Seven Examples of Cheating in Warhammer 40K

[@olismith2782]

I got accused of cheating when I rolled 4x 6's for my saving throw. This would have been amazing and maybe worth the debate for them if I didn't have to roll only +2's on my GK Terminators....

[@L3GHO5T]

4x 6’s?! obviously you had magnetic dice 🤬

[@oliverp3545]

A 1/1296 chance (assuming it's just the 4 dice) is not a rare enough occurrence to accuse someone of cheating, probability is only so reliable to suspect something. It's better to focus on their behaviour with the dice rather than a single role.

[@olismith2782]

@@oliverp3545 It was just the 4 dice on that roll. That game i'd rolled poorly and decent at times so pretty average. Was a game as it was a 2v2 where everyone had their moments. One player early on kept rolling 5-6's on super crucial saves of 5-6+. My moment was just 4 x 6's. And they accused my dice of being BS. As that turn I had a really good psychic and shooting phase. But after debating and pointing out my turn one psychic phase was ultra crap as I only passed 2 tests in my gk army and 1 was denied. My round 2 was mediocre, got more passes but denied twice. And why would I use loaded dice when I have to pass +2's saves? Eventually it just settled down and we cracked on.

[@olismith2782]

@@L3GHO5T it was the only way to make sure those 2+ rolls happened!

[@joshuamcguire2423]

sure you didn't, like that attention don't ya...

[@0MaxK0]

One of the best sayings I've heard of is: "Never attribute malice to actions that can be explained by naivety or stupidity" It is also an important reason why I feel playing by intent is necessary for the game.

[@StephenPrintz]

That would be Hanlon's Razor

[@OllyWood688]

@@StephenPrintz Which is coincidentially also a sufficiently fluffy explanation why the chaos god Malice is not as prevalent as the big four lol

[@pepi560]

pitfall is people abusing that saying and just playing dumb to get away with malice

[@Drogue84]

Totally agree, it's so easy to make an error in 40k as well. Even if not stupidity, just absent mindedness. Hopefully it evens out over a game though. I had a semi-competitive game the other week where I forgot ROD required you to be >6" from other table quarters (I thought it was >6" from the middle like Engage - why these are different I don't know, would be both easier and balance Engage better to add this!). But on the other hand my Death Guard opponent forgot his faction secondary required no enemy models to be on an objective for him to do the action, so scored an extra 3 points there. In the same game as he was scrupulously honest that his termies couldn't move the extra fraction of an inch to get on an objective when I asked if his intent was to move one onto it, so pretty sure these were entirely unintentional. I do wish there was a way of doing easy reminders though - I'm used to playing video games where it's not possible to forget a rule.

[@robertbritt3129]

So if you request good rolls perhaps in your dice tray and they want to continue setting there dice down for better results and control of rerolls and rolls then they are making the error in malice and premeditatedly in my opinion roll your dice people

[@-rattler]

As a newer player, i catch myself accidentally "cheating" all the time. Most of the time to my detriment. Hard for 2 new guys with different armies to point out mistakes

[@IAM_THESOURCE]

Same man. It's never to my advantage lol

[@davidarbour2683]

You just progress and learned for your mistakes. Isn’t really cheating dont blame yourself too much

[@vladimiravramov6969]

Did this every time :D Rolling half the number of dice for example

[@TheHappiestMeal]

It’s understood with games this complex that some is going to get something wrong, it’s fine.

[@themasterninja110]

Its a mix for me. I misinterpret this. I forget about that. Even when its to my advantage I feel terrible afterwards. I prefer it be to my deterement though instead of giving me and advantage.

[@nicholaswalsh4462]

Cheating's kinda pointless in a game that inherently relies upon you having a decent relationship with other players. After all, if you piss everyone off, you're gonna have a hard time finding a game.

[@olismith2782]

Part of the fun is seeing other peoples devistating BS go off as well. Not just yours.

[@richardbradley2335]

Cheating though is a psychological trait....they wont care about that....not finding opponant will be everyone elses fault

[@funbro99]

Or you go on a 20 wins 0 loss by using extreme politics on a tshirt

[@joshuamcguire2423]

has nothing to do with a relationship with the other player, your playing a game not making dinner plans kid...

[@petemalysewich6845]

@@joshuamcguire2423 until you’re blacklisted from tournaments 🤷‍♂️

[@zaczane]

My group only plays casually, so we measure strictly for the first Model in unit. But then move the rest to match that first model. So there is a chance for models to gain an extra half inch occasionally, but we've accept this, since it saves lots of time.

[@josephskiles]

Seems like that's the best way to play

[@ruthlessromeo7527]

My group does the same

[@Dragonspirit223]

I used to go model to model, but when I realized Star War Legion used the single model Sargent rule (move Sargent and then move everyone around him), I've used that system and just moving things in relatively the same position.

[@Illiadofmalorne]

True cheating is extremely rare, but we all hear about it instantly now. Someone cheats at 1 tournament 1500 miles away and people act like it just happened at their local store. lol

[@notknightbean]

Same with the nazi guy in Spain who only “won” cause all his opponents refused to play him. There are assholes but they are a minority, and we should stop having a moral panic over them being assholes by thinking they represent the average fan.

[@johnpyrett4017]

@@notknightbean my only counter to that is it just proves how connected the entire community is that al kml if us take offence to someone cheating in OUR game. (Loud Russian music plays.)

[@kamerionsmith4551]

Acting like true cheating in a competitive environment with prizes is rare is naive as hell. Nobody pays attention to top 8 gt MTG competitions anymore because so many repeat winners have been outed as cheaters. But in tabletop wargaming you have to pay attention so much more to catch it. If I see a lot of stories of casual gamers with no stakes or motivation to win cheating, I'll bet my ass it happens all the time in tourneys and gets unnoticed or ignored. It turns into a game of he said she said because the opponent can just lie about giving their hero an extra 40mm bases worth of movement to make their charge (has happened to me) The player who won a gt with index orks before their 8th ed codex was accused multiple times of slow play to run out the clock and score on points, each and every facebook post about the incident was shut down by 40k group admins and discussion of the matter was grounds for a 24 hour mute on your account being able to post in their group. Like, the community actively tries to hide it and act like it simply doesnt happen

[@TalosLordOfNight]

@@kamerionsmith4551 admins in 40k groups are little more mature than infants.

