Why Do MMO's Fail?

[@erly230]

I think greed is the number 1 reason why a lot of mmo's fails

[@rickybindahoose6193]

Agree, MMO's are started from passion but slowly over time becomes business.

[@WindstrykeGaming]

Fucking amen. When you see a player with [Sword of Ultimate Power] and find out it's in the real money shop, rather than something tied to actual in-game achievements... "Oh well. Another one for the uninstall pile." I think that's why WoW is still as strong as it is. Store mount owners get laughed at, and 99% of everything cool / meaningful is still obtainable purely through gameplay.

[@rasmus6524]

Blizzard

[@shingfanchan4389]

+1

[@theblacksheep1000]

C=COINERS

[@horrorkesh]

What pushed me away from many mmos is graphics over gameplay, game looked gorgeous but was hollow as hell.

[@marc789]

I do agree on that 2 moon ( now dekaron ) and runscape look like shit by today standart but they are a lot more fun to play

[@Vallamaria]

Sadly graphics over gameplay definitely describes just about any recent MMORPG that has come out in the past few years and probably any that are currently in development too.

[@martinivanov1319]

thats every game, not only mmos. dumb ppl nowadays care only about graphics

[@marcosguedes8885]

Same here. In SWTOR was like “hell yeah lightsabers”, but after reaching max level was “that’s it?”,. But that doesn’t happen with WoW, because not only the content is endless, but also the Lore, to the point of search in books and internet about characters and events of the history.

[@TacynMegan]

horrorkesh so any Asian mmo ?

[@roflTiMeX]

The cross-realm system that WoW has introduced is a things that sounds good in theory but ultimately killed the community aspect of the game. Sure, you can find groups more quickly with the dungeon finder, but you will also rarely see the same people again. Making it very difficult to find new friends ingame. I've played in WotLk and remember doing dungeons with the same people who I eventually formed guilds and became friends with.

[@NickStrife]

Just add them as friends? Problem solved .

[@norryvamp]

Furthermore, I think each instance of group content like that was more "precious" than it is now as you can pretty much just leave without explanation and remain anonymous. You are not forced to try harder if things don´t work out smoothly. Whereas in groups that vaguely recognize each other, perhaps you had to keep your reputation in mind a bit more.

[@Devolgane4]

That's not how it works.

[@NickStrife]

@@norryvamp Good.. I don't like feeling forced to actually socialize.. I want that to be a choice..

[@NickStrife]

@A piece of fucking sliced white bread! Nope you didn't, you are on a private server because it's free.. Don't be a hypocrite and admit the truth like a man..

[@adventurepeaks4514]

You forgot micro transactions

[@koalakurre9656]

Do i watch this now or wait for Asmongold to react to it?

[@ChuckstaGaming]

LOL, both :-)

[@Zackius]

True. That's Right. (...) Ok. Yes. (...) That's Right Ok. OkEY

[@roehanostornsyn3367]

I usually catch it too late, so I watch asmon react. But if I'm an early worm, I watch the original

[@Igelme]

@@Zackius "Everything he said is right, McConnel you have anything to say?"

[@Fuzzatron3000]

Watch this because asmonbald is boring

[@Sherry_Armstrong]

cries that Wildstar will be gone next month , i wish it was good enough for people to stay

[@ShadowedEyedClan]

It's sad ik, i loved it, but sadly in the end all content in the game was all just player housing ... even though player housing was awesome :D

[@lilith8926]

Is it really? I beta-tested that game and just found it dreadfully boring.

[@cereilsilvaire9605]

It has one of the best player housing ever it was a lit a diff game all of its own, as for gameplay it had a solid one, imo the one that killed is that the raids were too hardcore and the amount of players needed were 20+40 plus

[@MrOrzeker]

It was interesting in the beginning, I still think the DA of this game is awesome.

[@MyouKyuubi]

Turns out, sci-fi MMO's generally don't tend to live very long, or if they do, the player-population tends to be depressingly low. MMO's have been a Fantasy genre thing since it was first invented, and that's not gonna change. The reason why Fantasy players crave MMO's is because they want to live in a fantasy world, a living breathing fantasy world, to be a person in a world where magic and mythical creatures exist, because real life is all-encompassing boredom to them... Fantasy is a break from reality... Sci-fi is imagined future technology, doesn't really give you a break from the every-day repetition where technology is a regular part of life. You don't get a break from math by indulging in imaginary math. xD That's why fantasy is the superior MMO genre, it doesn't concern itself with boring shit, it's free, it's fun, it's open, it's mysterious... All the opposites of reality.

[@Jonathanrawrr]

There are mmos that fail, but the whole genre seems to just be dying overall with a lot of the player market heading to mobile and stuff. Also, this is more content for Asmongold, i'm sure he will review it today

[@Jonathanrawrr]

@DrGreatScott The entire gaming market for mobile right now is 55 percent. That's more then consoles and PC. People just may not have the time to play those and they also work as well.

[@sleepydruid100]

Sadly the mmo genre is somewhat dying, yes. But this is only due to gaming culture focusing on instant gradification and microtransactions more than on putting work into somehting you want to achieve.^^"

[@ToxicFume]

This statement is akin to the statement that Single player games are dead, and i say no this is false. It's just every MMO release'd to date has failed to realize what the issue with their game was and has failed to fix it, and because of how easy it is to communicate these issue with the community is why we see so many MMO's fail.

[@SensationalBanana]

The MMO genre has been dead or dying, WoW especially so, since 2006, yet here we are? No, there are games selling that don't in any shape or form focus on instant gratification and microtransactions. Some COMPANIES move to that, and those companies generally appeal to the "casual", the person that enjoys a bit of play when they've literally got nothing better to do. Clearly, there's an entire gamer community with thousands of subcultures out there where players want hardcore grinds as well as fast-paced action. All genres sell.

[@maddiescott8645]

The MMO genre isn't dying. Its evolving. Games like Fornite are simply modern variations of MMOs, the old school grind till you die MMOs are simply shifting into a more casual style we see WoW shifting too.

[@thanosv9177]

I dont need content... I only need goldshire

[@TheSpectreAgent]

They should revamp Goldshire. Like add sex dungeons and stuff. Hahaha

[@mrInSaNiTyDuDe]

So, you need the other two C's?

[@jasonmnosaj]

Loser.

[@thanosv9177]

@@jasonmnosaj xD

[@MrDryhammer]

@WhereIsRichboierinoInTheThumbnailerino χαχαχα, γιατί αυτό το σχόλιο;

[@lorrieruff4402]

You placed a lot of thought into this video, I can not find a flaw in your train of thought. It's not just the developers as it is also the players, who you play with and how.

[@mikoajrokicki3459]

Dude, players decide which games are played, so NO, it is never players' fault. The game is either good or bad, and players have nothing to do with it.

[@rebelangel8227]

developers can change but never expect the players to.. their the consumers and no matter how much one harps at them they will still be who they are.. so don't expect the world to change for the favor of a few..

[@chelazy]

The flaw is assuming that WoW has to be an MMO. If WoW introduce moba mode bgs or solo queue RBGs or battle royale modes, it could work. But Blizzard is stuck in the middle trying to be everything and failing everything. And also, MMO is dying in general because there are new genres, new consoles/games, new mobile games coming out after MMO, you have a limited increase of total player number and there are way more competition.

[@arctorusmedia]

He said we didn't get a BG in WoD. Ashran.

[@Dunderfut]

Rick Harris "not that MMOs shouldn't be built around group play" ummm...nah ill just leave it at this.

