Star Wars Maps are Lying to You

[@davidnumber7]

This channel is exhibit A in how youtube prioritizes low-effort rage bait over high quality content. Corey is consistently putting out informative, high-production-quality videos that are as good or better than anything else on youtube. But his videos simply don't get recommended or seen by people. I can only imagine how frustrating it must be.

[@grandadmiralmitthrawnuruod5011]

This is the perfect place to once again ask you for a Star Wars Timelapse of the Imperial Civil War

[@BN-uh8cm]

I hope he does it I always wanted to see what the heck does the Imperial Civil War look like every time I look for it there's no good looking map or it absolutely nothing

[@huntclanhunt9697]

Also the reconquest of the Outer Rim.

[@nomar5spaulding]

Holy crap talk about a difficult project.

[@grandadmiralthrawn3164]

Do you impostor as me?

[@nomar5spaulding]

@@grandadmiralthrawn3164 I think you must be impersonating him, personally.

[@lamnaa]

Not to mention that, assuming it's like the Milky Way, the Galaxy is something like a thousand lightyears deep. So you could have planets that look like they are right on top of each other on a 2D map, but are massively far apart.

[@winngedhussarmalaka7685]

there is a shit laod of plkanets still to be explored in the galaxy in the deep core alone not to start on outer rim or the chaos

[@flamebreaker7318]

Do you not pay attention to the beginning of any Star wars movie it’s a long time ago in a galaxy far far away

[@fluffly3606]

@@flamebreaker7318, They said LIKE the Milky Way, not literally the MIlky Way. And since the Star Wars galaxy appears to be a spiral galaxy its structure is likely broadly similar; in fact if it wasn't it would only reinforce OP's point since elliptical (read: spherical) or irregular galaxies are or have the potential to be even deeper in the third dimension, respectively.

[@LordVader1094]

@@flamebreaker7318 Did you not pay attention to them saying "LIKE the Milky Way" and not literally the Milky Way?

[@grandadmiralzaarin4962]

Well Corey, you know what this means...Mapping breakdown videos!

[@AbramsCzu]

DO IT COREY DO IT! DEW IT.

[@kanalkucker14]

Dew it, even if it's not the jedi way!!

[@Hibbidyhai]

So, instead of showing which faction controlled which sections of the galaxy with giant blobs of color, should we highlight the hyperspace routes that they controlled instead?

[@CoreysDatapad]

It's all really context dependent- sometimes that's more relevant, sometimes the territory blobs work better, it's just important to remember what the purpose of the map is, especially when comparing different eras, for example.

[@Kolonol1]

Well they might only control 1 end of the hyperplane or something. It is extremely useful to control only 1 end of the hyperplane in my opinion.

[@archaean2331]

What we really need is a 3d map rather than a 2d one

[@Hibbidyhai]

@@archaean2331 Since the Star Wars galaxy is a spiral disc similar to our own I'm not sure how much that would add, versus complicating things too much. If you were an in-universe map you would have to account for 3 dimensions though.

[@archaean2331]

@@Hibbidyhai It would definitely complicate things. Whilst it's probably not the best example but if you've ever played elite dangerous which is supposed to be a reasonably accurate representation of the Milky Way, you'd see just how much depth there'd be even to a spiral galaxy.

[@nevertrusasmurf]

Wow as a former historian of frontiers in the Byzantine-Islamic area, I'm quite impressed by this video, well done

[@Cos_Why_Not]

You should make videos on the topic

[@nevertrusasmurf]

@@Cos_Why_Not thanks! I've been working for the Belgian federal government for 5 years now so sadly I think that I might have missed my mark for that but I hope some other history channel does pop up. If interested, I can always suggest the work, in English, of Jonathan Shepard or Catherine Holmes. In French there is also a lot although it is older and therefor less accurate sadly but Gilbert Dagron is quite famous though wrong on many fundamentals

[@Kolonol1]

This is interesting. Kind of like in games such as Stronghold Crusaders (or any of the stronghold games really) most of the map could be controlled by enemies as long as I controlled the mountain areas. I would build tiny little outposts on the hills surrounding my keep as long as it was within the buildable area and I could use. The enemies could control whatever parts of the maps they wanted to but as long as I held the....inb4 the rush of Obi-wan fanatics...high ground they couldn't use their land so it doesn't matter very much if they "control" it. Same idea applies in star wars. If the enemy controls 1 end of the hyperplane. Then that hyperlane is essentially useless until they can gain control on the other end.