[@mrcamo2usir]

I once rolled straight 6s with a volcano lance damage roll and I freaked out because I had never seen such carnage before. Usually if someone ismt surprised when something wild happens is my go to

[@adamhanson5565]

The slow play thing is so real. I played against one of those pre-game move necron lists & hadn't yet seen the light of chess clocks. He went first & was partway through his turn 3 when the round ended. I think I played a total of 30 minutes of the 2.5 hour round.

[@silentark6023]

First ever game of 40k back in 7e, my 1k points of tau got stomped by a dark angels army, even despite being new I thought their army was over the top, though the other player insisted that it was 1k points and getting hammered was just because 'I was new' and ;yeah this is why space marines are nuts'. The store owner noticed and after the game, made him write up his list in front of the whole store of about 15 odd people, turns out he took just a bit over 2.2k points of marines.

[@jacobwestfahl1510]

What an absolute dick move that pretty much only works to stomp on new players as well.

[@PWaldo-lw2ds]

To be fair, you can make an incredibly broken 1k DA list that will stomp Tau even with 1k, too... Guy is just a dick period.

[@bestnameever1850]

hmm thats a little Much

[@eicha41624]

The rules bloat thing is definitely a problem. I play Necrons and my friend plays Dark Angels, and if he tells me something does a thing I believe it. I can barely remember all of my own rules and stats, let alone his

[@ReverendMeat51]

Same, also Necrons playing against my blood angels bro (split Indomitus box of course) and between the two of us helping each other out with rules I have no idea how people play this competitively against strangers

[@Daidalus2]

Know that feeling, I gotta constantly check up on my own rules and FAQs during listbildung just to not cheat my friends.

[@edmondarmstrong1834]

Back in 5th through 7th I literally read every codex multiple times and used Battle Scribe to make lists for armies I didn't play constantly when new things came out. It's not that hard, you just need a decent memory.

[@eicha41624]

@@edmondarmstrong1834 bruh it shouldn't take studying a multitude of $50 books for yourself to play a game at a reasonable level. People have other things to do during the day

[@edmondarmstrong1834]

@@eicha41624 sailing the high seas renders the price of the books irrelevant. 40K was also my only hobby at the time.

[@nocturnal8171]

99% of "cheating" is one of the two players forgetting or misremembering an obscure faction specific rule. Some armies are absolutely designed to confuse people who don't play them. It's shoddy game design.

[@WheelChair-yy1ji]

i regularly verse thousand sons... tell me about it

[@morerobotwarscontent1476]

At a push you get quite a few people who seem to only forget stuff when it advantages them but you can definitely point that out to them without much drama.

[@punkhippe]

I dont disagree but I dont blame shoddy game design. It's fun that a thousand sons army is totally incomprehensible to an opponent, very tzeech. In order for armies to have interesting mechanics and identities you gotta push some unique mechanics.

[@eldoriath1]

Playing against admech... Played against a friend and felt like he could have said just about anything considering how many layers and rules they got xD

[@adddad9779]

Ever played against Deathguard? OMG man.... there are rules that modify rules for the rules...

[@Ghilliedude3]

Declaring your intention during movement is a great way to avoid confusion or gotcha moments. For example "I am placing this here so it is out of LOS of that unit" making sure both players agree before the unit is moved makes things way smoother than getting to the shooting phase and having someone shoot at something you didnt think they could.

[@DylanChester97]

I feel like picking up dice before anyone has seen them is by far the most common one I see. I even catch myself doing it sometimes if I have a lot of shooting to get through or are in a particulary exciting bout of melee. And while I don't personally cheat while doing it, its hard to believe that not at least some of those people definitely were.

[@thealleycatuk]

Especially when people are using unusual dice with numbers or themed symbols. Most of us recognise D6 rolls by pattern recognition of the pips so it takes people a lot longer to process rolls with dice they aren't familiar with.

[@wulfbak]

Yep, always roll where both you and your opponent can clearly see. Use a dice tray. Show your opponent the dice tray after the roll.

[@bitharne]

Kinda easy when you roll in the open and pull failed dice only.

[@mikemarcotte5962]

My group usually has a lot going on at once, and I've had to reroll more than once when I've forgotten about an opposing unit's To Hit modifier and couldn't recall every die. Now I make a conscious effort to leave them as-rolled until everything's resolved.

[@yoshienverde]

In the group I play with, we tend to not worry too much about throwing dice where everything is perfectly visible, instead of where's covnenient for us. That said, we do try to throw where it's visible if possible. We also tend to extend a bit of fair play mentality with our opponents: I don't intend to fudge dice, since that's unsportsmanlike, so I expect the other player to not do it either, and thus I don't bother checking every die thrown. What we do to avoid issues is to clearly enunciate everything, and wait for the other player to acknowledge, before grabbing dice for the next throw. That way, any doubt can be dispelled if needed

[@Frosty-kz4om]

I feel very lucky to have a group of friends who will always interrupt if their opponent is making a mistake or breaking the rules to their own detriment. The rate at which we all improve at the game is always increasing.

[@T3AMCXMCHUCK]

Concerning modelling for advantage, I have a little story from a friend of mine who played for my country in ITC, he told me about all the times he saw some examples of people doing such things and one really stuck with me: apparently one national team had a marine lists with lots of flyers (can't recall which one) and had them all modeled turning left so that they could fit more models on the table since the footprint of the model would be slimmer, not cheating persay but still a bit of a cheeky technique.

[@dominusbalial835]

When templates were a thing I heard a funny story where someone lengthened a spacemarines flamer arm to comedical proportions

[@wulfbak]

Sometimes I think you can get a little overboard. For instance, I have no real desire to rebase my Howling Banshees from 25mm rounds to 28mm. Those were the bases the models came with when I bought them in blisters back in 2007. I really don't think 25 vs 28mm provides any real advantage. If it gets to be an issue, we can always guesstimate things imagining slightly bigger bases.

[@T3AMCXMCHUCK]

@@wulfbak most people are fine with this, you can always just put their 25mm base on a 28mm base if its really an issue, no rebasing needed

[@taserrr]

@@wulfbak It's 3mm, people that complain about those things are just sad.

[@eyesofstatic9641]

@@taserrr all of my exes haha

[@timunderbakke8756]

The only cheating my play group has done it was on accident like mistaking how a rule works. I’ve done it too and apologized when discovered. Same for the others. We do the best we can and learn if we messed up a rule

[@tcideh4929]

That isnt really cheating then. Cheating is intentional.

[@Sorain1]

@@tcideh4929 Indeed. Cheating is intent. But mistakes can be really embarrassing. (Me and the Gauss rule on vehicles back in the day of first version Necrons.)

