Southwest B738 FLAPS FAILURE over New York | "Crash Fire Rescue"

[@YouveBeenMiddled]

Boys, if you've got an issue and you're asking for special handling just call the emergency already. Most declared emergencies also land successfully.

[@GWNorth-db8vn]

"Or would you like me to declare it for you?" settled the issue. I wonder if their reluctance is about paperwork or they're just being cowboys.

[@oiseauvert_]

yeah, but, the PAPERWORK

[@Evolixe]

Absolutely no response at all to being cleared for 22 and reading back 31? What the.. what?

[@chrisschack9716]

It's worse, "traffic will hold on 31"! Cleared to land on a runway they're NOT aligned with AND told there will be traffic holding in position on the runway they ARE aligned with!

[@igorluiz9551]

I rewatched to be sure. This is bizarre!

[@batshevanivylerner8582]

@@igorluiz9551 i backed it up 3 times as i thought i must have misheard.

[@DavidMcCoyII]

I shouted when I heard that, but I guess when you become an emergency aircraft you just have the power to phase through other traffic?😮

[@jamescollier3]

lol.. right...Also, they did it correctly, not like that Prime that didn't even take one lap, and landed at high speed this week and went right off the end. Maybe Prime should have planned a bit more?

[@rainbowwarrior6452]

Cleared for the wrong runway and nobody noticed. All kinds of bad shit could have happened.

[@bru_haha]

No one said anything about the tower clearing them to land on 22 with traffic holding on 31 and Southwest readback of clear to land 31? Was there actual traffic on 31 or was it a ATC mistake?

[@ds78613]

Based on having to ask for 31, I'm guessing ATC had been using 22 for landings? They probably and been in the groove of clearing landings on 22 and maybe traffic holding on 31 and said that again. Still disturbing that the controller said the wrong thing, the pilot read back what he was EXPECTING to hear, and the controller didn't question the read back.

[@1947dave]

@@ds78613 Controller said 22 but mistakenly thought she'd said 31 or corrected herself, then heard a readback of 31 so from her memory point of view there was not an issue . Pilot wasn't paying full attention but was probably satisfied by controller then saying traffic hold on 31 and took that as a correction, also pilot likely had his hands full at the time. Innocuous slip of the tongue, some expectation bias but no actual danger though yeah, one of them ought to have queried it.

[@1dariansdad]

Why else would tower set them at 280 for 31?

[@bru_haha]

@@1947dave She said traffic was holding on 31 though. If she meant cleared to land on 31, that wouldn’t make sense. She didn’t say traffic holding short of 31.

[@Ndub1036]

Think they heard 31 in the clearance and that’s why they repeated it back. Confirmation bias

[@paulie_di]

It’s unbelievable how long it takes pilots to declare an emergency.

[@trilight3597]

Usually running checklists, troubleshooting and calling company. I think it also reduces paperwork for them. Depending at the airport it can be costly. Not in just money. If their issue can be resolved at said airport. Company could say, to divert. Though at least a pan-pan. Airports I think are having ATC shortage. Which would stress them out and cause other issues but they should probably declare a PAN-PAN.

[@craig7350]

Always, always, always an issue with fuel. He asked for time remaining, he got it in minutes, but then, he asked for it in pounds.

[@ickipoo]

ATC want to know how long they can stay in the air, fire crew want to know how much fuel they're dealing with if there is a fie. Conversion is not necessarily trivial.

[@dermann439]

​@@ickipoofuel in minutes is quite important because you don't want them to run out of fuel while dealing with checklists but I really don't get that stupid pound amount. If it burns it burns. And rescue crews should be able to figure how much fuel they'll burn approximately when calculating how long they are in the air.

[@nicolascaro4523]

No, because every airline, plane, engine consume differently on depends the apply or demand of power. The time for the ATC, the pounds for the fire crew how know what they need to fight ​@dermann439

[@davimatt7301]

@@dermann439yeaaaah …that last bit is just utterly wrong and nonsensical.

