The Agreste Arc Is The Most Depressing Failure Of Miraculous (And Here's How I'd Fix It)

[@OpticalSorcerer]

This show has been VERY bad with handling abusive behavior. Honestly Adrien's upbringing explains his friendship with Chloe (plus his ultimatum to her) as well as him idolizing Ladybug and ignoring Marinette's stalker behavior.

[@isabellarain3604]

I agree. I also think the whole Adrien is a sentimonster situation undermines portrayal of how much an abuser can have control over their victims. Adrien being controlled by the rings feels like another add-on to the lazy writing but that’s just my opinion

[@Awtuch]

Fr

[@OpticalSorcerer]

@@isabellarain3604 I really hate that as well. I would've appreciated the sentimonster aspect more if Gabriel learned to care for Adrien like a real son over these seasons and acknowledged treating him like a puppet, eventually culminating in a real, healthy relationship.

[@bunnyconcubus8468]

​@@isabellarain3604I do think the centimonster part is decently good it's just the thought of the writer's and intent behind it

[@parttimeloverandafulltimef1096]

what's with all this stalking behavior you talking people.. all i see from Marinette is that she's a kid that's in love , like don't we all of us do dumb awkward stuff when we are arround our crush, someone help me understand plox

[@nixthelapin9869]

You know, we joked for a long time about the show ending with Gabe, a literal terrorist, getting a sympathetic redemption when Chloe, a mean 14-year old, is treated as irredeemable, but man, I never thought they would go *this* extreme

[@mozzy2968]

Chloe's desent and Gabe's honoring were both caused by Ladybug and were both poorly handled plot points. The fight scenes were pretty cool, but it was very unsatisfying.

[@ashebennett7726]

Gee, funny how a “feminist” show writes mean girls to be “irredeemable” but then write full grown men as villains to be “sympathetic. They make some actions worse than they are while other actions are swept under the rug. “So remember kids, every girl is a superhero. But if they’re mean to you, they’re worse than any supervillain, terrorist or r**ist.” This is literally what Thomas believes. I wouldn’t recommend reading the things he posts because it will guarantee the loss of sanity and brain cells.

[@shanenanigans27]

Gabe is just as irredeemable as Chloe tbh

[@Noshushpls]

@@shanenanigans27Chloe’s not eve irredeemable she’s literally a kid and most kids don’t start maturing mentally til they hit like 16 etc now she’s lost everything and sent to New York she’ll probably get humbled

[@shanenanigans27]

@@Noshushpls Being a teen is not an excuse for bad behavior, it may explain her behavior but it's not an excuse.

[@moonie6801]

I can't tell which I'm more disappointed by: - Adrien not standing up to Gabriel - Ladybug battling Hawk Moth alone, or - Still not getting the Reveal

[@Anthyrion]

That Cat Noir couldn't be in the final fight and we STILL didn't get the revealing of the secret identities was the most annoying thing for me in the last episode

[@nevaehhamilton3493]

​@@Anthyrion we don't always get what we want, and it's a matter of life we need to accept.

[@ainaazmi1043]

atp i don’t even care about the reveal anymore 😭😭

[@whatever5401]

Adrien not standing up to Gabriel and Ladybug battling Hawk Moth without Chat Noir are easily the worst mistakes, because they're IRREVERSABLE MISTAKES. We could still get the reveal in a later season, but we're never going to get to see Adrien actually standing up to Gabriel and fighting him in the final battle, because Gabriel is already gone forever. And unless they're gonna pull a "Gabriel was still alive all along", I don't think they can fix this

[@petergriffin1023]

Agreed we better get the reveal in the next season

[@underachieve2258]

The fact that Adrien has been missing from major battles or being utterly useless in them since S3 makes this entire arc absolutely pointless. There is no reason as to why he shouldn't have been there - it's HIS father! Him learning everything would have not only given him the character development we've wanted to see for so long but it is the WHOLE POINT OF THE SHOW. Why even bother making a protagonist the villain's son if they NEVER DIRECTLY FACE OFF?

[@ishashifar]

Exactly, the show portrayed him as a delicate little flower who couldn't handle knowing the truth about anything hence everyone he loved lied to him, in my opinion I think Adrien was emotionally ready by that time to figure out his dad was Monarch, the whole season has been building up towards it with him slowly realizing how abusive his father actually is, and his fight with Night tormentor proves how far he has come he's no longer denying or trying to justify anything his father is doing in the name of "hes hurt since mother died, he's just trying to do this to protect me etc" no, he accepted that his father was abusive and controlling and should just let him live the way, he felt sorry he was ever his son, and called him insolent and a coward,(both of which are true)that was peak charecter development for Adrien, only to have it completely reversed by making him believe everything his father did to him was justified in the name of the last act he did being to help Ladybug. I felt like at that point Adrien had come to accept how horrible of a person his father was, and frankly once knowing the truth would've probably expected such level of cruelty from him, and the emotional weight of him being the one to essentially kill his father with his own cataclysm that was also taken away by him not knowing.

[@underachieve2258]

@@ishashifar I absolutely agree. Having Adrien slowly building up his courage to even say no to his dad (IMO Risk doesn't count because he was under the akuma's influence), openly call him out as Adrien, and the things he said in his fight against Night Tormentor are clear indicators that he was ready. Gabriel could have done anything before that but it would NEVER have redeemed abusing his own child and others just for his own gain - which he could have resolved the moment he used the Bunny Miraculous. My theory is that in the end Adrien will turn into Chat Blanc anyway because of being constantly lied to. However, that doesn't mean that this route the writers are taking makes sense. I absolutely dislike how the writers casually brushed off holding his own son hostage, forcing him to obey, and depriving him from any sort of joy. For a lot of people, that is their reality - and for them to brush it off as "oh, well in the end he did a good thing so it's all good!" is such a dangerous message to put out.

[@weedleisopcute3626]

Star Wars did that whole “main character is villain’s son” thing a lot better

[@johay899]

Agreed

[@singoflovesongs]

amen to all of this... we've been expecting this scenario since practically the first 5 episodes of the first season... literally, i have no idea how the heck they were able to fumble things THIS badly????? what is the damn POINT of adrien's backstory then??

[@RedDeadSpider343]

Ah yes, An abusive and neglectful father who psychologically torture his own son and get the miraculous because to revive his dead wife in the most sociopathic ways, gets labelled a hero and rewarded a statue for it in a narcissistic way. The hero who akumatized many people, including children and his own son too. What a great ending for to redeem a villain in 5 seasons without zero consequences. Edit: I'm watched the movie of miraculous ladybug and they actually have Adrian confronting his father because of his cruelty and gabriel does care about his son as he realised that cat noir is Adrian.

[@Andovers848]

I heard somed theory about consequences coming in season 6

[@Andovers848]

@@passarovoador6662 really ? How could read the right and not the fake bible ???

[@starsiadraws]

​@@passarovoador6662Do. Not. Post. Spoilers. jfc

[@RedDeadSpider343]

​@@Andovers848even within the theory about the consequences, Thomas will just straight up ignored it and stick with his ego to make the show even more worse just like the sentimonster theory of Adrian and Felix because they look almost identical towards each other as in twins than cousins.

[@Gabry4777]

​@@RedDeadSpider343 no! Astruc is not involved in season 6!

[@arilawrence5853]

I’m a survivor of child abuse, and I’ve honestly never felt more insulted by a show’s representation of the matter. Absolutely disgusting.

[@mauricioandres7470]

Same here, in S4 they hinted at Adrien being tired of obeying and wanting a life for his own, that could have gone perfect, but no, let's glorify the abuser

[@AndHisNameIsJohnCenaaaa]

Nah cause honestly this whole redemption arc shit has pissed me off.

[@saintzeroinfinity]

@mauricioandres7470 Adrien was a slave to the twin rings of the graham de vanily. As cat blanc, he showed some resistance but, as ephemeral he was absolutely obedient. As long as Gabriel had the rings Adrien was going to be a threat to Ladybug.

[@saintzeroinfinity]

@arilawrence5853 I’m sorry that you were a victim of child abuse I just hope you are no where near the people that hurt you.

[@ultimatedisneycruiselinefa5112]

Ouch…I’m so sorry that happened to you.

[@littlesparrow303]

The writing team really doesn’t know how to write a good story even if it comes to emotional trauma. Even fanfiction writers who are into the show can do it 10 times better than the S5 finale

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

Facts! Also I feel like this finale could've been the best. Like imagine Felix figures out Kagami and Adrien got captured in that white room. He decides to save them with a sentibeing and break them out. And Adrien decides he's done hiding secrets from his loved ones and tells Kagami and Felix he's Cat Noir. Plagg reluctantly reveals himself to Felix and Kagami. While he doesn't hold a grudge against Kagami. He does hold a grudge against Felix. Felix says he understands he's not worthy of being forgiven. But he does tell Plagg he wants to change for the better even if it takes years. Plagg says he appreciates Felix breaking Adrien out of the white torture room. But has a long way before he forgives him for his past choices. Adrien decides to ask why Felix was so angry about Adrien not coming to Felix's father's funeral. Felix tells him bluntly. Because I wanted you to understand what it's like to be happy when an abusive parent is dead! Adrien is shocked and feels guilty for not knowing. Felix says he didn't want Adrien to lose his optimism and happiness just because he did. Kagami tells them they need to get back to Paris. So Adrien transforms into Cat Noir and Felix who is already Argos head on their way back to Paris. Meanwhile Marinette is trying to understand why Felix told that play. Then it clicks for her. Gabriel is Monarch. She was right all along and was too stupid to realize it. Eventually after a lot of hopping and spinning across London back to France. Felix, Kagami and Adrien make it back right where Marinette's house is. Meanwhile Marinette transforms into Ladybug and sends Cat Noir a text that Gabriel is Monarch. Cat Noir gets the message and slowly grows disgusted with his father until that disgust becomes fury. Fury that is out for destroying him. Felix can't help but feel bad for his cousin and tells him he was never a good father to Adrien. Cat Noir nods grimly and becomes determined to end his fath no his enemy's life permanently! Ladybug sees Cat Noir and and quickly gives him a hug. Slightly helping Cat Noir calm down. Kagami isn't sure what to do since she doesn't have a Miraculous to fight. But Felix reassures her that even without a Miraculous she's undefeatable. Which makes Kagami smile at him with love. Ladybug decides to not be gentle and uses a lucky charm to break into Gabriel's prison of a house! Gabriel is shocked to see the heros and Anti hero. But seeing Cat Noir furious surprises him a bit. Cat Noir then speaks with disgust. I can't believe I ever trusted you! I should've cataclysmed you sooner you excuse of a father! And then most would play out the same. Except Cat Noir tells his identity to Ladybug. Gives him her miraculous and fights Gabriel who has transformed into Monarch. But the wish isn't made. Because once Felix takes the butterfly off him. Gabriel has no life in him left and before he dies into complete ashes. Adrien walks up to him and says. You were never a good parent. I hope you never find peace for the vile man you are. Afterwards. Felix decides the butterfly should be with Kagami as he trusts her and knows she has a caring and good heart. Ladybug decides that's for the best. But warns Felix if he even thinks about using it for evil. She will gladly take him to jail. Felix understands and promises he won't use any miraculous for evil. It's after a few days of Monarch being defeated. Felix is making up for his bad choices in the past by doing community service but glad his girlfriend and cousin are safe from being hurt. Marinette is slowly getting ready for her first fashion class to share her designs with others. Adrien is slowly recovering from his terrible life with his father. A part of him wishes his father hadn't become a monster. He also sadly learned Natalie was Mayura and that she died the same day as Gabriel. While he misses her. He also is disappointed she was willing to help Gabriel in his horrible and vile plans. He doesn't know if he can forgive her either even though she's gone. He misses his mother but knows now from the recordings of his mother that Emilie wanted Gabriel to stop using the Miraculous for evil. It's the closest thing he has of his mother left. And although he still misses her. He now knows she was the only good parent he had. Gorilla or Gregory has decided to adopt Adrien as his son. Adrien really appreciates it. He is slowly trying to figure out what he wants to do when he grows up. But he's thinking maybe being a teacher would be nice. Or maybe a history teacher. Plagg has been much closer to Adrien now and has become like an older brother to Adrien. He still loves camembert but also seems happy to try some new things as long as they aren't too sweet. He gets to see Nooroo a lot now as well as Duusu! Which makes him really happy! Amelie visits Adrien with Felix when Felix is done with his community service each day. Amelie also decided to adopt Kagami as her daughter in law. And made sure Tomoe can't see Kagami ever again. Everyone gets their miraculous. But if they prove to be evil with it. Ladybug will take them back. After about a week. Adrien and Marinette finally share their first kiss together and admit they love each other. And Felix and Kagami admit once they are old enough. They want to get married. Adrien jokingly points out you have to propose first. And they all laugh.