[@Swiss_femboy]

Not entirely true. A Hyperlane is useful to you as soon as you can reach what you want to reach along the route. Not every goal lies at the other side of the Galaxy. Also oftentimes conquering parts of a Hyperlane is the first step to move down along the Route, so letting an enemy be with the thought of „it’s of no use to them“ could be fatal in Star Wars.

[@penzorphallos3199]

Imagine space ships as Ferraris on the highway. Highway might go through major towns but it's not all towns, and trying to get off the highway only to end up on local poorly maintained roads in bad weather without a gps is going to be tricky. Now imagine that in space with uncharted asteroid fields, space bats and pirates....

[@Kolonol1]

@@Swiss_femboy I'm confused....you just essentially said what I said with a completely different conclusion...

[@Swiss_femboy]

@@Kolonol1 no I am saying your line of thought is completely deadly to yourself in Star Wars. You cannot let an enemy maintain a foothold on a hyperlane without being at constant threat by it. It enables an Enemy to quickly attack you and as I say, rarely the goal of your enemy is at the end of the hyperlane. The stronghold comparison is bad. It would be like sitting on the end of a pipe, and an opponent controlling what goes through it. One day it might be goods coming you way, the other day it might be an invasion force, with the difference you cannot seal the pipe.

[@Kolonol1]

@@Swiss_femboy I know that's exactly what I said.... You are saying what I'm saying while you're saying that what I said was bad.

[@charlieo1138]

This is one of the best videos you've done. I love the intersection between your personal interests outside Star Wars, a deconstruction of the concepts behind mapmaking as it applies to Star Wars, and outside of it. Great video, can't wait to see what you put out next.

[@Arashmickey]

The Rakata Empire map told me there's a huge blimmin Togruta head right outside the "north east" edge of the galaxy, but I went and checked and it turns out there's nothing there.

[@DIEGhostfish]

And then there's stuff like political allegiance being less certain. Or errors like thr Atlas and Guide to Warfare confusing Zsinj's secret holdings on Corporate sector worlds with him owning thr worlds outright

[@demonicaxeman7264]

What bothered me about Star Wars growing up was that I noticed there were 2 groups of Star Wars fans. The ones that believed the war ended in Return Of The Jedi due to the Death Star II, Emperor, and Vader dying along with the celebration dance. The others who were fans of the comics and books, said that the civil war lasted for another 20 years. That mismatch definitely caused issues concerning what actually counts as a victory. It makes more sense that the Galactic Empire would not have all its forces in one system (Endor) and then be all destroyed in one battle. I don't know what Geroge Lucas' vision of how big the Star Wars galaxy is, but outside the black and white fantasy of the Original trilogy there is so much that realistically was not accounted for. If Lucas continued making Star Wars films right after ROTJ, perspectives about the political landscape of the galactic map would be further explored. I love that the Prequels was heavy with political content, something that was only lightly mentioned in the Original Trilogy.

[@pizaster2058]

Im appalled at the lack of views. You deserve hundreds of thousands more. Let’s get corey to million guys

[@michaelandreipalon359]

"Can you see any BORDERS from here? What has BORDERS given us?! We're going to start over from scratch. That's what V2 is for." "Too bad, Buddy. This twisted GAME needs to be RESET. We'll start over from "ZERO" with this V2 and entrust the future to the next generation!" (If anyone is confused, it's from Ace Combat Zero: The Belkan War.)

[@kingdomofesildon9609]

*Spanish Guitars and Latin intensify*

[@Dermenscha]

The really interesting thing comes in when you look at groups like the Hapens who control a very dense but highly built-up area of the galaxy that might not even show up on most maps.

