Smash Ultimate: Should Steve get BANNED?

[@namelastnamefirst4520]

From “worst character” to “Should we ban him?”. Wow what a wild ride.

[@arch4ngel]

Bro’s gonna be eating his own words for years to come

[@myoblivion420]

The journey of Steve in Smash Bros has been such a wild ride. From a meme character to most likely a banned character lmao

[@emberpowertcg7692]

Character development fr

[@murilotheodoro5025]

Just goes to show how much these crazy techs impact the game. I'm all for crazy characters with gimmicks, I love rivals of aether, but the sentence "is he even playing smash anymore?" applies to Steve more than any character ever before and I don't think it's healthy for the game

[@caseyrhom]

@@arch4ngel use your brain. No one “eats their words” on a first impression. So sick of this shit lol.

[@mintyfresh8732]

Even if Steve didn’t have access to his huge damage combos and kill confirms, the ability to cancel out of hitstun and punish your opponent for it is the definition of game breaking.

[@LordNebilim]

Shulk : *intense sweating*

[@ChaoticSonic400]

@@LordNebilim granted, at least for shulk's tech it has its limits. he can only do it if he has any monado arts out of cooldown and even then he has to consider sacrificing an art that could be crucial later in the match.

[@mintyfresh8732]

I understand that there are characters with frame 1 escape options, Snake and Duck Hunt for example. But even those options don’t give you TRUE 0-death combos.

[@_M_4]

Just SDI bro jk

[@sethswoodruff]

@@ChaoticSonic400 to add to that shulk is also not the best character in the game WITHOUT a hitstun cancel

[@Yhsanave_]

Realistically, with the smash team either disbanded or working on other projects, there is no shot we get another balance patch. Just business wise, getting the staff together for the dev work and testing just isn't viable at this point. The only shot we get any patch is if steve players find a way to consistently crash the game and start spamming it on elite to the point that the game becomes unplayable for casuals, and even then the most we'd get is a hotfix to prevent the crash and nothing else.

[@doorto6152]

I agree. Though, is there precedence for a AAA game getting a patch years after official support ended due to players finding an online-crashing bug? If so, that’s hilarious

[@radandredeemed]

Jigglypuff

[@daenchouest8879]

@@radandredeemed Go away

[@profanity1601]

@@doorto6152 A few weeks ago Nintendo randomly released an update for Mario Kart 7 on the 3ds for some reason, so it's not impossible I guess

[@legoboy7107]

@@doorto6152 Mario Kart 7 lol, got its second update not that long ago, like over a decade after its first and formerly only update.

[@joolian4763]

It's weird because alot of Steve tech is just weird glitches that would have been patched out given we still had balance updates. Without patches he is basically the only character with glitches that are genuinely useful.

[@geordiehalma7323]

Glitch fixes are done outside of balance updates in many other games. It's kind of insane how good of a job was done on so many fighters to Steve come out shitty.

[@Scrap802]

THERE HE IS

[@cancrusherify]

This is the straw that breaks the camels back. Getting punished for winning neutral is taking it to far. Character has got to go, only reasonable option at this point.

[@tavare1163]

At this MF point!!

[@Cheesesteakfreak]

Yes

[@ChaoticSonic400]

My main concern is how this affects competing for prize money for some people. I mean imagine signing up for a tournament with a $100,000 prize, practising day and night to improve your neutral and combo game. Only to lose to some dude who plays a character who doesnt play neutral the same as everyone else and literally cheated the game through hitstun canceling and beating you for it. I feel bad for players who genuinely like Steve as a character in smash bros., but I think that tech is way overpowered and too vague to detect in normal circumstances.

[@SirFuzzyLogik]

WhyDo's "unintended mechanics" comparison to Wavedashing is flawed. This form of free hitstun cancelling is exclusive to Steve, and obviously not supposed to happen. Wavedashing applies to all characters and can be used by anyone. If you could only wavedash on Fox, people would rightly want to ban him.

