Review: Rocket Cronometro R Giotto and Mozzafiato Espresso Machines

[@AxellFolley]

Would you recommend the And ask this ROCKET MOZZAFIATO CRONOMETRO or the new Apartmento Tca thanks .

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi AF, If given the choice I'd go with the Mozzafiato - of course it's more $$ Marc

[@annakryzilinski4748]

This channel is way more than amazing. It brings coffee making knowledge to a stratospheric level.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Wow, thanks! Marc

[@N___470-e6f]

@@Wholelattelovepage ج١و١

[@BarryMcGreal]

Thanks for the video. Have this machine with Eureka mignon specialita about two years now and wondering it upgrading the grinder to ceado e37s will give me any noticeable improvement in taste of espresso? (I have watched most of uour ceado vids so do understand the other benefits of the machine, but really kist curious about flavour). Thanks !

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi, larger burrs like those in the E37S produce a more consistent grind particle size. Compared to the Specialita the E37S produces a fluffier and virtually clump free grind. Distribution into the PF is excellent as is consistency of dose to dose timed weight output. Once you reach a certain level of grinder taste improvements are incremental and subjective. Both the Specialita and E37S produce excellent espresso. The Ceado, by reducing variables makes it easier to do so consistently. Marc

[@ah14032006]

Hi Mark, could you please let me know why there is always (and I really mean always) a heating symbol on some machines when they are turned on when not pulling a shot? The machines in your video don´t have it but many others I saw on the internet do. Do you know anything about it? Does it depent on the charge you receive? Another Software? Many thanks from Hamburg, Germany! :-)

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi H, Just answered this in another comment. Marc

[@squibcakes74]

I agree the hidden pid display is better for authentic look. Nice machines!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi sc, Thanks for the comment. A little hidden tech! Marc

[@nikilow5748]

Thanks Marc for sharing these great videos! For Rocket Cronometro Giotto / Mozzafiato both type R and V, and R58 as well) can we use smart plug to set timing in the morning so machine can be started automatically? i assume these machines are not time programmable and since they need to warm up 20-25min, i wonder if i can buy a smart plug to set the timing to switch on and off. Thanks so much!

[@davidd7064]

You can use a smart plug. Just be sure the smart plug is rated at (or above) the amps of the machine. I believe the R58 can already be timed. I know the cinquantotto can and think the previous R58 can as well.

[@TomReinerDE]

I have a small kitchen and therefore the Rocket Appartamento. Love it so much...

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Tom, Thanks for the comment! The aptly named Appartamento is a good fit for small places. Marc

[@lukepypu5693]

I have Mozzafiato Cronometro R and found that after long period of idle 60 minutes my group reach 92-93 Celsius When group has 92 different, i guess boiling water comes from shower and after a while normal flow occurs. Group temperature rises to 96 Celsius and after few minutes after flush drops to 88-89. So I started to do a little flush and I am wondering what temperature do I get? PID is set to 121 C which should give 95 C according to manual. It would be nice if someone with Scace device established correct flushing/no flushing routine. I have noticed that if I make espresso every 5-10 minutes group temereture remains stable and has lower temperature than after long idle period. In this moment I think that flush is necessary after long idle period. But maybe I am wrong?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi LP, Thanks for sharing your info and the question. Group temperature can vary a bit depending on use level. Long idle periods may tend to cause a rise in group temps. So like you are doing a short flush to smooth flow prior to extraction is a good idea after long idle periods. There will be slight variations in group temps depending on ambient temps and air movement in vicinity of the machine. Personally I would trust the manual but do a quick check with a short flush. Do that for a few days or in different situations and you should develop a feel for when the machine needs it. Hope that helps! Marc

[@ad1swiss]

Does it need cooling flush?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hey AZ, Need to flush depends on time from last use. If you run pump with PF off and see bubbling steamy water then flush a few seconds until water flow from group becomes smooth. Marc

[@kdiggitydog7696]

Hi Marc, I was just comparing the weights of Giotto and Mozzafiato Cronometro R on the respective Spec sheets when I noticed the Giotto is about 15 lbs lighter than the Mozzafiato. To what do you attribute the much lighter weight of the Giotto, and do you think this suggests less robust build quality of the Giotto versus the Mozzafiato? Thanks in advance!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hey kdd, Internally the machines are nearly identical. All or most of the weight difference comes from the Mozzafiato side panels which are heavier thick slabs. Marc

[@chadashton7029]

Sucks that ALL Rocket machines don't have the tray magnets. The tray on the Appartamento slides off so easily...I've dumped one double shot and one frothing pitcher full of milk by simply wiping the drip tray with a towel and the whole tray slid back and away from the machine. Of course now I don't wipe with anything sitting on the tray but that really shouldn't have to be a concern. I'll be adding my own magnets but obviously it's something that Rocket knows about that they would be adding magnets to at least some of their machines. I know pretty minor complaint...but still one that IMO is a legit issue.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Chad, Thanks for your comment - I'd be frustrated dumping milk and shots too! Sounds like a change in technique helped avoid anymore of that. At this point the magnets are a feature found on these more expensive machines. Surely something you could DIY a solution too. Maybe super glue some rare earth magnets to strategic locations on your machine. Marc

[@m.f.8752]

Hey, where’d you guys go? Haven’t seen any vids for a while. Looking forward to seeing some new videos covering updates to rocket equipment - and anything else coffee-related.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

hey MF, We're still here! Recently completed our top 5 favorites of 2022 in a bunch of categories including dual boilers, HX boilers, premium entry-level machines, grinders and automatics. Also a recent focus on support videos. Many of those don't go public. They're unlisted but available through our customer support here: support.wholelattelove.com/hc/en-us For Rocket equipment, did this video last week showing how to calibrate the new Faustino: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e5nXfmahZt-Lo9U Marc

[@qwe7410]

It's not uncommon for drip trays to overflow and land exactly at the spot where the PID is located. That's a display + regulator combined, not cheap to replace. Came across a snapped off ceramic mushrooms. Good video from WLL though.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi q, thanks for the comment. You are correct with location of PID. One does want to empty the drip tray! In most cases the front end of the PID is fairly impervious to moisture. I agree with ceramic mushrooms - they are brittle and can snap if dropped or similar. I prefer stainless steel mushrooms. Marc

[@dickburns2403]

Below the green power indicator on the lower left are 3 symbols. They seem to be a water drop, 3 wavey lines, and lightning bolt looking thing. Do they actually serve a purpose or are they strictly aesthetic?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi db, They are graphics indicating power and water functions. Marc

[@GNRritz88ROCKS]

