Should Mother be Charged in 'Spoiled Brat' 105 mph Fatal Collision? | Kiernan Tague Case Analysis

[@Sailrjup12nh]

He should never been allowed to drive the car, but he is an adult in a court of law and he needs to be held 100% accountable.

[@alicecoppers8980]

take his inheritance for victims family

[@Grelotmystiqueetal]

No she let him drove HER vehicle.

[@punkaakee]

Both are 100% responsible for the death of the passenger

[@chcarroll5164]

@@Grelotmystiqueetal As the owner of the vehicle she is certainly exposed to civil liability, but her knowledge that her boy has demonstrated a profound capability for irresponsible driving doesn't look good for a criminal defense.

[@thomson872]

​@@mysock351C The father is dead. Didn't you watch the video??? He stated that within the first minute!

[@sunnygirl9691]

Released on bail?? WHY did she get him out!?!?! This is a clear sign of him never facing consequences for his behavior EVER throughout his upbringing.

[@enjoystraveling]

He should’ve had no bail since it wasn’t just one time but many times and very high over the speed limit.

[@coweatsman]

Why was he granted bail? I don't know about the US but in Australia bail can be refused for 3 reasons. That the defendant is a danger to the public, that the public is a danger to the defendant or that the defendant is likely to abscond.

[@julzmusic8708]

@@coweatsmancan guarantee you this doesn’t happen in Melbourne. That 14 year old with over 200+ charges, (the one filming the hit and run on beach road that gave the cyclists life-long injuries) + multiple aggravated burglaries keeps getting bailed. Then there’s the one who his parents are so scared of they have boarded up their house and put locks 🔐 on all of their doors, who keeps getting bailed. The hard part is in a lot of these cases the parents are BEGGING for the courts to stop bailing their horrible murderous children, but the courts keep letting them go with zero consequence, so they can go out and continue committing crimes. I personally think any magistrate that bails a child or adult and they reoffend should have to pay for all ongoing expenses or outcomes based on the crime and any mental/physical damages for those involved for the rest of their lives… that might change the system a bit ❤

[@bromack3]

I remember my mom once telling me when I was a teenager, if you get arrested, understand I don't have any money to bail you out.

[@AngelinoShred]

I guess she's not as afraid of him as she said she was

[@loganzintsmaster4418]

Flynn was my best friend since childhood and such a beautiful soul in this world, his massive stature made him the most gentle giant. This situation has broken my family, the MacKrell family and the city of grosse pointe to the core. I miss Flynn more and more every day and I hope one day to see him again, to all who are behind the wheel, please be safe and drive responsible.🧡🧡

[@hildeschmid8400]

I am so sorry.😢

[@finleys_mama5891]

Really sorry for your loss.😢 Thanks for reminding us that we're speaking about real people and real loss.

[@noriwilliams4637]

Sorry for your terrible loss

[@sarabrittlegill9587]

Sorry for your loss.

[@thisisanaussiegal3590]

what is your opinion on Elizabeth being charged given your close relationship to the victim?

[@funnydonor9484]

It’s always the passenger that dies instead of the reckless driver. Terrible

[@ckp2ator389]

I’ve heard that as well, and that it’s because in the last few milliseconds the driver will take the action instinctively that will preserve their life.

[@williamSmith-fv5hi]

In the old day the front right was called the "suicide seat". ☹

[@kiiltochii1607]

How do you know that Flynn wasnt encouraging the speeding?

[@sylviekins]

@@kiiltochii1607well the driver had sped many times before, without encouragement. Are you now blaming the dead boy?

[@BLUEEYESLIKETHEOCEAN-ql8kw]

​@@kiiltochii1607, the driver is in charge of that vehicle, NOT the passenger.

[@Ocean1688]

Would have never bailed him out…..let him sit there.

[@stephaniehowe0973]

Told a boyfriend back in the day and my kids. You get arrested expect you are staying the night.

[@Annii_Oakley_]

Worked for me. The time my parents didn’t get me out was the last time I ever went. 17 years and counting…

[@Rummy893]

Why?

[@fionamackie3357]

​@@stephaniehowe0973I never even had to say it. My kids KNOW categorically I'll be far worse than the law on them.

[@nata3467]

he was physically abusive - and an asshole. I would NEVER have allowed him continued access to any of my vehicles, not paid for his insurance. He sounds like a pyschopath

[@ginamarie2349]

Can you imagine what hell this boy will inflict on any future girlfriend/wife? He’s a nightmare!

[@SoundofSilence492]

He left boyhood and adolescence long ago. He is an older teen, almost an adult. It minimizes his guilt to refer to him as a boy.

[@grossliz1995]

He will have a nice prison "girlfriend" now.

[@Kat_Stewart]

Im sure he doesn’t feel good about this either. Who would?

[@Kevin_Rhodes]

@@Kat_Stewart Affluenza sufferers rarely have much in the way of remorse.

[@Kat_Stewart]

@@Kevin_Rhodes I’m not going to assume how he feels. It’s terrible for everyone involved.

[@annajohnson2367]

This was in my community. There is a HUGE problem with speeding here, especially by the more affluent teens. My little sister was biking home just recently and was hit by a reckless teen not paying attention. Thank God she’s fine. Thank you for covering this Dr. Grande! I was hoping after this happened that you would

[@DamePiglet]

Perhaps law enforcement should be more strict

[@annajohnson2367]

@@DamePigletit should. It’s absurd. If you ask Me? People in grosse pointe with “connections” get let off the hook often. I was picking my sisters up from school 2 years ago when a student missed a stop sign, sideswiped me, and totaled my car. Police didn’t give her a ticket bc it was “too close to the holidays”. Anyways. At least insurance came through for me

[@AMRARDvermebrungruppe]

​@@DamePiglet it's illegal to fine, cite, or arrest rich people

[@jenm9099]

Best justice money can buy!

[@JanBruunAndersen]

​@@DamePiglet - be more strict? Won't happen. Law enforcement is too busy harassing people for victimless crimes.

[@billflipper1130]

Enabling bad behavior in a child is so dangerous. I've seen so many parents love their child to death.

[@davidwilliams7552]

Yes this is why ai argue against people who say that all children need is kindness..... sometimes they need to be told to get their act together.

[@kimstringfellow6493]

That’s not love

[@Jesus_equals_LOVEnForgviness]

So many parents love their child to other people's deaths.

[@Reyma777]

The mother in this case was afraid of her son, whom she probably spoiled from a young age.

[@jbug1979]

in this case, she loved someone else's child to death.

[@melodiebear]

By this reasoning Judges who let criminals out on bail that are clear dangers should also be held accountable.

[@notchback93]

There was a Teenager in my town that had multiple vehicle crashes and violations due to his reckless behavior. Husband and wife were divorced and the father had decided not to purchase the son another car due to him wrecking 3 separate cars. So the mother decided to purchase him a then brand new Subaru WRX. This happened in a believe October of 2007 So one day the high school had closed unexpectedly due to some flooding from a busted pipe. All the students end up across town hanging out at a local golf course parking lot. The son decides to show off how fast his car is, with his younger sister and her best friend in the car. At about 85 mph he mistakenly crashed into a truck.He misjudged the distance and speed of the vehicle and turned directly into the front of the truck, he and the other 2 passengers were killed instantly and from what I’ve been told by cops who were at the scene everyone in the car were unrecognizable. So then the mother who purchased him the car went out and sued everyone one she could, the driver of the truck, the manufacturer of the car he was driving,the owner of the parking lot that the kids were hanging out at, etc etc. she never once took responsibility for her basically enabling her son to cause a another reckless accident that killed both her children and a innocent girl who was unlucky enough to be in the car, it happened in Wolcott CT in 2007 I believe. The kid driving also had a suspended license at the time

[@NutsItsBerserkinTime]

I found the story the driver was 17 year old Anthony Apruzzese his sister Jessica and her friend Thamara.

