Brandon Ingram: The NBA Star Without A Team

[@tommartyn524]

Teams are realizing that they can’t afford to pay third options max money. The “ Brad Beal contract”. Those don’t work

[@tomoetoomoe2425]

Yup, new CBA basically made third option players not worth giving a max, I mean look at Denver, the MPJ contract screwed them big time, making them destroy their depth just to stay below the second apron Teams will prolly want their third option guys to get the same contract that DLo or Klay got ( 20m a year ) so they can still build decent depth

[@Stown4life]

Facts. Your 3rd guy must give max production. Looks like is better to spread the money around for elite role players, like Boston

[@pinobluevogel6458]

Ingram has been a first option, but if Zion was on the court, he has been a 2nd option for stretches. Most of the playmaking still came from Ingram when they were both healthy and they somewhat split the scoring task between them. Now with Dejounté, not much is going to chance, except that he needs the ball too for possessions. Ingram has to play more off-ball, which he has never done much. There is one small detail that I really like and they could try with Ingram, playing him in the post or at the nail. He is tall enough to catch most passes (and has excellent hands too), he can immediately kick out to an open shooter from there, which is an easy pass for him to make, but he can also do a one-dribble pull-up, which has always been by far his most effective midrange shot. The times where he has to create with multiple dribbles allows good defenders to react and often leads to a tougher shot. Just simple, decisive actions out of that position will net him a ton of effective plays, as he has been amazing for basically his entire pelican's stretch from there.

[@tommartyn524]

@@pinobluevogel6458 do you see Ingram being a second option on a championship team? I don’t. And if that’s the case then he’s not worth 50 million a year

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@tommartyn524 Yes I do. You could say that about any of the players on the Celtics, but they made the championship because their individual talent level might not be as high as the NBA top players, but the overall talent level on their starting lineup is amazing. (including only two-way players and a very good system) Ingram is by no means as effective defensively as those celtics starters, but he is a positive defender if used in the right position. (not defending in space) His offensive package is very polished and complete, basically the only thing that he needs to change is being able to play more off-ball and taking more threepointers. I don't care what they pay him, he might as well pull a Brunson and go for less, he still is an amazing talent that needs to have a medium to large role on a good team.

[@erikscream]

I will always be a Ingram fan. Regardless where he ends up he gone do his thang. I’m saying it now he gone be a all star this season again just to show y’all what he can do

[@eejintech]

as a blazers fan i don't mind the trade. we have 4 centers on the roster with ayton, clingan, reath and williams. so giving one up wouldnt be to bad

[@Stufman2024]

He might make us too good tho

[@sanchilandscapedesign6316]

Damn that would be perfect , blazers can give up ayton fs

[@blablablaa14]

You gonna pay him 50m a year for the next 4 years? Portland needs to keep tanking away to get more talent. If anything they need to trade talent away for picks instead of bringing in talent to be 3 spot better int he west

[@AnotherStatsGuy]

My guess is the only C the Pelicans are even remotely interested in is Ayton. The other issue is looking at Portland’s tradable draft capital.

[@Redyyr]

@@Stufman2024 portland looking to be as bad as possible again doesnt make sesne, better to be like 24 houston and take a step as a team. they have enough promising young pieces like simons, scoot, sharpe, clingan, avdija, no need to look for more lottery picks

[@robert-surcouf]

Ingram is basically just a 3rd best player in any champion team and his ceiling as a 1st option in the team is the 1st round at best. The 2nd apron rule is just made to punish teams who give max contracts to player below the top 20 and push for a financial gap between top 15-20 (basically the all teams players) and everyone else (the non all stars or borderline all stars). The good thing about the new rule is that if a franchise player like Nowitzky or Duncan is smart and modest enough to understand that he needs to chose between max contract and title.

[@vulcanraven9701]

exactly. teams should be more careful about the contracts they give.

[@wyatt5167]

​@@vulcanraven9701 yup and players shouldn't feel like they can bully or pout their way into big contracts. Was absolutely disgusting watching teams lose players because another team could/would offer a max to a non max player. Made a lot of players think that they were worth more than they actually are

[@gnm4]

Ingram couldn't be a 1st option in a 1st round team. The league is very competitive especially in the west. If Ingram was the 1st option they wouldn't even make the play-ins

[@pinobluevogel6458]

I'm not one to decide what a person's ceiling is. We've seen some amazing things in the year the Pelicans went against the (still very good) Suns in the first round. Ingram was basically a 50-40-90 guy at 27 points a game and 6 assists at quite a stretch at the end of the season, pulling the team into the play-in, which he also dragged them through with very good performances, only to be the best player on the floor in the Suns vs Pelicans series, which they lost in 6 games. (27 PTS, 47,0FG%, 40.7 3P% and 85,1 FT% with slightly over 6 assists) Now this is the best version of Brandon Ingram we've seen, but I think he is a better defender today, as well as taking less of a leading scoring role, with Zion being way more important naturally.

[@robert-surcouf]

@@pinobluevogel6458 But Ingram was drafted in 2016 and had already played 8 seasons. Even a late bloomer superstar like Nash rise in his fith season, became an all star and all nba in his sixth and an mvp in his ninth. An all star level (top 25-30) could lead you to a first round but you need an all nba level (top 15 at least) to make you win playoffs series or many all stars players with a game identity like the pistons. For Ingram himself, he only played two playoffs series in his career and was indeed great against the suns but he lost nevertheless and isn't able to give you a full regular season (he only played more than 64 games only in his rookie season) neither so unless he has a Nash trajectory, it seems impossible for him to become more than a 2nd option within an average team.

[@harrygarris6921]

Ingram is the next generation of DeMar DeRozan. He can be productive as a scorer when he’s put in a highlight role in an offense, but he’s not really giving you much in terms of playmaking or defense, and he doesn’t stretch the floor for others. He’s one of the least versatile players in a league where versatility is king. If he’s a guy who’s making max money on your team your team likely has a hard ceiling. I think that’s why teams are not eager to trade for him right now.

[@EzMoneyMir]

Bi might be the best passing wing outside of bron 😂

[@harrygarris6921]

@@EzMoneyMir I don’t think so, he gets a lot of assists because he has the ball in his hands all the time. But an offense where BI has the ball all the time is a mid offense at best.