[@LordyT34]

I'm glad to see that most people recognize that 9/10 cases of 'cheating' is just people making mistakes in a complicated game with literal books upon books of rules to keep track of

[@tabbyplays930]

I find that cheating through bullying, or trying to push their will on their opponent is pretty common in competitive play

[@lockemyastan6276]

I find it interesting that some groups will call that smack talk or a mind game tactic, and others call that cheating or mean-spirited. I also find it interesting that some groups would consider something as small as smiling while the opponent misses attacks bullying and yet others will tolerate insults like it's just second nature. It's just an observation that I've noticed with several games.

[@uncletiggermclaren7592]

It is Universal in Australian Sport.

[@KingBobbito]

​@@lockemyastan6276 I'm not sure of OPs intent, but when I think of "bullying" in 40k it's the guys that always insist they're right when a rules decision needs to be made. A measurement being down to a hair, always no when it's their opponent and always yes when it's him, same with cocked dice. Yelling at your opponent to rush play any time they stop for even a second, meanwhile he takes breaks whenever he feels like it. When there's a weird rule interaction you don't know, instead of trying to take a minute to figure it out he insists that it's his interpretation (regardless how stupid his version is) instead of at the very least rolling for it. Just the kind of guy that will take advantage of quiet players to get an advantage in the game because he puts on a tough guy act and they're nervous because it's their first tourney.

[@lockemyastan6276]

@@uncletiggermclaren7592 Couldn't agree more.

[@lockemyastan6276]

@@KingBobbito I absolutely HATE people that will use their experience in a hobby or game to talk down or bully newer or less vocal players. If there is someone new to the game, you'd think it'd be polite to teach them how to play fast and efficiently through explaining it instead of just rushing them into bad decisions and not rechecking rules. Thankfully my group tends to be really chill when to comes to war games and such, but I know those meaner people are out there, somewhere.

[@themanbehindtheslaughter7633]

That "guy": The code is more of what you would call guidelines rather than actual rules

[@TheAstroRain]

I heard a story about a player, who moves terrain with his tongue, while checking Line of Sight for his models(it was about a 6ed or 7ed times) to make sure that his weapons be in range for target unit

[@AndrewSmith-xs1cg]

I think everyone does a lot of the more “innocent” cheats more often when they’re first starting out, and mellow out as they actually learn how the rules are designed to work properly, or perhaps have felt the pain of having those same cheats turned back against them. In my experience though, teaching new players how to play the game is the single most effective way to deliberately break any cheating habits you may have, whether it be moving your models an extra inch when its convenient or picking up a couple extra “hits” each shooting phase. Who wants to deliberately cheat when you’re showing a new player, sometimes even your friends, how they are supposed to be playing?

[@veameal9725]

We had a friend of mine unironically bring 4k+pts of space marines (Ultramarines ironically) to a 1500pt game. After a curious time observing him set up I asked for a small break and brought the entire store to the table to observe his "Deployment choices" Watching a man perspirate in real time was a sight to behold and remains a store legend there to this day.

[@UmbraAsterism]

How does someone possibly think they can get away with over double the limit of a game? Especially with Space Marines, where everyone knows roughly what things should cost for them since they're (more or less) the standard everything else is compared to?

[@veameal9725]

@@UmbraAsterism It was pretty wild. I even asked a few times if he was done setting up, he just looked up and responded with "almost done" as he slapped a thunderfire cannon in his backline near Calgar. It was a riot bringing everyone in to silently observe him slowly realise that he had been rumbled.

[@JuliusCaesar888]

@@UmbraAsterism it's a fake story that happened in his imagination, that's why.

[@AngelWolf12]

I knew a guy who was into cheating back when I played 30k. He was so intent on winning at any cost he would go into battlescribe's data and manually change the point values of certain items. That power fist for 15pts? Now 10. Artificer armor for 10 points? 3 now. Hunter Killer missile for 5? Try 1. And then print out the list and have it fully available, you can check it and everything and unless you knew the exact point value of his Legion's unique units, in this case Night Lords, he would get points by you, and the deficit would add up and allow him to grab something. Nothing huge, maybe a predator or upgun some heavy bolters to lascanons, or jump packs for all his Terror units or an extra HQ. Just through editing the data he would get an extra 75, 100, 150 points from a list which can make a big difference. 2000 vs 2075 doesn't seem out-matched, but in a tight run match that extra predator or jump chaplain can be the difference between victory or defeat.

[@Pannlord]

Good Lord, that is DESPERATE.

[@krilc]

That is just embarrassing

[@BrotherBarakiel996]

My man needs to really ponder his life and his choices. if he is that hellbent on winning, what problems or failures in his life got him to that point. Im a verry casual player, and i usually go for the rule of cool when it comes to models. I always want to give people a chance at playing, but damn if i saw that shit id just pack up and go home. At that point its not fun anymore, its just ego.

[@smugron1101]

The rule "error" one made me remember a post about someone who was a first time player playing Black Legion and played against their "friend" who played Blood Angels. They made up bullshit strategems like "1cp, the Emperor's Light: Your enemy removes d6 infantry models from the targeted unit, 2d6 if the targeted unit has the keyword". They made up some stupid op rules too but I read it a long time ago so don't exactly remember all of it.

[@opesam]

Would a follow up (sort of) video be a good idea as a "Primer to good wargaming etiquette". Things you SHOULD aim to do to give yourself and your opponent a good game. Would be a handy resource to refer people to if they're starting out the game!

[@azraeldirge1695]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZmekqomrhbOosLM

[@bungus_chungus1401]

If I ever bought trick dice to roll sixes, I’d still roll ones on them. That’s just how bad I am.

[@danwallace4745]

I feel this sentiment in my very core. XD

[@bungus_chungus1401]

@@danwallace4745 yep. When you lose terminators to one volley of lasgun fire from one infantry squad fairly often, it’s all you know

[@lartus8027]

Yes sums up alot of my play over the year, you can choose a balanced force or a direct counter, postion well choose the correct targets but none of it matters if you roll bad and they roll well. Now if it was just one turn or one game, never mind theres always next turn, next game but when it happened over and over it just isnt fun. I even recorded dice rolls over multiple games, i constantly rolled below proberbility and they rolled over.

[@merlyberdproductions883]

F E L T

[@TheocratOfPoontang]

Yep, same here.

[@NergalDeMors]

The one you forgot is the guy who looks at your army before taking his out. Ant that person has more then one transport bag and says " oh i forgot this model i'll replace it with these for the same points" i have had this happen more then once with same person, but it stopped when i started waiting for him to pull out his models and pulling one at a time at his speed. He never forgot models when I did this.