[@blank_ivysaur]

That would be an awful reason to ban a character

[@callumbreton8930]

​@@blank_ivysaur no, it wouldn't. Banning a character for having a movement option with literally zero risk and massive benefits to every section of gameplay is a perfectly valid reason

[@TritoXD]

No one would ban fox for having wave dash even if he was the only char with wave dash because you could argue that you can learn the match up and understand how to punish it but if fox was the only charakter in melee that could do a crouch cancel he would get banned because its the same thing with steve he can cancel hitstun completely but others cant

[@eragon78]

@@TritoXD If fox was the only character in melee to have wavedashing, he would probably be FAR too strong for the rest of the cast to deal with. Wave dashing is essential for a lot of characters to effectively counter fox because it allows them ways to actually play good neutral against him. If they didnt have that, their neutral would be significantly worse against a very explosive character. If fox was the only character with wavedashing, he would probably have been banned by now. Wavedashing being a tool everyone can uses means that characters at least actually have tools to counteract Fox's own wavedashing which keeps the meta more in line.

[@epu7539]

I will never understand why the smash community is so afraid of banning a character, especially considering Smash is not a competitive game and, therefore, Nintendo will never patch it to have a balanced game

[@sinbad4435]

It's because that person who put in time into the chracter might not want to compete anymore because they usually want to play with their chracter they like and stuck with. Which is why there's a hesitation with banning

[@epu7539]

@@sinbad4435 I think that argument is valid when talking about Steve, but Meta knight and Bayonetta where straight up brain dead characters and were never banned.

[@ken7007]

Boo hoo this could apply to any other character that got ban in other game's So let the busted character run tournaments. Smash player's really showing they are a bunch of incompetent baby's this was the same excuse use for bayo if that evo Grand finals wasn't a wake-up call I don't know what is How yall making the same mistake in a row Lmao

[@fr0stdr4ke95]

​@@epu7539 Meta Knight was never banned due to Japanese bias. Japanese players outright said they wouldn't come to American tournaments if MK was banned. Bayonetta was overpowered, but got nerfed. And good players were beating the few Bayo players that stuck it out despite the hate and nerfs. She could be beaten, if you were willing to put in the effort to grind the match up. And SDI her combos. Same reason why Miis got soft banned. Mii players were only allowed 1111, despite it being universally a bad preset because a lot of people didn't want them to pick their own moves and be good at counterpicking. A lot of this info comes from ESAM, Coney, and MockRock videos. People who were either top players, had a lot of influence in the community, or were heavily invested in the game. You can watch MockRock reacting to the Smash is Broken series to see it for yourself. Personally, I think it is a mix of all factors. American players ban the characters some people don't like playing against. Japan doesn't. So Japanese players either get overall more match up experience (in a country where already it seems like they are much more willing to grind out more complicated match ups with random characters suddenly winning tournaments), come to the states and win more, or they don't come at all and a huge section of the community is ostracized. And we can't ban him because we have proven that he can be beaten. With several players having winning records on Steves. With the main ones with the best records knowing how to punish him and play around his tools and doing it consistently. And the ones who are slowly learning the match up and beating him (like recently, Asimo, the best Ryu in the world), simply proving that you can outplay Steve. Even if it is an uphill battle.

[@DylanYoshi]

If Steve is to be banned, it should be sooner rather than later. I know people are afraid to jump the gun, but the longer we take the harder it will be to ban him. Meta Knight was basically impossible to ban because so many players played him by the time they tried to, we should not make that mistake again.

[@Micha-Hil]

i find it funny that the most powerful character in smash ultimate is some square man with blocks

[@cephlo4933]

I feel like Steve is going to be like Brawl Meta Knight, where some tournaments may ban him or the ones that do allow Steve to be played will have rules against using any game breaking tech. This was the same case for Meta Knight who could stall under the stage and use his down b to disappear infinitely.

[@silverpotato4272]

The dimensional cape bug was really easy to spot though, Steve tech is a lot harder to moderate

[@cephlo4933]

@@silverpotato4272 Yeah I see your point, and much as I hate banning characters outright. We might have to Ban Steve completely, if only Nintendo would still patch the game afterwards...

[@sauce8277]

That last drag down to blast zone tech is hilarious.

[@christoss5319]

Huge respect for not putting your old take under the rug. Good stuff as always Izaw!