[@mitchellbrecht2240]

As a GIS major and star wars fan, thank you very much for bringing up the discrepancies between discrete borders and the reality of the ground.

[@christiandevey3898]

It’s kind of like French colonization of North America. For the most part it was just a few small settlements or trading posts along the major rivers

[@edwardkarppi436]

absolutely amazing video, Corey! I think it could be more beneficial to visualize faction power by what hyperlanes they control

[@-lgoonareternall-3772]

Are there any maps you do mainly use for reference, in terms of what you brought up in this video?

[@GermanOlle]

"The Essential Atlas: Star Wars" is what are you looking for; but it is based on the old Legend/EU canon. It's about the galactic history (from "prehistoric" Rakarta Empire to Post Endor Era) of the SW galaxy, showing sector maps, faction overview like Harpes or CSA, shwoing the routes of our heroes in the movies etc.

[@spiffygonzales5899]

@@GermanOlle So the real canon then

[@GermanOlle]

@@spiffygonzales5899 Yeah. :P But I have to say: Some Disney canon stuff ware okay, too. But the Sequel era... nope. XD

[@NiiRubra]

It's easier to explore planets within a secured "border" (how do you even establish a border in space, what, are they gonna put up fences?) than to expand that vague notion of territory, so it makes a lot of sense that the growth of these territories was one of planet density, rather than geographical expansion.

[@bobwill]

I'm currently reading *The Essential Guide To Warfare* and it's kinda of neat that I could pretty much guess the time depicted on the map, based off the names of the location, even though I don't think I've encountered any maps, yet in the book. (Kindle Version, so it doesn't make sense to flip ahead to look a the pictures.)

[@starwarsunfiltered7848]

A great video, although just about every point you make was addressed in some for or another in the first chapter or two of the Essential Atlas, specifically regarding density and the paradox of of attempting to border sections of three-dimensional space.

[@michaelbonnett4347]

Easily my favorite star wars youtuber! You’re the man Corey

[@Ashguy733]

"See more boring videos like this." Hey! This was neat and appreciated!

[@namelesssomebody2557]

I can never find the Tapani Sector even when the Lore says they are right next to Fondor

[@Bluepizza1684]

not matter how flat a galaxy loooks like it is still exist in 3 diemsions and there are star systems and other cestial objects in all areas of the 3 planes of existance there is a real possiblty that nations in space fairing univsrse would have overlaping borders on a 2d map due to some systems existing "above or below" (abritrary anyways) the galactic plane, aka the equator of that the galaxy rotates on

[@lonerangerv1224]

map painting goes brrr

[@Aszod96]

As someone hwo does GIS for a living. All maps lie to you in some aspect. Maps as manipulated to show what ever the author wants

[@toptiergaming6900]

yhea my imperial warlord faction I made up as a shitpost is always gone for some reason, almost as if it is not cannon

[@RayHardman7567]

Star wars has the best explanation of ftl travel in all of sci-fi. Every movie and game it's point your ship in a direction, activate the ftl drive, and you'll arrive at your destination soon. Star trek is the biggest supporter of this. Halo actually attempts to explain they're traversing dimensions human eyes can't see, but it's still point and arrive.

[@keith6706]

Then you should expand your horizons of sci-fi, because if you think it's special--or even unique--you're kinda mistaken. Many have variations other than "point and arrive" that long predated Star Wars. Just a few examples off the top of my head: - Warhammer40K: Faster than light travel used by humans involves traveling through a literal hell dimension where demons are waiting to feast on an unprotected crew. Oh, and you might arrive at your destination before you left. Or a few centuries later. The Warp is like that. - 2200 RPG: Stutterwarp limits your ship to only being able to travel a given distance in light years before it has to stop near a stellar body to discharge the drive. Which means that if your ship can have a maximum travel distance of 7.7 light years, that star 8 light years away may be forever beyond reach except by taking a very circuitous route traveling though multiple star systems before being able to get to your destination, or be willing to spend decades poking along at sublight speed using reaction engines to get within range. - Alderson Drive: example of your standard jump points. Get to a point, activate your drive, and you instantly pop-out at the companion jump point at another star. Of course, like the preceding example, if jump points don't connect the stars directly, you have to go the long way around. Or perhaps not be able to reach it at all. Of the jump point might inconveniently be _inside_ the star you're going to. And if your trip involves multiple jumps? You're spending weeks chugging at sublight speed across a solar system to get from the point where you came in to the point where you want to leave. - Incidentally, Star Trek has had ships pulled out of warp, tossed into alternate universes, damaged by space anomalies and a whole host of other things which prevents it from always being "point and arrive", so even your best example is a great example.