[@PapaValhalla]

MY issue with WoW, not all MMO's but just WoW, is that it feel like your paying $15 a month to play a slot machine that has time gates and grinds for no particular reason except to keep you paying that $15 sub longer. WoW has always has grinds, but it tied into your class fantasy. Doing professions really helped with that. Rogue needed to herb to make poisons, tanks mined for stamina, hunters skinned, and had to feed their pets, and make ammo for themselves to use, etc etc, i could go on, but you get the point here. Now the grinds in the game are like "why am i doing this?". Grind rep till your exalted, ok, done. Now i have a endless AP dump of a necklace for azerite gear that serves what purpose besides to provide traits to "semi make up for the bad class/talent design". $15 a month to do world quests, and grind AP..... Also $60 for the expansion, that gave 1 day of content, no new class, no new race, and no new talent tier. Allied races are not "new". They've always been in the game, we just get to play them now... And highmountain taurens and void elfs are just re-colors/updated effects of a pre-existing race.... Come on lol. Dark Iron dwarfs are cool and all, but again, they were in the game a long time ago, we just get to play them now after a long ass grind....

[@NickStrife]

Where do I begin? You even contradict yourself in one post.. So wrong on so many lvls.. For example, World Quests are the better "grind" than skinning etc etc.. But you say you despise grind but you like grind?? Could it be the other grind was better only because it was Vanilla grind?? You know what.. fuck it.. I feel like it's a waste of time trying to argue here..

[@silverquis]

No he's right. BFA became a worst grind than WoD and Legion. WQs are bad and give crap rewards compared to Legion. Islands are not fun and are a pain with pugs. AP is back for the 3rd time and is somehow worst than ever. Az Gear is the dumbest thing Blizz has came up with yet. Some classes are still NOT FINISHED from beta. Warfronts is a catch up within the 1st month of release. Your problem is that somehow someway you feel that WQs in BFA (LOL) is better than skinning (a profession) yea you're done here.

[@NickStrife]

@@silverquis Yes they are.. Because of their nature not being "grindish" despite the fact you call it "grinding".. It really isn't.. I don't find the WQs tiring at all.. The place, foe and the task are a bit different each time.. You don't even have to accept/turn in the quest.. Maybe I feel that way because I don't do more than 3-4 WQs everyday?? The thing is they are FACTUALLY less repetitive than skinning, mining, fishing etc etc. The fact you fail to comprehend something so simple is disturbing.. So yes.. I am done here.. P.S. Hope Vanilla comes out soon.. Then all of you can go there and leave the rest of the playerbase in peace..

[@NickStrife]

@Bierbak Lore? You mean the best thing in BFA? Lore belongs to the main quests.. The "grind" for resources belongs to WQs and other activities.. What's so bad about that? I personally I enjoy the Lore in-game more than ever..! Legion did a lot things right and a few wrong.. Same happened in BFA too.. Since I enjoyed Legion, I enjoy BFA as well exactly because it's not too different.. It's only common sense.. And some changes were quite the improvement from Legion, like the change in the AP catch up mechanic, the azerite items (yes despite their flaws they are better than Artifact Weapons), the removal of Emissary caches and the removal of legendaries. Also, the "real MMO feeling" is a subjective definition that has a different meaning for almost every player out there...

[@aussie870]

If you want Classic to come out sooner so most of the vanilla people can leave the modern community, I think you'll be surprised how dead the main game will become. I am waiting for something to do in BfA that doesn't involve grinding for rep or AP. I'm all for the grind, but grinding arbitrary stuff like that just to prolong game features and the bloody main storylines (7th Legion & Honorbound) made me unsubscribe one week in because I feel like I have no real goal in BfA.

[@SadeGames]

In my personal opinion, I think balancing and competitive raiding can actually destroy an MMO. Sounds strange, but when a game like WoW becomes as balanced as it possibly can be, classes start to feel the same, play the same, and this is all done so that competitive raiding can be fair for the few that actually do that. I don't think there's anything wrong with classes being wildly different from each other but not necessarily balanced. They should have strengths and weaknesses. If you were a paladin in vanilla, your dps was non existent, but you were still an important part of your group because you could act as a support. Now, though, paladins feel exactly the same as warriors, dks and even shaman. The problem with focusing on the competitive scene and e-sports and shit, is that Blizzard is unwilling to bring back the old legendary system where 1-2 players on your entire server would own a certain legendary because it was hard as fuck to obtain. They're afraid to have some classes trade dps/hps for utility or fun. Everything has to be about numbers and stats now. Lastly, it's ironic, but the internet destroyed MMO's. The oldschool MMO's we know like Vanilla WoW, Runescape and so on, were largely successful because they had so much mystery around them, but now we have WoWhead and any time a puzzle is put in WoW, the 10,000-strong discord community has some fun solving it, but once it's solved, it's solved for literally every WoW player because the guides will flood youtube, facebook and wowhead within minutes.

[@aussie870]

95% agree. I wouldn't really say things like WoWhead DESTROY MMO's but they certainly take away the aspect of self-achievement. Questing in vanilla felt like you were going on an adventure in a mystical world when you wouldn't know what happens next. Nowadays due to not even quality of life, but quickening of life, quests are clearly displayed for you to make it easy and braindead. And whenever there is something mysterious you find or a difficult piece of content, WoWhead is their with a guide JUST for you that once again ruins your self-achievement because you don't accomplish things like the mage tower on your own accord and skill.

[@AlexeiMotoRin]

you read my thoughts!

[@danielskrivan6921]

Actually I see WoWhead as much better than the built-in quest helper. Much better to have a community-driven tool. My only issue is how much WOWhead and other sites can datamine, and how much information Blizzard willingly gives you in the form of adventure guides. It's impossible to explore if the exploration is done for you.

[@aussie870]

Yes WoWhead is helpful in that regard which is definitely true. What we mean is that it belittles your self-achievement when this quest is obscure in detail, and you would have to use the quest text and general knowledge to find your way around to eventually complete the quest. This much is especially true for the class quests.

[@blarghts]

The resources where there in Vanilla wow, however most people didn't use them because the game wasn't as srs bizness as it became later in its life.

[@malindastevens1016]

Got a couple more C's to add to that list: Creativity: Yes you can pump out all the content you want, keep adding in more patches, more places, more armor, more abilities however if it is basically cookie cutter stuff that is like every other freaking MMO out there it gets boring very fast. It's like these free to play browser based MMOs I've seen (primarily Japanese made I believe due to the really bad translations to English), they're basically the same thing over and over. It automatically moves you to your next quest giver, automatically takes you where you need to go, auto battles, and even auto turns the quest in. I've tried to get into them but I just can't, I play for a few hours then it feels like I am basically playing the last game I tried and got bored with. Choice: Let me choose my race, let me choose my class, let me choose abilities and what path I want to take! I've seen many MMOs out there that give you like three classes to choose from and that's basically it. Each class determines what your character looks like (namely what scantily clad anime looking avatar is your little menu photo and your avatar that they move around for you) rather than picking a race to be able to CHOOSE how you look. I'm not saying they have to give you the option to go in and customize features to the level of some games where you can change how big your nose is, chin, ears, eyes, etc but at least let me decide what my race is and maybe make some minor changes so that character feels like it is MY character not the same one that every other person who chose this class has. Let me change hairstyle and color, eye color, skin tone.....that makes a game far more personable to the player, makes them feel like they really are a part of the game and a part of this character that you as a developer want them to invest time into!

[@Lintary]

Seeing a hunter with Lohn'goron, Bow of the Torn-Heart was the reason for me to finally level up on my lvl 41 hunter which had been 41 for months as I started in Vanilla and TBC launched. Don't get me wrong I had a ton of fun helping people out, I mainly spend my days boosting people through the DM. Then 1 week after I hit lvl 70 on of those people I had boosted a few times PMed me asking me if I wanted to join his guild raid to Karazan as their hunter was a no show. This is how I ended up in Karazan in blues and greens and started raiding.