[@look_at_kai]

@@harrygarris6921I don’t think you know the difference between a good passer and a good playmaker, Ingram is a playmaker he may turn the ball over because he isn’t a good passer but he definitely sets up his teammates and same thing with derozan

[@xencloud]

Literally the most clueless outsiders take I've seen in a while!

[@harrygarris6921]

@@look_at_kai I completely agree with you that BI can pass and does so at a higher level than like the average NBA player probably. I'm just saying in order for him to succeed he has to have the ball in his hands all of the time and take a ton of shots, but if your team is built around BI having the ball all of the time you're not going to be very good.

[@jonathanwalker6074]

Trey Murphy should be mentioned when discussing the Brandon Ingram situation. NOLA is trying to find a way for Murphy to enter the starting lineup and easiest way to do that is with Brandon Ingram gone

[@jalenjohnson0339]

I love Trey Murphy he really has the potential to be an all star and your right as long as Ingram is there he won’t reach his full potential

[@AnotherStatsGuy]

What about bringing CJ off the bench?

[@Redyyr]

@@AnotherStatsGuy when the pels have a lineup with zion and prob another non floor spacing big there gonna need cjs shooting in the lineup

[@ell5261]

​@@AnotherStatsGuyI say CJ should come off the bench rather they trade BI or not

[@ActivateMysticMine]

Trey Murphy is one of the biggest glimmers of hope we have as a team coming from a Pelicans fan. I think next to Zion being healthy for consecutive seasons and maybe Jordan Hawkins taking a large leap Trey in the starting lineup could elevate the team instantly.

[@tonycurtin279]

When players show their greed it tends to push some of these front offices away

[@snupedummy]

U mean when players want they worth

[@tonycurtin279]

@@snupedummy wanting your worth and being worth what everyone else values you at is 2 different things...being greedy has sent plenty of players overseas to make a fraction of what they thought they were worth

[@pinobluevogel6458]

Don't forget it is often not the players that personally do the negotiations for salary, that is most likely their agents. They might even get paid more if they can get a higher result, so their incentives are clear. As far as I know, Ingram is not only happy in New Orleans, he is also someone that lives in the gym and filmroom, a real professional. Outside of it, he is basically a laid back guy, so I can imagine he can do a Brunson here and do what is best for the team. He already has generational wealth and even doing a Brunson will result in generational wealth, especially if he can continue his career in the same line as before .. playing like a really good sub-all star or all-star level wing.

[@ColdHoops]

​@@snupedummy Shoutout to LaVine 💀

[@BigMy28]

Carried a team to the playoff 2x and playins 3x mostly without Z to help for 3 years Built up a rookie coach, mentored and set off season workouts for rookie and young players for three years ( with Z never attending) Everytime he's been injured someone has injured him as opposed to Everytime Z has been injured HE INJURED HIMSELF Averages 23pts on 17.5 Fga's and never being given the opportunity to average more than 18.6 fga's regardless if Zion is there or not. His highest is 18.6 followed by 18. Pels have kept a strong leash on him Hell he even helped design the Skelecan uniforms the franchise loves so much If there's one player the Pels owe its B.I and for teams to pretend the guy that they double and play box and 1's against is all of the sudden not worth max while P.G, Wagner, and Barnes get max, their showing their stupidity

[@pinobluevogel6458]

I'm not a huge fan of comparing Ingram to DeRozan. While they both have a midrange game and are really good isolation scorers that are also good in clutch situations, Ingram is a much more advanced playmaker and passer and has solid defensive upside as a team defender and shotblocker. He is also not a bad threepoint shooter, his biggest issue is just having very low volume. He takes his threepointers mainly if the shotclock is down and he has to force something up, or if it fits in the offense and comes naturally, mostly on spot ups and occasionally on a pull-up. Lastly unlike DeMar, he is only 26 years old and still improving his game each and every year. Last year, he improved quite a bit defensively for example. Now there are issues with him that are not ideal or would be considered a negative, like not having great lateral movement defensively and lacking a bit of footspeed to defend in open space. Another thing is his handle, while very under control and versatile, just like with other tall players it is a very high bouncing handle, which makes it harder to protect the ball against defenders. Also, a large part of his shot diet is the midrange, which in todays NBA isn't the best shot to take. If he can take a bunch of his longer midrange shots outside the arc, his shotdiet could be a lot better. Another major issue is that he always tries to play through fouls, which can really hurt hin in the postseason, as he simply is not great at showing the refs when he is fouled. Stoic Brandon is just making the game harder for him by doing so. Lastly, he - like Zion - hasn't had the best of health over his career and this makes him a hard sell at his high asking price if you can't get a full season out of him. Not to mention he does always need quite a bit of time to get back into rhythm as well, which is not like some players that are basically good to go once they're cleared for play. So to sum up start with his cons: - vulnerable handle, due to his high bounce - needs the ball in his hands to be great - not great vs very physical play - takes too few threes - relies on midrange too much - injury issues and long recovery time To end with the positive, here are his pros: - very complete, well rounded player that can do a little bit of everything - can play very well in clutch situations - 3 level scorer that is much underrated at the rim - very deep isolation bag and extremely reliable with the one-dribble pull-up - the best wing playmaker in the league (if you count LeBron as a big) - good team defender that works well against slower players in isolation - he can be a shotblocker as a help defender - he lives in the gym and the filmroom and studies basketball, a true basketball fanatic Overall, I think he is easily a top 30-40 player, just not a great fit next to what the Pelicans currently have. Although it needs to be said that he did carry this team on his shoulders at several points, keeping it afloat while Zion and many others were injured. This year, he definitely had a down year, despite still having good 2 point scoring and being reliable in that playmaker / clutch scoring role. I'm really hoping for a contract extension for the Pelicans and that he will stay and they find another solution to their roster.

[@mattsell2361]

I think it’s a good comparison but because of their play style but more their ranking in the league. BI is just in the weird tier of very good but not insanely good. So he deserves a large contract but ultimately won’t get the team anywhere. I’d rather have a worse player on a smaller contract it will just be more beneficial to my team

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@mattsell2361 If it was to be more beneficial to the team, it might be an improvement overall. But we don't know that. The only main thing the team really needs right now is a really good center. They have Theis and they have Missi, but that first one is more of a backup and Missi is still a project. Certainly the market value for BI is lower than ever after his not so great playoff series where he was still injured and having issues with getting past Lu Dort. I don't blame him for that, but it certainly looked bad. For the pelicans it might be best to have him play and see if they can get more for him nearing the trade deadline or just have him on the team if it works out well. I don't like selling low. That is something the team did before with Jrue and I still dislike that move.