[@linsioux217]

"Apruzzese, his 14-year-old sister, Jessica and a 15-year-old friend Thamara Correa died when their Subaru collided with utility truck on East Street after clipping the back of a boat being towed, said Wolcott police Capt. Domenic Angiolillo".

[@NutsItsBerserkinTime]

I found the story the driver was 17 year old Anthony Apruzzese his sister Jessica and her friend Thamara. It’s ridiculous that the mom and thamara’s families sued the truck driver when Anthony was driving 70 in a 45 mph zone.

[@childrenpraisegod1230]

#4:49 Can a hidden tracker switch disconnect the power to the car starter to cut out the power ABOVE speed limits? I heard some people's cars demobilised if above set speed limits.

[@rabbit9905]

​@childrenpraisegod1230 this sounds pretty dangerous on its own. Sure you don't want your kid going 100+, but what if they're doing it on the highway and their car shuts off. Now they're stopped on a busy highway with a disabled vehicle.

[@ddoperations2768]

If that had been my son he’d never drive my vehicle again. F that.

[@YouTube4me]

Exactly!!!!

[@everydaywithsandra]

Seriously

[@laurachavez8724]

Honestly though, he sounds like a psychopath. But yeah, it does sounds like he didn’t suffer any consequences for his previous bad behavior.

[@valjohnson1927]

Impulsive

[@onemoremisfit]

So you'd only cut him off from your own car but still let him keep his license on your signature?

[@carolinelief9132]

The police also knew he was out of control...

[@katbar6066]

but they couldn't stop him driving unless they caught him speeding or breaking the law.

[@markusallport1276]

They can only do so much, they aren't raising the child, the parents are.

[@Hummerbird99]

The police don't have the power to stop anyone like that. They can arrest people and that is pretty much it.

[@sananselmospacescienceodys7308]

The tragedy is that the wrong person died in the accident.

[@YouTube4me]

That always seems to happen too 😢

[@christy4062]

Exactly

[@summrflowers7253]

This is a really unproductive comment. Not to mention you shouldn't wish that anyone suffered a fatality.

[@anneleeuwen2105]

​@summrflowers7253 mmmm... really

[@holaizzy]

​​​i don't think the comment was wishing fatality on anyone. Just saying that IF someone did suffer fatality, it was the wrong person.

[@Planetside223]

No. The judges and officials who failed to put him in jail or remove his license should be put in jail

[@paulaunger3061]

Absolutely! The state had a duty and it failed shamefully.

[@janewright315]

Finally some common sense.

[@HH-in9im]

The mother has been through much with her son. No way should she be further punished.

[@bedlambikes]

Well stated.

[@Lightbarer6]

Put in jail? lol

[@shawnaweesner3759]

Kiernan’s mother could have taken the keys to her BMW with her, and/or put a steering wheel lock on her car, or a wheel lock on her car.

[@OxfordCommas79]

Kids can be sneaky.

[@PinkAgaricus]

​@@OxfordCommas79Adults, too, we had a case down here where a guy that lived with his parents that was barred from driving still drove without a license and ended up killing a high school student in a crosswalk. While the road planning for a "boulevard" could be blamed, everything and everyone failed everyone, not just the deceased, but normal law abiding citizens. Even if we have our license we tend to throw most of what we learned in drivers ed out the window once we "graduate" and behave like people who deserve their ability to drive taken away (especially speeders and dui'ers and oftentimes both combined are the cause of motor vehicle accidents).

[@QueertyUCR]

He beat her...

[@galndixie]

Also could have purchased a remote disabler to stop the vehicle.

[@markusallport1276]

So many things she could have done to prevent this. Sometimes the more money you have, impairs the ability to do or learn basic things.

[@susannpatton2893]

Yes. These affluent kids need to be held accountable for their own actions

[@culcune]

Afluenza is real!

[@cashkitty3472]

I don't think it matters if they are affluent or not. Your clasism is showing. Jealously is not a good luck

[@combustiblerush4ever]

@@cashkitty3472Not a good Luck! Your inexperience and ignorance is showing and I smell shit. So it sounds like you don’t know how to think… Obviously because you don’t understand how the world really turns. Cash kitty, I first imagined gold digging only fans tramp, then I thought disgusting incel troll living amongst filth, urine bottles, and take out boxes, but then I just hoped, by the sliver of faith that your name is inspired by maneki-neko, but, ultimately I smelled a cat house on a hot summer day. So yeah your probably nothing like any of those, somehow your something worse then all that. Something with no hope of being anything redeemable in society. Like a turd that clogged a toilet, and somehow your poopy arm reaches to flush that toilet, and you keep flushing, eventually you flood the filthy gas station restroom you were dropped in, and now your free of the drain you are destined for but forever a drain on society. Floating about in your own fecal matter paradise. Your paradise, everyone else’s shit show nightmare. Good look… 💩

[@Sirormaamthisisamcscreech]

@@cashkitty3472I think you miss the whole point, which is not surprising at all, based on your comment. No one cares about how much money you have. If you are a garbage human, you deserve to be held accountable regardless of how much money your parents have. Money can’t buy life, respect, or in your case the ability to spell. Do better.

[@rubyfisch5077]

It's not the money, it's the utter lack of parenting that creates these A-holes. People seem to forget that parent is a verb, not just a noun. I'm sure there are lots of poor kids that get into just as much trouble if they have weak parents.

[@bandit_six5418]

Sounds like he treated his mother like shit and was an absolute menace to society. Unfortunately, someone else has died because of his actions.

[@jacko4483]

I think after a few weeks in the penitentiary he'll be wishing he was the one who died. Momma ain't gonna be there for you kiddo.

[@pocho689]

His upbringing was a HUGE factor on how he turned out!

[@Trammiliin_nr2]

This someone else was a grown man who was fully aware of Kiernan's driving habits and yet decided to go speeding with him. I'd say Flynn was Kiernan's accomplice.

[@uNiels_Heart]

@@Trammiliin_nr2 Yeah, I was wondering that, too. If they were friends, he should've been aware of Kiernan's reckless and dangerous driving habits. Maybe he even told his parents, depending on how close and trusting their relationship was, but I guess we'll never know.

[@obaanshira3797]

@@pocho689No, his sister turned out fine. The boy was just evil in nature.

[@KE-xj9vm]

Unfortunately there isn’t much support for parents of troubled kids. And it’s easy to point the finger at their parenting but some kids are just bad eggs.

[@linmorell1813]

And some are never given boundaries

[@markusallport1276]

You're joking right? You can't possibly believe that!? Open your eyes and look all around you. Mental health clinics are all around us!

[@autumnaltumn]

Exactly. The daughter seemed to have turned out right.

[@leannegarnett3777]

This mother is an enabler. Give me a break.

[@MS-pm9fe]

Agreed

[@alexandramail930]

Congrats on 1 and a half million Dr G!

[@shelleyperchward1832]

Congratulations Dr. Grande! You have great content

[@kathleenrogers10]

I have only recently discovered this channel. Dr. G is so low key. I will tune in a few more times before taking the plunge.