[@Vallamaria]

This probably doesn't apply to any MMORPG Nixxiom has ever played. But a majority of MMORPGs that have come out of Korea in the past decade have largely failed due to being shallow attempts at creating a WoW clone. Far too many Korean companies thought they could simply attempt to copy WoW and become just as successful without ever realizing just what it was about WoW that made it such as success. That and the failure to realize that anyone who wanted WoW was already playing WoW. Yet for years they insisted on stubbornly pushing out such shallow, boring, and utterly unoriginal games in the vain hope of dethroning WoW. Add to this the fact that they were also F2P but horribly pay to win with a huge focus on massively inconveniencing the player in order to incentivize cash shop purchases and gambling for high end gear.

[@MAGAMAN]

The other reason Korean MMOs fail is that people just don't like the look of korean armor/gear and the horrid anime looking characters they all have.

[@Vallamaria]

You're probably right. After all it's mainly kids who like the gear designs and anime looking characters in Korean MMORPGs. The fact that such games are usually F2P is also an alluring factor for many kids. Because kids don't have money to spend on games unless they have a part-time job or parents willing to use their credit card for them. So those games end up dying unless they also have some adult players whaling hard on the cash shop and gamble boxes.

[@RED_Theory038]

That's funny when you say it looks like it's for kids when one of WoWs biggest complaints, especially in the early days, was how cartoony and childish it looks.

[@Vallamaria]

VLX11387, I see you either paid very little attention to what I said or simply have trouble reading. *Because nowhere in my previous comment did I say I think it they look like they're for kids.* What I specifically said is that it's mainly kids who are attracted to them. Which is true. Also, I said "mainly" to imply that adults do also play these games. Since as I mentioned at the end of my comment, F2P MMOs naturally can't survive without some adults who spend a lot of money on them.

[@RED_Theory038]

Why would kids be mainly attracted to them if the average age of an mmo player is 26 and things like Fortnite, mobile games, and console games exist?

[@kalzor56]

I only play star wars the old republic because its star wars. nothing else.

[@harzular]

Same

[@Masterwar15]

The story is pretty entertaining though.

[@GenericUsername-qp1ww]

i play it because the game is actually fully voiced; both NPC's and player character and not throw walls of text in ur face for EVERY quest and the levelling is actually fun....unlike some *looks at WoW* and the replayablity factor is VERY high for SWTOR, u can have 2 of the same classes but one as a light side and the other dark side whereas the only replayability factor in WoW is the class halls for each class which u have to reach lvl 100 to get, thats 100 levels u need to get in one of the most boring leveling experiences out there.

[@aussie870]

True, SWTOR has excellent leveling, however SWTOR's endgame is abysmal at best, it's why it never usurped the throne from WoW.

[@GenericUsername-qp1ww]

except the leveling is what determines if someone stays subbed or not as if someone isnt enjoying leveling their character and finds it incredibly boring which is exactly what WoW leveling is then b honest, why would anyone continue leveling their character in WoW when they have a TONNE of other MMO's to choose from? 10 years ago WoW was essentially the only option anyone had but not anymore. SWTOR's strengths lies in its leveling and replayability factor as the entire game is pretty much fully voice acted so no walls of text, each planet has its own questline, each class has its own questline that u start right from lvl 1 unlike WoW's which requires u to hit 100 and in SWTOR there is a morality system making playing thru quests WAY more immersive and replayable. I'm fine with the lackluster end-game content from SWTOR, the game is made by Bioware who makes awesome RPG's so of coarse theyd concentrate on the story which is why I have more alts then I care to count

[@TheHelLDriver999]

The true path to a succes of MMO is having a good old Barrens Chat with main B,i played mostly in private servers,and even if its not retail level of people,it feels way more alive when it has Barrens type world chat :D

[@Rawnblade13]

Isn't that what Trade chat is in modern WoW? xD

[@TheHelLDriver999]

i never really played retail cuz back then mom and dad would never pay monthly for a game,but most private servers i've been barrens chat was present :D and it made them alot more lively

[@azraelle6232]

But seriously, where is Mankrik's wife?

[@Zenocius]

I'm currently hooked on gw2

[@Roamingfirebat]

I’ve been playing wow since vanilla I was 3 years old when I started playing I’m not Joking I was 3 All I did was sell my dads gear. I still love the story and the game itself. I enjoy playing it with guild mates and helping new people out. Just the other day I was in stormwind and saw a level 30 mage asking how to get to the western plague lands and he didn’t have a flight path there so I hopped on my motorcycle ( I don’t remember the name the one with a side car) and drove him there myself we just talked till we got there. A few minutes later while driving I looked away for 3 seconds and fell off of a cliff I was able to put blessing of protection on him so he didn’t die but I couldn’t open my glider in time so it was a small set back but in the end he got there and started questing. I enjoy helping new people or lower level people out in any way being there body guard so they don’t get ganked‘ escorting them to different areas and so on.

[@jessicabowman7169]

I was a pretty hard core WoW player for 10 or so years , then one day I decided to quit ( middle of Legion ) because I was maining my Ele shaman had poured everything into my Ele shaman for 2 expacs at that point & decided she was all I wanted to play but blizzard hates shaman, so I decided id quit because why pay money for a game that doesn't support the class I love, So I quit for about a year til my husband convinced me to play again, I came back & played my hunter this time, but honestly just wasn't feeling it, nothing to do with about the hunter , just the grind of it all, I told my husband I didn't want to raid hardcore I just wanted to play casually & yet we ended up in one of death jesters side guilds ( zeroes to heroes ) & I felt like they were all pushing for mythic ( something I didn't really want to commit to ) I hate world quests , I don't care for island expeditions & I feel like a lot of so called content in the game is just there to force people to feel like you need to keep playing instead of playing because I enjoy it : / hate World quests but have to do them for AP , Hate Island Expos but have to do them for AP . Idk I quit playing again, although my husband wasn't very happy about it. I told him that I wanted to play casually I had told him that before we started playing again, but I felt like he was trying to force me to play more than I wanted . Maybe I just out grew the game I'm 39 years old now I'm a mother of 2 teenage kids & while I love the lore & story of the game, I don't get a feeling of enjoyment in the game anymore like I used to years ago, logging in & doing world quests etc feels more like a chore IMO But that's just me . I feel bad that we bought 2 copies of BFA for us only for me to decide I was done again a month into the expac, but I wasn't gonna force myself to do something I just didn't enjoy anymore.

[@thorbeorn4295]

Im the same. It just feels like I grew out of the game. I played from 2005-2017 And quit in legion. Didn't even buy bfa. I Will play classic though because wow's Golden age for me was vanilla- wrath.

[@mlibermang]

If you appreciate the Lore and you're literate, you could try roleplay.

[@jessicabowman7169]

@DwarvishPasty I actually love FFXIV, my husband unfortunately does not :(

[@MicchuTheVamp]

For me, even the dullest of wq become fun bc of my guildies, killing alies, doing wq and warfront have a new meaning with the right guild and people to play it with

[@enigmaticunknown3200]

Jessica same here,i quit BFA be cause of what they did to my Arcane mage,in legion days i felt unique and my class unique,i had this strange magical talking staff on my back,Aluneth who was just awesome companion,one for the real Wizard,order hall where i walked it felt like home every single time...Tirisgarde

[@12kidder1]

Did you specifically time this with Wildstar's announcement?

[@speedynz9832]

God Is A High School Girl what happened to wild star?

[@12kidder1]

@@speedynz9832 The day before this video came out, Wildstar announced it would be shutting down

[@Ras548]

It feels like Nixxiom just talks about classic wow when he works down his C's. Kinda feels like a "why was Classic wow so great" video. I love it.

[@MrOrzeker]

Kinda feels like that yes, but classic was a success because he came at the right time, no real competition back then (plus Warcraft universe, and it was a revolution for many)

[@Rawnblade13]

@@MrOrzeker Indeed, many factors contributed to Vanilla's success. People need to take into account that times change as well though. Vanilla has many flaws and outdated design choices and gameplay mechanics that are just clunky and annoying by today's standards. I can't deny that modern WoW needs work, but going back to Classic WoW isn't going to work either.

