How Zootopia Almost Became the Best Disney Movie

[@Rockotarthepurplehatguy]

Can I get a pat on the back for uploading a new video within a time span of less than two weeks for the first time in over a year and a half?

[@the_swagman-l6l]

No :|

[@Rockotarthepurplehatguy]

@@the_swagman-l6l oof

[@MagicalCycero]

Okay. :)

[@danielcoolgaming8293]

sonic

[@Theathelavalily]

Yes!🫂

[@asdflkjh-r2g]

I love the scene where Judy looks back at Nick and his collar is on yellow. She knows they're feeling the same way about what just happened but only one of them can experience their emotions without repercussion. It reads to me that she truly realizes in that moment that it's not a safety precaution, predators are being punished for just being alive.

[@arlynnecumberbatch1056]

trans ppl be like /s sad we live in a world where people just suck

[@moonshinershonor202]

Stegosaurus wanta to know your location.

[@DapperLastname]

You forgot to mention the part where the collars shock the predators whenever they feel any strong emotion, like, *all* emotions. The kid at the polar bear taming party is at first excited, then he gets too happy and gets shocked.

[@Axiian19]

Yeah, and the amusement park Nick wanted to make would allow predators to actually be excited about things without getting shocked, like to be able to feel adrenaline / excitement / fear freely. It would be terrible to live in a world where you HAVE to always be apathetic and suppress your emotions just so you don't get punished.

[@MowMowScribbles]

It does fit the expectations put on many minorities. A lot of us are expected to alway keep a level head even in the case where it is justified.

[@Ari_C]

that scene is so heartbreaking and I wish so badly they'd stuck with the version of the movie that would have kept it. what we got is by no means a bad movie, I still enjoy it enough to rewatch on occasion, but the original concept would have been so much more emotionally impactful

[@gregvs.theworld451]

@@Axiian19 Hmmmm. I'm feeling more intersectional allegories being illuminated in this conversation.

[@LuznoLindo]

Goodness--like something out of Harrison Bergeron.

[@pyronuke4768]

Personally, as a writer myself, I think the reason the collars were removed was because they couldn't find a way to give the story a happy ending without making it feel like a major contrivance.

[@zachnewby4739]

I think if they did not have to have a traditional happy ending, they could have done it. A bittersweet, there-is-hope-for-the-future ending would have worked, but Disney would never go for anything less than perfectly happy in a kid's film.

[@sakuraice22]

I feel like part of the reason they removed them was if they kept the collars but resolved them by the end of the movie there would've been very little room for sequels. I was crazy for Zootopia when it was still being made so I had seen some concept art and ideas at the time even though I didn't know english very well and I fell in love with the promise of the movie; I don't hate what we got but after learning everything it could've been I would've prefered the version with the collars.

[@normalabsolutely7240]

​@@zachnewby4739 they did it for incredibles 1

[@neonoah3353]

Imo, im glad they remove that, i think the collars would be too much on the nose, or i guess, the neck.

[@tinydragon2]

i feel like they really removed it for it being "too discriminatory" and "too depressing" for kids

[@omegafire6253]

Ironically the original script could work as a prequel, a sort dark kept secret for the perfect zootopia from the current film.

[@nataliaborys1554]

It could be set, like, around right before Judy was born. Would've retroactively explained why some of the characters seemed prejudiced for no reason other than being meanies - they remember the time when predator-prey relations were much worse, leaving the prey with newfound fear now that the predators are suddenly uncollared even though all their lives they were taught that that's dangerous, and the predators can have leftover anger about how they have been treated just a few years ago.

[@akamered4483]

@@nataliaborys1554 Would also be a much better representation of how it came to the discrimination in the first place. Like with sexism and racism, the government first played an active role in perpetuating these ideas, like the shock-collars would. Now, we are living in the aftermath, like the original zootopia would.

[@t1dotaku]

@@akamered4483 Also also it would mirror real life so much more in that way. Like how you see a lot of older folks that are more prejudiced because they grew up during a time where they were pushed to fear the out group. It would show with only a few generations the majority of people have come to accept these differences while also still being taught/witnessing the prejudices still at play either subtly or openly via their parents or even grandparents.

[@akamered4483]

@@t1dotaku Exactly. I like the idea behind zootopia for being a modern representation of discrimination "post-partum", but the detective plooooooot for gods sake

[@furthings]

Or possibly the laws of another town/state/country within the universe honestly. Some cities are more progressive than others

[@kkinthewheelchair3049]

This is the " if it was indie it'll be a classic" movie pick for me

[@holben27]

If the original script was adapted as a stop motion Wes Anderson movie it would be 10/10 and ironically more in line with classic Disney than modern disney.

[@rivy-lurk-869]

​@@holben27 Dude, this would kick hard as a Wes Anderson film. I wish he actually did direct the movie instead

[@Nopeasaurus]

Agreed. If it was written during the Disney renaissance, no executive would've looked at the script and went "ew that's depressing" and demand it be rewritten to be as safe and inoffensively corporate as possible. It's still an enjoyable film regardless but seeing what we could have had felt like a robbery. Prejudice and fear being the villain instead of a stupid sheep, Nick being the main character with a better backstory and an actual motivation to do good instead of being a sleazy conman, the city being a dystopia instead of utopia where everyone largely gets along for the most part and racism is in just a few rotten eggs.

[@JackebBee-iz7qi]

@@rivy-lurk-869 Yeah and Imagine if humans actually existed in the script and the main villains are the farmers.

[@rivy-lurk-869]

@@JackebBee-iz7qi Dude, Mr Fox was fantastic. ... Pun not intended.

[@SiliconSlyWolf]

Based on some of the size difference things in this movie, you'd think they would NEED things like rabbit cops to police mouse town or such, rather than say, an elephant who is basically a kaiju to them.

[@cgsr2182]

Omg! That's why there's a vole mafia rodent town is underpoliced! 🤯

[@ClownHoundII]

Yeah that's one of my issues with zootopia, the size difference enforeces the idea that predators are a danger and prey have every reason to fear them. Which goes against the whole lesson and ruins the metaphor for racism.

[@camarvan]

@@ClownHoundII Because it's not just racism, it's discrimination in general. It's not a 1 to 1 metaphor and i really don't think it's supposed to be

[@bowserbreaker2515]

I remember when my sister saw this. She came back and said, "The movie was good until the end where the sheep turns out to be evil!"

[@StevenJones851]

i agree

[@seriousnesstv7902]

1000th like

[@Nopeasaurus]

These twist villains never work. You'd think Disney would finally learn by now but nope, they did the same thing with Magnifico from Wish.

[@bowserbreaker2515]

@@Nopeasaurus He wasn't a twist villain, was he?

[@realdragon]

@@Nopeasaurus They work when they're done the right way

[@fluffywhompus]

Somthing that still confuses me is how Judy never knew about the night howlers despite living on that farm her entire childhood. Even if she never went near them herself I feel like she would already know about how dangerous they can be

[@feiradragon7915]

Yea, if the flowers were around since Judy's childhood then it'd be a very rational decision of her parents to warn her not to go near them. Repeatedly even. That's like the equivalent of having an electric fence and never telling your child that fence is electric.

[@LaLaLaLaNom]

My assumption which might be wrong is that her parents had stopped using the nighthowlers for a while because they knew how dangerous they were, and they only started using them again because their business started booming and they started growing more crops which necessitated it. But that’s just a theory.

[@Perdix64]

It could also be because they went by a different name.

[@Fourger14]

@@Perdix64 You've landed on the explanation clear in the movie. Judy's parents use the scientific name to warn their kids, scaring them with the complicated sounding words. Judy only finds out it's related to her case because her childhood bully says his family and circle calls them nighthowlers. Still, you'd think she and Gideon would have talked enough for her to hear that once or twice. I suspect Judy was originally a city bunny in the first version of the movie, so this wouldn't have been a plothole, assuming the flowers still mattered in that version, which I think they did based on the finale concept art of Nick fighting off three out-of-control tigers.

[@Quinn-he3vn]

She does actually, but her family never referred to them as night howlers

[@SoulshadeVr101]

man the original story would've been so good we don't have enough mature animations

[@Dr.Mlieko]

Watch Beastars It is more or less the same story

[@rozinq1351]

​@@Dr.MliekoEhh not really, I love beastars but the story and overall themes are very different to this

[@MoonShadeStuff]

I don’t feel like it would. The movie we got actually has a message we can relate to. The collar thing is more of an unimaginable dystopia that we can immediately identify has not much in common with our own world, so the points about rac*ism would be mute. The movie we got is actually much more subtle about it’s messaging, which I think makes it more relevant for people today.

[@rozinq1351]

@@MoonShadeStuff Personally as someone who is a part of two distinct groups that both are pretty marginalized on their own and even more when they overlap I identify with this early story much more than I do with the final version but that's because I think the collar thing becomes much more meaningful and applicable to real life if you think of it as something more symbolic or metaphorical rather than literally taking it at face value, though I do get that this is a very specific interpretation that doesn't really hold as much ground when applied to the intended meaning which was very clearly racial issues (though I did see quite a few comments from people of color under this video who said they felt this version represented their struggles well too and I'm obviously not trying to disregard their experiences, in general I think it's safe to say that allegories don't necessarily have to be 1 to 1 reflections of reality to connect with people). Idk I guess what I'm trying to say is that I get what you're trying to say but I personally think that there are still demographics today that could have connected with and benefited from this version of the movie as well

[@Kizakoe]

Lets not forget Disney animated films like this one are meant for children. While darker movies are indeed interesting, I do not believe looking here is the best place Yes children are capable and stuff But also not really ? Thats not the point, what I mean is : Yes mature is really good, but here is not the right place ? Feel free to tell me if you believe I am wrong, there may be things I am not considering

[@ixiahj]

I remember the original ice cream shop scene with the elephants. The guy did not want to sell the jumbo pop to Nick because it was too big for his "son." He was not gonna finish it and most of it would end up on the floor as wasted food. I thought that was a logical take on the scene but the final cut made it look like they were just mean to non elephants. Same with Bogo assigning Judy with traffic duty. She's new on the force. That's not discrimination but they made it look like discrimination.

