Is Sonic Frontiers Update 3 Bad Or Are YOU Bad?

[@SonicHubYT]

What are your honest thoughts on Frontiers Update 3? Join The Discord: discord.gg/NARkMTAyDV

[@Vader.x]

It’s awsome awesome still need classic sonic frontiers tho.

[@SonicGamer20-Pro7]

SonicHub after Sonic Superstars livestream can you let us know when you add Sonic Dash and Forces to you video content livestream 😊

[@IchigoKurosakitheSalvation]

I think its fine. I love it, despite the small issues

[@SonicSpeed501]

It's amazing but after all just my opinion

[@edwardrobinson5470]

It's partially great in ways. Not so great in others. My favorite part is playing as the other characters,The dialogue,their moveset and the story.

[@ChaoticJester]

I mean to be fair, everyone was so used to just holding parry that suddenly having to time it in the Master King Koco Trial, a Boss Rush no less, certainly took everyone by surprise.

[@ultraplayer4594]

Fr

[@prettysunk]

its 5 frames

[@lukasruston8618]

@@prettysunk On Hard mode it is but still, I don't think the perfect parry is too difficult, I got used to the timing pretty quickly (fighting Wyvern helps a lot with practice considering how much parrying you have to do in that fight to get a good time). 5 frames was the perfect amount of time for people wanting a hard challenge imo

[@maorfahima7315]

I actually beat it on hard in 2 hours, believe me it’s really difficult but again it’s more of a high skill issue cause I saw the content creator unleash do it in 2nd try and now he took more than 10 hours the beat in on extreme 😂

[@1DAR26]

​​@@prettysunkwhat a parry should be mine you. 5-10 frames at best. Here's a tip on how to get better using the perfect parry. Pause buffer. Pause and unpause as much as you need to for incoming attacks. This will help you understand just when to perfect parry as you are anticipating it frame by frame. Once you start practicing this and getting the hang of, gradually start to perfect parry without the need of pause buffering. This is one of the oldest tips, tricks and advice when learning how to properly parry in video games.

[@MrNeedleM0use]

Personally, I loved it! But if people didn’t enjoy, who cares? It’s their opinion let them enjoy whatever they what!

[@best_mate456]

Yeah let them throw themself off the Empire State Building while we enjoy what we have, EVERYTHING

[@christopherford39]

Preech

[@jboyathegamer]

True dat

[@kyperactive]

Me about to drop their address:

[@jasonblack2477]

Problem is it should be good for almost everyone and not be controversial lol

[@kahboom76]

I agree about taking the time to get use to how the characters control. I saw many streamers rush through the story, but I focused more on exploration and unlocking all skills for each of them , even doing the platforming sections that were restricted until their second campaign. This is probably the point Open Zone gameplay.

[@reggielacey2235]

still trash

[@kahboom76]

@@reggielacey2235 it’s your opinion but I and many others enjoy it

[@tardissins7512]

Honestly I think the big issue behind the difficulty spike (for me it was the bosses) was that story stuff was stuck behind the challenge. That shouldn’t affect the experience, but in my experience, failing over and over and knowing you’re missing out on something big because of it is very frustrating. On top of that it’s unclear how the difficulty setting affects the actual difficulty. I thought it was literally no different, only finding out later. But after finishing the final story, I went back and committed myself to getting good at the boss rush… only to beat it in two tries. It was frankly easy. The pressure behind it on the first go was the biggest issue.

[@SonicHubYT]

Boss rush was not good but my focus on skill was more based on the platforming sections

[@Kraziel797]

Wow this old guy really defended the damn tower challenges? You literally have to slow down in a Sonic game just to reach the summit. Think about that. The other game in a Sonic franchise where I was scared to do my next move was SONIC 06, yet this guy calls it a skill issue?

[@tardissins7512]

@@Kraziel797 unironically get good

[@Geobot3000]

I’m definitely getting flamed for this but I actually liked the og final boss over supreme part 2. Having the end give that giant monologue about how it’s death incarnate with I’m with you playing in the background definitely felt like a more epic finale than super sonic getting a new form just for it to be literally the exact same thing except you can parry now (when you could already do that the whole game).

[@Dragonnotfound_]

The Difficulty made the game more fun in my opinion, The thing I hate though is how useless the combat for the other charathers, I'm not sure if the devs intended for you to fight the guardians, but if they did, then the combat was bad. They gave you 3 attacks in the skill tree to use to fight the guardians. I had expectations to see the charathers in combat but it was such a let down.

[@NeonStudios763]

Knuckels should do so much more damage Tails needs more range Amy just barely combos. She needs more attack moves

[@SonicHubYT]

Yeah they rendered combat and cyberspace more as optional side content which I guess you can say is either good or bad depending on whether or not you like those things. Personally it felt odd that you could skip the content though

[@chaoraiser2338]

Yeah honestly it sucks and it takes way to long to defeat them especially with the other characters the only one that can do some form of good damage is tails and he is so defenseless with that gun on his mech not to mention you have to be positioned right so unless your like me and just like doing whatever to beat the mini bosses your probably just gonna play sonic for it

[@teamsonicchannel4400]

@@chaoraiser2338 guys remember this is all just a test and its free this is to see if we actually like playing as the other characters when sega see we want them back were gonna get something more along the lines of adventure i dont disagree the moves arent that great but theyre at least better than 06

[@chaoraiser2338]

@@teamsonicchannel4400 idk I found the moves in 06 to be better also yeah I know it's free but still I think they all know we like playing as other characters they've shown time and time again that they're just scared of having characters like day tails get more independent so sonic won't fully be the main focus anymore I assume at least it's still just ok to me great but ok I could do without the new story or new boss fight and just added new characters

[@Sneeakie]

It's a combination of the two. Basically, there is definitely jank and troublesome game design that makes the game more frustrating than it is difficult, but also, people use that fact to justify not actually learning or taking the game seriously enough to succeed. People claim that using the Spin Dash or momentum to clear challenges (and I'm not talking, skip over the entire challenge, I mean simply using it at all) is "cheesing" and "breaking the game" when it's not.

[@Colecionador7162]

For me the only unfair parts of the update were the boss rush and the fact that it doesn't explain the final boss mechanics very well, other than that I found it very balanced, the towers and trials can be easily broken with the parry and momentum, cyberspace is very easy to learn and the enemies can be cheesed in like 100 different ways if people simply took the time to upgrade their characters and learn the enemies mechanics Like, I've seen people talking that knuckles is the worst character for combat when in reality he can break apart ninjas+ and most mini bosses in less than 30 seconds when he's upgraded, bro literally has the highest damage of the entire cast and his parry would be banned if it was fighting game, that's how broken it is I wouldn't be against a general balance patch, since casuals also need to like the game lol, but only if it's on normal and easy, the only actual unfair challenges are the boss rush and the lack of clarity on the final boss, everything else just looks like a skill issue for me

[@crimsonwolf31]

Based, I think, and feel the exact same way. Maybe except the last part though--I wouldn't say I'm bad at the game, but yeah there are definitely some jank here and there

[@sterlinghoward5859]

Yup, totally right!

