S2E12. no fats/no fems?

[@AjaeUpHere]

To all of my big & tall feminine men, like myself, carrying purses, wearing makeup, painting/doing their nails, wearing wigs/weave/extensions, wearing crop tops/dresses/tight clothing/heels, I love you so much. 💜 Please don’t hide or change who you are for anyone. Not everyone will appreciate or “understand” your beauty but don’t you doubt its [your beauty’s] presence because you are beautiful and worthy of love. 💜

[@JustJutt0610]

I love this comment....this interview...sheesh

[@musicandtheater7681]

I like your comment cause it seems like it open minded

[@darianagnew6524]

❤️❤️❤️❤️

[@chrisbabess]

Thank you so much❤️❤️ and this interview…. The bigger man pissed me off the entire time

[@donovan5543]

Thank You💕That means a lot I was about to comment the same thing I’m dam near 6’6

[@jayhunter37]

im so glad as a fat/feminine purse wearing ass man, ive learned to build my confidence and not think the way this community does, cause the way they try to play us big boys especially the black & feminine ones like me, i would’ve taken my own life a LONG time ago. The LGBT+ just misdirect their trauma into others instead of just BEING‼️You can STILL get through in this world just like any other btch can. YOU MATTER TOO SIS 💕💅🏾

[@armahfrancisoko5142]

When Obio said, I'm not laughing with you!! And truly, we weren't laughing with him!

[@zaadrobinson182]

He think we on his side. Nah many masc gays love fem dudes...just go to prison .

[@Calm_B4_Storm]

I appreciated this conversation. The concept of “preferences” comes up a lot and yes, EVERYONE has them. A point of critical thought that people seem to avoid is how they arrived at their preferences to begin with. Whether we wanna accept it or not, preferences are almost always informed by socially dominant traits that put (already) marginalized communities at a disadvantage. The whole “no fats no fems” thing is a disservice to the community. Treating fat and feminine queer men as less than is the antithesis of what our community is supposed to represent. I can’t imagine shunning a group of people for being fat and/or feminine while also co-opting their spaces and aesthetics that they’ve carved out for themselves.

[@humbled92_Mister]

The gag is that alot of the people fighting for gay rights are fat and/or fem. They are the ones that cannot blend in society and are fighting the most for inclusivity and safe spaces.

[@Calm_B4_Storm]

@@humbled92_Mister Exactly. Meanwhile, the ones shouting “no fats no fems” don’t contribute much of anything and ride the wave of those doing the labor of advocating for queer & trans rights!

[@rellenoz]

Maybe it just doesn't turn these guys on. I think it's that simple

[@jahmad5791]

@@rellenoz I agree… Because it would be an extreme disservice to date or interact with someone who isn’t interested in you because you’re bigger or fem.

[@mauhuff]

@@rellenoz all of our preferences ( yes even sexual) are mostly a result of conditioning. No one is asking us to change what we like but opening our minds may allow us to see the beauty in others as well. Also genuine attraction can sometimes transcend preference barriers. The last dude I fell for is the opposite of what I’d typically “like”.

[@KahariKyles]

His experience is a singular journey of his romantic and social interactions and not a direct reflection of the totality of gay and queer men within the community that are considered plus sized. I will say that he, as a guest made a few potentially problematic comments that weren’t used as a teachable moment but surely based in his preferential attractions. I would challenge you to doing a follow up series with another guest who is a bit more educated. This topic is far more illustrious than we know; it casts a dark shade on the other side of the dating experience for some. I would love to hear someone touch on how fatness within our culture is shamed and femmeophobia is rooted heavily within Black culture as it relates to gay identity and physicality.

[@kriskanei7369]

I love that statement “potentially problematic” because as much as I might disagree with his opinions and preferences, I did enjoy having someone who isn’t completely put together verbally. He shed a light on those that feel this way and allows for us to, like you said, have a follow up conversation. His “potentially problematic” explanation was valuable to my understanding of the topic at hand! Great post Kahari! 💕

[@albertowilliams959]

Ppl need to stop using sexual “preferences” as the ONLY reason to so much as interract or even LOOK AT someone! Goddamn i hate gay men

[@jinmushui1soul]

Not every fat black person with an audience is going to be an activist, and we shouldn't expect them to be. I agree with many that there was a mismatch between the guest and topic. Not that his opinion isn't "valid" but he does only seem comfortable and equipped to seek from his own experience; no larger structural analysis. Would be better to get someone who thinks about this a more often/critically.

[@JamalTateIsTheGreatest]

I loved this conversation and I’m noticing more and more that you really make people feel comfortable and that is a gift. My type has changed since I was younger so I get trying to weed people out cause you know what you like. Now I just want someone I find attractive inside and out which could mean different things in different spaces. Love this space that has been created!

[@grayscar05]

I don't really like the no fats/no fems saying, instead it's more appropriate to say i prefer fit/masculine men. But what's interesting to me is that most of my fem friends strongly prefer and praise more masculine men. Most of my fat friends strongly prefer and praise more fit men. Most gay men are very visual and like men who act like men ... makes sense. Needless to say there's a lot of self-hatred in the gay community but that's a whole other video.

[@cordellboss]

I think it'd be a great idea to have a roundtable of gays from different sectors of the community come together for a discussion on self hatred. I'd also like to see this done for the different type of sexualities out there.

[@dabigd1860]

@Jss Pss i got vilified and banned from Nico's Aesthetics KZbin channel for saying that I prefer masculine men. It's just what i am attracted to and I have been that way ever since I was a teenager and didn't even know how to say i was g4y. But i am vilified for it by today's modern day g4y community. I really don't understand why.