I just got a Mozzafiato R recently - when I try to pull a shot, the coffee almost just spits outs of the portafilter very fast, no slow creamy shot? There is no crema at all. Any suggestions?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hey G, Shots pulling too fast is a near 100% indication your grind size is too coarse. Here's a video explaining the simple process of dialing-in to the correct grind size: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oIC8aHdmZ9Nnedk Marc

[@justinriddett9595]

Hi there, is the warming cup area on the Giotta smaller vs. the Mozzafiato? Looks to be that way over the video but I might be wrong? Justin

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi JR, Ever so slightly smaller. Minus the panels the machines are identical. The way the Giotto has the rails around the tray takes a bit more space making surface area of cup warmer smaller. Marc

[@hussainmahmoud7881]

Thank you for the detailed review, What is the difference between both machines apart from external look, as the Mozza. is cheaper?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

HI HM, No internal difference between the Giotto and Mozzafiato models. Just the external case. Marc

[@rAustinBall]

Hi Marc. I've finally landed on my first good machine. The Mozzafiato R. Can't wait. Just to clarify, You still need to do a cooling flush with the PID yes? I've heard elsewhere that the water that's in the tube for brewing will be too hot because it's been surrounded by the steam temp water for too long.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Austin, Thanks for question. I've done a lot of Scace testing of HX boiler machines with PID. Based on those tests, I believe in most cases a cooling flush is not required. It's a very different story when using HX machines without PID. Here's a video I posted yesterday on the ECM Technika V Profi PID, a very similar machine to the Mozz R: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nGHRdaShfN-Veq8 In that video I do a Scace test after the machine was sitting idle for 2 hours. No cooling flush and no overheated water. Of course this is not your machine. And your ambient conditions may be different. In the video I do a demo showing how important the E61 group is in dissipating heat and how ambient conditions might affect brew temps. A couple of things to know: Water does not sit in the tube within the HX section of the boiler. It's constantly circulating out to the group and back. I explain how this thermosiphon works in the linked video using an HX boiler and E61 group cut in half for a view of internals. Also, keep the portafilter in the group when your machine is on and idle. It's part of the the system which bleeds heat from the HX section of the boiler. Marc

[@ANTheWhizkid]

Want to buy the machine next month anyway. But you know how that is, before you get something like that... you enjoy the thrill of anticipation, watching videos of your chosen product^^ What I´d recommend is a pressure regulator if you wanna use the waterline of your household (at least in europe - im not aware of water pressure in the usa)

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Whiz, Thanks for the comment. Yes - if plumbing a machine direct to waterline a pressure regulator is recommended in some cases. Rocket Espresso recommends a regulator to limit plumbed in pressure to 5bar/~75psi. In US typical domestic water pressure is ~60psi/4 bar but I've seen it range from 40-85psi (1 bar = ~15psi). So for Rocket machines in US pressure regulator may not be needed. Another determining factor is hydraulic system design of a particular machine. All plumbable Rocket machines have a solenoid valve on the waterline connection which only opens the machine to outside pressure when the pump is on. It's a little different in machines from Profitec/ECM. They do not have a solenoid valve on the waterline connection so the machine is always open to line pressure. This allows for line pressure pre-infusion. Profitec/ECM recommends a pressure regulator to limit input water pressure to 2 bar/30 psi. Marc

[@OmarSiddiqi__]

hey Mark, absolutely love your KZbin channel. you’ve made my journey into coffee so much more meaningful, and allowed me to find joy in the mishaps along the way. i’m currently trying to decide between the Rocket Appartamento and the Ascaso Steel DUO PID. I was wondering if you were planning on doing a comparison video between the two, or if you could offer your advice on which one I should buy. The Apartamento of course has a proven record, but it would be nice to have temperature control and near instant heating. thank you in advance for your insight 🤍

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Omar, Thanks for the kind comments. The Ascaso you mention uses thermoblock heaters instead of true boilers. Sorry, I have to be honest... but for that reason it's not a product I'm interested in looking at. Thermoblocks will have issues long-term unless one is extra careful with water quality. For less $$ than the Appartamento have a look at the Profitec Pro 400: www.wholelattelove.com/products/profitec-pro-400-espresso-machine-flow-control E61 group, stainless boiler and 3 level PID. If you purchase from us, flow control on the Pro 400 is a free upgrade at the moment. The Pro 400 is a newer machine so not the track record of the Appartamento but I've been inside the 400 and like other Profitec machines I give it the edge in build quality tyo comaprable priced Rocket machines. Marc

[@Mt.herzberg99]

That's wow video

[@ВиталийБойко-з5й]

Hi there! Nice and informative review, as always. Question is, what is the counterpart of Rocket Giotto from Bezzera is? Thanks for job, Vitals!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi! Thanks for the comment and question. Closest machine from Bezzera is the Magica. It's an HX boiler machine with E61 group. Main difference is the Magica uses a vibration pump while the Giotto in this video uses a rotary pump. Check out the Magica here: www.wholelattelove.com/collections/semi-automatic-espresso-machines/products/bezzera-magica-pid-espresso-machine Marc

[@ВиталийБойко-з5й]

@@Wholelattelovepage I have already trialed the Magica in our coffee workshop, despite using rather noisy vibration pump, it works amazing

[@horeinator]

Is the walnut version still available? I don't see it on the store !

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Spencer, The walnut version of the Mozzafiato and Giotto Chronometro machines have been very popular and are currently out of stock. We hope to have more soon! Marc

[@alfonsplasil]

That is unfortunately completely not true. Have this at home and you need to flush big time. Of course you do. Its a HX design. Otherwise a nice video

[@Todd.T]

Unfortunately you are incorrect. I own one. No flushing required. You must be thinking of an older machine with no PID that will need flushing for sure. The only way this would need a flush is if you have the temperature set too high, but you'd see that on a gauge. If you need to flush, something is off and you'd better have it checked out. And you're right, it is a nice video.

[@pjshien]

I bought Rocket Giotto type V last year. This is also my question, reallly do not need to flush even the machine is idle for long time (e.g 30 mins)? My seller told me, as long as it is heat exchange machine, flush is needed. But saw Whole Latte video, no flush is needed. 🤔🤔🤔

[@Todd.T]

@@pjshien I see many other merchants of this fine product that are stuck in the past and mention you have to flush the machine. They made KZbin videos as well. When they flush, no steamy water comes out, so I think they need to review how to use the machine. In between Whole Latte Love's detailed videos and comparisons showing no flush needed on PID HX Profitec and PID HX Rockets and the other people telling you to flush it while they are doing it and the water comes out without steam, you have your answer. The way it used to be @7:48, then compare to the above video @ 2:40 for how things have changed. kzbin.info/www/bejne/bX6vdnaGga2Uf8k

[@alfonsplasil]

@@Todd.T do you have brew temperature gauge installed?