[@thorbeorn4295]

@@Rawnblade13 people don't agree. That's why classic wow is coming back and many NEW upcoming mmos, such as Pantheon, are making the game with a classic mmorpg feel in mind. Mmorpgs was best and at its peak 10 years ago. People still want that back.

[@Rawnblade13]

@@thorbeorn4295 There is one reason and one reason only that Classic WoW is coming back, money. Blizzard saw there was an untapped market in selling people nostalgia and have decided to tap it, as selling nostalgia can be quite lucrative. Just like any issue, plenty of people agree and disagree, and I doubt Classic will go that well. It had many bad design choices that don't hold up to today's standards.

[@thorbeorn4295]

@@Rawnblade13 the majority of players who play on classic private servers didn't even play vanilla when it was retail. How is that nostalgia? Just accept that many people like oldschool mmorpgs more.

[@Vivereftw]

Great video. I completely agree with the 3 points. Modern MMO players complain about "content drought" all the time when, in reality, it's "commitment drought" because rewards come too fast and people have no reason to keep doing the content that already exists. I don't recall anybody complaining about content drought in vanilla WoW. Things took time to achieve. There was also more content than many of the expansions, but some of the expansions have had relatively similar amounts of content, and the community still perceives a content drought when it is a commitment drought.

[@hirumaredx]

Gratz on the 400k!

[@kastar23]

This is a video that should be showed in a game development class. Top notch, Nixxiom.

[@WalkinonWalls]

MMO's fail because no one stays a kid forever, it's impossible for me, at 30, to come back to wow from Vanilla - Cata and catch up on content in my limited free time. There's way too much shit, lore, profession depth, toys, events, just too much shit going on that I have no idea what I want to do. Nothing stands out as "this is cool, I would have fun doing it" - I can just hop from thing to thing without putting any effort into it. Either I can grind for gold, or stand at an AH flipping stuff. Stand at a table and do missions. Join pvp, dungeons, or raids from anywhere with no connection to the people inside. Yeah there's a ton of stuff to do, but no reason to do it. Mostly agree with everything you said, there's just no reason to meet anyone and form relationships anymore. Content used to be leveling up and deciding to go farm some blacksmithing levels because trying to dungeon for gear took too many hours to form a group. I want the struggle, I want the pain, because that makes getting to where you want to go that much more rewarding.

[@pedroaltuve3444]

Wow, this puts in a very ordered and clean way that feeling I had when I began to play WoW. Great video!

[@DagothDaddy]

One major problem I am seeing recently is "Story focused" MMOs like SWTOR that just end up feeling like Single player games you need to pay a subscription for. It is possible to tell a good story in an MMO but it shouldn't be mandatory look at FF14,and ESO they have pretty cool stories but you don't have to do them in order to reach max level

[@Merchuyley]

ff14 feels like a bad choice since you kinda do have to do the story to unlock things such as dungeons and raids

[@whatno5819]

But in FF14 you HAVE to do the story to do any content that matters. It even bars you from an expansion's content until you completely beat the story of the expansion before it.

[@DagothDaddy]

@@whatno5819oh really? Maybe I have done the story then

[@RoxxiTheDiceGoblin]

What FF14 does is locks content behind the story content IF you have a brand new character that hasn't done the story before, BUT, because every new character can play every single class there is absolutely zero need for alts unless you want a new race or the such. Do the story content, unlock it all, and then level up whatever other classes you want using the various other methods FF14 provides. Add ontop of that the fact that FF14 has what is, personally to me, one of the best stories in an MMO out there and it actually makes the prospect of new alts much more enjoyable.

[@lonebear6779]

you can reach max level doing only dungeons, pvp, or space pvp in SWTOR once you're out of the starting planet (lvl10), which takes an hour or two

[@zdl5665]

Hey, Nixxiom, long time listener, first time caller. Great video! I absolutely enjoy the real talk videos you've been doing lately. I'd love to see more discussion videos like this one. Keep it up, man!

[@Coco-vv8nf]

i miss when i would meet ppl in mmos...it is so hard now..

[@Coco-vv8nf]

i use play a mobile game when i was 15 that was one the first mobile mmos i remember the joy of helping new players get stronger and even unlock special abilitys or level up abilitys via collecting rare drops skills, i wish a pc game would pick up this ideal

[@PsyCoCinematics]

Well said, Mr. Nixxiom. Warframe's goin' through similar issues at the moment and a lot of what you said lines up with the rough spots that one has right now. Lack of content straining the community's commitment. In many ways the dev's commitment is more to getting their own ideas out and darn near assuming the players will just wait it out and be there when it's ready. Hopin' they return to form after the next big patch but we'll have to wait n' see.

[@futer1987]

1:10 Honestly, it's scary how a lot of this stuff applies to WoW atm.

[@umegaalfa5900]

Of course, because he speak about mmo through a wow player's eyes.

[@stuff4812]

I think its pretty fair to use WoW as an example as to how to be successful and how to fail at MMO's. WoW became the biggest and best MMO and then proceeded to almost kill itself with WoD. It may still be bleeding slowly but Legion honestly saved the game from immediate failure. Now time to see what BFA does to the game as it evolves

[@Nikki-gq3eo]

Back in WotLK is when I first started raiding, being painfully shy back then I was forced to speak up in order to find a group. In doing that, I was able to find a guild and make friends, spending countless nights pissing off my mom for not going to bed before 2 am. I literally had to no choice but to form alliances in order to raid. IT WAS AMAZING! Now with LFR, I don't feel as connected and I've been hesitant to find a new guild since most of my old friends don't play anymore lol. LF friends for this expansion

[@TheTripledz]

I'd add another C.. Continuity having an interesting and stable lore people can enjoy

[@ProphTart]

I feel like MMO's failing is simply because of the times. MMO's were rare back in the day, especially one that made it as big as WoW did. You described the exact same hook I experienced. Stepping out of my starting zone for the first time and seeing the huge map is what made me obsessed. I had never seen a game so fast and unexplored. That just isn't the case anymore. Almost every big release these days is a massive open world game with a ton of secrets to explore. It's not that they all reach the scale of WoW, they just disenchant the idea of that huge world to explore. Combine that with the fact that there are a lot of successful MMO's now that capture their specific niche better than WoW could and you have a recipe for mediocrity.

[@Zackius]

When do you think MMO die? When they are shot through the heart by losing active players!? No. When they are ravaged by an incurable bug!? No. When they drink a soup made from greedy companies!? No! It’s when... they are forgotten.

[@alighadeer4930]

Hiluluk lol

[@nicowst4515]

Hiluluk 💔

[@jasonmnosaj]

Exsactly. Blizz loves WoW. With every game the make they take the profits and make WoW better. It's no coincidence that when Overwatch came out we started seeing more content from them. Every other company making MMORPGs gave up on them once there player base dropped by a margin. Not Blizz.

[@-elbritil-4452]

Well Nixxiom, u summed up greatly this. I found these and my C: Chill in WoW and GW2. Chill is when the cool running on your back from a music that connects you to the game, that something grasp on your heart for a moment when you hear THAT quote. It's indescribable when the trumpets cries out in Honor Hold to the Outland sky, you just feel "guys, we're home", or when you walk into Icecrown with the mourning plea of Invincible. The same with Here be Dragons and Fear not this Night from GW2. Sadly, the last exp. of wow that made these to happen was wotlk. legion tried to touch this string, but missed, as bfa lachs at the beginning the same. they want(ed) to grasp into the 2/3 of the enigmatic wow (fearing what they gonna do with wotlk tryhard copy exp). There's missing THAT nuance, that little spark what made vanilla, BC and WotLK into 3 gigantic mountains of feeling. I just mourn for it, feels like I lost an old friend, while the new buddy just dont get it, what it takes to be a real friend.