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

Years later Marinette and Adrien are happily married and have 3 kids. Emma, Hugo and Louis. Emma is like her father and a bit oblivious to very obvious things. Hugo is a bit like his mother and a bit of a klutz. And Louis is a mix of both his parents personalities. Felix and Kagami are also married and have 3 kids as well. Amanda, Koyuki and Charlie. Amanda is a bit like her mother being blunt and doesn't hesitate. Koyuki is more like her father a prankster and likes to cause trouble. But not too far. And Charlie is a mix of both his parents personalities. The kwami's are still around. But only visit with their holders. Adrien is a history teacher, Marinette is a fashion designer, Felix is a magician, and Kagami is an artist who teaches kids about different types of art and drawing.

[@Imperial304]

Fr I read a Ben 10 and Miraculous crossover and it covered. Mari's stalker behavior, Adrian's abuse, and etc. This is why I love the fandom better than the show itself.

[@Pollares_ice]

​@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan🙇🙇🙇🙇 I will bow before so much wisdom!!!

[@Pollares_ice]

​@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan🥺🥺🥺 how fantastic

[@dspace4514]

Even if we ignore the Gabriel BS, they dont even give us a reunion between Adrien and Emilie. I swear the only thing keeping me tied to this show is Adrien finding out Ladybug lied to him and gets mad for a good reason.

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

Facts!

[@docfox4353]

Knowing this show, Adrien won’t find out until season 8 and he won’t even get too mad about it.

[@geoffreygoncalves931]

Even if the labels of the character model says otherwise, I personally don't think this was Émilie. Otherwise they wouldn't have cut the scene where Adrien and this woman smiles at eachother. I think this is Amelie.

[@marocat4749]

Or it indeed is amelie in a twist :P The fact that it unironic would make sense and emily is still dead makes it so bad writing.

[@geoffreygoncalves931]

@@marocat4749 How it will be bad writing ? It's bringing her back when she didn't want to be brought back that be bad writing.

[@ianoliano2057]

Also cannot forget the whole thing with Kagami and Felix FINDING OUT MARINETTE'S SECRET IDENTITY, and giving her all the backstory, to when she even agrees to help them. It felt like a team up, gathering allies for the big finale. Kagami and Felix were supposed to have a part to play. When instead, Kagami's in prison the whole time, while Felix DOESN'T EVEN APPEAR? They made us watch that cringy reenactment play for nothing?!

[@gamefan64]

It really feels like that episode shouldn't have existed.

[@kou7191]

Indeed, it was just exposition for the sake of exposition, you could cut that episode completely and it wouldn't change the narrative AT ALL - Marinette is sad Adrien left, skips the school dance and goes home to cry herself to sleep, wakes up next morning decided to go confront Gabe/Natalie about Adrien. See? nothing changed.

[@hwtvi3466]

@@gamefan64ikr? It made absolutely zero sense.

[@kamarismith9422]

It's sad to me that most fans of this show could probably write a better ending for the Agreste arc than the professional writers could. I can imagine there were people who were worked on this episode that were probably just as dissatisfied with the ending as a lot of fans were, but had to go through with it because it's what Astruc wanted.

[@dani_zvlogs]

I also just want to say that I feel like giving the miraculous PERMANENTLY to all of the holders might’ve been a bad choice. Like all of their holders are her classmates, that’s almost 15 Kwmais in the same room. 15 miraculous! So are they all just going to lie to each other? Wouldn’t that get suspicious after awhile? Like: “oh Adrian and Marinette left! Oh there goes Ladybug and Cat Noir to save the day! Oh where did Nino, Julika, Kim, and Alya go? Wait look there’s the superhero team!” And I feel like some people are definitely going to tell other people about their identities, like Rose and Julika, Marc and Nathaniel, Ivan and Mylène, and Luka doesn’t like lying so wouldn’t that be bad?

[@sugarkitty2008]

I think the school year is over and they are splitting up into different schools. Had that episode with everyone's applications.

[@kou7191]

It's funny too because as far as Marinette is aware, Adrien is literally the only one in the entire class without a miraculous, because she doesn't know he's CN (imagine the IRONY if she gave him the butterfly miraculous had she not lost it)

[@okanimation68]

They are all going into different lycées so they are fine

[@redram6080]

My problem with all those heroes is that they are going to have to somehow make Lila 10x more powerful than hawkmoth to justify her being more of a threat and given that she's a teen who likely just found out about the miraculous' in the end of season 1. It just doesn't make sense for that to happen.

[@kyacook5702]

I think it is dumb giving the classmates miraculous because most of them were exposed in Miracle Queen. People know who they are. Also, Bustier decided to make a new school for students to figure out what they want to do, so they would be together.

[@docfox4353]

You could have easily fixed the protagonist issue by dividing it into seasons. Season 1 would be Marinette focused with her arc revolving around her gaining confidence and learning the ins and outs of being a super hero. The season would also drop hints about the Agreste family to gain interest. Season 2 would be Adrien focused and be about him coming to grips with his dad being a villain. Later seasons could work on expanding the lore. Introducing new villains like tyrants and maybe even the ghosts of past evil miraculous holders.

[@miss_chelles1338]

👏🏾 ☝🏾💯

[@marocat4749]

Bu couhave to be strictly episidic somwhow.

[@godabandonedthistimeline]

I swear every person in this fandom has better ideas than the ACTUAL writers.

[@virnalassiter382]

Yeah I wish that the monarch was still a stranger to vewiers and didn't have an Orhan story at this point because yeah while he kind of deserves to be left out in the final it's disappointing that he's related to the main villan of the show and his girlfriend is doing all the work it's not a big deal it didn't happen in the final we got that in representation like is that the reason it didn't happen in the final? And even though I'm happy that chole isn't getting redeemed how can the director think that Gabriel and Andra could get redeemed?

[@emyra1345]

This!! That would have been so intresting!

[@moonie6801]

Neutering Adrien by using the excuse he'll fly into a rage if he learns the truth shows the writers have really forgotten how to write this character. What makes Adrien special (for lack of a better word) is his ability to be kind, decent, and self-controlled IN SPITE OF the terrible things that have happened to him. That's what made him possibly the BEST person to wield the cat miraculous, this object capable of such devastating destruction. The few times we see him almost lose control canonically (so Cat Blanc doesn't count here), he's either 1) able to restrain himself, 2) restrained by Ladybug, or 3) knocked aside by the villain which effectively shuts the moment down and prevents anything from happening. We can only guess if Adrien would have gone off the rails in the finale after learning the truth (like he did in Cat Blanc), but even IF he did, watching him control his impulses and ascend above the temptation to wreak selfish (albeit justified) destruction with his miraculous would have been SO POWERFUL. What a disappointment after all these years. 💔

[@esayem7746]

Yeah I'm not a fan of the writers turning him into some ticking time bomb.

[@greenstarlover1]

Like, stories like ladybug live and die by their drama. Adrien discovering hawk moth's identity had ALL the drama from day 1. How the hell do you screw such a golden opportunity? And what if the cat rages? Let him rage. It's more conflict and such more material to work with.

[@emyra1345]

I stopped watching when the creator stopped caring for other characters. I mean Chloe and Adrien definitely got swept under the rug, which is sad because they were the ones with the most potential in my opinion. I also strongly dislike how little consequences Marinette had to deal with. Everyone was basically always like it's okay because she's Ladybug and even as Marinette she got away with so much. Not at all what a role model aka hero should be, a hero should recognize their mistakes and learn from them.

[@narnia1233]

@AptMantis2278. My answer to that is watch Sofia The First. I know that might sound crazy but because I have a toddler niece and nephew now I did end up watching Sofia The First and unironically it for real is a perfect show in my opinion. It literally treats all the large cast of characters, boys, girls, adults (parents, aunt, uncle, teachers, etc.) all well. The writing is really good. It’s crazy. I couldn’t believe I actually loved it, but I did. Anyways, in that show one of the interesting things it does extremely well is it lets other characters have the spotlight in episodes. And not just other major characters but even completely random side characters too-but somehow all the characters, even side characters, are interesting and likable. And they even all contribute to important plot events in the story too and in the grand finale all of them have a part to play. It’s a very satisfying show story wise the entire way through. It’s not dark. But has real meaningful consequences. Main characters AND side characters have growth and even their own arcs. Anyways, Sofia The First has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that you can write a show with giving meaningful outcomes and development to a huge cast of characters. And no, it’s not dark. But, it literally has more impact than Miraculous Ladybug.

