Simple and easy Army rules for Age of Sigmar 4?

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[@17vmrivas]

Among others, I thank you for these videos, it helps out a lot for newcomers like me. This past Sunday I went to my local Warhammer store since they were having a learn to play AoS. This guy who has been playing 40k since the beginning was helping me out , he's in his 60s. So I'm off to a good start.

[@RealJahzir]

I really appreciate you doing these video. As someone who is just starting I have no idea what these articles mean for the game.

[@capt.mannerings8095]

Going to be an "interesting" edition I think. Thank you for the video as always you sir are amazing!

[@KcBull]

"Interesting" indeed

[@bristlebauss78]

I’m a bit sad about losing sub factions if I’m understanding it correctly. I love my skull fiend tribe for how it looks and also the units that it favoured, skull reapers and khorgoraths, and how the specific subfaction rules represented the tribe narratively in how they played. Likewise I wonder how it’s going to effect my soulblight, I’ve always loved legion of night and the deployment shenanigans with manfred and nightfall pack, if that’s removed that’d be a shame. On the other hand I can see the perspective of not having rules or play styles locked into specific colour schemes, although that reasoning is pretty weak as most people don’t care how your army is painted. Having said all that, it’s not going to stop me taking the units I like even if there’s no sub faction benefit to it anymore.

[@jakea3950]

Another important reason is some subfactions either suck or have stuff tacked on you dont want. For example i can take slimux and beasts in befouling, all thematic. But i need 3 trees.... mega lame. If i can avoid needing set rules ill take it and most others would agree. In terms of theme, the regiments are all themed. The hero goes with their theme, and they won't be big heroes. it'll be the smaller ones. Big ones will probably be able to take most things, meaning more flexibility. I oive subfactions alao for theme but at the end of the day this isn't stopping a theme at all. The hero regiment for example could get an extea rule still allow manfred for example to move more with with them etc. The thing about subfactions is they are great if the rules are good and if not you dont take it and cant even play your theme unless you got all the requirements and don't care about bad rules.

[@davidcampbell621]

My biggest concern about moving from subfactions to formations is boring rules. When you tie the rules to a something in the narrative, you want the rules to express the way that thing works in the narrative. Without the narrative tie there's much bigger potential for boring/lazy rules. In terms of army rules I want to stay vs go I hope ironjawz stay mostly the same, and kruleboyz get a full rewrite of their army rules.

[@DaigotsuSoetsu]

"And that's interesting" "He always says that" "And it's always interesting" "He's not wrong"

[@renatofornaroli]

Great video as always, one note on the Celestial Realms. I think that is just to better clarify against rules that put units in reserve in other ways (for example specific battleplans or Kruleboyz' dirty tricks). This way is 100% clear which deployment rules are relevant in each situation.

[@Serra7racon]

"We want to make it more intuitive and easy." It sounds more complicated, than before :D.

[@squidjuice666]

I'm loving these vids rob, I've actually stopped reading the articles myself and just wait for your video on it!

[@markpandelidis2079]

I think this reinforces my belief that in AOS 4.0 the idea is to build your army around a plan. Because you have so much more freedom in choice of units, the fact that you can get alot of your units in thunderhead to be +1 to hit means you can build a list that focuses on other command abilities. Since the resource is tighter, only having 4-5 for the entire round and you have 8-9 commands you want to use every round, it means if you can eliminate the need for 1 or 2 of them, you now have 4-5 command points to use for 6-7 abilities. I think that's part of the design concept of 4.0

[@AnthonyPaoliMasakiSays]

Hoping ogors keep eating/hungry as a battle trait. It really drives home their intended play style.

[@ReaperTimeComing]

Even hoping that they expand it a bit

[@AnthonyPaoliMasakiSays]

​@@ReaperTimeComingThat would be great, but I'm not holding my breath for it 😅

[@SaltySeadogKP14]

Important to note that THEIR FINEST HOUR is in the hero phase, which means you can't use it on a unit that shows up via SCIONS OF THE STORM or HEAVEN-SENT

[@Jacoooify]

Says who?

