FLSUN v400 Review - I do not recommend this

[@robs_garage4790]

First off, this machine is nearing 2 years old... From a company that definitely does not move a lot of units in comparison to brands like anycubic, elegoo, creality, prusa, bambu lab The thermal runaway is definitely an issue that should not have been allowed out of the factory in such a state. However I own two of these one with WELL over 4000 print hours on it.... And let me tell you, the V400 absolutely can print beyond 600mm/s with accel around 50k while retaining quality at that. The delta calibrate also does work, I have seen the values change in the .cfg Who cares what slicer is on the given usb drive really... Theres up to date profiles for these machines on all the major slicers. As for expensive parts, amazon exists. I have spare hotends with heaters and thermistors I got for $22 each

[@Rolohaun]

thanks for the comment The stock hotend can no way print at 600mm/s I know the hardware and motion is decent and it can move that fast but not print or cool a part at that speed. Not only does FLSUN include a outdate slicer on the USB stick but I was told by FLSUN that only Cura 4.13 would work with the 600mm/s profile. As you said modern slicers already have up to date profiles so there is not need to include or recommend Cura 4.13. FLSUN can easily update this. I am sure you can use clone volcano hotends with this printer but they should offer better priced replacement parts

[@robs_garage4790]

@@Rolohaun my stock one is running a 8 hour print right now, when it finishes I will take a video of it absolutely being capable of printing that fast on the stock hotend. It 100% is capable. And is it a clone hot end if it fits the v400s proprietary mounting? The one that definitely violates slice engineering's patents that no one ever talks about...

[@Rolohaun]

thanks! I appreciate it. Do you have a link for the spare hotend your using I am sure users would like to know places to buy@@robs_garage4790

[@robs_garage4790]

@@Rolohaun Made a new YT channel as this one already has content of a different genre. Cant share the links in the comments but the stock and CHC upgrade hotends are 29 usd on amazon right now.

[@Armored_Turtle-RK]

@@Rolohaun The video is on this channel..

[@ryanwest30]

I just hit 1,000 hours on my V400 and its been running great until the Thermistor finally died. Which is normal. Replaced and back to running perfectly. I did upgrade the spool holder to a bearing style.

[@belakulcsar]

This or bambu?

[@Chrissi33004]

it baffles my mind that were still here in 2024 testing thermal runaway protection after the anet A9 and ender 3 fiasco of the early days. Imagine being a 3D printer company in 2024 that doesn't even get the basics of the software part right, that has been solved for years.

[@tiborfulop3984]

Well its a good printer, the non stock klipper doing good work. The termal runaway protection settings can be changed back to vanilla klipper spec, like i did in the printer.cfg file. Beginner friendly? Maybe not so much, but as a step up from common first printers its an awesome machine. I can only recommend it. Big plus: the after sales support is amazing, they help you with everything.

[@Rolohaun]

From the users I have talked to support is garbage and FLSUN does not care at all. The fact that they could just release a new printer.cfg at the very least to remove the thermal issues but do not is poof they don't care

[@JohnStruemph]

Glad you did this review. As such I bought an SR instead. I fixed its Bowden issues and have a bearing’d horizontal spool holder on it to replace the horrid stock unit. It is now a fine printer even on Marlin (stock). It will get Klipper down the road after I build a laptop for that. I may do the V400 effector if I can do it cheap enough. Thanks for all you do and good luck on your job search. Same thing happened to me 3 years ago, luckily I was old enough to retire. Be well!

[@hameroffandroid]

I've been using one for months with 0 issue, just bought another. I use them mostly at slower speeds with hotter filaments, works great. I make long tall objects. I have the firmware updated to the newest flsun one and it works fine. A couple layer shifts but I think it was my settings those times. I use custom orcaslicer profiles

[@Rolohaun]

the hardware is fine, and it will work just make sure you do not leave it printing over night or anything

[@jarexxsuvexx8212]

🤦🏾‍♂️FLsun competitor/affiliates posting videos recommending against purchasing their products. Poor consumers are at the mercy of these dishonest brands.