[@petervizzini4006]

@@narnia1233 I liked the final battle with vor

[@ashebennett7726]

@AptMantis2278 the fact that it’s a kids show is EXACTLY why it should be taken seriously. Children deserve to be treated as PEOPLE with intelligence. Underdeveloped, doesn’t mean stupid. But they are impressionable. Children will develop a way of thinking and take things to heart. Why do you think parents dictate what their children can or can’t watch? Because they may not find the morals to be taken seriously or real life situations handled in a sensitive manner, and they don’t want to expose their children to it. If a kidnapping/hostage situation played off for laughs, it could be painful for a child of trauma who survived such ordeal to look at. Or if stalking was seen as something quirky/funny/cute, people like me won’t see their source of trauma that way which is insulting for something scary that they remember from their past to also be played off for laughs. So no, it’s not just a kids show. Real life situations are put into these stories all the time and the characters given the illusion they are real so that the audience can connect with these characters. And if the connections feel real, it can either be helpful or hurtful to members of the audience who might want to learn how cope with their situations/issues/trauma etc. For example, my comfort characters are Octavia Goetia, Stolas Goetia, Varian, Peter Parker/Spider-Man, and the mains from Demon Slayer because I relate to and connect with them as a way to cope with my issues. They tell me it’s okay to not feel okay, you’re stronger than before, don’t let people walk all over you, you’re important, through depression and anxiety it’s possible to be happy again, things like that. Animation can be a great influence and leave a strong impact on audiences of all ages. That’s why good writing is crucial. There’s a reason critiques exist. There’s a reason stories exist. Even when they don’t have to mean anything, they can still be enjoyable if written with talent. But if it’s suppose to mean anything, it’s important to write with care. I’m not trying to sound exaggerating, but it’s a kids show is not an excuse for bad writing and it’s not an excuse to be insulting towards the audience. It’s flimsy at best and boils down to “it’s suppose to be bad” “you’re wrong for wanting it to be good” “they’re just kids, it’s not like they’re smart enough to get it” but the reality is children are not stupid and it’s insulting to their intelligence when people say “it’s a kids show” as if they don’t think children deserve better or to be treated like people with intelligence. So I’m tired of these excuses. Don’t give excuses, just do better.

[@facundopollacino7956]

​@@ashebennett7726 ¡exactamente!, creer qué los niños son tontos es erróneo.

[@nicholasbalingit9049]

I feel the same way too! Adrien and Chloe were much more interesting characters, but of course the show threw away their character development to make Marinette look better because she's the protagonist. My Hero Academia did the same thing with Shoto and Bakugou so they could keep focusing more on Midoriya. It's a shame both groups got sidelined because they're more interesting than the actual main characters.

[@phoenixshadow6633]

The movie handled Gabriel's and Adrien's relationship so much better despite how the two have less screen time together.

[@mileyrodriguez9432]

Agreed 👍

[@YoKujo_05]

Fr

[@littlesparrow303]

Can’t wait to look forward to that!! I saw a tumblr post so spoiled it for me a bit. I can wait 2 more weeks for it

[@jasminkrieger8464]

Zag thinks the plot a bit more structured and better

[@jasminkrieger8464]

Its zag version alternative Verse mit astrucks series one zag wanted a multiverse like in Spiderman

[@Thoast_]

Honestly that pitch of having adrien being the one to talk down his dad sounded really good, kinda sad thats not the ending we got.

[@chillswany]

B-b-but Gabriel Agreste needed to be redeemed, because unlike Chloe who is an abused teen he can change…😢

[@geoffreygoncalves931]

Did you watch the episode or read between the lines and scenes ? This is not a redemption. He glorified himself, escaped to his wife in death and gilttriped a teen in a lie. He's selfish, as usual. He didn't change.

[@marocat4749]

@@geoffreygoncalves931 Can you read sarcasm, that comment is as earnst as the smallest violine in th world plying for poor gabe. If not, renas comment is sarcasm and mockery.

[@geoffreygoncalves931]

@@marocat4749 Sorry, it's hard to tell with this crazy part of the fandom. It's a bit tiring....

[@katrinaleahu9369]

This show made me mad frr

[@Kirbyscreed]

LMAOOO frfr poor gab need a redemption over chloe because he's an adult :(

[@Eramiskel]

If this show gets a season six I hope they revive Adrien's character after it was horrifically assassinated in season four and five. The finale, ironically surrounding the Agreste family, which includes Adrien, had pretty much nothing to do with him, something that had an amazing build up to a climactic scene, was an angry Adrien/Chat Noir, we've seen how he fights while angry and how he isn't afraid to use his Cataclysm, and when he developed to be able to use his Cataclysm as much as he wants it raised the stakes of how dangerous he could be to anyone who opposes him, but then Thomas realised how much of an amazing plot development that is, decided to shut down any possibility of an outburst from an angry Adrien as Chat Noir, by using Gabe using that nightmare stick thing to instill fear in Adrien that his anger would destroy everything, therefore he would control his anger.

[@Neather_king_neaus]

Seasons 6 7 8 have been confirmed

[@marocat4749]

in a better show, given treated that way, adien would go harry osbourne :(

[@nixthelapin9869]

Considering how they handled his issues and their dynamic in season 4 (ie, brushing it under the rug), I highly doubt it

[@virnalassiter382]

Yeah it may not be a big deal sense we got in the previous episode but yeah like what's the point of making the main villan of the show related to cat noir if ladybug is in the spotlight more? And yeah it's disappointing that the agreste hero isn't in the final that much or even thought and didn't get a reunion with his mother and Natalie I guess the season 4 final was better considering Adrian finally got to tell someone that he doesn't want what his father wanted and Marinette has finally got the nerve to convince Adrian to stand up to his father and almost tell him she loves him and yeah I can't believe he still is willing to help ladybug despite how much she ignored him for the whole season and yeah they are like oh yeah were going to get those miraculoues back together and yeah they should have tried to grab as many miraculoues as they can in destruction defelgration and intuition but nope Marinette's attempt to retrieve the miraculoues just came out in the final ha feel free to say that at least in the 3rd final car noir had gotten alot more time to fight than ladybug but look the season 3 final is only bad because that led to chole's redemption arc being thrown into the trashcan but look it was fun regardless even if Marinette did get kagmi just to keep her away from Adrian it's good to see her held back her jealously and try to have fun with her and kagmi the season 5 final is over the place

[@assiaelkhayate-sl8hu]

The show is already getting 8 seasons,even 12 if the audience stays

[@lenastorm6280]

Gabriel, the grown man, who abused his son and terrorized all of Paris gets redeemed, but Chloe, the 14-year old CHILD can't get a redemption, because she's a spoiled brat & a bully. Makes sense. -.-

[@esayem7746]

She's beyond help, truly evil incarnate. But the man whose been terrorizing his son and Paris for months is just sad cus he misses his wife, go easy on him :'( 🎻

[@JayRedGear]

@@esayem7746 I miss my wife, Tails. I mean, Ladybug.

[@JuanGomez-ke5py]

Yeah Chloe is the most realistic character in the show

[@Jagged-Dust-Jacket]

The child Abuser is redeemed and the 13 year old girl with trauma is demonized and has a whole character Assasination. Totally good writing.

[@pagodrink]

It's wild how the latest Spider-verse inadvertently did this type of story much better. Of course, there's a lot of differences, especially since Spider-verse follows mainly Miles' perspective, but the main part of Miles and Adrien respectively being left out in a super hero group and the movie still goes out of it's way to show a huge part of Gwen's story so that we can understand her actions while still understand why Miles would be upset with her. Miles gets to have his moments where he stands up against the people who wanna put him down, while Adrien doesn't. Again, the stories are ultimately different and there are different stakes, but the fact that Spider-verse was able to give two superhero character almost equal time to flesh out a story between them, while a 5 season series couldn't is unbelievable.

[@rllytrd3316]

which is crazy when you consider miraculous had so much more time to do so also spider-verse on top

[@empirestate8791]

I don't like that Gabriel's identity wasn't revealed to the population. I think it would have been very interesting to see Adrien speak about his father's crimes and promise to make up for his father's legacy by being a good person himself. It would have been a great culmination to Adrien's arc. I also think an identity reveal would have been excellent, especially between Adrien and Gabriel.

[@creativerealms]

Apparently Jeremy Zag agreed. Man the movie just does things so much better. Its not perfect mind you but it avoids so many of the mistakes of season five and the show.

[@janellecharles7337]

Miraculous Ladybug is an example of how you should NOT write a show! You can't milk complicated love drama into a show; it would never work! Bro, people were waiting to reveal their secret identies since season 2! Remember the episode "Dark Owl"? People were patient for that special moment, but of course, no! The writers thought it would be soon to reveal their identies, so they decided to extend it! I hate it that they always put the focus on Adrienette, Adrienette, Adrienette! When the show first started, I was a fan of that ship, but as the show progressed through time, it got too tastless consistently. Ugh! I even thought they were better off with Luka and Kagami, because it wasn't it! For real, when the MariChat arc accumulated over time in season four, the writers just had to BUTCHER it! You know why? It's because the writers are just TOO OBSESSED with Adrienette! They always find a way to envy the fandom: "Chat Blanc" and "Ephemeral". LIKE STOP PLEASE! ✋✋✋✋ They regressed too many characters arcs! So much missed potential! The writing just gets lazier and lazier everytime, CON ✋SIS ✋TENT ✋LY! Like I started to move away from the all the love drama and depend on the other featured story arcs in the show: Luka's arc, the Agreste family, Alya's development, Felix's purpose and appearance, etc. Of course, some of that gets demolished, and the writers just want to shift it over to ADRIENETTE! This season finale describes so much of this disgraceful, god-awful show! Adrien should've been the one there to confront his dad, but no! The writers thought it would be too much for Adrien to handle! "It will be too dark," they probably said. They didn't even show everyone's reaction when the world "ended," just an unbearable, utterly unbearable, happy ending! Bruh! I've been watching this show for seven years and THIS is what I and all of the other fans RECEIVE? Wasted some much of my life! 😩😩😩😩

[@katrinaleahu9369]

So based☝ I feel like I wasted my life too. Thankfully i wasnt invested in the show sience season 3 (God what a bad season ending that one had too). I reached the point where whatever happened happened. And I couldnt care less. This show is pathetic

[@janellecharles7337]

@@katrinaleahu9369 I hope, now that Astruc is gone for the sixth season, the writing might get better, I hope!😢

[@underachieve2258]

I 1000% agree. They threw away so many good characters just to make Adrien and Marinette look good, but in reality it just made us all realize the writers were digging this show into the ground. Luka, Chloe, Alya - all destroyed. I started to get bored of this show because there were so many things that just didn't make sense that never got addressed and the way they suddenly pushed Adrienette after four whole seasons of nothing; them getting together this season didn't even make any sense. So glad that this "arc" is over so I can never touch this show again.

[@poppyseed799]

Tbh if they removed the ships I wouldn’t be as interested in the show. It’s a core part of the series and the show would lose a lot of what makes it unique if they removed the romance drama. It gives the show more flavor. I’m not even like rooting for the ships, it’s just fun to watch the drama unfold, and if they made it simpler to focus on the important stuff then the show wouldn’t be as fun and interesting to watch imo. We all have our own opinions and you can say that the romance drama is written poorly, but to remove the romantic conflict would, imo, ruin what the show is supposed to be about.