[@Perdix64]

I feel if he said that, she potentially could’ve understood that, but if instead, she was given a job just in the offices would’ve been a better way to show she’s being somewhat discriminated against due to her size. Potentially, it could also show how the guy wants to, “Keep the little ones safe”

[@_indigo_inked]

Yeah I think the discrimination in the police force is mostly meant to be represented by her treatment by others rather than just exclusively the case loads. It wasn’t explained to her that everyone goes through traffic duty, instead it did feel like her coworkers were singling her out. I think it was vibes based, as we the audience, do see the wider context of the treatment and expectation of rabbits. We get the feeling that something unfair is happening and zero explanation that traffic duty is for every new recruit, in the same way that Judy experiences it. So even if it wasn’t intentional, we can come to the same conclusion that the force was engaging in discrimination. Even reading the scene with the benefit of the doubt, this is still probably a failure in communication from management paired with a societal issue that exacerbated the feeling of discrimination. It has been a hot second since I watched Zootopia though, sooooo I could be envisioning the scene better than it was.

[@Dolphanatic]

@@ixiahj I'm pretty sure that was the point. It was meant to misdirect audiences with confirmation bias. Since the story is told from Judy's perspective, it makes sense for her to fixate on prejudice directed her way while turning a blind eye to her own prejudice.

[@superfightingrobotmkx7776]

I’m just glad they changed the way he tricked Judy. In an alternative cut, he spun a completely ridiculous story about how Finnick was insane and had a litany of various medical problems in order to win Judy’s sympathy. His acting was also so hammy that only a total moron would believe him. The take they went with was ultimately much better.

[@jocosejpeg]

Holy shit, Fuzzy Things pfp

[@kialeysmith327]

wow, that polar bear scene was chilling and heartbreaking. disappointed that it got cut, bc that seemed so well written

[@realdragon]

I was thinking about it, I imagined rather grim scene where collar on someone activates and being in pain caused more anger thus collar continued to shock predator causing causing the loop of anger and suffering until that predators passes out or just dies

[@def3ndr887]

Another idea to show messed up the world is would be for Judy or a prey cop who’s still green along with some experienced cops going under cover to one of those parties to watch the dad and see if he’ll sit there and watch his son get shocked or break the collar leading to his arrest

[@fantasticbirdblue]

I honestly feel like people only like the tame collar plot because of the shock value (pun unintended) rather than the actual story behind it

[@gregvs.theworld451]

@@fantasticbirdblue On one hand, I do think it's a bit heavy handed and dark, though maybe that's my bias and concern for what people and kids are intelligent enough to see and understand and discuss, but imo it is more realistic and more accurate to systemic racism, which is a real thing that negatively impacts people in the real world. It can be unhelpful to pretend that all prejudice in the world is an issue of prejudiced individuals and not complicated systems of hierarchies designed and refined for centuries to work against marginalized groups and identities. If anything, the collars are the more kid friendly, digestible low ball parallel to real life, since in real life people who are prejudiced against to be considered more dangerous often don't get a little punishment tap to keep them in line; they get tenderized by law enforcement or sh o t or k i ll e d.

[@Trickpants]

@@fantasticbirdblue I'm confused what you mean by "the actual story behind it"?

[@SpeedyWeedyYT]

I don’t really like how they’re called predators and prey in this universe. In Beastars, they use herbivore and carnivore, and they’re alot more violent and prejudiced in that society than the zootopia world. I just think that’s bizarre.

[@matthewkuscienko4616]

It's strange to be sure, but the reason why Disney did this, I think, is because they wanted to try to have the film be more dark and mature and be able to tackle more nuanced themes, so labeling the animals as "predators" and "prey" was an attempt to give it more of an edge. The issue arises with the fact that this is Disney we're talking about: to keep it brief, they are afraid to make things too dark because they know that people are not comfortable with confronting negative emotions, and as a result were not willing to fully commit to their original idea with the collars and the more blatant prejudice. Disney has always had something of a reputation for sanitizing their properties -- the themes of stuff like "happily ever after", "good will always prevail over evil in the end", or "you can do anything if you're willing to put your mind to it and work hard for your dreams" are all things that make people feel good, and Disney wants desperately to be associated with making people feel those happy, uplifting feelings. This, I believe, is what ultimately causes them to rewrite the story to become what it is, even if it came at the expense of the nuance that we could have gotten if they had not been so afraid that people would like their movie less because it made the audience confront something so clearly dark

[@ivrydice0954]

I'd imagine if the film would establish the negative connotation of Predator & Prey then like post-time skip have carnivore & herbivore used by people against the system. That would've sent a message with only subtle changes in the dialogue.

[@jesustovar2549]

I wonder how a film from the Predator franchise works in this universe.

[@Disheartthorn]

I honestly don't see a problem with "you can do anything if you're willing to put your mind into it & work for your dreams." Even if that's not necessarily true, it's better to die at least trying to achieve something you want than being alive, complacent, & Uhappy. ​@@matthewkuscienko4616

[@supremeoverlordvader5552]

The problem with Beastars is how u classify carnivores who aren't predators. Like hippos, boars who eat occasionally meat but aren't hunting killers per se.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

I love the movie. My only problem with it is that the anti-predator sentiment was solved by pinning it on the villain even though the ice cream shop scene implied it was systemic. I also wasn't a fan of portraying Judy collaborating with the mafia to interrogate the weasel as a positive thing, since that is dangerously close to making her a rotten cop. Other than that, it was a decent buddy cop movie with likable characters and great humor.

[@gamerstheater1187]

To be fair, Mr. Big seemed less like an organized gangster and more of just a guy who wanted to be left alone but people kept attacking him

[@vetarlittorf1807]

@@gamerstheater1187 He's still a criminal.

[@justanotherguy2609]

On the first point, I don’t think the anti-predator sentiment was “solved” it more so calmed the tension between animals. Prejudices will still exist, this just stopped the city from falling into chaos. As for the second point, I don’t think the movie portrayed that as positive, just something that needs to be done for the case. Judy and Nick need information from a weasel who won’t give it away, so they use Mr big to get it. Not really a big deal, just part of solving a case.

[@prixe12]

​@@justanotherguy2609 It is a pretty big deal actually. Threatening some guy selling bootleg movies out of his car with death is a pretty disproportionate punishment. Police aren't supposed to be playing judge, jury, and executioner just because it's convenient for them.

[@squiddler7731]

​​@@prixe12 I imagine they never actually intended to kill him, they just threatened to knowing it would get him to talk (Judy would never want to kill anyone and Mr. Big is smart enough to know dead men tell no tales). Still morally ambiguous for sure, but technically Judy wasn't a cop anymore by that point, which was why she went to Mr. Big to begin with. That and it was a funny cartoon scene that they didn't want to think about too deeply, lol

[@Anonymous_Lilac2270]

The scene where the polar cub receives the collar and celebrates before getting immediately shocked broke my heart. And when he went back to hug his dad, AH. That would’ve been one of my favourite Disney movies ever.

[@LazyOldFusspot_3428]

I'd personally consider Bellwether to be a discount Waternoose

[@bowserbreaker2515]

Waternoose is the best twist villain of all time. Bellwether isn't the worst, but is one of the worst.

[@allenj7613]

​@@bowserbreaker2515King Candy/Turbo is the best twist villain

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

​​​​@@allenj7613THAT WAS HIS MISTAKE Idk turbo and water noose are by far the best

[@Rockgem12]

Oh Anna if only there was someone who actually loved you, its either waternoose or turbo/king candy, stinky Pete and lotso are the best I might be forgetting someone else but I don’t think I am *also is auto a twist villain I haven’t seen WALL·E in a while*

[@firenze6478]

Waternoose’s motivations made sense, and he did is evil regretfully. Horrible monster, but he makes sense. Bellwether is just an insane racist who gets off on her own evil.

[@DrewDesign]

Just gotta say, Nick talking about Night Howlers was NOT how they followed the wolves - they came up with the idea of checking the traffic cams & followed the truck that had picked up the Jaguar to the holding location of the infected animals. They only made the 'Night Howlers = wolves' leap when they realised who it was picking the jaguar up. That was genuinely good detective work.

[@grantpotter8289]

I'm just disappointed in that "too miserable" talk that changed it. If all family-friendly studios had that kind of talk, I doubt things like Majora's Mask or any of Studio Ghibli's works would have ever seen the light of day

[@DostoyevskyTolstoy]

'You've met with a terrible fate... _haven't you?'_

[@Dr.Mlieko]

Here's the difference - those are both Japanese

[@PatientSqueaky]

honesty, they can still make family-friendly things, one of the problems is how they don't use bittersweet endings as much anymore. Like Twilight Princess, it's a bittersweet ending. For me the definition of a "bittersweet ending" is something that ends happy but not in the way you hoped. In TW we had this with Midna as she broke the mirror. Of course, a bittersweet ending can be ruined but that's something for another time. Despite this, the ending is what makes the game as good as it was. The problem is companies shying away from bittersweet endings which then makes more clichés and makes the story predictable. TW shows a good use of a bittersweet an ending and an old movie called "The Last Unicorn" did too. Heck, I didn't really enjoy most of the movie but my gosh that ending still left me on the verge of tears and had me sad for another hour.

[@sev1120]

Hell, with the "too miserable" stuff would've meant a number of classic films and shows wouldn't have been made. Remember Coraline?

[@Dr.Mlieko]

@@sev1120 Pretty sure Coraline is not by Disney

[@khoavo510]

Honestly, I think I'm the only one who liked Bellweather as a villain, or at least the concept behind her. The idea of a politician hiding behind a facade while using fear and discrimination to sow mistrust between groups of people and subsequently gain power by doing so is so perfect for the type of movie that Zootopia is and what message it was trying to tell. Bellweather honestly just needed to have more scenes that fleshes her out more. Maybe a backstory that was similar to Judy's and Nick's where she was mistreated and underestimated throughout her life because she was a meek little sheep but she never rises up from those discriminations like Judy had and she let those feelings fester more deeply Nick had. Thus making her like a dark reflection of both Judy and Nick.

[@hawklegs6940]

Honestly, I don’t really agree with her being a bad twist or not showing up enough in the movie. You see her several times being denied and mistreated because of being a meek little sheep. I think why people find her underwhelming is because of her design and personality. She’s so tiny when sheep are usually quite hefty. A change in her body language could make her go from sweet and kind to intimidating. I think her personality should have changed drastically at the reveal, showing her playing into the meek stuttering stereotype so people look the other way why she does her criminal work. Also, what would have helped the twist was if the people cooking the flowers weren’t also sheep, and the only other sheep we see clearly in the movie.

[@fanofyoshi2238]

That's a good interprétation.

[@carmandirda]

She's honestly a realistic villain as well. Many politicians love to fear monger and subtly or un-subtly make people distrust other groups of people to push their goals.