[@Todd.T]

@@alfonsplasil I've just got the factory steam boiler gauge, which of course affects the brew temperature. The gauge has the green zone which is more about the brew temperature and nothing really about the steam temp. I mean, it indicates steam temp, but the green zone is where the brew temp is concerned. On 121/92.5 degrees, the gauge is in the middle of the green zone. At 122/93.5 degrees the gauge is at about 90% total of the green zone. What is yours set at??

[@justv22]

Hey Mark, for these Rocket machines specifically Mazzafiato, do I need to purge the steam wand after the machine is turned off? Any other tips for daily use?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hey J, You do not need to purge prior to shutdown but always purge after steaming milk - every single time!. Other stuff: 1. Run a couple of cups of water out of the hot water tap every day or two unless regularly using hot water from the machine. This will reuce minerals 2. Filter/treat water with a BWT product to reduce calcium and prevent scale. 3. Backflush with water only every 10 brew cycles. Backflush with Cafiza or similar every 100 brew cycles. 4. Allow the machine to fully warm up before use and have the PF in the group when warming up. 5. Make EXCELLENT espresso - of course! Marc

[@justv22]

@@Wholelattelovepage thank you Mark! You guys are the best!! 🙌🏻

[@humstrumbangtwang]

The best videos on these machines. Rocket would not do a better job!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi h, Well thanks for the comment! Marc

[@andreashuber7653]

Thanks for the greate video. I already have the Mozzafiato and it is great design. Like in this video and others the espresso spouts out and does not have a nice flow. Did you ever saw a Rocket machine which produces nice espresso flows without splashing? I have 5 years of expereince with 2 other machines and do not get it right with this one.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Andreas, You are welcome for the video. Not sure I understand what you mean by the espresso splashing? Marc

[@andreashuber7653]

Hello Marc, at the start of the video when you pull the shot the espresso spurt goes left to right, dripping and no constant flow like I see on other machines e.g. Profitec. At least at my machine the espresso flows using the two spout portafilter goe to the middle so that it runs over the rim of the espresso cup. Actually the espresso tastes good. Shot time (25 sec) and ml (25ml) are also in the recommended range. So the question was if it is common to Rocket machines?

[@hannahverheul6563]

Would you recommend the Profitec pro 400 new or a used mozzafiato v with PID? Thanks

[@rivertranced]

Great stuff, Marc! I read through the questions below and did not see this answered, but apologies if you've listed it somewhere else. Do you think this machine could keep up with doing 2-3 12 oz lattes in a row, or would I need to go up to a double boiler? I'd be OK doing all the milk at once if that made a difference.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi river, Thanks for the comment and question. Dual boiler would definitely be more capable and there would be less interference of HX boiler heating in brew temps doing back to back drinks. That said, I think this machine is capable of 2-3 back to back drinks. It should totally recover by the time you've prepped the next shot and refilled you milk pitcher. I would not suggest steaming all the milk for 3 drinks at the same time. Hope that helps! Marc

[@rivertranced]

Thanks!

[@BigPoppa-t3z]

Marry, on my mozzafiato i notice the circulation of the water in the e61 is much less. I had the Apartamento and you used to hear it all the time. The mozzafiato not so much. Is it because of the pid. I also notice with a brew head with my temp gauge it’s not what the pid say now I’m talking about when I’m not pulling a shot or when I’m not flushing just when it’s just sitting there. The Apartamento when just sitting got like 207 F. Is this because I didn’t pull the shot yet. Is it because the pid got the boiler water to desired temp and when I pull the water coming through bre head will be at the temp of the pid? Thank you much.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Dirr, Honestly don't think you should be hearing circulation of the thermosiphon. I've never heard that on any machine! On the Appartamento only thing I can guess is maybe hearing some boiling associated with high temps. 207F in the group is really close to boiling and it's likely (but not certain) there were some bubbles in thermosiphon. But again, I've never hear that on any E61 machine.

[@YuGoXDD]

Hi Marc, great Video as always! What would you consider to be a good or actually a great single boiler machine? I'm usually just drinking straight up espresso 99% of the time and need a new machine for that

[@yevgeniydundukov8179]

ECM Classika PID or ECM Puristika

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Yugo, Thanks for your comment. For 99% espresso the current class act of the single boiler field is the ECM Classika with flow control: www.wholelattelove.com/products/ecm-classika-pid-espresso-machine-with-flow-control Marc

[@hannahverheul6563]

Just wondered what the longevity of copper boilers are? As I’ve read stainless steel tends to be better as doesn’t scale or degrade so is it risky buying a copper boiler in this day and age and does it mean I can’t descale the espresso machine? Thanks again 😊😊

[@marcochiasson2298]

Mark, great video (again!). I bought myself a Mozzafiato for Xmas. Love the machine. Not sure why they add the hot water spout though (do you? Legit question here). The steam boiler water is way too hot for Americanos (obviously) so I end up using my kettle. Next time might look at dual boiler machine.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Marco, Thanks for your comment and happy to hear you are loving the Mozzafiato - beautiful machine! Unless you get into a machine with water mixing on the hot water tap (which does not exist to best of my knowledge in HX boiler machines) that'll always be an issue. I know what you're talking about. I prefer Americanos served at ~155F/68C. With a dual boiler you might be able to bring the temp down in the service boiler, but depends on machine as to what you can set as minimum. You might try taking your hot water into a cold cup prior to extraction so it can cool a bit before use. Marc

[@aportilla007]

Just a thought here....you could prefill your container with a "finger" of room temp water...

[@Neihdmai]

Thoughts on the timer starting as soon as the lever is raised? In previous videos you mentioned you like to start timing on first drip. Thanks!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi s, I've covered this in a few of my videos and in many comments... Timing is the most basic measure of appraising an extraction. Use it to get dialed in for grind size and then use a a scale, brew ratios and taste. I prefer first drip as I use so many different types of machines as well as doing extended low flow rate pre-infusions. For me timing from first drip evens out the differences. For example, it takes 5 or so seconds more for a vibration pump machine to come up to full pressure than it does for a machine with a rotary pump. Should I use the same timing for both? Probably not. If always using the same machine then timing is a useful reference point. Regardless of what some may say it's fine to go outside the basic timing rules so long as it produces an espresso you like. When I do extended pre-infusions and/or lower flow rate extractions 40 seconds from pump on happens all the time and the shots are phenomenal! Here's a video in which I pull some bottomless triple shots using a fresh from roast Yirgacheffe coffee at 1:2 ratio. As I recall the shot I liked best using a long low flow pre-infusion followed by a lower than standard flow ran ~40 seconds from pump on while it was in the 20's timed from first drip. Here's a link to that video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/foXEnaxumJKclbc IMO those that get wrapped up in timing sholud ditch the stopwatch once a coffee is dialed in and then use a scale, brew ratios and flavor. Hope that helps :) Marc

[@Neihdmai]

@@Wholelattelovepage Thanks Marc for the thoughtful response - I recently got a rocket Giotto chronometro R and was unsure of the benefit of the shot timer starting immediately.