[@dziabuka1981]

​@@janellecharles7337 even if he's gone there's no way back. Astruc did too much damage to that show

[@Benn847]

4:06. Thank you!! Thomas was spewing on twitter that Adrian wasn’t included because “it didn’t work before” but time should change characters and showing that Adrian has grown throughout the season and maybe his relationship with Mari made him a better person with stronger control of his emotions, but no he was ripped away. So stupid

[@iothemighty]

I've seen some of Astruc's tweets, I think replacing Adrien with Marinette is supposed to be some kind of women empowerment thing, sort of the reason Adrien/Cat Noir been a punching bag this entire series. Yeah man its really frustrating being a Miraculous fan 😭

[@esayem7746]

He's not the feminist he thinks he is lmaoo

[@rileypickett778]

Hilarious he thinks that he's fooling anyone with that "rah-rah girl power" spiel when all you have to do is look at his treatment of just about every other female character in the show. 😂Dude has been mad for years over Adrien/Chat Noir's popularity & fans' being very vocal about wanting more screentime so wrote him out of the series defining moment that was very obviously from the beginning set up for his character out of spite.

[@greenstarlover1]

It's like a bad dnd player stealing your spotlight in what should've an important backstory-related epic battle. The pieces were all into place, and they were all knocked over in one fell swoop.

[@zoruasnivy]

I don't feel empowered by Astruc's writing in the slightest. If you have to sideline the men in a story to make the women stand out, you're doing it wrong. Not to mention the morals he presents in the show are very questionable. Marinette's stalker behaviour gets a pass, but Chat's doesn't? Marinette was just as bad if not worse.

[@Doomzdeh]

It isn’t really about that. Astruc has shown time and time again that he hates any kind of fan criticism or feedback and that he absolutely hates our ideas for the show because he finds it patronizing to take any input from us. The fact that the fandom wanted Chat Noir to play a central role so badly is why he did this. He wanted to gut punch us to show that he’s in control of the show and that we aren’t. He’s a literal man child. It’s a pattern. Something big happens in the show, fans rave about how much potential it has and where they want it to go, and Astruc promptly either drops the plot or takes it in the opposite direction. It happened with Fu’s backstory, it happened with Chloe’s arc in Season 3, it happened with Lukanette and Adrigami, it happened with Adrien’s angst in Season 4, it happened with the Sentimonster reveal of Adrien/Felix/Kagami, it happened with Luka finding out Ladybug and Chat Noir’s identities, it happened with the Chat Blanc reveal to Adrien, and it even happened with the hopes of Ladynoir or Marichat being built up after the Season 4 Finale (instead, Astruc demolished both in the most disrespectful and nonsensically made Adrien fall for Marinette within one episode for no reason). I hate this show. I hate how it constantly drew my eye with its unlimited potential and yet let me down at every possible opportunity. I hate how Astruc treats us fans and I hate how utterly disrespectful this finale was to all of us. I’m not watching whatever slop they put out after this unless Astruc is far away from it. I’m at my limit.

[@electrobob992]

AGREED I personally expected Felix to swoop in, break his girlfriend and his cousin out of the parent made prison, reveal to adrien that he learned his identity after he took his ring and to go confront his father. Possibly felix and kagami CALM his nerves from the revelation, etc. *Thus preventing a cat blanc scenario, OOO maybe this time even with the amok Adrien's love for Marinette overrides it without the sudden shock during the fight. Like the amok itself BREAKS without him breaking, a sorta emotional feedback. Making him his OWN amok.* Having a three way reveal at the manor, but NO that wasn't Astruc's plan. He wanted Adrien to be the Kent to Marinette being Barbie. Adrien is JUST arm candy, nothing more, nothing less.

[@ultimatedisneycruiselinefa5112]

Thank you! You’d make a better writer than Mr. Astruc!

[@Doomzdeh]

I’ve seen many takes on what the finale should have been, but I think we can agree that yours is the best. Felix breaking Adrien and Kagami out could’ve given us the interesting subplot we needed as Marinette confronted Gabriel. All three are Sentimonsters so it makes sense. Felix and Kagami reveal everything to Adrien, they run into Madame Tsurugi (she legit got off scot free in canon), she reveals her role in everything, they defeat her, and she tells them out of respect what Gabriel is up to. They run to assist Marinette, who is getting the pants beaten off of her by Gabriel and his many Miraculouses. Just as he’s about to take her earrings, Chat Noir busts through and cataclysms the floor, sending everyone to the basement. As the dust clears, everyone is shocked to see Emilie’s body. Chat Noir freezes, Kagami runs to help Ladybug, and Argos fights off Monarch. Kagami has no miraculous though, and Gabriel, in all of his cruelty, grabs her and threatens to end her with the amok if Felix doesn’t yield. Everyone steps down and Gabe smirks and demands the Miraculouses. Chat Noir breaks down in anger and screams at him. Monarch isn’t phased until Chat Noir destransforms, at which point Monarch is shocked as Adrien confronts him. Ladybug is absolutely floored too. Adrien gives his miraculous to Gabe, saying that he hopes this is worth it to him, because he may regain a wife but he’s forever lost a son. And he says he doubts his mother would ever be with a horrible person like him, revives or not. Felix jumps in for some verbal lambasting and Kagami does too, comparing Gabe to her mother. Ladybug destransforms, lends Adrien her support, and gives Gabe her miraculous. Gabe is suddenly conflicted on what to do and this is when Nathalie shows up, glaring at him and telling him that he’ll be able to revive Emilie but that he’ll never be loved by anyone again. He destroyed his family with his schemes; he didn’t save it. Gabriel cries but resolves that he must go through with it, as he’s come too far to give up. Everyone is embittered at this as he makes his wish, dying in front of their eyes as they all turn their backs on him. He tries to reach out to Adrien or to Nathalie and neither will look at him. He realizes just what he’s become and he tells them that he’s sorry. He uses his wish to fix Nathalie. He doesn’t revive Emilie, as he wishes to see her in death and knows that Adrien has moved on. He gives Adrien his amok and tells him that he’s his own person now. Adrien bitterly takes the rings and therefore takes his destiny into his own hands. Afterwards, we see Ladybug return the other Miraculouses to Luka, making him the unofficial Guardian after his training and his move back to Paris. Ladybug keeps her memories but the Miraculouses are safe. She, Adrien, Felix, and Kagami are the only permanent holders. The Butterfly Miraculous is in safe hands, at least for the time being, though we all know that will change pretty soon. That’s my ending.

[@mari_stari]

​@@DoomzdehTHIS WOULD HAVE BEEN SO GOOD BUT THOMAS. FUCKING. ASTRUC. OR HOWEVER YOU SPELL IT HAD TO CAST ADRIEN ASIDE CAUSE HE'S "a FeMiNiSt 🥺🥺" I WISH YOUR VERSION WAS THE CANON ONE 😭

[@madexha]

Anyone, who only watched ONE episode of the show, can write a better fan fiction of the finale than the miraculous writing team.

[@dizzyheads]

Look at the movie for a good example lol

[@godabandonedthistimeline]

The most shocking thing about this show is that the people who write it are being paid. Meanwhile the majority of the fans has better ideas about the characters and the plot, many of them write fanfiction in their spare time and don't get paid. Edit: I just realized how that came across so to correct myself, the people who most likely made the show like this are the show runners and not the writers. The writers that tried to save the show deserve better.

[@marocat4749]

Dont blame them, blame the sshowrunner and hearwritr, astruc , cough cough. Seriously they ar paid to write wht thdey are told to write, and given it had good scenes, they tried, but they cant decide how hthe story goes. So yeah, blame the showrunner and headwriter. astruc

[@godabandonedthistimeline]

@@marocat4749 You are right. The writers probably tried to do something better with the show. They unfortunately are the ones that we usually blame.

[@Yami-mugoni613]

⁠@@godabandonedthistimelinehell astruc reconned the hard work of writers that did Chloe redemption arc

[@littlesparrow303]

Yep as someone who writes fanfiction for fun I agree. Even writing ships for Marinette who isn’t Adrien is done so much better

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

@@littlesparrow303 True.

[@Cat-oc5gc]

They made a statue for the man that tortured EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD! Because he gave up in the very last minute to bring his wife back… DID THAT EVEN AFFECT THEM?!?! Why?!?! 🤨😤

[@heartsisastars_]

After watching the show for eight years they mess up this arc SO BADLY like the show already had a problem with trying to handle Marinette and Adrian both as the main characters this easily could've been fixed if we threw out some of the stalker behavior from Marinette or Adrian idolizing Ladybug and gave them both time in each season so we can learn and follow their character development more. IT MAKES NO SENSE WHY ADRIAN WASN’T THE FINALE! This is his Dad Gabriel is the main villain how do you not gonna let him be in the finale but let his girlfriend be in it and get all his development? It also wasted those episodes like Cat Blanc and Ephemeral seems pointless now they made it seem like Adrian was going to finally find out about his dad in the finale and set that all up but no nothing like that happened at all.

[@Lordxzamasu]

Honestly if Adrian was the main character of this hawk moth ark the show would be a lot more interesting

[@delphoxhoopa7289]

They'd still probably find a way to mess it up....😕

[@ashebennett7726]

@@delphoxhoopa7289just get rid of Asstruc and his flunkies and replace them with Zag and his team. Problem solved.

[@Icelynsinging]

Alix brought Luca to Paris, why couldn’t she have opened a portal into Adrien’s room and take him there too? 😭

[@Renno802]

she dont kno2 Adrian is CN plus luka know both LB CN identity etc

[@craigpeoples9883]

​@@Renno802Alix has time travelled for probably a few weeks at this point she should know

[@BoyFromBelgium99]

*My improvements of the show that would make Miraculous so much better:* 1. Don't let anyone, not your team, hackers or fans, ever get the whole summary of every episode you made or going to make. 2. Don't change the animation when different people work on the show, especially when it's the first and second season of the show. 3. Do more research of Paris and it's buildings and let buildings in the show replace real ones, so visiting Paris isn't disappointing. 4. Similar to the MCU, they should've had a script with the whole story but make it that every episode has something to set up. 5. Be more clear about what the backstories and intentions are for every character, like how did Gabriel get the Butterfly. 6. If there are upgrades then show us every upgrade throughout the show, not just 3 or 4 of them. 7. Character developments: let there be an evolution to the story of every character, like half of the characters don't do much. 8. Don't use a lot of the same villains but let there be different ones each time, that way you make it more interesting to watch. 9. Make more realistic scenes like the politics and helicopter crashes are so wrong. I get it, it's a kid show but then don't include them. 10. Make Adrien like Marinette throughout Season 4 instead of only in Season 5, that way the specials are a nice set up for them. 11. Introduce characters like Luka, Zoé, Kagami, Félix and Su Han much earlier so we know who they are once they step up. 12. Let Chloe becoming more friendly towards Marinette when Lila comes into the show, that way you get development. 13. Adrien & Kagami are done dirty in Season 5, it all feels rushed and they're pushed away in the final. Let them escape and help. 14. Let there be consequences of actions, Gabriel, Félix, Tomoe, Chloe, Lila and some others don't deserve getting forgiven. 15. Make it that Season 4 is stretched over Season 3 & 4, so that every classmate can shine in some episodes with their Miraculous. 16. Address the sentimonster plot a lot earlier in the show so fans can understand what it means and what can happen later on. 17. Give us more episodes like Derision, where we see backstories having an effect on the present day and the characters. 18. Let Hawkmoth/Shadowmoth/Gabriel come out of his secret hideout more, he should take more risks because he's desperate. 19. Explain us in videos on youtube certain stuff that isn't in the show like the kwami powers, what they like to eat etc. 20. Bring us more information about the release of episodes and first air them in English or French, not the whole Gloob thing.