[@dalecrosby4479]

People only call it self hate when a fat person doesn't want another fat person, but when a skinny person doesn't want another skinny person that's ok.

[@humbled92_Mister]

@@dabigd1860 did you use the word "masculine"? Nico is not gonn just block someone for saying they only like masculine guys. I am sure you said something more or in other words.

[@dabigd1860]

@2Blessed2BStressed I swear to you i didn't. And i didn't say anything that i thought was offensive or in anyway personal against him. I think he just didn't agree with me, or didn't like what i said regarding MY PERSONAL preferences. Unfortunate, because WE ALL need a place and a community to feel apart of: not just solely "FAT-FEMS" need support camaraderie understanding and acceptance. I have always said that sometimes the community the preaches tolerance can be the most intolerant of others and their viewpoints

[@xamanbro826]

The guest was very honest. There are many bigger guys who don’t like other bigger guys, but get offended if a fitter guy doesn’t find them attractive. Just like there are fem guys who don’t like other fem guys-this is a common paradox, as many fem guys are looking to be paired with a masculine guy. The prejudice often comes from the person who gets offended in these cases. If someone says “no fats/fem/Blacks” etc, then move on. No need to be offended by someone who isn’t looking for you. Have self confidence and find someone who do likes you. A hook up is a hookup. People have a specific interest when they are looking for sex.

[@dabigd1860]

@Xav Rose AGREED!!! My Lord, what ever happened to just a plain ol man who likes men? Seems like we only have these very flamboyant extremes to choose from nowadays. Like you just can't find a regular average guy any more. It's almost like there is no more space for just a plain ol gay man.

[@Joshua-re3xw]

Exactly!!!! Perfectly said 👌👌👌

[@Joshua-re3xw]

@@dabigd1860 people have always had preferences! Just go with the person that finds you attractive

[@PerryPerfectPerson]

Thicker guys don’t sit around and post it on their profiles though. Bigger men get attacked from profiles constantly. Making them feel less than. The only thing iv ever seen in bios is (no fat, fem, black only, white only) i ain’t ever seen no tall men. No short men. No Indian men. No Europeans. No Africans. No Latinos. I just haven’t seen it. But iv seen no fat, no fem, no black, no white. More times than I can count and that is an issue.

[@PerryPerfectPerson]

@@dabigd1860 don’t say regular. Heteronormative men is what you are looking for.

[@tytre757]

What really gets me about some of these comments is that folks don’t understand the difference between self esteem and access. Fat folks and femme folks and folks who intersect at these identities are rarely seen as attractive and are def ostracized and erased from community. Desirability and attractiveness def plays a part in how folks navigate these apps and their relationships (let’s be real even friendships) and that’s a problem. If you are someone who benefits from being thin or benefits from being more masculine of center you are less likely to experience these things and therefore don’t understand how these things show up. It’s not about how sad I am that I’m not wanted, or that my self esteem isn’t there- it’s about blatantly being seen as undesirable and less than compared to your counterparts and how that then hinders you from access to intimacy and sex and relationships. Also! The fact the as a community of black queer folks we think it’s fine to dismiss folks based on body type and that shit plays into anti-fat,anti-queer, and white beauty standards and that shit is tired. Also.. This guest… A choice. The range don’t seem to be there..

[@power2g]

Facts. Black fat guys have limited access to men in general. They love our friendship but a lot of times not to date or have sex with unless done in secret. I have way more women who wants to date me that care less about my size but I have yet to find the same in non fat men (except those who have a fetish for big guys). Obio is very attractive and I would consider him my type but men I meet similar to him reject me strictly because of my size. But now I have another "NO" characteristic in the gay community and that is my age. Being fat, older and gay is a very lonely place.

[@mauhuff]

I really just think it’s all about finding your right people and becoming your best self so when we do meet the right guy we’re ready for it. Superficiality and desirability politics definitely don’t just hinder Black gay men. I know plenty of straight (and queer) people who may be considered desirable yet are still lonely or constantly in troubling dating/relationship situations. I know we have a smaller dating pool but the reality is still true.

[@wacawaka1802]

“People don’t want to date unhealthy people and that’s a problem.”

[@tytre757]

@@wacawaka1802 Sure, jan.

[@awesomelife3710]

I agree with what you wrote. That being said, one of the biggest guys I’ve ever seen told me, “I am the Michelle Pfeiffer of the Bear Set.” (She was a Supermodel). No kidding: he had an incredibly handsome, fit, dancer of a boyfriend who liked him exactly as he was. So there really appears to be someone for everyone.

[@wally6914]

The Keke Palmer insert had me cracking up. You funny for that 🤣

[@johnjacob80]

Frfr

[@yqw1mfk]

😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@sebastianalexander1629]

preferences are important and everyone has them, but there is a fine line between preference and discrimination, that is not really addressed in conversations like these.

[@ccosby3712]

Love his honesty, but... Just but...

[@Devndj16]

A lot of folk seem to be really sensitive about the guest i didn’t find him problematic he’s speaking from his perspective and the things he’s experienced. There are so many walks of life and attraction is so nuanced people are going to like what they like. So him saying he’s not attracted to large feminine men isn’t an insult. It’s just something he’s not attracted to. I think we get use of language mixed up with discrimination. It’s all about tact like he said. And I’ll speak for my self as bisexual but if i want a man, i want a masculine man 85% and this changes with what I’m looking for at the time. This conversation goes much deeper. You can find someone attractive and your mannerisms and small things , like speech pattern, how they react to things in life all play a part in this conversation. I think we forget that physicality is much more than muscles. I’ve had feminine men, where i liked there personality but my attraction changed due to the femininity in the way they dressed, interact with other in public etc. it may sound shallow but what people like is in part based on the environment they grew up in etc. I’ve also been masc-fished which is a whole other conversation. Ithink where the conversation dropped the ball was just have these two perspectives when there are honestly tons of them.