[@birdytaken]

@@kekyoin2715 what Chris meant was “respect for addressing your old take and not acting like it didnt exist”

[@christoss5319]

@@birdytaken Thank you! Don’t know how people don’t realize that addressing an outdated year old video (even if it’s deleted) literally puts a spotlight on its flaws.

[@MikiCaughtFire]

Being open and honest is hard sometimes. But we love to see it, because it takes strength. I respect the hell outta Izaw for it. We all mistakes, it's all good.

[@Ozzmaniac1]

@@birdytaken Ayo Birdy

[@birdytaken]

@@Ozzmaniac1 ayyy ozzy!

[@swampat4093]

I don't want him banned or any character banned for that matter, but if he were to be banned I'd understand 100%.

[@VideoCentral-bh9tf]

Why not? Just curious?

[@colinhay1666]

He can frame 1 punish any move in the game out of hitstun with a combo starter zero to death for starters. If they don't patch the game what do you suggest pro players whose career is competitive smash do?

[@swampat4093]

@@VideoCentral-bh9tf I don't like the idea of characters being banned, but this tech is too much. I'd completely understand why he'd be banned for this tech.

[@_Spooky]

Meta Knight brawl all over again

[@swampat4093]

@@colinhay1666 idk what you want me to say. I just said I'd understand 100% if he gets banned.

[@Buttersaucee3]

I’ve fallen away from watching competitive smash so I don’t necessarily have a dog in the fight, I just think the “should we ban this contentious character” being Steve from Minecraft is absolutely hilarious

[@icymiles]

I seriously don't understand how so many players have a deep hatred for this character when he's literally MINECRAFT STEVE

[@TheKnightguard1]

I remember reading preteens' and gradeschoolers' posts on Miiverse asking Sakurai "please add Steve from Minecraft".

[@j.rubach9910]

@@icymiles Not too difficult to understand when you look at his gameplay

[@icymiles]

@@j.rubach9910 BUT IT'S LITERALLY STEVE FROM MINECRAFT AKA THE MOST POPULAR VIDEO GAME

[@icymiles]

@@TheKnightguard1 Those kids are probably in college now 😭

[@dreamstar3857]

As someone who advocated to keep Steve unbanned this new tech will actually make him unbeatable with zero counter play so if you actually break through his defence you can still get punished for GETTING GOOD that's a huge no no.

[@eragon78]

It wouldnt make him unbeatable with zero counterplay, but it would shift the balance so far into Steve's favor with yet ANOTHER thing you constantly have to worry about that its just unfair. The risk/reward for fighting against steve with this tech is just stupid. Its not IMPOSSIBLE to beat, but its completely unbalanced.

[@apertureb2247]

I don't understand why players dislike bans. Banning things is a normal part of any competitive environment.

[@iantaakalla8180]

The idea of playing with your favorite and of wanting 3 to do good is the issue with bans as well as the fact that it might be hard to set up. The thing is, those things are moot. Steve hate is being a Smash fan, and that tech can be done accidentally and is subtle.

[@apertureb2247]

@@iantaakalla8180 Competitive players are separate from casual. You can still play with your friends with Steve just not for money

[@sylvaticriver5428]

The good ending. Props to you for keeping an open mind and admitting faults

[@earthboundfan95]

Glad you got your channel back king. 👑

[@dusk2896]

Thanks for sharing your opinion! I share the sentiments of wanting a character ban, at least until a balance patch. It's sucked to lose interest in what was my favorite game over all of this

[@cashbag]

The game hasnt been patched in years and it likely wont be. Nintendo isnt making more money by fixing Steve they are probably just working on the next Smash game.

[@dusk2896]

@@cashbag I agree, and am not going to disappointed if Steve stays banned. Here's hoping that the next Smash game isn't a rerelease of the same game and still in Beta

[@soundsbyzer0]

@@cashbag its only been a year and some change lol relax

[@FaeroN]

Steve is going to be the best character in Smash history. The fact that he does shit like this NOW while still having so much potential makes this absolutely clear to me.

[@tbc1880]

He's a platform fighting game character who can freely and easily manipulate platforms.

[@iantaakalla8180]

Steve should have never been in Smash - rather, Steve from Minecraft should be part of a new platformer fighting game where everyone gets to place blocks like they were in Minecraft.

