Revisiting Hand of Fate: Ordeals - A Game that Should have been a Massive Hit

[@MrJenssen]

The amount of love put into the design of this game - not only how they actually made it into a great boardgame, but also all the attention to detail in attempting to bring the videogame to life - is just incredible. It's sad that it never managed to garner a proper following. But that's just how the modern boardgame industry is, I guess. It's so bloated by now, that you need to spend an enormous amount of money on marketing if you aren't an established well-known publisher.

[@Castorshells]

I just found this game a few days ago and bought it used for $18. Never even knew it existed. I really want to find the royalty expansion but the only one as of now is on Noble Knight for $125. I agree with you on the artwork, I love it.

[@TheDungeonDive]

It's a fantastic game!

[@Castorshells]

I got the Royalty expansion off Amazon! They had got more stock in or something and it was a reasonable price at $25. Awesome game!

[@davidchilds2935]

Because of your earlier preview I managed to track down the game, the expansion, some silly kickstarter exclusives and a beautiful playmat. I fell in love with the game. Your channel spotlights these amazing gems. Thank you. I am so sad the developers who made the source material videogame and the people who made the boardgame are both gone. Is this IP cursed?!

[@TheDungeonDive]

Thanks! Yeah. It’s a real shame about this game and it’s developers in all forms. A cursed property perhaps!

[@z3r0slugfm]

what a wonderful game. I had no clue this existed. Roguelike modes are always welcomed in my book.

[@NefariousKoel]

Good timing. This has been near the top of my list to get on the table next. Although my set came with some of the location cards a bit discolored on the back, so the hidden info part of that might be a problem in the long run. When I requested replacements, they said that they'd get back to me after fulfillment was done but they stopped replying, unfortunately. Guess this was a one-and-done thing.

[@davidchilds2935]

The company went under, then the developer of the game it was based off of did as well

[@RyRinehart]

I didn't even know there was a Board Game for this! Just recently got into the Video Game version and was just looking it up to see what people thought of the game as I currently play through it. This looks cool!

[@AstralWalker]

I love the Hand of Fate 2 video game and had no idea they had made this. Now I need to track down the special edition.

[@fabiansteins6223]

Aaaaaahhh, I forgot all about it. Now I need to hunt it down .... Thanks Daniel!

[@adrealz276]

I agree with you, the width of the rule books in board games always gets in the way. Thanks for the review Daniel, it’s always really honest cheers !

[@TheDungeonDive]

Thank you.

[@Tokioka]

Just picked this up in a trade on your recommendation. Looking forward to getting it to the table.

[@paulaceto6492]

Great video, as always! PS - no need to go to e-Bay, Cardhaus has the Special Edition has this in stock for $59.99.

[@TheDungeonDive]

Oh wow! That’s great. Thanks for letting people know.

[@paulaceto6492]

@@TheDungeonDive After I watched your vide, Cardhaus had one fewer copy.

[@TheDungeonDive]

Ha! :) Hope you enjoy it.

[@gerrrz]

Just got this game last year in near mint condition and it's the all in pledge for just $140 in our local marketplace. It has everything from the wooden and metal tokens to the play mat which is surprisingly very wide and it also have several parts not present from the cardboard mat such as the discard piles and location for food/usage tokens. The original owner just punched out all the cardboard tokens and sleeved the cards which I would have done anyway. He also said it was unplayed and I believe him as every component still has that smell of a brand new pack of cards that was just opened. If I had to nitpick a component with issue, it would be the kallas mini figure as it's gold color is not shiny compared to the unboxing I've seen in youtube but its probably normal as paints do fade with time. We played competitive mode maybe like 7 times already mixing all compatible cards from the expansion and the experience is great! Our games lasted 1 to 2 hours which seems reasonable enough for me as it doesn't feel that it overstays its welcome. My favorite cards are from the trickster (blue) as it has cards that let you clean up your deck of bad cards so you can optimize your deck as you move forward. All colors feel necessary for you though as you build your deck. I tried a deck with almost no Wanderer card and my food supply is often low that I could barely move the map and I rarely able to use the Push mechanic. I am a bit confused about the setup of the Queen's Encounters though as its 1 less card compared to the Jack but I don't personally see a reason for it. The King's Encounters make sense that it's a card less than Jack because that slot is reserved for the Lich's Encounter card, if it needs to be played. We haven't tried the campaign and even the 1v4 as the pages for it in the rulebook looks overwhelming. I think this is one of the best purchase I made from last year and I don't see it leaving my collection anytime soon.