[@Rolohaun]

at least there is a way to fix this by users putting on the proper firmware. I can be a good printer if people know how to do the work

[@arnovereecken2261]

i have had my v400 for about a year now, never had a single issue with it. What exactly would change if i do go to vanilla klipper? i was thinking about it a while ago but then i thought “if it aint broke dont fix it” but then again im not a 3d printer tech guy

[@Rolohaun]

ya if you don't want to mess with the firmware just remove the verify heater part in the printer.cfg like I show in the video

[@arnovereecken2261]

@@Rolohaun well yeah but ur not the first one to say that going to vanilla klipper is better, i just don’t exactly know what would improve? If the benefits are actually worth it i will definitely do the change but i just simply dont have the knowledge

[@Rolohaun]

@@arnovereecken2261 i have heard the flsun version fakes delta calibration and speed but I have not tested

[@Texastoo2]

Very strange that this command creates a runaway. The documentation states: The verify_heater extruder command in Klipper is used to check whether the extruder (hotend) is heating up at the expected rate during the printing process. It monitors the temperature increase and ensures it meets the desired rate. If the extruder heats too slowly, you’ll receive an error message. You can adjust parameters like heating_gain and check_gain_time in your configuration to fine-tune this behavior12. If you encounter the “Heater extruder not heating at expected rate” error, consider modifying these settings to improve the heating performance3. Keep in mind that this feature helps maintain consistent print quality and prevent issues like warping.

[@Rolohaun]

It allows a higher differential between the heater and actual temp, if the thermistor comes loose and the temp is within 20 degrees klipper is allowed to keep powering the heater. It's not good and it's also not needed removing it is recommended so it uses the klipper default which is 5 I believe

[@Texastoo2]

@@Rolohaun Thanks for the information. I deleted the line from mine today after I watched the video.

[@MisterDeets]

Good on ya for making this correction and exposing this issue.

[@theVariedLife]

Wow. That thermal runaway and questionable klipper and old slicer is a problem. I was hyped about the new S1 that is coming out but now I'm beginning to be a little worried. I had my plans set to buy the S1 but now, hmmm.... what printer do you recommend for a person with $1,750 budget? thanks for the video

[@Rolohaun]

it's hard to say, you can wait for some S1 reviews to come out, maybe it will surprise us, but I have 1200 plus hours on my Bambu X1 and it was one of my best purchases

[@theVariedLife]

The Bambu is X1C my other choice. I really want to like the FLSUN S1 like improved speed and all the other bells and whistles but apparently they are not as good as advertised. Makes me wonder if they got the software side of their business fixed. It comes down to a lot of variables but mostly happy customers who get good prints. Thanks for the video. @@Rolohaun

[@windmill10]

Same here ☹

[@ralphg3315]

Buy the bamboo Labs the best purchase I ever made I will never purchase nothing from this company ever again buyer beware purchase at your own risk

[@theVariedLife]

@@ralphg3315 Yea the Bambu is high on the list but I hope they come out with a bigger version of the X1C with say a 300 square build area. BTW what did you find so bad about FLSUN? I like to make informed decisions and value personal experiences.

[@GrumpiestKitten]

Thanks a bunch for making this video highlighting the faults! Wanted to upgrade from my old Anycubic i3 to one of these because I think deltas look really cool. Will instead go for the bambu p1p now because I don't feel like fixing out of the box software on a printer that isn't particularly cheap.

[@micheldaoust7345]

Congrad for doing such in deep review. Really appreciate the hard work.

[@jeremybodell3619]

Rolohaun did I hear you say before that you’re in Edmonton? I’m in St. Albert and I have a T1 on pre order if it ever actually arrives I would be willing to let you unbox and review it.

[@Rolohaun]

That would be neat! I don't want to unbox it but I would try it out for a few days after you are able to use it a bit. I heard they are delayed?

[@jeremybodell3619]

@@Rolohaun I’ll let you know when it gets here.