[@squashmallow2006]

Let me guess. You didn't know you had to cyloop the gun off of The End's back and then Cyloop it again to give it to Eggman? If that's the case, then that's on you, since that was one of the earliest tips the game gave you lol

[@Colecionador7162]

@@squashmallow2006 no not that one, it was obvious, I'm talking about the cable, where to attack the cable you need to attack the head, dodge AND THEN sonic will lock on it Unless you've replayed the knight fight 100 times and knew about that trick it's literally impossible to know this is what you're supposed to do, it is if you don't start mashing your controller lol

[@Colecionador7162]

@@crimsonwolf31 yeah I agree with about the jank, I was talking about balance but if we are talking about a general patch than I would like for them to remove the delay on knuckles glide and tails flying, let you use the jukebox on the new ouranos, spawn master kocos on other islands after you beat the DLC (so you can play as other characters in said islands) and to add new courses in the arcade mode, battle rush and cyberspace challenge for Ouranos+ I would also adore if they added a new difficulty, like keep the stronger enemies and harder trials from extreme mode but remove the upgrade limitation or the one-hit-kill rule, something between hard and extreme, like a extreme minus/super hard mode

[@IchigoKurosakitheSalvation]

It's just it in a nutshell. No one will ever be satisfied with a Sonic game cuz it never meets their standards. Or it doesn't live up to being SA/SA2. People gotta have validation and they bash something just to see if others will follow. Everyone is entitled to their opinions at the end of the day but face the facts. Games are not gonna live up to your overly ideal standards. Do I think they could still be a bit better? Of course. But to call yourself a true gamer, you look at both the good and bad and give proper criticism not overly praise or bash something to hell. It's a balance... That said, the final update to Frontiers is far from bad. Does it have issues? Of course but it's still perfectly playable and enjoyable in my eyes

[@spark9189]

the master king koco trial was the one thing that i felt was outright bad in this update. every time i saw people asking for a perfect parry i was always like "no, that would be bad, these animations and hitboxes are not good enough for a perfect parry" and i was proven 100% correct. i have said it before but sonic team really should have gotten help from the pso2 team for frontiers' combat.

[@Magaleg]

I agree people jump to conclusions way too quickly and they just wanna immediately post their opinion social media

[@jaydenlenzy3487]

That really irritates me people don’t wanna actually take the time to enjoy a game fully and just want to get out to voice their opinion on something as soon as possible. People are just way too quick to call something good, mid, or trash and that’s super annoying.

[@lasercraft32]

No, even though there are good parts, its bad. Its not just a "skill issue," the difficulty was unfair difficulty, not earned difficulty. The towers are a PAIN because they have no checkpoints and have really clunky platforming (however, when you set it to easy its thankfully a lot more forgiving, so its not a big deal). However, the biggest offense is the final Titan Boss Rush. Even on EASY MODE its incredibly hard (which defeats the purpose of difficulty modes)! And one of the main reasons why its hard is because the bosses were NOT designed with a perfect parry in mind, so their attacks are not telegraphed well! Their movements don't match up with the animations very well and its super awkward. I also think the final boss is overrated. Its hard to enjoy the raw epicness of the moment when the immersion gets killed every time the camera gets blocked by a bunch of trees mid fight. I'm glad you thought it was worth it, but I sure as heck did not. It doesn't matter if you like the game or not, people complaining about the difficulty ARE valid complaints. Because this game isn't like Celeste or Hollow Knight. Its not hard because of real difficulty what makes it hard is having to repeat tedious segments EVERY. TIME. YOU. FAIL. Every mess up on the towers makes you climb all the way back up and do it all over again. During the Master King trials, every time you lose you have to climb up the titans again, run along the loop to get onto the Wyvern, and watch every unskippable cutscene for when the titans go into their second phase... This is NOT fun. This is not good game design. Its just annoying. My biggest issue is with the difficulty settings barely effecting how hard it is. Like I said earlier, the towers are ridiculously easy, basically skippable when you set it to easy mode... But on normal and hard its a nightmare. And for the Master King trails, easy mode makes it go from SUPER hard to barely manageable (since all it does is increase the duration of the parry). Easy mode should feel easy, not still feel hard. When the story is locked behind it, it should not feel like "The Perfect Run" from Super Mario Galaxy 2.

[@zaney2172]

True

[@meekstone8120]

Definitely a combination of both. Need a couple of things nerfed down like enemies and to buff up the other characters. Also 100% gets nothing? Should have gotten Super Sonic for the open zone and cyberspace. At least for new game plus.

[@SonicHubYT]

Forgot to add that because I rushed to get this out but that is also an issue I had that we don’t get a 100% reward

[@milesstorzillo7650]

Oh, but there is an 100%. What is it? Hints on how to defeat the final boss! Well done, that has to be the most pointless reward I've ever seen in my life. By the time people 100% the game, odds are they already beat Supreme End, so they already know they needs to attack the head then sidestep to switch to the cable and Cyloop his gun out of his back when he's stunned.

[@evdestroy4121]

@@milesstorzillo7650 The game straight up tells you that's the final reward before you get it. It's your fault if you do it and then don't like what the game said you were going to get. An actual 100% reward would have been nice, but if you're going to 100% a game it should be because you enjoy it, not because you expect some big reward.

[@teamsonicchannel4400]

Agreed i say its a skill issue we all asked for it to be harder

[@gamecitysavior2910]

Same.... the same people complaining would be the same people saying it's too easy.

[@k-stubb8203]

@@gamecitysavior2910exactly

[@Bec007]

6:37 for the tarot card gimmick if you don’t get that that’s ok it mostly for people who have played all the og sonic games like the one she was introduced in and one of my favorites, sonic cd. Her story is she was reading tarot cards when she was told by the cards that she would find her true love at the short arrival of a one off, never seen before or after place called little planet that shows up over never lake (I think that’s the name) and leaves after a short while. She goes there and meets sonic, she gets kidnapped, Eggman does his thing, and you know the rest. And that’s where the cards come from. They have made a cameo in some sonic media like the sonic mania shorts and are overall just a small unique little trait of hers.

[@evdestroy4121]

Everyone knows where it comes from, but it has never been referenced in the games themselves outside of Sonic Chronicles (lol) and suddenly it's just her defining character trait here in the update. Amy's main choice of weapon has been a hammer for ~30 years now, so randomly giving her tarot cards to fight with comes completely out of left field.

[@mookraw23]

I personally never had any issues with the update. Knuckles glide was literally my only gripe. But everything else i had a blast, plus i have no pride, that difficulty went right on Easy. Didnt care about the struggles, just wanted to see a satisfying ending and i got that.