[@TheDungeonDive]

It's a fantastic game that deserved far more success. It should have been a hit.

[@nobbynobbs8182]

Man I do need to get this to the table. I backed the game at the time but sadly I still haven't played it yet. Maybe the timing was bad, maybe the rulebook was a bit of a slog,... but I always thought it looked amazing in concept and artwork. The mini's are a bit crap, and plenty of people were complaining about it but I didn't mind too hard as the rest of the components are fantastic. Felt bad that the company went out of business after their one and only published game because they were passionate about their game

[@johnberry5296]

This looks amazing and I literally just heard of it for the first time today….

[@CormanoWild]

Same and i 100%'d both the actual video games

[@captainnolan5062]

Do you get more components with the Special Edition, or only the rules for the endless mode? I see the standard game for sale, but not a special edition.

[@TheDungeonDive]

Yes. The special edition does come with more stuff.

[@captainnolan5062]

@@TheDungeonDive I will keep looking. Let me know if you find one for me.

[@SILVERF0X13]

I think there are a few reasons for it not being a massive hit. The first and biggest of which is that it was a kickstarter game based on an indie video game. Don't get me wrong, I loved the video game and that's what made me buy this game (and it is probably the best possible board game adaptation), but I think by that virtue, it had a pretty small audience to begin with. I think the other 2 main things that kept people from picking it up is that games take a long time to play, and there's a lot to learn before your first game. It's one of those games where most things just kinda make sense after you have been playing for a bit, but it's a lot to take in from the get go. Due to it taking such a long time to play, even though I backed it at the highest level, I've only ended up playing it once so far. That being said though, I plan to pick it back up soon and actually get my money's worth out of it. I think just like the video game, this is destined to be more of a cult classic than a widespread phenomena.

[@loarnchilcote9895]

Hello! Would you be at all interested in selling any of your HoFO content?

[@jamesmit7914]

Special edition is a bit pricey to get from the UK. Is the special edition much better than the basic version? Can the new rules just be ported over, or are new cards needed?

[@jamesmit7914]

Okay, bit the bullet and got it (shipping and tax to UK wasn't cheap!). What is the Royalty expansion like? Does it add much??

[@TheDungeonDive]

It adds a little bit of everything to most of the card decks, plus some co-op expansions.

[@jamesmit7914]

@@TheDungeonDive so not a deal breaker? I got the special edition, I couldn't resist the artwork on this game!

[@TheDungeonDive]

I don't think it's a deal breaker. The special edition is good enough.

[@tonydegenaro9400]

can anybody with the SE send pics of the cards included since they are impossible to find i have to proxy them

[@Xammblu_Games]

$12.99 on Amazon atm, glad I've been camping this game for a price drop! Just in time for the weekend 🙂

[@CormanoWild]

Shit, it's $40 now

[@ryanmclaren3899]

Hey Daniel, you ever get around to looking into O'Toole? 😜 Wildly prolific board game artist, it's super fun seeing him flex his creativity in this game. He's usually a Eurogame guy, and his graphic design/game sense is just as strong as his artistic vision.

[@TheDungeonDive]

Not yet!

[@antytrend]

Ill buy it based on this The cards look reasonable thick, are they thick?

[@TheDungeonDive]

Not sure. Standard.