[@kellsom5222]

This video made me more sad...even though its so incredibly insightful. Damnit....

[@DarkSpells87]

You triggered my nostalgia with your. I remember when I started as Druid in Teldrassil. I was shocked and awed because I never played any mmo, or any online game up to that point. I was so silly running around talking stuff to other people, who are thousands of kilometers away. And yes, seeing end game players with shinny tier sets and mounts made me wanna achieve that in the future. I enjoyed every new area I explored, I read ever quest I was given (silly I know, but I like stories). When I got level 40 mount I was so happy I can not describe. Then expansions came, and me being the huge fan of Warcraft RTS was so immersed... thank you for bringing those memories back.

[@blahlbinoa]

Final Fantasy is doing a good job keeping their game going after their meltdown. I don't play the game curre not because I'm just burned out, but I'll be going back for their next xpac

[@YungPain]

love that 6:14 gnome jokes who are all over your channel just to explore em XD

[@nezr32]

I wonder if Nixxiom heard about what is going on with Wildstar lately. Best MMORPG Experience I ever had. Fun PvP, Great Community, Amazing and immersive world and design, but the Developers lacked commitment and gave up on the game itself and it now is being shut. It has been really poorly managed for many years which is still a susprise it did stay alive for as long as it did. I would really recommend people to try giving it a shot before the game goes away.

[@lilazndrgnboi]

We should all buy wildstar and tell them to keep the game as it is. XD

[@TheMostLonly1]

I do feel like Carbine did their best to fix most of the game's issues within the first year of the game post release, but after the free to play launch their content production has grinded to a halt, releasing almost nothing afterwards.

[@tripnils7535]

I loved raiding in Wildstar. Very challenging, very unforgiving. 40 man was overkill tho for that type of fast paced gameplay.

[@rikrinkens5095]

Yo man, keep the good work up! Really enjoy it!

[@cheezitzrcool]

FF14 Gave end game raid like content early , was actually funin that game

[@LeprosuGnome]

Man i remember being a noob and seeing people running around with amazing looking gear and mounts, i'll never forget that feeling

[@Litany_of_Fury]

Is this a LazyPeon video?

[@ferencmeszaros9087]

nixxiom

[@Litany_of_Fury]

whoosh

[@immortalkdude8721]

Friend

[@Anidem9]

Community really is important. I started playing WoW back in late 2009, and I have to say, I felt there was no real community back then, and it only got worse over time, to a point where I play WoW solo most of the time. I used to play MapleStory before I started playing WoW, and let me tell you I had a ton of friends in that game, but to this day I honestly don't have any friends in WoW, and I only really play because I love the lore.

[@broknuckles7127]

classic waiting room

[@handle_m1]

*elevator music*

[@umegaalfa5900]

Classic won't last more then half a year. Maxim. Because hype.

[@aegoni6176]

That pp tho

[@Zwiebel4]

@Umega Alfa: Then why did Nostalrius survive for years? Why does Lights Hope still have a stable playerbase even now that Classic WoW is announced?

[@umegaalfa5900]

I'm speaking about Blizzard's servers of Classic. All will rush in. Will play for a while, a week, a month, maxim half a year and then people will be bored because of the lack of features that current expansion have. I'm not speaking about private servers that some players play like a holy ritual.

[@Daniel-vk7rr]

The #1 problem with most MMOS is that the developers start listening to the community without thinking from within, and this causes lack of innovation... and you sir hit that topic perfectly. The players only know enjoyment or lack of it, and will try to rationalize their emotions once they feel that they are losing interest in the game. Games were never about graphics, gear and gameplay, sure they matter. But it has always been about immersiveness, involvement, and innovation... and apparently good things come in 3's... Guild Wars 3 maybe?

[@mongislort6440]

it's true, I quit WoW because of the last C

[@jasonmnosaj]

People who look for friends online are losers in both.

[@mongislort6440]

People who don't look for friends in an MMO are loners.

[@spiritwildfiregaming1975]

I'm a loner and a loser. I'll just stick to Warframe

[@akhsdenlew1861]

+ Jason Allcreator noone is looking for ACTUAL friends in WoW. We are looking for WoW gaming friends-partners. I have my real friends, but that's completly different. I don't wanna log in to a game and talk only to npcs. I'd rather go playing the new assasins greed if that's the case since it looks cooler

[@albertgeorgy6827]

@@jasonmnosaj i play mmos becouse i.m a loser...if you know what i mean...i like to play games with ppl,to speak with them etc

[@RangerOne-l2i]

Community is a big, important part. I joined a guild for the first time since MoP at the start of Legion. I became an important part of the guild, something that I had never gotten to become before. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed my guild, the memories we made. However, the GM started having trouble in real life and had to stop playing. Slowly, the guild died. It got to a point where I only ever saw one or two people on at any one time. I eventually left the guild and haven’t been in one since. Now that I’ve been out of a guild for so long, leaving my cousin to be the only person I can play with (during the rare times we are both on at the same time), I’ve grown bored of WoW (I actually ended up cancelling my sub at the release of Uldir) because I don’t have a community to play with.

[@grimmreaper9005]

next C = combat STOP MAKING BORING CLUNKY COMBAT AND MAYBE I WILL GET PAST LVL 20!

[@liberatusblair]

Don't bother, western community likes clunky tab-target. I bet, no mmo that we will get in the next time, tries to make a proper engaging combat-system. BDO was a good beginning but it needs way more work.

[@cereilsilvaire9605]

@@liberatusblair bdo had an awesome combat system but the game was overall shitty

[@richard-pv4ff]

@liberatus you might like the ashes of creation combat but it wont be out until about 2020 personally im one of those tab target clunky players with the exception of gw2

[@liberatusblair]

@@richard-pv4ff ashes of creation............don't get me started, the footage of its combat system was making my eye itchy.

[@liberatusblair]

@@cereilsilvaire9605 yep, though it's actually not the lack of content overall, it's more the lack of relevant content. I mean, there are many ways to spend your time in bdo but only what gives you silver is important. And this silver is then used to fund enhancing which is then necessary to get gear, which makes your character more potent in pvp. Unfortunately, this is kinda useless due the reliance on rng enhancing and lackluster class-balance + ridiculous damage-scaling and lack of direction for each class. And many things more, BDO started good but went downhill pretty fast.

[@Metallong]

Well said Nixxiom. I use to play Final Fantasy XI, that was truly my first mmorpg. Played it for years, but ultimately i was unable to continue to afford it and had to stop playing. It was difficult for me anyway as i was stuck using a dial-up connection and playing late at night not too many people were on that wanted to help out anymore. Near my end time most of the friends i made there had moved on. I do miss it sometimes, but the servers are down and the game is gone, such is life right?

[@p1zzal0ver61]

i hope the day comes when we can play wow like sword art online anime

[@robm6726]

would be nice lol

[@Mordring]

Just not 1 death = death IRL, cause I would accidentally fall from the first bigger cliff 5 minutes from logging in as I do in WoW all the time :D

[@umegaalfa5900]

2020 incoming soon, so yeah.

[@spiritwildfiregaming1975]

Sooo...big part of the people dying in real life or committing suicide in-game which kills them? Why...

[@p1zzal0ver61]

@@spiritwildfiregaming1975 i didnt mean that part. I mean seeing the game like the real world

[@LeprosuGnome]

I miss my expectation to level up just to see what the high level zones looked like, taking the gryphon from ironforge to stormwind for the first time and seeing searing gorge, all that fire and high level enemies really made me excited back in the day...