[@ishashifar]

Honestly this show has so much untapped potential, like with the premise, the worldbuilding it's so easy to write a good story with it. I know it because I can come up with multiple storylines for fanfics just from the typical girl and boy are heroes, girl likes boy, boy likes the superhero form of her oh and the boy's father is the villain to save his dead mother, even with that simple information it's so easy to come out with storylines for multiple charecters yet they don't do it

[@BoyFromBelgium99]

@@ishashifar Yea that's what frustrated me a lot as well and my point 4 was brought up, if they had a script for the whole Agreste arc, it would've been better with storytelling and every episode we would've seen new villains, new characters and new buildings and recognize them from the real world. That way you don't get a set of like 4 blocks of buildings and nothing else, while Paris is a really big city and with 5 seasons you expect at least some diversity, also show off different superpowers and obstacles etc

[@adraabouji1937]

I agree, but PLEASE not Dersiion. It's just an awful retcon.

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

Adrien got treated horribly! I'm seriously disgusted by the season 5 finale! And Adrien should honestly just break up with Marinette! I'm sorry. But she has lied to him so much and I'm sick of it! Adrien needs his family! Not a stalker or abusive PIGTAILED STALKING CREEP as a girlfriend!

[@DragonGoddess18]

It's repulsive that she thinks telling an abuse victim that their abuser was a "hero", is the right thing to do Doing one good thing doesn't "Thanos snap" away all the bad things he willingly did. Marinette has no right to do that to Adrien and it's gonna come back to bite her

[@Awtuch]

I agree

[@MGory828]

And here’s the best part. Marinette is, ok with all of this. She is fine with the lying. She is fine with making her enemy look like a hero. She is fine with lying to everyone as if she thinks it’s the best solution.

[@virnalassiter382]

Well yeah lied to him alot as cat noir but what about him as Adrian? Of course lied to him if she was going to fight as ladybug but what else? Of course about his father being a hero but I mean before she's went from being an obssevie stalker and fine think what you want I mean look there both love morans neither of them have the gut to let their crushes go off they both Iove hamsters and look both has gotten threw alot of torment forget it was in the last minute and it was just to excuse her stalking behavior Marinette had to suffer with chole alot more than she does now and yeah Adrian has been abused maybe not 100% but yes they deserve each other geez people stop making Adrian look better than Marinette I feel like I'm the only one seeing cat noir as a creepy stalker dame I would rather be stalked with someone doing what Marinette is doing than how cat noir is doing like don't you get that people don't like sexual harassment that's one of the reasons ladybug is so mean to cat noir like i can't entirely blame Kim who maplated her into being interested in a boring man over a cool and fun guy if cat noir weren't so stupid and accepted ladybug not loving him back than with or without Kim making her lose interest in guys with his personality she wouldn't have to act like a mom to him

[@vgngolley341]

Seriously, why the fuck would Marinette hide the secret from Adrien? Gabrie doesn’t deserve her keeping what he did a secret. Adrien DESERVES to know the truth

[@user-soneinewholazyforcontent]

They didn't give cat noir that big role in season 4 finale and they absolutely removed him from season 5 finale honesty season 3 was last season when lb and cn were truly partners this all is building up to adrien going in his villian arc and confronting absolutely everyone leaving them and having his own life i hope it happems! HE NEEDS TO KNOW THE TRUTH!

[@kaijunasan4497]

Remember the days every episode was so anticipated ❤ the finale could have been a lot more tho

[@miss_chelles1338]

Fr!

[@moonie6801]

I miss those days.

[@Me-dr9dv]

It's quite simple actually. Adrien/Chat Noir was excluded from the battle in order to make Marinette look better. This is a "girls show", which apparently means Adrien/Chat can not participate/have his time to shine out of risk of downplaying the "girl power!' message.

[@hiradsadeghi4406]

The Worst part about the finale is the fact that they threw that two What if scenarios In s3 and s4 , and since there will be no Agreste Confrontation , because Gabe is gone , there are the only cannon things we have.

[@athena6425]

this finale made me so mad! the fact that after gabriel literally caused so much more harm, but he was “accepted as a hero” is just so freaking stupid. He literally caused trauma and terror to the citzens of paris yet they MADE HIM A STATUE FOR EVERYONE TO ADMIRE. and its literally like the people of paris are robots too because they for real were cheering for him. also the fact that this show is called “Tales of Ladybug AND Chatnoir” Chat Noir did not even get the reveal of his father, the pain of finding out that it was HIM all along but instead it was just brushed off. Horrible writing. Even a wattpad fanfic of this show is seriously 10x better. This show had so much potential, please somebody fire the writers like. 😭😭😭

[@itemboy6814]

Not being in the finale of your own character arc has got to be something like your family forgetting about your funeral

[@greenstarlover1]

Sounds like something out of r/rpghorrorstories

[@primal1233]

This season finale is disappointing. It could have been so much better

[@littlesparrow303]

Especially it being the end of the first arc

[@jasminkrieger8464]

Be glad it isnt cut like hey arnold season 6 earthworm jim series reboot dark Crystal age of resistance season 2 or steven universe ok heroes starve forces of evil cut

[@jasminkrieger8464]

They cancelled the powerpuff live Action series people are glad since sone live Action dont work

[@bigj200016]

Don’t get me wrong, the finale was pretty good. But you’re right. Adrien missing from it all was just completely stupid. Even if Astruc was insistent on Garbriel ultimately winning, Adrien needed to be part of the fight with his father. And there needed to be some sort of reunion with Emilie. The fact that Adrien appears to never learn what a complete POS Gabriel was is just a huge fail.

[@rhaeasoul8531]

I also have to question how they explained monarch. Who took the blame for being the big bad that has been terrorizing the city all year? Give the Saw movies some credit it’s explained that multiple people have taken the name jigsaw; now in ladybugs cover story who were the the people / person that acted as monarch? Someone had to get blamed for all that so who?

[@Doomzdeh]

How was any of the finale good to you? I legitimately cannot understand, as I myself can’t find any redeeming factors to it. The side characters are uselessly fighting random goons, the goons all look the same and aren’t even interesting at all, Adrien and Kagami and Felix are missing in action, Madame Tsurugi gets off scot-free, Nathalie isn’t involved in Gabe’s redemption, Marinette only confronted Gabe because of Adrien and not because she found out his identity, the fight took up pretty much all of the episode without any plot, Lila is suddenly a hacking whiz without any explanation, Lila shows up conveniently without being seen, Lila manages to find the Butterfly Miraculous when she didn’t witness where it feel and should’ve been seen by Marinette, Lila should’ve had no reason to believe she could steal any Miraculous in this fight, Gabriel’s redemption was rushed to hell and he has no connection to Marinette as a character, and the epilogue is so absurdly painful that it’s not even funny. Ms. Bustier suddenly being mayor and fixing all of the city’s problems is idiotic and unrealistic, Gabriel is worshipped as a hero, and we don’t even get to see Adrien interact with anyone after all that happened. This was the biggest slap in the face I’ve ever received by any story’s ending. I can’t imagine any way that this finale could have been worse.

[@Doomzdeh]

@AptMantis2278 It being a kids show does not excuse such atrocious writing. You either are able to write plots out well or you aren’t; None of Miraculous’s plots were tied up in this finale. We don’t see Luka’s Guardian arc come into play, we don’t see Nathalie come into play to fight Gabe, we don’t see Adrien or Kagami or Felix at all, and Gabe is suddenly redeemed by a girl he doesn’t know and doesn’t like. Nothing makes sense about it and I’m tired of everyone excusing it because our standards have been dropped to hell by Astruc over the years.

[@darkron288]

It kinda became obvious that the creators and writers didn't care about Adrian at all. Adrian in any other show would have been the main character because he is a character with alot deep and interesting wells of stories they could draw from with his father being the MAIN antagonist. But instead we focus on his stalker the entire show. Ladybug should have been the wacky and well meaning sidekick to Adrian's story but nah because "its a girl's show we must have a female lead" ugh go to hell Thomas austruck

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

Facts! Thomas asstruc belongs in hell.

[@OthandoSimamane-lb1kr]

I agree with that entirely

[@kehkehd646]

I’m not even mad Marinette is the main character. The show could’ve been great with Mari as the Mc if it just FOLLOWED UP ON ITS PLOT POINTS AND DIDN’T SIDELINE THE SECOND TITULAR CHARACTER

[@wispral7739]

on twitter somebody asked austruc abt why adrien isn't preveleny and he said "marinette is barbie, adrien is just ken" 😭😭😭

[@njivwathomassilavwe2056]

Honestly not that interested in Adrien myself but he deserved to be in the final fight

[@lornabrady2578]

Why did we not see the interaction with Adrien and his mum like or the sisters meeting again anything like that

[@lornabrady2578]

I know

[@pixelmagicbeat8131]

In season 6

[@BlueRoseAFK]

There is no confirmation that that was Emilie though, it could very well have been Amilie, and Gabriel wished to just cure Nathalie and sacrificed himself and Emilie for it

[@lornabrady2578]

True

[@lucamagic]

I always had a feeling it would end this bad tbh. It’s just something about barley no progress being made in so many years that made go “It’s either never going to happen or it’s going to happen but be bad”. By the way, the thing at the beginning about people growing up over this time, I felt that. When I started watching I was about 11 or twelve.

[@thetwotasksgirl1535]

Based on the clips I keep seeing on Instagram, Jeremy’s vision of miraculous as a whole *FAR* outweighs anything Thomas could ever hope to try and put out. I’m excited!