[@mi2b824]

And thank you for not letting it go to your head and developing a personality of your own. Bleep blorp 🤖

[@jarls5890]

Breaking news about the case, reported only a few hours ago: "Michigan officials have requested a warrant for a relative of a teen accused of killing an 18-year-old star swimmer in a horror crash - as the victim's parents demand the driver's mom be held accountable for the tragedy."

[@carpathianken]

When you say "officials" are you referring to MacKrell's family badgering Wayne county prosecutors to pursue criminal charges against the killer drivers mother? Emotions of the families are highly extreme at this stage when their son is killed in a car MVA, especially when negligence or speed is involved. In the next town over from me a guy killed his friend in a car accident that involved speeding ,so do you know what the father of the son that got killed in the accident did? He went & killed the drivers mother before killing himself & the killer driver still got sentenced to a long stint in prison on top of having his mother murdered.

[@FH-lg9oc]

@@carpathianken Eye for an eye

[@turnkeydirect]

Can you imagine if all the single mothers of murderers and carjackers were held accountable for their kids’ intentional brutality?

[@peteywheatstraws4909]

​@@carpathianken If it was known by the parent that wreckless driving was a standard practice, then the mother enabled him. It's not about "badgering a prosecuter", it's about being held accountable for actions or inaction.

[@Jujubean9795]

⁠​⁠@@turnkeydirectcan you imagine if all the fathers that abandoned their children would be held accountable for the actions of their offspring? The fact that they neglected to raise their own children, makes them equally responsible for their outcome. HOLD both parents accountable!

[@Just_Another_Youtube_User-i6k]

I grew up in a very rural and wooded area with lots of windy, narrow back roads. The High School I went to had lost many students over the years due to reckless driving. I still remember being in the backseat of friend's cars and being utterly terrified by how fast some of them would go down the roads. Every young male in my area thought they were the next rally car champion. It really taught me the value of safe speeds. I got my first car at 16, a 2006 Ford Mustang. Even at such a young age, I knew well and truly not to fuck around. There was a line you just didn't cross. Not if you wanted to come back alive. One of my proudest achievements was never pulling a single ticket during my ownership of that car. The only time I ever really felt comfortable putting my foot down was on the highways. I was once driving home from a weekend away and found myself on a desolate highway without another car in sight. I decided that I was going to floor it to see what my Mustang could do. I got to 100mph before I became so frightened that I had to slow down. I cannot imagine doing 100mph+ on a residential street. The sheer lunacy of it. ZERO survival instinct. I hope that kid never gets another peaceful night's sleep again.

[@elizabethcloutman8913]

@@Just_Another_KZbin_User-i6k Yes, his rage seemed to be destructive not only against his mom, but self-destructive.

[@wot4me2]

Exactly- thank you.

[@Weirdkauz]

Well, he killed his best friend, so... no, I guess he won't. (Smirk)

[@stevemiller1517]

Twice the speed= 4 times the kinetic energy.

[@alaakela]

A Ford Mustang at age 16? A Ford Mustang. At age 16. There is something off with your story.

[@TeresaADrake]

Wow.....sounds like another narcissistic psychopath to me. 😡

[@carynmartin6053]

It's in the drinking water!😮

[@carynmartin6053]

It's all the chemicals in the drinking water and food!

[@ceiling-deskfan]

What would the internet do without these people?

[@chudleyflusher7132]

Absolutely! Pure MAGA.

[@coweatsman]

We live in an age when narcissism is praised and applauded. Just look at major influencers from billionaires down to tik tokers,

[@ammiller3911]

I actually feel sorta bad for his mom. Sounds like her son was a nightmare. Tracking him and calling the police on him is more than some parents would do. My only question is why leave the key?

[@kenmore01]

Agreed. He should never have had a key.

[@aaliyahbeeby]

Son was probably a nightmare because of mom.

[@Raggamuffinz917]

You're right about the key. His mother seemed to terrified of him though, like scared for her safety levels of afraid. I could see a kid this unhinged threatening to kill her or actually killing her if he didn't get his way on something he clearly loved which was her car.

[@greenseadream]

Her daughter sounded fine.

[@Woozlewuzzleable]

@@aaliyahbeeby Some people are just Aholes, even when they come from a good family.

[@jessicarakowicz1627]

Sure, she knew about the danger for awhile, but he was aggressive to her. She called the police many times already. I think that plays in a lot here.

[@helenestiernstrand6575]

💯

[@lauren9004]

Why was he aggressive towards her though? Probably because he knew she wouldn't do anything because she's a trash mother. This is not a domestic violence case between spouses. She's literally his MOTHER.

[@dyslexiccowoom3991]

​@lauren9004 way to blame the victim there champ. "He can't possibly just be aggressive, angry, and violent when he doesn't get what he wants! She must've done something to provoke him!"

[@markusallport1276]

Excuse me, She called the police many times? That makes no sense at all when she was the one to bail him out. She is wholly responsible for allowing him to drive her car, for driving at all. She was an enabler for not taking action to prevent this tragedy from taking place. It starts when the child is a toddler. If you can't control your child, then you need the counseling to learn how to deal with it and how to gain control over your own child.

[@christinelitvak6427]

I think that in this case you could quote the adage, "It takes ten minutes to become a parent and more than eighteen years to deal with that mistake."

[@jskillet8912]

Man it can take a lot less than 10 minutes 😅

[@djk0125]

That is not helpful.

[@clarissa8477]

I don’t see my children as mistakes.

[@nadinewhite993]

​@@clarissa8477 It's not that the children are mistakes, it's that their parents are not competent.

[@lukeymuffler6265]

@@clarissa8477 And Kiernan's parents would say the same about Kiernan.

[@captainsewerrat]

So....20+ police interactions and the cops did nothing?

[@Louis1059]

Privileged white male. Fits the bill.

[@terrorists-are-among-us]

Exactly. They knew. They had more power than she did. They did nothing. So file charges against the police!

[@kenmore01]

Yep, checks out.

[@coyotetu]

This is the real story behind crime statistics that WS love citing.

[@LifesAPeach2Me]

Unless the police are being filmed and/or the case has gone viral...the police don't give a shit!

[@donnahoman5632]

Thanks! Your videos are always interesting and well presented. I love your humor too.

[@missylynns8966]

3 minutes in I’m screaming ‘take away his license and lock up your dang keys lady!’

[@katiefrankie6]

Right??? He may still try to drive, but it won’t be your car because those keys are gone!

[@LBdreamin]

Fatherless behavior (They divorced and then the father passed away)

[@The-Oneness11]

​@@LBdreaminUnfortunately she didn't have any help.

[@alesia7470]

She can't just take his license.

[@lolazal1]

She was afraid of him, and can't take his licence. Buy she may have been able to withhold her car keys.

[@gazoontight]

No. He was out of control, violent, and his mother was afraid of him. He is old enough to know right from wrong, and people today are babied way too long in their lives. He is responsible for his own deeds.

[@fornx8574]

agreed, according to the video, he hits his own mom and destroys her property

[@kjean8605]

He definitely should be held fully responsible for his own actions, but the mother should have done better. Whether or not she is responsible legally, she bears some responsibility logically. She should have taken her car keys with her when she left town. For that matter, if his car was in her name, she should have taken those keys too. He shouldn’t have had access to a car, period. Who could have taken his keys to protect society from him? Only her. I feel for her that he was a menace, but again, she was an adult with resources. She had a reasonable duty to protect others from him. Sounds like he needed a bicycle.