[@evilminion6326]

guild wars 2 has hit all 3 on the head, no mater where i am on it i can always think of something to do, weather its fractals, dungeons, pvp seasonal events and more. 3 years in and i havent even scratched the surface of some of the other things like raiding or world vs world. the expansions arent yearly being only 2 but with living world adding new aireas it dosent really need big content floods. the best part of all is its not subscription based. base game and all the time you want is compleatly free, only the two expansions cost money. and the comunity is ever helpful and friendly, i cant think of how many times i have seen a mesmer portaling people threw jumping puzzles or people playing instuments, or just answering a simple question.

[@Venexes8]

Community was the whole reason for playing. I started in 2004 and only stopped playing last year. My server died off after the end of wrath, It didn't recover through cata and I was still dedicated to the game but with very little friends to play with. The last friend to go was right before and during early legion which is why I no longer play. Still love the game, might sub for a month every year just because I like the holidays, but ultimately I don't play anymore.

[@TipsOutBaby]

C L A S S I C W H E N???

[@mariusknauer5623]

Tipscraft when?

[@zsoltsiro1310]

BLIZZCON RELEASE DATE ANNOUNCEMENT HYPE

[@zsoltsiro1310]

Seriously dude I'm shaking here I WANT MY BLIZZ QUALITY CLASSIC PLEASE 😟😟

[@khatack]

CLASSIC!! NEED CLASSIC!!! AAAAAAAAGGGHH!!!!!

[@snarkymcsnarkface1863]

Well with mr. You think you do, but you don't Running the show. Expect classic to be tossed in a dumpster.

[@Saluuntv]

I doubt you will read my wall of text but you literally asked for it so here we go: Aion: There were certain questing places wich had elite mobs and you couldn't solo them, you always had to group up with people to do it and even then it was very tedious to finish. And in my opinion there was just too many of these areas and I didn't like to spam the chat to look for people and waiting ages untill finally somebody showed up. What drove me away most were ganking rifts. SWTOR: I loved the questing, I really liked interacting with NPCs, it was very immersive I liked that NPCs handled you differently per race and class, BUT again elite group quests... same deal as in Aion.. maybe it's just me but I really really don't like looking for people do a certain thing atleast not the way it was introduced in these games.. In WoW I like the groupfinder cuz I feel like it removes the awkwardness of looking for people and it makes it somewhat quicker and you don't have to spam the chat. FF14: I know this will sound stupid but I didn't like that I don't know how much dmg I'm doing.. If I remember correctly you could have addons in there but it was at the time really difficult to set it up or something. Also I didn't like that the dungeons had no explanations what to do.

[@supramarjo8636]

Thank you very much Nixxiom, I'm trying to "develop" a mmo rpg (its really in its early state) but I have considered all of your thoughts. Thanks

[@Fain255]

Dryen That sounds cool af man, good luck with it!

[@oidana]

you need a CEO i think i know how we can make the best mmorpg ever.

[@grammargrill]

you really hit the nail on the head with this video. I haven't felt immersed in this game since WoTLK. Each expansion seems to have less and less content with more tedium. But my biggest gripe is the game is too fast. Low level content is really non existent now. Leveling alts isn't fun because it's rush rush rush. Most of all, the game doesn't feel immersive anymore.

[@alcedof.6629]

I play Gw2 and im Happy :)

[@notalive_zombie]

I was listening to this and when he said progress, I was thinking back to the days when you leveled and received a point to place in your skill trees. I instantly went back to the days of Vanilla to Wrath, when you did not just get abilities for leveling up, remember when you had to run back to town to get to your class trainer to give you that next level of your spells or abilities? And when blizzard did cater to one type of player we ended up with WoD. Two years with scraps and nothing else, now I'm looking at Legion and Battle For Azeroth and I'm not impressed.

[@flofunk2176]

Most MMOs require you to put 1000 hours into them before you actual get to the good stuff. People simply don't want to put this much time into a game anymore. Something that personally always bordered me is how leveling works verticaly in MMOs, not horizontaly. Basicially vertical leveling is a process where you keep unlocking better and better and better stuff until you eventually reach the level cap. In horizontal leveling you don't get better stuff, but othher stuff. Image you have 5 starting options with your character design and the more you play the game, the more options you optain for your character design. So yeah that's my opinion on this topic

[@AsTaFTheRealOne]

I think the bigger problem is having vertical leveling and progression with very little ability to make yourself unique. It always comes down to community classes and you can''t really make your charcater truely unique in terms of gameplay or even design, even though you will definetely play him for hundreds or thousands of hours. But since promoting truely unique characters would be a nightmare to balance, game developers try to dance around several unique classes.

[@shadowlife15]

You might not have 1000's of hours of free time anymore, but just because you don't doesn't mean others don't as well. There will always be players who can dumb their lives into games. That won't ever change. In terms of level design. There are freeform mmo's like starwars galaxies and structured mmo's like WoW. There are options for both currently out, just go look them up.

[@mz_emmet]

vertical is the only way to touch people's sense of improvement. people want to see numbers become bigger... people learn skills IRL just to see how far they could come and the effect of time multiplied by grinding/work

[@xBloodxFangx]

Yeah most people just rather do a pay to win rout, like just buying lvl 110 but then you still have to put hours in to gear and such. Really people just want to spend 50 bucks to be instantly awesome, which most mobile games give you the ability to do...

[@boblob3509]

Um I got to the good stuff in gw2 without having to put in 1000 hours? It was actually pretty quick...

[@TheRealJDPerry]

Spot on about SWTOR, I loved that game right up until endgame, at launch endgame was farming a raid, some daily quests and crafting mats and that was it. Even now its still pretty much just that, it is well worth leveling through each class for the story but that is it, there just isn't any endgame. It is basically just one giant Bioware RPG were you can see other people running around, it is built like that, it has a beginning and an end.

[@user-uq4gr5nl5o]

Hi, Asmonbald. Ready for some withered army training?

[@DR4C44N]

Pretty much this! It's a shame that most developers have no idea about that.

[@robheller9139]

The 3 c's 1. Cuntent 2. Cuntmitment 3. Cuntmmunity

[@BohemianCarpenter]

I think you were spot on with this vid. I have been playing Star Trek Online for years for those three reasons. I have a good fleet that i log in to chat with on a daily basis, and sometimes i find myself not even playing the game. Just chilling out and chatting while i watch tv or something like that.

[@TheBarbusprimus]

thanks for giving asmongold free content

[@naychur]

My first MMO was Aion. It was Free To Play, but I was enjoying it so much, I was buying the monthly special loot for 2 accts. I was at the top of one of my professions when there was some kind of glitch that did not produce the final product. I contacted the game to report a bug. When someone responded, they told me to do something I had no idea how to do. This was my first MMO, afterall. They refused to give me any step-by-step instruction to give them what they needed to fix my bug and got rude with me and just listed my complaint as "solved" when we had not even come close. I moved to WoW, 2 years ago. My 2nd MMO and I have been playing it ever since. Subscriptions, buying gold, merch, digital items ever since. Even though I mainly solo WoW, the Customer Service helps keep me here!

[@N9colai]

No

[@ravenseeker8267]

one tip how to encourage socialization and cooperation in mmo - being in group gives you certain bonuses (+ 5% exp/currency for example or whatever else you can come up with) just this single thing would make people want to group up.

[@ferrusmanus4013]

Warframe is a new type of mmo

[@RED_Theory038]

In what sense is warframe an mmo?