[@ngotemna8875]

​@@iantaakalla8180 Him not being able to freely build MID-AIR is all the nerfs he needs in my opinion. Even gets rid of this new tech

[@2FadeMusic]

When you didnt play brawl

[@TheActionTourist]

I've been waiting for this day, ever since ive seen mew2king's vids on him 2 years ago and even before i always expected there to be massive potential with the near limitless creative options you'd have with his block placing, used to watch his tournaments for this very reason to see its abstract potential gradually take concrete shape. I'm glad its potential has come to light and also find it quite enjoyable in the face of people with a lack of imagination. Looking at how people used to call him low-tier at one point is completely laughable now and i'm all here for it (like a 'i told you so'), too bad it progressed to such a point where (what i can only assume to be) exploits have been found aswell which made him get banned. Though i'm still in love with the idea of what was initially a meme (sort of underdog status) character having such crazy creative potential being slowly exposed to the point of being nr. 1. Seeing its potential being progressively untapped has been very satisfying and cool to see, like a vision coming true.

[@PassTheSnails]

Remember, they patched out Villager’s Lloyd Jacket but left all this in…

[@samesu766white7]

I'm glad you got your channel back izaw!

[@SuperSaiyanDCG]

I didn't know Elon musk played smash Jokes aside, I'm glad you're back. I was really worried.

[@kyoar3397]

I can't believe izaw smash got hacked by Elon musk himself 😔

[@captainmario_]

How is it “S Tier” anymore if it has 19 characters (21%)? Is it “official” if Steve is underdeveloped? Should he be S++? Unbalanced = unfinished.

[@grimsdol4665]

Damn Izaw got hacked, hope he can get his channel back

[@condenabo]

tbf it was pretty understandable to think steve isn't good in smash. steve doesn't even play smash

[@zoruar]

Damn, that last steve video aged like fine wine

[@1111_makeawish]

More like open beer

[@xSixthiSx]

more like warm milk

[@Dynamus21]

Imagine if he ends up somwhow being wrong on this take too

[@iantaakalla8180]

That Steve video aged like fine wine that was placed on a weird dimension that speeds up time for too long, and upon returning ti retrieve the supposed wine a centuries-spanning war in that dimension is waged over getting that supposed wine, and no nobody wins. Steve should have never been in Smash.

[@electroshockgamer2733]

​@@iantaakalla8180Steve was a good addition to Smash, he just has glitches that really never should have existed to begin with

[@steel5897]

This is the third channel I follow to get hacked by these elon clowns in the last TWO WEEKS.

[@kurotama_doublebread]

Sakurai himself said Steve was a challenge code wise, even if there was another DLC for the team to rework the previous characters, fixing all these issues would be very demanding and not cost effective. Sadly, this is the price we had to pay in order to have a character like Steve in the game

[@Wienerdog5]

As it turns out, his recovery isn't below average at best.

[@Casual_Shots]

the ability to cancel out of hitstun and punish your opponent for it is the definition of game breaking.

[@nathanlevesque7812]

For hitstun cancelling, either Steve takes damage and doesn't move (this is the tech), or he doesn't take damage (SDI / slip out), or he moves while taking damage (SDI). Everyone has phones that can send 5 second clips. Videos that short can be quickly converted to formats that allow for going frame by frame. Either ban is fine but the tech ban should be tried first. In regards to whether or not he's "playing Smash anymore", that really doesn't mean anything. He's in Smash. This is Smash now. It's tautological. The only alternative is circular reasoning. About the allegedly improper rise of Steve mains, setting aside another circularity here, that's a product of selection bias. We don't pay attention to or care about previously unknown young players making big debuts with other characters. If he was truly carrying that hard then the results would be more uniform. Someone was always going to be on top. Upsets were always going to happen with someone.

[@waltermelon4161]

LOVE your content man. Glad to see you’re still active in the Smash community. Thanks for creating even more awesome content!