[@crazygamer_1082]

I loved her as the villain it made sense. Plus it wasn’t like the Lion mayor wasn’t also the villain…he was and actually got punished for it. I do hope we don’t have a twist villain for the second movie. But I feel like twist villains are common in mysteries which is technically what Zootopia is

[@petal5326]

I agree-- when it first came out I was super confused because I basically forgot she existed by the time the twist villain was released

[@MrTragedious986]

You know i was wondering how they switched Nick to Judy as the main protagonist in development. Because in the first concept art I saw he’s like getting a lot of focus.

[@Chivecookies_domain]

According to an old video I remember watching (it was in like 2019 or 2020 I think) that it's because of the test audience suggesting that Judy would've been the better main protagonist, only for Nick to be the fan favorite lol

[@MrTragedious986]

@@Chivecookies_domainof course Nick is a fan favorite since we can relate to this Fox.

[@JackebBee-iz7qi]

@@MrTragedious986 There are also other reasons,,,

[@zaytaz9331]

BRUH i wish nick was the main protag, i love him so much, he's also very relatable than the average mc Judy

[@generallyunimportant]

@@JackebBee-iz7qi he _is_ hot as fuck, yeah..

[@WobblesandBean]

15:30 This is actually not true at all. There is a very concerning study of child psychology that showed kids as young as 4 start to treat other races differently based on their parent's own prejudices. Kids internalize that stuff, more than you realize.

[@The1stPurpleCat]

I was absolutely shocked and amazed (not in a positive sense) when I saw video documentation of a similar(?) study. Very young girls, toddlers(?), of different races, were given dolls of 3 different skin colors. Each kid was a different race with different skin colors. The dolls either had the same outfit or no outfit, so no bias there. When asked “Which one is the prettiest?” “Which is the kindest?” “Which is your favorite?” All but one chose the lightest skinned dolls, even from kids with darker skin. One kid picked the medium/middle skin color “because she’s like me!” When asked “Which one is not pretty?” “Which one is mean?” “Which one do you not like?” All /Most of them chose the darkest doll, even the kids with darker skin. The one from earlier to picked ‘the doll that looked like her’ had a super hard time picking one for this round because she ‘thinks they all are nice’ and are ‘best friends’ and implied it wouldn’t be fair to pick one. I am white. I’ve mainly only been in places with majority light skin. But I don’t have any negative connotations towards darker skin color-ed people. But at the same time, not being around them took away the perspective of seeing people treat them differently. Which is why I was so taken aback when the adorable little girl with dark skin like dark chocolate pointed at the dark doll when asked who was bad, and pointed at the light skinned one when asked who was good. I think I realized a lot of my biases and closest thing to ‘racist’ thoughts are just my complete unawareness that some people are racist. For example, in the movie world, I’d be a prey out in Bunny Burrows. And if I went to the city, I would be confused and tell predators to their faces that they aren’t being discriminated against because I didn’t see any discrimination against predators in Bunny Burrow, where there wasn’t many predators to begin with. I clearly now have a much more… nuanced(?) perspective. I can see now that that’s how I used to be and I can correct myself when that happens. Like what he says around 29:07 to 29:45

[@mutedwoodlands]

Yeaaaah! I have Experienced this Personally It’s very painfully difficult to try to improve another person’s discriminatory behaviour, for years you can be friends with them, from childhood to adulthood, you speak up to them, and they still end up hurting you when you thought they left all of that behind.

[@petal5326]

I agree. I assume he just meant that the kids' views weren't concrete or deeply instated yet, so doing something as drastic as putting a collar on someone else seemed a bit unrealistic.

[@GremlinJohnny]

exactly.. i mean he does realize children of marginalized groups have literally been murdered by peers before, right? that's a pretty extreme case, but children can be extremely vicious to one another, usually it's learned. i saw a comment not long ago of someone who said they were nearly beaten to death by bigoted children as a kid, a comment under a video about kids who have been influenced by Sneako. of course, some children can very well be some of the most open people around because they haven't yet been steeped in the biases of the world around them. unfortunately, some have. pretty much everyone has some bias engrained into them in one way or another though since it's systematic, atleast here in the USA and many other places. many children who hold harmful views instilled by authority figures are able to have some sense talked into them though, and most of them aren't spiteful since they are young and, he is right, most of their views aren't that concrete yet. it seems a lot of children just want to do what is right sometimes, or what feels right for them based on some internal compass, so will do things like still try to be friends with people their parents have told them they can't be friends with. i do see where he is coming from, and i do think it's pretty rare to get cases where children are just mean and spiteful like that, but they unfortunately can be. P.S - other than that, a few of his other points were also kinda 'ehhh' to me. i definitely agree that the original version of zootopia would have worked way better though

[@ignorant1126]

unrelated but as a kid I thought if I touched a black person my skin would change 💀

[@LasagnePlays]

Fun fact: Here in the UK its actually called Zootropolis.

[@DostoyevskyTolstoy]

Fun fact: That's a worse name! 👍

[@thedrewster0408]

What’s interesting about that name change was because whenever the movie was being released around March of 2016, the UK was still a European Union member at the time before Brexit happened 3 months later. This information is relevant because there was a zoo in Denmark, another EU member, that had already trademarked the name “Zootopia” so to avoid trademark infringement, they named it Zootropolis instead.

[@ihaveaname699]

I thought this was a prank we were playing but no it's actually called that here oh my god

[@Gloom_Shroom_Gaming]

Even in the US its official name shown on Disney+ was changed to Zootropolis at some point. However, none of the actual movie was edited, so the part where it shows the title towards the beginning still says "Zootopia"

[@Laaks]

In germany it's "Zoomania" No connection in name to an area what so ever

[@Aquiliqex]

The entire plot fulls apart when you stop to think about the night howlers, the flowers and how these things are probably well documented, with their 'feralising' capabilities being well known. The cops should have been investigating suppliers of these plants from the get go and the movie would have ended in half the amount of time with the lion mayor not having to result to lying, all he needed to say is that the predators going feral are most likely due to a drug sythisised from a flower and that they're working towards apprehending these criminals.

[@filipadsiekierka5350]

I agree, I also find it weird how no one questions why the predators are going savage in the first place and why is it only happening in the city, what about the outskirts and other towns?

[@Martyismylifesupport]

@@filipadsiekierka5350 I think they only said for it to be in the city because the movie takes place in the city and also because the police are stationed to protect the city I’m sure places like bunny burrow have police but other then that anything that happens outside of the city police’s stationed area is out of their control

[@filipadsiekierka5350]

@@Martyismylifesupport Well yes, but those ”savage” incidents sound pretty serious. Surely other towns and cities would get interested if they heard about it, right? Why did no one from outside question why this is happening only in Zootopia?

[@Martyismylifesupport]

@@filipadsiekierka5350 because it is said by the skunk doctor and lion heart that up until nick and Judy found the hospital lionheart kept this information from the public to save his reputation and to protect the city from going into chaos and most likely up until bellweather was mayor she kept this information from outsiders which is probably why any outsiders didn’t know but that’s up to people to theorize:)

[@DreamersOfReality]

It literally doesn't matter if people know about Night Howlers. Poverty in real life informs the vast amount of crime, but you still have people denying it. Instead, they'll assert that *certain* demographics are just "predisposed" to crime and poverty. That they're impoverished because of an intrinsic flaw in their *blood*. Racists in Zootopia won't care about the feralizing effects of Night Howlers. They may even say that Predators are uniquely vulnerable to Night Howlers as a result of their race, facts be damned. Bigotry is not rational.

[@Fusilier7]

I will always maintain that the best children's media that tackles discrimination, and just how ridiculous it all is, was the Dr. Seuss book "The Sneetches and Other Stories". The story goes that birdlike beings called Sneetches were divided into two groups - Star Bellied and Plain Bellied, which was a misnomer, as the Plain Bellied had a star that was just too small to be seen, nevertheless, the Star Bellied considered themselves the superior of the two and enjoyed their privileged status, while looking down on the Plain Bellied Sneetches. Until one day, an entrepreneur/con-artist named Sylvester McMonkey McBean comes to the island of the Sneetches and approaches the Plain Bellied, with his invention that will give them a visible star, all for the price of three dollars. This angers the Star Bellied, as they now lost their special affiliation, until McBean approaches the Star Bellies with an invention to remove their star, for the exorbitant price of ten dollars. The story climaxes with the Sneetches, spending more money and going through the machines, with ever increasing insanity and lunacy, as both groups of Sneetches try to one-up the other, until they run out of money, and are left confused as who was who, McBean leaves the island a rich man, gloating that "You can't teach a Sneetch", but the Sneetches did learn for this folly, and realised that just how foolish it all was, that a Sneetch was a Sneetch whether they had a star or not. Zootopia works in a similar way, with or without a shock collar, this was the point Theodore Seuss Gisel was trying to make with his story, discrimination is the collar we wear in life and will shock you regardless of your status. The 1973 Dr. Seuss special featuring the Sneetches illustrates this quite vividly, the Star Bellies were taught to be haughty, conceited and condescending to the Plain Bellies, thus went to great lengths to keeping this privileged status _ad_ _hoc_ and _de_ _jure_ by any means necessary. The story was not one-sided either, as the Plain Bellies embellished in this foolishness too, they were left penniless just like the Star Bellies too by McBean, the whole ordeal revealed to all Sneetches, that they were capable of doing the same embarrassing thing. I think Zootopia should have shown the institutional discrimination, rather than individual, that it was all dictated downward not upward, and that the law and practises were designed to keeping this convoluted status quo, like the Sneetches, Zootopia could have shown just how farcical it all is, Zootopia could have been a parody of real-life Hollywood, that despite viewing itself as the progressive capital of the US, still have institutional inequality that could rival any authoritarian regime. Moreover, whether its stars or collars, discrimination works in both plain sight and behind the scenes, we don't have stars nor collars to know the painful sting of discrimination and inequality.

[@wakkaseta8351]

What you're saying is that the best story is the one where capitalism solves racism?

[@Manas-co8wl]

@@wakkaseta8351 What we're saying is that you can't teach a human, and you're the prime example why.

[@llynxfyremusic]

​@@wakkaseta8351you missed the point by a mile.

[@miimiiandco]

​@@wakkaseta8351 It's a story about how some can go to great lengths to protect their privilages.

[@MasterGamer-f4n]

I loved that book!