[@JDWLegoLegendsYT]

You've honestly had the best take on this update I've ever seen so I definitely have to agree with you 100%

[@darkfox1403]

I love the final update. What I will say is that the difficulty did catch me a little off guard. So here’s the thing, prior to the update, I played the entire game (or one save file of the game) with level 1 stats for everything. I started playing with level 1 because when I had max stats the fights got too easy and ended faster than I enjoyed it. So I made it harder for myself just for the fun of it and I’m glad I did. Though, after the third update, it became harder than I expected therefore giving me a good reason to level up. I like how the developers took note that by now lots of players are already at Max stats and making it difficult accordingly while at the same time having other difficulty levels accurate. Master King’s trial is a bit of a challenge, which I’m all for. Though what I don’t understand is that so many players complained that pressing and holding parry was a weak spot, now they complained about perfect parry being too hard. Like make up your mind? That’s apparently the problem with Sonic fans… they’re often not sure of what they want, or they ALWAYS have to find a problem… Anyway, granted you don’t get to train or practice perfect parry prior to the trial, but if you still can’t get it, just temporarily switch to easy mode and then try mastering it on hard mode later after you completed the trial. I do have some things to say about the other three characters, but I’ll leave that for another time after I level them up and change my opinion. Love playing as each, I’m glad they had a chance for a bigger role in the game with this update.

[@Rman1228]

Thank you for bringing out that argument about instant gratification for the difficulty section! I swear this is the true root of the issue - I saw so many streamers chats rushing the person to get through the story to the point where they weren't even able to get far enough with the characters to enjoy them. Sometimes (or in my opinion most times) having to work harder to get what you want is way more satisfying then having it handed to you on a sliver platter. It's why some of my favorite games of all time all have something in common - long term payoff 💯

[@StardustBlazer]

I also agree with this. This era of gamers is too soft and will usually take the easy way out if there's a chance of it. 😊

[@LucidTUN3S]

Yea it makes sense. When Ive seen all the complaints about the difficulty, it was within the same hour or so of the update being released. Thats a clear sign that these people werent even practicing. They just started immediately complaining. It shouldve been a full day of dead silence with ALL of them in the lab trying to fully understand the platform and combat mechanics since apparently this update was the hardest thing on earth… but instead they all just ran to the nearest chat section to see who else was whining with them. Now granted I used to speedrun this game so I am most certainly no average gamer, and there certainly is some oversights like lack of check points and platform respawn issues, but Kishimoto FINALLY taking off the weighted automation straps off our ankles and finally implementing actual immersive 3D platforming that takes the characters abilities into account was the biggest W out of this update. Its something 3D Sonic games been needing for literally decades… and yet people will just completely gloss over it because they didnt beat the towers in one go like they could with the other boost era games, because in those games, it plays itself so much significantly more and asks so little of the player generally. Some of these players lost sight or never cane in contact of what an actual challenge was and misconstrue it as bad game design which is simply not true.

[@Rman1228]

@@LucidTUN3S I'm surprised I just read this! I fully agree with this. The fact that the training wheels came off at all is a good thing! I hope they refine the ideas they introduced in the Final Horizon in the next game, I'd love to see a difficult Sonic game done well!

[@DefinitelyNotClassicShadow]

This is why I'm 100%ing the map before I fight the final boss. I want to feel that magic and satisfaction during the final boss that I've completed everything and this is where it ends. The new final boss was my most anticipated part of this update, so I'm looking forward to fighting it! I'm not going to rush through the game and make a beeline for the final boss, while avoiding all of the extra platformimg challenges scattered around the map, like many other people did. I want to experience everything this update has to offer before I finally give my opinion on it. So far, this update gives me high hopes for the future of the franchise, and if they continue improve with each title, then I could see Sonic be higher than he's ever been in terms of popularity. Great video, Chris! I feel that stuff like this is what we need more of in the community!

[@Son_Joe_Productions]

I loved the DLC. But I will say, I feel like SEGA took it to heart that the Hard mode on launch was not much for veteran sonic gamers. So they buffed up a bit for update 3 with its bosses, challenges, and The End.

[@dark_nightwing_xl2797]

Hard mode is kinda good

[@StardustBlazer]

Kishimoto did take it seriously and decided to drop a Sun on us.

[@dylanvincenty-cole2714]

I will say the difficulty made feel more rewarding and made me not give up plus the story with multiple playable characters were fantastic it was so fun the update makes me love the game even more I see the criticisms with the update and understand to me it can be hard but don't give up you got this:)

[@cool7492]

The act of side stepping in order to attack the tube on the final boss should have been hinted at or foreshadowed somehow, like in one of the trials. That issue really doesn't have to do with skill at all, it's a mechanic that a lot of people simply aren't aware of.

[@SonicHubYT]

The skill issue deabte is more about the platforming

[@cool7492]

@@SonicHubYT I agree that the platforming parts simply take more skill.

[@evdestroy4121]

As he said in the video, the game gives you hints the more of the island you do, and if you do 100% the game straight up tells you to sidestep. You can also do the same thing against Knight to get past his shield and save a ton of rings.

[@cool7492]

@@evdestroy4121 So that's one of the hints given to you by Master King Koco, huh? I didn't know that. I stand corrected.

[@squashmallow2006]

I've seen some good streams, and some very irritating ones too. The fundamental instruction the game gives you is to poke around, investigate and figure it out. If you remember one of the earliest tips, "If something seems suspicious, cyloop it." This is applicable in almost every single boss battle. The boss rush had you fight Knight again specifically to foreshadow how crucial this mechanic was. Cyloop essentially reveals a vulnerability in enemies or it unearths something hidden. It's how you figure out what to do next. So many of the irritating streams ended up idiotically attacking the gun holstered on The End's back instead of cylooping it and then wondered why nothing was working. And when they do get it, it's legit out of dumb luck cuz they did a quick cyloop combo amidst the combo-mashing. Dumbest part was when I saw someone detach the gun and then continue to just punch it while it was on the ground as if they expected that to do something. Then they complain the game didn't teach them enough. Like... fam what?

[@trevorragan2464]

The knight was supposed to teach me how important cyloop is in boss fights?

[@GrassyBoy]

I personally love the master king trial. It was hell on Extreme mode, but now it's like the boss rush we really wanted. Set it to Easy or Normal, and you can just play the bosses. And you're at level 1 so they aren't over in a minute and you go through all 3 with a good parry.

[@StardustBlazer]

I took the whole "Side step" when attacking to the next level. So far that I can skip start-up animations of skills with relative ease and stacking damage on top of that. Imagine skipping the start-up of *Spin Slash* after your side step from a Sonic Boom with 2 extra inputs before entering another skill.

[@MisterKenK]

Tails: i have two sides. *Minigun* / *jet*

[@SonicHubYT]

loool

[@kaldrulfr1940]

My biggest gripe with the difficulty is that it makes the jank in this game very obvious. There was also one tower I hated because the jank led to me falling off. It was the tower with the purple walls that you have to homing attack. I fell off and learned that the purple walls don't respawn so you have to travel on the panels that are as thin as Sonic's feet, and this tower has 2 of those sections. I love what they went for with the new final boss but hated the camera especially with the trees blocking your field of view. I also agree the playable characters left alot to be desired at first and really needed time to warm up to.