[@jeremybodell3619]

@@Rolohaunyeah they are delayed. Flsun says they are supposed to ship from china to Canada this week but won’t leave the Canadian warehouse till may 20th. Hopefully there aren’t anymore delays.

[@Rolohaun]

cool feel free to DM me on discord or message me here@@jeremybodell3619

[@joe_duck]

Damn shame they don’t take ownership of their products

[@alexanderscholz8855]

HAHAHAHAHAH that remind me to the good old days!!! There was, if i remember Anet and Creality did this with Marlin. They canceled Thermal Protection out of Marlin. Someone did his job not right.

[@comradef1916]

I cannot state how much I'm happy to finally see an honest review for the v400, me and the other members of the Open Flsun discord have been trying since the release of the v1.4 firmware in September to get somebody to acknowledge any of these issues publicly - only for Flsun representative on their official discord to worsen the situation through inaction, and intentional refusal to listen to the community in the event of conflicts or issues. The runaway via loose thermistor issue you mention is a lot more likely than you'd originally think, since Flsun has a history of using the cheapest, lowest-quality thermistors on the market; a glass bead shoddily placed inside an open-ended metal tube, secured inside entirely with very soft thermal putty. I have unintentionally pulled this glass bead through the soft putty and out of the tube on my QQS during hotend maintenance.

[@Rolohaun]

thank you, glad I can help raise awareness

[@chlpdf]

why would they do all that work to make a bad os when they could just install vanilla klipper?

[@Rolohaun]

I really have no idea, FLSUN doesn't care to fix it

[@woodcat7180]

Probably for same reason as Creality, Qidi or Flashforge.

[@daliasprints9798]

You could ask the same question of every vendor of Android phones...

[@nl-rf7bu]

Are you still planning to do a delta build the rolo your own community?

[@Rolohaun]

Yes a mini and a 250 ish size

[@johngelnaw1243]

What's the wattage on the heater, and what temperature did it actually reach? What are the changed settings on thermal runaway?

[@Rolohaun]

volcano hotend is 40 watts, I shut down mine after it was well over 300 with my inaccurate IR Probe and the modification allows the heater to get over 500 for long enough to burn PLA which can result in a fire. You can see the modification under verify heater line in the config. FLSUN also modified Klipper to report fake speeds and other things I am told.

[@jdlem]

delate the line? is it the whole thing with the 500 and the line bellow it or just whats on [ ]

[@Rolohaun]

all 3 lines

[@jdlem]

I was confused new at printing 😅 thanks a lot.

[@8bits955]

i have way too many spare boards and thermistors around could just slap them on and install normal klipper 😅

[@iangreenhoe6611]

I wonder if the thermal runaway issue was deliberately put in by the person who left.

[@Rolohaun]

Who knows, luckily a easy fix

[@virtualpirate-eo9yb]

Any chance you would share the orca profile you fine tuned? I am looking to switch as well.

[@Rolohaun]

I recommend the v400 Orca profile default, it works great and included with Orca

[@abitnutz6747]

I'm trying the Klipper install but after the install. Klipper won't start. Is says: mcu 'mcu': Unable to connect. Do I have to flash the firmware on the mcu before Klipper will start on the screen?

[@Rolohaun]

yes you will need to flash the mainboard for the v400 also. as long as your following the guide you should be good

[@abitnutz6747]

@@Rolohaun But shouldn't Klipper start on the screen? It fails to connect at all...the guide implies that the screen should work even if the MCU is not flashed.

[@WORLD_OF_M4V3R1CK]

​@@abitnutz6747did you ever figure this out? Really don't want to brick my speeder pad.

[@daganael]

can you share your orca setup for the v400 ?

[@Rolohaun]

I don't have it anymore unfortuantly

[@JakobDam]

Thanks for this! The hardware indeed looks pretty good. But with the software being so lacking, it's too much of a tinker printer for 2024.