[@charliechurch5004]

😂 afraid of him???? Hell no!! She's the mom, she's responsible

[@charliechurch5004]

​@@kjean8605imo they are both responsible

[@fornx8574]

@@charliechurch5004 bro the son would beat her and break her stuff. just because you and I never had to deal with that dose not mean it is all fictional.

[@leilanicorbelle]

This one kinda hits home - when I was 15 my 18-year-old friend accidentally killed his best friend when he rolled the car doing 90+ in his neighborhood. He hit a speed bump and couldn’t (or didn’t) slow down in time. It sucked for everyone involved for a long time, but I think he only got probation with no jail time. Just really makes you think how everything can change in an instant with no warning, especially when you are being careless.

[@blkcat93]

That mom was suffering from battered woman syndrome. When he didn't get his way he lashed at her. He needs to be locked up for murder.

[@mikeswanson6145]

She suffered from bad parenting. Should have brought a father figure into his life and stopped spoiling him. She is a despicable person for bailing him out

[@francescawilliams8177]

And yet when she got the chance to be away from him , she bailed him out

[@drummingtildeath]

@@mikeswanson6145 her husband died dude wtf

[@dirtinmyeye6505]

I was wondering if she could use battered syndrome for a defense. Seems he was dangerous for more than the road.

[@KRistyrose978]

@@mikeswanson6145 and how do you just bring a father figure into some trouble teens life at the drop of a hat? I think his dad died less than a year before this accident ,not much of a turnaround

[@bunberrier]

No she isnt criminally liable. Its long past time for him to be accountable for his own actions. However, his mother failed miserably and is open to a civil lawsuit.

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

Curious why the driver’s mom would be liable but not the victim’s parents who also knew of the driver’s reckless behavior but still allowed their son to go with him knowing he was driving the vehicle. Does this not work in both directions?

[@shawnaweesner3759]

To @bunberrier: I agree.

[@shawnaweesner3759]

@@barnabusdoyle4930 I commented that, too.

[@VaeluX]

​@@barnabusdoyle4930 who provided access to the deadly weapon to the mansaghterer? That is the person is is liable via criminal negligence. Hope that clears it up for you

[@sandraboyd7468]

@@barnabusdoyle4930along with the cops whom the mother called.

[@MetsterAnn]

Sounds like she was abused by her son. Domestic violence is not only between intimate partners. Maybe something went wrong when her husband died. However, she should never have left the keys when she was out of town. It is possible she thought the BMW was safer than their other car, but she didn’t consider him crashing into others. This is not like Ethan’s parents, who were completely neglectful. She seemed to think reasoning would work, and was obviously too afraid of him to stand up to him. I imagine there were many incidents of domestic violence. Don’t they have highway patrol in Michigan? How can somebody drive 125 mph for over 20 miles and nobody notices? And doing it that often? There are highway patrol helicopters and planes above me every day, it’s crazy this happened so often.

[@semplybalanced3210]

That boy is going to end killing his mom, if she doesn’t kick him out. He’s a pure psychopath. Him being that way has nothing to do with her skills as a mother, especially since the daughter seems okay.

[@Sensitive_info]

It depends on how he was brought up. You can't exclude the role the mother played in his behavior yet you can clearly hear that she did nothing to stop him besides a tap on the back.

[@LisaAnne-n8f]

@@Sensitive_infoexactly because there are many mothers who spoil the sons and have different rules for the daughters

[@denverrsouthers5531]

People don’t like saying it for some reason but girls and women are just better people overall. There’s a good reason I hated being a boy and transitioned into a girl. I hated being associated with that whole gender

[@denverrsouthers5531]

Girls and women are just better people overall and idk why people are afraid of saying it

[@amppma7302]

you are making a LOT of assumptions based on little to no information. how the hell do you draw the conclusion that the daughter seems okay? based on what? that she sent the same sort of sniveling, ineffective text messages as mom? maybe he is a psychopath, but why was he allowed to use her car? seems like a piss poor choice on her part. which, in turn, would translate into piss poor mothering skills. she knew about his terrible driving record, can't act the innocent party on that. mom has some culpability in the death of that 18 year old kid.

[@Teejayhaych28]

These parents need to stop trying to be their kids best friend and start being a parent.

[@Biggestfoot10209]

I agree with you 100 percent. When I was young I loved my Dad, but he was my Dad. By the time I turned 20 ,I still loved him, and he also became my best friend. I’m 67 now and miss him terribly.

[@stephj3331]

It sounds like she gave in to keep the peace.

[@Kyle_Schaff]

I read a quote the other day that maybe you've heard before. It goes something like this: If you're friends with your kid, you'll parent your grandkids. If you parent your kids, you'll be friends with your grandkids.

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

There was no way the mother was going to consistently restrict access to a vehicle from her son who has a history of violence to the point of domestic violence report from the police. She didn’t give him the keys because she wanted to keep the peace. Her took the keys because she feared for her safety. There was no way she was going to reign her kid in otherwise the next broken table would have been over her head.

[@stephj3331]

@@barnabusdoyle4930 yes, basically what was implied.

[@Onegoodmichael1]

Dr. Grande, your videos are always exceptionally astute and supremely just; I esteem good judgment as it is so absent today. And your kind and considerate delivery is always just and never offensive. Thanks for your tireless good work kind Sir!

[@MentalFacility-u7o]

Damn this kid was nuts 😮 those speeds are outrageous.

[@user-fi6dc8dw9f]

Dr Grande’s final statement including, “which bone? Apparently Not the backbone” = 🔥🔥🔥🔥🙌🕊️

[@2realformost]

“If you cater to your children you will be serving them for the rest of your life” These are my grandfathers words. All of us have to suffer the consequences of our actions. The mother was weak and ineffective and catered to her son out of fear. That’s why she allowed him to use her car knowing that he drove recklessly. There’s a consequence for that. Her failure to grow a backbone and stand up to her son caused that young man’s death. She should be charged along with her son

[@KeithLuttrell-fj7tu]

Luckily I had a father who would put me in jail and I knew it, thus no criminal activity. Thanks dad for teaching me better.

[@ET_Bermuda]

I love that final backbone line, man. Hits hard.....no pun intended.

[@christinaburkemper3105]

Man, that was especially brutal. 😂 I was like "Aw shit, Dr. G dropped the mic on that one."

[@carpathianken]

It's just a hunch, but I feel like Dr Grande has been bending over backwards with his content lately

[@RullVox]

Dr Grande has probably never been punched in the face by a violent 17 year old violent young man.

[@bold810]

Congratulations on reaching 1.5 mil.. subscribers! 🎉🎉🎉

[@Rodolfo-ho2es]

A 7 year old male student assaulted two female students by hitting and shoving them extremely hard, and one hit her head on the concrete floor, and the concern was about helping understand what triggers the student not the violence towards the young little female students and he was about twice their size. This country's educational really needs an overhaul

[@e.conboy4286]

Agree with you and add that I believe parents or guardians should be charged with Negligent Dereliction of Parental Responsibility. Turning a youngster loose with a vehicle constitutes a danger to the public and is totally irresponsible. He had no license and caused innocent lives to be lost because his parents allowed him to drive. Damn!

[@Catherine.Dorian.]

Honestly these students are going to end up bringing back corporal punishment in schools cause they’re literally little monsters at this point and very violent

[@lyndakling901]

Parents frequently are more concerned with jobs, big houses and expensive cars rather than their children..