[@nicholaswalsh4462]

I keep several sets of dice on hand for one reason: I subscribe to the idea of tainted dice. After I keep rolling lots of 1s and 2s with one set, I switch another set.

[@colinbielat8558]

I completely agree with that, if a dice keeps rolling 1s and 2s they go into dice jail so they can think about what they have done.

[@jossypoo]

I'm glad you said 'subscribe to'. I've never been a superstitious dice person, and people look at me like I'm from mars.

[@Bigglenndaddy]

Same, I bring 4 bricks of 36 d6

[@lv100Alice]

you fool. you just change dice when the dice have spend all the bad rolls

[@mobilegamersunite]

I got titanium dice 🎲 to roll for custodes 😂

[@ianfowler9505]

My mistakes tend to be to my disadvantage, like forgeting my deathskull re-roll. Last game I forgot to deploy an entire Mek Gun. Ooops.

[@Ichorslick99]

Not declaring what you're rolling first. This one drives me nuts. Especially with more casual players who will just pick up dice and make multiple rolls without saying anything, like "What the f*ck are you doing!?"

[@tomatotyrant31]

Worst thing I've seen: I attended a small tourney and finished middle of the pack after falling for some shady tricks and just being out played. However, my friend finished 1st place after the final game. The only problem was the guy that got second place went back and counted points from previous games and it turned out he and his opponent(his friend) in the semi finals had miscounted points in their semi-final game. He knew the TO and had the points recounted with his new score and took first.

[@TP_Rockstar]

As a new player, I'm very conscious about the slow play part. Particularly playing Tyranids, often with many large units, the movement phase is still happening very slowly compared to other players. Similarly, the simple part of counting up and rolling dice for a 20 model unit of Genestealers followed by a 30 model unit of Hormagaunts, trying to figure out which units are in melee range, remembering any bonus attacks, pile in, consolidate and then possibly fight again strats. Doesn't need to be complicated, just requires time.

[@BrotherVoidBomber]

The sheer fact your conscious about it says a lot.

[@the_snobot]

When I used to play regularly our test for cocked dice was to try to balance a second die on top. If the die was flat enough that you could balance a die on top of it, then the roll counts. If you can't balance a second die, it's a re-roll. Obviously there's some wiggle room for how hard you try to balance the die, but it's a lot harder to to feign effort (or lack of effort). And for friendly games it's normally a pretty fast, easy method for determining if you need to reroll a die or not.

[@ecs05norway64]

Wonderful example of "modeling for advantage" that I heard about. Way back in the day, the rules for Ork trukks were "build whatever you want, its carrying capacity is the number of models you can physically fit aboard. If anything falls off of it while you're moving it, that model is dead.". So this one guy had built this massive multi-decked monstrosity that made the Knight Bus look tiny and safe, and was able to load his entire army onto it....

[@Dreadnautilus]

To be fair I can see Orks doing that.

[@lauphingman4699]

I was making SO many mistakes when I first started playin. I jumped in at 9th edition. Even after trying strays that aren’t legal or movement that’s not right, the guys I play with and the community I play with have steered me to be better. Roll in front of your opponent, ask if whatever your doing makes sense. As a new guy, I can tell you having people around you helps you be better

[@GrasshopperKelly]

One thing I started using lately is a very loose thing lace like net or sheet of fabric under the base of objective markers (I started with a circular sheet of paper, then tried slicing radial cuts to allow it to contour to uneven table surface). Then we agree if any model (Unit in AoSigmar etc.) is half or mostly or infallibly within the circle, they contest the objective. Just feels so much easier than measuring and arguing over them. Love them. I'd love to use maybe some Latex sheet (same stuff Dentist use for rubber dams). I use 32mm bases with just a but of decor. One with a radio set and ammo, one with an ejected, partially buried dreadnought sarcophagus, flag on another. Simple stuff. With a magnet underneath (spaced out), so I can place a little steel circle under the paper or net (To hold it in place, I didn't want to glue them there, I was experimenting with what "fabric" or material works best), and It's a little bit recessed from flush with the plastic base's rim.

[@bevanmccrory289]

If I ever put a unit on a bigger base, I make it easily noticeable what the real base. For example, I have a Master of Ordnance on a 32 mm base, but it is standing on a 25 mm "mound" in the mud, where you can see the original base size.

[@klauskeller6380]

The moving of vehicles around terrain happens so often in my games and it always feels bad to tell them because they just call you picky

[@j.doveyakamarvelousjacketm9823]

I played against someone once who insisted every single models movement must be measured. I'm sure it was to prevent cheating, but as I'd turned up with a horde force so each of my turns took ages. Everyone else I've played against (regardless of who has the horde) is happy for the front models in a unit to move first then everyone else piles in behind them

[@jackhiggins8028]

the only major "cheating" ive ever experienced was me and a guy at my local store both totally forgot the morale phase existed and played about 3 rounds without it before realising why our units stayed around for so long

[@williamwills492]

Good dice etiquette is to pick up failed rolls first and leave the successful ones on table for opponent to see.

[@jdunster5436]

Loaded dice was a big one in Australia, Victoria during 5th edition. A fellow had some 'tap' dice he used with his wound allocation grey knights.

[@Kirusion]

When I used to play in GW stores there was one guy who was caught using an elastic ruler, it says 12 inches but more often than not it was 15 inches, sadly he wasn't banned and kept coming back with the same ruler to use on newer players, the ones that knew about him always brought it up so he couldn't cheat

[@zaczane]

I have always played by the same core rule that we used in MTG. We assume you know your rules, and are playing fair, however anyone can ask to see the rules in any given scenario.

[@tysonwollas1721]

I hate it when the opponent has hard to read dice. Years ago I had an opponent model a kneeling Wraithlord to make him shorter. I also saw a guy back before the official model built 6”wide Ork BattleWagons(this was back when Defrollas were very dangerous). He played 6 of them so he could just run over the board.

[@oliverp3545]

I'm very curious on how people have been able to convert the legs in a kneeling pose since they're one piece, like this is a reoccurring thing I hear about.

[@jayward8943]

@@oliverp3545 You cut the leg in half directly above or below the knee then cut out a bunch of material until you can put it back in place and use greenstuff to soften transitions. Some kits make it real easy to do. Lots of tau models have knees (and other joints) that are only locked in place with a single tiny tab and the instructions even let you know to snip it for a wider range of motion.