[@Jacoooify]

What prevents you using it on Scions of the Storm?

[@SaltySeadogKP14]

@@Jacoooify THEIR FINEST HOUR is in the Hero phase and SCIONS and HEAVEN-SENT is in the movement phase

[@WorldOfWeebcraft]

Finally! Been waiting for this one

[@jimvesal6012]

Really enjoying these rules summaries/outlines

[@NeloBladeOfRanni]

Might give AoS 4th edition a chance even tho I never enjoyed first edition. Since I'm slowly building a Slaanesh daemon army to ally with my chaos marines in 40k

[@KcBull]

I liked your point about there maybe being battleformations or characters which allow more of a horde style. Skeletons, skaven, and goblin heroes would fit this type of rule perfectly i think!

[@gertgrobler7131]

Their Finest Hour is stated as in your hero phase. So you should only be able to do it in your turn, not in your opponent's turn. Thus it should not be able to be used as a reactive ability.

[@steverandall8163]

Love these podcasts always learn something

[@TrulyLoathsome]

Honestly I think the most important thing when it comes to Battle Traits is that they're usable. Some of the traits we've had in the past, such as the goblin moon and nurgle wheel are more hassle to keep track of than they're worth.

[@GreatMachination]

I would welcome the day where all the undead get brought back together into one juicy book. Can you imagine the sheer mad variety an undead AoS army would bring? Mate....

[@cooljoe500]

I wouldnt.

[@TheLurkinglurker]

I'm so glad the aggression level will be increased. The current edition is way too much herp-derp sit back and do uninteractive battle tactics and not really commit to fighting. As you've said many times, Rob, a wargame should indeed include fighting.

[@matthewmortensen3687]

Temptation dice and depravity are the reasons I got into the game with a Slaanesh army. Perfectly embody what that army is. I will be gutted if they don't carry them into version 4.

[@thesoothsayer9223]

Commenting for algorithm. Could repeat my usual lines about how much i appreciate your content but you get the gist by now

[@TheWilliamsT]

Double deep-striking is how you end up catching Skaven.

[@williammetzger7211]

At current points costs, the celestial realm rule states "more *units* set up on the battlefield" without mentioning points. So as long as I have 3 units of Aetherwings and a unit of Gryphounds on the battlefield, Krondys, Karazai, and Ionus Cryptborn can all be set up in the heavens. Unless i've missed something, that's around 1500pts in deep strike while maintaining true to the rule as written

[@VeritasTemplar860]

It works like that now...

[@NisGaarde]

Hey Rob, will you be doing more army deep dives over on the Square Based channel? Really enjoy those!

[@thehonestwargamerstreams]

Yes, this week

[@NisGaarde]

@@thehonestwargamerstreams Awesome!

[@TheShweeble]

I don't really think that losing subfactions is a bit deal, it worked pretty well in 40k. I hope they come up with interesting battle formations, because some of the subfactions were kind mid tbh. As for battle traits I feel like later books of the edition had a good variety of cool mechanics, Nurgle disease points, Slaanesh depravity are both fun to play and to play against. My main army is Idoneth, and even though their battle trait is thematic and cool it doesn't really play all that well on the tabletop, I hope the mechanic changes in some way, possibly being able to chose a tide each battle round would represent their unpredictable hit-and-run approach to combat. I also play Ossiarh Bonereapers and I'm pretty excited to see how their playstyle changes, considering that both their battle traits seem to be incorporated into the rules

[@igorhirsch3102]

Makes the game simpler, faster und more fun for new players. Stormcast should be a army for new players. I play them since 2016. :-)

[@cullenasaro2229]

One that I am interested to see is how/if they will continue the idea of legions of the first Prince. I figure they will since Belakor and Eternus are new, but I mean more about allying daemons along with the army. Maybe that could be a formation?