[@ScottieDPOYY]

I not reading all of that but to say he is a far superior playmaker is just not true. They get their passes in the exact same way and yes he is a better potential defender.. he rarely shows it though. I basically here to say, comparisons don't have to be perfect.. everyone gets up in arms when thats not what they are not for.. its to give an idea of their player type and they are definitely VERY close in player type. Thats said, I no doubt think you probably made good points.. just tired of this distinction

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@ScottieDPOYY I'm not tired of having distinctions. I like my players being somewhat unique and thankfully almost everyone is. This just happens to be one of the players I follow everything of and another player that I follow somewhat regulary, so I had a lot to say about the differences. Also, sometimes it is fun to write some stuff down and dive into the specifics of what makes a player good (or bad). I'm perfectly fine if you don't have the time or will to read it, it is here for who does and for myself as a way of organizing my view on the player specifically.

[@ScottieDPOYY]

@@pinobluevogel6458 I not against distinctions in general or how players are unique lol. Agreed? We are comparing player types though, like I said.. where there are no perfect comparisons. Just quick ways of discussing their style. Its on you that you think comparisons need to be perfect lol. You basically just agreed with me anyway. I hear you on everything though.. I am more of a long form guy. Just not all the time, had long day. Also that players are unique and that people don't dive or see the actual facts nearly often enough.. so much bias. I respect someone actually talking ball for sure. Maybe I give it a read tomorrow

[@Jecko157]

Brandon Ingram is so slept on, easily a top 35 player in the league, 3 level scorer, best passer at his position (sf), extremely tight handle, top 5-7 middy in the game, he’s clutch, has elite touch around the rim, insanely quick first step and can dunk on you if he wants w his 7’3 wingspan, very good in the passing lanes defensively as well

[@SomeChink]

that’s not exactly being “slept on”…. a very good player who is a borderline all-star

[@pinobluevogel6458]

That is a very accurate description of his strengths. I would add that he is also a shotblocker and a great team defender. He improved defensely quite a bit last season. And while he is technically a 3 level scorer, he does need to actively commit to that 3rd level. He takes far too few threepointers, especially for such an amazing shooter. I have no doubt that if he really commits to it, he can average 5-6 threepointers a game at good efficiency. (37-40% should be attainable for sure)

[@ColdHoops]

@Jecko157 How can you have the balls to say Ingram is slept on, when he had an awful playoffs performance last season? Have some shame

[@Jecko157]

@@ColdHoops it was literally only 4 games bro, don’t let that distract you from how good he’s been for the other 470+ games of his career, he also came in off of an injury too

[@ColdHoops]

@@Jecko157 Yeah, but if you're on the court, there's no excuses. He played poorly against Lakers in the play-in, but bounced but against the Kings. So I don't want to hear anything about 'injuries' 🤷‍♂️

[@saint520]

I can tell ppl don’t watch the pelicans when bi had lonzo or pg his first 2 years on pelicans he shot almost 40% from 3 on 6 attempts a game the problems was him having to adapt to Zion and cj finally playing together I see it similar to jaylen brown situation everyone was saying get rid of brown but look at him now finals mvp. Murray can be that jrue holiday for NOP if they can get nick Richard or walker kesler they can be top team in the league

[@pinobluevogel6458]

While you are right that with the right personell, BI would be more effective. We have seen glimpses of it with Trey and Hawkins on the floor (and ofcourse with CJ), just as Zion is really good with a lot of threepoint shooting, Brandon Ingram can create in such situations insanely well too. The problem is that they now have 3 guys that need the ball in their hands to some extent, so both Ingram and Dejounté need to play more off-ball than they would like. Zion can also do cuts and his speed really makes sure he loses defenders quite often, which makes for an easy lob target. Dejounté can make that pass and Ingram can make those passes in his sleep by now. The comparison with the Celtics is a little hard though. They have no real defensive weakpoint in their lineup and they also run a far more streamlined system. Less creative and less reliant on creation talent, but certainly more effective (so far) The Pels might have Herb, who is an all-defense talent, but having to play guards like CJ or Hawkins will make their lineups weaker defensively, not to mention Ingram and Zion are decent shotblockers, but they can be taken off the dribble.

[@ColdHoops]

@saint520 Boston got rid of Smart. He was their problem amongst other things...

[@Sk8forever]

BI deserves to be on a team that’s actually good. #FreeBI

[@pinobluevogel6458]

While I agree with that statement, I do think the Pelicans sort of qualify. They were one of the better teams last year, the West was just stacked to the brim with competing teams.

[@Sk8forever]

@@pinobluevogel6458 bad coaching. a star player that isn’t fully committed to greatness. overrated guard play. Herb a dog tho. NO headed no where fast, but true there are worst places to be

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@Sk8forever I don't think Zion isn't commited enough, he looks very motivated and improved quite a bit last year, both in his availabillity and his defense. His health will probably be a concern, but so is that of Ingram. I think some of what coach James Barego introduced, a true pace and space offense, was really needed and we might see the fruits of that next year too.

[@Sk8forever]

@@pinobluevogel6458 fair. As for Zion, he gotta show up season tip off in shape. That’ll be a great sign

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@Sk8forever Agreed

[@swoodsvert2825]

hed shine on the warriors playing a 2022 wiggins type role. Steph off ball movement allows BI to play his game with the ball and control the offense in certain situations

[@ColdHoops]

He wouldn't want Kerr as his coach. If you paid attention to the last FIBA, you'll know what I'm talking about

[@swoodsvert2825]

@@ColdHoops what’s Kerr doing wrong lol? Benching Embiid and Tatum made sense. AD and bam a better defensive and more efficient back court that doesn’t take the ball out of curry, lebron or kd the main guys hand, and booker dwhite and holiday play a role without the ball better than Tatum who’s more ball dominant. Stats dont lie better with them off the court

[@NS327-t7h]

@@swoodsvert2825 Kerr values off ball movement, constant cutting, and movement. Ingram is allergic to all that as he'll often stand around after passing. Kerr also doesn't like it when you pass up open 3s and dribble into tough mid range shots unless you're Kevin Durant and even KD didn't do it to that extreme.