[@emblemblade9245]

There are over 80 characters in this game, I think it’s ok to ban one lmaooo

[@LinkMaster5555]

Yeah i wont be missing steve

[@smoothie_kohi]

missed your content, glad to see you're kicking it still

[@Matt-hy9qj]

In your defense izaw, some of the best Steve players thought he was low-mid tier upon release. I remember Dabuz tried playing Steve for a little while and eventually dropped him

[@dogyX3]

Holy moly, I didn't know he had THIS MUCH TECH 💀💀

[@guidoskerianz2633]

With the new tech I think it's justifiable to ban him.

[@jeffjohnson6562]

So glad you got your channel back ❤

[@BLamb]

My, my, how the tables have turned.

[@IchiExorz]

Steve feels like he's playing chess in a game of checkers. I think he was already worthy of a ban before but w ith this tech i think he 100% needs tobe banned. Banning tech in specific will be worse for the pro scene in general with all the headaches it could cause.

[@jellybean5929]

I think the knowledge of bugs and the gameplay reveal show, that implementing Steve was a pretty expansive undertaking. Which really needs another patch. If they become an issue for fair competition. Then a ban sounds necessary.

[@ethanryan4188]

The Izaw Steve Arc is wild!

[@QuintBlitz]

I don't play smash, but plenty of other fighting games. If in those games a character could get hit and simply say "No", then PUNISH YOU FOR IT, I wouldn't play that game. Yes, super/hyper armor exists, but it's usually not something you can do whenever you feel like it, and most of the characters who have those properties are usually so terrible they NEED those tools to survive. Doesn't even seem that difficult to do, so mains of the character (and others looking for a quick advantage) will be able to easily implement the tech into their game. Kinda feel bad for smash players, this character could easily ruin the game if something drastic doesn't happen.

[@last_surprise9507]

Glad you got your channel back! I hope this doesn’t discourage you from making content

[@perirZX]

Steve honestly just feels like a unfinished character lol

[@Moss_Dude]

I still think Kazuya deserves a ban just as much or more than Steve, so I won't be ok with banning him unless the big scary electric man goes too. Edit: Well that cancelling hitstun thing is definitely more of a problem, yeah.

[@themalaphage673]

Imo just knowing this is possible makes the character ban worthy

[@pyro_335]

Big respect for acknowledging your old video was incorrect, too many people online try to defend all of their arguments tooth and nail and never actually admit when they're wrong.

[@aramisbetances572]

I remember day 1 watching your stream, telling you that Steve would be broken and you laughed. How I wish you were right lmao

[@shaydonwoolstenhulme4436]

Either Steve needs a new patch OR its time to ban him in tourney settings. We waited long enough and its only going to get worse.

[@redssb]

I agree with a lot said in this video! I definitely think that we should as a community come together and ban Steve. Although steve tech is super sick and these players have a lot of skill, Steve makes competitive smash impossible. These things are just impossible to play against and will make the advantage gap between playing Steve and not playing Steve so big that competition will be impossible. We were so close to a somewhat balanced game but unfortunately something like this was inevitable. Hope we can find a solution!

[@LinkMaster5555]

Just ban Steve he's killing Ultimate

[@andrewprahst2529]

I think we need lobbyists to slide some money over to the dev team

[@Arc_TheAirPirate]

Didn't think I'd say it, as I've been a heavy proponent of ban-no-one, but after seeing this tech I think it's clearly the most practical solution.

[@ayar2]

Im more surprised they hadn't ban the character already, the competitive smash community is pretty good at banning smash stuff, like items, stages, final smashes etc. what's so difficult about banning characters?

[@64-Palms]

I study smash so much I have a Plex server with saved KZbin break downs of EVERY character ( I’m obsessive I know ) I play DBZ, KOF, MK and about 8k hours in smash. I hated being told to just learn counter play - never found it to be that simple for Steve. With the amount of information need - especially for new players. Seems unreasonable for newer players to have to search the entire web for niche counter play. My main reason for really wanting some action taken is the amount of information you HAVE to know for a single character. Normally a “freestyle” character isn’t a problem because they have a few things that make them weak. So what are Steve’s ? It use to be just don’t approach - but they get diamonds or gold and you loose anyway It use to be destroy crafting table - but what’s stopping them from mining off stage ? How many characters can stop that ? Not to mention it’s impossible to keep someone in disadvantage the ENTIRE game. They are still going to get resources until they aren’t holding their controller. What are his bad stages ? Ahh right. Also doesn’t matter much. Steve can still box a bit and with gold mine cart, not the best option to go for a smaller stage. OOS? Gotta watch out for footstool anvil Steve was barely manageable with destroying table and parrying but I’ve honestly never seen like 20% of the steps you’ve shown - some made my mouth drop lol With this new tech I really just wanna play a different game. Sometimes hate how much time I wasted getting attached. Not surprised about Steve’s better shield art, just waiting on the next tech at this point. No matter how much studying I seem to do, I still feel like it’s a nothing much I can do. Not even a char thing. I happen to be good with his “bad mus” cloud, Seth, wolf, and lucy Steve his as SSOOOOO much