[@vizualbandit5331]

We need a pt 2 with a fem guy because I think many understand that there are levels to it. I'm noticing certain guys don't mind fem if they can at least butch it up in the daytime or as long as they don't wear make up and nails, or a fem guy who isn't in ballroom, or as long as they play the "bottom/submissive role"......ect. there's all these conditions that alot of us tend to have.

[@AnokFero2007]

I completely agree! I wish I could be a guest on here. I have been dealing with this FEM issue for 25 years now unfortunately! SMH

[@AchillesandArtemis]

I agree with the point that when someone declares their preferences, I can know not to talk to them if I'm not it. And I also agree that it could be tasteless to declare that X or Y are not your type. Maybe forming it in a opposite and positive way is the better way to go. For example: instead of "No fats" or "No fems", just say what you ARE into. Realizing that I'm not everyone's type also helped me realize that there is nothing wrong with me and people just prefer different things. NOBODY is going to be EVERYBODY'S type.

[@TheAlfredPlatform]

Why are we still shaming other LGBTQ+ people for expressing themselves?? Low key, it's the gworls with the makeup and purses that often stand up and help push our community forward.

[@albertowilliams959]

^THIS!! All this!!! Never do i see these cis “men” doing anything except colonizing spaces when its time to celebrate and pushing our TRUE heroes out!!

[@TheAlfredPlatform]

@@albertowilliams959 🙌🏾🙌🏾

[@glamslamcam]

This was a great discussion. I used to be someone who was offended by that term being that I was someone who was not fem but thick but when I gave it some thought one day, I realized that people have the right to like and want what they want & I should be able to do the same thing. You should be able to express what you want without it being a problem. The only reason why it would be a problem is because the person reading it was probably attracted to that person and because that person may fall into one or both of those categories, they got their feelings hurt. That’s what happens when it comes to meeting people for dating or hooking up. As long as the person expressing what he wants isn’t rude with it, then i don’t see a problem. Again great conversation.

[@berealkiiid]

These episodes only get better and better. this was equally funny, educational and uplifting.

[@venusdoom90]

Ugh ... this! I can relate to this so much on so many levels. I'm slim and athletic and I ALWAYS get frowned upon when putting across that I'm pretty much exclusively into bigger guys. I don't know why people have such an issue with it honestly, it's so annoying and infuriating to the point that sometimes I don't really want to talk about sexual stuff with anyone. I have always been into bigger guys - why? - I don't know why but I just find them more attractive, they have this set of proportions that are able to nurture my internal needs on so many levels, not only on primal-animalistic carnal level.

[@SainteDenali]

This should’ve been a panel discussion. Very interesting.

[@willienixon6847]

Maybe, but they would need the right chemistry. I would want to hear their points, versus people talking over each other.

[@amareb529]

This was conversation was needed and very eye opening. I never identified as a skinny person or a fat person. My body type has always been slim thick. But to some people I’m too skinny and to others I’m not big enough. It’s always left feeling like I’m just not desirable to anybody. Gay dating apps have only made my self esteem deduct 10 points. Which is why it’s extremely important to love the skin your in before attempting to date or having sexual interactions with anyone. Your aura and energy will tell someone everything they need to know before getting into bed with you so there is a lot of truth to that.

[@dabigd1860]

@Amare B bro, stay off the dating app, social media and just get out there and be visible. The internet and those apps will destroy your soul. I don't fool with them. I go out, work out, etc and if in the course of my travels and leisure i meet someone, then great. But i am not advertising myself or chasing anyone on those apps or on social media.

[@pppexplorer]

In recent years, I am actually seeing less and less of "no fats, no fems" on people's dating profiles. But I live in Canada. That's a great development! What has been pleasantly surprising is I am seeing masculine guys asking for "Trans, CD, etc." Years ago, that was very rare. It seems people are growing and becoming more open-minded sexually.

[@albertowilliams959]

Well that’s because ur not in the USA, where progression is capitalized on

[@iiakaj]

The way I’d love to sit with Obio to have these conversations I’m always so INVESTED in these they are my serotonin !!

[@thoughtsandwords3029]

Chub here! 6'3...371. I love this topic. It's always interesting to see what people have to say about no fats/no fems. Preference...in the alphabet community...let's talk about it...briefly. I agree, there is nothing wrong with having a preference; as long as that preference is not rooted in the oppression of others. The language around preference, is so important, and is not discussed enough. Saying "no fats/no fems" is negative in view. It's negative because the belief that surrounds that particular phrasing, is born from belief that those two demographics, are dirty, embarrassing, not representative of what gay society defines as beauty, so therefore it is undesirable. If we change the language around preference, preference wouldn't be demonized as much as it is. Explain what it is you are attracted to(and be able to offer the same thing...another topic) versus stating what you don't like or find attractive. One of the points the guest glazed over was, that some people do see fat people as lazy, unclean, slow and unattractive, etc. That's not true for the majority of fat people. There are "fit" people who fit right into the aforementioned categories. It's okay to like what you like. Just don't use negative language about what it is you don't like. Some guys in the community love to fetishize us fat guys. I'm not a fan of that, and it's kink for some guys(gainers, feedings). Now just as many gay guys that say they don't like that, I've never had a problem getting laid. The guys love us for closed door sex; just not a public relationship or display of affection. I've been fortunate to have 2 long term public relationships(5 and 4 years), with "fit" guys who loved me well! I believe personality, energy, ora, are more important than what someone's looks are. It's a combination of it all. I can go on and on...lol...so I'm going to end it here.