[@EccentricSandal]

You absolutely SNAPPED with this video. The culture of reactionary engagement farming on social media is beginning to skew how people view how games are made. People ignore the context altogether, and then rush to social media (especially Twitter) as quick as they possibly can for their likes and retweets. It's causing people's attention spans to shrink drastically. The biggest issue with it is, most of these game developers don't operate on social media AT ALL, so they create games from the basis that people's attention spans are still as good as they were pre-social media. In Update 3's case, it was intentionally designed to be a game that picks up momentum the longer you play it, but people get so bored and frustrated so quickly that they don't care to do basic game functions anymore, and find *any* excuse to justify this frustration. I BARELY played Frontiers post-launch, and I did the 2nd Koco challenge on my 2nd try. Between all 5 towers, I only fell off *twice* and recovered with parry. Master Koco challenge took me 2.5 hours on Hard Mode (but that one is understandable why people don't like it). People don't have long attention spans with games like this anymore to observe situations carefully before acting. It's just "go fast, go fast, go fast"

[@Roy.R.]

Imma be honest, when people asked for a harder game, they meant overall, not shove super hard things in one area, for a boss fight which, hot take, is overrated. The fact you can beat it within just a few minutes after you know what to do, and part of the bossfight is just waiting, isn't really worth the hard challenges, if it was like a new phase, I could see that, but it's an optional update for a boss that hardly attacks, the fact that I had more trouble with the original Supreme (even now) kinda shows how overrated it is, which leads me back to my main point, hard mode isn't hard until the very end, when people wanted a harder game we asked for an overall harder game and not shove it in remakes of towers that were hard to begin with, and extremes mode's one hit kill is way too hard for casual players, when we wanted harder sonic games, we wanted somewhere in between this games hard mode and the extreme mode, and using the "Well you asked for it" card, when, mind you, it ISNT what we asked for, is just a Doucebag move, like, half the video is just flexing and saying "you asked for this, you wanted this, and I did this on my first try, haha skill issue" like please, you make good videos but this just isn't it man.

[@Blue900-jg5gt]

Thank you for what you said in the video. I much more appreciate the difficulty spike now than I did before. I just need to keep my pride in check. Thank you for reminding me of that. Also this update was amazing.

[@JakeNazzaro]

Sonic Frontiers update 3 is for sure a bit more difficult than it should of been mostly due to the master king koco trial. The final boss is actually not too bad once you know what your supposed to do. As for the playable characters Knuckles glide should of been more like the Sonic Adventure 2 Knuckles however playing as Tails and Amy were good. The platforming with Sonic did have some moments that got a bit tough. Overall with Sonic Frontiers update 3 I did have a lot of fun playing the game.

[@LandontheHedgehog]

I agree that the trials are annoying, but come on, the final boss is worth it. Amy's card hover is.. kinda busted, Knuckles, I actually gotten used to very fast, I didn't mind at all and Tails is great too. Yeah, you gotta max everyone's status, but I didn't mind. The cyberspace levels are fun as always, despite the fact that it takes a while to S rank. Overall, The Final Horizon is really good, despite the "skill issue"

[@best_mate456]

Yes the trails definitely could be more justifiable But we all hopefully agree the final boss is the most peak ever

[@Bornagainvillain]

Nah. If I have to suffer through Trial 5 anymore then I don’t really give a fck about that ending.

[@shadic1988]

The difficulty was aggravatingly hard and you're not even told it was going to be like this and no saying "Get good" is not a valid argument or rebuttal. Someone tried to bring up "people have not played the Misson 5s in SA2, Super Hard Mode of Heroes, Expert Mode of Shadow, or the Hard and Very Hard Modes of 06 as well as the DLC levels in Unleashed". And the thing is that doesn't work because the games those modes are in straight up tell you it's a harder version of the stages you were in (except Unleashed). Frontiers doesn't do that. You then have the trials with gimmicks like the Snake trial where they tend to be aggravatingly brutal due to the short time limit or the fact that you need to have quick reflexes. Making it more painful. And for me who was never a fan of the Blue-eyed Super Sonic even when the teaser was shown (I'm not calling it Super Sonic 2 when it's just a palette swap), I personally don't feel like any of this was worth it or the ending. Another issue is the way you switch characters. It should be: Open Map, press triangle, highlight the character you want, press X. Instead of me having to look for a chaos emerald. That's so stupid.

[@edwardrobinson5470]

True. Those gave you more enough of a warning.

[@shadic1988]

​@@edwardrobinson5470And some of them weren't even as difficult as the game states. Mad Space Mission 5 is the easiest treasure hunting mission out of all of the treasure hunting stages in SA2

[@HellfireComms]

There's some jank to be sure (Master King's trial would've benefited from granting rings depending on if you beat a Titan super fast for example), but the towers are just difficult. They'd be a nightmare in any other Sonic game, but Frontiers controls so much better than most entries in the past decade or so that it's kind of a non-issue. Maybe put a halfway checkpoint and I imagine most of the complaints would disappear. There's a lot of highs in the DLC with some sour lows. Not as polished as the main game and it's pretty clear they did the best with the time they had. Love the new characters.

[@SonicHubYT]

Imagine doing the towers with gens controls lol

[@LiquaFusion]

here's my argument: I always tell people that you don't need to be good at a game to have fun with it, you just need to UNDERSTAND it that being said, this update does a REALLY bad job at teaching the player what they're supposed to do, there's a lot of weird nonsense going on like unpredictable physics and game mechanics that just don't really make a whole lot of sense also the open world looks like a Halo Reach forge map lmao

[@blazer9047]

I enjoyed the update, characters included. I never expected the characters to be copied and pasted from sa1 and 2, so was never dissatisfied. I do get it that the moves for knuckles and tails need to improved better. I enjoy the challenges and difficulty. I agree most people are mad because they got what wanted and can't handle the difficulty. People do not like challenge themselves. Glad I don't use Twitter 😂

[@SasukeUchiha-hw7jx]

finally someone said it Is Sonic Frontiers Update 3 BAD Or Are You NOT GOOD?

[@TortillaPizzeria]

I’ll add some points to the argument. I don’t think it’s valid that peeps have to unlock basically all of the map to realize that “hey, you gotta sidestep to beat The End”. They should’ve told you that during the fight, just like they told you about the perfect parry. The perfect parry is flawed. It’s a good idea but the enemies’s attack indicators usually suck so you never *really* know when is the exact right time to parry. Easy mode fixes this but it just seems like a band-aid solution. You can have really challenging stuff in a game without making it punishing. I didn’t have fun with the towers, I thought they were absolutely tedious and not worth the time I spent on them, half of that time being spent learning the jank of Frontiers. I enjoy really hard games like Metroid, Super Meat Boy, Doom, etc, but those games are challenging in a good way. Those games give you checkpoints where they can, and they make it fun to repeat stuff. While yes, most things that go wrong while on the towers are usually your fault, the Frontiers jank sometimes just pops it’s head around you screws you over, so I think it would be best to at least have a half-way checkpoint. Trial 2 along with Trial 5 was also really bad. 2 minutes. Level one. Beat all of these guys. It took a while and I got it after numerous attempts, but then I go to Trial 3 and it’s the easiest thing ever? What happened? Did they even play test them? Also at points I do feel like this update is trying to be a bit filler, not so much that it’s unbearable or anything but sometimes it just feels like “welp, gotta go do objective number 67, which is running to a certain location and watching a cutscene”

[@best_mate456]