[@그냥_사람]

Welcome back Mr. Izaw Musk

[@TommysGreatRevenge]

His acc got hacked by Tesla wtf man

[@rafisdead]

steve's a menace bro

[@Beannie7777]

Here is my take, i main kirby and pit, i have a bad MU. But the most annoying thing is that even when i outsmart the oponent by two stocks, im at disadvatage because they can just kill me from zero, so i have to go lucas (my thirt) so i can camp in order to have a chance, is not fun, i dont play lucas like that, i rather do snake combos or nair/fair spacing. But no, i can just spam pk fire because is the only thing to keep me alive, steve is not only toxic, it leads to toxic playstyles as well

[@zsoliddannys242]

Baning Steve is a win for literally everyone except Steve mains. Steve ban is for the best.

[@WorldOfWeebcraft]

I feel like we have come full circle

[@heterodoxagnostic8070]

This is kinda an exciting development, it's like melee fox/top tiers where new tech is found, except this is at an even faster pace, sad there aren't other characters in ultimate with this level and amount of broken tech, broken tech is fun most of the time ngl

[@Helios2737]

Tbh I sort of agree, I'd rather have a game where every character is busted and insane than a game where everyone is watered down to the point where the only thing that matters is fundamentals and memorising like, two combos

[@Shyag]

thank you father

[@drowzypollinator640]

I think I mostly agree with your take. I was reluctant to want a ban for any character, especially so early in the games' life. Steve seemed to be a good character at first, with mysterious techniques and this mysterious, character-specific counterplay. I do not think that's enough for a ban. Like you said, his numbers in tournament are showing an early indication that Steve may be OP to the likes of, if not exceeding, bayo or meta knight, both of which I believe deserve a ban for overly centralizing the meta game. I don't think Steve has overly-centralized the meta game yet. When it comes to OP techniques, historically we have seen a ban of those techniques only, but in this case, as you said, it is hard to catch, hard to identify, would require constant supervision, and most importantly, easy to accidentally perform. Pressing B quickly is the requirement to do some of these glitches and pressing B quickly is part of normal Steve gameplay. I don't think the combination of requiring constant supervision, a unique, popular and strong character incentivizing their play, and accepting the risk of being disqualified for accidentally using a glitch makes for a fun gameplay experience. What happens in the event that when in grand finals, you get glitched on, TO doesn't see it, Steve wins the tournament, you review the footage, and he performed the glitch? Do you undo their win? What happens when it's not grand finals. Do you need to record and review every Steve match? I do not think that is healthy and I would be on board with a ban for glitchy-ness,.

[@nkirmath8621]

Nothing to say because this is the exact same stance that I take on the matter. Thank you for making a video on this.

[@greateststam1]

Sakurai and nintendo really should consider a patch for Steve. Or else we would need to find some clever way to fix it ourselves such as with modding, which I know nintendo hates. Maybe if we mod patch it Nintendo will either understand the need for modding and/or patch it themselves. We can only hope.

[@Sketch_XR]

An emergency ban will be the only way to prevent it from getting any more out of hand. Don't wait like we did with Bayo until the last few months of Smash 4, ban Steve ASAP because of all this

[@RockManSSB]

Redemption arc of the century

[@dogyX3]

That'll be when Nintendo add a last patch the very moment they realise we banned Steve

[@willthomas3122]

I think he should be banned purely because of the hitstun cancellation. That is just absurd.

[@Senketsujin]

Steve is just playing Minecraft and the opponent is just getting in the way.