[@burntbread2814]

I’ve had a couple friends who have accidentally cheated by using certain strategems and units in a different way simply because they misinterpreted it

[@themasterninja110]

I've done that. Some of the starters are worded weird and are extremely confusing.

[@jamesclarke5331]

I did it once. I was playing a local tournament assumed that evilfish were BS3 because a hammerhead is also bs3. Played a whole game like it. The next game I played, my opponents original amy was tau and he picked me up on it. I felt so ashamed, when he told me and I checked the codex! He wasn't too bothered, he tabled me by turn 3 🤣

[@donhartfield]

At the start of 9E, GW's stance was "if you purchased a model from us, you use the base it came with" - this just helped cover issues where an older model was purchased for character models, but the most-recent versions say they needed something bigger (usually came with an old 25mm but needs 32mm base). In some of the latest FAQ updates, as well as the official GW PDF for their events, they outlined that *all* models have to meet the minimum base size (and outlined what those were) even if the model was purchased with a different base. This is a good thing. However, it mentioned specifically that only the minimum mattered and there was no requirement for maximum base size. While some people would argue that could be used to cheese / cheat, I have yet to see someone show up with an Apothecary or Captain on a 100mm base even though GW's stance is "that's ok".

[@krilc]

Age of Sigmar gets this right by just having a huge pdf list of all units official base sizes

[@oliverp3545]

I've just assumed 40mm base sizes for my characters because the most recent one that came out has a 40mm one.

[@Pers0n97]

When I play a game, I make people agree to roll dices into a dice tray, ti fixes a LOT of problem. As for the base size, I think the bases should be noted on the database (like they are in wahapedia). Bases should NEVER be something you can just change for aesthetic reason if you intent on playing them on the table, as for the "size" of the model, welp, I'm still shocked that GW is still going with the "i duno, look at the model I guess" instead of adopting a much more standard approach like Privateer press, where the size (ie height and volume) is dictated by the base size.

[@andrewnoble8743]

I always roll my dice in a tray. But all of my opponents persist in rolling them on the table. Cocked dice and slight of hand are big ones.

[@captainweekend5276]

@@andrewnoble8743 The weird thing is that age of sigmar has hard basing rules with them releasing an FAQ for official base sizes but for whatever reason don't do it for 40k.

[@andrewnoble8743]

@@captainweekend5276 ye I guess. But a bit of an elastic rule/tape isn't that bad really in my oppinion. In a casual game. Maybe? Rules are rules. But dice rolls you shouldn't mess with, because there really isn't any reason too. Rules you can forget/ mess up. Measurements or measuring can get fudge by terrain/model position. But rolls are definite, even a cocked disc you can usually see which is the top face.

[@gargoylesplinth867]

I once had a bit of a weird 'modelling for advantage' and terrain interaction. It was in the edition where everyting was true LOS, and my opponent had mounted his Rhinos on bases, where if they exploded, he could leave the base there as the crater marker. But these bases lifted the Rhino's up, to the point where in one case I couldn't see the actual tank itself under some low tree branches, but could clearly see the base (and therefore the Rhino's tracks if the base wasn't there). My opponent tried claiming I had no line of site as I couldn't see the Rhino model, only it's base.

[@kamaeq]

Slow Play, in my personal experience extends back to 5th edition. I've been accused of it when running an older mass Necron Warrior list. Even if quickly and efficiently moving 60 to 70 infantry models (and laying oneself open to accusations of movement shenanigans) after having specifically bought movement sticks for each movement and shooting range takes time. A true horde army like Orks or Guard foot lists literally cannot be moved quickly without large compromises. Admittedly, this has improved with the discarding of templates so trying to minimize losses by spreading out units isn't a thing, but still a squad of X models takes Y amount of time per model to move. Still, even disregarding actual slow play, a list 100-120 minis takes a LOT more time to move. It is, in fact, a valid tactic, since I showed one time back in the day than even taking potential movement "liberties" by doing a lot of eyeballing, five turns could not be completed with that size list just based on movement. Now add in firing, charges and melee and games with one mass foot list will not be completed on time generally. Recent examples are a pair of 1000 point lists, Custodes (14 models) vs Guard (52 models). Unless the Guard are fully loaded in their transports, movement takes a LOT longer for the Guard, as do the other phases.

[@Dwarficus]

It might just be my OCD, but when I kitbash models, I always check the bases of the current offical models. To be honest, with GW changing the base sizes from time to time, I find I check when dealing with any older kits, just to be on the safe side. I think a lot of this comes from not wanting to gain an advantage by having the wrong base (otherwise I'd have my kitbashed BA smash captain on bike on the Imperial Knight base). I have enough problems remembering all the rules (and I play three different armies, which doesn't help), so getting the right bases is one less thing to worry about.

[@stormisuedonym4599]

That's not OCD, that's normal practice when kitbashing for playable armies.

[@Dwarficus]

@@stormisuedonym4599 errr... I've been dianognised with OCD, by the NHS, and from my experience, most kitbashers don't check the bases.

[@stormisuedonym4599]

@@Dwarficus Yes, and?

[@Dwarficus]

@@stormisuedonym4599 sorry, I'm confused by your comments. I'm OCD, about the rules, about ensuring I have no unfair advantage. This presents it's self, in this case, as ensuring I use the exact base for that unit.

[@stormisuedonym4599]

@@Dwarficus Sure. Whatever. You're absolutely correct, only people with OCD ever bother to make sure their kitbashes have the correct base size.

[@TekoMuto]

This year, a guy at GenCon's Killteam events was kicked out for using d12s that had two sets of 1 through 6 on them.

[@deckofmanytoyboxes8845]

Interesting because the math on that works out to be equal to 1d6. Since 2/12 is equal to 1/6 haha

[@ReadyToRole]

I have a solution for the cocked dice thing- if you can place another die on top of the cocked one and it stays, it's not cocked. If the die on top falls off, its cocked.

[@exquisitecorpse4917]

If the result is clearly legible, that's a roll to me. D6s almost never give an indeterminate result unless they've been rolled into a very uneven terrain piece (and even then they usually lay slanted with one number clearly on top). So far, I've only played friendly Warhammer, so I begrudgingly allow the "cocked dice" people to take their rerolls. But I do consider it cheating, and I do poke fun at them so they know I know. In a tournament, I would say "HANDS OFF" and call for a TO. You can't just reroll your 2s because they lay on a speck of dust.