[@humbled92_Mister]

Good insight!

[@ImPricelessHunnie]

everything to what you just said... this was the commentary I was hoping to hear more about that yes was glazed right over.✨

[@wacawaka1802]

Women are oppressed and gay men are oppressors.

[@GrandPrizeFitnesAJAY]

I love that he was honest about not wanting to be with a fat fem guy either. I'm sure some people will say it's a contradiction. I guess Black gay men just have no love for fat and fem...even if you're fat and fem. Dang.

[@ocomogosiay]

4:31 mark... Masc/ Fem to me are subject based on culture, upbringing, what we are exposed, there is no universal standard. It's all about perception, and reception to me. I think I'm masculine TOO ME... but I'm aware that other's may not see me the same. I've learned that ONLY I can define WHAT MY masculine looks like for ME and accept how individuals identify , in the same way we accept how people identify in their gender.

[@adrianlopez8058]

Yup!! And I notice body type is different from gay to straight as well as north vs south I show my mother a straight woman men that gays find attractive and she doesn’t understand it she thinks they look weak and scrawny. Women tend to like bigger protective men.

[@BimRen246]

I just came from watching a piece on Sexual Racism to this. I think we need more discussion generally asking why we have these preferences and if it is a preference or a serious bias. We should individually ask ourselves why and where our biases/preferences come from. I laughed and I am happy to see Obio from 4:50 - 5:30 kept saying no. Great conversation as always.

[@jdg7515]

I also wonder how much porn plays a role in these preferences. And I think many people would open up their "preferences" if they were free of judgment.

[@BimRen246]

@@jdg7515 I had the same thoughts. Terms and categories are great but it can feel like hook-up apps and porn can pigeon hold us to narrow scripts of sexual & gender identity and expectations in sexual behaviour. I am learning more and more not to identify with LGBTQ+ terms based on heteronormative orientations.

[@jermainejennings1514]

What is the name of the piece?

[@dabigd1860]

@BimRen So true. I think that for a community that promotes a "rainbow" of colors as it's symbol 🏳️‍🌈 S8xual Racism is more of an issue than the "no fats/no fems" thing. I live in Dallas Texas and experience a lot of s8xual racism from the community that i thought was supposed to be so welcoming and without prejudice. NOTHING COULD BE FURTHER FROM THE TRUTH. The larger white AND HISPANIC g4y community here is VERY PREJUDICED TOWARD BLACK MEN of any body type, complexion, educational or economic level.

[@BimRen246]

@@jermainejennings1514 How Sexual Racism Affects Online Dating - Beyond the Scenes | The Daily Show and Sexual Racism in the LGBT+ Community? | Alex Leon

[@tjkane5465]

Thanks for this. I have been called a chubby chaser. I like bigger men. This was a great discussion. What about ageism as a topic. On the site Bigger City, often a big young men will reach out to me, but I really don't wanna talk with anyone in their early 20's. How do you let someone go without hurting their feelings?

[@jarias3751]

There is nothing wrong with having a preference. I prefer taller, fitter men, but that doesn’t mean imma knock down a guy bc he doesn’t check a certain box on my list. From what I’ve seen and experienced, there is a lot of femphobia and fat phobia in the LGBTQIA+ community. I do see that femininity is more acceptable within white men and even non-black men of color. On the other hand, Black men are not allowed to be feminine. At first, it was a sad time to be in this intersection because your dating life is practically non-existent. I believe the my moment of clarity came when I started to seek internal validation instead of external validation; love myself from the inside out. When the confidence was lit, baby, the boys started to flock. My message to all the fem gay men: “Don’t change who you are, be you because someone out there is going to love you for you”

[@humbled92_Mister]

Preach

[@grayscar05]

Black gay men are definitely allowed to be feminine. Walk into any black gay bar or party ... usually at least half the room is feminine men by dress and/or demeanor. Also white gay men are equally femphobic ... Obio interviewed a white gay guy about it recently this year. The problem is black fem men want to be viewed as highly desirable and that's just not gonna happen. Either they gotta conform to a more masculine energy or deal with the consequences of living as a fem man.

[@jarias3751]

@@grayscar05 I don’t think anyone has to conform or assimilate. As I said it’s all about respect. Society has always seen Black men with only being able to express masculinity and not femininity.

[@grayscar05]

@@jarias3751 Billy Porter, RuPaul, Sylvester, EJ Johnson, and others are/were POPULAR out and proud feminine black gay men. I see what you trying to say but feminine men have never and never will be on the top of the food chain in the gay community ... period .... so 2 choices: conform or remain at the bottom. They are highly respected for entertainment and talent, but very little outside that.

[@dabigd1860]

@Jss Pss Never forget that the MAINSTREAM MEDIA and entertainment industry always has an agenda. So of course the flaming effeminate black man is being supported by them. The thug, gangster, rapper type is also continuously advanced. Rarely is there a sensible, respectable and realistic medium for black men in terms of image or type. We have to deal with being black men in society at large, irrespective of our s8xual orientation, and then we have to deal with the reality of being a black man even within the g4y community. There is racism and prejudice there alsi

[@YHoll]

Wasn’t a big fan of the guest….. but they are entitled to their opinions.

[@MoneybagJ03]

Are you fat or fem? 😂

[@KahariKyles]

Exactly.