[@tequt]

15:50 Children aren't really immune to bigotry, this is what happened throughout much of Europe where kids 1:1 mirrored the bigotry taught to them by their families and the state. Children participated in lynchings and hunts of minorities in Nazi Germany, and a more concrete example of it being the Hitlerjugend. And in the modern day its still a problem among the Balkan youth to basically terrorize anyone thats outside the norm (my close friend had a foreign student from the US get relentlessly bullied for months at his middle school because she was from the USA until she had the chance to get moved to a different school).

[@Raddish-IS-Radd]

I don't think that was his point. I think what he was trying to establish was that the scene did a poor job at showing why they hate predators so much. They don't come off as, "were scared of this creature." They come off as, "we wanna be mean to you for the sake of being mean." Playing into his point that people in the movie come off more as hating predators for plot's sake instead of actually being more nuanced like Judy. I'm sorry but children at their age would just not be as spiteful as the movie tries to portray. I like how you bring up counterpoints but the bigotry argument you proposed doesn't apply at such a young age, and comes with literal years of beliefs instilled within someone only fully realized when they're adults or teens and not literal children. Sorry for the long comment.

[@82844]

THIS!!!! The moment he said that I immediately went to the comments if someone shared the same sentiments I had (you!!! :D) as I was like ??? no?? Children CAN be cruel for the sake of being cruel, especially when the cruel is accepted by those they look up to (parents who makes passive remarks or be outright discriminatory). I will never forget My Child Lebensborn first day of school. THAT is exactly what happened to Nick. The scouts have a system and Nick just isn't simply part of the "good" cogs.

[@82844]

@@Raddish-IS-Radd But the children are mean for the sake of being mean. Society IS wary of predators. The moment Judy told "it is simply in their nature to be feral" those who were passive immediately went "I knew it!" and got more aggressive on their stance. Also children don't understand consequences much but they do understand that if they don't get reprimanded then what they're doing is okay. You're right it takes years of beliefs to fully be instilled on someone but don't forget, the children grew up and lived with one. They either hold on to it or they change once they understand the actual happenstances. Sorry for the long reply I just think you're missing a lot of points. Nick simply had that moment saved as a traumatic event and named it as his world view's turning point.

[@FluffyCloudsandCats]

@@Raddish-IS-Radd you've clearly never been bullied before

[@Raddish-IS-Radd]

@@FluffyCloudsandCats Literally racism shows I haven't been bullied before? Tf are you smoking?

[@Nic_2751]

It’s a shame how the villain really was a big major factor in these 2010s Disney movies, even putting aside King Candy as Turbo being the best possible twist villain, most of the following after just really hindered the movies and some cases nearly destroy it, which is a shame cause it held back so much potential if they had been realized better

[@t1dotaku]

It really did feel like M. Night Shyamalan was whispering into the ears of the Disney execs at the time XD

[@pyronuke4768]

@@Nic_2751 Frozen making a metric fuck ton of cash while having one of the laziest twist villains probably didn't help things.

[@lasercraft32]

"Too miserable" just means "Too realistic..."

[@ELbabotas1]

meh

[@MagicMan1_1_1]

Yeah… except we’re not putting electric shock collars on ethnic minorities, are we?

[@hawklindbergh]

@@lasercraft32Then fuck realism. I want to be entertained, and the original collar story is not entertaining.

[@davidci]

As someone who regarded Zootopia as one of my favorite movies and has been an influential movie for me to pursue film, that Bellwether twist has only pissed me off as time went on. It felt like they just had to assign the villain role to someone last minute. Here's to hoping the 2nd film does better with the themes especially since we've experienced more nuances with its themes since 2016.

[@livingwarrobots4119]

Might not happen as it's too risky but who knows

[@GenderedMess]

Dude same, like I watched this movie 24/7 it was on repeat in my room. But after a certain point I would just skip the reveal of Bellwether because younger me HATED it. As the years have gone I just hate it even more, it made no sense whatsoever and as you said felt extremely last minute.

[@realdragon]

How could it be improved? Could there be clues she's behind all that?

[@def3ndr887]

Don’t count on it, Pixar announced that no more movies will be produced by directors that convey their own story and instead will be focusing on sequels

[@bunnyx2819]

She could have appeared in more scenes or contributed. And at least make her suspicious.

[@JustaGuy_Gaming]

I think another big part that was ignored was how long ago was Zooptia not at peace? Or rather how long ago were Predators still eating prey? It's fine to say "get over it" but if the foxes were eating the bunnies a generation or so ago it's a big ask. Especially if they still have all the natural weapons and teeth needed to still kill. Given the stronger reactions from the older characters like Judy's parents, it almost makes you believe bloodshed was fairly recent.

[@akamered4483]

Yeah, discrimination usually has a long history behind it, the shock-collars would be representative of how the government also used to perpetuate ideas of sexism or racism through laws. Without that context in the film, what should be the focus is how the aftermath of such times affect society (the exact thing we are facing in out modern times), but I guess a badly tied together detective plot was more important than that. 🤷‍♀

[@realdragon]

I imagined it was like caveman times

[@Jaceisdabest]

in the second sentence of the movie judy says “thousands of years ago” for predators eating prey. so they pretty much told us how long ago right at the start

[@JustaGuy_Gaming]

@@Jaceisdabest That is interesting and concerning at the same time. It's been a long time since I watched the movie and I will admit I missed that. That said it's either a long time ago, if it's multiple thousands of years, or fairly "Recently" if it's only 1 or 2 thousand. It would be like saying we were cannibals in the 100's or so.

[@IDonotHaveAGoodName]

@@Jaceisdabest for all we know, zootopia could simply misconstrue history as is often seen in real life. Saying that thousands of years ago two carnivores preyed on small animals but that's passed and now they live in harmony is like saying we used to discrimate black people but they've got laws now and we all live in harmony.

[@mortuaryerror]

Fuck, I love the idea of the first pass of Zootopia. It almost feels like Basil The Great Mouse Detective but with systematic racism and. I don’t know. There’s something nostalgic about animated movies handling dark subjects. Actually, yk what, gonna watch Basil again. Good bloody video

[@jaypee116]

I believe Basil is a better detective than judy.

[@lifeisadrag7705]

@@jaypee116 He most definitely is ngl

[@user-tt1zt6sm8c]

You'll like Zistopia.

[@tarsis5933]

Dude, amazing video, but i will have to disagree with you on somethings, and the biggest one is "the bullies discriminating Wild just because they're mean". I feel like people that say stuff like "children cannot be spiteful" haven't experienced it themselves, and i have throughout my whole childhood. The scene with the bullies might've been the hardest hittting piece of Disney media i've watched, it reopened a box of memories and made my eyes swell with tears. I'm a Venezuelan inmigrant (latino basically), and i could not get away without getting bullied in school because i was was "the spanish", they made fun of me and beat me hard just because the thought my accent and the fact i was an outsider was funny, they called me every name and made me consider that thing a teenager should never (Capital S) and this happened twice during different schools, they never came off as being scared of me, i was a short kid, they genueily hated me because i wasn't white, but as i grew i realized it was them being the jerks, i made friends that respected who i was and cared about me, and that scene broke me because of it. I feel like the movie handled that aspect better than most, sometimes children have bad influences and that might change aspects of themselves for the worse, even hurting others.

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

Yeah children suck. I've had something similar happen to me what nick went through. The stuff haunts you for life and i just can't forget about it

[@currybread5298]

I agree, I can't understand what that feels like but as neurodivergent.. I feel like other kids could sense that I was not like them. I've been treated like shit most of my life. I can assure they were not feeling threatened by me. I was and am kind and harmless. So yes I agree

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

@@currybread5298 I got treated like shit because of race mostly or the fact that I have OCD but mostly due to being a teacher's kid in middle school. Teachers did nothing to stop that

[@Angninjin22]

I'm sorry pal for what happened to you, but I'm glad you found friends in the way. And yeah, children can be good and all but they are still naive and most of the time can be jerks...

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

@@Angninjin22 Ra

[@Dan0saur]

i see all your points and pretty much agree to all of them. However what ruins the movie for me is how it's supposed to be funny/quirky that judy is a corrupt as fuck cop

[@Boricua_User]

As soon as she joins the police force she profiles, blackmails, and makes conections with the mafia.

[@nicholassims9837]

@@Dan0saur how is she corrupted? Your just using excuses to hate a morden Disney movie 🎬

[@theultraatomicgamer]

​@@nicholassims9837She got help from the Mafia

[@hana_flower875]

At least she was trying to do good. The chief character is far worse and doesn't even get a little consequence for being the spitting image of a corrupt and negligent cop.

[@dynamitewolft4194]

@@nicholassims9837 did you even watch the movie

[@spikeabug]

I'd still argue the best scene is the one in the train where the tiger sits down and the mother scoots her kid away from him- it's so subtle but perfect

[@AnxMa]

It wasn't fully appreciated initially but it's still amazing. I got a voice acting background and Jason Bateman's performance's been an inspiration for me since this film. The vocal training was tough, without noticeable results for months but actors like him or the late Kevin Conroy are a great impulse to not give up: I was almost Leon in those new RE games :)

[@Rockotarthepurplehatguy]

Neat

[@Arbysroastbeefjuice]

These aren’t actual voice actors, they’re just celebrities, and Disney likes to hire well known names, rather than people who solely, or mostly do voice acting. Kinda sad, really. They’re just a name

[@Greanery]

@@Arbysroastbeefjuice Jason Bateman is an actor, though.

[@MysticHydra]

Oh my god, the "taming party" scene wouldve broken me. I wouldve been ugly crying in that movie theater.

[@Theathelavalily]

This is one of the best videos on Zootopia ever made. The way you had an entire section where you genuinely praised aspects of the movie you liked, differentiating them from the aspects that you don't like very much was amazing. Honestly I don't often find critics who do it like that. As much as I love the movie we got, the cut version was so much better. The way it showed the prey-the "oppressed" group, making life so much more difficult for the predators, the "oppressors" just to keep themselves safe, is a message we almost never see in film: the people that *historically* had a disadvantage eventually turning the tables on the people with relations to the oppressors who want nothing to do with it, and who don't deserve to have the same done to them. It's such a punching message and the fact that they cut it really irritates me, since there's so much needless prejudice against good people just because of their race, religion, sexuality, political stance, etc. that is celebrated by people who smugly believe they're the most accepting of all.

[@ellugerdelacruz2555]

Exactly! It would've been ahead of its time considering we now live in an ironic age where those who are -ists are the ones calling people "-ists"... Rather than take the opportunity to be truly successful and move on with their lives, those people would rather dunk on the people that look or identify with their oppressors and ask for nonsensical "reparations". Thus, giving the people who are still oppressing them justified reasons to do so and perpetuating the Cycle of Violence.