[@snethss]

I could not agree more. I just sold my Thunderstone Quest today, and I absolutely treasure Hand of Fate. I did find the King of Scales to be a bit too powerful for new players. I also didn't like traps. Other than that, it's a damn fine game.

[@TheDungeonDive]

Yeah. The bosses can be very difficult. For sure.

[@Xoopams]

Thanks for the Awesome video! This video single-hand is making me chase this game!! Does anyone knows where I can find a digital (pdf) version of the Special Edition Rulebook? I can find the base version, but want to check the other one before I go crazy and pull the trigger for it.

[@matpetheny]

New intro is very cool!

[@TheDungeonDive]

Thanks!

[@joshreeve9975]

Ya that intros great

[@captainnolan5062]

Great review / revisit.

[@TheDungeonDive]

Thanks! This is a game I think of often.

[@Judgedredd1973]

I hate deck builders but I love "Hand of Fate!"

[@TheDungeonDive]

It's so good! Especially the endless / rogue-like mode.

[@foyoGames]

Ay! 1 Player! Picked this up super cheap on amz last yr or so ...& really been digging into soloing....might crack this out of the plastic Do you prefer it to gloomhaven?

[@TheDungeonDive]

Yes, I do. I do not like Gloomhaven at all.

[@foyoGames]

@@TheDungeonDive Novel opinion...great grounds for a video, if u haven't made it already.

[@TheDungeonDive]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/b6O5lIuXi612jtksi=9w9IUSwNSPJXQs-I

[@foyoGames]

@@TheDungeonDive touche

[@Evildata]

A really awesome game with a sad release story. It was a bad luck that the publisher as well as the licence owner got broke in a short time period. And this game was not the reason, it was rather succesful.

[@LenHarms]

$40 on Amazon, I just bought a copy.

[@Judgedredd1973]

Thunderstone quest drove me nuts, it was like bookkeeping from round to round.

[@TheDungeonDive]

It did feel like a lot of work for so little joy.

[@NefariousKoel]

I hesitated picking up the new one when I already had pretty much all of the old TQ Advance. Haven't tried the new one yet, but I've still had the feeling I would prefer the oldie more.

[@rhubahb]

Daniel, would you say that the Royalty Expansion is a must-have for the way you play the Endless variant?

[@TheDungeonDive]

I have a hard time remembering what came in the expansion and what came in the deluxe KS version of the base game. Sorry. :(

[@rhubahb]

@@TheDungeonDive That's fair. 🙂 I have a copy of the deluxe KS version coming, but the expansion is harder to find on it's own. :(

[@sethpeterson8261]

Looks really cool. I've had the videogame on my wishlist forever, but have just never pulled the trigger. I'm looking at copies of this now and it looks like there are several for sale, but missing the KS exclusives box. Sad. EDIT: Actually might have just found an all-in complete copy. We'll see

[@TheDungeonDive]

You don't need an all in. Just the Special Edition of the game. "The Special Edition is not a Kickstarter Exclusive but is a limited quantity item. We have offered these to people who have preordered after the campaign and any leftovers will be offered to select retailers, sold at conventions and direct sales." There's one on ebay right now for $38. That's a steal. The special edition comes with the rules for endless mode, and the trap locations. It doesn't come with more bosses or campaigns, but I never play with the campaigns.

[@sethpeterson8261]

@@TheDungeonDive Ah, good to know thanks. I'll wait to be sure on this all-in first though simply because if I can get everything for under $100 anyway then why not. Plus I'm a sucker for neoprene mats and those metal coins you have look coolio. EDIT: Wow. After I messaged the guy about it on BGG he raised the price $25... lame. Well he lost his sale.

[@volkira]

YAY !! Just picked up an unopened Royalty edition + playmat.

[@choffman7830]

Picked this up yesterday based on your recommendation!

[@TheDungeonDive]

I hope you enjoy it!

[@browe]

Me, too! Just saw this video today and had to grab it based upon the overview!