[@minkdee647]

Right

[@taodevane9139]

Comversations like this have been going on for years. I remember going to a same gender loving adult fun party in the 90's and seeing a sign that said "No Fats, No Fems and No Grandads" LOL SO when I went in, I was seeing faux masculine dudes standing around. LOL A year later I went to the same party. This time no sign and inside were those types that were shunned the year before. Needless to say, the event was very festive.

[@AnokFero2007]

I remember hearing about those signs & parties in the 90’s as well…SMH!

[@holyheathen435]

"faux masculine" is just the word, lots of people living with repressed femininity, that sht is exhausting it's like trying to look like you have a flat tummy by holding in your belly

[@BlueYaweh]

A lot of the disparaging and discriminating language we see on gay dating apps is common on headless and/or catfishing profiles. Most men who cite "no fats/fems" know that kind of language is hurtful and hence say it anonymously. Gay dating apps are another conversation in and of itself but I find the anonymity and DL opportunities these type of spaces provide create an imbalance in people's attitudinal presentation - where the most mean spirited or immature behaviors can run rampant because there's no accountability or little social pressure to be polite or connect. Of course some guys can be ass holes in person! Regardless, there's always someone for everyone. I would hope gay men and boys in their formative years of finding themselves in this community would pursue quality connections in more curated and healthy spaces rather than starting on the popular gay dating platforms. Starting there may lead one to believe they are undesirable when it's simply not the case.

[@owtsideperspective3588]

The standards are funny because they see as what they want you to be. When I was younger.. 5'7, 160 lbs they wanted me to be fem and dainty and it was acceptable..... in my 30s and about 70lbs heavier (mostly muscle).they look at me and see "masculine" so I'm forced into these walls and boxes

[@roberth2627]

What a great conversation with Jari..loved the nuance that he brings ..along with you Obio 's insightful questions & probing....Lots of men in my family were husky like Jari & sexy...so if many of us grew up with men like that..I can see why some us would be attracted. I hold heartily agree it's about the energy & heart that a man bring that( Aura ) that tells a lots about a person...I thought you two had great chemistry..Thank You Both...!!

[@darianagnew6524]

I honestly don’t ever need to have a conversation about my preferences. Either I’m attracted to you, or I’m not. My type isn’t confined to a physical archetype. It’s more about aura

[@gudboi2519]

Same here

[@akinyeleakinruntan3496]

When he said "Never"...I hollered lol

[@viccrawford7791]

Thanks. Ive been waiting on this one.

[@tatsf]

Thank you for this conversation cuz I think it needs to be had publicly a lot more than it does. I like your sentiment right near the end of "I like kind men". Overall, that feels like a good response to this topic. For me there are two different issues that often get blended together when folks comment on this topic - socio-political appreciation and acceptance of all different types, sizes, ages, classes, races, etc. for friends and community members. Then there's who are folks sexually attracted to. The two can't be completely conflated in my opinion even though I understand that there are underlying reasons why we might be attracted to who we are. That's a psycho-social conversation, not an "I need to get off right now" conversation. But to examine it (presumable when one is not trying to get off LOL) is probably a great idea. Thank again, Obio, for important discussions!

[@Smoothoperator89]

Self Love, Self Respect, Personal Growth & Personal Self Reflection is Extremely Important! Once you Have Manifested those Qualities you will Learn to Accept & Not be so Judgemental of others. GOD Bless Everyone and I Hope Us as a Gay Community need to be more United and Understanding because WE can be our Worst Enemy.

[@CdotC]

I say this all the time. I may typically not find someone attractive if I see a picture on an app but I can fancy the shit out of the same person if I had a face to face interaction with them

[@Edwards9011]

Love this convo; and I definitely agree with everyone having their own preferences. However, I do believe that our social conditioning informs our preferences and it functions as a bias towards things that more closely resemble what we’ve been conditioned is “attractive”. Black gay men are definitely more susceptible to this, with the stereotypes that pervade throughout society about us.

[@tyjohnson6536]

Ok. Shoutout to Obie for two key moments: 1) "I'm not laughing with you." This was important because it showed willingness to understand the exact nature of that put down and ultimately that it stemmed from how the guest viewed himself. Moreover, what he has internalized from others about what looks good. 2) "Never." Okkkkk! Although the guest was making an example it is ultimately how we view ourselves that matters and no one can make us view ourselves in a way that we do not believe is true to us. It's giving.....Subscribe 😊

[@SayWhatttNathanH1]

what a great episode. i'm still short, black, and fat. i'll talk to my therapist!

[@tfh5575]

i would post my weight in my a4a profile and i would constantly get messages asking if i was really 300 lbs because they were attracted to my body but couldn’t imagine that number being attractive to them. it’s like how when it was revealed that meg the stallion weighs over 200 lbs and people just couldn’t accept the number

[@Michael-ww4wl]

The reason why i loved this episode is because there was genuine disagreement between obio and the other guy. I think we need more episodes like these that show the reality and not just the ideals.

[@LifeOnCoach]

13:14 😲 Not too much on the Bingo community. BINGO! Bingo has been called. 🤣💙✌🏾

[@mrhvssp13]

Growing up in cali it’s all about the body and face is everything. I’m a bigger thicker guy, and i like all sizes but love bigger thicker guys. Growing up and still to this day i don’t feel beautiful or attractive due to my size. I’ve had a lot of interaction with the ppl I’ve like and when i tell them like them they don’t like me back but in the same breath they say your a great guy very intuitive smart etc. I have a great personality and everything and they can’t see pass the outside. I don’t wanna date anymore or meet anyone until this weight is loss.