[@chickenelafsworld7105]

My favorite part of this season is when the existentially horrifying truth of Adrian being a sentimonster whose father has unknown control over his life is info dumped to Marinette. Like sir what does this have to do with her??? The full extent of his father’s abuse and secrets is revealed to us and they couldn’t even put him in the scene??? WHY??? Thomas really made on of his main characters the child of the villain then decided to give the reveals to his favorite instead. Like if you liked Marinette that much she should’ve been the one literally related to the plot. This is why everyone was mad at him on Twitter for sidelining Chat, he gave HIM the fixings of the main protagonist then mad him the supporting cast!

[@lukasoravec5815]

In my opinion, the only thing they can do to possibly save Adrien from becoming a full on unimportant side character, is to have Lila dump all the secrets everyone is keeping from him in his face because no one else will do that. I think they will do that because its a good storyline for him getting akumatized, but we cant trust this show anymore.

[@maybe8985]

The potential for it to be one of the greatest and interesting storylines in a kid cartoon and they just…🥴

[@DanBull-ww7qq]

I was well disspointed with Season 5 ending, you can just imagine now Adrian actually finding out what went down and going proper psycho over it. Wouldn't blame him at all, Adrian and Cat Noir have been treated pretty crappy and deserve more, there could be so much emotion with the way Adrian/Cat Noir are tied into Monarch/Gabrial

[@randomthings608]

The writers did Adrien's character dirty from season 1. Only this guy gets into trouble and unable to defeat the villains alone and ladybug always rescues the desperate cat coz why not. Finally they just screw up his character in the finale too .. whyyyyy???

[@SaveMeMoon]

The fact that we didn't even get to see Adrian reunite with his mom, that could have been the most emotional moment in the entire show. Won't be forgiving them for this and doubt I'll watch anything going forward with any enthusiasm.

[@riotkitty]

Adrien never finding out his dad is Hawkmoth is like if Luke Skywalker never found out that his father is Darth Vader. Now with this terrible finale, I’m questioning why would you make Gabriel Hawkmoth to begin with if you’d never have his son find out who he is?

[@rurihime4965]

It's like if instead of Luke confronting Vader it was Han, he gets the Vader is Anakin reveal for no reason and he doesn't tell Luke or Leia

[@riotkitty]

@@rurihime4965 oh god yeah 😂 few words of sauve from Han and Darth Vader just suddenly decides to toss the Emperor off

[@narnia1233]

Agreed. I honestly just can’t believe how Gabriel ended. Adrien has been set on fire, run over by a bus, and thrown in the trash. That’s how I feel. How in the world is Adrien left out of the ending of his own father? How in the world did we get gipped of even that confrontation? And sorry but how in the world is Adrien going to be able to trust Ladybug in the future if he ever finds out she lied to him about his dad? It’s hard to explain too but since Adrien didn’t get to see what actually happened in the final battle then I think it’d be near impossible for him to believe. How would Adrien even know it wasn’t Ladybug who got rid of his dad? I too didn’t really think it was possible to mess up the ending to Gabe so much. But, as usual I think the show runners for whatever reason prioritize the worst things in the story. Namely dragging out “the reveal” forever. When really if they DON’T make the reveal soon then they’re literally sabotaging the couple’s relationship. By the end of this show I don’t know if anyone will want Marinette and Adrien together. Which honestly I originally thought was impossible to do too. But seriously, Adrien literally needs probably an entire season to recover from the news of his father being Hawkmoth. It needs a lot of time for Adrien to go through his own journey. He shouldn’t be experiencing life THROUGH Marinette. He has to find his own way too. This in my opinion was literally the perfect moment for Adrien to be set up for his own hero’s journey. His own self reflection which he desperately needs-more than anyone else honestly. Honestly Adrien’s story has so much depth in it that he is more main character potential than Marinette. But, at the very least if he really was treated as a second main character then that would be good enough. It’s just a complete shame. Wouldn’t it have been so cool too if in the finale it ended with Adrien breaking apart from Ladybug to go on his own? And maybe to imply that he was on a razor’s edge to possibly turning into a villain in the next season? Personally that’s the type of thing I was imagining over the years. I always thought their costumes of light and dark-that it would be neat if Chat Noir became a shadowy figure for a time and becoming a true hero over time following a different journey than Ladybug. But obviously that’s never going to happen either.

[@greenstarlover1]

Tldr but you're completely right

[@greenstarlover1]

An Adrien villain arc is completely warranted considering how he treated so far. Let the kitty lash out for once.

[@Ace-oc6wx]

Dude thinking about how long ive watched this is gonna cause me to stare at a blank wall and rethink my life and think about how much time ive wasted just hoping for something to happen. Ive literally watched it half ny life, started watching it at 9 and im now 17.

[@sarawithnoh1811]

What's even worse is how they pushed Chat Noir/Adrien aside for the past 4 seasons and basically treated him like a punching bag which obviously created the inference between fans that Chat Noir would have an amazing jaw-dropping comeback and then they land the extreme final punch in the gut by having him locked up in London after teasing all the fans who've been watching this series for the past 8 years, by not even having him be a side-kick. Hell, he doesn't even get to find out his father was his indirect enemy that he'd been fighting for the past few years because Marinette lied to him for the thousandth time. Take Avatar the Last Airbender for an example. Imagine just before the battle of Lord Ozai and Aang, Sokka accidentally hits him in the back of the head with a boomerang and he falls unconscious, then Katara fights Ozai and get's defeated Aang is unconscious for the next literal like... DAY. Then afterwards Ozai reflects on his actions and he's like "nahhh I'm lowkey a terrible dude" and then accidentally lights himself on fire the next day and when Aang wakes up, Katara tells him some stupid ahh lie about what happened.

[@eleana4251]

Honestly i gave up on this show a long time ago. Gave up watching it that is, but I have been keeping up with peoples videos, hoping, hoping that is would get to a point where i wanted to watch again. Because i loved all the ideas it had and i wanted to love the show itself, but I lost my trust in the writing and i didnt want to be let down. Even still, this is awful. Adrien deserved better. I hope the fans will find a way to still engoy this by writing fanfics and making comics.

[@alandoodles]

Yeah, this finale was so disappointing. Like geez, I can't believe I'm surprised by it's poor execution.

[@thedeathsidius]

I love this show, but Thomas just, I don't know. He just doesn't want to give any attention to Adrien/Chat Noir. :( But my hope still lives on for the show. Waiting for season 6. :D Thomas Astruc won't be the writer in season 6.🎉🎉 (No offense)

[@GL4MORGL0SS]

Fr

[@Orkprof]

Remember when fans complained about the treatment for Chat Noir, and Astruc retaliated trying to frame the critics as mysoginists ("you guys can't accept a girl in the leading role")? Pepperidge farm remembers 😎

[@DragonGoddess18]

I agree Thomas needs to see a therapist because clearly,his personal problems are affecting the show in terrible ways and his behavior on social media. Putting male characters down to elevate female characters is not social justice. It's social vengeance.

[@virnalassiter382]

Yeah the only reason I'm trying to defend him is because of him chole didn't end up being a superhero yes I know how alot of people wanted chole redeemed but nope I don't do school bullies and yeah never wanted to see her as a superhero or get redeemed and yeah sense she's leaving Paris for good there's nothing we can do about chole's redemption arc with or without the drieactor who brought her back going away just because Adrian Alex and Luka have come back donsen't mean chole will

[@DragonGoddess18]

@@virnalassiter382 🤨 What's a "drieactor"

[@PringlestheToast]

Honestly, the ending for season three felt SO MUCH MORE COMPLETE than any other season imo! I know there were some unanswered questions at the time, but I believe that if the writing was done differently, the show could have ended at season 3. Or, at the least, end the way season 3 did, with Master Fu handing down the Miraculous box to Ladybug.

[@skunkaroonie]

okay gonna be completely honest, a lot of people are forgetting that Lila knows that Adrien's father was Monarch, personally the only thing excusing this ending, is the fact I theorize that Lila is going to find some way to continue to use that to her advantage, whether that be emotionally manipulative or another form of abuse. Either way, I'm kinda hoping that's the route that's theyre going to pursue. Perhaps Lila telling Adrien the truth, and Marinette's morality being tested.

[@kou7191]

Considering how they treat Lila, it's likely she'll get a case of smooth brain and only use it for the season finale.

[@esayem7746]

I'd be inclined to believe this if we got a hint in Marinette's expression while talking to Adrien about his dad, that she felt conflicted about having to hide such a huge thing from him. But we don't. If it does go anywhere it'll be just as trash as the last two seasons. Especially since despite popular belief, Astruc is STILL involved in the writing.

[@skunkaroonie]

@esayem7746 that's unfortunate xC I'm having my fingers crossed though

[@PramkLuna]

This has got to be the biggest SCREW YOU the show has ever done. So much build-up, so much money, so much time, and AN ALTERNATE REALITY VERSION that shows what would happen when Adrien discovers his dad is Hawkmoth, then toss that away. Even minor characters like Luka, Kagami, Felix and the Resistance make an appearance but our boy Adrien is locked away in London with NO ATTEMPTS FROM ANYONE to save him.

[@featherlight2652]

The fact that they messed up this story *so badly* is genuinely a marvel to me. I have absolutely been in love with the concept of this show for *years* and somehow they managed to completely and utterly butcher it. In a way it’s absolutely amazing

[@anothertypicalproduction5346]

"They just felt like they were filling up the quota" EXACTLY. I swear Thomas does hate Adrien. There are 7,000,000 ways that you could write this arc correctly. Every fan with a brain and heart can write it.

[@nicolas._.2294]

He probably hates adrien becs people love him more than Marinette

[@greenstarlover1]

Even the most poorly written fanfics in the community had an idea of how the end should've played. This show is reeaally bad firing off checkov's guns. It literally had an arsenal of them just laying dormant.

[@LuluHea]

Miraculous is full of wasted potentials. I hope this show gets a HUGE remake with actual good writing in far future.

[@splendisdude]

Smarty Pants makes me feel like I’m not the only one, and that I’m not going insane. Thank you.

[@Macalicious]

Chloé, Adrien, Kagami and Felix keep having more interesting things going on and it feels like 1 screenplay meeting later, the writers are like "okay, shit, we actually shouldn't have done this because then things get resolved. WE GOTTA SCRAP THIS" and then write off all progress.

[@gibberishfish0]

I’ve watched this show on and off for years. I watch it because I like the idea of the show and some of the characters, then I stop again because Marinette is too much of an obsessed stalker and it’s embarrassing. Today I’ve finally gone back and finished the show and I could not be more confused or disappointed. What was that play Kagami and Felix did and what was the point of it? Why did they leave Adrien locked up and have him give up his miraculous? Why did it end with Gabriel getting his wish? It ended with them failing and everyone still being left in the dark about Gabriel. I just hate the route this show took. Natalie dies, Gabriel got his wish, the confrontation between Adrien and his father never happened, and they still haven’t given us the Chat Noir and Ladybug’s reveal. I’m just so confused on what the hell they did with the ending. Honestly, this show needs a reboot. It has so much potential for something amazing. An example of its potential is the movie. The movie did a better job at making these characters likable and giving us a satisfying ending in 1 hour and 45 minutes then this show did in 5 fucking seasons.