[@swoodsvert2825]

@@NS327-t7h andrew wiggins bought into the system i dont see why BI wouldnt be able to, hes not known to be a selfish player and no one is going to get traded to GS and think they have priority or a voice over Curry, most players understand u have to play a role when playing for the warriors/with curry.

[@k.edwards6746]

Brandon is one of the best small forwards in the league. He will get about 43 million dollars on a new contract. One thing we forget about is he carried the Pelicans when Zion was always hurt.

[@NS327-t7h]

Teams want to win championships. "Carrying" to a play in spot doesn't cut it for teams if they're handing out 50M to a guy who can't scale and maintain value as the team around him improves. Take a look at Lauri. Lauri can get you 30 points with just 13 dribbles if that's what you needed him to do, and he also can score in a variety of ways while being able to maintain value as surrounding team improves. Ingram can't do that, which is why NOLA and other teams are hesitant to pay him. If someone was willing to pay him a max, they'd have traded for him.

[@KhidJ1]

Toronto trade not bad, surprised Cleveland doesn’t trade JA for him

[@ajt5188]

I thought they should have traded garland for Ingram before the pels got Murray. Allen for Ingram would be a good trade cause i think Mobley will be best when he’s a 5 or if Cleveland can get a stretch 5

[@KhidJ1]

@@ajt5188 i feel that definitely

[@Jayse]

Poetl and Bruce for Ingram and missi is what raps want to do or no deal 😂(no picks)

[@SP.007]

If I'm the Raptors, I would try to make a 3 team trade. Raptors get - Ingram, Reddish, Lewis Pelicans get - Rui, Poeltl, Hayes Lakers get - Brown, Agbaji Add picks and salary where necessary.

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@SP.007 While I can see Poeltl being great at the Pelicans, they have no need for Rui or Hayes. They already let go of Hayes before as they had no room to play him. I like both those players including the center, but I don't think the Pel's front office is going for those players.

[@Mr.NBA07]

I like the trade idea with the raptors or blazers for the pelicans, but I can’t see either the blazers or raptors doing that trade because they want to tank, and despite Ingram being a pure scorer and that’s it he can still lead to wins. And neither of those teams would want to gain even a few more wins because of the upcoming draft class that seems it could be extremely good

[@Therealtre]

As a Celtics fan I remember wanting Ingram that draft. But was happy we got brown I still thought tho BI was gonna be a yearly all star.

[@goatsquadtv8786]

Lol yeah that didn't work out,i remember people saying he was better then Brown 🤣 even as far as three years ago. Didn't work out that well for those people,Bi is ok but just ok

[@jaukeelcarvan]

Brandon Ingram would be an all star in the east, easily.

[@EAZYMONEYSNIPER7]

As a cavs fan, I truly wish we'd be able to trade Jarrett Allen for Ingram

[@blowc1612]

If Pels didn't trade for Murray, could have seen Ingram for Garland. Allen isn't worth an Ingram caliber.

[@mundanemorselsmundanemorse7028]

As a Pels fan, I’d actually take that trade. But I’m not a fan of BI, really.

[@KH-ou4st]

But Allen and Zion gon clog up the paint so there won’t be no spacing

[@mundanemorselsmundanemorse7028]

@@KH-ou4st true. I just think they might be good enough in other facets to make pundit the poor spacing, but it wouldn’t be ideal.

[@pinobluevogel6458]

It is the one trade that makes the most sense for both teams. I really hope Ingram stays, as I like him a lot, but if he goes to the Cavs (who need a really strong 3 that can score and create consistantly) I'm for sure going to watch cavs games a lot.

[@nbapbaupdate8338]

Brandon Ingram biggest problem his contract extension & last playoffs performance

[@5fingerdpunchfan]

He looked out of it In the playoffs this year. Half baked every game and zoned right out. His whole team was engaged and he honestly played the pels out of that series.

[@Shortballa11]

You didn’t mention the main issue which is you can’t put a non shooting big next to Zion. So forget Walker Kessler or Jarrett Allen. Gotta get Kelly olynk type

[@tj5180]

Olynk isn’t a rim protector but his passing and shooting obviously would be nice next to Zion

[@Shortballa11]

@@tj5180 we know this bt getting a rim protecting big that also stretches the floor is rlly tough. Only a few out there that stay healthy. Rather just get a shooting big that’s decent at passing and defense

[@PetarZorić-k3b]

I love Bi, he's a really good player, but 1/3 of cap space for him is crazy

[@jrh63200]

Wonder if the Pistons would make sense?

[@mundanemorselsmundanemorse7028]

Best trade partner IMO. Plenty of young assets and could use a consistent shooter/scorer like BI.

[@ColdHoops]

@jrh63200 I would wait until next summer if I was them... Give their new pieces a whole season, then re-evaluate in free agency

[@moegreene3630]

He would be amazing on the warriors. I’d say they should trade him for Wiggins, gp2, and some picks. Imagine Kerr developing him into a mini KD.

[@mundanemorselsmundanemorse7028]

The Pels conditioning/training program has failed the franchise. It’s like the opposite of Heat culture. Players, especially their stars, are far from optimal conditioning, leading to more injuries and lack of finding true potential. Luckily for them some of their young studs are more apt to keep on peak condition.

[@NellofTOC]

A classic case of the “Floor Raiser” vs the “Ceiling Raiser”. Floor raisers are mid-level players who deserve mid-level pay: $12-$22 mil per year; no more.

[@jojostorm]

Definitely one of my favorite players to watch his mid game crazy

[@angeloaaz]

The perfect trade partner would be the Cleveland Cavaliers Jarrett Allen and Caris LeVert for Brandon Ingram

[@myplatinumlife]

I’d compare him more to Julius Randle. He’s a ball stopper who will cost you a ton

[@benjaminkeene2346]

Clippers? With pg gone could be a good replacement

[@andrewmcglashan5385]

But the clips would have to trade zu

[@sting114]

Clippers want Ingram , but they don’t want to pay him the max . If Ingram agent is okay with 4 years/$160 million, clippers will give pelicans the 2030 1st and some role players , zubac is not needed to be in the trade to make it happen.