[@SlightlySalty584]

Aren’t you

[@kathy9341]

Schools are educational facilities unfortunately not psychiatric facilities. Schools definitely could improve but not sure taxpayers want to pay for that?

[@cynthiaholland13]

I can't say that the mom wasn't trying to curtail his behavior. She advised him against speeding, refused to give him things and calling the police.

[@wot4me2]

She obviously wasn't trying hard enough.

[@notyourordinarygran]

She left him alone with a ridiculously fast car and the keys. She is guilty of negligence. She provided him with a lethal weapon.

[@Celisar1]

@@notyourordinarygranhe is an adult. He is fully responsible. In the western world we are not in the habit of sentencing families. In our system guilt is personal and cannot be transferred.

[@dyslexiccowoom3991]

​@@Celisar1 He's not an adult. The driver was 16. But he did have a valid driver's license, which I argue makes him responsible for his own conduct when operating a vehicle.

[@dianehawkey3642]

The Mom meets all of the legal criteria, but the fact that she was afraid of him is a huge mitigating factor.

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

No, the mother had no ability to deny her son access to a vehicle. He has shown violence against her when she tries to intervene. She feared for her safety. There was nothing reasonable she could have done to stop him from his reckless behavior. At the same time, how are the victim’s parents not also facing manslaughter charges on the same grounds? They knew about the driver’s reckless behavior, had approached the mother about it several times but still let their child get into a car with him. How would they not be equally responsible for their son’s death?

[@wot4me2]

@@barnabusdoyle4930 The victim was a legal adult, and can get into any car he chooses to.

[@robingalbraith323]

​@@barnabusdoyle4930yes because we have no systems for these situations! No people for you to call to remove the threat from your property and hold them somewhere away from society. Nope, it's a shame there was NOTHING to be done. Oh wait.....we have these people called COPS and this thing called PRESSING CHARGES which results in holding them in this place called JAIL. Good god you guys are as bad as the mother. She had no ability to deny her son access to a car?! What?! Are you joking or trolling because you cannot possibly be that stupid. Yeah you can. It's called take the keys? Cars only come with so many sets so don't give him one. Wow that was hard. He steals the car? Call it in stolen immediately. Call the cops on him every time you catch him speeding. All the courts are looking for for culpability is whether you tried to do ANYTHING to mitigate the behavior. She didn't.

[@koryano321]

Call the police. But the mom was too busy protecting her son. Mom should just go into the night to make amends to the other parents. Homicide-suicide while kiernan is out on bail? That would be fair.

[@sandhanitizer15]

People do not take driving as seriously as they should. I'm a big advocate for making it a lot harder to get your license, and a lot easier to lose it. People should not be allowed to continue driving if it's proven that they don't obey the rules of the road. It's crazy how many people die from completely preventable accidents. I lost my father to a reckless driver and i don't wish that upon anyone else.

[@enjoystraveling]

I almost lost my mother due to a drunk driver

[@enjoystraveling]

And much later in life, I almost lost both my mother and father due to a hit-and-run driver

[@johnny10grasp3]

You're walking a slippery slope there. What's next a mandatory child limit?

[@sandhanitizer15]

@@johnny10grasp3 what are you even talking about lmao what does that have anything to do with my comment

[@johnny10grasp3]

@sandhanitizer15 You want the government to make it a lot harder to get your license and make it easier to lose it. How about we say if you get two traffic tickets you lose your license and can't drive for a year. How many people are going to lose their jobs. People already struggling are going to lose jobs, houses, family. The list goes on.

[@TJTurnage]

Is it possible for him to be charged as an adult *and* for her to be charged? Seems contradictory given that being charged as an adult would imply that they’re fully responsible.

[@Nallisn]

Yes, Ethan Crumbley was charged as an adult and his parents were also charged and convicted

[@TJTurnage]

@@Nallisn That's crazy. It's like double jeopardy but for different people.

[@matthewwarren7879]

@@Nallisn thats BS. we aren't north Korea

[@marcjohn9404]

The way I see it, it's not contradictory because it doesn't actually change the fact that they're a minor. Being charged as an adult doesn't make that person an adult, it means that they knew the full extent of what their actions well enough, and shouldn't be given the legal exemptions that minors would typically receive.

[@Nallisn]

@@matthewwarren7879 what’s BS? That’s what happened

[@markusallport1276]

Growing up in Mich. only a few miles from the community, there are plenty of resources available for the mother to have gotten help for her son. Included in those resources are mental help, anger management, driving courses and counseling. Many of the residents in that area are doctors in different fields of practice, so that will be a contention if charges are ever brought against the mother. Affluent parents tend to trust their children and ignore many signs of trouble, brushing it off as just a kid finding his way. It would be interesting to hear about his school behavior in this case, which will shed some insight on his both his and his mothers behavior. We will have to wait and see if charges are brought against her, and what those charges will be. RIP Flynn, my condolences to the family, I hope you find some sort of please and healing.

[@cobrabusadventures]

"...certainly, it's not a backbone." I haven't laughed this hard in a long time. Thank you.

[@christinathein951]

I damn near choked 😂

[@Devyn-Devyn]

Yes, that was one of Dr. Grandes best lines yet IMO. 👏🏻

[@JH-th9th]

I don't know how a parent can be there all the time...but I do hope that this kid with no respect for anyone is hopefully gonna be punished by the law....cause he sure doesn't listen to his mother...my heart goes out to the mother ! bad behavior starts at an early age...the child doesn't need another friend...they need parents that set rules and carry out appropriate punishment...

[@UnauthorizedComedy]

I have no sympathy for this kid however lesson until the parents have gang members and thugs and criminals get charged with their kids crimes I think people are going to have to take the L on this one

[@WakenNate]

She could have been there some. She purchased a vehicle that possibly accelerates at 0-60 in 3.3 seconds. Seems like she tried to solve her own problem, but it will come back to bite her.

[@dukey19941]

@@UnauthorizedComedy And when do you draw the line? Do you really thing they'll ever go after gang members mother's? So is it pick and choose?

[@JH-th9th]

@@UnauthorizedComedy Great response !!!! Agree

[@adotintheshark4848]

the "justice" system is equally guilty. Why was he never charged with a driving offense, let alone having his license taken away?

[@swiftxrt]

if my kid ever drove at 90mph in a residential suburb he would never drive my car ever again. He can drive like an idiot if he wants, but he'll have to get somebody else's car to do it with.

[@moneygrl247]

Welcome to the 1.5M club Dr. G 🎉🎉🎉🎉

[@zyrrhos]

You have 1.5 million subscribers, too?

[@kaboomkelly]

Love the last line of the script about Elizabeth’s chilled bone. Great writing Dr G!

[@AndriaBieberDesigns]

This is a comment separate from your video. I accidentally stumbled on your podcast yesterday and subscribed to it. It’s a really good one. Thank you for having it. I’m assuming it’s older, but it’s still nice to listen to it.

[@victrola2007]

Authorities failed to help the mother.

[@mrazik131]

no

[@ValerieBailey-y9u]

But how many times did she bail him out or refuse to press charges; tying their hands.

[@maureeningleston1501]

Thank you Dr Grande, for providing me, and MANY others with GREAT content over the years. 👍👏👏

[@DenyDefendDepose358]

This is a thought provoking video Dr. Grande. Very well analyzed and explained.