[@silverfortune2205]

Something to remember with subfactions is many of them had specific heroes you could only take in that subfaction. Example being stormcast where Gardus Steelsoul who's full abilities was locked behind hallowed knights. But now in 4th I can take Gardus Steelsoul and Bastion (who was locked behind hammers of sigmar) in the same army. THIS is what I appreciate about 4th battle formations. No more hero restrictions, just take who you want and have fun. Also having 4 battle formations to start means GW has learned from 40k 10th who only gave 1 detachment at the start. Much better this way. +1 to hit seems underwhelming until you realize you can simply all out attack for non warrior chamber units, on top of Their Finest Hour on your main combat unit. It's better then you'd think imo.

[@WindlordRyu]

I don't mind reductions in rules like Holy Commands basically being stripped down to Heaven's Sent, usually there was just a best option like Thunderstrike Volley you picked every time anyway.

[@raigomander2817]

I find funny them mentioning the "4 Stormcast battle traits", and then count scions of the storm as 2.. it's kinda silly that they're not the same rule given that one doesn't make sense without the other...but then, of course, if they grouped them, their nice squares, with little symbols and colours, wouldn't fit...such a shame I have a bad feeling about this edition...looks like made by a Project manager who wants to overhaul the whole system to feel good about themselves, without actually adding much, and giving tons of work to everybody but them

[@rq_itami9945]

Nobody asked but here are my opinions on current Battle Traits. I think Battle Traits should make your faction play distinct from others and encourage choices: - Citieof Sigmar: Orders are cool, but why are they so racist I feel like Cities should be about combining the different races - Daughters of Khain: Big miss imo and seem pretty dated, neither the Heroic Action nor the Command are super interesting and other faction get pretty similar stuff. The Acummulating Buffs are really basic and feel like a less fun version of Big Waaaghs thing. Somehow it feels like all the faction flair rules come from Morathi. Id like to see changes here for sure. - Fyreslayers: Overall fine, could use some changes maybe. The Runes are fun and the command is really cool as well. One of their Battle Traits only affecting one unit is kinda weird tho. With Subfactions going away I hope that the Grefyrd rules will be turned into a Battle Trait. - Idoneth: Whilest the ideas are flavorful the executions feels a bit lackluster to me and whilest some of the Tide Cycle feels unique it overall could use some love I feel like. - Kharadron: Feels really good in my opinion. The ships are obviously unique and I like tailoring the amandments to my playstyle. I think there could be more but its not needed. - Lumineth: Whilest they feel pretty thematic to play, espescially with some of the subfactions, their battle traits arent really the reason for that I feel like. Could probably turn the Shining Company thing and the Units are Spell Casters into Battle traits. - Seraphon: I havent actually played them so big pinch of salt here. I feel like Starborn is thematic but problematic. Coalesced feels a bit boring rules wise and Im not a fan of the -1 damage thing. - Stormcast: We already know the new rules and they seem fine I agree. - Sylvaneth: Feels great. Strike and Fade, spawning trees for synergies Seasons of War are nice, one of the best package of battle traits - Beasts of Chaos: They played super unique and I really enjoyed them ... F tho ... RIP - Khorne: Whilest thematic I feel like theres a big disconect between the Fantasy of Khorne and how they actually play which Id personally like to see adressed - Tzeentch: They fit pretty well. Kinda dislike playing against them and when Im playing them I always feel like my oponent isnt having a great time but I think thats a problem that needs to be adressed with interactiveness in casting and shooting - Slaanesh: I think the Depravity mechanic is one of if not the coolest Battle Trait. With their subfactions they also feel kinda unique so Id like to see some of that retained. - Nurgle: Overall really nice. Cycle can be a bit annoying if you rng start at a bad one but overall thematic - Skaven: Really fun to list build with all the different clans and their bonuses and the rest of the Battle Traits were fine as well - Slaves to Darkness: The marks are cool and the subfactions were interesting as well. I personally felt like the Eye of Gods thing was super flavorful but often underwhelming since STD often wasnt as hero focused so Id like to see some changes or additions - Flesh Eater Courts: Overall pretty good, think there could be some changes for Noble Deeds, as getting 6 points for killing 6 clan rats doesnt really feel ... like a noble deed. A Mini Quest system sounds fun but maybe kinda hard in addition to battle tactics. I think theyll benefit from losing their subfactions. - Nighahaunt: I really like them. Retreat and charge, giving debuffs on charge. Being spooky so no inspiring presence (oh well guess well need some changes there) and ghosty so being etheral. Pretty good - Ossiarch: Pretty good, lots of fun commands to pick and choose from. They really felt like the strategic elite fighting force imo. But with the comments about changing CP economy we might need some new stuff alkthough I thinks thatll probably take away from the feel of the army -Soulblight: Different Dynasties are cool but I havent played them so I cant comment on the individual rules too much. Recursion in enemy turn whilest thematic sometimes felt a bit unfun but not too bad. - Gloomspite: Pretty good and dynamic although I think its kinda strange that your army can lose most of their battle traits to rng - Ogors: There are some alright things the hungry and eating stuff and damage on charge. Might makes right is just necessary for the army to work. Whilest overall fine I think there could be some changes to make them feel more distinct. - Orruks: Big Waagh is kinda fun and both Kruleboyz and Ironjawz were okay. RIP. Bonesplitterz - Sons of Behemat: They surely seem unique to play. I havent played them, I highly dislike playing against them but thats obviously personal bias. Their traits seem fine I guess. If youve really read through all of this thanks a lot have a nice day