[@Polychi1998]

@@ellugerdelacruz2555Sorry, can you elaborate what you said in the first sentence?

[@unHolyEvelyn]

​@@Polychi1998 I hate to break it to you, but this is a thread of two racist people who think that people of color hold the majority of power in America and Europe. The language of the first guy saying "the historical oppressors becoming oppressed" is a nice way of saying "white people are being oppressed by people of color," and the second guy is saying it's more racist to call racist people racist in the first sentence, and goes on to say that racism isn't and has never been real, and if it was it's their own fault that people are racist to them anyway. Just good ole KZbin commenter white supremacy :3

[@milo_thatch_incarnate]

@@Polychi1998 - I believe they mean that the people who are screaming that some groups (such as normal straight Christian white people) are inherently racist and sexist... are in fact the ones BEING those things.

[@JaserJas]

​@ellugerdelacruz2555 I get what you're trying to say but the take "the oppressed dunk on people who look like thier oppressors and ask for reparations which gives the ones in power justified reason to keep oppressing them!" which is...not how that works at all I'm sorry to say 😭 Marginalized groups were being savagely oppressed even if they acted the best that they could and kept out of the way, they were still torn down if they ever got too "uppity". If you look up the Tulsa Massacre you'll see what I mean. Even the reparations thing is dumb to bring up cause even if it was 200 years ago, black former slaves were promised 40 acres and a mule when the Civil War was over and never received it. Which led to thier descendants being left with little to no land or prospects. You can have the opinion that the marginalized should let these things go and move on with thier lives but it doesn't change the fact that this history is still affecting these groups to this very day, all across the world. It's not as simple as "be free and be the best you can be!" even though I wish it was.

[@RbyMm]

If companies weren't afraid of making their movies too miserable we'd have movies with better themes and more profound messages, as a lot of good media has those miserable aspects. I'd also talk about aspects of The Lorax by Illumination, especially the cut song "Biggering", but that feels less as being afraid of misery, and more like the studio was afraid of showing a depiction of greed and corruption that could in some way affect their reputation

[@edgaropts5257]

I think it's great that they had enough courage to cover a topic like this in the first place, but it did always feel like something was missing from this portrayal and I could never quite put my finger on it. However, I did notice at the end how all the city's problems were solved without them needing to do anything, which always bugged me.

[@colinrogers9896]

Zootopia is one of those rare movies, where the directors got too ambitious with their first draft compared to the company they were making it for. I would have loved to see the original vision for zootopia as much as the next guy, but unless Disney decides to do a “Snyders cut” of the movie I doubt we’ll ever see it come to fruition

[@seymourpant]

The worst part of Zootopia is shilling an obnoxious pop song and having a dance party ending

[@DostoyevskyTolstoy]

Shakira, shakira...

[@Xhepyxopila]

The worst part is said obnoxious pop song has been stuck in my head since 2016, i was obsessed with that song as much as the characters in the movie

[@UmQasaann]

Literally the worst part of the movie

[@khoavo510]

That's the credit scene, every movie credit (or credits in general) already has a song anyways. Zootopia just happens to make it into a concert. Labeling it as a "dance party ending" is disingenuous.

[@KingBuilder525]

Look up the HISHE parody of that song. It’s hilarious

[@tytheaniman497]

The original version definitely would’ve been better because of how much more real it is, but the one we got was still very relatable and enjoyable. I think both are great but still wish we got the original film because I would’ve loved to see it.

[@NightFangClash]

Disney shouldn't be afraid to make their films a little dark. As long as you have a balance that doesn't make it feel like kids can't watch it too, then it can still work. Disney has made movies with dark content in the past before like The Black Cauldron, the original animated Pinocchio movie Night On Bald Mountain from Fantasia and more.

[@GalekC]

@@NightFangClash peak

[@theinkingskeletonsmess]

Oh wow I just realized how long ago this came out and I'm so glad that someone agrees that the old idea was better than what we got.

[@NightFangClash]

I agree. If I was in charge of Disney, I would have a Zootopia spinoff movie or miniseries where Judy Hopps and Nick Wilde from the final version of Zootopia that we got accidentally end up in the original Zootopia and they have to find a way back home, while trying to make it through this dystopian version of Zootopia and helping their counterparts there.

[@kawansiesquad6659]

Guys go watch beastars if u want a dark version of zootopia. Zootopia is like if humans were pretending to be animals. Beastars is like if animals were pretending to be human. Beastars actually explores the fact that predators need to eat meat and how their society essentially makes eating meat illegal, they have substitutes for meat but it’s an unspoken secret hidden from all herbivores that there is a hidden market selling herbivore meat to carnivores. The story also explores interspecies relationship and how they are viewed by the public. Predators and larger species of animals have to take medications or learn how to suppress their instincts to live in society in peace with herbivores. Bears have to take specific meds so that they don’t get too strong or too big so they don’t harm anyone but it has painful side effects. And there is so much more! It’s such a fascinating story.

[@robk2167]

@@kawansiesquad6659 but are there humans eating other humans? What kind of analogy is there between humans and animals (carnivores and herbivores)?

[@pyro8632]

@@robk2167 Lol an analogy is never 1 on 1. There's also discrimination in Beastars to both sides, I feel there's a bit of an analogy to gender discrimination there, in that carnivores are always seen as the dangerous men and herbivores are the helpless women. The carnivores understand the danger that herbis face and wish to protect them, while herbivores hate the fact that they can't just live in peace and feel safe. Meanwhile Zootopia is more about racial discrimination I feel.

[@robk2167]

@@pyro8632 I dont agree with you here at all as for me Zootopia is about gender than race where carnivores are seen as the dangerous men and herbivores are the helpless women. Its toxic feminism.

[@pyro8632]

@@robk2167 Honestly if you omitted the part about toxic feminism I could see your point, but it kinda shows a certain mentality that's just a bit concerning. Regardless, the final message of any media is very personal to every person, so both of our viewpoints can coexist with neither being wrong. My point was more about Beastars' massages, to be honest.

[@robk2167]

​@@pyro8632 I haven't watch Beastars so cannot give my opinion on this. Ill try to watch asap so I can give you my point of view.

[@amojmarr]

Despite these flaws, I still think this is an incredibly underrated Disney flick. Can’t wait for your next video, as always, Rockotar!

[@Wilker_uwu]

remember how Disney has shut down an entire studio to prevent Nimona from being released. i said it before and i'll say it again: i want a beat-by-beat realization of the original storyboard for this movie!

[@danielx7609]

How about we don’t and you be happy with the movie we got! Like BILLIONS OF fans around the world, like me!

[@NylaTheWolf]

Unless there was something I missed I don't know if it's accurate to say that they shut down Blue Sky just so Nimona wasn't released. We don't know how much they actually knew about the movie.

[@meta527II]

One thing I didn't like about the scene where Nick was being bullied in the flashback was that that one leopard guy or whatever is a hypocrite. He's bullying Nick for being a predator, when he himself is a leopard! (at least I THINK he's a leopard, he sure looks like one.)

[@lightknight6749]

It could have been a commentary on oppressed people putting each other down so that they individually aren't the ones looked down upon (if they did it purposefully, which I doubt)

[@Dolphanatic]

@@meta527II He was a woodchuck, not a leopard. All of the kids in that scene (aside from Nick) were prey animals. That was the point.

[@kade-qt1zu]

@@Dolphanatic Bro confused a woodchuck for a leopard, that is crazy.

[@Alexx.wee-]

Yeah im pretty sure there was a hippo too like

[@donkylefernandez4680]

The moment you realize bullies don't actually need a reason to be toxic wastes of human beings

[@dawdtambadou3060]

This and Ralph breaks the internet has me fully convinced that Disney micromanaging is what drove rich moore away. There's just no changing my mind

[@jaypee116]

Wait so he's not doing the sequel? Because that's bad.

[@anthonyrodriguez4905]

​@@jaypee116Jared Bush, who wrote and Co-directed Zootopia and Encanto is the only one returning to write and direct Zootopia 2

[@jaypee116]

@@anthonyrodriguez4905 oh thank you.

[@AtariiWave]

Isn't Byron Howard working on the sequel? ​@@anthonyrodriguez4905

[@SivleFred]

I do kind of understand why you'd consider Zootopia to have a lot of coincidences and that this is a major flaw, but I think the major flaw of Zootopia is that it's very plot driven. It's something I noticed looking back at it where I noticed a lot of the praise for the movie back then came from its moral and the pop culture references (especially the Godfather one). But if you take out the references and the moral, you're just stuck with a cookie cutter, by the number buddy cop film. It pretty much plays all the tropes in the book, and dead straight, too. By-the-law cop that wants to prove they’re worth something? Check! Partner usually breaks or bends the rules and that’s how they get things done? Check! They have a time limit to solve the case? Check! They arrest someone, have a fallout, and then proceed to capture the real villain, complete with a dramatic showdown, evil gloating, and a caught-on-tape Engineered Public Confession? Check! Check! Check! It's thanks to the moral and chemistry between Judy and Nick that this movie does have a personality, but it does feel like Zootopia is going through a plot checklist, just making sure all the scenes are progressing at the right times, using the coincidences you mentioned. I do agree that the reveal of what the Night Howlers were is bad. It really feels like an amateur writer wrote this without knowing what "show, don't tell" was. Considering the shock collar plot was abandoned in late 2014, Disney only had a little more than a year to redo nearly the entire movie, and when it comes to movie making, that amount of time is relatively short. I will bet that this is why the final version of Zootopia is the way that it is, with the coincidences and plot checklist feel. I wouldn't be surprised if having to rework the whole movie in only a little amount of time meant having to resort to coincidences instead of letting the plot grow organically. I do believe that Zootopia is the most average of the Disney movies, and had it had more time to develop, I think it would have been much more well regarded today. At least we'll have a sequel. We'll see what that will bring.

[@MrAspiringactor]

THANK YOU! That was my problem with the movie; it had way too much of a "plot checklist" feel to it.

[@hawklindbergh]

@@SivleFred So then watch something else and STOP BITCHING ABOUT IT.

[@lasercraft32]

Remember when Isabelle from Animal Crossing was a twist villain in a Disney movie? That was wild. XD

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

I know right crazy Surprised Nintendo didn't sue though

[@MrStark-up6fi]

Which movie was it? I’m gonna watch it lol

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

@@MrStark-up6fi communist zooptopia

[@lasercraft32]

@@MrStark-up6fi Zootopia (or Zootropolis, depending on your region). Its this movie lol.