[@IxXMadPenguinXxI]

All the tech I've seen has been things that are aggressive and give borderline ban worthy combos, kill power or ability to kill with cheese, but I didn't think Steve needed a ban. Then I saw the new tech where he can break hitstun and it changed my mind, the character is literally broken, as in they're able to do things that were not at all intended. No character in the game should be able to just nope out of hitstun. There's no point in playing against steve at that point, you cant hit him, because the hitstun will do nothing, you cant approach for a grab because of the millions of setups, you can't sit there and let him mine, get diamond and either kill you or time you out. You can't do anything. It's a lose, lose, lose, lose situation for anyone playing against steve who uses these techs, and against another steve.... well now you have the smash 4 evo lima vs captainzach bayo neutral b situation. Ban steve.

[@LazyStarrfish]

Love Steve and Minecraft, but I can’t stand playing against Steve in Smash. I hope the scene finds the right solution to this issue

[@baliaza4485]

He should be banned. And we can not wait for results because of something Larry Lurr said. If we wait too long, we'll just get into this big argument about it and nothing will happen. We also can't wait for Nintendo because look at what happened with smash 4. After bayo was released and there was a final patch, no more patches at all. Steve is quite literally a broken character both in rankings and in the fundamental aspect of smash.

[@iantaakalla8180]

Also, if Ultimate is ruined, then Smash is basically a 2000s game given its longest-lasting games are Melee competitively and Brawl for The Subspace Emissary, with all else after Brawl being forgotten, simply because there was always a broken character.

[@Kason76]

Wasn't the reason that Brawl MK wasn't banned because a lot of top players mained him and threatened to not play if he was banned from a tourney? If so, I can see people being more willing to ban Steve since none of the pre-pandemic top players main Steve.

[@Ser0z]

I saw someone say that banning this tech is equivalent to when people talked about banning wave dashing in melee which couldn’t be further from the truth wave dashing a movement tech that is extremely important to melee players the Steve tech is a literal way to negate hitstun they are not even close to the same no character in smash history hell fighting game history has ever had the ability to just say fuck you to hitstun and no character under any circumstance should have this ability even if it’s unintentional

[@NrettG]

...mahvel baby. But in all seriousness, I've seen the tech more and there's a lot more going into it. From what I've seen it only occurs in the air, not on the ground. It's not a guarantee and some moves ignore it. I think it'll easily get countered and played around with like most of the other smash games. He is however much worse than Smash 4 Bayo imo. Bayo could just deny mixup you had and combo you into the air. Steve can just deny you service.

[@iantaakalla8180]

So then, the game is now about hitting Steve off the side in one move on the ground?

[@alive527]

I havent played since kazuya was released, and i dont think coming back is even very good anymore due to how much steve im hearing about. Honestly, i wish they never stopped updating smash. I feel like its at the point in the franchise where there is nothing to go any further. This was THE game with everyone in it, I dont see why they couldnt just keep this game going.

[@GT-Rev]

I also believe that Ultimate should just be the definitive smash game going forward and just be ported with updates to newer consoles

[@hugocastilla3102]

I mean, every game has to stop development at some point... Sakurai himself was getting tired

[@alive527]

@@hugocastilla3102 No yeah I agree sakurai should take a break, but im saying nintendo should update this game still. Makes playing it better since rn its just steve hell, and they can keep making money, win win. Sakurai deserves his break tho very much

[@2FadeMusic]

Crazy idea here but you could just play characters you like with your friends. Are all your friends steve mains who know every single tech or something? Lol

[@alive527]

@@2FadeMusic i just said i havent played since kazuya released. But i do actually have a friend who hardcore mained sonic and steve so, yeah wasnt very fun

[@cheapR1]

They need to make one more patch to fix Steve and maybe Kazuya (as much as that pains me). Maybe make Sephiroth a little better and get rid of Mewtwo's tail hurt box

[@eggdogtim8593]

They need a overhaul on multi hits too. Part of this Steve problem is just a ultimate problem. Also hell yeah my boy septh needs a buff and nurf pyra/Mithra

[@zechariahcaraballo8765]

I just hope they dont gut steve and kazuya, or any of the top and high tiers, other than that another patch would be great