[@RED_Theory038]

@Coperfil Negro I know what warframe is, I play it. I just dont think it counts as an mmo. It's more of a third person action rpg than mmo. Its massive multiplayer in the same sense as call of duty. Tons of people playing online at the same time right? Lol

[@stuff4812]

actually with Eidolon and the fact that at some point a new open world place will be released. The game has open world content where you can see other players. Its kind of like Destiny in the idea that a lot of mmo players can tell the games drew a lot of ideas from the genre. Obviously they aren't technically MMORPGS but they are very close to mmos. They are like WoW if WoW completely removed most of their world and kept their dungeon finder and instanced pvp. hmmmmm

[@rokka7188]

RuneScape in lot of ways is rewarding in alot of ways you can train anything and you can start doing anything from the start, you don't even need to do combat necessiraly. However there's admittedly heavy competition in the game for spots, resources like ore, etc. Which can be a good or a bad thing. Quests are more point-and-click adventure like quests, with some having intricate puzzles, some taking 30 minutes to a few hours, etc. Also encouraging players to do them for access to new training spots, shops and areas, maybe big chunk of XP for a newbie account if you know the game well, etc. And also give players lot of options when it comes to training their skills. However with added group activities being added to the game and such, the community has began to grow as well. Just that it works fine as a single-player game very well, which is why they added solo-player mode called 'Ironman' and also the reason why people think it's similar to games like Skyrim, etc.

[@izurukamukura221]

Also is it bad I liked wod :(

[@hxejacjiuyetheunpronouncea80]

Yes

[@cristimurphy4186]

No its not you are allowed to like whatever you want :)

[@Rawnblade13]

Nah, it had likable parts. I think if Blizz had refined it better, it would have been an okay expansion.

[@RED_Theory038]

You oughta be ashamed of yourself lol

[@tripnils7535]

Best part was the end.

[@toshitosliba4737]

Man, you gave awesome reasons abt why, community is important, interact with another players should be important, the game itself needs to make ppl to socialize and interact with each other, meaning cooperatively or competitively, the content is essential yes, the interest of the developers and the company itself to see the game succeed and making the players hooked, I guess its all true, you know Im waiting for some new MMORPG to come, they say they will release before 2020, you should check them, well its name is Ashes of Creation. Besides of that crap though, I know I will get some hate for talking about a new MMO that some ppl may not like it ahahahah, Im going to put a big like, really liked the vid, keep up the good work ^^

[@izurukamukura221]

I left wow for Star Wars XD

[@emiljensen3298]

HUH

[@justinanderson2631]

I did when my guild quit, then I came back in legion. Swtor definitely died due to the lack of content outside the cartel market

[@Nicolas-dl6fz]

I left Swtor around 2 months ago, because I had the best armor possible, many mounts and a lot of level 70 twinks. So i didnt know what to do.

[@novaslayer8449]

Swtor is good but it just not worth the subscription but as of recent I left wow for FFXIV. I really like the story it fun to play solo or as a group and has a decent community or at least a little better than wow right now

[@justinanderson2631]

To be honest a KZbin comment is always gonna be too small to Capture how we feel about leaving other mmo's swtor I finished all the single player content and I even made certain multiplayer content like flashpoint heroics solo content. There was only one/two end game raid that gave anything unique or cool and that was scum and villainy for the dread mask and jetpack from dread fortress. The more creative armor sets were donated to the cartel market as a means to promote monthly loyalty as people farmed credits and cartel coins "to look cool" you do more dailies to make a decent buck as crafting felt unrewarding and raids were not lucrative. I imagine any mmo has the same taste. By the time I had a second alt ready for "knights of the fallen empire" I was like "why? It's over, there's no point"

[@tideash]

I played/play a game called Forsaken World. It was pretty much the spiritual successor of Perfect World. Everything it did,it did better than Perfect World. At the beginning at least. It was a free to play MMORPG, with lots of content, endless side and main quests, lots of instances with unique boss mechanics, hidden quests ,daily events and most importantly...quite hard, but doable endgame content. I played it every single day for years...the community was...well an mmorpg community with its pros and cons. But it was flourishing. Then...the smell of money came. The developers put their first lottery orb in the cashshop. Sure it was nothing gamebreaking, but thats where it all started to go wrong. New lottery boxes came, one after another, while the expansions were slowed down, lots of people got bored and left...others left because of the company's greed. They slowly removed every single ingame farming options. The only way for you to get tradeable currency, is by letting your computer eating your visa card. The game changed so much over the years its basicly unrecognizeable...at some point in the "lore" we lost access to 90% of our previous maps, because of an invasion. Only to fight and farm reputation for each map,to take it back. We only got our original main city back recently, but only as a ghosttown...no npc-s who used to "live" there, no quests...or even mobs or herbs to pick up...just...an empty map. For no reason at all. Exploits, server rollbacks happened which did a LOT of damage to the community...yet they never punished the exploiters correctly because they were the biggest cashshoppers. But everything,all of this would not be a problem at all...if the game at its core,would still be enjoyable.But it is not... We are not allowed,to have fun or progress anymore. Since the game was originally a chinese mmorpg first and foremost, we fell way behind content wise, we got patches and balance changes for almost half a year delay and in big patches instead of lots of small ones. This created a big gap, between the required and the actual power level of the community, and this gap became bigger and bigger with each patch. This power difference became so ridiculous, that a Tank, who could tank the lvl85 endgame raids with barely any healing received, was unable to aggro more than 10 normal world lvl90 mobs when we got the lvl cap increase. It became even worse when the lvl100+ content came. Right now, the latest expansion came 2 months ago...99% of the population...cannot...finish...a daily instance. We are simply not powerful enough. The new raids are so ridiculous we dont even try them anymore because its just hopeless. And te worst part,we never will be able to finish it...because the way to upgrade our gears..is locked in the same raid instance. The community cried, yelled and fought on forums with everything they have, but the developers didnt listen and refused to do anything but putting more lottery orbs in the game. The community is now long gone. Only those who put way too much effort or money in their characters are the ones remaining on the servers. The population is decreasing day by day, we are just waiting for the inevitable now. All we can do now all day, is doing the same daily and weekly quests what we did since pretty much lvl80, and farming reputation for certain factions or gear exchanges which have no use at all anymore. I could make a book about the tragedy of this game...but i dont think anyone cares about it anymore.

[@wurstbeu5951]

because it takes too long to get to the actual content

[@emiljensen3298]

Word

[@KongQuest95]

I've never seen a new WoW player (and I've seen plenty) stick to their free boosted character and play the "actual content", they always wound up making a level 1 character and enjoy the game much more.

[@Masterwar15]

Koops Troops I don't think he meant that. In WoW you start playing and boom, you can already talk with everyone, make friends, have a party, join a guild, etc. That's the actual content. Other MMO's sometimes will make you go through a long chore before you can start playing with others and having fun in an instance or etc.

[@Busketroll]

I'm curious, as i've only played WoW, Guild Wars 2, Lotro and a few other MMOs. But which MMO are you talking about here? It seems like a completely backwards gameplay decision to gate people from the social content of an MMO behind "chores".

[@Vallamaria]

@Dat Tengu, I've no idea what MMO they were referring to. But I will mention one MMO I know of that kind of does something like that. In FF14 you're pretty much forced to just do story quests solo until you get to this level 15 quest that unlocks the first dungeon for you. Also, the low level areas are all pretty much barren and devoid of players. So outside of striking up a conversation with other players in a major city there's no real social content to speak of until unlocking that first dungeon. Sadly the game focuses a bit too heavily on the single player story experience for unlocking almost just about all the content in the game. So being forced to do so much solo content just to be able to get to the parts where you play with other people can certainly be seen as a chore by some.

[@araposkulo]

This felt like a passive-agressive criticism of WoW xD Nice video in any case Nixxiom, you the man!

[@MinecraftersVL]

Warlords might have had a content drought, but what we got was polished, and legion was just go grind more AP every patch, overall WoD was much better!

[@dinosdaniel3508]

Amen brother

[@aquinoloayza8822]

Argus was terrible, JK LOL 😭😭😭 THAT PATCH BIGGER THAN ALL OF WOD PATCHES PUT TOGETHER 😂😂😂

[@MinecraftersVL]

Argus might've been bigger, that still doesn't change the fact that it felt rushed af. And was it really that much bigger? It was a gigantic timegate for what, an hour of content?