[@andrewmcglashan5385]

@@sting114 did you not watch the video the pelicans have no center

[@benjaminkeene2346]

Seems like a good idea. Zubac is a good enough starting center and the clippers would get a star to fill seats in the new arena

[@sting114]

@@andrewmcglashan5385 so what . Zubac will not be in the trade . If pelicans don’t want the 20230 first , there will be NO trade !

[@MoGhadas]

Another casualty of the 2nd apron? Trading assets and paying superstar money to an above average scorer is a much more dangerous endeavor with the 2nd apron. I think the 2nd apron was solving a problem that didn't really exist, the luxury tax was doing the job well.

[@blablablaa14]

There was a problem. Teams like warriors and clippers were out spending everyone with no repercussions. That’s over now

[@ididntaskverified3663]

Second apron will punish teams for picking up people like harden, kawhi, pg, and Lebron by making it more destructive to make a super team, this doesn't stop the players from moving

[@MoGhadas]

@@blablablaa14 But genuinely what is the issue there? The Clippers have won nothing and if they had kept George, would be paying an old team and the Warriors were arguably paying tax for a championship team. Do fans want the owners of their favorite team to avoid the tax when their team finally becomes a contender/champ? Lacob isn't even in the top half of richest owners.

[@ididntaskverified3663]

Dynasties era is over, expensive teams won't last 7 years, you're not gonna be able to leGM and trade a roster aswell, but you're gonna have to be a lebron super star. The type of player that can't win without moving teams and changing the roster

[@MoGhadas]

@@ididntaskverified3663KD left the superteam Warriors willingly and the superteam Nets collapsed without winning anything. There hasn't been a superteam since.

[@BigMy28]

Imagine being the reason your team makes the playoffs while the so-called best player sits on his ass Imagine building up the team from scratch while the so-called best player takes a season and a half off Imagine being told to sacrifice so the team thrive but then being deemed not that good or not a game changer Imagine getting injured but coming back early and carrying your team to the playoffs through the play-in, just for people to say that a dude you torch religiously put you on clamps... While injured!! Imagine when you get hurt your team drops from fighting for the 4th seed to fighting for a 7th seed play-in spot with the so-called best player leading the way, but people pretend blind Imagine when you get injured that your team goes on a 5 game home losing streak, but people play blind Imagine averaging 23pts 5.5rebs 5.2asts for 5 years on 17.5 shots and being called ok while other players are being called great for averaging 25pts on 20+ shots The narrative around Ingram's career as a 3rd guy or as a player that can't impact the game as a 1st option is gross, especially when there're so-called 1st options missing the playoffs while he was making it (mostly without Zion being available). That young man being this disrespected entering his prime is gross. I hope he comes back this season and not listen to a single coach, force a trade through his play and let the Pels eat themselves for their disrespect I'm amazed that a team that free agents don't want to go to will be this disrespectful and deceitful to a player that built you up after AD wanted out and Zion wanted to play around on company time

[@mont-doggBeats]

exactly, these people in the comments are a bunch of zion glazers, you can tell they dont follow the team. zion is the franchise player on paper, But the francise player from a actually doing the work, the person asked to keep the franchise postseason relevant and not a complete joke is ingram. if it wasnt for ingram cj wouldnt have wanted to get traded at the deadline, he literally said he was the reason he wanted to get traded to the pelicans, he also has been a help to trey, herb and jose since they were rookies, its interviews of them saying so, zion himeself has said as recently as this season,Ingram and cj had to carry the team in his absence and he specifically mention them having to carry the team while he played himself into shape after the terrible in season tournament play

[@jarvispatrick6485]

You can tell people don’t watch this team when people say all BI do is score.

[@xvegeta13]

With the addition of Murray id personally move CJ since you have the guard and everyone else is younger than him but that's without getting into the finer details of which IDC about because it's the pelicans lmao

[@devingiles887]

Need to come to Miami…

[@shirleydouglass4399]

It is not that no one wants Brandon. For example, Sacramento wanted Brandon. It was the Pelians who taking their time to get a third team involved for a center, and Sacramento moved on. The Pelicans then were asking too much, now everyone pretty have who they want. Brandon carried the team when Zion was injured. When Zion started to play more Brandon had to change his game, scoring less. Diring the playoffs Brandon came back injured, with low performance. Brandon has never had a good coach, trade him to the Heat or Spurs and see how he thrives...

[@brianking7757]

Agreed. Sometimes I think David Griffin is an overrated exec

[@rapgodreloaded9259]

Zo's a seamless fit on any championship team. BI and Zo are on similar trajectories where they're just the third best player.

[@Colonel.B.Sanders]

Zo like you said is a plug n play, which if healthy most teams would definitely prefer as 3rd options usually take a big defensive role too

[@rapgodreloaded9259]

@@Colonel.B.Sanders 💯

[@trentonpearson7353]

Disagree on similar trajectories. Ingram can a be a number 1 option on a fringe playoff contender. Lonzo is a guy that anyone would love to have on their team, because it doesn't need to fill the stat sheet.

[@cloudzundersky]

I just remember him balling out in the Suns 2022 series when Zion was out.

[@thuggwaffle8825]

If they’re gonna make a deal with Portland they should go for Ayton instead of Williams. People love doggin on him but Ayton averages 17 and 10 and is a great shooter from mid range. They need a big that can space the floor so Zion can just bully his matchup in the paint.

[@NS327-t7h]

The issue with BI is that he wants max money, and he's a third/second option level player who plays like a first option. Teams are willing to pay max money to second or even third options, likely, if that player has a playstyle that can scale well next to better players, and add value even if he isn't having all the touch time in the World. A great example of that is Lauri Markkanen. Issue is Ingram doesn't move off ball much and basically stands there thinking his job is done after a pass, he doesn't take 3s at a high volume when he's shown he can make them at an elite rate, and he'll often turn down open looks from deep to dribble into a less efficient midrange shot that teams will happily give him or live with.

[@iceblazzer7549]

this video is 🔥

[@Solghetto]

Wild, I was just thinking the Utah Jazz would be a solid team for Ingram. Still until they figure out what they’ll do with Lauri Markkanen then that idea is on hold.

[@kevinlopez1117]

He’s a great second option to an elite player

[@blowc1612]

More like a 3rd option for a title contender.