[@siqi]

The good : reliable///nearly 10000 shots only steam noob gasket leaking drops. Much Quieter than V pump///works like belt drive garage door opener compare with chain drive. The BAD: small water tank ///seems only designed for plan B so pls plumbing it! All E61 may burns your arm /// better than a cup of coffee to wake u up ouch! Small tray cause Desk wet/// need extra tray when brush cleaning like Silvia. Weak steam/// not because my steam gasket start leaking! Over all for not wake my baby up , it was a good buy:/

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi SQ Y, Thanks for sharing your experience. Yes, do plumb that machine! Nothing so freeing as never having to fill a reservoir again! E61 groups all get hot so not a place to be resting exposed skin - ouch! Weak steam is surprising. Should have plenty of steam for steaming even in a larger pitcher. Marc

[@siqi]

Whole Latte Love I got faster results from Silvia PID than this. You are right. I should say decent steam power, not weak!

[@jbosch3362]

Hi Marc. I'm investing in a new machine. Which one is better. Rocket Cronometro R Mozzafiato or Bezzera duo Top DE

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi J, Thanks for the question. Both machines are quite good and similarly capable of making excellent espresso. The Rocket uses a heat exchange boiler while the Bezzera Duo is a dual boiler. With the dual boiler you'll have individual control of temps in each boiler so changing temp in the steam boiler has no affect on brew temps. That's not the case woth the Mozzafiato with the HX boiler. Beyond that the Mozzafiato uses an E61 manual group while the Duo DE uses the BZ group which is electrically heated. With that, the Duo is faster from cold turn on to ready to brew. Duo has a touch screen control and push brewing start for both programmable espresso sizes or manual start stop of extraction. Mozzafiato is free of digital displays except for the small shot timer. Here's a link to a side by side spec comparison of the machines for more details: /pages/compare?products=MTU0NjAwNDEzNTk5NSw0Mzk3MTY0NjkxNTEw Hope that helps! Marc

[@lukepypu5693]

Should I adjust PID settings when I use naked portafilter? If portafiler works as heat sink, smaller naked portafilter will distribute less heat So I am wondering if 121 Celsius still gives 95,1 Celcius on the group?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi LP, Thanks for the question. You might turn the temp down a bit when using a naked PF as it will not pull as much heat out of the group when idle. Marc

[@rodrigocartens7563]

For a small coffee shop, which machine would you recomend, that is good looking and efficient? 😀 By the way. Amazon review on the Rocket.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi RC, Thanks for the comment and question. These Rocket machines are technically not rated for commercial service. That said some likely use in offices, bed and breakfast, etc. If your local regulations allow the use of non-commercially rated equipment you could get away with one of these heat-exchange boiler machines for lower volume service. These models have commercial grade rotary pumps and can be plumbed direct to waterline for unending water supply. You might want to take a look at dual boiler machines which have separate boilers heating water for steaming and brewing. With those you'll have more steaming power and more consistent brew temperatures. Have a look at the Profitec Pro 700: www.wholelattelove.com/products/profitec-pro-700-dual-boiler-with-flow-control or the ECM Synchronika: www.wholelattelove.com/products/ecm-synchronika-dual-boiler-with-flow-control Marc

[@BigPoppa-t3z]

Mar question I have this model. I set pid but I also have a brew head temp on this unit also and it seems the brew head dosnt get to this temp. I mean sometimes but not always. The water function when I dispense water it’s scolding I understand this but leaving machine idle very rarly getting to that 201 202 etc I have to like flush a lot. Is this normal or is my brew head temp off or forget about brew head temp unit. Thanks. I just checked machine at pid of 252 it finally hit about 201 F on group head. Maybe I’m overthinking this. I just want to make sure when I pull a shot it’s not like 192 while pulling. At 201 is good to do it.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Dirk, Thanks for the question. The group temp gauge will not read the full brew temp when the machine is idle. I do not use group mounted thermometers much as I have a Scace device which is far more accurate IMO. Think you are overthinking. Marc

[@rAustinBall]

Hi Marc. The price for these two machines at a retailer in Canada just went up $500 ($375 USD). They say it is Rocket increasing their prices due to increasing costs. Have you heard anything about this? Apparently ECM and Profitec prices are going up next week as well.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Austin, I have not heard anything about price increases but it's not a part of the business I'm involved in. Marc

[@kennyallan5113]

Hi Mark, your videos are great, have been watching for some time trying to decide which machine to buy and your reviews certainly help. Would you be able to answer my question regards model numbers for the Rocket Mozzafiato machines. At the end of the numbers are, A07, A11, B11, W11. What are the differencies between these machines? many thanks.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Kenny, Thanks for the comment and question. I'm guessing the model number differences are related to different versions of the machine. The Mozzafiato has had 4 recent types. The newest two are the Cronometro versions which have the shot timer on the face of the machines. The Cronometro comes in the "R" version which have a rotary pump and are plumbable and the "V" version which uses a vibration pump and is not plumbable. To complicate things a bit more both the R and V types are available in "Nera" which denotes black side panels and "Bianca" with white side panels. Here's a link showing all 6 current versions of the Mozzafiato side by side: www.wholelattelove.com/collections/all-espresso-machines?_=pf&pf_v_brand=Rocket%20Espresso&pf_p_price=2156%3A3200 Hope that helps! Marc

[@joseph248]

Hi Marc, I have the rocket giotto v and running into the problem that my brew pressure is only reading 2-4 bars upon extraction. Weight of ground coffee is 17-18g and in 25-35s pouring a 2oz shot. How can I be sure or differentiate if the brew pressure needs to be adjusted or simply adjust the grind size? Is the giotto lock ring also on the base of the machine? Thank you!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi J, Thanks for the question. Your time/volume is good. If brew pressure is indicating only 2-4 bar and gauge is correct your grind must be rather coarse to get that timing. Does your grind seem coarse compared to when your brew pressure read normally? If not I suspect your gauge reading is incorrect. What does the gauge read with a backflush disc in place? If it's reading 9-10bar then gauge and pump are good. If in US and would like some one on one phone support please contact our tech support at 585-924-7170. Marc

[@GlennMartin]

