Revolver Myth Busting: Taurus Model 85 is *not* a Copy of a S&W Model 36 J Frame; Disassembly

[@dbx1233]

At around 21:00, it looks like the Taurus may have a stronger forcing cone than the S & W. I do have a newer model 36-10 and the forcing cone looks a little anemic. But it is rated for 38+P. Anyway, I appreciate this informative video.

[@ColterBrog]

Thank you. I’d have to measure them to be sure, but it’s actually a pretty tough dimension to get an accurate measurement on with the tools available to me. .38 Special is a fairly tame caliber. Certainly +P ups the ante a bit, but it still doesn’t normally see issues with premature failure. Now, when this sane concept of making allowance for clearances was introduced to the K-frame, issues did arise, but even then it was only with certain ammunition, and was only particularly severe in certain year models due to a design change. The Taurus is a bigger revolver, by a hair, and probably does have a more substantial forcing cone. In my opinion it is not necessary for this caliber. Causes no harm, though, aside from slightly larger dimensions. I apologize for the extremely long delay in responding, as I usually answer within a couple days or a few weeks. I had to contemplate this one, though.

[@dbx1233]

@@ColterBrog The Taurus looks like it not only stacks up well to the Model 36 but may actually be a better built revolver. I would feel confidant with either one. Thanks for your response.

[@scotttwombly6528]

S&W and Taurus were both owned by the same parent company at one time. And shared engineering.

[@ColterBrog]

It’s certainly S&W inspired. Can definitely see that’s the source concept in the 85. I do like some of the changes Taurus made to the design, though. I’m not a fan of the way the cylinder and crane interface, but their system for tensioning the cylinder stop is preferable to me over the way S&W does it. I think I probably prefer the rebound slide system, but I have to give them credit that their rebound spring is very easy to disassemble.

[@svbarryduckworth628]

The early 85's were even made in the same factory and with the same tooling that once produced S&W pistols before Taurus spun off on their own.

[@randymccalla9995]

If you ever open up a Rossi 461 you will Have a good comparison video with S&W..

[@ColterBrog]

If I get my hands on one I will do that.

[@svbarryduckworth628]

It's not a clone, it's an incremental update descended from the original S&W design parentage.

[@ColterBrog]

I think that’s an excellent way to put it. It absolutely shows some design influence from S&W and is distinctly different from Colt. Quite a bit of incremental change, though, to reach the design of this revolver. S&W derived, but definitely not a S&W design anymore.

[@anthonyangeli256]

Great informative video. Nice job.

[@ColterBrog]

Thank you.

[@edmazzeo1985]

keep the video's coming ....very well done.

[@ColterBrog]

Thanks. New one coming soon, likely this month.

[@grahamohea2424]

It isn't a perfect copy... I would call it an improved copy. Having disassembled Smith revolvers, I can certainly appreciate the improvements that Taurus has applied. The change in safety to a transfer bar is a nice touch. However, the differences between the two are minor, especially when compared to say, a Ruger or a Colt, which are completely independent designs. I think this is what most people are talking about when they characterize them as clones

[@ColterBrog]

In the past I haven’t been as fond of transfer bars. I always considered S&W’s rebound slide to be the more sophisticated and elegant design. As I deal with more and more revolvers with transfer bars, though, I am starting to like them more- and it avoids the annoyance of getting the rebound slide in and out during disassembly.

[@grahamohea2424]

@@ColterBrog I've only seen hammer blocks in Smith revolvers, but transfer bars are everywhere (my first gun, a break open shotgun had a transfer bar), so there is an aspect of familiarity with them. However, what I like most about transfer bars is that they are generally a more fail safe design. If the bar gets broken, the gun cannot go off, so safety is preserved. If a hammer block is broken, installed incorrectly, or not installed at all, it doesn't fail safe, it is (to coin a term) "fail fire"

[@ColterBrog]

@@grahamohea2424 I can’t disagree. I think both are good designs. I’ll mention, though, that if a hammer block in a S&W were to break, the revolver is still safe because of the rebound slide. That’s the primary safety, with the block only acting as a redundancy. I rather like that the hammer block is there as a backup, and isn’t constantly receiving a sharp impact like a transfer bar does.