[@emilfrederiksen.1622]

3rd option i agree. But 3rd options aren't gonna get paid 50 million in the new CBA.

[@HoopsAficionado]

Some teams that could use secondary shot creation and could therefore trade for Brandon Ingram - Charlotte Hornets (First option: LaMelo Ball). Toronto Raptors (Current first option: Scottie Barnes. I understand you may want to keep the ball in his hands). Los Angeles Lakers (First option: LeBron James). Atlanta Hawks (First option: Trae Young). Note: I know the Hawks could have traded Dejounte Murray for Brandon Ingram earlier.

[@jessiesteele2675]

Lol, I died that his Jersey in the thumb says “Zatarains”

[@danishaga4972]

On the surface the raptors trade makes sense but 100% Toronto wouldn't do it. They just added so many young players & hired a development coach in Darko Rajakovic. Why would the raptors trade for BI given his play style plus he's not the best fit around Barnes which is their deal breaker. Toronto is BUILDING around Barnes & won't add anyone that doesn't already show clear signs of fit around their max player.

[@danishaga4972]

I can still see a trade between the 2 teams but centered around NOP Herb Jones / Trey Murphy III & TOR Jakob / BB . After trading OG, Toronto should be interested in either as a really good replacement. NOP needs a center to be at least be competitive in the west + BB is a championship caliber role player on an expiring deal (Toronto also looking to move BB anyway).

[@Jayse]

@@danishaga4972maybe do a Poetl + Bruce + firsts for trey Murphy + filler

[@AndrewBradley-m2o]

To me, he is the in same echelon and caliber of player like Zach Lavine, Khris Middleton, Fred Vanvleet, and Julius Randle. A good second option to a great third option on most teams.

[@sweetchillyphillyc9383]

I’d love to see him in Toronto.

[@Jayse]

Same

[@LoonyJack]

I think he’d be good on the spurs with wemby and castle, i can imagine that would be a very good system

[@terrancedavis4851]

I want B.I i seen the man cook my raptors from the 3 last year. Sure we were underman but he was shooting the rock splashing 3’s. We need the scoring and id be excited to have him

[@ColdHoops]

RJ got over 100 million. IQ just got paid. You really want ANOTHER 100+ million contract player on your team? 🤔

[@terrancedavis4851]

@@ColdHoopsWe want a another talented wing/forward to start alongside rj and Scottie. Gradey dick just might already be the guy tho, and ideally we’d want a center closer in age to the bbq core (rj,barnes, iq)-for those who dnt know wat bbq stands for, even tho portle is already very good. We need a lob threat with shooting ability atleast on the bench if we cant find that with a portle upgrade

[@ColdHoops]

@@terrancedavis4851 If you think Gradey is that guy, aren't you contradicting yourself?

[@terrancedavis4851]

@@ColdHoops Im not saying Gradey is the guy tho, he has potential but still has to prove he can be that guy. He showed what he can do second half of the season but still a small sample size and B.I though struggled with his fit in the N.O is a proven player

[@rusty5004]

What about trading McCollum and sliding Ingram to the 2? It doesnt solve the issue of Ingrams extension (full 30% bird max is rough but doesnt kill the team, 5/230 is ideal) but it does offer a better solution to the fit issues in NOLA. Ddepending on who NOLA gets back they can establish a full starting 5 of 24-27 year olds (Murray-Ingram-Jones-Zion-) who can stick around for a while and build some kind of stability

[@markburnsworth3591]

Ingram is a very good player, most of the time. He tends to disappear at times though and in my mind definatly not worth a max contract.

[@Prince_mt12]

I will never pay this guy that amount of money. Like his current one is the best possible for him to continue being signed by teams.

[@jasonm2081]

Ingram,DeRozen, Herro, and Simons in Portland are all in that "good piece to a title team...but not a main guy" players.My guess is Ingram ends up someplace like San Antonio that has assets they can give up and don't have to play Wemby for a few years. Maybe Atlanta depending on if they want to do a rebuild or a reload. Maybe Minnesota if they want to move on from KAT and have Ant fully take over. But h Ingram just ain't getting a max deal for his next deal no matter what he wants.

[@NateArchibaldWithTheFro]

I think he could be a really good, overpaid, 3rd star on a team somewhere. He basically is that now for the Pelicans, but the fit isn’t right there with Zion. There’s just not a lot of landing spots for him that perfectly fit that ideal scenario. You already know though one of these busted up franchises like the Wizards or Hornets or someone like that will pay him and take him for a test drive and raise their ceiling incrementally.

[@ChrisHobson916]

One of the first casualties of the new cap rules is the BI max contract.

[@bulaclacj]

He needs to take an Aaron Gordon role.

[@ShadowX2406]

Not so quite. He needs a role where he can be effective as a scorer and passer in a tertiary position.

[@NS327-t7h]

@@ShadowX2406 Problem is 3PT shooting and lack of off-ball movement, which are crucial for being in a smaller role. He should be like a prime Khris Middleton, but he doesn't have the off-ball game and volume of that. Mid-range shots are meant to be a counter when your scoring options are cut off, they aren't supposed to be your main source of generation offense.

[@Leharrio_Structure7414]

(Miami) would be a good fit for Brandon .. Clippers // Milwaukee or even the Spurs if they tryna put another good piece in the middle of Wemby & CP3.. I can see a Big 3 over there with WENBY, B.I, CP3 or WESTBROOK😉

[@MindExcursionMedia]

The 20th team they offer Tyler Herro for?! 😂.....(when N.O. is guard heavy?).....wishful thinking.... Miami can't ever get anything to remake their roster when they never have anything other teams WANT🤦‍♂️

[@cl8355]

Ingram to the nets One 1st round pick, Bogdonovic and finney smith to the pelicans Easy deal that works for both teams. Bogdan is an expiring deal and finney smith contract is team Friendly for new Orleans. And the nets get a young all star caliber player on an expiring contract.

[@rcbarnson6488]

Teams want him. Markkanen is clearly the more valuable player and what happens with him will determine where BI goes. He is next domino after.

[@emilfrederiksen.1622]

Nobody wants to give Ingram a max with the new 2nd apron rules. Would be best for the Pels to let him leave in free agency.

