Stellantis CEO predicts doom for auto industry: Chinese EVs a “Major Trap”

Stellantis CEO predicts doom for auto industry: Chinese EVs a “Major Trap”
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[@jluis333]

I am touring the major cities in China right now. Half the cars are green plated evs. They are mostly chinese brands and about 10% teslas. There is no smog, the air is breathable and car noise is minimal albeit the occasional honking (no police or emergency car noise either). I am seeing the future today.

[@jonathantaylor1998]

I just wish you could take out with you all those anti-EV keyboard warriors spewing out their usual FUD, saying they'll never buy an electric 'milk float'... they'll never work... etc etc No, EVs won't combat global climate change, but they WILL further improve the local air our kids breathe in as they play out in our towns & cities and that WILL reduce the incidence of chronic asthma and other respiratory diseases they're currently forced to suffer as a result of the toxic gases pumped out by the cars, SUVs and trucks they all drive.

[@passby8070]

yes i was there 4 months ago, absolute blown away how far they are in their adoption process, thought it would be max 20% of the total, but some cities are looking like 2 of every 3 cars.

[@sriarno335]

The future, when only few will possess such means of transportation,

[@jluis333]

The future like some will be on bikes, many on electric scooters and others in evs and ice cars. Each with his own way working all together for a common goal - prosperity (I didn't see any homeless people or drug addicts/drunks roaming either)

[@StrongmanLi-pz7sl]

@@passby8070 Most of the green plates are hybrid like byd dmi system or similar, they have gasoline engine, comparing to pure ev this is not enough, in my opinion.

[@Dave333M]

The problem with European carmakers, especially the premium brands is not cheap Chinese car but the premium options that made those cars expensive, now comes as a standard in most Chinese cars or most other EVs. Is called competition. Remember when we use to pay more for GPS, massage seat, automatic window control, open roof, alloy rims, touch screen control, cruise control, remote key or keyless, Leather seat, and the list goes on. Hypothetically speaking if the actual cost of European premium car cost $35k but you add another $40k for those options and more. 😂😂😂 Those days are gone bro.

[@iainwares6361]

Part of the problem yes, but no getting away from the lower cost base in China whatever trim a car has and the Chinese state subsidies. Look at the Dacia Spring, a basic EV made in China and shipped to Europe sold at a profit. Could be made profitably within Europe and sold at under €17k? Probably now with low battery costs so why are Euro makers fleeing to China.

[@Dave333M]

@@iainwares6361 I hope Electric Viking will do a honest video with real verifiable numbers about how much $ subsidy Tesla & Other western counterparts received in subsidy, how much of it was spent on R&D/infrastructure compared to stocks buybacks. I believe we are likely to see some hypocrisy there. Viking himself also said in one of his old videos that Tesla did not become profitable until we went to China.

[@billstrasburg384]

I think you're correct, and I'll be glad to see the nickle-and-dime fees go away. But the real problems is the cost of doing business in Europe and the U.S. Unions are a blight upon humanity. They always have been. And the government taxes and regulates every component and production process, significantly adding to the costs. The Chinese have an entirely socialist country and they don't even do that. It's ridiculous how much of the economy the government controls. We haven't experienced Capitalism since the 1980s. Robotics may improve quickly enough to save the American car manufacturing industry from the union component, or it may not. But the government squeezing industry to death and forcing it overseas has always been a major moral hazard.

[@Dave333M]

@@billstrasburg384 You couldn’t have said it better. I agree. I think we are digging our own graves with all these fraudulent tariffs. I wish the government could read your comment and wake the F up to reality. Their time is running out fast and they don’t even realize it. Pathetic

[@cuteandfunnyearthlings2863]

European carmakers just want to rip everyone off.

[@mengsiongkheng113]

I was in China last week, the road is so quiet and the air so clean because of EVs - saloons, busses, bikes. Amazing.

[@Tigerex966]

500.000.000 cars owners in china only 20.000.000 ate EV s 2 percent Most of the EVs in china are charged with dirty coal Pollution is at the utility not the tailpipe. You should know this.

[@user-ms9nh2gw4w]

@@Tigerex966 Haha, have you visited China? I guess not. Have you seen how clear the sky is? maybe you are still seeing image of Beijing 20-30 years back. They have built more coal plants, to replace the old and aging plants. China is leading the world in solar panels, wind turbine, reforestation, hydroelectric. Guess you are either ignorant or choose to deny. Stay delusional if you insist. Meanwhile, China continues to march on.