[@abitnutz6747]

my menu make menu doesn't come up as shown in the guide. [*] Enable extra low-level configuration options Micro-controller Architecture (Atmega AVR) ---> Processor model (atmega2560) ---> Processor speed (16Mhz) ---> Communication interface (UART0) ---> (250000) Baud rate for serial port () GPIO pins to set at micro-controller startup (NEW)

[@Rolohaun]

You need to change your processor first and it will change the options

[@abitnutz6747]

@@Rolohaun well, I didn't realize that you could select the processor and there was a menu under it. It looked like only the the ones in parens could be selected. I'll try it.

[@burmy1552]

I have one. Everything he said is right. Plus the thermistors go out too often. Wouldn't buy it again.

[@Rolohaun]

Thats a shame, hopefully flsun can improve

[@JudithWagner-m3h]

The model I was going buy says it comes with Klipper. Are you saying it doesn't? Oh No, I respect your honesty! OMG I just went through a nightmare with Creality. Pure Garbage! But the FLSUN? Nooo please do not make it sooo. I am so bummed.

[@Rolohaun]

it comes with Klipper just a hacked up version

[@guillermiot]

you have the orca profile to share? thanks

[@Rolohaun]

I just used the default orca profile

[@jstro-hobbytech]

it's around 5 and change in canada on amazon now. i've never owned a delta so i didnt bother with it.

[@sirrodneyffing1]

Thanks. You can never know but you may actually be saving someone's life here. Looks like a pathetic effort to lock users into their ecosystem.

[@addads6978]

Thank you!

[@kanrogcreations]

This could have been such a good printer

[@Rolohaun]

it's still good with some effort

[@ArnoZwaag]

Clickbate title FTW right. It actually is a really proper machine. And FLSun have, like most other manufacturers, not yet really understood the concept of open source and knowledge sharing. Yet, some changes, as you say less than an hour work, and it's all nice and dandy. So, that would be the proper title of this video. Changes to make right after receiving your V400.

[@Rolohaun]

there is a potential of fire here and FLSUN could care less. Easy fix to just listen to the community and remedy the firmware of the printer out of the box. FLSUN doesn't even know what some of the changed do that they made

[@3dexperiments]

You're missing the point. In 2024, thermal runaway should not be an issue. It's absurd to expect the end user to have to solve such a basic and potentially disastrous flaw. And regarding open source, there's nothing to understand by FLSun. All they had to do was implement absolute standard Klipper. They chose to make the mods and did so incompetently.

[@ArnoZwaag]

@@Rolohaun one can also argue Klipper should not allow disabling thermal runaway protection that easily. I can imagine the ability to disable it for testing purposes, but a need to acknowledge that risk at every reboot. Nevertheless the title of the video is clickbait and I do think you would have done better with providing an informational video over a rant.

[@Rolohaun]

@@ArnoZwaag thanks for your opinion

[@caramelzappa]

@@ArnoZwaag It's open source software, by its very nature you cannot stop companies using it from modifying it.

[@madbotanist3605]

Nice beard dude, good info too

[@moyu1616]

This is unnaceptable, very dissapointed of Flsun refusing to revert back such an important safety measure.

[@Rolohaun]

such and easy fix and the fact they seem to not even know why the modification is there

[@SPACE_TRAVELLER_01]

​@@RolohaunTHANK YOU VERY MUCH for the fire warning. I appreciate It very much 🙏

[@JudithWagner-m3h]

Oh so we can remove the software they have installed and install the original FLSUN Klipper software? Fake Delta Calibration? How difficult is it to install the right software? Thank you so much for being honest. You do not know how much that means! You sound so disappointed. As am I, I was just about to buy this machine...I don't understand what people are doing these days. How difficult is reinstalling the software? And it does not print at 600mms? How fast can it go?

[@Rolohaun]

there is a guide in the description to install "Normal" Klipper on the speederpad. If you do not want to do that you can at least remove the section in the printer.cfg that I point out in the video. For speed it depends on material and the cooling you need. 300mm/s is probably the limit

[@ut5ush]

Hello from Ukraine