[@jae_vee]

The original story is amazing. As a person of colour, that version hits so so close to home. So many people in my community of brown and black people (specifically poor and low-income) WANTED to live their lives like everyone else, had dreams and inventions and ideas and businesses, but the world wouldn’t allow them. So just like Nick, they became what the world expected of them or just gave up. And the collar is especially genius; in a humor, relatability and world building standpoint. The ‘collar’ in real life is the suppression of ourselves to conform to eurocentric ideals. The pressures to be the ‘good black person’ who is quiet and wellspoken and not like ‘the others’. The weight of knowing that every move you make could potentially define the attitudes of your race to others. So many black and brown people actively codeswitch and reject their culture to appease the system that rejects them. And the simple doodles of how prey and preds see each other made me strangely emotional. Prey see predators as dangerous, unpredictable creatures. Predators see prey as ‘sitting on them’. And it breaks my heart of how relatable it is. I’m not necessarily ‘afraid’ of white people, but it has been instilled in me that I am below them. That I have to shut up and agree for my safety and to get through life. If I saw this movie instead, it would be my favourite Disney movie of all time. As is, I enjoyed it. But I agree wholeheartedly that to make the problem be personal instead of systemic failed to address the root of the problem. It’s not about the ‘good cop’ and the ‘corrupt official’, it is the poisoned foundation of their society that is causing such horrific damage.

[@lifeisadrag7705]

I'm a person of color too, and while I liked the movie we got when I was younger, I remembered seeing the deleted scenes on youtube and feeling upset that we couldn't the originally idea with the shock collars and Nick not just being a con-man out of just one bad experience with prey as a kid and instead as a guy who's down on his luck trying to make the best out of a bad situation, and trying to make life better for him and predators like him. I think it's a big shame Disney couldn't try something like that with something so raw, especially with that scene with the taming party. Learning in order to become an adult you have to become more aware of how the world works, how cops view you, how certain people will treat you is genuinely heartbreaking as a child, and something that was inflicted onto me when I was younger.

[@DostoyevskyTolstoy]

As a person of (paler) color... ...yup, that about sums it up. :/ I'll do my part to combat the institutional barriers when and as I see 'em, but probably half the time I just don't notice in the first place. I stay quiet, humble, and try and stay open and teachable tho. :) Always lookin' to help a brother out, when and as I can tho. Top minorities in my area are Hispanics, Pacific Islander (Filipino) and Native American, and I'm in what's historically been a very... _exclusionist_ subregion. At my high school, only about 2-4% were actual 'black people,' but I mean... Mark and I got along fine. I _think_ I remember having checked out his Soundcloud page. (it was just a'ight.) ...it's tough to figure out how to help when there ain't so much to help y'all _with_ in my local area, but... I mean, I *do* try...

[@Polychi1998]

The term “color people” is back on the menu! White racist would be smiling on you guys!

[@Quarckster]

Nah, I see it more as an analogy for social credit.

[@Quarckster]

What part of black culture is being suppressed exactly?

[@xiujinkim9518]

I would recommend Beastars, it’s an anime that have a similar concept, but darker. It hits the more complex ideas Zootopia wasn’t able to explore.

[@Dara-qk5md]

yess i was just about to say this, beastars is amazing

[@gebbygebbers]

Hecc yeah, watch zootopia, then beastars back to back 😊

[@zerostudioszx3227]

I know this is a bit of a controversial opinion, but Bellwether was like, the last somewhat decent twist villain, since her plan...kinda makes sense, in a way. I personally think the movie up to that point was really good, if not, amazing, but the twist just kinda brings to movie to a crawl. Though thankfully, at that point, you're just a few minutes away from the end of the movie, so at least there's that. Other than that however, I do really like Zootopia.

[@Gloom_Shroom_Gaming]

That's a fair opinion. Bellwether's plan makes sense, I just don't like her because of how boring and predictable she is, being the "overworked secretary of someone powerful and [seemingly] bad" archetype.

[@hawklegs6940]

I think she shows up in the movie plenty, and they show how often she’s pushed aside or ignored. Honestly I think she could have worked a lot better with a design and personality change. Make her the actual size and shape of a regular sheep, then play into the fat, slightly annoying from stuttering, meek hunched character. People expect the fat character to be the joke character, unfortunately. Then when the reveal happens, she changes her posture, and her voice. Suddenly she’s strong, intimidating. Suddenly she speaks clearly in less of a high pitched ditzy tone. She’d be leaning into the sheep stereotypes on purpose, just like nick, because nobody expected anything more from her. She lets this fester in resentment, and decides to weasel her way in and make this plot to gain power. I think it would have made her a much better villain!! It’d be freaky to see her change so suddenly and drastically when there’s really no change at all, how unsettling it’d be to find out she was being fake the whole time. Also, if they didn’t want the twist to be so obvious, her lackeys shouldn’t have been sheep as well. Or at least not all of them.

[@notapplicable8957]

7:50 - What really doesn't work about this movie though is the fact that the characters being animals creates a violation of verisimilitude. If you know anything about real life, you know that animal behavior is specific to their species and sub-species in a way that isn't as true for humans. If a rabbit was in a social situation with a fox, it would be in real danger because foxes eat rabbits. The idea that we can just forget this fact as we notice that they're people really doesn't work very well because the movie has to spend too much time either working against or completely ignoring this understanding of reality, such that in the end we can't really be sure what it's getting at. I'm not saying animals as characters can never work, but if you're trying to go deep on what the psychology of discrimination is like, this really isn't a great platform for doing so.

[@theggamer2824]

Ngl I didn’t watch Zootopia in theaters. I actually watched it first in a classroom and I loved it at that moment and ngl I was kicking myself for not watching it in theaters when it came out. I will say I feel like if the Villain was better i woulda probably consider it one of the best animated movies. As it is I still love so much.

[@GalekC]

i saw it three times in theaters &, while i thought it was my favorite thing at the time, i don't really remember that experience anymore

[@cosmicskydragon333]

One thing that always hurt the movie for me was how the Night Howlers were used and how shortly before Judy had to give the conference she heard a doctor say those things. Did no one in the entire world know of this somehow? The entire world would have to be so racist that everyone who knows refuses to call. That a common plant can do this on all animals at base without complex chemical interactions. That it doesn't wear off on its own over time. She somehow found it out in secret and managed to keep a secret without anyone spilling it. Where someone was caught stealing this and no one looked up what it could be used for to cause harm. This is literally a single step from being a zombie apocalypse, and... it is an allegory for racism cause by funny plant that can do this on its own by hitting someone with it not even ingesting it. No prey animals accidentally hit or effected at all. I legitimately believe the implementation of Night Howlers was done so quickly and so poorly it harmed the core narrative and it genuinely raises questions. Did Nick not fear for his life when he heard the doctor and Lion talking, did he completely dismiss what was actively happening? That when we find him later he is perfectly fine and not crippled from the stress of this situation and fear of becoming a monster as he will get infected by whatever is happening? He's behaving like he already solved it and knew, that right after the conference he was going to tell Judy about Night Howlers but didn't, and he considered visiting her to tell her but realized her farm would have it so she'd be back when she learns the truth, and decided to record it. I think that is why I say the original drafts for the movie were better, it wasn't as contrived and actually addressed the issue without using cheap glass that if you look at even slightly creates major concerns.

[@TeresaCabreraAliaga]

I agree

[@nicholassims9837]

@@TeresaCabreraAliaga Your thinking way too deeply into it

[@evanbarth7173]

10:11, congratulations, you just perfectly described systemic racism/sexism! This is one of the many reasons why I love your videos. Also, I’m working on my own Ralph Breaks the Internet video if you’re interested.

[@SuperSallySteak]

You got any spare oppression? I'm feeling a little bored and need a conflict

[@evanbarth7173]

@@SuperSallySteak this analogy counts for disabled people, too

[@Sumschmuck]

@SuperSallySteak It's 2024, you can be oppressed about anything you want so long as you blame it on the mean ol' wypipo

[@chingon718]

In my opinion this should have been a Pixar movie as the theme and message is exactly what Pixar does.

[@SaffronicSaffron]

Zootopia walked, so that the movies we make in the future can run. That's just what I think.

[@SaffronicSaffron]

Thanks for the heart.

[@unclebaba3463]

"Zootopia walked so Disney could slowly and increasingly cripple those that came after"

[@GalekC]

im happy for it doing well - i think, making it past a billion in revenue. i can say that much

[@Echiewel]

3:05 "Not to mention being on opposite sides of the predator and prey spectrum." Oh wow, I'm not sure I ever realized this, but cops "prey" on criminals, so their relationship is defined along this axis in more ways than one.

[@Toshiro93]

Aside from the plot and the characters of Nick and Judy, what I appreciated most about Zootopia is precisely the fact that they resumed the use of animals as an "allegory" of humans, given that they hadn't been there for a while animal protagonists in a Disney film, especially if we consider intelligent animals (like humans) in the wake of Phaedrus or Aesop.

[@McDonalds_Tighnari_official]

I feel like if the target audience wasn’t 7-10 year olds, they probably would’ve done it like this

[@simplydavid6191]

First that but secondly Disney just dislikes to take risks and wants to have an as broad audience as possible to maximize profits.

[@bowserbreaker2515]

My biggest issue with this movie is well...the theme itself. While I am glad that it was more general and not covering anything specific in the real world, I just don't think Disney should have tackled this. And there's also the twist villain, who stinks. If this were just a buddy cop movie, it probably wouldn't have been as memorable, but more consistently entertaining.

[@AbrasiousProductions]

the message against racism here is executed very poorly and doesn't mesh well with the film, mainly because it's a natural fact that predators are instinctually driven to have a desire to hunt pray but applying that to real life is like saying black people are instinctually more driven to commit crimes when that isn't true at all, the cold hard truth about bigotry is that it's an idea that could infect any race, no race is more racist or lesser than the other, you could find a black and a white guy who are both equally as bigoted or friendly as each other. that's why I think the film fails in such a profound way, it's almost hypocritical in it's message

[@nicholassims9837]

This is again someone taking the film way too seriously then whats needed The film uses predators and prey to make it easier to understand and its loads better then being prejuidice when you think your better then another race or a thoundsand year war you dont even remember . Its like the lessons in Willy Wonka where they teach you no to be a bratty spoiled child

[@Dolphanatic]

While Zootopia's scrapped tame collar storyline did have some interesting moments, I disagree with the idea that it would've been a better movie overall. Sure, the taming party scene with the polar bear cub is sad in isolation, but it falls apart when you remember that up until that point, the collars were mostly played for laughs, not drama, making the sudden tone shift really jarring. There's also the issue of the conflict being spelled out too obviously, taking away from the mystery aspect of the movie. I honestly prefer the subtlety we got in the final version of the movie and think it works a lot better, even if it still relies on the overused trope of the twist villain reveal.