Would you recommend the extra $$ and go for the Cronometro over the Appartamento? Just coming form a Rancilio but wondering if the PID is a big winner here as I don't think the Appartamento has one.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Glenn, Thanks for the question. You are correct no PID in the Appartamento. Depends on your budget but the Cronometro R Giotto and Mozzafiato machines are a big step up from the Appartamento. Beyond the PID, The "R" versions of these machines are plumbable direct to waterline. There are Type V versions which use a vibration pump and are not plumbable. Both version of these machines produce very consistent brew temps without the need in most cases to do a cooling flush prior to an extraction. The Appartamento almost always requires a cooling flush. Hope that helps! Marc

[@mahdialbuwaidi8331]

could you explain in a video how direct plumb Espresso Machine in rocket machine (direct line & water tank large bottle ) and do i have to put Flojet, water pressure valve ... please

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi MA, Thanks for the request/question... Most machines with rotary pumps can draw from a water bottle without a Flojet so long as the water bottle is not significantly below the level of the machine and you will not need a water pressure regulator in that setup or if direct plumbing to pressurized plumbing. Rocket machines have a solenoid valve on the plumbed in water connection which only opens the machine to external pressure when the pump is operating. Hope that helps! Marc

[@markpalmos]

Fabulous! How long do they take to warm up first thing in the morning (in a 62°f kitchen) ?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hey Mark, I'd allow ~25 minutes for full warmup. Machine will show boiler up to temp far sooner but you want the mass of the group fully warmed as well. As the Cronometros have a mechanical power switch it is possible to use an appropriately rated appliance timer so you don't have to flip the switch. Marc

[@okaybarista]

Hi Mark, I have a question for you. Do you think the Rocket Cronometro R Giotto could hold up in a small shop making under 30 espresso drinks a day?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Lucas, The machine can handle that volume but a couple of things to be aware of. The machine is not NSF rated so not truly intended for commercial service. You may get a slight rise in brew temp if doing many shots in quick succession. Marc

[@lukepypu5693]

For how long machine was idle before SCACE tests? I am wondering if it needs flush after long idle period.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Luke, They were idle for at least 15 minutes prior to test. Depending on ambient temps machine could require a short flush after extended idle times.

[@BigPoppa-t3z]

Mar, you talked about pid and Celsius and F. I got into that menus and I changed it but I clicked one more time I guess I went to the next item and I think I changed something from zero to one. How can I go back to factory reset on machine so I start at beginning. Thanks

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Here's a link to listing of the factory settings for the Mozzafiato: www.home-barista.com/repairs/rocket-mozzafiato-pid-settings-reset-t53477.html Be very careful in there! Marc

[@DarkPa1adin]

Apart from the shell design, are they any differences? I didn't hear you mention any apart from the shell and maybe cup rail

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi D, Thanks for the question. Internally the machines are identical. Slight aesthetic difference in the design of the feet but other than that the same. Marc

[@baristakev5709]

What espresso machine would you recommend for a step up of a breville barista espress

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi LK, The Rocket Cronometro R machines in this video are a step up from Barista Express. Beyond these any Italian made machine with a heat exchange or dual boiler is a step up. Also have a look at the Rocket Apartamento: www.wholelattelove.com/collections/semi-automatic-espresso-machines/products/rocket-espresso-appartamento-with-black-panels Profitec Pro 300: www.wholelattelove.com/collections/semi-automatic-espresso-machines/products/profitec-pro-300-dual-boiler-espresso-machine Bezzera BZ10: www.wholelattelove.com/collections/semi-automatic-espresso-machines/products/bezzera-bz10-espresso-machine Marc

[@yevgeniydundukov8179]

Marc, I wonder if you can talk to Michael Hauck from ECM at the earliest occasion and share this great idea about drip tray magnet holder. Unless it's already patented by Rocket. ECM Synchronika needs them too, absolutely! For the new machines and as a retrofit kit for the current owners.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi YD, I will mention along with swapping out single spout PF and single basket for a bottomless and triple basket. I will say on most Profitec and ECM machines drip trays stay in place better than on Rocket machines without magnets. They're not really needed on Synchronika as one must lift up a bit on the drip tray to remove. Marc

[@nocoffeenogame]

How would a machine like this fare in a smaller specialty coffee shop?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi SC, Thanks for the question. Technically these are not commercial machines. They are not NSF rated. That said, they could serve in a low volume environment. Marc

[@baristakev5709]

Hi Marc I have a question So do you think I could store coffee in my bean hopper on my grinder if I only put enough in there for the day so it wouldn’t sit in there for days and just for like a few hours

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi LiLK, Thanks for the question. I think that's perfectly fine - I do it all the time! Matc

[@baristakev5709]

whats better the baratza 270 or the eureka mignon

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi LK, Thanks for the question. That's a tough one... I love the Sette 270 Wi. So nice to grind hands free and know I'm getting accurate weight every time. Also love the fluffy well distributed grind it produces. Compared to the Mignon It's a lesser build quality, but much faster and also louder due to it's open design. The Mignon is decent at cycle to cycle weights using timed based grinding. But as you change grind size the timing needs to change to keep dosing weight the same. If you're particular about dose weight and do a lot of dialing in it's extra steps with a scale to be accurate with the Mignon. With the 270 Wi I barley have to give that a thought. What's better depends on how you will use it. Hope that helps! Marc

[@aportilla007]

Hi Mark, so I've been feverishly educating myself for 3 weeks on espresso machines. My head is spinning. Please, advice is needed. I've decided to buy from Whole Latte Love because of the support and the videos - you sold me ;) I'm down to these 3, and all I ask is for you to pick one (everyone else is encouraged to chime in): 1 - Quick Mill Vetrano 2B Evo Dual Boiler Espresso Machine 2 - Profitec Pro 700 Dual Boiler Espresso Machine 3 - Rocket Espresso Mozzafiato Cronometro R Espresso Machine Thank you, kindly!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hey Alex, Thanks for the comment. My easy choice of those 3 is the Profitec Pro 700.

[@aportilla007]

@@Wholelattelovepage Thanks!

[@cigarnationwarriors3981]

Marc, can I use the Rocket Ceramic Mushroom Valve Assembly in my Profitec Pro 500? My first Mushroom Valve lost MOST of its chrome. NOT GOOD😱🤬😱

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi William, You must have an old Pro 500! Profitec and ECM have used stainless steel mushroom valves in all E61 group machines for a number of years now. I would suggest replacing your chromed mushroom with a SS mushroom. Marc

[@cigarnationwarriors3981]

Whole Latte Love I bought my PO500 three years ago from Mark Jackson. Are you saying I was sold old equipment?