[@ghostwaterminiatures302]

Over all I am liking everything I am seeing, but I am scared… as well. Sometimes it just seems like they are renaming things ? Who cared before about the colors you painted your minis ? There are a lot of things changing I know , but again just seems like they are renaming things for the sake of renaming thing. Please make my tree boys goodish

[@ncfcpaul8761]

The more I'm seeing the more I'm thinking about both Warcry and OPR Fantasy rules which seem to be influences on AoS 4. Just me?

[@matthewsinger6397]

Much needed SCE changes

[@Cranacti]

I’m becoming numb to the term Deep Dive 😂

[@boldirealmadrid]

I would like if every army had just 4 battle trait. And then try to make them as thematic as possible.

[@questery]

"in the faction packs..." does that mean that the faction rules won't be in the PDFs? Strange wording

[@gertgrobler7131]

As Scion on the Storm says pick a friendly unit, and a is one, does this mean that you can only set up one unit in each of your movement phases?

[@drzephy]

with having access to fewer command points and other strong commands having priority, I dont think ppl are going to use AOA that much this edition which would make that firs formation pretty decent. But the second one could be game ending yeah.

[@jimskaven5963]

I really am hoping that these new army construction rules don't break the synergy of the clans for the Skaven that is currently enjoyed. I don't want to see the misery of 2nd and 1st edition returning (didn't even play those as 3rd is what finally brought me into AoS because they finally got it right). All we've seen so far is how SCE work, so I'm holding my breath. The absolute debacle that 40k is turning into isn't exactly filling me with confidence, but trying to remain hopeful. Skaven NEED to have more than just clanrats on the table, and if every thing else is auxilary, that's going to be a shackle around the army's legs every game. Just how is it going to work?

[@johanderyck6598]

Seperating some ‘abilities’ that used to be costing CP between battle traits and abilities that cost CP, feels like giving more complex dicisions to the player. So contrary to the initial feeling that ‘skill cap’ is going down with the first previews of the rules, it feels like there’s some form of strategic balance in there as well. [stop reading here] Untill top players break which combo’s of CP costing abilities and battle traits are ‘broken’, of course.