[@boardgameblips9651]

If you can find the directions, can you play the endless mode with just the base game?

[@TheDungeonDive]

I am not positive, because I can't remember what exactly comes with just the base game. Sorry. Maybe someone on BGG might be able to answer more definitively.

[@tylerlamb4108]

I liked the video game a lot I'll have to check this one out.

[@DieNische]

In coop mode it becomes repetitive very fast. Due to the limited quest system you are collecting the same card types over and over again. As a coop deck builder it is not that great in my opinion.

[@TheDungeonDive]

I only play the endless mode, so it’s never repetitive. Always something new around the corner.

[@DieNische]

@@TheDungeonDive But I do not find it thematic as well. It is an abstract card game. Other deck builders (Cthulhu, Legendary Alien or even Shadowrift) create a much deeper atmosphere in my opinion as well.

[@TheDungeonDive]

Yeah. It's funny for how much we have in common, we tend to disagree more! LOL. I think we just value very different things a lot of the times! And that's good. :) I don't get any theme out of those games you mentioned, although I haven't played Shadowrift, so I'll look into it, thanks! Don't think I've ever even heard of it. For me, this is really the only deck builder that feels like an adventure game. This is the only one that really feels like you are building a character, one with actual different builds, skills, abilities, etc. I do want to try Clank Legacy, but I dislike Clank so much that I'm having a hard time pulling the trigger on it.

[@DieNische]

@@TheDungeonDive Have you played Cthulhu -A Deckbuilding game? And yes, it is a good thing that we do not always agree. We will reunite on The Ghosts Betwixt. ;)

[@sethpeterson8261]

@@DieNische I've never heard of it (unless that's the Arham Horror card game?). Never heard of the other two you mentioned either.

[@BLDTHEGAMER]

Yes, this game is awesome. Track it down, its worth it.

[@jonathana6298]

I was familiar with the video game. I didn’t know there was a board game. It looks like the expansions are only for co-op modes?

[@TheDungeonDive]

They add some things to the base game, I think, but mainly they add more co-op campaigns. I'm not a huge fan of the game in campaign mode.

[@jonathana6298]

@@TheDungeonDive Well, I just pulled the trigger on it. I am also one of those people looking for the perfect "Roguelike" board game. I held off on Mage Knight for years until someone described it as a Roguelike. I picked up the ultimate edition and didn't get drawn into it at all. Rules were very complicated and it was more of a deck-builder experience and less Roguelike than what I was looking for. I'm a competionist so I had to track down a copy with Kickstarter exclusives... It's a weakness of mine. I guess I'll find out how many expansion components may be added to the endless mode. Edit: I could not find a copy with KSE's that didn't have the expansions bundled.

[@TheDungeonDive]

I hope you enjoy it!

[@nicolasbrun9795]

Does anyone know if this game is good for solo play? opinions?

[@TheDungeonDive]

This whole video is about solo play. 99.9% of everything I cover on the channel is played solo only.

[@arcubal]

Wow, what a find. Too bad there's no way for me to get it. Amazon only ships this game to the States.

[@anhmai7124]

would you recommend this game solo?

[@TheDungeonDive]

Yes.

[@sethpeterson8261]

...I just picked up a Thunderstone Quest last week. Was going to be my first try of a deckbuilder (never played one before)... But hearing that multiple players can have the same Hero sounds terribad. Anyone want to buy a complete w/expansions all sleeved used copy of Thunderstone Quest?

[@TheDungeonDive]

I’m pretty much the only person who doesn’t like TSQ. So don’t just take my word for it. Everyone else raves about it.

[@TheDungeonDive]

I have very, very idiosyncratic tastes in games, so if I were you I'd try TSQ before passing it on. You might love it, and if you've already paid for and have it opened, no loss!