[@lifeisadrag7705]

I really disagree since with the little animation/scene of Nick's reaction where he gets his collar taken off with the armadillo doctor, we're given a visualization of how he feels before and after it is off. You can see the pain in his expressions when it's on and the surprise and relief you see in his face when it comes off. It's played off for laughs, but it's easy to view that as just how they cope with the situation.

[@Dolphanatic]

@@lifeisadrag7705 It's still not serious enough to match the tone of the taming party scene. We see way too many moments of the collars being used as a visual gag to take them seriously. The tonal whiplash audiences would experience upon going from seeing a group of predators get comically electrocuted after water splashes on them by a passing car and Finnick setting his collar off while ranting about how he hates being dressed like a baby would make it almost impossible to take the emotional scene with the polar bear seriously.

[@nikaduhaney6790]

27:14 what you’re describing here is a sentiment I’ve grown up with my whole life as a black person, the “twice as much work to get half as much” rule. While I see how the original version of Zootopia more accurately portrayed all kinds of discrimination, I feel it speaks so much more to racial discrimination than anything else (speaking as someone who is black, queer, trans and AFAB). The internalized sense of a lower self worth that Nick’s conman personality represents reflects my own internalized racial biases as an African American. The collar idea and the fact that Zootopia’s discrimination is based on physical attributes and anatomical characteristics comes across as discrimination against the people explicitly for how they look rather than their economic status. (totally just my opinion tho)

[@pjp48]

If you don't like racism move to Europe

[@mateogonzalez5678]

​@@pjp48 That's a good joke lolll

[@mateogonzalez5678]

I can agree with that. I think if they committed to the first draft idea, the "predator vs prey" dynamic would've been more concrete. It would have made for a more powerful story if it were focused on that racial discrimination angle rather than trying to make it vague in fear of offending or alienating a broad audience.

[@gryffonmanic]

"Beep Beep I'm A Mean Sheep" ...I understood that reference

[@eeveefennecfox]

wait,that's a reference? to what? I've seen it every where but the original

[@DIGITULW0RLD]

@@eeveefennecfox "beep beep im a sheep" its a song from asdf movie

[@eeveefennecfox]

@@DIGITULW0RLD thank you,I will take a look at it

[@SleepyLuigi]

I remember some of the deleted scenes making me cry, which is EXACTLY what a Disney film should do, even if it isn’t for the right reasons.

[@gamerstheater1187]

Honestly, after the stuff that happens next, I think we can say it was the best modern Disney film

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

Yeah this was the last good Disney movie if I can remember

[@sedij2358]

Nah, wreck it ralph and encanto were much better in my opinion.

[@MeepMacArthurlll]

@@sedij2358 wreck it Ralph came out before this and I think encanto is pretty average and has that line of Disney films where there is no actual bad antagonist and is just domestic or family or something

[@ivythay4259]

Encanto was well received

[@sedij2358]

@@MeepMacArthurlll yes, but wreck it Ralph can still be considered a modern Disney movie. It came out only 4 years before zootopia. As far as Encanto goes with its main conflict, I think it did it the best out of the Disney movies that have used that trope.

[@Boricua_User]

17:49 The armadillo doctor is straight up wearing an ordenance disposal suit.

[@loszhor]

It was visually good looking but the story felt rushed and very thin. Like tons of stuff got cut and what was left were mediocre jokes and a nonoffensive, "safe" story about discrimination with the unmistakable scent of copaganda. So overall very "meh".

[@dracodracarys2339]

My biggest issue with Zootopia is that they use...predators and prey as an allegory for prejudice? The thing about real-world prejudice is that it's purely unjustified. It's really very arbitrary and unfair how people are treated differently for superficial things like the color of their skin or the shape of their eyes or the language they speak or the genders they're attracted to or identify as. But to equate that to prey being afraid of predators? That's a JUSTIFIED reason. Of course the bunnies and sheep and deer are afraid of the wolves and lions and bears. There's an actual, reasonable cause for the prejudice. I have the same issues with X-Men and Elemental, too. Of course normal humans are scared of the guys with laser eyes and metal claws and psychic powers, because they are able to inflict great harm to them if they so wished. Of course the fire people are scared of the water people because they literally extinguish them if they touch. Unlike different races, ethnicities, genders and sexualities, which a community is more diverse and better off when they mingle, they literally depict herbivores and carnivores, fire and water, and the superpowered and the powerless: things that, by inherent nature, should be kept separate.

[@nicholassims9837]

This is again someone taking the film way too seriously then whats needed The film uses predators and prey to make it easier to understand and its loads better then being prejuidice then you think your better when another race or a thoundsand year war you dont even remember . The X Men is a bad example as Shrek taught us to not judge a book by its cover as why should people be afraid of a muntant just for beign different there not evil monsters that need to be killed off ? and elemental while yes fire should be careful but you still shouldn't be dicks as again its not the wayer's people fault

[@amarhastings6849]

@@nicholassims9837you can’t take a film about racial prejudice “too seriously”. It’s a serious issue. Also, DONT JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER? You are literally inferring that minorities look or are dangerous. Shrek is a giant green ogre. The fear of him is not arbitrary, unlike minorities

[@cosmicskydragon333]

It gets even worse when you realize a common plant is causing what looks to be the equivalent of a zombie apocalypse entirely effecting predators. That a doctor pushed it to something on this level as the only thing they could come up with. That no one in the world knew what was happening and didn't inform the city. This is not the best set up for an allegory, this is the set up for a horror movie.

[@nicholassims9837]

@@amarhastings6849 no it's not it's judging someone before you Even know them

[@miimiiandco]

I think there is a lot of potential for uneven racism stories. A bigoted Prey could fallback on the excuse that their kind ate people in the past, or they're dangerous. A Predator could use their dangerous status as a scare tactic. Maybe mice could be treated above bigger animals because their small size makes it easier to care for them. A fish society is necessarily segregated from land animals, so they're bound to be treated differently. How would a society so disconnected from the others gain an opinion on, say, mammals? What about the other way around? That requires you to make a story about racism among animals, rather than a story that uses animals as an allegory for human racism.

[@Timetowakeup83]

Bro wtf is this music 14:34

[@rumpeltyltskyn]

You can’t… critique a story for requiring coincidence. That’s generally how stories work. “You’re telling me, out of ALL the people in the universe, Luke just HAPPENED to meet his long lost twin sister?”

[@jcohasset23]

While coincidences do happen in stories the amount of them in Zootopia does raise eyebrows

[@rumpeltyltskyn]

@@jcohasset23 I’m pretty sure if you looked at the plot of most movies you could say the EXACT same thing. Jurassic Park. They just happened to break down in front of the T. rex padlock? Ian just HAPPENED to get covered by straw so that he’d survive- and he had the ability to give himself a tourniquet, which isn’t a particularly well known skill? Grant and the boy just HAPPENED to get into the perfect stop to survive a car falling DIRECTLY on top of them falling out of a tree? The group just HAPPENED to run into a sick dinosaur so Ellie separated from the group so she was with Muldoon to help turn the power back on? Coincidences run stories because coincidences run real life.

[@jcohasset23]

@@rumpeltyltskyn Some coincidences can be accepted if they feel organic, especially if the audience is still willing to suspend disbelief. With Luke and Leia I don't think it was decided for them to be siblings until RotJ, though Star Wars has pretty much always relied on coincidences to further its story. In the book Ian didn't survive (but then neither did Hammond) so him dying had to be retconned for The Lost World, which author and screenwriter Michael Crichton only started working on after Jurassic Park was picked up to be turned into a movie. I've always felt the scene with the jeep to be a plothole as initially the paddock is shown to be level with the road yet when the jeep is pushed into the paddock there is a large drop on the other side (Grant and the kids also apparently don't encounter any more enclosure barriers until the scene with the electric fence). As for Ellie being separated from the rest I don't recall how it came to be in the book as by their professions one would expect Grant to be more willing to stay behind but I do recall that Grant and Ellie's character arcs are different in the book and the kids play a smaller roll compared to the movie. If we were going by Zootopia's coincidences the sick triceratops would have shown up at the end to battle the t-rex.

[@rumpeltyltskyn]

@@jcohasset23 My guy I could do this all day but it’s a waste of my time and energy. I simply do not agree that this is a valid criticism. (Outside of the infamous magically appearing cliff in the T. rex paddock. That’s a plot hole no matter what) All the coincidences in Zootopia are pretty tame for a buddy cop movie.

[@Jane-qh2yd]

One reason why I think the collars wouldn't work is because it would create a very clear good guy vs bad guy scenario, which would completely go against what you claimed to be a strong point of the actual movie. The same way Nick could be discriminated for being a "sly dangerous fox", judy can also be discriminated for being a "dumb small bunny". However, this dynamic wouldn't be possible if one group was marginalized to the point of submission. It would remove a lot of the nuance of the final product. I'd say neither is actually better. They are just completely different visions

[@carlamcgath7528]

I’m so happy that this is being talked about, I think one of disneys biggest issues right now is they’re not taking any risks, but it’s crazy because some of their most popular movies are all ones with darker themes, not only do kids movies with darker themes make a lot of money on release but they tend to make a lot of money in the future aswell, films that you grow up and watch as an adult but still enjoy, so it just confuses me why a money greedy company wouldn’t want to make more money. I believe some day Disney is going to either do something big or it is going to die out, the only way they have been able to stay relevant is by creating controversy for themselves, but that doesn’t last long, I’d like to hopefully see a new animation industry start up in my lifetime, because the people who work at these big companies aren’t normal people with interesting ideas their all people who were given these opportunities and make a fortune from mediocre ideas. Nothing new is ever happening.

[@kacklina]

Zootopia feels super incomplete for a reason, the first version seemed to me to be the true version, always.

[@expertfilmliam]

I don't like Zootropolis (That's the British Spelling of the Film) as much as other Disney films, I think it's alright with some really great moments, but to me it didn't grab me as much as other films, and seeing what could've been makes me like it a bit less, because the idea of Collars being something that Predators have to where, is such a novel idea that truly reflects the real world and it could've really opened up so many peoples eyes to how scary the world really is.

