mating surfaces. The machined cover locating pins are a close-tolerance fit. The Bearhawk is almost done...thanks for asking! Hopefully it will be transported to the airport next month for final assembly and inspection by the DAR. You can look at the mykitlog website for my progress. Hope this helps, feel free to ask any more questions.

[@jeffanderson1653]

Thank you! I have the exact saw. It took me a month to find the 26mm I’d bearing for the shaft. Everyone tried to sell me the standard 25mm x 52mm x 15mm bearing. I couldn’t remember the sequence of the parts. You da man!

[@brianb9410]

Same problem. Not sure I could have repaired it without your video. Thank you!

[@alaskabearhawk]

You're welcome! Glad it helped...

[@mattpolitzer2920]

Thanks for the details. I just serviced the outer lovejoy coupling and shaft section. Rust holding up the movement of the out lovejoy connection Your video also confirmed that the inner lovejoy coupling roll pin is intact on my machine. Great informational video. It's a fantastic versatile machine.

[@jimbecker9033]

Thanks for the video. Your explanation of the mechanism was invaluable to me. I had a terrible time getting the gear box out of the saw and found it impossible to reinstall the gear box once the main shaft with the big gear was in place. Maybe this is a problem unique to my 28-300 model saw. I think I found a much simpler way to replace the roll pins on the love-joy couplings that does not require removal of the gearbox. I split the two main saw castings in half at the joint where you can add the optional height riser block. I removed the table and disconnected the lower half of the saw from the stand and drained the oil. I then put the lower casting up on my workbench in a flat, or horizontal position, supported by blocks. You could also lay it across 2 saw horses. Then I could drive out the main shaft without disturbing the position of the big gear and it's spacer. After repairing the love-joy couplings, I inserted a wood dowel to keep the big gear and spacer in place and flipped the main casting over 180 deg. I removed the dowel and then drove the main shaft back in. The main shaft is tapered so it will center the gear and spacer as it is driven back in place. It is a good ide a to rotate the gears a bit while you are driving the shaft back into place so as to be sure the teeth are engaging properly. One more tip. I cut out a wood "U" shaped spacer that fits around the shift shaft to hold the shaft in neutral position, 1/2 way between low and high speeds so neither love-joy was engaged while I pounded on the shifter knob to drive the shaft back into the saw casting.

[@alaskabearhawk]

That is fantastic Jim! I really appreciate you taking the time to pass on your experiences with your saw. It certainly seems like an effective solution.

[@GatofieroYT23]

This is helpful. My problem is that mine will not pull out of metal-cutting mode to go into wood-cutting mode.... Not sure what's hung up in mine...

[@alaskabearhawk]

Were you ever able to change between the two modes?

[@GatofieroYT23]

@@alaskabearhawk No, sir. I inherited it this way. It runs in metal-mode - no problem there. The knob is just stick in metal mode.

[@alaskabearhawk]

@@GatofieroYT23That area on mine was pretty dirty. There is a shaft within a shaft that has some pretty close tolerances and it's easy to get gummed up with fine metal debris, old oil, etc, etc. Probably disassemble it, give it a good cleaning and it will be as good as new.

[@GatofieroYT23]

@@alaskabearhawk By the way... With enough PB Blast, and a gear puller, I was able to break the clutch free from being stuck... I blasted it with PB Blast and now it's pretty smooth action engaging, disengaging... I've been trying to find the correct adhesive gear oil for it, because I want to change it. I am finding it hard to find figure out the correct one. I read somewhere that the additives in the oil could effect any brass on the gears... I know that there are some brass bushings on the bandsaw wheels, so MAYBE there might be cause for concern that there might be brass on that huge gear inside... I didn't take mine apart since everything seems to be working well as far as the gear box is concerned... Any thoughts on oil for this?

[@alaskabearhawk]

@@GatofieroYT23 I have the instruction manual and all it says is this: “The gear case is filled at the factory with 1 ½ quarts of oil. It should be drained after 1500 to 2000 hours of operation and refilled with a good grade of heavy adhesive gear oil. A pipe plug is provided underneath the band saw and is removed when draining the oil.” So, any good oil will work, I used Sta-Lube SAE 85W140 oil, part number SL2432. It has run fine with zero issues. docs.crcindustries.com/label/lbSL2432-14A.pdf

[@bradhess2721]

Thank you for this video. It was so helpful. For anyone that has an issue with this mechanism being stuck, drive out the existing roll pins as stated. Here is what I haven’t seen anyone clearly state. The roll pins don’t need to fit super tight in the keyed connectors. The important part is to pin the center Rod with those roll pins. If you try to buy roll pins to fit the keyed connectors you’ll likely try to Jam in 3/16 pins. They are too big for the center pin. I used 5/32 they were a bit small for the keyed connectors but fit the center pin perfect.