The final boss even on hard mode to me it not bad at all

[@FanicTheHedgehogYT]

Sonic Superstars got a new trailer and an October 17th release date at Gamescom Opening Night Live, but once that was done, Geoff Keighley dropped a bombshell: that wasn't the only Sonic news they had to share. Information on the third and final update for Sonic Frontiers was revealed, including a teaser trailer that has a lot more questions than answers

[@TheLedezmas]

The ending for the Final Horizon is even better than the original game, while the original ending was brutal and mid, honestly. This update is fire, and I also loved it! It is nothing but peak. Some things for the new ending are similar to the original even though it's slightly different. The original ending was dog water if you had to destroy The End, and I get that rage that Chris had while beating the original Frontiers. I found it really unfair. The update is very important like I said before, because it does add up, or at least seems to add up. Playing as these characters were kind of mid especially when it came to Knuckles, because his frickin' gliding is what gets you to lose. His SA2 glide feels better and was easier to control. It is very junky as heck, like holy crap! It is fun to climb as him. It did lead to get confused too when I first saw this. The other characters were OK, but are also mid. I respect people of they have their own opinions on the update, especially you, Chris! I respect yours all the time. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and opinions on the update, dude! You're one and a million!

[@agentclank8183]

Honestly I've grown to like the original frontiers ending. It's quaint. The end's phase were you can't destroy health is still bad but it's not too hard. At the time I was very disappointed but knowing we would get an alternate ending made me warm up to it. My thoughts on the current final boss are not too good. It's not very clear how you're supposed to progress the boss and the perfect parry in hard mode is honestly dumb. Sonic is so little and the attacks don't smooth out very well where it's hard to follow the parry feedback sign. It bothered me because even though sonic in his cyber form can now to damage to the end he was downgraded gameplay wise. There are no new combos or a moveset. Just a new cyloop animation (every enemy has this) and a different parry animation. I'll admit in hindsight the boss makes more sense now. Of course you hit dodge to go around, it's not made clear to do that though. All of this could be chalked to not being good enough and that's fine. What is inexcusable is the horrendous camera in the boss. Tress constantly block your view, the orbs blindsight you by going through the boss, the camera is so zoomed in. They need to work on the camera. Ultimately I think the final boss will grow on me like the original did, but everything from Master kobo to the final boss left a sour taste in my mouth. They overcomplicated a system that wasn't built for in depth bosses (doing a combo with lock on can be jank sometimes.), I hope they patch some stuff and don't go overboard. That's my opinion though.

[@Sone01TheFirst]

Bloody hell this video needs to reach more people, especially that part near the end on people trying to beat Final Horizon as fast as possible instead of getting better.

[@SonicHubYT]

KZbin is weird about my channel because I make too many different types of sonic content for too many different audiences so its hard for my stuff to REALLY get out there lol

[@TheZeroNeonix]

This update's challenge is the equivalent of a dungeon master being like, "Okay the party breezed through the last dungeon. I better give them a better challenge this time." And then accidentally getting a TPK by going way too far the other direction.

[@SpicyPunkRockerOfficial]

I hope future sonic games are hard to be honest I liked it lol

[@infintebruh007]

I'm confused about one thing. People were bitching that the game was too easy, and now since update 3 is actually a challenge people are now bitching it's too hard. Sonic fans. ☠️

[@Noobing764]

I'ma be honest, I figured out ways around all the difficult platforming in the open zone and barely did any, other than the towers. I didn't even know about Knux's first emerald challenge until after I beat the new update-

[@BenSchubert1995]

6:11 Smooth like butter, like a criminal undercover...

[@BlackFlash09]

I don't know if you'll read this comment, but I have a different criticism. It was difficult to get up the top of the towers, especially with no checkpoints or other means of recovering progress. By the second tower, I saved my game before starting the second trial. However, the game froze on me. And by the time I booted up the game, I respawned at the bottom of the tower.

[@SonicHubYT]

Yeah my game crashed on stream after I got to the top of tower 5 that was a huge L lol. But yeah some of the bugs were bad just like that one you mentioned.

[@BlackFlash09]

@@SonicHubYTThanks for responding. But yeah, I'm not even mad. I laughed as soon as I realized that the game froze. And I fully expected to respawn at the bottom. Is there a different term for rage quitting, but quitting out of humor?

[@ChaoticJester]

​@@BlackFlash09yeah, the issue isn't even because your game froze, it will always respawn you back at the bottom if you were to save and quit, heck even unlocking a new skill and being forced into the training mode respawns you at the bottom.

[@BlackFlash09]

@@ChaoticJesterYes, I know full well that was the case. I tested it beforehand on lower sections of at least one tower.

[@ChaoticJester]

@@BlackFlash09 which I honestly find it super confusing.

[@dukelewis8929]

I'll be honest I'm surprised that no one has tried to reboot Sonic Adventures 1 and 2. Considering most of these Sonic fans prefers the classic. Is everyone ready for Sonic superstars and what system are you playing it on?

[@SonicHubYT]

I’ll be playing on PC and haven’t decided on switch or Xbox Series X for personal use

[@Winterfang]

No mention of how the towers don't have any checkpoints? The towers are as big as some stages and if you mess up once you can find yourself at the beginning. And the second tower has some destructible panels that don't respawn when you fall. So you have to go to kill yourself at a nearby place and then run to the tower. Is so punishing and the controls are wack

[@SonicHubYT]

I think I talked about it at 15:00

[@DaSheepKiller]

I’ve played my fair share of unfair levels in games, and the towers in this update are far from that, in fact I actually enjoyed them. The only thing I can say is unfair in this update is the Master King trial, and that was VERY unfair.

[@rainraven9881]

I mean, when you go into the update content Sage _does_ warn you that "the trials will be grueling." Personally my biggest gripe was the pink square breakable walls in the second tower not respawning, so if you fall you either have to reload the game or do some awkward parkour. The second tower ended up also being where I got frustrated and turned the difficulty down to easy, but that was more me being impatient to see the new ending before I could get spoiled by youtube thumbnails, rather than a problem with the game itself. I do also wonder how many people went back and did the parkour challenges for the special Koco that were added in the second update. I hadn't done many of them yet but from what I had done they kind of felt like mini training courses for the more difficult towers in some ways.

[@Miguel-Red]

The ending was good ngl But the fight? Was horrible, the game doesn't tell you "hey! You gotta smack the cable and use triangle to grab gun to defeat the boss!" So I was there smaking hes head until I did research and was told I gotta dodge so Sonic can smack cable ☠️

[@sonicfanatic6733]

I adored this update, and I pretty much agree with you about everything in regards to the difficulty. It’s the end of the game, it should be difficult, and I really hope SEGA doesn’t get the wrong idea and nerf the challenge. I absolutely loved the adrenaline rushes I got from trying to not fail a challenge and the satisfaction of actually completing it. I wanna see more of it in future Sonic games, because damn, this was some of the most fun I’ve ever had with a Sonic game

[@Bornagainvillain]

Nah, nerf that shit. Endgame challenges should be so difficult that it alienates a whole sector of fans. This isn’t dark souls. High difficulty doesn’t need to be a standard in video games that developers should achieve. This isn’t some “the game isn’t meant for you then” nonsense. That’s a mentality that needs to die. There are specific games with difficulty in mind because that’s how they were designed, and it caters to that niche. Sonic is NOT that series. Difficulty can exist in these games so long as they’re balanced. The trial battles in this update need to addressed, and handled SOON.