[@leehines1260]

💙

[@melvinhhcp3615]

I feel you!

[@Tajographist]

It's funny, when i was a real skinny teen, I actually liked bigger guys. I didn't care about the body fat composition. I only cared about proportions. Everything had to match. So other skinny dude were pissed when I chose thicker men over them. The same with woman. The world genuinely associated looking ugly with weight. I just like who I like. Don't ASSUME because I'm skinny, I don't like fat guys/woman

[@EBrown-cr1gr]

I’m glad he mentioned region. In Atl yes definitely you can be bigger and get attention from the ideally fine men. NYC, CHI, DC is the same. But that’s not my region and let me tell you here... it is definitely not sought after. It’s hard af and you def feel the pressure

[@deonshotwell]

I appreciate the conversation and continue learning through these videos and my experiences. I wish the guest was more body positive towards larger feminine men and not disenfranchising them. It’s like everything about his opinion on the topic felt sexually influenced by hookup culture and not based on the objective of unlearning

[@topperallen3622]

I am so happy you posted this video, I believe we all should slow down and take the time and get to know a person first before making a judgement call. No fats, no fems is a judgement phrase. This is like saying no spics, no nigs. These derogatory phrases should be eliminated from posting boards in my opinion, anyway, we should ONLY talk about ourselves in profiles on hook up apps, no post negative phrases and comments to offend others should be allowed. I've heard people in the community say, I don't want to waste time with offers I know I don't want, okay, but, some of us in the gay community, especially in gay black community are very insecure about our sexuality, we tend to act straight around heterosexuals and a little effeminate around gays, these types of gays may make great bed buddies and friends, but because you chose to post these negative phrases you'll never get to know them, I'm just saying get to know a person by texting, talking and possibly meeting one another in a mutual place first. And yes, even for just hooking up because you may be passing over people would not only make good bed buddies but maybe pass over friends for life.

[@Shell1425]

Whew, Chile! Right Conversation but Wrong Guest. There are too many times when I cringe at some of his statements. I think he viewed things solely from his standpoint and that is understandable. I think we all have been susceptible to that in the past. However, it was just hard to watch him relay criticism he himself may be subjected to back on others. He seems like a nice guy but this was a mess.

[@marctee12]

it wasn’t the “wrong guest” simply because you didn’t like what he was saying . he has opinions just like everyone else . We have to realize that things in our community that are issues for some aren’t issues that bother everyone . example him saying “no fats/no fems” doesn’t bother him, as a big guy, should let you know not ALL big guys are offended by the phrase . it’s all a matter of opinion . and his opinion deserves to be heard like everyone else . maybe this could’ve been a better episode for you with multiple perspectives .

[@marctee12]

with that being said @obio , I believe it would be great if you had a round table of different types of guys to have a long length (podcast style) episode where you guys can discuss maybe two or three topics at a time .

[@Shell1425]

@@marctee12 His opinions about his life around being a thicker man was not my issue. I did find issue with when he went on a tangent stating that men larger than him don’t look good being effeminate. There are even points in the conversation where you can see Obio stops from stating something that would be inherently problematic. That is why I said he was the wrong guest. In comparison to the other voices he has had on the show his viewpoints were not as well rounded.

[@jdg7515]

@@marctee12 Its not about not liking what he said. All of the episodes prior have been pretty educational and enlightening. When you're coming on to talk about groups of people, and it's not a roundtable discussion, you should be careful with your words. Especially when talking about groups that already deal with bull on a more regular basis. This guy was flip floppy and didn't give much insight on the actual topic at all and he was rude. If Obio didn't cut some of it out it clearly would've been worse. There are people I don't like but I'm not about to rude about it and definitely not on a bigger platform.

[@dalecrosby4479]

I agree. They merely scratched the surface of the topic. I wanted them to get down to the nitty

[@jdg7515]

Good topic, not a great guest 😬...why the big guys gotta have a less than great representative 🙄? Can we get a redo?

[@scubanelly]

i-

[@Eyeneticz1]

Agreed, he wasn’t a great representative for this issue. He agreed with a lot gay ideology and stigmas that a lot of fat/femme people are trying to push back against.

[@co9971]

i dont do fat guys bc a masculine body is one with less body fat than our counterparts : women. i like a guy with a femme personality/behavior with a very masculine body.

[@joesmith-em2cd]

The interviewer 😍😍😍

[@ariesbluff]

live for these convos every week 💗

[@justmisterp]

I’ve dated guys double my size despite in the community I’m considered a chub. I always went for whatever attracted me. Body size didn’t matter. I was big on cute guys knowing how to dress and hygiene if anything. But body type didn’t matter.

[@guyafrica7894]

Loved this comment. Clicked on ya profile and loving the horror and pop culture topics, gonna watch them later. Really fascinated with the vertiligo condition MJ seemed to have had too

[@ericlucious5761]

My issue with the no fats no fems. Some you guys don't even meet the basic qualifications, job, car or place to live. Now u trying to say u have look a certain way to live up to ur fantasy. Some u guys are miss out on some good relationships because of ur likes

[@Earthsylewind]

Factss

[@rspen2142]

I think preferences are all apart of the game no matter if you are gay or straight...I, personally, have never been attracted feminine, hyper-masculine, short, really skinny guys or large guys. I prefer medium to thick guys; you know the ones who were skinny for the majority of their high school years and gained a little weight during college, type of thick. However, I do believe there is someone for everyone and when you fail to settle, you will find them. You only need one.