[@alaskabearhawk]

Thanks for sharing your insights Brad. You are correct. The pins don't need a real tight fit, just enough friction to keep them from coming loose in normal operation. The good news is the roll pin is still available to buy. The part number is 905010102732S (old P/N 905010102732) and fits many other Rockwell Delta machines. About $2.00/ea online. Just google the number

[@BVM03]

I'm glad I found this video. I have a 28-380 and the shift feature seems to be frozen. I can't get it to go in or out. I assume I'll need to break down my bandsaw as well and clean and lubricate that entire main shaft.

[@jeffanderson1653]

I just bought a twin to yours and yes I have a similar problem. Something is causing the shaft to bind. When I push in on the knob to activate slow speeds it won’t move. Thanks to your video I can dig in to see what’s going on.

[@pauli2062]

Thanks for this video bud, facing the same problem with mine. Would have figured it out eventually but you just saved me about an hour of tinkering and head scratching.

[@alaskabearhawk]

Perfect! Glad it helped.

[@ovalwingnut]

Timeless Gear-Head secret society insider info... and I'm loving it :O) Thank you so much. Cheers from So.CA

[@alaskabearhawk]

Glad you enjoy it...and thanks for the kind words!

[@leopavao8667]

Thanks Paul, I figured it out as well. Thanks for the feedback.

[@jeffanderson1653]

How did you get the shaft through the bearing on the wheel side? I’m replacing the bearings. If I install the bearing in the housing on the wheel side, place the bushing on the shaft, through the bull gear and into the bearing bore, it stops. If I tap the shaft it drives out the bearing. I now have the shaft and bearing in the refrigerator. Fingers crossed. Help!!

[@makefitdepartment8621]

Thanks for the video, very helpful. Do you know the dimensions of the roll pins?

[@alaskabearhawk]

@@makefitdepartment8621 I’m glad it was helpful! I don’t know anymore the dimensions of the roll pins, but if I remember correctly they are about 1/8th in diameter, length dictated by the diameter of the coupling. Hope this helps.

[@TerryONeill-x5s]

Hi alaskabearhawk, I'm EAA 5572, Terrence O'Neill, with a broken metal/wood bandsaw like yours. Trying to remove the lower shaft using the crappy isometric drawing in the Rockwell 11/15/65 manual. Missing pin in a clutch piece and no description of how the torque loads of from pulley to sawblade... Anyway, I have the gearbox cover loose but ut resists further pulling off. Is this because the gear cut into the bottom/multi-pulley shaft resists sliding out of the teeth of gear LBS272-S? ... or something else not shown on the isometric.? Thanks. Also, did you finish the Bearhawk, or is it 90% done with 90% to go? Ihad a Dragonfly, then a Lancair 320, and now modifying an EArthstar Gull, with an HKS700E. Terrence O'Neill

[@johnpaulmonferdini5758]

did you make a video of putting it back together? I'm having a heck of a time getting the shaft to pass back through the bearings and wondering how you did it.

[@alaskabearhawk]

No, sorry. And I don't remember what I did. But I don't remember having every problems. Sorry I can't be of more help to you!

[@franciscoluna9596]

hello Paul, great reference video! I have the same problem, roll pin was broke in the shifter rod....I have a question for you, Im sure you have much better understanding about this machine....should I saturate the bearing that goes inside the big gear with red grease? or that one just run dry?....I doubt the oil goes up to lubricate all the parts on the main shaft....thanks in advance!

[@alaskabearhawk]

Hi Francisco...glad the video helped you out! That main bearing is quite a robust roller bearing and can handle quite a radial load. Believe it or not It is splash lubricated. Best thing to do is to put the bearing in a cup of gear oil before assembly for a minute or two and spin it, or just squirt some oil in the bearing while on the shaft and give it a few turns. Those gears bring a lot of oil with them as they turn and that is what gives that bearing its lubrication.