[@evdestroy4121]

@@Bornagainvillain It's not the "end game," it's an optional secondary end game. Most casuals will play through the original ending and have a fine time, but if you want the "true" ending you have to put in the extra work. It's no different from having to get all the chaos emeralds in the classic games to get the true ending or beating all of the stories in an Adventure game to see the true ending. There is nothing stopping you from "beating the game," but if you want to see the good ending you will have to put in extra effort. All of this content is entirely optional, the original ending is still there for people like you.

[@dave_the_slick8584]

@@Bornagainvillain Finally, someone making some goddamn sense!

[@dave_the_slick8584]

@@evdestroy4121 You did not just compare getting all the chaos emeralds to this bullshit.

[@classicsoniccyclone1991s]

Basically, that third update of Sonic Frontiers was totally okay and good enough to do that. Also, I'm probably good at this game

[@nathanbrownlee9276]

The only problems are that the camera placement in the final boss fight was really awkward (sometimes it’s too close to Sonic, or too far way, or clipping through the forest making it impossible to see anything) and that the game was never designed to have a timed parry so some enemies have really weird parry windows. Though that’s all stuff that can get patched later, weird bugs/design choices aside the new update is really fun.

[@georgejohnson7637]

I think everything you said here was spot on. I personally welcomed the difficulty. But maybe they should've made easy mode even easier for those who don't like the challenge.

[@Gnidel]

I liked it for quantity (it basically doubled the content judging by my 100% save file play time) and for Cyberspace levels (which were among the best levels in Sonic, of all games). I also have to praise complete lack of 2D. I just wish it was a new island instead of Ouranos because visuals got boring to me. The ending was flashy, but too bad that we didn't get The End boss fight, just Supreme Phase 2 subtitled as The End but we didn't get to punch the moon outside of a cutscene. Master King challenge is the reason why I'll never replay it. It's unplayable on Extreme. Consistent frame perfect parry is impossible and it's required because I bad block means return to grass next to Giganto. My Extreme save is basically locked until they patch it. Overall, I think it can be saved. And it should. After few small fixes it will be phenomenal, but currently it's too poisoned with issues. I had a lot of fun, but I just don't want the hassle of Master King.

[@maorfahima7315]

That what EXTREME means😅

[@imnotkaiser]

That final boss was the most dragon ball arc I have ever seen, it was amazing

[@YourAverageNerd06]

Honestly, I really loved this update. Everything was perfect; the new characters felt great to use, the new challenges were a nice step up in difficulty and the new cyberspace levels were fire. The only minor thing, which I don’t think was even required, is if there was a better 100% completion reward. Playing on hard difficulty was menacing but so rewarding. Dying to guardians 10 times and improving every time until I beat ‘em feels so rewarding at the end. All in all, was a great update!

[@Velstrazo]

i actually enjoye knuckles, especially when you get the max ring glide. it's beautiful to me. i also got used to that janky movement because in my head, if kind of fitted his fighting expression. the fighting move themselves are mid, but outside of that. i loved it. especially endless boosting in the cyclone. i literally flew in freedom

[@fredyrivero824]

when sonic said it's frontiering time i cried 😢😢

[@gustavolobo2001]

I loved this new update. Moreover, I am SO grateful that we get to play as other characters again... and that they are contributing and doing something useful where it's not just Sonic being the only one who gets things done... I loved it, and I'm expecting something even better in the next game!

[@jackiguess700]

i think this update makes the game extremely good, but there needs to be some tweaks to the other characters except amy tbh. The difficulty doesnt matter cus people just have a skill issue if they are complaining about the difficulty

[@ej_matthewsart]

Its wild to me that people are genuinly angry about a free update with content that WE begged for and that kishimoto said specifically will be an experiment for the next game. I feel like the people who had problems with using the momentum for the platform challenges are the same people that asked for the momentum but didnt understand why it was important to have in this game; they blindly followed a youtubers opinion but now that the games changed, they dont like the outcome. I will say, my main and only big issue with the update are the bugs introduced and lack of polish overall. I wish it wasnt as buggy, especially the issue with the game crashing. I hope they fix that. But i also do wish the other characters were playable on other islands and in cyberspace. That would have been nice along with a global perfect parry. Im very excited for the next game tho because this game is honestly imo comparable to the adventure games at thjs point.

[@JAH_VAU98]

All I can say is difficulty selection. You have the "git gud" people on one side that wants to keep the game as is, while the other side fights for a lower trial difficulty. Both fighting while not realizing that the devs can/could fix the requirements of each trial DEPENDING on what difficulty the player chooses. Easy Mode: Still keep Perfect parry or take it away, idk, but increase the Ring/Timer amount and set stats (Set stat ^ only if they keep perfect parry as a requirement). Boom. Higher Difficulties: Keep it how it is now. Boom. It's so simple yet people get so hostile and blindsided. Yes, it takes away the braging rights/effort put into it, but thats the beauty of difficulty selection. The player can literally change the difficulty WHENEVER they want to, then if they do beat it on a higher difficulty, well there ya go champ. I just feel like these type of games should be versatile in diffcutly since it appeals to both kids and adults. And the fact that not everyone is the same. I'm also not saying that this should apply to every single game out there either, bc I love me some SoulsBorne games 🤣. P.S. I beat the Trails, my kid just rages the everliving shit outta the final trial and hasn't played his file since the update came out. He plays on my file tho and I not don't want to go through it a second time 🤣😅.

[@SonicHubYT]

Its crazy because the solution for peoples problems already exists lol

[@Vader.x]

Sonichub what do you rate update 3 0 out of 10 ? Also who is your favorite character

[@inkchariot6147]

This update did good in exposing the scrubs of the Sonic community. Thanks Kishimoto-san!

[@dave9515]

7:57 this challenge used cyknuckle? I just homig attacked the cannon balls spewing downwards lol. I could have also used his tax evasion technique but i noticed that the ballas have a pattern that lets you gain height indefinitely till you reach the top.

[@user-mp2yg6jw6d]

I don't care if people are going to say that I'm bad at the game, but that final boss rush is simply unfair, especially in the fight against Whyvern, not only are there parts of the fight where the game FORCES YOU TO WASTE TIME by simply taking control of the player, but also how you have to parry attacks that simply blend into the scenery and become impossible to see, as has also happened several times where I was caught by a missile that hit me from off-screen. Not only that, but having to use the parry with two buttons instead of one, and having no indication when to use the perfect parry so that I can adjust my timing, combined with you NOT being able AT ALL to recover rings before or during the boss they just make things even worse and I really don't think I'm going to go through the stress of trying to beat this boss rush.