[@Flight_of_Icarus]

The virgin modeling for advantage vs the chad accepting the disadvantage given by your cool model. "Why yes sir, that hover tank is actually hovering with the conversion I've given it. Yes that means it's taller than it usually would be and yes that means it can't fit behind that piece of cover, feel free to shoot it"

[@kieranwalsh2058]

Just makes winning much more impressive

[@Sorain1]

"That's the problem with being cool I guess."

[@gmradio2436]

One I heard about was custom tape measures. 1and 1/8 inch marked as 1 inch.

[@demonprinceofkhorne]

I have a couple of models that look like they are strategically posed for the advantage (Canoptek Wraiths built to be crawling scorpions). One thing I do there is if that unit takes a casualty, those ones go down first to ease future confusion

[@mycatistypingthis5450]

I have put tactical sticks, swords and somesuch on bases to put the height at a normal level.

[@JayAndNightASMR]

Most common I've seen is fir deathwatch, a lot of people forget units lose certain keywords and try and use things they cant

[@Tom_Cruise_Missile]

Deathwatch is one of the worst armies to remember the rules for it. I often just forget entire major rules.

[@ronnyrdr6553]

I have one for you. I had a guy that only used bigger (14-16 ) colourfull dice. There were so many colours that looked alike that you had to be really focused to see the dice he was throwing. Now i myself threw so poorly i missed 22 phantasm grenade launcher shots that had to be 6 or higher >.

[@Marconius6]

The Moving Models one I can relate to as a fairly new player, I did that too. I think the main reason is that you measure distances between two models different from measuring movement, which was unclear to me at first. Like in your diagram those the two tanks are 10" away from each other as pictured, but that's more than a 10" move...

[@christopherflanagan9626]

Combining disembark and move to place a unit 9 inches away from a vehicle when there was not enough room to disembark the squad within 3 inches of the vehicle in that direction!

[@childrenoftolkien]

I'm new to the hobby. Thank you for the ideas.

[@michaeljones7916]

Well as for Bases Games workshop says you can always use models with their original bases that they came with but whenever possible I try to rebase (when it is larger) a model if it doesn't make it look weird....

[@quadsnipershot]

I hate WYSIWYG, its not likely my opponent knows exactly what stranglehorn canon and venon canon look like from 5 feet away and painted. As long as you tell the opponent what models are what and which have which it should not matter at all. Except maybe in its a 10 man squad and they have like different profiles.

[@tripod222]

Bolt Rifle vs. Stalker Bolt Rifle. Even SM players probably couldn't differentiate, not even up close. That being said, I had one game where someone brought 2 devastator squads, one with lascannons and one with hvy bolters, but not wysiwyg. I killed the lascannon squad. On his next turn, turns out that that was the other squad (no, it wasn't). What a surprise. Nowadays, I'd just concede at that point and never play that player again.

[@oliverp3545]

This is why people need to show their armies and list before setting up.

[@tripod222]

@@oliverp3545 Oh, he did. He just decided mid-game that squad LasCannon had actually been squad HvyBolter all along and I had mistaken it. And it's pointless arguing since you can't prove it - it's a "he said/she said" situation.

[@willconstantinople6434]

One regular tournament gamer I knew years back (and never played against for obvious reasons) out-and-out stated to me that it was his opponent's responsibility to catch him cheating - if he wasn't caught, that was his opponent's fault! One of his sneaky moves was to lean over the table in a particular way to catch a piece of scenery his unit was in and edge it forward when he needed it; another common one was to pivot a vehicle as though he was going to move it, 'change his mind, pivot it back but from a different point on the vehicle (meaning he had gained a variable number of inches based on which vehicle and which point on that vehicle he used).

[@LiliaArmoury]

as someone who conversion builds models I honestly prefer measuring from the base where possible so as to try and avoid issues of modeling for advantage. atleast in 9th we don't have to worry about firing arcs for vehicles so converted vehicles aren't as big of an a issue as they may have been prior to 8th

[@noregrets3925]

“I’m not cheating I’m just being extra tactical”- someone who told me about cheating incident

[@Moredakkamus]

You missed a time honored classic: moving the extended tape measure forward with the model.

[@simonmorley4816]

My biggest peeve about stuff like this is when someone tries to retract something that has an element of risk, such as a CP rerolled save. Also, there is the un-readable dice trick, which irks me greatly

[@TheRainman614]

I hate the people who play with skull dice as the symbol. For a while, GW had skulls for 1s so you could use the skull dice where you had standard 6s or skulls (1s) count as a 6. That and people who use clear dice with fluorescent numbers you can barely see! Or they roll them so quick you can't see their roll. Or they pick up successes, or roll away from the action.

[@whotookmydice]

Great list of cheats! I have seen all of these at one point or another. If I may add one, I had a game where my opponent had his reserves and his dead pile very close together. he would then take models from the dead pile and then state that he forgot what each grouping was. He did this multiple times.

[@joshuapinkley8562]

I had an experience where a guy would pick up different dice depending on if he needed to roll high or low. you may not have weighted dice, but if your dice are poorly cut and seem to consistently roll more 6s than 1s and you know this so you keep using those dice I consider that cheating. You may not have made them that way intentionally, but continuing to use them IMO is cheating.

[@WheelChair-yy1ji]

nahhh... ive got my lucky orkky green dice for charges. i found them!

[@peterclarke7240]

That's more unfairness than cheating, but I take your point. I'd ask them to roll the dice ten times in a row. If they consistently get high rolls, I'd ask them if they really wanted to carry on using them. If they said yes, knowing that they had an unfair advantage, I'd pack up and go home, because at that point it's not really a game any more.

[@oliverp3545]

I've heard of people using a sander on their dice to reduce the edges in order to make the opposite face to the 6 the biggest, so that it's weighted and also has a larger surface to stick onto the table with.

[@eldoriath1]

People using "lucky dice" is not uncommon and I don't see an issue with it. Cheap and mass produced dice will be biased for some numbers, like when some guys tested GWs dice and found they had a lower than expected avarage. Transparent dice are generally speaking more likely to be fair since they are clearly homogenous. I also have five second hand casino dice that I like to use for things like charges and stuff like that and a special novelty tungsten dice for things when I only use one dice, like rolling for first turn. These are meant to be more precisely random and before I had these really nice dices that were a budget precision dice. Sadly they got lost during the years and they are expensive as heck, so won't be replacing them any time soon =/

[@WheelChair-yy1ji]

@@peterclarke7240 but it does consistently hit high charge rolls.. but the dice goes straight back in the bag that we both use, and its a normal dice. Its that real waagh energy that you will never understand lol

[@pervyturtle2673]

Far more common in my experience is my opponent reminding me of something I forgot to do that actually helps me where they could have just as easily ignored it and benefitted

[@lonecolamarine]

It feels like cheating when your oppenent's never played 40k before so he charges his gunline of warriors into your assault intercessor squad.