[@fehner27]

I liked Thunderstone Advance when I first got it. I find it too long for what you are trying to accomplish

[@TheDungeonDive]

@@fehner27 We played the original TS and liked it, but that was when it and Dominion were really the only games in town like it.

[@sethpeterson8261]

@@TheDungeonDive Will do, but I've found over this past year that the things that both bother you or speak to you match my feelings really closely. Plus I only paid $25 for a complete TQ set so no reason to ditch it. Hell the 5000ish sleeves it came with would have cost me more than double what I paid for the game with expansions.

[@MusicDiscoveryNet]

I'm selling my copy (shipping within Europe) if someone is interested, special KS edition

[@BigPuffDaddy]

I love this game so much, just finished a solo campaign session and it was a blast. I wish they didn't go under. I also really regret not knowing about this, I really want those kickstarter bonuses!

[@TheDungeonDive]

It’s a really great game.

[@nquartuccio]

Such an amazing game

[@TheDungeonDive]

Sure is!

[@harryosborne8215]

My main issue with it was that it completely failed in being a “Hand of Fate” game. Completely. The coolest (and real draw) of the video game was how completing a card swapped it out for a new one, completing that one swapped for another, etc. There is NONE of that in Ordeals and it’s a damn shame

[@TheDungeonDive]

It's a great board game. That's all I really care about.

[@HellGamingPlus]

@@TheDungeonDive That and....well Harry's actually completely wrong. If they're talking about exploration, then no, whena card is used up in Hand of Fate until you go to the next floor it remains inert and is just for travelling across, the board game replicates pretty much one to one; if they're talking about never drawing repeat cards, that's because in Hand of Fate you deck build the dungeon, no the character, the deck limit is exactly how many tiles are needed so redraws are not something that can happen (fun fact, you can still replicate this by drawing events to shuffle each round via a draft rather than randomly, it's actually a great house rule), so in that aspect Hand of Fate is still replicated perfectly. Unless they're talking about card and event unlocks in which events had objectives that would unlock new cards for the deck-building in future games, and, okay, Hand of Fate Ordeals doesn't have a video-game unlock system for every event card (although the campaign missions actually use specific events to actually replicate this progression of events across a campaign so...it's actually still in their in a minor capacity); but if that's what you're annoyed is missing....well this is a board game that isn;t trying to be a legacy game so...yeah....it's not going to replicate that and to be honest the game would be worse for doing that, it would add an unnecessary wrinkle on a really smooth design. As for whether it replicates Hand of Fate....well the art and presentation is spectacular, holds to the card art perfectly, the game replicates a tonne of cards, ideas, and equipment from both games, all the characters are companions from Hand of Fate 2, all of their equipment unlocks in campaigns are their hand of Fate 2 equipment and suits their individual playstyles in that game perfectly... I mean the game basically oozes passion fr Hand of Fate so hard, it is legitimately the most evocative of that game it could be, it suits it perfectly; if you don;t get along with the game for whatever reason, I get that, but I'll say this right now, if you genuinely think this fails in being Hand of Fate, I can only disagree with you; it might honestly be the most perfect love-letter to that game that will ever be made; add the kickstarter bonuses to make your devil tokens actually made out of metal, and play the soundtrack for both games in the background and it honestly blows me away how in that universe I feel. A great boardgame without the Hand of Fate theming and presentation, and transcendantly beautiful one with it :)

[@fehner27]

this looks good. this or Iron Helm, or Gate. hmm.

[@TheDungeonDive]

I need to get Iron Helm. Looking into it soon.

[@fabiansteins6223]

@@TheDungeonDive Curious about your opinion for Iron Helm. Absolutely fantastic solo dungeon crawl.

[@warpaint9385]

Good game which I have but I only like the competitive version of the game. Did not like the campaigns at all. The deck building isn’t massive in this either so there’s a tonne of cards that you never see. Agree with you on Thunderstone Quest. Overrated big time. The Australian publisher that released this game are no longer around. Too hard to compete I’d say.