[@zenpuppy6025]

Another great conversation. I enjoy your channel and your guest seems like a really nice guy.🙂👍

[@vuyox]

It's really no rocket science. One who goes around dictating what others should be has no idea of what they should be. 😪

[@WalterLeeHamptonII]

This was a Great conversation! every one is entitled to their preference. I don't like "thugs" or ignorance. its a turn off to me.

[@martinbirdwell7986]

Me too I don't do the thug/DL type

[@dabigd1860]

@Walter Lee Hampton II Exactly. I want to know why is it that we tend to bristle or react whenever someone says they have one type of preference vs another type of preference? Like most of us have no issue when someone says they have a preference for someone who is 'financially stable' or 'independent' or a 'go getter' or a 'hustler' or 'no brokes'. Heck, that is what most of us say. So why can't you say 'no fats, no fems' if that is what you prefer? Sometimes it is about similar lifestyles and interests. If you are active, like to run, swim, workout, eat healthy, watch your diet, limit beer and alcohol, etc. You may simply be seeking a partner that likes to do the same. And once more, while so many fats and fems on here may be bemoaning those who say 'no fats, no fems' i rarely if ever have seen a fat fem man in a relationship with another fat fem. They themselves usually lust after more of the masculine, 'heteronormative' behaving, dressing, looking type of male. It's almost like the pot-calling-the-kettle-black: They mad at people for saying 'no fats, no fems' but they don't go for fats, fems themselves. Smdh.

[@ocomogosiay]

OH and you CUT TO's ARE PRICELESS!!! I CRACK EVERY TIME!!!

[@amaniaman7818]

🤣🤣 not that you like to eat. Damn what a beautifully structured and honest conversation. Thank you

[@ruckiss77]

***SIGH** I guess I appreciate his honesty 🙄

[@johnoutlaw3958]

My sentiment

[@vuyox]

Chiiii💀

[@AyrenGriffea]

First of all- The guest is Fine!!🤩🤩 Secondly, love how u all break down stigmas and talk openly about sexual preferences and stigmas!

[@tashawnalbert]

I absolutely love y’all vibe man! Y’all are hilarious! It’s y’all laughing at what’s not being said for me cause y’all see what each other really wanna say 🤣🤣🤣 I’m a new fan, mission accomplished. Subscribed, notifications bell turnt‼️😎🫶🏾Love y’all keep doing y’all thing.

[@caesarjay1665]

Him saying he doesn’t want to see a big feminine guy .. is disgusting 🤮 How dare he. I couldn’t even watch after I heard that … 👋🏽

[@MysticAngel3224]

I really enjoyed this chat... no lies were told by Jari, relating to how most people are looking to hook-up even when they say that is not the intention. I laughed at Obio being shady at 4:57 😂😂

[@herbsaint636]

These "dating sites" have baked in this a la carte style of finding a lover. Dozens of categories within categories. In my opinion it cheapens the human experience. Free yourself and let life happen.

[@musicandtheater7681]

I’m just so tired of being told don’t rush or wait to find love I’m 25 I want to get married and start a family it is so normal for hetro couples to have get married at young ages and have several kids why can’t I find this for myself I am a gay male. I’m clean I’m not super skiny I want to be but I’m not on a normal comparative scale tho I’m not huge I’m 198lbs and 5’4 there are lots of hetro couples with big guys or big girls. Big. On big and big on small I out going and welcoming the only thing I think I could do it go to gay clubs and talk to people but I’m afraid they just ignore me or make fun of me. I don’t know what else to do I tried to message people online so we could meet up and start hanging out but it hasn’t worked. What am I gonna do I don’t want to wait another year I don’t want to spend my year of 26 alone and working all day. Why is this so hard for me.

[@vmisdaone]

I’ve never understood why gay people have so many labels for everything, butch Queen, fem Queen, chubby chaser, etc. we seek equality, but have no equality in our own communities and it’s even worse when it’s in the black gay community, who suffers from shame and ridicule on both sides of race and sexuality. It’s all just annoying and weird to me.

[@kobeashton9148]

the way i wanna put my input…. the way i’ve been discriminated against for my size from men and women is SICKUH

[@solodondolo5890]

From your pic I think your lying lmao I like the beard 😂☺️ it’s sitting right

[@d.m.junior6194]

This was a great episode! Such a help for the gay black community! 💯

[@albertowilliams959]

Yea if ur a cis male.

[@jessemorman]

This was a great conversation. We all have preferences and there is nothing wrong with that however, I think some of us misunderstand the distinction between a preference and a way of life. For example, I prefer chicken. However, I've tried beef, turkey and pork, to come to the conclusion that chicken is what I prefer. We can't claim to prefer something over another, when we've never tried anything outside of what we're use to -it's an unfair comparison. Honestly, it's just remnants of white supremacy and western european standards of beauty, that have trickled their way into our small community. Also, I hate that we (the gay community) participate in the contradictions of America - we're supposed to be different. Case in point (one of them at least): we glorify fit bodies and shame unfit bodies, yet we live in what is considered to be the "fatest" country in the world; America has the highest obesity percetage - but got awf sis.

[@l3GR_Lavahero]

What’s up everyone. So I am a big guy 6 foot 278lbs and a proud gay masc, but accepting of my fem side big dude. I just want to put this out there. Being big is not a bad thing. Some of us get it as a gene and I know I did, because my mama was big and sexy. She didn’t lose that weight until she got a surgery. Society 24/7 throws the image and stereotype that the muscle man is better and they are gonna save the day. You know the be knight in shining armor, but us big guy do to. A lot of time we are the people with the biggest hearts, we go through a lot to understand ourselves, and as lonely it can be sometimes we do everything in our power to take care of ourselves. I have never loved a muscle head bro guy ever in my life I have always found more love in intelligent people who pushes me to be better and stop caring about the bullshit society shows. Even my boyfriend/fiancé now he ain’t the pretty boy, but he handsome enough in my eyes that I love him. Personal growth takes time. Relationship take time. Accepting yourself takes time. But you got to practice it everyday. Because big is beautiful, masc be smashin, and fem stay slaying. There is much more to be said but this comment isn’t audio enough to get it out. Just remember you are special as you are and no body can take that away from you. Now go get your money.