[@aquinoloayza8822]

MinecraftersVL yawn whine whine, still subs

[@MinecraftersVL]

It's more like you whining, trying to defend legion, with nothing that was good

[@dave2daresqu]

finally someone put into an essay what I've been hearing and feeling bits and pieces for years. Absolutely everything you say is true. MMO game content is just a catalyst for human interaction.

[@RandomGamer404]

i like the frozen throne hearthstone pack opening sound you used for the c's. it triggered me to no end

[@Kaiyuni]

Oh god, I agree so much with the goals point. When I played in vanilla, nothing made me wanna push forward more than seeing a decked out warrior speeding by on a mount.

[@AzuretareLPs]

I agree with the community part BIG TIME. That's the reason I used to love RuneScape to death. It had people socializing, hanging out, and doing things everywhere. Now you don't see it as much, but because the game has changed to gear towards solo play, (as it always was for the most part) but because the community has become fixated on being efficient and don't socialize or hang out anymore. (The content that doesn't reward you is very social. Good social content but yeah.) That being said RuneScape isn't entirely without socializing and hanging out but it's a lot rarer now. Old School RuneScape still gets so many fresh players who do that! Also I love to play Minecraft MMORPG servers lol like Wynncraft, Pixelmon, and now Dragon Block C. I think your point on Minecraft looking bad is correct in the technical aspect but it has a fantastic artstyle, and you can customize it with super high resolution textures, high-end modern shading effects, and tons more. (And all graphics-only mods work in multiplayer servers!)

[@Thalln]

I couldn't agree more with Community being the single most important. I played ESO for a few months solo and really enjoyed it. Slowly i began hating it, i didn't enjoy the content and was logging in less and less. Eventually i joined a Guild called Decibel. Quickly i began to fall in love with the game, i couldn't stop playing. I always had people to talk to and run content with, and the content that i once hated I actually enjoyed. For the first time since i was a kid i was staying up until 3 or 4 am just to play and i loved every minute of it.

[@Zaelkrie]

I've played a few MMORPGS in my time and they all fail when there's a lack of content and people don't need to group up to face bosses or dungeons, so I think this video is pretty spot on.

[@gasops5606]

This happened to me in mist of pandarea, just got tired after getting the legendary cape. Plus i didnt have good graphic card for my lap top to play during the new patch. But i started again few days ago since my friend was playing it. The nostalgia was great seeing him play, im just glad i got back, its fun, new content, im not familiar the lore after pandarea but ill eventually know the lore while playing and thats one of the fun thing in WoW.

[@TheBlizzkon]

the biggest thing that keep me from playing some mmo games is because of how you move your character and wow captured that right for me.

[@ouijamaru6930]

Another great video! I completely agree with every statement made! Keep up the great work I'm always anxious to see what you bring us next!

[@Maddinhpws]

I personally believe there is a 4th major factor. Knowing wtf you are doing and interesting progression. I've started playing some of these Asian Mmorpg's a short time ago, the ones that are said to be really good. But it just felt plain wrong. Like I was level 20, not even really realizing it (because I only played for like an hour). And I still had the exact same abilites I had with level 3. Well maybe there was one or two new ones, but I had so many at the start already. But the worst part, I still oneshotted everything. Where is the fun in that? I've been playing for an hour, give me an enemy that actually deals damage to me and doesn't die instantly. Especially since I don't even know what I'm actually doing, but I don't need to, cuz it is so easy. I've had similar problems with the current WoW, where you will oneshot everything on level 20, 30 and 40, etc. and never feel any kind of threat from an enemy. But at least WoW has straight forward mechanics that you understand real quick when you start the game.

[@ohchinchindaisuke1927]

My honest gripe about wow is the pace of the status as a player. Going from being a nobody in Durotar who is basically an adventurer to seek out raids that didn’t impact the world my example is “I killed ragnaros and my reward was gear and gold” now it’s “hero/commander/champion/titanslayer! You must kill a robot in uldir that is running on windows vista! It plans to spread its OS to all of zandalar! Or our world is doomed!”

[@Thrall2005]

First experience with higher levels was when I got to Razor Hill on my orc hunter... Got ganked by a 44 paladin on that sweet ass mount... Intrigued me to level a paladin, and still have him to this day

[@Nathanismyname27]

Love your vids, keep up the good work :)

[@warhammerguy]

Yo Nixxiom, I just got an great suggestion for an idea for a future video you should think about maybe making :) When BlizzCon launches and people start playing the demo there is a good chance that people from both blizzard itself and press people might ask players playing the demo questions like.: - Why do you want to play classic? - Why do you think blizzard should make classic servers? - What do you think of retail versus classic? -etc I think it would be a good idea to maybe make a video explaining or giving advice on how to answer these type of questions in both a constructive, informative but also positive way. This way it will make the classic community stand out in a good light, while also maybe convincing/explaining to people that was not keen on the classic idea while also being respectful. It will be a hell lot better than a "lol retail suxs!" answer :P

[@vwlssnvwls3262]

Your statements of community are so very true. I keep trying to get into BFA, because it seems like it has a lot of good stuff, but I literally play for 3-4 hours without seeing a single thing typed into chat. I can run, and heal a dungeon without anyone saying a single thing. After a while it just gets kind of boring. I like WoW because of it's RPG aspects in a world filled with a lively community. I know if I were in an active guild it would be slightly different, but how do you find those guilds. 90% of all guilds these days do nothing except collect players. I am so looking forward to Classic so I can play a fun and lively game again.

[@maxengelhardt3927]

I appreciate your argument, however it can be simplified to 1 C: Challenge Making friends was easy, because the open, competitive world was challenging -- especially if you played on a PvP / RP-PvP server. Having a role (tank, healer, dps) meant something special because you would be remembered in your server's community as either being a challenging player to play with, or someone who made challenges easier. Finishing quests led to interesting adventures, curiosity and exploration because it was a challenge to figure out what the journal was saying. Getting a gear upgrade felt incredible because you were mostly weak, and it was challenging to survive. Each new piece noticeably influenced your power. Hanging out in cities was fun after raids because it was a challenge to maintain raiding for many months and gradually gain your full sets -- proud moments of your efforts. Now it's a carnival. Exploring the world was exciting because it was a challenge to run on foot all over the continents, again, always exposed to the open, competitive world. Having a tight-knit community in PvP or PvE communities was easier, because organizing groups for BG / Raids was challenging -- and being successful in them required considerable diplomacy and dedication. Guilds were important because there was no cross-realm opportunity to be rude or bad at the game if you wanted to succeed and see more content. You had to stick to your guild, couldn't afford to lose your raiding slot -- fewer chances to jump ship or, like now, do it alone -- an asinine idea for a huge multiplayer game. The content was more intense because it was challenging to clear bosses and manage character economy. Level 60 was extremely meaningful because 1-59 was extremely challenging and time consuming. Tier sets felt amazing to wear because it was a challenge to work your way out of bad looking gear. Riding a mount was great because the challenge of farming gold was also great. Completing dungeons was redeeming because it was a challenge to outlast them. Discovering how to do your professions, get attuned for raids, earn class specific items, were all challenging because there was less information and more time and energy required to earn the necessary pieces and finish the quests involved. Case in point: The legendary game design of Dark Souls

[@ericyantis6810]

The problem is...people are forever chasing that feeling of getting lost in a new and exciting place. That is what it was like to play some of the first MMOs like Everquest and WoW. Everything was so new and different. But MMOs are not new anymore... Unfortunately, it is very hard to get that "new in-love" feeling again. Just like any relationship. Infatuation phases end. People will keep jumping from MMO to MMO searching for that spark...but ultimately leave after only a couple months...and a lot of MMOs that have any kind of problem...become destined to fail.

[@limem2526]

I could see blizzard watching this and showing this vid to all their devs and designers...

[@roelixgameplay6815]

that's the reason why classic games are taking on such importance this year ( like linage II ) nice video bro