[@DGooseYT]

please review Milesto EM-30, its a $1500 double boiler, rotary pump machine

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Ryan, Thanks for the request. Unfortunately I do not have access to the machine for a review. Very little info for the made in China product. Marc

[@DGooseYT]

Whole Latte Love i know a seller here from Indonesia, I wanna buy it but im affraid the machine wouldn’t last long because its too cheap

[@benwilson3321]

Hi guys, I have approval from the household finance minister to upgrade our machine. I'm finding it difficult to decide between the Rocket Mozzafiato R as reviewed in this video and an ECM Technika V Profi PID. If you could offer some advice in comparing these two it would be appreciated, thanks.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Ben, Lol - finance minister. I have one of those too! Here's a link to a side by side spec comparison of the machines: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=MjIyMzc0MzUzMzExMCw0Mzk3MTY0NjkxNTEw Some key differences... ECM Technika: Angled PFs, stainless steel boiler, joystick valves, PID on face of machine, more exterior detail, stainless steel mushroom valve Roccket Mozz R: Straight PFs, copper boiler with brass end plates, knob valves, PID control behind drip tray, subtle shot times (Chronometro version), heavier on the branding, ceramic mushroom valve I have no preference to boiler material type, I do prefer angled PFs, valves are personal taste. At the end of the day they are both equally capable. ECM machines tend to be a little more tidy under the hood. Hope that helps! Marc

[@benwilson3321]

@@Wholelattelovepage Thank you for taking the time to reply Marc, your advice is appreciated.

[@MattyMattnj1]

Hey Mark, i recently purchased the Mozzafiato V and found it to be a mistake due to the noise, and just traded up to the Rotary pump with the rosewood handles and love it...my question you had already answered once with the "V" is how to change the PID to F* which you answered by holding both buttons while switching machine on.....after receiving the R, i tried this same procedure but it didn't work? ...how do i do it on the R version?.....also i noticed after having the V for almost 3 weeks i struggled to get the pressure in the "green" no matter how i tamped or grinded it seldom hit that sweet spot on the dial...yet after receiving the R version, without changing a single thing the new machine hits the sweet spot in the green every single time??? Did i have a defective unit?.....Thanks...

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hey ADK, I think it's unlikely your V was defective. Did you ever try running the V with a blind basket in place to check the brew pressure? We recommended vibration pump machines be set to produce 10 bar with a blind filter in place. Adjusting the OPV controls the max brew pressure on vibration pump machines. Happy to hear you are loving the rotary pump machine! They are much quieter than vibration pump machines. To the best of my recollection changing C to F should work the same on the R version. Marc

[@MattyMattnj1]

@@Wholelattelovepage yeah i cant get it to make the switch for some reason...

[@ThunderRunner]

How do you change from Celsius to Fahrenheit? Just purchased this machine from you and it’s not included in the instructions.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi M32, Thanks for the question. I do not have a machine in front of me at the moment so I cannot confirm but fairly certain you hold down both the +/- keys on the PID display while turning the machine on. Wait until "F.__" appears in the display then use the + key to move thru the functions. I believe temp is in F.01 or F.03. Select that function then use the keys to change from C to F. Marc

[@ThunderRunner]

@@Wholelattelovepage perfect! Thank you!

[@hkorasch]

Hi Mark, I had some quality issues with my mozzafiato V and sold it. After your videos about the Crem One I am very interested in these machines. How do you think the Crem One and the Rocket do have differences? Can we compare these machines in terms of quality....styling? Thanks for your videos, als always m: great job!

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi HK, Thanks for the kind comment and question. Sorry to hear about your troubles with the Rocket. Not something I've run into. As too comparing to Crem machines... Style is a personal appraisal. Rockets as you are aware are heavy on the branding. Some like that and some do not. Qualoity of the Crem machines is very good. Be aware they have some plastic like the drip tray and the chassis. Not necessarily a bad thing but some are opposed. The Crem machines with Rotary pumps are extremely quiet. I consider the Rocket machines to be a very classic design and the Crem machines use more modern manufacturing materials/techniques. Marc

[@hkorasch]

@@Wholelattelovepage Hi Marc, thank you for that fast and detailed answer. Rocket is in deed very stylish and beautiful to look at, maybe my issues came from cleaning too much with cleansing tablets :). Did not know about the plastic at the Crem One: thank you very much, this is a very valuable information. Did I mention that I love your channel? I'm loving it :)👌

[@PatrickSittinger]

Hi, Could it be that the R version comes with the magnets and the plastic rim on the drip tray compared with the V version? Or did Rocket an update in 2020?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Patrick, Yes, R (rotary pump) models come with the magnets on drip tray and drip tray slides.

[@PanzerIV88]

Exactly, my mom just received the Type V today that I gifted her and it didn't have magnetic drip tray, which I didn't even know the Rotary version had as even my R58 doesn't have that.

[@muju3585]

Hello Marc. I have a question about this machine and all heat exchanger machines. When we set the brew temperature at 90C, what is the steaming temperature? Is it also 90C ? Does the boiler send the same temperature to both group head and steam ?

[@muju3585]

I know that there is an actual temperature inside boiler but just asking about steam temperature. Did you mesure it?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi MA, These are heat exchange boiler machines. Inside the boiler there is a single heating element. Brew water runs through an isolated section within the boiler so water used to generate steam and that used for brewing do not mix. When you set the brew temperature the steam section of the boiler runs far hotter than the isolated section supplying the brew water. To generate steam the temperature must be higher than 100C/212F. The isolated brew section of an HX boiler constantly circulates water out to the group and back. The water gives up heat to the group and returns cooler. This process happens by convection and is called a "thermosiphon". The water circulation happens without the pump running as it's driven by convection. The constant flow of water out to the group head and back keeps the water in the isolated section of the boiler much cooler than the water in the steam generating section. To make things more confusing some HX machines use an offset when setting temperatures. With those you set your desired brew temp and the machine uses an offset programmed into the PID controller which runs the steam generating portion much hotter. A machine like the Profitec Pro 500 uses an offset. Rocket Espresso machines like those in this video do not use an offset. Using a chart in the manual you look up the desired brew temp and get the temp to set the boiler to get that brew temp. Hope that makes sense and helps! Marc

[@grantlea6752]

G’day Mark, great vid and love the machines. I enjoy the classic, clean look but the Fausto doesn’t seem to follow the same design language, particularly the bright interface. Has Rocket commented on the direction for the grinder or do you have alternate interfaces that can be substituted? The Faustino seems much closer to the Rocket look, but I prefer the bigger burrs and motor.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Grant, I agree! I love the look of the Faustino. Control is far more subtle than on the Fausto and switches to just the "R" when not in use. I have nothing definite on a change to the Fausto display but have heard rumors - stay tuned. Marc

[@AlisonWheeler]

I bought this in Giotto form last week. Mostly I love it... but I don't like the spout on the double being on the 'wrong' side for tamping on a table edge, and the green light is really bright (and I wish it went off once up to temp. Minor niggles though.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi AW, Thanks for the comment. I hear you with the spout location on the PF. Does make table edge tamping a pain. Have you considered a tamping station like this from Rocket Espresso: www.wholelattelove.com/products/rocket-espresso-tamper-station-tamper-not-included Marc

[@AlisonWheeler]

@@Wholelattelovepage One already on order!