[@RayHardman7567]

@@keith6706 never knew most of that. Most informative. Thank you.

[@wilhufftarkin8543]

0:42 what is the source of this beautiful cinematic? It looks like a EaW mod, but the cinematography is beyond!

[@CoreysDatapad]

These are animations I've made for various videos

[@wilhufftarkin8543]

@@CoreysDatapad Did you create the models yourself? If yes, how much would a commission cost? I always wanted a model of a Victory-class Star Destroyer according to my own headcanon. There is not a single depiction of my favorite ship out there that is 100% the way I like (except schematics from the side). All of the available official and non-official depictions (that aren't schematics) show different unique elements compared to the Imperial-class, but not a single one combines all of them. The Armada model is as close as it gets (the model in this video looks very close to it), but I prefer the atmospheric wings that open up over the way it's depicted in this video. Also, I love the way the two main engines of the Victory I look compared to the three engines of the Victory II. Do you know the model they created for the Victory I in the X-Wing Alliance Upgrade mod? It's almost perfect, but it has a diagonal "spine" behind the command tower, like the Imperial-class, instead of a vertical one. Edit: Also, the Essential Guides to Vehicles and Vessels' schematics from 1996 didn't show the communications tower that is present on the Armada model and the model in this video. I don't have any Legends sources for this, but my guess is that it's very possible that many of the Victories that were around during the OT were retrofitted with those, just like the Imperial Is.

[@iratepirate3896]

I am always reminded of the tiny Ottoman island in the Danube that was left behind after the independence of the Balkan states

[@christophmahler]

These are all _conclusive_ points - begging the question why it is not modelled in-game, despite the mechanics being part of the 'vanilla' code. *Exaggerating features to the point where a desired outcome appears as self-evident and 'intuitive' as in real-life* would be an approach: ° e.g travelling aside hyperlanes is 'possible', but takes e.g. _ten times_ as long as moving back and forth along the lanes (display a warning tooltip e.g. when hoovering over lanes) ° moving supercapitals, capitals - and even cruisers - along lanes is 'possible', but is e.g. _ten times_ slower than an entire fleet of corvettes and frigates (due to 'something something _fictional physics of mass'_ ) Such design choices will alter gameplay, drastically - turning 'a micro-management simulator' into an exercise of _strategic imagination_ .

[@CoreysDatapad]

This is a lore video, it has nothing to do with any video games.

[@christophmahler]

@@CoreysDatapad "This is a lore video, it has nothing to do with any video games." You are mistaken. And You know why.

[@ArmageddonEvil]

Why does Star Wars Scream Warhammer 40k? I know Star Wars came out before Warhammer 40k, but this feels like those Psychics that help Ships move in the Warp. lol But I suppose, not this specific thing you said @ 4:14 that made me think of Warhammer 40k.

[@SkywalkerWroc]

Brilliant video, one of the best topics since a while! Cheers! :D

[@userequaltoNull]

Honestly, this was a very good and original idea. Subbed just from this one video, which is rare for me.

[@NikoLavikainen]

How does one widen a space lane?

[@legoinglegion458]

I imagine that it's a massive project involving super powerful reverse tractor beams pushing space dust and gases out of the way.

[@Ptaaruonn]

Awesome content.

[@jordanjames2956]

Bored on Twitter. Twitter is either bored or angry so it makes sense.