[@garylee9668]

@@Tigerex966 power plants are usually far away from the city areas where most EV cars are running, especially all the taxi, China's version of Ubers are using EV cars. it makes a big difference.

[@Tigerex966]

@@garylee9668 pollution is pollution carbon is carbon it makes no difference in the computer model false lies and theories theories that carbo is killing and heating up the earth beyond repair and evs are part of the solution

[@wanwan-xo9fl]

Today, BYD released a plug-in hybrid electric vehicle, the Qin L. LFuel consumption of 2.9L/100km, thermal efficiency of 46%, range of 2100 km.

[@eysleysl]

And only cost USD13.8k for this car in China

[@peteness9550]

Stellantis has plenty to worry about. An entire portfolio of crap.

[@andrevanrossum8408]

Bullshit. Stellantis makes great cars for an affordable price. They deliver cheap spare parts and service for a long period. What do we know from Chinese brands? Low or no service because probably 90% of the Chinese EV brands won't survive. That is not what I say, that is what experts say. A brand needs to sell enough cars to survive.

[@johnbeckham1483]

Carlos Tavares needs to listen to what his customers want & it's not EVs ELECTRIC CARS! The American Automotive Industry is much different than that of the European market!

[@liberty-matrix]

"China will be the dominant global player in the transportation sectors of the future." ~Bloomberg Technology

[@williamduffy6633]

The car companies suffer from a ridiculous amount of over capacity. However, governments and unions refuse to face that reality. Many factories are obsolete and will need to either close down or depend on governments for subsidies. I think the next 5 years will become ugly facing that dilemma.

[@hanswitvliet8188]

Over capacity on models we don’t want, while not enough capacity on attractive models….

[@yourcrazybear]

Yeah. The same goes to the over supply of brands and models. They need to trim it.

[@carlcadogan4510]

The problem is no matter the industry, everyone needs China, like it or not.

[@KUANGCHI-ot6tt]

If Chinese government gives a huge subsidy to EV, and people in America and Europe buy those EV in a very low price. Does it means Chinese government gives a lot of free money to American and European customers? How bad is it?

[@blackjackpinoko]

It is not about the average consumers. It is all about protecting the domestic industrialists.

[@sneakymove]

Isn't competition the way to protect domestic industrialist long term? 1st, u dunno simple math, 2nd u r short sighted as the politicians

[@andrevanrossum8408]

They buy market share, destroy our car industry and then the prices go up. That is very, very bad. Millions of European people wil get unemployed.

[@user-tk2xl5cx8z]

American here. Please name 3 products that are not Chinese that you bought in the last 5 years. I have ALL Chinese and not complaining. LG OLED Sony OLED, refrigerator, recliners, Nikes, furniture, etc. All are good quality and a good price. Just buy an American Tshirt and compare price/quality to others. And I am NOT Chinese origin...we are European origin. 30 years ago when we emigrated to America they said we don t focus on manufacturing anymore, we are just focus on financials. So...don t complain about cheap products from China. Even our Tesla M3 have the battery made by BYD.

[@eldios831]

This is the same problem in the UK....very focused on doing world finance businesses

[@jamesvandamme7786]

LG is South Korean, Sony is Japanese.... it's a world economy. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.

[@stevoz6743]

Chinese American here. There is only one thing I want to say, the constant nagging about China from the US government and the countless hostile economic policies against Chinese will continuously reduce Chinese people's interest in US made products, even as a Chinese American myself and can't get out of this country as easily as some people have claimed, I am trying my best not to fund those devils that hate my race because I know Chinese Exclusion Act was deliberate, it just couldn't be sustained because it's racist.

[@jasonwang1572]

@@jamesvandamme7786 but made in China

[@andrevanrossum8408]

Well said. In time China will also take over finance. And then we have nothing left to compete except our stupidity and ignorance. The problem is that we can never compete because we don't want communist state capitalism.

[@richardchiu3305]

The thing with China is that they have over 100 manufacturers and most likely only 5 will survive long term. So the eventual survivors will be the fittest. If American keep protecting their companies, the gap between American manufactures and Chinese manufacturer will only grow larger and American consumers will end up paying 2x or even 3x for their cars. The worst thing is, American automaker won't be able to sell anywhere else in the world but only inside the US where they have trade protection.