[@HegeRoberto]

15:04 I think you are not noticing how this movie is set in a setting like the 2000s and Judy is Nick are both the first Rabbit and first Fox police officers. Bogo, Judy and many others in the city don't just have a problem specifically with Judy they all think rabbits are weak and helpless and have pushed them out of the profession. Same with Bogo shutting down Nick in the rainforest district with "do you think I will believe A FOX". He doesn't have a problem with Nick specifically, and not of the officers that work for Bogo are even surprised by his blatant speciesm against Nick and foxes. It's why no fox ever wanted to become a police officer before Nick.

[@xavier10x]

I'm sad you don't love it, but I will respect your opinion!

[@timy9197]

You make a lot of great points. I loved this movie but I always thought it was weird that Judy’s speech changes Zootopia immediately rather than people already having that bias beforehand.

[@AJ-wg4rz]

The way i always saw it is that hearing the speech from Judy, a figure of authority, made their preexisting biases against predators feel ‘acceptable’ to openly express.

[@isaiahnaegi645]

Looking back, A Bug's Life (another 3d film regarding wild animals) was a bit darker than the final product Zootopia turned out based on the execution alone. If they had stuck with some of the more mature elements (among other things), Zootopia, The Lion King, Dinosaur, Hell even The Jungle Book, The Good Dinosaur and The Wild would've been the best disney animal themed projects ever.

[@Lesbiwolf92]

I don't think it's fair to say Judy's bias, be it consciously or subconsciously, against foxes comes from her parents. She was bullied by Gideon and he even attacked her leaving a mark on her physically and mentally which while outwardly she doesn't hold it against foxes, it's clear that through her parents and past experiences with Gideon she does have hidden biases she isn't aware she has until Nick literally scares them to the surface and she reaches for her fox spray.

[@OpticalSorcerer]

I definitely prefer the more modern, realistic vibe vs a dystopia, but I think it'd be interesting for the sequel.

[@ladyharubun]

You would have an absolute FIELD DAY with the anime Beastars. It's often compared with Zootopia because both revolve around tensions between predators and prey. Beastars, however, is intended for mature audiences and the predators don't simply “go savage”. Every single one of them has to hold back their blood thirst in some way shape or form. This is the first video I watch from you so, I'm not sure if you're open to watching/discussing anime. I just think Beastars would give you more to chew on, if you enjoy the dark and mature ideas from the Zootopia that could have been. I really enjoy both things and I'm very excited for Zootopia 2.

[@Jurassic93-nd2tm]

Bros comment got hearted and I was one of only 2 people to like it dam

[@Origoldklang]

I love your videos, your monsters inc. review is still one of my favorite ideos on yt, same with the Azula analysis

[@goroakechi6126]

…okay, while I like what the concept movie was going for…I can also see why it was cut. You’re right in that Disney wanted it to be family friendly, that’s their brand; movies that can either be enjoyed or understood by people of all ages. Even if you don’t understand the banal evil in The Incredibles of making superheroes, icons of selflessness, work the scummiest jobs known to man, you can still get a kick out of the movie. With this, I genuinely don’t see it. Without toning down the inherit violence and complication of discrimination, kids can’t understand it. And it would definitely be painful to watch.

[@lioN1313yn]

I feel like you could sprinkle in some stuff from Beastars, an anime that does talks about the nuances of an animal kingdom live together but are always in fear about each other nature and instincts. Herbivores always having subtle bias on carnivores , and Carnivore must be trained to restraint from eating meat if they ever want to live peacefully with other animals.

[@QueSeraSeraaaa]

Strangely enough, they handled the theme of discrimination better, Nick being a boy-scout who was bullied by the preys and Judy being bullied by a predator who improved a lot as an adult, to the point that he apologized to her and become loveable. Nick wasn’t trusted due to being a fox and Judy wasn’t either but because she was a rabbit, a cuddly meek prey. My only issue is neither of those characters, it’s Bellwether, she wasn’t given enough screen time to explain how she went from being an ally to being an enemy without further explanations, it sorta happen.. Also, who is Doug?, how she met him? Since when he was working for her? But, whatever, it was a really nice movie.

[@5upertnt_ng73]

" A movie that i have _liked,_ but not *_loved._* " You're not Anton Ego bro, don't even bother.

[@DostoyevskyTolstoy]

Because he doesn't *_swallow...?_*

[@leebulger7112]

"I don't like food I love it! If I don't love it I don't swallow".

[@leebulger7112]

@@DostoyevskyTolstoy You just barely beat me to the punch.

[@DostoyevskyTolstoy]

@@leebulger7112 Never forget: it's not about who does it _first,_ it's about who does it best. And you've proven you can recognize this by acknowledging me, so I'll leave you with one more fun saying: "Great minds think alike, though fools seldom differ." (Keep up the good work, kid. :)

[@leebulger7112]

@@DostoyevskyTolstoy When I made my original comment I didn't see yours so for a minute I thought I was first not that it matters just a little fun.

[@ChronicAndIronic]

video you came for starts at 22:00

[@helpigotkidnapped]

well doesn't he have to talk about the flaws of the movie to show how much better the original could've been

[@ChronicAndIronic]

@@helpigotkidnapped not for 22 minutes, plus you should probably have a general understanding if you watched the movie

[@justanotherguy2609]

I personally love this film and do think it’s one of Disney best! I respect your opinions and analysis, as I can understand its flaws, I can just personally overlook them. Great video.

[@TigerKirby215]

I think the collars make the message of both sides having negative stereotypes less impactful. A big point in Zootopia is how Judy is seen as nothing more than a "cute bunny" and Nick is viewed as nothing more than a "sly fox." It's meant to depict how both sides are judged by society. By comparison with the collars you have one side that's inherently seen as "bad" by the general populus. That does somewhat exist in base Zootopia (prey are the dominant species) but I think opening Judy up to being judged by her peers in the police force (bigger "prey" animals like the police chief ox) shows how stereotypes harm everyone. With that being said I wish Nick's backstory was fleshed out as more than just "bullied lol." Being denied his dream due to systematic racism as opposed to "some kids were mean to him" would've been much more impactful for the message. Same with the sheep having any characterization at all: I understand the message of "the meek sheep is the fiercest predator"/"even the kindest people can have the most sinister intentions" but sheep is depicted so poorly for Disney's funny twist villain craze that she detracts from the movie overall.

[@NylaTheWolf]

I feel like it was more than just some kids were mean to him. He was muzzled, that's a traumatic experience. Also even though he wasn't an adult, that prejudice did crush his dream of being a boy scout

[@GarrettPetersen]

If you were in the Zootopia universe (collar version) how would you organize society? 1) Let predators kill and eat all the prey animals 2) Segregation of predators and prey 3) Use a technical solution like the collars to allow predators and prey to live together without predators killing prey If you don't live in a convenient universe where predators are actually no threat to prey animals, then you have to deal with the problem somehow. That's why the racism angle falls flat.

[@Cosmosdestructor]

I mean, by the end their relationship definitely was romantic. “You know you love me.” “Do I know that? Yes, yes I do.”

[@someone-.-]

The directors left their relationship deliberately ambiguous to test audience response and better define their relationship if they made a sequel.

[@Cosmosdestructor]

@@someone-.- they are making a sequel. Nick and Judy are in a relationship.

[@bobtheball5384]

That doesn't mean they're in a relationship...people say that to their friends too. It's fine to ship them and there is genuine chemistry to there relationship but the movie just makes them friends. An "I love you" moment in film would be more explicit. A better example where you could tell two cartoon characters are a lot more than friends is Diane and Mr. Wolf from the Bad Guys. You can just tell by the way they interact and behave around each other their relationship can be read a lot more than just platonic by the way the dance together. With Nick and Judy I can see them being partners as just any other buddy cop duo. That dance party scene at the end was more like casual friends. Not necessarily lovers.

[@manuelarocho8131]

I guess platonic love doesn't exist. Though i do understand given their chemistry and Nick did look a bit worried, well as worried as he can with a face like that, when Judy was questioning if she does. Haha. But yeah it was left to interpretation and given the results. Majority of fans do want them together- hopefully it's natural like the first.

[@AquariumBoy55]

Omg you don't know how obsessed I was with the original Zootopia concept. I'm so happy you made a video about it. There are barely if any videos on how amazing the movie could have been

[@svalluxadequex6913]

14:00 wtf is this music. no like fr. someone legit had to sit there and think "huh yea this is good background music" wth. great vid otherwise tho

[@avramweiss4125]

Fr though

[@StitchdTeeth]

nerve wracking ass bg music

[@Laaks]

If I don't mix things up, it should be from "Legend of Zelda: A link to the past (Snes)"

[@evereq8970]

Language..

[@evereq8970]

​@@StitchdTeeth language..

[@ZOLIENZEV]

The worst comment I’ve ever received on a video was a short I did covering the movie Nimona. I claimed that I felt the movies discrimination allegory wasn’t handled the best due to it being one sided, and that Zootopia is a better example because it shows how discrimination effected all sides of the story. Man oh man I was not expecting the absolute bitterness and aggression from the top comment of that short. I’m really happy to see that I’m not the only one that feels this movie had a very refreshing way of handling its allegory.

[@thedrewster0408]

Yeah I can see why they would be upset about that short video considering the various production issues that Nimona had faced, especially how it initially got shelved and cancelled by Disney due to the shutdown of Blue Sky Studios. Then Annapurna purchased the film from them along with Netflix distributing the film so that the Nimona team can get back to finishing the movie. But I can totally understand where you’re coming from because people on the internet can get quite irrational when it comes to these takes.

[@feiradragon7915]

@@ZOLIENZEV To be fair, Nimona was straight up willing to befriend a murderer just because the victim was a politician. She had no reason to believe Bal was innocent until after they met. Granted her bias against the government is justified by the fact they criminalized her mere existence but still.

[@benfox4626]

If Disney really wanted to tell a story this groundbreakingly mature in its' subject matter, Disney honestly should have upped to age rating to PG-13 for once, that way they would have been able to keep in the scenes that were deleted. It's a major reason why I think "9" is a superior movie to "WALL-E" despite the two films sharing a similar thematic message.

[@Eri__draws_123]

We missed out on a better story as usual but I still think it was good

[@Flipdagoose]

5:12 "Not the intent of the writers" Nobody has a problem with what the writers intent was, the problem starts with the implication. I personally think for instance that portraying discrimination as a "Predator and prey" dynamic is among the worst ways you could do it. It's not even a good way to explain something like that to children, because it implies there's a genuine important difference between these kinds of groups. You can't effectively portray discrimination between human beings with a diverse range of animals, which all work in VASTLY different ways and have VASTLY different needs.