[@dermann439]

@@davimatt7301 why so?

[@dwDragon88]

Near collisions on runways was a theme for a while. Now it's high speed landings?

[@bubz4196]

no, its high speed landings WITH near collisions

[@EdOeuna]

It’s a game of “guess what happens next”. Pilots don’t seem able to request what they want. It’s like a pantry game from 200 years ago. What happened to “we have problem X. We require xxx”.

[@Clipper707]

Not sure I would be happy as a passenger (with too much knowledge) knowing we were doing a 180 knot landing on a 7000 ft runway when there are much longer options available nearby. Mission accomplished though, so kudos.

[@CanyonBlue737Capt]

SWA uses a proprietary software package that calculates stopping margin for every takeoff and landing. In addition to all the typical inputs like weight, wind, RCCs, AB's, flaps etc it includes inputs for any existing non normal condition when crunching the numbers (flap disagree, flap asymmetry etc) In addition to running the QRH procedure, they were running various options for where to go and generating actual stopping margins. If they didn't have data with a positive stopping margin they wouldn't have been legal to attempt the landing.

[@1dariansdad]

I'm curious about the conversation from cockpit to passengers. "Um, good afternoon passengers. Prepare for the hardest braking and possibly skid you've ever experienced."

[@Johnny-Michael]

This was my thought too

[@sojiro288]

"hope y'all like roller coasters, cuz this landing is about to throw you like a bucking bull"

[@CanyonBlue737Capt]

@@1dariansdad A Max Auto Brake landing in an 800 is aggressive but there's no skid and honestly, it's not that big a deal. If you've ever landed in places like SNA, BUR or MDW in a heavy 800 or MAX8, you've probably literally experienced one. You just didn't know it. If the RCC's are 5 or less, SWA uses AB's procedurally, and it's not uncommon for the PWB data to return an AB MAX setting at short runways. Happens frequently. Other than the higher Vref/VTarget driven by the flap issue, this landing wouldn't have felt any different than landing in SNA on any given day.

[@DavidMcCoyII]

Clear to land 22, traffic holding 31? Clear to land 31 😳🤯☠️

[@DomManInT1]

Southwest 2196, you are clogging up my airspace and you are now declared as an emergency.

[@hendrikharryg]

Wrong landing clearance and no prompt about it? Yikies!

[@imbowser]

why is there no standard for reporting fuel in pounds and souls when declaring an emergency

[@austinj3881]

There is a standard and for fuel, it’s always suppose to be given in time, the pilots had it right, controller had it wrong

[@christiancherniss8063]

ty for sharing love your content

[@hyb180]

And why not divert to an airport with longer runway…JFK, EWR?!

[@lisanadinebaker5179]

Considering what has been going on at EWR lately, I would go anywhere else but there

[@consortiumxf]

True story: A train dispatcher (aka 'train traffic controller') missed an incorrect read-back from a train, which turned into a collision course with 2 trains, killing all 4 people on board (2 on each train). Just putting that out there.

[@skycop56]

Clear communication always seems to be a problem during these incidents. “Say again” over and over

[@tzahner]

At 4:59: “we should be able to come back in this lap”

[@stevenverhaegen8729]

You sure they said flaps? 😄

[@BruiserFL]

Hmmm...Flap fail issue. JFK or EWR would be my first choice over LGA but, then again, I don't have all the facts.

[@CanyonBlue737Capt]

They initially told ATC they were considering EWR. After they reran their PWB data for LGA 31 they had a positive stopping margin for their current conditions so the divert wasn't necessary.

[@JimMacintosh]

Not necessary but still a poor choice. Take the longer runway and be conservative

[@JustherefortheLOLZ]

They were half way to Stewart. Could’ve just extended.