[@BadmintonBombshell]

As a Canadian who uses the metric system, I took a minute to convert the MPH to KPH. 155 mph is 250 kilometers per hour!!! Unbelievable that she ever let him be unsupervised with access to a vehicle. She should be charged.

[@cynthiaholland13]

Wow, that sounds so much worse. It really is hard for me to imagine, where in the US you can even do that for any length of time. He was an accident waiting to happen

[@NEALMOHANFUCKSKIDS]

​@@cynthiaholland13lol I live n the mountains of Virginia and Thier are MANY places that u can hit crazy speeds...it's called intersates

[@Asukaisan]

it was 105mph or 169kph

[@NEALMOHANFUCKSKIDS]

@@Asukaisan first time it was 105, then he said his mom seen where her was doing 120,150 and that's mph

[@Celisar1]

You are fully responsible when you are 18 or older. There is no legal possibility to punish the parents of adults unless severe mental illness is involved.

[@Thisismetman]

They shouldn’t be able to charge the mother IF they charge him as an adult. If he is an adult, he makes his own decisions.

[@jakemiller4411]

It’s still negligent to give someone access to your car when you know they are reckless when driving

[@nancybrouse5070]

Accomplice,

[@strayedarticle2838]

​@@jakemiller4411In Florida it's called wreckless instrumentality.

[@lynngallagher7456]

Well, the fact is she bought the car she gave him the keys. He had been driving horribly. She should’ve called the police on him and had him arrested taken away. The keys sold the car and put him in a Juvie or therapy or something rather than just going, oh you’re being a bad boy, honey.🙄🙄🙄🙄 I firmly believe if you’re going to squirt out babies, you have to be responsible for them. He was only 16. He wasn’t even 18 yet. The problem for him is in a murder trial you can be tried as an adult. And I hope they do charge his mother. She was horrible. He’s been doing this behavior for a very long time. Start parenting would’ve been a good suggestion for her.

[@e.conboy4286]

I am so sorry for horrific loss of the youngsters and send my sincere condolences your way the families. Their lives will never be the same and I understand their hearts breaking. May God comfort and give you His support for each moment of the day.

[@samaireoctober5584]

This is complicated and tragic. I have no opinion but I do see charging parents as a slippery slope in the future.

[@RullVox]

Governor Stalin of Michigan disagrees.

[@joaquinmurrieta2406]

Parenting is not a self-centered endeavor. Parents who are hypocritical and live a narcissist life often reap the cost with their children.

[@AM09286]

There’s just no way I would have a BMW on my drive way if I knew my out of control teen liked taking fast cars on joyrides. A smart car would have been a better choice.

[@cynthiaholland13]

A jalopy, a beater, an old minivan. Definitely not a fast luxury car

[@kirkpowell8301]

Thanks for the story’s bud I look at most of your videos ❤good job like the way u handle your business

[@RullVox]

Kiernan should get 25 years minimum. His mother should not be charged, she was afraid of his violent behavior towards her. Even if she were charged, I doubt any jury would convict her, and it would also make the state look like an overzealous bully.

[@davidgray1515]

I would convict her if I was on the jury.

[@pocho689]

Yes, she needs to be held accountable. Obviously his bad behaviour has been going on since he was a preschooler. She CHOSE not to discipline him in his early years so why would he change his behaviour as he got older?

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

@@pocho689 You clearly don’t have children, do you.

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

How are the victim’s parents not also being found legally liable for their son’s death? They knew about the driver’s reckless behavior, went to the mom about it several times and yet still allowed their boy to get into a vehicle he was driving. How are they not just as responsible as the mother would be in this situation?

[@dsoule4902]

They'll convict. Vengeful townspeople ... crumbly case set a terrible precedent. But they won't go after the moms of young thugs, will they?

[@kingcosworth2643]

The mother hasn't got the legal tools to 'stop' the son, he can't lock him in a room, hold him at gunpoint, all the things the government can do.

[@TheSarahSunKissed]

She could have stopped him by keeping the keys from him.

[@davidgray1515]

She could kick him out and make it known he was on his own.

[@Trammiliin_nr2]

So, she has no legal tools to call police on him and provide all the evidence she had on him? She has no legal tools not to buy a very powerful car or keep the keys locked from someone whose driving habits are knowingly terrible?

[@drea4195]

@@davidgray1515 Not legally, when he was still underage.

[@wot4me2]

Yes she does- she can prosecute him for grand theft when he takes her car without permission, then NOT bail him out.

[@babsamy010]

Your presentation was excellent, well thought out and interesting as well. You have a very dry manner but it didnt take away anything from the story, nor lessen my interest.

[@freshlimejuice]

Congratulations on 1.5M subscribers Dr. Grande! 🎉

[@loginusername7]

Absolutely not. We cannot start charging relatives for the crimes of family members. Talk about slippery slope!

[@allwaizeright9705]

As SAD as these things are - I don't think the MOTHER is really responsible for what her son did...

[@ninjagirl226]

I’m trying to put myself in the mother’s shoes. I recently had a coworker who was fired. He was a horrible person who would lie to and threaten people. He was as the HR manager put it the textbook definition of a covert bully. The HR manager chastised me for not coming forward sooner about this. But I am scared of this guy. He posts photos of his guns all over social media, opening destroys the reputations of anyone who dares challenge him, and has told horrible stories of things he has done to former coworkers. I am scared of this guy that I wouldn’t go straight home out of fear that he would follow. Cause he mentioned seeing me on my way home. I started actually biking the trails home because he couldn’t follow me in his car. Is it fair to blame a victim? No. Because you don’t know what the aggressor will do.

[@MhnFive]

While I firmly believe we shouldn't blame victims in cases like yours because that is actively punishing people for not stepping in the line of fire willingly, I do believe that in the context of your children (especially as minors) there is a level of responsibly you simply need to have. I'd love to be able to say something like "the police should have been called right when he physically attacked his mother" but we have no shortage of families who did similarly and ended up inviting a trigger happy officer who fatally escalated the situation.

[@thomasschiuma8105]

This is not the same thing. This is a mother who gave her son access to vehicles when it was obvious someone would get hurt. Every time he gets violent you call the police, PRESS CHARGES and let him stay in jail. Make him learn consequences. Do you what you gotta do to protect him from himself and protect others from him. Like the doc said, mother had no backbone.

[@julieann2315]

She was an enabler that cultivated this situation

[@deltasyn7434]

Kiernan may legally be a child, but he has the strength of a grown man and I think the mother did everything within her own power to control him. It really begs the question, what does a parent do about an abusive child? This isn't as simple as giving him a spanking as it sounds like she'd have to get the police involved if there was to be any discipline. Which leads to another question. Why haven't the police done anything after 20+ visits? It seems like people just want someone to blame rather than look at the big picture.

[@YTStoleMyUsername]

Yes, it's like an abusive relationship, except with a child you can't exactly just up and leave them (and even in abusive relationships, there's many reasons why it can be difficult to just walk out). Law enforcement and the legal system need to play some role here in holding him accountable. From her messages it's apparent she was scared of him and had lost control over him.

[@deltasyn7434]

@@YTStoleMyUsername I wish more people understood this.

[@davinasquirrel7672]

I agree with both of you above, particularly the man-strength, I remember teenaged boys, with all those hormones and strength, add arrogance and recklessness into the mix, that is a volatile cocktail. Don't forget, he had already been charged for DV against her.

[@dianehawkey3642]

I love your videos, they always generate a positive vibe.