[@김민석-r9r5u]

Hearing you describe what you would've done different makes me realize that you're really, really going to enjoy the Miraculous Movie. Like, really, really enjoy it. Can't wait for your review.

[@bearerofbadnews1375]

It impresses me that the diamonds of Steven Universe had a better redemption arc than Gabe.

[@darkron288]

The diamonds weren't really "redeemed" future makes it clear no one forgave the diamonds. No one wanted to start another 1000 year war so everyone just fake forgiveness so it wouldn't lead to another war

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

​@@darkron288So like Love and tolerate kinda?

[@artslife4424]

👍

[@marocat4749]

White is horrible, at least lue and yellow got a big scary bad and wer likable enough and characters, but white?!

[@monerb7185]

@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan steven just gained 3 racist aunts that he avaoids until he needs something from them pretty much

[@unihoshi8158]

The only way I could think of that would sorta redeem this would be for Lila to reveal that it was Marinette who stopped Monarch and blame her for the loss of his Adrien’s dad. Then we’d get a full betrayal mode where Adrien is conflicted, but then he recalls everything his father did, goes back to his senses and teams up again with Marinette. The ending was pretty bad but this is the only way I could see them redeem this😭

[@katemacdonald3765]

I think that your ending is 100x better and I'm glad I'm not the only one FREAKING ANNOYED by it. Every morning I wake up a little more annoyed. I've been so frustrated with the writing for so long that I've literally written my own story with a love square between two people (but set in a fey/fantasy world) because I need SOME REAL RESOLUTION, GODDAMNIT

[@joachimjara1473]

I really hope Adrien finds out about everything Ladybug hides from him. I think Adrien being the third arch villain would be the best way to make it up to us for this horrendous finale.

[@fxtmata]

I hate how adrien was BARELY included in the s5 finale. He deserves to be. They like to make everything about marinette when it shouldn’t be

[@LynnThreadzOfficial]

You just explained in less than 13 minutes why I stopped watching the show seasons ago 🤣They kept on adding random, boring plot points at some point instead of giving us an epic finale to the storyline that hooked us to begin with.

[@pamspray5254]

My greatest fear for the finale was that Adrien would get written out. I won't lie. I saw it coming. With how brief every scene he's been in was and how much they focused the camera on Marinette, I had a feeling the writing team was ready to write the boy off. I don't know if he'll ever get proper screen time at this point, but his character arc is by far one of the most compelling in the show. I enjoyed Marinette's struggle with anxiety for a while there because it was interesting, but she's mostly resolved that. The next thing on her character agenda is becoming a proper team leader. And unless they allow Cat Noir to shine in that role, I'm afraid we'll fall into a rotating perspective of Marinette + important hero(es) for the episode. Alya has stepped up where Adrien's stepped back and I'm worried about what that will translate too. I just hope that Ladybug's promise to never sideline Cat Noir again will carry through and that his character will actually be allowed to shine. Our boy's been through enough. The least the writers could do is follow through on at least **one** of his storylines. His name is in the title of the show for goodness sake! Let him be the star he deserves to be.

[@Jasiuc330]

This is the reason why everything past S2 is shit. Season 2 gave us everything we needed in term of plot -New Kwamis -Chloe redemption Arc -Gabriels caring side about his son and reveal of his true intentions -and much more but what we received in upcoming seasons? everything went to shit expect kwami thing How they could mess it so baddly We should receive an episode where Gabriel start doubting even more in his doing noticing how much and more and more he is hurting his son. Yet we got scene where Gabe learns about Adrien second identity and rather being shocked and have more doubts he smiles and get excited cause he can exploit it. Compare it to "Gorozilla" (I think it was name) episode from season 2 and tell me that this is the same Gabriel Agreste

[@ArcticFFox]

I think the most tragic part is that this is the Ladybug and Cat Noir show, they should have wrapped this arc up with the two fighting side by side perfectly in sync with one another. Instead they just made Marinette become god for a couple of minutes meanwhile Adrien wasn't even allowed to be awake during the fight.

[@austint4139]

The weirdest part to me is the plot progression For the first 3 seasons the plot drags at a snail’s pace then for seasons 4 and 5 the snail suddenly has a rocket and is going at light speed

[@greenstarlover1]

Went so fast it crashed head first into a wall.

[@bdariamihaela]

I was in middleschool when I started watching the show. Now I'm in college

[@starsshinesforever1425]

I was in elementary school when I started the show now I jus finished high school and I’m getting ready to go off to college.

[@emilyprice178]

I think Astruc's obsession with sidelining Adrien/Chat Noir can be explained by him wanting to be/portray himself as a feminist, but he is unwilling to examine his own misogyny. We've all grown up in a society where women are still not yet treated as equal to men, and as such we all to some extent have interalised the misogynistic messages that kind of society teaches. It takes self-awareness to examine your own biases and realise that "hey, I've internalised something that when I actually think about it, is actually a close-minded/bigoted/harmful idea" and to put in the work to unlearn that idea. Astruc has good intentions, wanting to create a positive female role model for girls, but he clearly has biases that he isn't willing to admit to even himself. He thinks that if he lets Adrien share Marinette's spotlight at all, then the audience will automatically treat him like he's the main character, simply because he's male, which highlights Astruc's own bias, that he thinks that female characters will be bulldozed by male characters because subconsciously he thinks that female characters are inherently weaker than male characters. He doesn't trust that Marinette/Ladybug is a compelling enough character on her own, so he throws the second most important character in show under the bus to bolster her as the main character, completely unnecessarily.

[@ashebennett7726]

And when people comment how Jeremy Zag’s movie is way better than the series, Thomas tweets “the movie gives people what they want, but my series gives people what they need”. What does that even mean? Thomas worked on this show for eight years and there’s very little to no pay off. And pay off and closure is a NEED for the audience, not a desire. His goal is to have the longest running series possible, not a decent story with beloved and relatable characters. You know what, this is about HIS desires, not what the audience needs for pay off and closure. This man has the ego the size as the freaking sun and it burns with passion to make him feel like he’s some god of writing children’s shows which he believes is better than shows like WINX, power rangers, sailor moon, any anime or ATLA. Like freaking really? He really believes he and his show is the sh*t when so many people are leaving it while so many people are rightfully walking away from it and revisit their favorite series from their childhood or watching Jeremy Zags movie and actually applauding the movie. I’ve seen an audience reaction in theaters from France and they applaud and hollered like when people watch infinity war, end game or Spider-Man movies. And why? Because Jeremy Zag gets it! Thomas only thinks he does. And I believe that Thomas believes he ‘gets it’ is all I’m saying.

[@ventusxzephyr13]

The cruelest thing Gabe ever did was making Adrien believe he finally had his father back.

[@zechariahanderson98]

Who also thinks Felix should have teamed up with lady bug and confront Gabriel with her. Who else thinks that the episode should have been longer and we have chat blance fight landybug

[@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisFan]

That would've made the season 5 finale a bit better.

[@Ysae791]

Or maybe he could have gone to save Adrien because he would know that saving Adrien would definitely distract Gabriel who LB would be fighting.

[@ImD3Star]

Adrien: Me and You against the world Ma lady Adrien on the finale: *wears a clown costume* We are super robbed with a great finale only for adrien to not be there to find out the truth

[@Libra712]

The ending finale was kinda like Ben 10 Ultimate Alien. The whole arc of Dagon vs Sir George ended up with Ben using Ascalon against Vilgax. What's the point of building the entire plot if Sir George and Dagon were replaced at the last minute. Same goes for MLB, the entire time tension between Adrien and Gabriel has risen like a volcano that is about to erupt and in the finale Adrien wasn't even there, leaving Marinette to fight his father on her own, alone. In both episode Chat Blanc and Ephemeral we got to see how Adrien found out the truth about Emilie, about his father being the holder of the Butterfly Miraculous and got akumatized in the end. What we want to see in the finale is that will he stand against his father or will he be akumatized again and succumb to his fate? Guess we will never find out.

[@davidalacabo4298]

They've been hyping up how bad it would be to make the wish then he did get the wish and their lives look better than before like bruh I was expecting chaos akumas running about or maybe adrien in exchange for Emilie but nope

[@Jaden_N.]

It genuinely baffles me how the writers had so many opportunities to make the finale decent (in my opinion) yet STILL managed to somehow make all the worst decisions.

[@cierandelle498]

Not including Adrien in the S5 finale is a slap in the face. The opportunity for Adrien to confront his father went down the toilet. All of the turmoil Gabriel put Adrien through is erased and he gets redeemed as a hero. SMH.

[@MechaEmperor7000]

The ending was very much rushed, likely because they probably wanted to end it before Zag took the reins and ordered more seasons. With that though, there was something they could have done. Since I have some experience in storyboarding, here's how I would have went about it: The fight happens the same way, with Gabe finding out that Marinette is Ladybug. meanwhile, instead of the filler we see, Luka is grabbed by Alix for the final fight, only for him to tell Alix that Adrien is Cat Noir and they need him for the final battle. Alix then uses this knowledge to bring Adrien to the final battle with Monarch. Just as Adrien runs into the mansion, Monarch manages to overpower Ladybug and she de-transforms before Adrien sees. Monarch takes the Cat Miraculous from her and talks about how he's getting rid of "two bugs with one stone" and cataclysms her. Marinette is killed just as Adrien comes in and sees. Adrien flies into a rage and fights Monarch. Monarch, being Gabriel, can't bring himself to harm adrien and loses the cat miraculous to him in the scuffle. Adrien transforms in front of Monarch, and it's at this point Gabe learns who he is. Cat Noir cataclysms the floor, and both of them fall into Emilie's tomb. Adrien is shocked to see her corpse, and Gabe detransforms to explain that all of this was to bring her back, and they could do it now since ladybug is out of the way. Adrien then snaps back at Gabe, telling him that in trying to bring Gabe's love back, he destroyed the love of his son. Gabe tries to defend himself, even tries to use the ring to make adrien obey, until Adrien asks him "what would mom think of this?" Then the full weight of his fuckup hits Gabe and he realizes that due to all of this, he's going to leave Adrien with *nothing*, no love, no family. Natalie then comes out and states that she could still fix this, if they gave her the miraculous as neither of them could trust each other at this point. Adrien hands over his cat miraculous, but then Gabe hits her and Adrien with Venom to snatch it. As he summon Gimmi, Venom wears off and Natalie and Adrien yells at him for being a selfish prick. Gabe then tells both of them he's finally waken up, and it's time he fixed his mistake. The sequence happens as in the show, and we see Marinette open her eyes in a destroyed agreste mansion, with Adrien and Natalie but *not* Emilie looking after her. Natalie is healed and it's revealed Gabe gave his life to restore Marinette. We then cut forward to the (normal) grave of Emilie and Gabe Agreste, where the trio are standing over it and Natalie has become Adrien's legal guardian. he's still salty over his dad, and thinks they should reveal his identity to the world, but Marinette reassures him that his father ultimately did it out of love, however misguided, for his family, which is proved by him reviving her in the end. Natalie then reassures both of them that Gabe and Emilie are finally at peace, as it should have been a long time ago. They then leave after ADrien and Marinette both leave a flower on the grave, then looking forward to a brighter future together. We then get a montage of the other characters, Su-Han getting handed the miraculouses by Adrien and Marinette (to which he hands back to Marinette in her home when she's alone), the other heroes getting their permanent miraculouses, and a scene where Cat Noir and Ladybug are on a roof where the subject of Monarch targetting marinette comes up and both of them try to dodge the question knowing that it would reveal who they are, showing they are still oblivious to each other's identity. Then in the post credit scene you see Lila get contacted by Ms Tsurugi with a message saying that the Miraculouses aren't the only magical charms in the world, and asks if Lila was interested in a partnership.

