Shamsi: ❝Prophet ‎ﷺ can NOT help others nor himself!!!❞ Speakers Corner @DUSDawah

Speakers corner Shamsi misuses the verse and belittle the Prophet ‎ﷺ abilities. Istighasa debate
#spubs #mohammedhijab #shamsi #salafi #madkhali #bidah #islam #danielhaqiqatjou #speakerscorner #tawassul

[@MohammadQasim]

Note: My contention is lack of respect and acknowledgement of the Prophet ‎ﷺ benefit whilst he was alive. (After death he benefits too such as returning of Salam etc *however thats not the issue of contention right now)*

[@alu177]

S alaykom br, Im a Shia Raafidhi, and i totally agree with you on this matter of the prophet of Islam being able to help during and after his life by the will n permission from Allah swt, My question is After the prophet of Islam, he said he is leaving behind 2 weighty matters, The Qur'an and Ahlulbayt Known as hadith Thaqalayn... So like the Quran is Alive today so too must be his Ahlulbayt a.s Your view? Thank you

[@MohammadQasim]

@@alu177 Hi, when you say the ahlul bayt must be alive in the sense in the world then this is problematic because the text doesnt say that, this is an assertion. Even if we were instructed to follow the ahlul bayt they dont have to be alive for us to follow them just like Prophet sallahu alayhi wa salam isnt alive in the world but alive in barzakh. 2) Now lets look at the hadith together - , but I am leaving among you two weighty things: the one being the Book of Allah in which there is right guidance and light, so hold fast to the Book of Allah and adhere to it. He exhorted (us) (to hold fast) to the Book of Allah and then said: The second are the members of my household I remind you (of your duties) to the members of my family. Sahih Muslim 2408a وَأَنَا تَارِكٌ فِيكُمْ ثَقَلَيْنِ أَوَّلُهُمَا كِتَابُ اللَّهِ فِيهِ الْهُدَى وَالنُّورُ فَخُذُوا بِكِتَابِ اللَّهِ وَاسْتَمْسِكُوا بِهِ ‏"‏ ‏.‏ فَحَثَّ عَلَى كِتَابِ اللَّهِ وَرَغَّبَ فِيهِ ثُمَّ قَالَ ‏"‏ وَأَهْلُ بَيْتِي أُذَكِّرُكُمُ اللَّهَ فِي أَهْلِ بَيْتِي أُذَكِّرُكُمُ اللَّهَ فِي أَهْلِ بَيْتِي أُذَكِّرُكُمُ اللَّهَ فِي أَهْلِ بَيْتِي ‏"‏ ‏.‏ From this narration its clear whats being told is have consideration for the ahlul bayt and care for them etc... it doesn't actually mention follow them. Note: I'm not against following them since there's clear virtues of the rank of Fatima, Ali, Hassan ,Hussain.... I also want to point out if you notice in the quran Allah includes the wives to be ahlul bayt too, unfortunately your community, doesn't consider them included.(see quran 33:33 and the verse before and after and the arabic pronouns which are feminine plural) Lastly we have been told to also follow Abu bakr and umar aswell as the sunnah, so we cant ignore these texts we take a wholistic outlook with all of its sources. (you may have noticed the lengthy response and i usually don't do it but i think it was important to respond to your genuine friendly question, i wish guidance for you and I'm sure you wish it for me. May Allah grant us Guidance Ameen

[@alu177]

@MohammadQasim Thank you brother for that reply, Looking at hadith Thaqalayn and the actual wordings said by the prophet of Islam, one CANNOT go by the narration stated in Muslim as the full accurate words of the prophet of Islam, rather Zayd only gave a summary to what he could remember for several reasons, 1. If you see when Zayd bin Arqam was asked about the hadith, he himself acknowledged that he has become old and has forgotten alot due to his old age. 2. If you pay attention, Zayd states that the prophet gave a sermon in Khumm, and we ALL agree that in that event of Ghadeer Khumm the prophet famously said من كنت مولاه فهذا علي مولاه Why is this statement not in that particular narration from zayd in Sahih Muslim? Because zayd forgot it. Therefore this whole narration in sahih Muslim cannot be taken as it is, rather we need to look at other reliable sources to get the full proper version/wordings of the prophet regarding the two weighty matters. Hope I'm clear, Hope to hear your response. بارك الله فيكم وجزاكم الله خيرا

[@MohammadQasim]

@alu177 What do you think zayd رض forgot? And which other sources would you like to quote? And what is overall point that you are trying to make Thanks

[@alu177]