[@lauramarielenius83]

Hey Dr Grande, can you do a question and answer episode?? Im sure many of your listeners would be interested in hearing your opinion on certain topics. Thanks for reading! 😊 Love the show!

[@aprilkurtz1589]

Personal responsibility!! It's entirely Kiernan's fault! The kid was a little bastard. He was busted several times. Why wasn't his license confiscated, and suspended?

[@EH-dw3wb]

She knew he was acting dangerously on a regular basis, gave a 16 year old who is proven to not be able to act safely behind the wheel access to a BMW and allowed him to be bailed out. It shows that she has poor judgement and is grossly negligent in her responsibility as a parent to take reasonable action to keep others safe from her child.

[@dankadesign7462]

Who paid bail for spoiled brat? Another parents lost their child due his craziness 😢. Thank you De.Grande .

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

The person who wants them both to have a strong and solid legal defense, especially for the mother. Have you ever tried to build a legal defense for 2 people when one of them are in jail? That’s how you guarantee you will lose the case.

[@NoWr2Run]

@@barnabusdoyle4930 WHO & How do you know this ?

[@LilyGazou]

We have a current case near Seattle. The kid crashed a car, got given another then blew through a crosswalk killing a mother and several children. On video. Horrific.

[@agentequinox]

This is so bizarre to see. Dr. Grande doing a video on a situation that occurred at my high school… this is truly a sad accident that so easily could’ve been avoided. Rest in Peace Flynn.

[@NeurodiverJENNt]

I still think the precedent of holding parents liable for their wrongdoing is going to be such a slippery slope. I understand the facts in the case of Ethan crumbly and am sympathetic to the ruling but still believe this has created an open-ended slippery slope that will be putting a lot of innocent people behind bars.

[@JK-xr4yp]

People are so shortsighted. It’s a terrible, dangerous, and unwise precedent to set.

[@RullVox]

Michigan is on its way to becoming a dictatorship and having the thought police.

[@shoechew]

I completely agree with you.

[@RullVox]

1984 by George Orwell

[@pethomas]

@@RullVoxWhat in 1984 has anything to do with this?

[@ToyInsanity]

Grande speculating on timely topics!

[@dianehawkey3642]

Thanks!

[@generalali7609]

Once the world knows what to do when you are a single mother with a psychopathic teenage boy, then we can put more blame on this mother. The cops came to the house and they didn’t send him to jail when he attacked her. They didn’t remove him from the house. I think you glossed over the fact how she could have truly been afraid of a psychopath.

[@sherberts]

I'm glad you and most of the Dr Grande commenters agree with me, that she couldn't control him. She already called the police and he became violent when he was denied! Most FB commenters want her to be charged. But she already told him to stop, called the police, what else could she do without him killing her. She couldn't control him.

[@rvk6321]

No. She left keys with that he got ahold of. Both belong in prison.

[@kenwillis8487]

@@rvk6321oh, you were there? You saw her give him the keys? You listened to all the conversations between the two in the weeks leading up to this? I’m guessing no!

[@kenwillis8487]

I have seen firsthand a situation just like this where the teenage son was physically and verbally abusive to his mother. No matter how many times she tried to ground him or stop him from driving he ignored her and stole her keys and car! She’d report him and report the car stolen and the police would bring him home and even deliver her car for her. The judge told her she was responsible for his actions and she could not kick him out . The police told her if he got physical again to call them. No one helped her out or gave her any options for dealing with him. His dad was in the navy and called me to step in. After a few persuasive conversations and a week long camping trip the boy did a full 180 and never laid a hand on his mother again.

[@sunnygirl9691]

@@kenwillis8487 She never parented her child from the beginning is the problem. You don’t wait till they’re teenagers and then say now it’s a problem that you weren’t listening to me. Now it’s a problem that you were out of control. You start when they are little and you do your f-ing job!!!

[@LadyAsh8898]

So sad. If the mother knew her son had a history of going way over the speed limit, why does he continue to have access to the keys of the car? Recipe for disaster.

[@johnny10grasp3]

She shouldn't have let him drive but it's easy for us to sit back and say that. We don't know their day to day life. For example, maybe the mom would have to pay for a driver to take him to school. Hindsight is always easier.

[@davidgray1515]

@@johnny10grasp3 Im sure they have busses or public transportation.

[@johnny10grasp3]

@@davidgray1515 I knew someone would say that. Like I said we don't know their situation. Maybe buses don't pass in that area. I know areas here in California that it's a thirty min walk to the nearest bus stop. I don't live in that area but they exist. The list of things that we can't see is huge. We have hindsight to say it's better than what happened.

[@retsaMinnavoiG]

Or if she hides the keys he bashes her when he gets home? She calls the cops, they say don't do that. Rinse and repeat.

[@LadyAsh8898]

@@retsaMinnavoiG change the locks on the house. There are numerous options. She just doesn’t have a backbone. She’s a weak woman and he took adv of it.

[@pamelacox540]

Why on earth did this mother keep buying high performance cars? And when he was violent, was he over 18yo? Why wasn’t he criminally charged? I think she was afraid of him but her failure as a parent led to the death of an innocent.

[@sparkplug5481]

Arguments….plural ……with his mother? When I was growing up there would have been exactly one of those

[@pauguste6559]

I would not have lived PERIOD!!!

[@dredknots]

Argument singular, was not even an option for me

[@erikschmidt476]

And then what? One of you was unalived?

[@boxbackknitties]

​@erikschmidt476 beltafied would be a more accurate term

[@elisekuby2009]

Yes!

[@RodSerling5]

_'Spare the rod, spoil the child' a paraphrased biblical quote regarding the upbringing of children that has endured for over two millenniums. However, in the case of young Kiernan Tague, perhaps a more accurate axiom would be 'spare the rod, spoil MORE than one child.' Because over-indulging one's offspring can sometimes have consequences that can extend far beyond just one child's wellbeing. -- So sayeth the proverbs according to...The Twilight Zone._

[@retsaMinnavoiG]

Yeh and for thousands of years most people raised under that system were complete monsters when they became adults... They have also been saying for thousands of years that the latest generation is a rude, undisciplined and uncouth generation of lazy idiots. There is no definite answer.

[@JosephGoclowski]

The twilight zone is great but sparing the rod should stay back into the paraphrase proverb… abuse begets abuse

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

He was physically stronger than his mother and has a history showing he was willing to use violence against the mother to attempt to get his way to the point of police being called on him for domestic violence. There was no way she was going to be able to effectively prevent him access to the vehicle consistently without endangering herself. Your quoting of the Bible cannot apply here because she had no power in the relationship. Though I guess people quote the Bible as an excuse to stay in abusive relationships all the time too.

[@RodSerling5]

@@barnabusdoyle4930 So you're basically saying that she had to just keep giving him everything he wanted because if she didn't he would be violent towards her? It's probably that logic that got him to be the way he was in the first place.

[@RodSerling5]

@@JosephGoclowski Yes, I agree. There's other forms of discipline that are more effective than striking a child.

[@Danji_Coppersmoke]

Yes. She should be charged. Unrelated to this case, all car should be limited at ~

[@werquantum]

Do you ever sleep? I’m not diagnosing you. I’m just working on a theory.

[@KarenA-d2e]

He probably has a little help and he just has to talk about it...

[@JK-xr4yp]

You’re not diagnosing him - just speculating on what could be happening in a situation like his.