[@Nostripe361]

I would love to see a three dimensional map of the galaxy. A flat plane is a really bad way to show territory in open space.

[@eonrier9469]

which game are you using to get those stills?

[@CoreysDatapad]

They're animations, they're not from a game. The ship models are from the EaWX mod for Empire at War, the maps are specifically made for this purpose.

[@Blurstrike]

What game are you showing in this video?

[@CoreysDatapad]

These are animations, though I made them using models we made for the Empire at War Expanded mods

[@spiffygonzales5899]

If you're looking to play a game that looks like that, look up StarWars: Empire at War. The remake mod looks AWESOME.

[@spiffygonzales5899]

@@CoreysDatapad What mod specifically?

[@josiahshangrila7322]

@@spiffygonzales5899 The Empire at War Expanded mods: Thrawn's Revenge and Fall of the Republic

[@StabbyTheSkaven]

@@CoreysDatapad now im hoping for a EaW sequel with that level of graphics. or just a EaW sequel or something like it in general. i like the original but many things i find very clunky and even modded they can only be fixed to a certain degree when accounting for the fact that the game is really old by now.

[@zepheth2479]

Pathfinders sound an alwful lot like the spice pilots in Dune

[@lethalnl]

have you tried foxhole? even has a timelapse after every war

[@Tk3997]

This is all well and good in theroy, but the problem is that well... basically EVERY writer ever in the setting completely fucking ignores it and just has ships blasting direct from system to system at will without the slightest mention of difficulty pretty much ever.

[@CoreysDatapad]

They'd be moving along established hyperspace lanes, so the specific paths of historic exploration doesn't really matter. There are plenty of plot points about hyperspace lanes being mined and such, or places that have limited access (especially in the NJO and Clone Wars)

[@zebjensen4251]

what game are these clips from?

[@CoreysDatapad]

They're animations I made, not game clips

[@zebjensen4251]

@@CoreysDatapad dang, you should be in game dev this animations are meta. Had you told me this was prerelease on a game or mod you where making I would have believed you.

[@CoreysDatapad]

The ship models are from the EaWX mod for Empire at War, the maps are specifically made for this purpose.

[@randomobserver8168]

Long live Greater Maldrood! So much better than those w*nkers in Lesser Maldrood.

[@MegaZeta]

I am glad they still play the bongos

[@boreasreal5911]

now I am asking myself wether the pathfinders were inspired by Dune or WH40k

[@mill2712]

I'm unsure but if I were to guess, Dune. A lot of sci-fi was inspired by Dune. A lot of Star Wars itself was inspired by Dune.

[@Marvin-sj9lr]

I would not be surprises if 40K itself took some inspiration from Dune (like AI being tabu), Dune is almost inescapable when it comes to space opera

[@TKA001]

How many other lies have I been told by Wookieepedia??

[@maciejkamil]

Interesting.

[@SubManic]

Aw hell yeah. Get wonky on it.

[@LibertyLocalizer]

I see Pallaeon, I click

[@Безымянный-ш6с]

Corey Code : 1.The Galactic Map is a lie.

[@Iamthelolrus]

I think this is the perfect place to voice my support for the Japanese claims on the Northern Kuril islands...

[@DIEGhostfish]

Even japan omly claims thr southern Kuril though. (By claiming they are not part of the Kurils)

[@Iamthelolrus]

@@DIEGhostfish crap knew I should have looked it up

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@Iamthelolrus Yeah, Japan is very bog on not openly defying their surrender treaty, qhere they swore off the Kurils, other than "Well THESE islands really aren't part of the Kurils."

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@Iamthelolrus And it's no big deal, we have at least one head of state making the same error, though he certainly has motive to take a maximalist position.

[@spiffygonzales5899]

Any map that takes away land from China is a map I can support 👌

[@markusskram4181]

Cool

[@JohnNathanShopper]

💛

[@rileymosman2808]

I would like to see more boring videos like this, yes.

[@Herstal8389]

first!

[@eiffelium]

There was a map showing the population density of the galaxy in a legends' essential atlas or something, I'm surprised not to see it in this (great) video