[@dalejenkins5102]

Another really nice video, I'm really a novice gunsmith that would never work on someone else's firearm. But looking at these 2 side by side in polishing up parts for a smoother action ( not simply changing springs ) the taurus design I think has an edge on several parts . I've owned several j frames, and up until a month ago never had a taurus. I now have a model 85 , and comparing it to my 36 smith it seems to me to stack up pretty well . Lol I guess in price the smith differently has the edge ! Again a really nice job on the video.

[@ColterBrog]

Thanks! I like them both for different reasons. My preference goes to the S&W, but that’s largely due to quality control and my own familiarity with the design. The Taurus does have some clever features that I like as specific details like the cylinder stop plunger, but also certain things I find annoying such as the way the cylinder retains on the crane. I think you’ll enjoy your 85. It’s sometimes fun to just have something different than what we’re used to.

[@svbarryduckworth628]

The fact that the cylinder and the crane are pretty permanently married comes in handy when looking for used replacement cylinders. They always come used with a crane still attached. Two parts for one and on eBay they go for $25-30 for the assembly. I've never purchased one and always wondered why there seem to be so many for sale for the model 85. Was there some sort of updated cylinder that was available somewhere that people are commonly replacing them? Is there a fly-by-night company selling .357 cylinders for these or something?

[@CA.0verview]

21:17 what do you recommend to remove carbon buildup on the front face of the cylinder on a blued gun like the Taurus. Is there a cleaning procedure that Hass to be done so the bluing doesn’t get removed?

[@ColterBrog]

I’m not aware of a good way of doing it that is safe for the bluing. On blued revolvers I just leave it alone. The dark rings tend to blend in to some extent. I clean with normal solvent and a rag to buff away any loose debris, but the scorch marks remain.

[@johnochicago8457]

Would you say the quality of the Taurus is the same as the Smith in terms of parts and assembly?? Thanks

[@ColterBrog]

In general, no. S&W seems to routinely have better metallurgy and much better fit and finish- both in cosmetics and function. These revolvers in the video are not a good representation of current production from either company. Both have changed manufacturing processes over the decades. Most Taurus revolvers work fine, but your chances of having a problem that falls as a warranty issue are higher. I like certain design aspects of the Taurus, but would still prefer S&W.

[@johnochicago8457]

@@ColterBrog I agree. I have put 200 rounds through my 856 and no issues. I'm never going to carry it as a primary gun.. Thanks Colter!!

[@Anibal677]

Rossi revolvers are more similar to the S&W revolvers

[@ColterBrog]

I have heard that, but as best I can remember I’m not actually sure I’ve ever taken a Rossi apart. Certainly haven’t in the past decade.

[@Anibal677]

@@ColterBrog I did once and is almost identical to the modelo 36 S&W, they have the rebound slice, and the hammer block as the S&W, I am not be sure they have the samer messuraments but they almost copy every part in the form.

[@dankinsler1930]

Doesn't Taurus own Rossi?

[@Anibal677]

@@dankinsler1930 Yes, Taurus company own Rossi, but the internal parts of the Rossi revolvers are diferent to the Taurus internal parts and more alike the S&W J frames internal parts, even the larger Rossi revolvers are like a J frame S&W to scale.

[@lukakarson2075]

Hello! Thanks for the video! I have a question! What is the outer diameter of the Taurus Drum? And what is the drum length? Thanks for the answer !👍

[@ColterBrog]

Length is 1.510” at the chambers (not including gas ring). Diameter is 1.343”. The gas ring appears to add about 0.040” in addition to the chambers, but it is difficult for me to get a precise measurement.