@MohammadQasim Ahsant, Before we can stipulate/deduce if the prophet left the ahlulbayt JUST for us to care, love and respect them, We need to know the actual wordings of the prophet of Islam related to hadith Thaqalayn... As A Shia Raafidhi, i am amazed how the Sunnis will go by the narration in sahih Muslim and close the door on that. You will find hadith Thaqalayn in many many other sahih narrations...from Sunni books (not Shia!!!) ... Now this comment section is not allowing me to copy n paste the sources and the actual narrations But please refer to e.g Tafseer Ibn Kathir vol 12 pg 271 His famous book البداية و النهاية vol 7 pg 688 Mustradrak Hakim vol 3 pg 109 (I cannot type out all the sources on my phone) many others... These 3 sources above are all from Zayd bin Arqam, all sahih... Please check out the wordings in them, and if you accept them we can move onto the meaning دلائل of the hadith In shaa Allah At your service. Thank you

[@Nawaf-qk9mu]

He's right. Narrated `Umar: I heard the Prophet (ﷺ) saying, "Do not exaggerate in praising me as the Christians praised the son of Mary, for I am only a Slave. So, call me the Slave of Allah and His Apostle." Narrated 'Aisha: Abu Bakr said: "Amma ba'du, whoever amongst you worshipped Muhammad, then Muhammad is dead, but whoever worshipped Allah, Allah is alive and will never die. Allah said: 'Muhammad is no more than an Apostle and indeed (many) Apostles have passed away before him ..(up to the) grateful.' " The prophet peace be upon him is but a servant of the Almighty, and now he is dead. The dead cannot do anything.

[@MohammadQasim]

He said whilst he was alive

[@MohammadQasim]

Those hadith dont disprove he can also benefit after death

[@Nawaf-qk9mu]

@@MohammadQasim And whilst he was alive he also cannot do anything a human can't do, except with God's permission. Just like when the Jews asked him about the story of Dhul Qarnayn, he said I will tell you tommorow but didn't say Inshallah. Then this ayah was revealed: And never say of anything, "Indeed, I will do that tomorrow," (23) Except [when adding], "If Allāh wills." And remember your Lord when you forget [it] and say, "Perhaps my Lord will guide me to what is nearer than this to right conduct." [Al Kahf 23-2] There are many examples in the Quran to show that the prophet is just a man like all of is and the miracles he shows are from Allah not from himself. Indeed, [O Muḥammad], you do not guide whom you like, but Allāh guides whom He wills. And He is most knowing of the [rightly] guided. [Al Qassas: 56] Etc.

[@Nawaf-qk9mu]

@@MohammadQasim He cannot benefit after death. If he could the companions would have called upon him. But they didn't. Are you more knowledgeable in the deen than the companions?

[@MohammadQasim]

@@Nawaf-qk9mu we have narrations that the salaf did.

[@SunMoon477]

😂😂😂

[@shiney94]

I hate shamsi, but i agree with him here. The prophet will not be able to help us on judgement day by covering our sins. in the quran there is a verse which says that in judgement day no soul shall be able to have 'shafaa' (aid) from any other soul. It's basically you and your deeds.

[@MohammadQasim]

Unfortunately you contradicted what the Messenger ‎ﷺ said and in your understanding of the verse theres a flaw. Lets begin by presenting the hadith: see Narrated by Al-Bukhari, 7510) i will present a portion of it - "...They would come to me and I would say, 'I am for that.' Then I will ask for my Lord's permission, and it will be given, and then He will inspire me to praise Him with such praises as I do not know now. So I will praise Him with those praises and will fall down, prostrate before Him. Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for your will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' And then it will be said, 'Go and take out of Hell (Fire) all those who have faith in their hearts, equal to the...

[@MohammadQasim]

In the quran it actually mentions this: quran 20:109 - That Day, no intercession will benefit *except [that of] one to whom the Most Merciful has given permission and has accepted his word.* Exception is mentioned. I hope you take back the comment brother

[@shiney94]

@@MohammadQasim I am talking about quran though; let me show you the verse. "Guard yourselves against the Day on which no soul will be of help to another. No intercession1 will be accepted, no ransom taken, and no help will be given."-2:48 It is haram to think that the prophet has some superpower that he can decide the faith of the believers. The only role the prophet has is that he will beg Allah (swta) to start the judgement quicker because everyone will be in immense heat as the sun will be closer to the earth. But as far as the prophet interceeding to help muslims out of hell, this is wrong and against islam.

[@shiney94]

@@MohammadQasim wait, let me read this verse. I didn't recall it. I will put my statement on hold for now, given i wasn't aware of this verse.

[@shiney94]

@@MohammadQasim hmmm.... I see, I guess there are exceptions. But as a general rule most people will not be able to intervene, it will be very minority I guess.

[@KingKhan-eg9lq]

My brother Mohammed hijab please educate shami the silly zoinistz wahabi keep on roaring my lion keep ali dawa in line starting to go off course bad influences Adnan Rashid another top man

[@uzairbrooks7420]

Where do you learn English?

[@funvidz4you405]

Let me guess, you’re either from Pakistan, Turkey or India. Tell me I’m wrong.

[@KingKhan-eg9lq]

@@funvidz4you405 a Sherlock Holmes’s 😜

[@KingKhan-eg9lq]

@@uzairbrooks7420 if you had a half loaf you would know it’s shamis college 😝