[@kiwifluorite]

You da goat for saying mewtwo

[@ManuelLopez-lo7sv]

@@eggdogtim8593 aegis is good as she is honestly. she’s strong but her recovery is very predictable and dogshit

[@dennisd.4726]

If we're throwing around wish lists, please fix falcon turn around and initial dash speed. Thx

[@allencummings7564]

At least I now understand the reasoning of people wanting Steve banned. Before this video I'd just been confused about it, because I watch like every big tournament and I've never seen any reason to ban Steve. Along those lines I'd think that nothing should be done until a problem in tournament arises. But then again I'm just a spectator, the decisions should be made by actual players

[@waterpot7751]

Man this sucks because people can call steve lame all they want, but all his crazy setups and block combo routes are so sick. I understand entirely if he gets banned, but hes such a cool character it'd be a shame to see him go.

[@2FadeMusic]

Yeah steve is such a cool character, right up there with Sonic and Min Min

[@yuh6132]

​@@2FadeMusic bffr

[@waterpot7751]

@@2FadeMusic 💀

[@petscopstan]

speaking of metaknight, when are you going to do a guide on him

[@fastexpand]

It’s taken me a long time to come around but I think he’s finally ban worthy

[@benyancey6454]

All I know is every Steve I play online just mines and fishes for mine cart exclusively it drives me insane

[@bronmanexe]

ngl I don't think Sakurai or Smash teams even care for this game anymore, so I don't think there will be a patch, but I do think Steve should get banned glad to see you doing well Izaw, seeing your videos is always great!

[@clayton_games]

I very much doubt Nintendo will do another patch. I think Steve should be banned, but I'm willing to wait until the tech is actually used effectively in tournament.

[@dustinwashington4818]

I’m Glad to see my man Izaw back, though one of the last things I expected him to do was make a video about Steve but I’m glad he realized he was wrong about the character

[@dabatninjah64]

There's some tech about Steve that I didn't even know about until now, I didn't realize there were so many that legit broke the game A balance patch would be awesome, but idk how likely that'd be

[@koca6685]

At this point I´m for banning him just because he carry´s bad players. Also this new tech is so easy to do I learned it in less than 20 minutes and can do it 10/10 times

[@CarbonMalite]

Thinking out loud here, top Steve players are so creative and skillful they could easily translate their abilities to a different character with some effort

[@tbc1880]

Then why are a bunch of them wifi pool downers before the picked up Steve

[@DracoAngelZero]

Doub it, Steve plays his own way, you can't translate it to other characters...

[@MiaoNya]

Have to agree with another comment here, many were pool drowners before picking up Steve, then started getting *immediate* results. The character genuinely carries bad players

[@DrCorndog1]

"I'm not trying to disrespect; it's just the truth." We could all stand to learn that principle, that the truth is the truth, in a world where too many people want to deny the truth because something about it "offends" them. At the same time, speak the truth, but speak it with kindness.

[@leophyte9663]

I remember when some people were saying when he first was released that his moveset would only become stronger with time as people learned how to use his tools efficiently... welp, here we are, now the real question is can he get even better?

[@GT-Rev]

The question has become "When will he STOP getting stronger?"

[@iantaakalla8180]

The answer is “when Smash 6 comes out and people abandon Smash Ultimate”.

[@rarebit2492]

In an ideal world they remove him from the game and give us a different character

[@figlego]

Ban the character because he causes games to become completely non-interactive. He can even use this tech against himself which results in two Steves just starting at each other.

[@Mike223istaken]

I really don't know how to feel about Steve honestly. A ban in completely justified though with the pmlg existing. Steve is a character I both love and hate since I find him fun to play as but he is the cause of a lot of the hate I know the smash community for.

[@twolf110]

I still remember your video where you said that Steve was a bottom 5 character 💀

[@nervantes]

he's the only character i dont enjoy fighting. Some others are annoying, sure. But steve isn't fun to fight. People just mine - attack - mine - attack and it's boring. It goes against what smash was built on. Worst character addition imo

[@Helios2737]

That's probably the worst way to possibly play Steve, at least the weird BS setups he can do are visually interesting from a spectator perspective (at least imo)