[@Dred0n]

This good I would prefer this over the one we got.

[@MechaEmperor7000]

@@Dred0n TBH anyone can make a better one. I think my frustration with this series is that it is such a good concept, in both narrative and visuals, but it's completely let down by the episodic nature and poor episode to episode writing. Like the entire reason there is no payoff between Ladybug and Monarch is because the two of them had so little interaction with each other that there isn't really any emotional weight here. Like Ladybug fighting Argos had way more weight because he personally screwed her and the world, then had the gall to laugh in her face. meanwhile we saw way more development of Marinette and Chloe/Lila interactions, so when Chloe got banished from paris, it felt more like her arc concluded there.

[@Dred0n]

@@MechaEmperor7000 thats true and I agree with you anybody can write a better one that's why I stick with fandom storyline they're always much better than the actual show itself.

[@gamefan64]

@@MechaEmperor7000 When the vast majority of fans can make far better endings then the one you wrote. You have utterly failed as a writer and should probably change careers. The most notable thing Astruc has worked on was Totally Spies, and that is remembered for unintentional reasons. Code Lyoko and Wakfu only had minor influence from him. I'm dreading that new Astro Boy cartoon since Astruc is working on it.

[@MechaEmperor7000]

@@gamefan64 I work in the animation industry and to be very honest, people like Astruc are the norm rather than the exception. This is because those who hold the money tend to be the marketing types who want to move merch and want yes-men for their half-hour commercials. And the ones that offer the least resistance are people who are willing to just OK anything under the veneer of being "creatives". To be honest I don't blame Astruc; he might very well be good at writing but bent the knee just to get funding. He just can't just say out loud "this was the only way I could get funding". At the same time though, they really, really don't need to go off on the fans, and they could very well work around these if they got creative (look at Beast Wars, a successful way of moving merch). Like instead of selling toys of just the heroes, they could have had some of the akumatized villains last more than one episode, escape, and be a thorn, and sell toys of those. EDIT: You are right to be worried, cuz I think a similar studio was responsible for the new Megaman Cartoon. "What megaman cartoon?" you ask? Exactly.

[@ZacharyResky]

I like this alternate version you created! That would’ve been a great ending but the one they went with was ok, not great but fine.

[@marocat4749]

its trrible adrien has nothing to do with it, at all. ok wopuld be if at least he gets any closure. that is. why?

[@Monty2289]

I'll be honest. On a personal level I don't even like Adrien or Chat Noir but the easiest way to fix Adrien is give him meaningful screen time. I mentioned this in finale video but its this new age subverting expectations crap. I think flat out defeating Monarch with Adrien actually being there may have been boring to the writers and maybe it is...but this show has built 7 years of story arcs crawling its way to the finish line only to shoot itself in the face. Who cares if it was boring to the writers. Its the ending that the fans deserved - especially since that's what was building up. We all knew Aang was gonna defeat Fire Lord Ozai but how dumb would it have been if Ozai won, beat Aang but within the next 24 hours Ozai stops burning everything to the ground, forms a peace treaty with all of the nations, and then dies of a heartattack the next day. How stupid would that have been? I'm just so tired of 'subverting expectations'.

[@katz440]

Anyone remember the alternate universe episodes (Cat Blanc/Ephemeral)? Those episodes had better set up and execution then the actual season 5 finale and they didn’t even make it into the actual main timeline! 🫣😬 What a journey we’ve been on for Adrien. From equal protagonist with his name in the title, to damsel/side kick of our real main hero Ladybug! Wasted potential! One thing this season finale did cement for me is just why the name is shortened to Miraculous Ladybug.

[@kou7191]

I think those episodes are, ironically, WHY they left Adrien completely out. Yes, it's utter bs and bad writing anyways, but it was their way of saying Adrien being present for that fight would be a bad idea, because he WILL be akumatized. (almost like he doesn't have Marinette's "power of love and friendship" plot armor I guess)

[@Jess-dm8hl]

(warning rant incoming) This isn't even about the finale per say, but more so about my experience with this show. Yeah I have completely given up on this show ever being as good as I thought it would. I have been a fan since season 1! I was 15 back then. Also I was banned by Astruc on twitter at 16 just for tweeting a lot about the show and it wasnt even anything mean or negative. I was crushed at the time and now I just laugh at how that dude was so immature he couldn't handle the babbling tweets of a 16 year old fangirl/ wanna be animator lmfao. Now I have grown up, I've read more (and frankly much better) romance mangas, I've finished my animation degree in college, and of course my own personal writing and drawing has improved so much during this time. What I'm getting at is I have grown so much as a person and yet this show has stayed stagnent! Marinette and Adrien's characters are not even much different than season one imo. And I cannot believe it took them 5 whole seasons/8 years to essentially wrap up one villian arc. That's not just slow pacing, that's lazy writing and a rather lackadasical attitute. Most shows like this tend to have one villain/ arc per season. Best example, Sailor Moon since this show takes a bit of inspiration from it (but clearly not enough). It's so incredibly frustrating how many awful writing decisions this team makes. I honestly cannot beleive this trainwreck of a TV show is still going. And I am saying this out of so much love and respect. I know how hard those animators, artists, compositors, composers, and VAs work. It makes me mad that all that hard work is going into such a medicore show. In terms of myself, I am just sad and disaapointed. I started watching the show to help me with my French as I was taking it in HS at the time. Not only did it do that, I fell in love with the characters, world, and of course the slow burn romance. I remember thinking back in those season 1 days that the first season was proably going to be the only one with "monster of the week" like episodes as thats kind of how many other big shows like Gravity Falls or Steven Universe started. I also though the reveal would happen by the end of season 2 or 3. Hahah oh was I sooooooo wrong and younger me had way too much faith in this show. Even though I've been pretty disinterested since the end of season 3, I kept watching becuase I wanted to see the show get better or to finally have all my waiting for that romance/ reveal to pay off. But no just no. The writing team has just continued to disappoint me with their sidelining of Chat Noir, failure to actually write a semi episodic show like they seem to be trying to, their terrible ship teasing while making the actual romance go nowhere, the show basically confirming I think? the terrible Adrien is a senti-monster theory, and now their literal redemption of Hawkmoth who is a terrible person that doesn't deserve it and all without having Adrien present to see any of it so now Marinette is just lying to him ughhhhhh. I've joked for a long time that the fan fiction is more entertaining than the actually show, but I honestly stand by that. Also there are all the amazing artists out there who make illustrations, comics, and animations that I get way more enjoyment out of. Hilariously, a piece of Miraculous fanart was the first piece of art I ever had stolen online and it got like 10k likes when mine got 100 big rip. My only hope at this point is the Miraculous movie coming out soon as I have way more faith in Zag compared to Astruc. Here's to hoping the movie does not follow the same terrible plot as the show! Thanks for all your reviews man! They have entertained me more than the actual show and it makes me glad to know I'm not the only adult out there that is watching this show and cringing at how much of a trainwreck it can be.

[@modycebula8161]

i am 100% sure the reveal was supposed to happen in season 2 at some point. every wattpad writer was waiting for season 2 just because they wanted to see the reveal. oh boy were we naive

[@Jess-dm8hl]

@@modycebula8161 Yeah exactly! The wait inbetween seasons 1 and 2 was brutal. I think it was over a whole year if I am remembering correctly?

[@okanimation68]

I have watched the movie it was great but too much songs in it even for a musical, there are also no developpement/real appearance of the characters except Marinette, Adrien and Gabe (and a little Fu, Nino and Alya). The ending was ok but Gabe young haircut was a NO idk why they changed it. Anyway that's all I can say without spoiler (yes I watched it legally in theaters since I'm French)

[@Pollares_ice]

​@@okanimation68From what I saw of the spoilers on Instagram, it seems that they Humanized gabe for the movie, I think it has to do with that famous phrase, "it's a children's show"

[@Slysum]

If the writers don't do anything with the Agreste arc in season 6... I'll give up on this show

[@captainofthes.saggressive2129]

I've seen so many fanfiction/other media projects that are significantly better than what we got. And they came out long before season 5.

[@everythinggirly916]

Good news, guys: a good version of Miraculous exists and it's the Awakening movie. Every fan should watch it. It finally made me content after I lost hope for the show.

[@joeleboeuf]

What do you mean, "weak character development?" There was no character development! And even when there was, it was touch and go, at best. We all know who's to blame for this bullshit. Thomas Astruc created the show, he wrote the episodes, he's the executive producer, this is his fault! But, yes. I agree, the ending needed a lot of work.

[@Iasgo]

At this point, is almost 100% confirmed and that they never wanted Adrian as one of the protagonists, they just needed ship material to boost the popularity of the first seasons.

[@ghjjiyeqsg1052]

The whole finale was a ‘yikes’, when Adrien broke down like a little shit and just gave up. It would’ve been so much better if there was a way found where Adrien could escape, or could even just transform regardless and escape and join up with Ladybug

[@geoffreygoncalves931]

Maybe because he understand how his power could be dangerous in the instable mental state he's in ? How a fictional character managed to be more emotionaly mature than real life people is a mystery...

[@johanroyce6324]

One KZbinr brought up the idea of Argos(Felix) breaking Kagami and Adrian out of the prison

[@craigpeoples9883]

​@@geoffreygoncalves931So did Alya but she still pulled up

[@NessaTheBat1]

Chat Noir was my favourite character. I got more and more frustrated when he got shuffed aside and now she show almost died for me because they shuffed Adrien out of his own story. Everything is so weird. First Chloe gets to be mayor, then suddenly everything is okay after Gabriels wish, the teacher became mayor and did a lot of changes in only month and Adrien is probably going to find out about the truth at the end of the show.