[@joelammons2438]

Thanks for making this detailed video of the Delta 28-300. I have one as well and the same thing happened to me. I'm having a little trouble getting the gearbox back in. Is there a trick to getting the main gear to line up with the shaft in the gearbox?

[@jeffreydeutsch7336]

When trying to remove the cover, the angular cut gears are still engaged. It is not a wiggle that is required. You have to rotate the shaft in one direction to unmesh the gears as you pull. I pried and broke the big gear and it set me back 60 bucks. Today the gear is damn near priceless. When I asked Delta about the paper gasket they said to use gasket sealer (Permatex/Loctite). Don't bother to make a paper one. That was when Delta was a real US company with a huge parts inventory. Today the current owners, Chang Type Int'l. of Taiwan have a US plant but can't supply parts for current production. They are not doing well.

[@petee716]

Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks for the video. Nicely done.

[@alaskabearhawk]

You're welcome...glad it helped!

[@djw4325]

Thanks for taking the time to make the video. It was very helpful. I also have a 1972 Model 28-300 with the same broken roll pin problem on the internal dog gear. In my case, the machine would not go into metal-cutting mode and the break did not become apparent until a piece of the broken pin tumbled out when I removed the drive shaft. As you stated, removing the shaft was straightforward. The challenge now is to reassemble it. As you know, the shaft needs to be driven into the big gear inside the body of the saw. This requires force toward the lower wheel side of the saw body. The bearing on the lower wheel side needs to be driven onto the shaft with force in the opposite direction. Installing one tends to uninstall the other. How did you solve this problem? Thanks! Dave

[@paulminelga3353]

+david weaver Hey David... Let me have a day or to to think about it. I do remember that it was really easy, so please stand by!

[@djw4325]

Paul, any progress on reconstructing those memories? Dave

[@alaskabearhawk]

Hey Dave...sorry it took so long. The shaft is a close tolerance fit, but it shouldn't need a press or any force for that matter to put it together. I would take a look at your shaft, the gear and the bearing. Each should slide onto the shaft without any appreciable force, but have no play. Take some emery cloth or red scotchbrite pad to polish it up. The bearing just slides on the shaft and is the last thing installed just before the woodruff key and the lower wheel. The shaft is held in place with the large wheel on one side and the bearing on the other side that has an external snap ring that keeps that end in place. If you need a bit of persuasion you can use the large nut and wheel to coax the bearing into place, but like I said it should be a tolerance fit and not a press fit. Another thing you can try is heating the bearing with a hot air gun and installing it while it is still hot. Don't use a torch of course as it's very difficult to judge the temp and you don't want to ruin the bearing. Hope this makes sense and I'm not too late!

[@MrBassjan]

Hi, is there n online version of that manual? I bought an old Rockwell with that system, but the button is also pushed in without the gears engaged. It stays in woodcutting mode. However, by putting a very large pulley on it, they got it into a slow speed for metal cutting...

[@alaskabearhawk]

MrBassjan Hi... I did find an online manual for the saw, but don’t know if the pdf still exists. Let me check this evening. I have two. One is a manual that came with the saw when new and the other is a military manual that is way more detailed. I’ll check this evening. One thing to remember is the saw needs the gear reduction to cut metal. Not only for speed reduction but helps to handle the additional stress on the saw as it makes cuts in hard materials.

[@MrBassjan]

@@alaskabearhawk thank you, I searched quite a bit, but always find those with less information. I managed to disengage the pulley but nothing engaged on the inside. I hope it is just the same problem and that the gears are still there... The shaft in the middle was used as intermediary pulley... And the small concentric shaft is sawed off...

[@alaskabearhawk]

@@MrBassjan www.liberatedmanuals.com/TM-9-3405-206-14-and-P.pdf

[@alaskabearhawk]

@@MrBassjan vintagemachinery.org/pubs/detail.aspx?id=2460

[@MrBassjan]

@@alaskabearhawk wow, thank you very much!! And thanks for the quick answer!

[@lamarrmingle5976]

I have the same saw. The problem with mine is that the shaft with the handle is stuck in the high speed position. Could it be frozen due to rust or corrrosion? What would you suggest I do to free it? Thank you.