[@NornQueenKya]

Before anything, to be clear, 90% of gaming experiences on the table are great. However every once in a while you do run into someone who is a little more liberal on their movements and ranges. Tournament wise, I only had one bad issue where I tabled the person and they tried to convince me they won via points. But after an entire game of questioning and being questioned I didn't care anymore and let it go. I'd probably never go to a big state tournament because for that I feel like I'd need to know every rule for every army... and that's not happening

[@HereticDave40k]

it is possible to win on points, even when being tabled... if there are still turns remaining the points for those turns can still be scored and added to the total VP for each side

[@NornQueenKya]

@@HereticDave40k it is. Especially if that table is near the end of the game. However the game I'm referring to, it was bad for him from the start and I wasn't being denied in points for primary and secondary. At all. So yeah I stand by thinking it was fishy. Granted his bad attitude didn't help, who knows.

[@exquisitecorpse4917]

Years ago in a MTG tournament, my opponent insisted on a particular interpretation of the rules which was (1) wrong and (2) horribly disadvantageous for my deck. I knew he was wrong and called for a judge, but they were all busy. He got irritable and unpleasant, and I didn't want to cause a big fuss, so I just let him "win" the argument so we could play. I lost the game by a hair, ended up in loser's bracket, and got shoved out of the tournament 1 win short of top 8. In the moment it can feel easier to just allow someone to steal your victory because you don't want to be unpleasant, and - hey - in casual play, maybe avoiding conflict is better than winning. But in tournament play, you paid to enter, you practiced your tactics, you fought for valuable prize, and you WON. Hopefully neither of us will make that mistake again. Lady gamers gotta stand up for ourselves!

[@reclaimatorerebus6531]

I do use "special dice" for extra important roles, but my special dice are actually balanced dice (so the opposite of weighted). I only have 2 though, so I don't actually use them much in 40K. Fortunately I guess, I've never been accused of them being fixed.

[@MagosCavantis]

I am always a big fan of people rolling their dices on the edge of their side of the table and pickung the dice faster than I can check their throw.

[@mau48310]

I'm barely about to pick up my first box , ty for this guide. This noob sure appreciated the heads up. Also, things to look out to make sure people don't mistake my befuddledment for malevolent implications .

[@ElLoboUK]

The best thing to do regarding 'accidentally' picking up too many hits etc is ask them to remove misses from the pool before picking anything up. It's generally just good etiquette to do things the following way: Roll in full view Remove failures Check dice pool Pick up remaining dice

[@LoneeLive]

I'm 95% certain at a tournament after saying my points my opponent added a 5 so that he would win by 3 points, I counted on a paper (should have counted his too), he counted on some 20, 8 & 6 sided dice. The rest 5% would have been a mistake.

[@markedforstrike]

Once my opponent moved his minis for 10" when they had 8" move. It was obvious, because he had his ruler here and I told him that this seems wrong and he moved back. Next round that happened again with 3 units, each moving 2-3" more then they should. I told his that one time is an accident, but 2 is a regularity. He moved back again. On third round I just called the judjes, 5 players on that tournament backed me by saying that this player does this every match with every measurment, be it movement, shooting range and especially half-ranges. He got banned from local store. Idk why nobody called him out for that shit, upping everything by 2-3" is a huge buff, especially on small tables We are posting rosters day before tournament and I usually copy them to my battlescribe, so during the game I has my stats printed and opponents on phone with quick access. Im not paranoic and suspect everyone, I just believe that information is true power and knowing what is what can lead to better tactics Also since rosters are public there is no way to squeeze more units - roster will be looked over by at least 7-8+ players and 2-3 judjes Once we got hilarious player who glued heads to bases and said "this orks are walking in the swamp". He got that idea somewhere on reddit and he was not allowed to use these minis

[@changer_of_ways_999]

Some tips that helps with cheating but also flow as well. 1. A dice tray 2. Battlescribe app to verify army build 3. All up to date rules on index cards or printed with reference and date that you intend to use 4. A measuring laser pointer 5. A "game master" or ref to be a neutral observer and mediator for games that are more competitive 6. A generous and laid back attitude to your opponent and enjoy the fact that you are able to play at all 7. Actual paint on your miniatures

[@oliverp3545]

You could also write up some iffy things to have clarrified on a document, send it to the TOs and get back their opinions on the rules, at the very least a ref would most likely take your side as a result, or they'll even include those clarifications, making any attempt obvious.

[@Stuboi0]

regarding the points scoring, I always call out at the end of both my turn and opponents turn about scoring secondary objectives. Sure, it might mean I'm prompting them to focus on them at the start of their turn, but it means that they can't turn around and say I'm being deceitful.

[@NathanaelHuber]

Most "cheating" at my loal store is probably mismeasuring, thats why I always premeasure and tell my oponent. If the charge is then suddenly is 3" shorter its time to look more closely.

[@occultplatypus]

I've caught myself doing a few of these things, but when I do, I just entirely discount any applicable rolls and start the action from scratch

[@oblivionfan345Tony]

I actually have a question for Imperial Guard players: Sergeant Ripper Jackson's datasheet specifically says you can use her in place of any Sergeant model in your army (because thats all she is, a fancy looking sergeant) but her base is much larger than normal Imperial Guard sergeant bases. Are you just supposed to put her on the normal 28mm base to use her instead of the larger, decorative base that the kit comes with?

[@DzikiWaclaw]

GW probably didn't even think about that. I bought commissar Severina Raine and she is mounted on a 32mm scenic base where as normal commissar model is on a 28mm base. Me and my buddies just agreed that you put your models on whatever base you got in the box with it.

[@KageApolloBiff]

This Summer I was in a local tournament (3-500pt games with clock of 1hr) and was up against the son of That Guy. This kid shows up with an Ad Mech army full of Skittari that he wanted to play 'because of this cool combo he found' (the whole 80 shots exploding 6s hitting on 2s rerolling 1s with like 2 Ap etc etc) plus the characters and a tank, but he did not bring a single Ad mech model. Every single model was a proxy, with supposedly the same base. For those inifite number of shots, he insisted in rolling 5 dice at a time, and then writing it down. I couldn't follow his logic with the how he would roll the hits and wounds and all that (it was weird order) but I just had to trust him. His first shooting phase took 35 minutes out of the 60 we had. Luckily I was eldar and on the small map I could reach an obj for second round primaries from my speed, and I won because he was so slow (movement and time) that after round two he barely had any points and then we ran out of time. So I won because of his slow play (though I was on my way to get tabled).