[@dennythomas8887]

@@JimMacintosh Secret form an airline contractor, $$$$ is figured in too. They don't want the public to know that either. I'm a retired A&P mechanic and unless it's a life-or-death situation (control issues, fire, low fuel) the airline will always go with the least expensive option. IE: Are there company maintenance facility's available or will they need to move mechanics and parts to an airport with no in house support? Very expensive and you have to borrow everything like ladders, manlifts, jacks, tow tractor/tow bar, etc. which can add hours or even days to the aircraft's down time. $$$$$$$$$ They will always go to an airport where they have manpower and parts on hand if possible and they aren't endangering any lives in the process.

[@JimMacintosh]

@@dennythomas8887It’s the captain’s call and no one else’s at the end of the day. All of that other stuff you speak of is just unnecessary noise that a good crew ignores in a situation like this.

[@troyfly71]

Would have went to JFK with flap issues and 180kts. Sure the landing data says it will work but float a little and you will eat up runway quickly. Then if you go off the end of 31 you are in the water.

[@jamessayre865]

If you float beyond what the data says you are good for then you go around and try again… as is with EVERY landing. What’s the beef if the runways long enough?

[@troyfly71]

You mean go around like Swa did awhile back when they almost hit the tower? When the tower told them to go around. Sometimes things don’t work out quite as planned. A 14511 runway is a couple of minutes away at JFK. The 767 at YVR thought they had enough runway and went 1800’ off the end. I’ll take a little inconvenience to increase the safety of a non routine flight.

[@EdOeuna]

FOLD meets OLD.

[@CanyonBlue737Capt]

For every landing, normal or non normal, SWA crews calculate not only the stopping margin, but the last point of acceptable touchdown based on that stopping margin. If the PM believes that the PF will touchdown past that point, they are required to call a go around. So if they were to "float a little" they would have gone around.

[@troyfly71]

I’m a captain on the MAX. I understand how the landing data works. I also know SWA has had a few go off the end. As have other airlines. Was this situation legal? Yes. It worked out well for them. I would have considered a runway twice as long about two minutes away. Nobody is going to go to bat for you if you go off the end.

[@msbongo14]

jesus man. having these three airports as my only real options makes me never want to fly again

[@mark-]

are you going to call an emergency or would you like me to declare it for you ? ?

[@Tortex88]

Genuine question, why are American (not specifically AA) airlines hell bent on not declaring emergencies vs for example the brits? The lack of correct terminology with mayday/pan pan is evident too, but what's the actual underlying reason? Paperwork? Retribution? Ego?

[@TrevorVanDerLinden]

It is said "things happen in threes". What will the third flap/slat issue be?

[@JASONCIRONE-kp4xr]

just glad this wasnt over my house i live 15 mins away in between both airports

[@carolynmacdonald8047]

Question- when a plane has a problem- or declares an emergency- do other pilots just shut up- or are they moved to another channel… ty

[@andreweddie8211]

Depends on the emergency. Usually everyone just keeps it short and sweet. If it’s serious enough and going to be over some time like talking down someone with nav issues in bad weather, they’ll end up being on their own frequency.

[@loudidier3891]

Other communications are edited out for this video.

[@vincentkorpel8695]

@04:59 not asap but this lap

[@rplieth]

If you need the fuel in pounds, just ask for it in pounds ffs!! Every fkn time.

[@basimpsn]

I'm glad the elevator made with a better system than flaps😂

[@kevinberger5671]

Does anyone know if the passengers are inform when in a situation like this?

[@ljfinger]

I was on a flight with a similar issue and we were informed in detail.

[@ds78613]

Depends upon the crew up front and how much time they have to talk about it vs. run checklists, fly the plane, and communicate with ATC.

[@madisonmorris7394]

It would be my last priority to inform the passengers. In terms of importance: 1. Fly the plane. 2. Checklists 3. ATC communication 4. Flight attendants inform briefly of emergency 5. Passengers Passengers can’t help. Might as well save your breath for the people who can first.