[@alaskabearhawk]

Since the shaft slides internally, it could just be old oil and other gunk built up inside. It could be rust, but I hope not. Try some Aero Kroil and tap lightly to help it penetrate. It seems to really work. Patience is key. It could take a few days. Sorry for the late reply.

[@strawboss59]

Very nice! I'm looking at buying the same machine but the knob that engages/disengages the gearbox won't move. I'm thinking that a busted roll pin has jammed it tight or it might be corrosion/gummy oil that keeps it from sliding....do you have any ideas? I can't run it because the seller doesen't have a 230 volt outlet.Thanks.

[@alaskabearhawk]

Well, like everything, it depends. A few things I look for: Does the machine look abused? Are there parts missing? Does the gearbox turn? The gearbox should turn when the pulleys are turned by hand. The 220V motor can be either rewired for 110V or it can be swapped out...they are relatively inexpensive. Look for signs of being stored outside or in a damp environment. These are great machines and are worth saving if you can get it for a reasonable price. How much does he want for it?

[@strawboss59]

@@alaskabearhawk It was selling on an online gov't auction. I put a bid in of ~$300.00 Cdn, the winning bid was slightly more than twice my bid. I have 220vac in my shop so that was no problem, the largest pulley was hard to turn by hand.

[@romex1465]

I am working on the same band saw that you have. I noticed the band saw documentation you had. It gives a great breakdown of the transmission. Could you tell me where you got it please? The one's that I have downloaded don't really cover the tear down of the saw.

[@alaskabearhawk]

+Jonathon Roman Try looking for "TM 9-3405-206-14 & P" in Google. That is the military version of the manual for the band saw and has quite a bit more info. Hope that helps...

[@romex1465]

+alaskabearhawk Thank you I found the manual. I would never have thought of that. Thank again.

[@joedoyle3598]

Rome, I just found the manual (or something close) when I discovered that I have a 28-303 bandsaw. The diagram was either exactly the same or pretty close to what ABH shows in the video. Check out page 11. www.mikestools.com/download/Delta-Bandsaw-manuals/28-303.pdf

[@djtafoya1]

Like the description and detail. Would like to see it put back together and running though.

[@alaskabearhawk]

I could do that, but it would just be a video of a running band saw. Kinda anti-climactic I think.

[@kr2bldr]

How about a video on the engine?

[@acmecider9069]

Wanted to thank you for the video! My Rockwell 28-300 has had that stupid broken inner roller pin for several years. After watching your video it was very easy to remove lower gear box, tap out upper gear shaft and remove the broken roller pin. Could that pin be any more fragile? What a dumb design. Everything else associated with that saw is very well made. Mine [1974] was purchased as NOS in 1995 and aside from that pin breaking it's be a great tool.

[@leopavao8667]

I have some issues with my gearbox on the same saw. How did you get the gear box off? I notices resistance after pulling the cover back about 1/4" Any help would be appreciated.

[@paulminelga3353]

Hey Leo, sorry of the late reply.. Had guests staying with us that just left. After I did the video I found a much easier way to get the gearbox cover off. You can jiggle and fuss with it and work it out without taking the bottom main shaft out. But watch the video at 6::15. I talk about removing the lower shaft. If you take out the lower shaft out first before removing the gearbox cover and gears, the top gear is released and can move around in there. Take a stick and insert it where the lower shaft goes through to keep that top gear from falling into the bottom of the gearbox when you remove the lower gear assembly. That should give you enough play to take out the lower gears no problem. Hope this helps...

[@jeffreydeutsch7336]

I do not reccomend jiggling. The spiral cut gears are still meshed. If you rotate the shaft as you pull, the plate, with the gear, will come right off. That gear is hard and brittle. I learned the hard way. If you pry you will bust the gear teeth. It was 60 bucks when I messed up. Today you will probably never get a replacement

[@paulmorgan5841]

Good stuff

[@David-kq9vp]

Where do you find the location to indicate what size blade . I just picked up the same saw

[@alaskabearhawk]

Go to vintagemachinery.org/pubs/detail.aspx?id=5750 and download the owner's manual. On page 17 of the manual in the parts section it shows the blade widths that are acceptable. It goes from 1/8th inch to 3/4 inch wide, tooth spacing dependent on material being cut. On the back of the upper wheel is the blade tensioner. Read page 3 and 4 for the procedure to adjust the blade tension. Hope this helps...

[@David-kq9vp]

Thanks