[@traiantulbure3819]

Unlike previous announcements this feels like a lot of rebranding to me. I don’t buy the ‘freedom to paint how we like’ line at all. The abilities previewed feel quite generic and oversimplified, and I’m really hoping that’s because they’re for stormcast and it’s not the case for all the factions. I’ll also miss the narrative element of subfactions, to me that provided additional flavour and a tangible hook for the abilities. I’m worried without it what we see could be somewhat generic and unimaginative.

[@yourgoodliness]

I'm underwhelmed by the Stormcast subfaction abilities they listed (naming yet another important key term battle___ is a poor choice IMO, subfactions is far more semantically useful) Subfactions in AoS3 are often highly transformative in the list building stage. They're not always optimal, but they usually offer great diversity in lists (Sylvaneth Treelords versus Warsong vortex, Cities Tanks versus Cavaliers, etc.) I'm worried that they're going to give them generic boosts, which would be optimized to be used with the best list, instead of incentivizing that diversity.

[@VeritasTemplar860]

Great video! As for rules I hope to survive: if Fly High goes away, I go away. Loving every thing I've seen of 4th so far though.

[@scottmills4164]

I got to say I'm starting to get pretty concerned about all this. I play against stormcast pretty frequently, them being able to buff their armor from an ability every turn plus being able to use all out defense plus being able to charge through your screens. Plus being able to strike first, sounds like they're just going to catapult an unkillable units right through your whole Army, then when you finally kill them, two of them return?(Fulminators...) Sounds terrible. I'm getting pretty worried. I think things are going to be just too powerful, and there won't be very much strategy to the game at all. It'll just be mayhem charging large overpowered units across the battlefield into each other. I hope I'm wrong

[@126p]

Please keep beastclaw charges

[@iainmacaulay8081]

Would it be fair to say that Age of Sigmar will be in better condition then Warhammer 40k going forward based on available info, I am sorry for 40k but some 10th edition rules and certain codex's are worrying.

[@gizmodj1]

Not sure I’m a fan of what I’m seeing so far for 4.0, seems too simple and like most armies are going to feel the same but with different models.. I hope I’m wrong

[@seabrain1212]

I don't think the change from subfactions to regiments makes much of a difference, aside from cutting down on reddit posts asking if someone has to paint their army a certain way in order to benefit from a subfaction ability. Nothing about this cha ge prevents someone from using an "official" paint scheme, so the fear that the lore won't be present on the tabletop seems like a misplaced fear. Also, this promotes creativity and allows for players to play their army any way they want without introducing narrative/gameplay dissonance, if (for example) someone used the Vostarg scheme but used the Lofnir rules.

[@bristlebauss78]

I look forward to fast paced and aggressive play though and hopefully less recursion! Stay dead dammit…unless it’s an undead faction…naturally

[@loopgru]

I hear the disappointment on the lack of lore flavor associated with formations rather than subfactions, but honestly, the current subfactions are kind of a paper-thin excuse for a formation-style rule anyway. For every one like Goretide that actually has some support in the lore and something interesting behind it, you've got half a dozen slapdash examples- Cabalists "have some more wizards!", Crematorians "what if skeletons but ON FIRE", Bloodtoofs "we like pigs", etc. And lately all of the lore spotlight hasn't even gone to those subfactions but instead to armies or regiments of renown, which we'll probably still have here.

[@sam336sam335]

So with battleformations we loose: a unique and selfexplaining name for new players with subfactions, now another of 100 things that starts with battle or combat. the lore and immersion a subfaction army offered to the tabletop unique heroes that could be balanced inside a subfaction less variety as 4 battleformations for a faction like soulblight with 5 bloodlines mean one wont be represented at all no more unique items and command traits for a subfaction and we gain, as games workshop explained it: Not beeing bound to a coulor schmeme of a subfaction....like someone ever felt obligated to use a coulor scheme they didnt like, such a made up problem So far i see this as a downgrade, and if the rules they showed so far are really all a Battleformation offers its a heavy downgrade from all the special rules, unique heroic actions, artefacts and command traits we had before