[@Nick4466k]

Just tell pax there is a technical issue and they need to land longer than expected

[@Makenz]

It depends on the crew I’d guess though maybe things changed since my last emergency aircraft, I only knew there was an issue as we were burning/dumping fuel over a lake which I knew wasn’t the normal procedure.

[@poetpilot]

Awful radio procedure throughout.

[@earlgreystoke3324]

"Slat issue..."

[@Dirk3672_StupidYT]

How about ATC get a conversion widget that translates minutes of engines still turning to pounds of fuel? Over and over again they have to nag about fuel remaining in pounds. Unload the cockpit!

[@ickipoo]

Conversion requires knowledge of the configuration of the plane.

[@danbarnard9785]

Not all engines burn at the same rate. Not all airframes have the same engines (PW, GE or RR for example). Thrust settings also change fuel burn. Would be more questions asked if it was a conversion of x time to y pounds/kilos. ATC wants to know how long they can issue delay vectors so crew can work the issue (and how quickly to move traffic out of the way), ARFF wants to know how much fuel to expect should things go wrong. In the grand scheme of things, time is more important than pounds since if something ignites you'll be fighting the fire regardless. ARFF just needs to know how much equipment to bring should a fire start on landing (in case of another emergency, you don't want to dispatch ALL your resources to one unless absolutely necessary...which you can always bring more later if needed).

[@7_of_9]

What's up with multiple Boeing planes with flap failures this week 💀

[@sirxavier4727]

Really, com on menn, that's because Airbus planes are awesome they don't suffer from flaps Slats bird strike stall engines and all the other stuff that 10 year old Boeing 738 suffers especially not needing mechanics to maintain these bird or maybe journalists and the media just don't care much to report them

[@lisanadinebaker5179]

All the Boeing planes got together around the water cooler in the hanger and made this their failure mode pick of the week.

[@Glideslopes]

Not the best look.

[@ajcook7777]

738?

[@VASAviation]

Affirm

[@RT-qd8yl]

Next gen, 737-800

[@phillee2814]

Standard short code for Boeing 737-800.

[@sirxavier4727]

Where is the crash and fire, or was this just a clickbait, because they landed just fine, 7000ft runway is nothing for SWA when most of their hubs have runways less than 6000ft their performance calculations is one of the best in the industry. I am going to go to an airport where company have operation on the ground if the calculations say others then there is EWR/JFK.

[@VASAviation]

Didn't you see the quotes "" ??

[@daveh5204]

BUR comes to mind…

[@HikingBob]

They clearly asked for "Crash-Fire-Rescue" which what the airport fire department was referred to before it was changed (a long time ago) to ARFF (Aircraft Rescue and Fire Fighting). Pilot must be pretty old-school to still call it Crash Fire Rescue

[@nrakma]

I heard that the new 738 is equipped with two new secret systems, not available on the 737.

[@VASAviation]

The new 738? What version is the "new" 738?

[@dcxplant]

It worked out but LGA would be the absolute LAST choice for me in the NY area.LGA TWR... DEI strikes again... ugh. ATC sux these days, the only good controllers are the old timers and they are retiring fast. Can't trust any of the new ones. I hear a DEI voice.. I go on high alert.

[@kimberlywoodbury1739]

WOW. Do you have any proof at all that DEI hires have contributed to any loss of safety at any airports? Your assumption is that white men are inherently better at their jobs than anyone else. You know that isn’t true, don’t you?

[@kolasom]

Sorry but that was boring.

[@slitten33]

Sometimes no news is good news

[@CanyonBlue737Capt]

It wasn't boring for the crew.

[@Alboalt]

"Oh, this free ice cream is not as tasty as I would have liked it to be!!"

[@16MedicRN]

​@@Alboalt😂😂😂 God forbid, there were no injuries.

[@d.nutter4950]

That's the whole idea... keep even emergencies in aviation boring.

[@austinj3881]

Not sure why the controller wanted fuel in pounds, it’s always time.