[@SonicHubYT]

Final boss rush was BS no disagreement there

[@yahia_y7]

Most of what you said about the new update I totally agree but despite what you've said about knuckles I still enjoy playing with this character I don't actually mind playing him while having his gliding issue for me he is still a decent character and I actually experienced the new update and I absolutely love it despite suffering from the trials and the platforming tower's and trying to overcome them still a masterpiece for my opinion and I have high hopes in the future that they will fix the issues with the characters in the future of sonic games

[@deontresmith7085]

I will say you probably shouldnt try to speed through this dlc. That was my mistake, I just really wanted to see the new ending. Now I’m taking my time with it,

[@godspeediot]

I loved the reward for completing all the challenges as well as playing all the new characters. I was never, EVER going to pass up the chance to have playable characters other Sonic. But my only gripe with it is that the game got a massive difficulty spike out of nowhere that I feel was completely unnecessary, especially for the casuals. In particular, the most difficult towers to me were 1, 2, and 4- With 3 and 5 being the easiest. (3 is mostly climbing and some auto mation and 5 is just moving platforms with homing attack chains, honestly great breaths of fresh air from the ridiculousness of the first 2.) If i had to rank their difficulty I'd say: 4 - Definitely the hardest. Not only do you not have a platform to catch you if you fail the fan traversal, you also have to worry about a ridiculously placed verrtical circle rail that can launch you into another section of the map if you're not careful. What's more is that the horizontal circle rails refuse to slow you down, so you risk progression all for the sake of hitting one measely switch. Almost made me rage quit. 1 - The second hardest by far also almost made me quit the update. Between every single spring that launches you being a Trick Spring that restricts directional air movement, you also have to deal with the unbearable Cyloop section with dash panels on the ends. Come on, seriously?? You're required to fall several times before you can actually get to the true platforming sections of the tower. Soon after that, though, you have the stupid platforms suspended in air. You have to focus on boost launching to stay afloat, something a majority of players won't get on their first try. But get ready for seconds because even after you pass this mess, you have to deal with OTHER slanted platforms that can kill your run. I did it pretty fast from an adreniline rush, but it's still utterly ridiculous. THIS IS THE FIRST TOWER, THIS KIND OF DIFFICULTY IS NOT NECESSARY FOR THE ONE THAT GETS YOU INTO THE UPDATE If this was converted into the 3rd or 4th, fine, but the Tower that introduces you to the updates difficulty SHOULD NOT be at this level. 2 - Hard, but not as bad as the last two. Once you know where to boost launch on the floating cube section, everything else becomes really easy, but when you do fail, its percision platforming onnthe egdes that previously held homing attack boxes. Once again, it's not that bad. It's what the First should've been like, if anything. It was not too easy, not too hard, it was just right. 3 - Like i said before, all you really have to do is climb, boost, hit a rocket, climb again, grind a little, Homing Attack, and boom- Its done. It's not as gut-wrenching to get through if you somehow fall, but it does get a little difficult without certain homing attack sections. My only real complaint is that climbing in this game is super janky in the sense that Sonics hand could be touching one pixel of unclimbable material, and you could drop all the way down for no good reason. 5 - By far, the easiest. It can get aggravating, but it is still the easiest. Its basic moving platform sections and various rocket sections give you homing attack chains that allow for easy traversal upward to the tower. An enemy may hit you unexpectedly, or you may miss a jump or two, but you still have chance after chance to climb back up and keep your progress, only rarely screwing up through misinputs and misplaced boosts. Breath of fresh air from the 4th Tower. The thing I hated the most about the update, though, is that they try to train you to use the Perfect Parry and force that training upon you. Dont get me wrong, I've actually been waiting for a Perfect Parry system in the game, but this games Perfect Parry is so hard to figure out (Especially among the Titan battles when your camera isnt even close to your character half the time) it just becomes offputting, and that made me painstakingly switch the difficulty to easy twice. Once to finish Master King and the next to actually USE Cyber Sonic. The act of perfect parry CANNOT be taught to you in the little amount of time you spend playing this update in comparison to the whole game. You need to learn timing, signs, movements of your enemies, EVERYTHING to be able Perfect Parry even once, and as someone who just wants to enjoy the game and see what the update has to offer, acquiring all of that focus is mentally draining and severely offputting. All in all, I thoroughly enjoyed the update and cherished every moment that didn't have me turning off my PS4 to cool down from being stressed out by the game. We got a better ending, extra characters, some great exercise in our gaming ability (In terms of the tedious tower climb sections and some of the Koco trials.) I hope the Sequel to this game has all of that on release rather than it being a future update. I also hope we get an expansion on the new combat system and a more extensive skill tree. One thing is for sure, though: everyone is going to HATE the Koco after this update.

[@VelvetAura]

8:00 I'm not gonna lie, I really enjoyed this section without the cyknuckle. I'd boost at the wall then run and jump off of it, then homing attack the cannon balls and make my way upward. They designed it around the cyknuckle while still making it possible to scale that section without that ability. Not saying it wasn't jank, but I found doing it that way more fun than when I went back with the cyknuckle anyways.

[@SonicHubYT]

Once you learn it it becomes fun tbh

[@exr_879]

I got cocky so I tried to beat the Master Koco trial with Hard mode on, without ever switching to Easy mode. Not only I had to perfectly time my parries but I had to also defeat the bosses as quickly as possible with mininimal ring loss. And after hours of trying, I NEARLY got it but ran out of rings before I could finish my last attack on the Knight, but after that, I eventually did it. And personally, it was a hell but it sure as hell was worth it. Thank you Kishimoto!

[@yandelromero06]

I beat the master king trial on hard mode and although I believe getting the parry timing down is difficult, I wouldn’t say that it’s unfair as some some people claim.

[@zubiayasar1945]

The mario shirt slowly corrupting his brain Sonichub (but now mariohub):all hail mario

[@The1upBlock]

I seem to have a pretty hot take on Knuckles-- And while I don't think he controls super great or anything, I do like the idea of putting gameplay restrictions on characters with strong abilities. Not being able to climb any surface is stupid for sure, but I think the concept of his glide being more of an activity you participate in rather than just outright getting a free fly (Which Tails already has anyway) is a great idea. In fact, I also want them to nerf Tails and make his flight more of a platforming friendly moveset rather than it just be completely busted from the get go. This is a weird deep dive, but something like Tails' Adventure for the Game Gear would be something they should look into for inspiration, upgrading Tails along the way to give him more air time and height while also potentially giving him some sort of gear-crafting gimmick. By the end of the game there can be a Skill Tree unlock or piece of technology that Tails can build to give him his usual busted flight for funsies and exploration.

[@lpfan4491]

What? Knuckle's glide is the strongest it has ever been.

[@The1upBlock]

@@lpfan4491 It is, but it’s not as comfortable to use I suppose. It’s too strong with the max ring buff lol

[@LiamDicken]

bro I agree with him. people need to actually play the game and get better

[@LiamDicken]

also another thing i love about him is that he doesnt just hate the game because it was hard. like hell, I cant beat the first boss but the game is still one of my favorites

[@nicnacs9779]

Honestly i feel like the Master Koco trial wouldnt have been as bad if you just did the super sonic portions and didnt have to run up the titans . Cause ill admit , having to chase down Wryren on that pathway every single time just to get another shot at the actual boss fight can feel a bit tiring . Overall, cool update though !