[@sickhcivc]

Hi Marc, Im sooo torn on a grinder to go with this Cronometro R, Im torn between an Faustino or the Eureka Atom - if you had to choose which would you go for? Or is the Mignon better haha

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi sickhcivc, Thanks for the question. First up, here's a link to a side by side spec comparison of the Faustino, Atom and Mignon: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=MjI2OTQ5MDQ3OTE1OCwxNTQ1OTk5NDUwMTcxLDIxNDgyODQ0NjUyMDY FYI a not so secret - secret... Eureka makes the Faustino. All these grinders use the same design with the lower burr moving against a fixed top burr for grind size adjustment. If I had to choose I'd go with the Faustino. I'm in love with the look and I prefer the minimal sleek display which reverts to an "R" after being idle. The Mignon is about the same price it has a slightly larger burr according to specs at 55mm v. 50mm in the Faustino. Also like the larger adjustment knob on the Faustino. The Atom has larger 60mm burrs and significantly higher price. In this burr size range I'd take the Faustino with the exterior design I prefer. Hope that helps! Marc

[@sickhcivc]

@@Wholelattelovepage that helps a ton! Thank you so much, and thanks for always replying

[@tobiasr8636]

Hey where can I buy the wood handels? 🤷🏻‍♂️ Is it a extra package?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Tobias, Unfortunately at this point machines with wood components as shown in the video on not available individually. :(

[@tobiasr8636]

Whole Latte Love oh that’s not fair, I want to have it 😋

[@AceHardy]

📝

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Ace!

[@PacoRV]

I understand the hidden PID concept from a design perspective, but c'mon... why would you want a PID if you can't take a look at it to monitor your temperature? 😌

[@alexjoda5241]

The PID is not there to monitor the temperature but to setup the temperature. After about 10 Minutes it shows always the same temperature, the one you set it to. If you want to monitor the relevant temperature you need to buy yourself a brew head thermometer.....

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Jan, Thanks for adding your comment. Slight correction in that the PID display will show current temperature of boiler. Definitely used to set it but also shows the current temp at all times. You will see the temp change in display as the boiler warms up. Also slight variations after reaching full temp. Like if you run off a bunch of steam or hot water the PID display will show a drop in temp in the boiler. Bonus, the little dot in the display indicates when the heating element is energized. So it cycles on/off in pulses. It's that control which makes PID far more accurate than boilers controlled by pressurstats or thermostats with no logic. Marc

[@alexjoda5241]

@@Wholelattelovepage Yes, you can monitor the actual boiler temp with the PID display but i don't see the the need to watch this all the time. That's why they are able to hide it with no problems. The boiler is heating up very quickly and thanks to the PID stays within a small temperature range from there on. You can also look at the boiler pressure (which is always visible) to see that the temperature is reached. Much more interesting is to watch the temperature at the brew head above the coffee puck because this is the relevant temperature for brewing. This is true even more for a HX machine because it is not able to control the brew head temp directly. One can buy a relatively cheap thermometer (mine is from coffee-sensor.com) that is screwed in the maintenance hole of the brew head.

[@DarkPa1adin]

What's their failure rate? I heard a lot of problems with appartamento tho.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi DP, Thanks for the question. Curious what problems you've heard about. We run a busy service center and work on many brands of machines. No unusual failure rate of Rocket Espresso products compared to other manufacturers. The most common cause of issues across all machines is using hard (mineral rich) water which causes scale deposits in machine. You want some minerals, but with proper treatment you can get to a level which will not cause scale in espresso machines. Marc

[@DarkPa1adin]

@@Wholelattelovepage thanks Marc, in Facebook, there's a Rocket group. It is common to hear problems with pressure or circuit board. This is especially common for Appartamento. So, I am worried if I should invest in a Rocket machine. I came from pods machine. Shortlisted Breville but realised its limitations and set my eyes on Rocket. But it seems I am back to square one.

[@hadiwid0d0]

Very informative video, you guys do a great job here 👍. I have a question here Mark. I have a problem with my mozzafiato, after i clean it using Puro the knob handle is starting to loose, i mean i cannot feel the pre infusion when i pull the handle. Do you have any idea?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi HW, Cleaning should not cause the handle to loosen up. Did you disassemble any components? If you need some advice and are in US give our tech support a call at 585-924-7170 for assistance. Marc

[@hadiwid0d0]

@@Wholelattelovepage hi mark thanks for your reply! No i don't disembark any parts. Unlucky i'm not in US. I think i use a wrong wors here, is not loosen. What i mean is i cannot feel the repulsion of the handle. I cannot feel anything when i pull the handle. Hope you guys get what i meant 😄

[@MrTee3three]

Really informative video - thank you. I like (and don't like) how the temp stability and flush debate continues :) - my question is about plumbing in - I was thinking to plumb in after a RO filter system with PH+ (APEC 6 stage). The pressure can vary depending on how full the buffer tank is. Does this mean I would have variable pump pressure? Should I just stick w/ reservoir?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Chris, Thanks for the comment and question. If using an RO system be sure that remineralization is part of that system., You do not want to put pure zero TDS water into an espresso machine! It can cause corrosion of metals and over-extraction. I hate filling reservoirs so I love plumbed in machines! Line pressure has minimal effects on a plumbed in machine when the pump is running. If you are referring to having line pressure pre-infusion when plunmbed in due to line pressure you will not get that on these machines. Rocket machines have a solenoid valve on the plumbed in connection that only opens the machine to line pressure when the pump is operating. Hope that helps! Marc

[@MrTee3three]

@@Wholelattelovepage Thanks much! This system adds back calcite (calcium carbonate) but I'll have to figure out if it's enough or not.

[@nathanschad8048]

Just ordered my Mozzafiato R for our coffee shop from your site! So excited. I Didn’t pick the walnut wood, but it looks great. Is it self upgradable later?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Nathan, That's awesome! Hopefully not a high volume shop as machine is more prosumer oriented. The wood package is unfortunately not available as an upgrade at this time :(. Marc

[@GlennMartin]

coffee shop? wow, how has it been so far, deciding between this and Linea Mini.

[@nocoffeenogame]

How has it faired in a retail setting?

[@4040mwilson]

Can you guys offer these custom packages with ecm or profitec?