[@logicalblackman8228]

Your opinion

[@JohnSmith-pn1vv]

If he does sleep and has kids, that is reckless neglect and he should be charged because you never know what your kid could do while you are asleep. He could be putting the public in danger by sleeping!

[@Stellar_Politics]

Maybe but he needs to put asmr in the backwards with his sleepy-putting voice

[@Rolando-SE]

If she gave him the car and told him to drive that way, fine. But he took the car. He is being charged as an adult. Let him face the consequences. Otherwise, where does it end? Are they going to seek retribution from the entire family?

[@sydnidowney3598]

he wouldn't have been able to take the car if she hadn't left the keys where he could get them. Likely a well to do family that cops didn't want to do anything against. Mother, cops, DA, judge.....are all responsible for this tragedy.

[@Rolando-SE]

@@sydnidowney3598 It still sounds like vengeance for vengeance sake. And so what if she left the keys where he can find it? By saying its partially her fault, it caters to his delusion. implying its not fully his fault. You see it when child pedos, say its not their fault. The child or their mom was partially to blame because of their dress or seductive behavior. This kid did the act. No one else. Let him take the full consequences.

[@keithpedersen3653]

The precedent is not that you can get charged with other people's crimes but that enabling dangerous behavior in your kids meets the actus rea and mens rea of the crime. Like felony murder, it's not that you did the murder but that your actions led to the murder.

[@spiritualtruthseeker1947]

I feel for the mother. She was the victim of DV at the hands of her son. The police had intervened multiple times and knew the situation. Why wasn’t social services involved?

[@ValerieBailey-y9u]

Probably because she bailed him out, and hired a good lawyer for him, instead of letting him face consequences for his actions.

[@unclegrandpa8021]

I have a similar situation with a younger child, no car or weapons involved but he beats on me. What complicates my situation is I'm not the one spoiling him or giving in to him, it's my parents. I live with them (long story as to why I don't have a house) and they have literally kicked me out of my son's room as I was lecturing him, then told him not to mind me. When I try to be firm, my mom will say in front of my son that I'm not understanding toward him, to the point that he prefers her over me hands down (I don't blame him as he is immature but the fear of losing him completely has caused me to become more accommodating, more like her if you will, as otherwise he has my mother telling him I am unfair to him). My father apologized to my teen recently because he had to restrain him from beating me and his sister, so my father felt like he owed my kid an apology. When I try to put my foot down with my son, my parents will form a team where they both tell me to leave as my son is getting stressed out from beating me as I try to turn off his pc over the content he is watching or because it's 2 in the morning. The result is he stays up all night and everyone is afraid of stopping him (he is pretty large and will destroy things saying we made him do it, like the kid in the video). Not sure whether I need a therapist or it would be more appropriate to find a lawyer (against my parents) at this point.

[@altaego2748]

In Ontario he would have been charged with stunt driving. Car impounded, license suspended

[@strikethatreverseit9108]

This is horrific.

[@Angelina_not_Jolie928]

" surely, it's not a back bone " Well said Dr. Grande !!!!!

[@tadghsmith1457]

It seems to me that if the “child” is over 18 then they are entirely responsible for their own actions. If under 18 and therefore shielded from the full force of the law due to their age, then an argument could be made that the parent is partly culpable also. For instance if a parent knowingly allowed their 16 year old to drive without a licence and they caused an accident then in my opinion the parent should be held either partly or wholly responsible for the accident.

[@logicalblackman8228]

That’s not opinion; that is law.

[@tadghsmith1457]

@@logicalblackman8228 I'm glad to hear it. I'm not that au fait with the law, so it just seemed like common sense to me.

[@semplybalanced3210]

If they’re under age, they go to juvie don’t they ? Why are people acting brand new & like juvie doesn’t exist?

[@kimchiking2005]

If an adult is irresponsible of driving, I should not give him/her my car to drive.

[@oooh19]

Nope if you’re 16 or 17 you definitely know better also teens do things without their parents knowing all the time. Think back to your teen years.

[@SASLnk]

If she had made so many cases/reports against him with the police, and feared him shows that she could not control him. What did they expect her to do?

[@julieann2315]

Be an adult and step up and stop enabling the brat. She didn't need to control him, just not give him access to her car.

[@pt9183]

Expect her to not give access to cars knowing well that her son is reckless

[@linmorell1813]

Get him out of the house

[@nata3467]

YES! She knew he was inappropriate driver ..she allowed access to something that was going to kill someone at some time, My son got ticketed going 90 using my vehicle . I took his keys, called and emailed my insurance letting them know I would be dropping him ( he got another insurance set up) and made him buy his own vehicle. I told him I would have NOTHING to do with his driving.

[@patriciafeehan7732]

At what point is a parent no longer responsible for their child’s behavior? If a person has a valid driver license and chooses to drive recklessly, how can another person stop them? You can warn them, threaten…but you can’t control their actions. Is the parent of a murderer responsible? He is fully responsible for his actions as an adult.

[@ValerieBailey-y9u]

You can take their keys, and stop enabling their bad behaviour. She probably didn't want him to go to prison for DV, but now he is going away for up to 50 years, and all she'll have is a huge legal bill.

[@dyslexiccowoom3991]

​​@@ValerieBailey-y9u So, are people at a bar going to held liable now if they don't take the keys away from someone they perceive as drunk? Because that's basically what you are asking for here. Also, how do you propose she go about taking the keys away from her violent son, whom she has already called police on multiple times? Is she supposed to call police and demand they take them from him? Or maybe she could hire an MMA fighter to wrestle them away? The kid had a valid driver's license. That means he's responsible for his conduct behind the wheel. She obviously has very little influence over her son.

[@galndixie]

@@dyslexiccowoom3991 There were multiple ways she could have kept him from driving that vehicle. Besides taking his keys, she could have put a boot on the tire, she could have put a lock on the steering wheel, she could have put a remote disabler on the vehicle. I know a guy that simply took the coil wire off his car every time he parked it.

[@tanagra2]

This one was brilliant and surprising. I do not consider the Mother is guilty. It’s ok just looking on and saying so from comfortable surroundings. Anyone who has lived with a nightmare, controlling and violent person would understand my point of view.

[@kristinaaslanyan5150]

Agree, he would have easily harm the mom if not killed ker, soo many stories about these psychopath kids killing their parents if they don’t get what they want 😢

[@bonniejosavland3227]

He was a minor so 5150 hold until she could figure out something more permanent 😢

[@NoAgendaReviews]

Preach. Completely normal to ask a nightmare, controlling, violent person to break the law with their fake id to pick up wine. Anyone with a serious problem knows to ignore it and drink because controlling car keys is just an impossible task. Sometimes there are even 2 keys.

[@PalmBeachDog]

What about Flynn’s parents that allowed his friendship with a violent nut case ?

[@American.Patriot1220]

Damn Dr. Grande!!! He dropped the bomb on em at the end. 😂

[@scottbaxendale323]

12:24 Under this logic wouldn’t BMW also be responsible for putting out SUVs with ridiculous amounts of power that are clearly designed to go way over the speed limit?

[@smokeybear390]

If BMW is giving access to an underage child they're the guardian of yeah sure

[@scottbaxendale323]

@@smokeybear390 He wasn’t underage, he had a drivers license.

[@blanklazar]

She won’t be charged with anything

[@just_passing_through]

@@scottbaxendale323Having a driver’s licence does not mean you aren’t underage. In the US you can get a learner permit at 14, and a full licence at 16. Kiernan was 17 at the time… he WAS underage.