[@SonicHubYT]

It was tedious and felt like padding for sure, had it just been take out the titans I bet a lot of people would not have been as harsh

[@tonythunder6048]

I honestly think it would’ve been sick if all 3 were together and you rotate between them sonic heroes style and maybe once you get to the specific platforms you could have tails say something like “I think I can get their using my tails” or something. Then you switch to tails and he goes alone for that part

[@sinfulrat287]

I think the biggest problem with the towers and what most people were actually complaining about, was being forced to do super precise platforming with a character that doesn't control very well for precise platforming. Most of the time the reason I'd fall was because of the games control

[@MiguelMartinon]

Then change the physics

[@quickgaming1179]

My thoughts on the DLC are that I love playing as the New Characters. I started to get mad when playing through the towers but once I finished them, I felt super rewarded when I finished them. The only reason I felt mad was because I couldn’t play as the new character which I felt like the time that I spent with the characters was kinda little. But once I beat the 4th tower, I was glad and excited for what is coming afterwards.

[@coooooooooooooooorn]

The people saying this update is bad because it's too hard are gonna become game journalists 💀

[@misschieflolz1301]

Only getting the overall gist of your opinion here.... I haven't finished it yet but I've been hearing the grumbles about difficulty. Especially when it comes to the Trials and stuff. BOI it's hard (I am playing exclusively on hard) and I fucking LOVE it. I've only passed the first trial so far since I'm taking my time and grinding levels.... but the difficulty really is making use of everything you know and more. It took me a few tries to pass the first trial, probably because I'm really rusty on Sonic's skill set having not really played much in months... but it was tough and it was so satisfying to complete. And a personal note, I love Knuckles' gameplay in particular. He's got the sweet spot between gliding/climbing, speed and throwing hands. I know Amy and Tails are both similar (and Tails' tornado boost is broken AF) but Knuckles just kinda feels the best to handle to me. I get it though, not everyone is going to like how tough some of these things can be, especially younger players. To me it feels like the same level of 'difficulty' as Ecco the Dolphin. If you know, you know. lol

[@evdestroy4121]

Most of it was skill issue, wonky difficulty curves aside. I think the biggest issue I had was Wyvern having attacks who's parry timings don't actually match up with when the enemy actually "hits" you, but it's easily mitigated by timing the parry based on when in the animation you would get hit instead of relying on the misleading animation itself. Even still, if you switch it to Easy mode, you're given an insanely generous two second parry which makes the entire boss rush super easy. Some of you guys need to play games other than Sonic because the Hard mode parry is pretty standard in most other games, easy mode parry being two seconds is insane.

[@ninjanate5018]

THIS.

[@SuperShadow2297]

Ngl i didn't even know battle guidance was even a thing because i never found a need to fill the map till after i beat the dlc so battle guidance never popped up but my smallest gripe about the boss is the fact when you die you start all the way back at supreme

[@MetalistCore24]

This sonic update difficulty just made me a better sonic player more than ever

[@The_Sl0th]

Probably the best review I've seen of this update so far.

[@SonicHubYT]

appreciate it these were just my unscripted thoughts so im glad you enjoyed it

[@DexDexter0]

amy plays like an angel knuckles plays extremely awkwardly tails not being able to homing attack is a mean curveball but the cyclone is a nice movement option the parry window is fine, but they need to match the timing top the enemy animations better. that and that umbilical cord target thing

[@SonicHubYT]

Well said

[@afhamdanish1957]

I think they wanna test the water first for the playable character because this is the first time in a sonic game has playable character since sonic 06 maybe they gonna fix it or they gonna do more polished for the playable character in the next sonic game i mean all three update is free is crazy how we got this dlc for free

[@Monochr_ome]

ima just be honest i struggled alot with the towers to the point where it made me give up the game before i even reached the climax. however knowing now that easy mode makes climbing the tower much less frustrating was a huge motivation. And yes i need easy mode because even with it i still fell some times

[@GooterBooch]

Honestly yeah. I was on the side of the crying babies until I figured out ways to cheese the boss battle. This was perfect. I enjoyed every second of it. (PLEASE)Read the comments below for more context.

[@SupportTheLittleGuy]

its fine but the people complaining are still justified, you sonic fanboys will still excuse just about anything

[@TortillaPizzeria]

I love cheesing in games but it’s a band-aid solution to a thing that doesn’t work how it’s supposed to.

[@GooterBooch]

@@TortillaPizzeria it's just cyloop and stomp.

[@GooterBooch]

@@SupportTheLittleGuy I know I was complaining but honestly I like the difficulty in the update. I still think they should change it for the less experienced players though.

[@TortillaPizzeria]

@@GooterBooch That’s for trial 2… you said “the boss fight” in your comment…

[@Dragonnotfound_]

Its not fair to bash on this update since keep in mind, its FREE, You can always ignore it or just don't play it in the first place. Tho for the modding community, RIP.

[@Slimeonian]

Honestly I really enjoyed the whole update. Yes knuckles is a little hank but I still enjoyed playing as him. The towers are really difficult and a bit infuriating but I still had fun with them. Honestly I found the first 2 towers the most difficult and the last tower the easiest :p. The boss rush was pain tho. Wyvern was so frustrating. But after I beat it I was so happy. (I did the whole game on hard mode) And the new final boss was amazing. The new music is all great too. Overall I really liked it all

[@NeoGameBowl]

These kids haven't seen eggmanland

[@Obi-Wan_Kenobi]

Speaking as a guy who has extremely limited experience with SA2, I was still disappointed with how a few of the characters controlled. I had no expectations beyond, you know, fun gameplay and for the most part that is 100% true. I really like platforming so far. Granted I'm just about to attempt the fist tower (I've been hearing horror stories!) so my opinion may change but for everything up to that point, it's very challenging but very rewarding. But there are a few glaring but easily fixed issues with some of the gameplay. For one thing, the game doesn't really teach you how each character controls and a few key abilities like the cyloop are needlessly blocked off. That later point feels extra pointless when the cyloop only costs a single skill point, why gate it off at all? Also, Knuckles is really janky. His glide feels terrible, the arc is too big, the delay feels unnatural, and I can never tell where he's going because the camera doesn't follow behind him. I have to do way too much guess work with Knuckles and they seriously need to fix this. It's not gamebreaking but it is very frustrating, I feel like I have to play around it. Also, Knuckles sometimes just doesn't grab onto climbable walls. They really need to fix this most of all, you cannot be in a situation where you are high about the ground and cannot depend on this basic mechanic working. I think all these issues are fixable and I do expect Sonic team to fix them in a patch. The Update is so close to being perfect, but these significant issues must be addressed and fixed.

[@ducc1]

I managed to do everything on hard EXCEPT the final trial. I mean we did ask for a boss rush but I don't think we asked for a living hell. Other than that and Knuckles I have nothing else to complain about

[@SonicHubYT]

Yeah looks like were on the same page

[@UchihaItachi1986]

Yeah I can admit that my struggles with this DLC are pretty much entirely due to my severe lack of skill skill