[@JustinDynamicD]

All of my Tyranid models happen to be burrowing which is why they just look like bases with no models. Yes, even the hive crone.

[@theTemplar08]

3ed had a ongoing in store turniment where we gamed every Saturday. A player would walk around and see what his competitors were playing then go to his car and tailor his list to have an advantage. He had over 5000pts of orks to choose from.

[@oliverp3545]

That's very overkill for a local friendly tournament, I'd understand huge events but being a dick to people you see at least weekly is crappy behaviour.

[@br42]

There's always talk about cheating, but very little talk about what you should do if you've realized what you should do if you've made a mistake. e.g. you switched your army list up at the last minute, but forget and come with the old loadout, and get part of the way through your first game. What do you do? I suggest you immediately concede, and explain to your opponent why, and then go talk to the TO and explain your mistake, and see how they want to handle it. I think these are more useful discussions to have than about intentional cheating itself.

[@morerobotwarscontent1476]

I do not think I've ever had someone cheat against me on purpose. However I did play back in 4th and 5th where every other tournament game was against someone who would only correct mistakes if it hurt their chance to win.

[@elliottwarner-wright3297]

As a new player, I only started about four-ish months ago, I have a hard time remembering stats and I've brought data cards, etc to try and help, The last game I played I had two squads of inceptors when I was making my list I planned for them to be plasma as I've been struggling to deal with vehicles so when I got into round my first round of shooting and looked at their weapons stats I felt so dumb (they were using Bolters). I had added extra units to other squads thinking I had lots of leftover points to spend. I outright said to my opponent that I meant for them to be plasma but I knew my costs would mean I would be way over the 2000 ish point game and declared I'd play on with my fuck up I did lose, I don't think I'm a good player but I'm trying to play to the best of my ability. My first army is Space marines Blood angels I'm feeling that I'm not using my army well at all. Idk writing this I feel like I'm being harsh on myself. (Side note I play at a small club that opens late and I feel like I have to rush myself going over my stats which immediately go out of my head plus rules constantly to make sure my game ends when they close for the day, I feel like this is purely a new player thing)

[@mrbearbear83]

Once bought loaded dice. A couple of issues: They were HUGE, like obviously something sus. They glowed in the dark They rolled "doggy style" a lot No wait, they might have been sex dice

[@exquisitecorpse4917]

As a magician, loaded dice are both rare and easy to spot. Weighted dice are much-discussed but extremely rare in the wild because they're hard to make and not terribly effective since they don't roll like regular dice. You can see them flopping clumsily on their weighted side; it's very obvious because dice roll while weights plop. The more common cheat dice just have desirable numbers printed on more than one side: Eliminate 2, add a second 6, that kind of thing. The easiest to find is a die with all 5s because it rolls 7s and 11s in craps. The good news is that any pre-made loaded dice you can find are going to be joke-shop stuff that's easy to see. And if someone's nefarious enough to custom-make an entire set of misprint dice with extra 6s and pass them off as genuine? They'll be caught eventually when someone sees the double 6, and you've got to give it to them for working harder on their cheat scheme than their Warhammer game.

[@Douglas-nt7jd]

I had a guy playing a vanilla space marine list. He kept trying to roll the dice for all his 5 man squad at the same time then picking which one was the plasma gun.

[@ryanrogers8923]

Ya I feel bead about this one, as I messed up pretty bad one time. I used a full unit of DG terminators to charge and destroy an enemy tank, it all went well, until after the game someone mentioned that the tank was a flyer (Eldar) and I missed it. It was not on a bass, and I wasn't thinking bout it. Still bummes me out to this day. So ya, I used jumping Blightlord Terminators, lol.

[@Whereisthefall]

Was doing a friendly game withy roommate, was testing a big list and went to my first turn to fire the guns on my exocrine, realized it actually hadn't made the cut in the actual list and had to inform my opponent that the exocrine spontaneously combusted when it tried to fire it's guns

[@eldoriath1]

Had a similar ting happen long ago in a tournament. We forgot that my devilfish's smart missile system had been destroyed and I had used it to kill an important model from him. We only remembered this a bit into his following movement phase. In fairness I had other units left after that would had killed it rather than some other model, but on the spot I said "okay, so the devilfish is destroyed due to the impossible happening, is that okay?". This was back when tau skimmers were hard as nails and killing the opponents army was how you scored points. The guy accepted this as feeling fair and we just kept playing. Sometimes these things happen. Like picking up dice for a storm bolter more than you actually had in the unit, rolling awesome only to remember it and re-rolling all of it only to score 1/4 of the damage even if you only went from 20 to 16 shots xD

[@UserNamedNone]

Dice aren't the same and they are always lopsided weight wise. I always got passed this by rolling the same dice the person hit with. Roll 5 dice, two are wounding. I roll those same two wound dice for the save. That way, if they were loaded, then the save rolls are loaded too. Fair for everyone, loaded or oddly weighted dice make no difference.

[@vulkan1179]

Toy soldiers. TOY SOLDIERS!!!! Well I'll have you know they're real to me lol.

[@GrasshopperKelly]

I'm very relaxed when it comes to proxy. Especially as I know some of the guys I'm playing against are four, five, six, even 10 years younger than me. They have what they just spent their first pay cheque or their pocket money on, or what they got for Christmas etc. They might not have a model fully built yet and just want to have a little fun while in the store, or don't know if they even like a model before they buy it etc. But I always make sure the players I'm with know or are even happy for me to put a half built and half painted vehicle or character on the table, or multiple of them. 99% of the local lads are very friendly and relaxed, and the only "competition" I've done it at was a very relaxed charity even organised by mostly store regulars. Very relaxed rules anyway. I also don't mind people mixing up their armies a tiny bit as well. I rarely play the same identical list twice. Even if I'm only mixing up 10 points worth, or half the 2k pts army.

[@TheGainfulGamer]

I have some GW Eye of Sauron dice I call lucky, because they roll extremely well for me. I often try to give them to my friends to roll well as well, but for some reason they don't roll well for them. Normally that gets the call outs to stop, since I allow them to try my dice if they would like.

[@Gozokukolat]

There was a guy at my LGS that would put his minis to one side after they died... and would spontaneously resurrect where he placed them during his turn.