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi M, Stay tuned... Just sent your question to our product specialist and he informed me we should have some official OEM olive wood components in coming months from ECM! Marc

[@4040mwilson]

Whole Latte Love nice perfect time to order one for my new house. Tell them the wood paddle on the flow control valve looks great lol

[@noelghallager4672]

The Rocket looks amazing but the PID being under the drip tray is exactly why I won’t buy one. I find it ridiculous they put a digital display where it can’t be seen! Lol Great channel though guys. Keep up the good work 👍

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi NG, I understand your opinion. It was a design decision made some years ago by Rocket. Their designer did not like the look of digital displays on the face of what he considered a classic Italian machine - thought it ruined the aesthetic. Thanks for your kind comment on the channel - we will! Marc

[@guritche]

I guess everyone's different. I don't want a beautiful machine like this with a darn ugly glowing digital display on it that I won't need all the time anyway.

[@noelghallager4672]

@@guritche To each their own. First, I don't find the digital display ugly at all. Second, I've learned that having the right brew temp (shown by a PID) is crucial to not only pulling a great tasting shot, but also quickly foaming milk. Putting a PID under the drip tray is like putting an speedometer in the glove box: it's absurd.

[@michaeljemery]

It’s about time Rocket included hidden PID instead of that irritating seperate controller. I hope they do the same to the R58. Not so excited about the digital timer, the font proportions look wrong and the display inset looks improperly finished.

[@alexjoda5241]

Just the opposite in my eyes. The timer is perfectly and very „stealthy“ integrated into the the nicely designed case of the Rocket. All the other vendors did this much worse....

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Michael, Thanks for the comment sharing your opinion. Hidden PID on their HX Type V and Evo R machines is at least a few years now. Marc

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Jan, Thanks for sharing your opinion. Marc

[@PanzerIV88]

Hi Marc, Again interesting, for example I read a lot online and never knew that only these models in Rotary version did come with magnetic drip tray. It's a shame they didn't update their R58 with that and a timer. I have 2 questions though as I just received today the (Rocket Cronometro Type V) that I gifted my mom to replace her broken Breville Oracle. 1- Is it me or it is never possible to adjust the pressure on any vibration pump, as only the rotary machines have the adjustment underneath? 2- I just brewed 2 espresso with 18g leveled and tamped, and hell... I know how to do my stuff after 8 months of daily use on mine and getting better every months, but I never figured out tonight why her pump gauge NEVER ever went above 4.5Bar so twice less than the recommended pressure. The steam gauge did stay at 1.0 on idle which I think is normal though I thought it would have idled a little higher at 1.2bar, anyway it did seem to steam just fine. As for the PID it is set to 120C but it keeps displaying 121C for some reasons. So I'm wondering if the pump is defectuous from day 1, or if the machine can take several shots before stabilizing and working fine cause so far I'm very disappointed. The shot was very watery, pale and had no crema using the same coffee I use home. Oh and thanks for also learning me in another of your video that a vibration pump always take 5 more seconds than a rotary to reach full pump pressure, cause that also I didn't know why it stayed to almost 0 for several seconds before going up while on mine it's instant.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi P, Thanks for the questions! 1. Most vibration pump machine have adjustable brew pressure via an OPV - Over Pressure Valve. On Vib pump machines we set the OPV to 10 bar which gets you ~9 bar at the group. 2. To verify pump and brew pressure use a blind filter basket in your PF, place in group and raise the brew lever. If all is well your brew pressure gauge should read at or near 10 bar. At a PID temp setting of 120C your brew water temp is 93.6C. you can increase the PID temp setting to get more pressure in boiler but that also increases your brew water temp. Not unusual for the PID to display +/- 1 degree from its set temp. The display shows the actual in boiler temp. If only reaching 4.5 bar during extraction your grind may be too coarse. Outside chance you have bad pump but that's unlikely. Yes, vibration pumps to take longer to reach brew pressure. Marc

[@membersworkout1763]

Tonight i got my Evo R cronometro (rotary). I had the same thing. The right gauge (brew gauge) in idle was at 4.5 when boiler gauge was at 1+ bar. Using fresh single origin coffe with baratza sette 270Wi at recommended 9E, coffee didn’t come out fast enough and took a lot of time for a cup of coffee. Do i have to do something also? Thanks!

[@aaroncrawley9573]

Awesome vid, just a random coffee question for you. Does grinding your own coffee before brewing taste much better or is there only a minor increase in the quality of the coffee

[@senfposaune]

Aaron Crawley it is a massive difference. You tremendously increase the coffees surface during the grinding process, so the longer it stays grinded, the more sensitive it is to external influences, oxidation and loss of taste. Also grind size is an important factor, so pre-ground espesso may not suit your taste that well. Whenever possible, you should go for a decent grinder!

[@aaroncrawley9573]

@@senfposaune Thanks alot, I will look into getting a good grinder for my espresso machine :)

[@Wholelattelovepage]

All the yes to this comment! Thanks!!! Marc

[@Todd.T]

Only one more thing to mention. Pre-infusion. These machines will pre infuse either running on the tank or plumbed in. This can really tame a bright coffee. You can also move the lever into the pre infuse position after most of the shot is done to ramp down the pressure for finishing the shot. Another variable to fine tune your shot.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Hi Todd, Thanks for adding that. In my mind the E61 pre-infusion is more of a pre-wetting. It's quite different than what you get from a plumbed in machine which is open to line pressure. Plumbed in, Rocket machines do not get line pressure until a solenoid valve opens when the pump switches on. Good call on the ramp down at end before fully lowering lever. Marc

[@Todd.T]

@@Wholelattelovepage Thanks Marc. I can usually saturate a puck with the pre wetting. The major difference that I noticed with a plumbed in (6 days now) machine is because it is winter, the water entering the boiler is cold and knock the temp down a bit more than the tank. The tank eventually has its water heated by the machine so warmer water is introduced. Pressure on the Rocket gauge is up a bit and I'm set at 5 bar on the gauge on the BWT regulator. Before anybody gets the idea to plumb in hot water, the amount of TDS is higher in hot water from a tank, like I have. a. Cold tap water TDS is 125. b. BWT pitcher water TDS is usually 99 bang on. c. Hot water from my tank is 280 and the tank was replaced at the end of November. d. Active carbon only, whole home filter is 189. Haven't measured cold water from the BWT filter and I have it set on 3 after measuring the water with test strips. I think replacing the filter each year will leave some of the filter's potential unused. I will go the next size up on the filter and tee off to the fridge as well. Now you all know why to use cold water for tea and coffee, and for me, now everything I would boil water for.

[@Wholelattelovepage]

Todd T awesome! Thanks for sharing all the details!!! Marc