[@willybeama1]

This guy was a walking contradiction. I couldn’t get through the whole thing. Some people just hate themselves and don’t know it.

[@vr6gls]

I don’t think there is anything wrong with an individual not being attracted to a more feminine individual. I don’t think there is anything wrong with someone not being attracted to a more masculine individual. People like folks who have common interests and backgrounds. I am a gay man who is into cars, auto racing, hiking, sports, and other things that society deems as “masculine” activities. Most feminine gay men I know are not into the same activities I am. So naturally I don’t find myself romantically attracted to feminine gay men. I do agree that it’s problematic to say “I don’t want to see that” or to expect a 6’5, 300lb guy to be masculine. We should never stereotype people into a category, although the gay community loves to do that. Being feminine is perfectly fine and if that’s who you are, than be who you are. As far as dating bigger men, I have a preference for bigger men naturally. Although I have dated men of all body types. My boyfriend of two years is 330lbs and I find him more attractive than a guy with a six-pack. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[@danlaw1208]

I like what I like, nobody can dictate me about it

[@jdg7515]

Yeah this guest aint it 😬. It doesnt seem like he actually thought through these topics at all. He was just talking....basura 🚮

[@KevinETaylor]

I think I checked out around 3:40. I will come back indeed, but the big guy AND the feminine attributes being put on the same person is just archaic.

[@chrisb2844]

He's too funny I love his laugh.

[@devpri1879]

This is a good conversation and the guest is super handsome. He'd the perfect size too me. I think that there's a thing call skinny fat and that's not the same as heavy set frames. I personal guys who are frame is built bigger. Nonetheless, skinny guys are ight too. But we ain't getting rid of fat guys lol.

[@handsomemahlambi]

Jari is really good looking like reeeeeaaally good looking🙌🏽🔥

[@vgreen1106]

I Respect the Guest's Honesty for real.

[@theocochin166]

I agree -it’s tasteless & unnecessary to announce it to the world. It’s like a landlord posting a for rent sign that says “No Asians or Blacks”

[@Jerry-xs1uz]

💯 PERCENT CORRECT AGREED KING 👑🖤 THANK YOU OBIO 😅

[@Lemarcus03]

You get points for honesty 🙂

[@adrianlopez8058]

Great point about how age affects it! People be 18 calling 25 year olds old and think they’ll be skinny twinks forever baby when that metabolism slows down they screaming they thick 😂😂😂😂

[@adrianlopez8058]

I also think people like and dislike what people tell them to. A lot of ppl were anti thick men but now that having body is in, they get on social media pretending to like it

[@dariusd2003]

This edits are taking me out especially 5:50.🤣

[@MichaelJohnson-os2hp]

The problem I have with this episode is that the placement of "no fats/no fems" insinuates sexual activity and your conversation confirmed that. If one sees that on someone's profile, so what? Move on and find people who will appreciate you in every sense. All gay men seem to care about is sex and I'm over it. What ever happened to developing friendships, real brotherhood, or business partnerships, whatever? Can we please talk about intellectual topics? What's going on in the world today...climate change and its impacts...the plight of people living with disabilities...our teetering democracy and what we can do to save it...the lack of diversity in the workplace and its effect on people of color...that's why many gay men can't handle me, because I'm well-rounded and don't talk about sex all the time.

[@terryyoung316]

Well there are hundreds of videos online discussing the topics you mention. Why not go watch those?

[@ChocPrynce]

No fats/no fems isn't relegated to sex. There are people who don't want friendship or any other bond with another man who is fat/fem, because they find those men detestable or less than. To pretend this is only about sex is to pretend relationship building isn't predicated on the same prejudices that underlie the rest of society.

[@MichaelJohnson-os2hp]

@@terryyoung316 I am...and your point is?

[@jbjesus123]

This so needed...

[@kenscales4992]

I hate all the labelling in the gay community. As I get older I'm more open to ALL body types. It's all about what's between the EARS not the legs.

[@marklouis1890]

SPEAK ON IT. Its more about connecting with the person and getting to know them. Attraction is what draws me in, but personality, chemistry, conversation etc is what will lock me into you.

[@kaym7704]

That’s typical of what happens when gays “age” out…they get shunned by the young masc white man so they go where ever they can find it. Like no, we aren’t interested either.

[@gorgiousqwan5221]

U like what u like i have not had a problem but to each is there own love your self everyone

[@darianagnew6524]

He’s me: “What does that mean?”

[@IrbyyTV]

I hope you invite another guests or more than one guest to receive a variety of perspectives…I appreciated Jari’s lol, but we need a variety because we all don’t feel this way.

[@franklincalvin7437]

They can say whatever..IDC because my quality of life improves. One less shallow I understand preferences too. I have time and place when I express fem...At the club ..you can see my fem ways and but it's toned at work and other places..just me..

[@Diz_27]

I've been with plenty of bigger guys which is another thing people are closed-minded to. They limit their opinions because of how superficial they are

[@zusibone]

I have dated everyone. Feminine, Skinny, Chubby, Regular size, African, European, Mix, Indian, etc. I however am not attracted to FTMs or trans men, etc.