[@JaySee5]

This is a lose, lose, lose situation. NO loses getting less or no value in a trade or non-trade. The team that trades for him loses by probably losing him in free agency. BO loses by not getting a max contract thanks to the new bargaining agreement. The best option would probably be to trade him to the Spurs for little to nothing. The Spurs can have him for 1 year and would be happy either way with the free cap space if he doesn't re-sign.

[@fenzelian]

Pelicans should have foreseen this situation and traded him last year when he still had 2 years on his contract.

[@blablablaa14]

He’s maybe the third or fourth best player on a title team and thinks he’s a max player. Those are the worst players to sign in the nba. He’s a 30m a year guy, not 50m. He’ll learn next off season when no one offers him big money

[@SonnyK248]

He probably thinks that because literally everyone in the league gets a max these days 🤦‍♂

[@ou8428]

I would rather have Derrick White than Brandon Ingram. Hell, I'd rather have just 2 Derrick Whites on my team compared to 5 Brandon Ingrams. DWhite is the 2nd best guard defender after Jrue and best shotblocking guard since Dwyane Wade, is an amazing PnR players on both roles, elite spot up shooter, 3 level scorer and is never hurt with no ego

[@wyatt5167]

​​​@@SonnyK248that's why I kinda like the new CBA. The max contracts were outta hand and it was getting tired seeing teams feel like they have to give a player a max and then screwing themselves financially. Even worse when these dudes would then just request a trade when they got bored. Truly the 2010s era took player empowerment and abused the hell out of it. Made it super clear that for the good of the game there does need to be some parity between orgs and players. Neither can have too much power Anyways, Let the max contracts be kept for the top players/franchise players. Role players/3rd options ect should get paid for what they are. And I mean either way they're still making generational wealth/more than us normies could dream of making in a year.

[@blowc1612]

He can't be a 50M player without All NBA. Obviously you follow this trash channel. I watch to laugh at the idiot and find the idiots who watches like yourself.

[@blowc1612]

​@@wyatt5167it's literally been over a decade that ONLY ALL NBA PLAYERS CAN GET THE SUPER MAX CONTRACTS. Ingram can't get 50M a year he isn't all NBA.

[@MegaMjjordan]

If he wants to try and compete still with the level of freedom he has Pelicans are his best shot with Murray and CJ. Anywhere else is just money without playoff & finals contention

[@jonathanyaney6110]

I think he’d be a great Pacer. Their whole thing is share the ball constantly and he can clearly pass. Haliburton would be the best passer he’s ever played with and would help keep his numbers up with his attempts down.

[@ShadowX2406]

Who would the Pacers trade away to get BI? Also have to keep in mind the Pacers salary cap since he’s in the last year of his contract. Is BI willing to do an extension before the trade or will the Pacers take the risk with him?

[@jonathanyaney6110]

@@ShadowX2406 I would say TJ, Nesmith, and Toppin. Toppin can play starting center and spaces/cuts well enough that he fits in pretty much any offensive scheme. TJ is the best backup point guard in the league and Nesmith is a phenomenal sixth man type. Essentially the Pelicans fix their depth and the Pacers trade enough cap to bring Ingram in without going into the tax. Plus I’m sure he would resign when you consider no one wants him right now and the Pacers would be a contender with him.

[@abreezyyt1705]

put him in the 6th man. he is effective everytime the ball is in his hands

[@ozzyargie2360]

The pelicans have won a lot of games with him as the top scorer.

[@ColdHoops]

Where was he in the playoffs though? 🧐

[@padrino8852]

​@@ColdHoops he had almost a career ending injury a month before playoffs and you expect him to get past the 2nd round without a very good teammate even LBJ couldnt get past the 1st round without healthy AD..

[@ColdHoops]

@@padrino8852 If you're on the court, there's no excuses. It doesn't matter how bad your injury was

[@clarenceorozco5300]

​@@ColdHoopsAlso zion was not present in the playoffs again...

[@clarenceorozco5300]

​@@ColdHoopsI saw your comment from the other reply section, ain't no way your an ingram fan.Your just a hater

[@sting114]

There are over 15 teams that will trade for Brandon Ingram this weekend if his agent and Brandon Ingram are okay with new extension around 4 years/$160 million dollars.

[@zerocrane]

No mention of Cleavland? Allen for BI seems like a pretty straight forward swap.

[@checkthapain]

I like BI. But he's not a max guy because of his defense. There is a way they could bring him back though, if they were to trade CJ. And he were willing to take less.

[@user-ed1yx2fq7l]

Ingram isn’t necessarily a star. I can’t see him being the number one option on a team making a playoff run.

[@jalenjohnson0339]

Ingram is at best a 3rd option on a title contender and no team wants to pay him 50 plus million especially with the new CBA teams are being more cautious on who they want to pay because if they give a player a lot of money they are going to be a bit cap strapped in the future Ingram isn’t worth 50 million at best he around 40 million and you could maybe give him 45 million but 50 plus is out of the question Another thing is he not much of a three point shooter he does his damage in the mid range and that kills spacing. The only teams that makes sense is the Cavs they would have to trade Jared Allen but if what everybody says is true the Cavs don’t want to trade him right now. The Raptors would be interesting him Scottie and Quickley would be nice but I think the Raptors might try to tank or they should tank. So yeah Ingram in a interesting spot right now where he a really good player but he not like a top 20 player in the league

[@LoneSamurai_X]

He'd be a perfect third option for a championship squad

[@cristian3_5]

I think Ingram to San Antonio could be interesting, he would rlly have less responsibility playmaking cause of CP3 and D cause of wemby

[@yeahwhanever123]

barely an all star and wanting the same pay as jokic and lebron is crazy

[@NS327-t7h]

Jokic gets 35% of the cap. Ingram would get 30% as his max. Still, 30% of the cap for Ingram is insane.

[@elijahmahone9358]

Surprised you didn't mention the cavs as possible trade partners almost elite fit for both. Mobley looked better at center Jarret has a huge cap hit. Cavs need some offense pelicans would love Jarret allen.

[@mareklame8589]

Ingram is very good, but not a franchise player good. "Robin" at best on the contender. With new CBA rules, it is reasonable to give him circa 35m a year. However, his biggest flaw are injuries, since rookie season he never played 65 games in a season. 120/4yr would be a bargain. 150/4yr a good offer for both sides.

[@Ckproduction03]

The perfect trade was with Cleveland but they chose Murray over Garland. BI, Daniel’s, and the same picks could have got them garland plus Niang Cleveland receives essentially a wing that replicates DG passing production and Pels get a long term PG Was a huge mistake for both sides

[@SDVaelo]

Cavs x Jarrett Allen makes the most sense for both teams

[@josiahross2463]

Neither CJ or DJM are better than Ingram. CJ should be the one on the way out imo

[@yapyap3]

Yup, but the Pels are trying to offload his contract, they know he's overpaid.

[@josiahross2463]

@@yapyap3 he’s not overpaid rn, he will probably be overpaid on his next contract

[@LandoReal__]

Toronto doesn’t need his talents bc that’s kinda what RJ is for. Toronto would probably want defensive role players so Scottie can play as a roamer on defense and not as a primary wing defender or POA

[@ColdHoops]

Seeing a lineup with RJ, Ingram & Barnes is terrorist basketball 🤮

[@alejandroperezquintero213]

What about Vuc, Lavine Carter and 2 seconds for Ingram McCollum and Nance

[@AnotherStatsGuy]

One note about Ingram leaving in FA? Any and all money issues basically resolve themselves. So a bad deal isn’t the goal here. Find a C with the exceptions.

[@PoppaTheeGoat2]

Miami get bi Jazz get Herro Pels drew Eubanks, Jordan Clarkson, Josh Richardson Throw picks and everything figured that out I think it’s a good deal for all teams Bi go somewhere new and fresh start, will have the ball more Herro get a fresh start and ball out on a young team and he will get trade his value will go back up Pels get more bench depth and get a center and a wing and a guy who can score

[@ColdHoops]

If Pat let trade happen, *he should retire on the spot*

[@rodericklee6790]

Heat,New York,warriors,bucks,76s,Portland

[@goodmooneung]

I really wanna see the Spurs get him. They can pay him bigger money than most think he's worth and make the bulk of salary come towards the end of his contract, but less than the max because of Texas having no state income tax.

[@ColdHoops]

They make the most sense. The issue is whether they would want him.

[@cleokey]

I can visualize a trade for first and a rotation player, but he's paid at about the right money with the current contract, not more.

[@drenigashi6157]

What about a Ingram for Allen trade? Could move mobley to the 5 where he is better

[@IgorBarduco]

I think the Pelicans lost the oportunity to sign Andre Drummond. Drummond is one of the best rebounders in the league, and I think he would be a good fit with Zion who is not. The 76ers got Drummond for 5M/1yr and the Pelicans got Daniel Theis for 2M/1yr.

[@melomanace3415]

Only problem i have with BI is the injuries. Other than that, hes skilled, well rounded, in his prime and no, he doesnt NEED the ball. Pelicans needed a PG and cj is definitely not that. Cj was the bigger problem but i suspect nobody wants him. BI is just more expendable bc of trey and herb being able to step in at the 3. Wish buyouts were more a thing in the nba. Id love to see this roster without CJ.

[@joshromero-burgan9860]

Bro this the most accurate post in here. This is it 10000%

[@SP.007]

To me, He's like the Paulo Banchero equivalent. Paulo gets the edge becasue he's 5 years younger. That's why I don't get the Paulo, as a star, hype.

[@ColdHoops]

You don't think Paulo could be a star? Are you smoking crack?

[@expectingpiano7911]

Kat for Ingram, fair enough deal for both sides. Pelicans Cj Murray Trey Murphy Zion Kat Wolves Conley Ant Ingram Reid Gobert

[@Will-wv7sn]

Aint gonna lie...id feel salty as fuqq if my teammate was getting pid like 30x more that I was...lol...and I out in the same amount of work.

[@mgannott02]

What would it take for him to get to Orlando, San Antonio, or Atlanta?

[@blablablaa14]

Him not asking for max money

[@mattsell2361]

Remember when people thought Brandon Ingram was better then Tatum 😂

[@Tsuny999]

Not even better than Jaylen Brown 😂😂😂

[@pinobluevogel6458]

He is better in certain aspects. He is a better playmaker, better midrange shooter than either of those guys. Not as good defensively and certainly not as switchable or athletic. I think you are still underestimating Ingram a bit though, the Celtics also have a system in place that is built around Tatum and Brown. Their defense is so good, because they stack multiple good defenders on eachother. One good defender can make a difference, but having 5 of them on a starting roster is just crazy.

[@mattsell2361]

@@pinobluevogel6458 saying Ingram is a better play maker then Tatum at this point is honestly crazy. Mid range I think still goes to both Tatum and Ingram

[@ColdHoops]

@mattsell2361 🫤 Where are these 'people'?

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@mattsell2361 You sir, are pretty misinformed if you think JT is close as a midrange shooter, I don't think he is bad, but Ingram is traditionally pretty elite, certainly top 10 and possibly top 5. Tatum was slightly higher efficiency from 3 over the season, at much greater volume, but that's about it. Just this year (which certainly wasn't the best year for either of them) Tatum shot: 41.8% from 3 -

[@blablablaa14]

I think its hilarious you do trades but they fail for cap space reasons and you still bring it up here like a legit idea hahahah

[@k.edwards6746]

Teams want him...but as usual for the cheap, while they will give players like Micheal Porter Jr. who isn't as good, but as always sign potential!

[@pierceliu9914]

He just had a bad year. If he’s playing like last year you don’t think people would be willing to give him 40 50 mil a year? Pretty wild that the world just gives up on him after one bad season one bad series. This is the perfect opportunity for teams with a star but limited assets to buy low and get their second option

[@balazsbalogh4109]

Before his injury he had definitely good season.

[@Dontsayitsover]

All i want is for Jarett allen to be traded for Brandom ingram since when jarett was hurt mobley was thriving at the 5 so giving us someone who can be a secondary option to Donavan Mitchel i would want a first with BI but giving us a great scorer to pair with our all nba type guard into a foward who can score and defense/playmaking with out 1 4 and 5 postions

[@zhongtiger6575]

he has insane leg to body ratio, better than giannis and kd

[@CrunchyHoopss]

trade centered around Kat for BI, along with other pieces to make it work, pelicans get their center, and the the timberwolves get a smaller contract and a secondary shot creator something they desperately needed in the playoffs, gobert and naz reid together had a +111 in 88 minutes in the playoffs