[@tedwong7037]

Chinese ev industry has been struggling for years, and the govt introduced Tesla to china to "muddle the water", its been three years of fierce competition, now the dust has settled a bit, many companies died, but the whole car manufacture supply chain is getting much more sophisticared. only brutal competition can kill those companies tricking govt for subcidies, but im thankful Biden thinks differently, hahhaha.

[@andrevanrossum8408]

So from 95 Chinese brands you don't have to expect any long term availability of maintenance parts.

[@marke9036]

*"How many times do you want to file bankrupt?"* *Stellantis and GM: "Yes"*

[@mnhsty]

It’s true the more protection you give to producers, the less incentive they have to improve cost and quality. With tariffs, you get visible benefits and hidden costs that may be greater - an ideal scenario for dishonest politicians.

[@katherandefy]

The don’t wanna cut their profit margins or descend the competition ladder.

[@thomasantn]

Chinese automakers including BYD typically have much lower profit margin than those European and American’s. Elon has to lower Tesla price in China several times over the last 12 months to compete against China's domestic auto makers.

[@katherandefy]

@@thomasantn very different market culture, yes.

[@bunsw2070]

@@thomasantn Nonsense. Most western auto companies have been running on profit margins of 0.5% for years. That's why their stock prices are so low.

[@thomasantn]

@@bunsw2070 Not for Tesla, at least not for it between 2020-2023.

[@bunsw2070]

@@thomasantn Tesla has been running on zero profits and infinite hype.

[@totifernandez9532]

The real trap is what these legacy automakers are setting on the American consumer. They will be taken for a ride in the wrong direction.

[@mavelous1763]

American consumers may be a bit lazy, but they’re not stupid. Some American VOTERS are stupid.(the anti-EV ’orange’ ones)

[@nickmcconnell1291]

Indeed, by shutting out Chinese EVs from the U.S. the American OEMs will slow walk or completely stop making EVs because they cannot compete with Tesla's feature/price offering. This will ensure that the US OEMs do not make the transition to EVs and will become dinosaurs that will die the first moment the tariffs are lifted. They also will die off quite a bit as Tesla robo-taxi slowly eliminates a large portion of their new car sales. Tariffs are stupid and result in higher prices and less choice and eventual destruction of the market.

[@MJ-revered]

And in the meantime Americans will keep on paying +10.000 Dollars to much for their cars because now they won't have to compete with Chinese brands. Nobody wins with this. ​@@nickmcconnell1291

[@100c0c]

Letting in Chinese EVs will kill them even faster. And don't say anything about joint ventures 😂. They gain nothing from Chinese EVs entering the market. They have enough competition from Kia alone. ​@@nickmcconnell1291

[@jantjarks7946]

Either way the car industry quickly comes up with competitive EVs, or they are going extinct. It's really that easy. Tariffs won't change that, as the Chinese will simply build factories where they are needed.

[@datianlongan5567]

I live long enough to remember tor years nobody would believe renewables can out compete fossil in a free market.

[@davidpickard9393]

The UK motor industry was fine until the Europeans started to make better cars and sell them here in the UK.

[@theandersonfamily4245]

Uk motor industry was happily producing terrible cars until Japan produced reliable better cheaper cars. Check mate. It’s Dejavue but with China.

[@NathanZar]

Really? When was that?

[@styx1272]

Fine Junk. The socialist paradise of Britain loathed capitalists.

[@larryc1616]

Same will happen to all legacy auto. The only car manufacturers left in 5-10 years are Tesla and Chinese ev manufacturers

[@sneakymove]

That is quite irrelevant now, because UK gonna follows what US does anyway, regardless the reason.

[@thesearethefables]

To be a successful business owner and investor, you have to be emotionally neutral to winning and losing. Winning and losing are just part of the game. Risk comes from not knowing what you are doing!!

[@korkyket]

Successful investment starts with clear goals and risk assessment, often best done with a financial advisor's help.

[@MrJohn-zb2bi]

With Bitcoin ETFs gaining popularity, some predict the price might reach $100k. Should I consider investing my $500k cash savings now, or have I missed the optimal time for potential gains?

[@threehoursofsleep]

I recently sold half my tech stock holdings due to all-time highs, leaving me with $400k. Should I invest in ETFs now or wait for a market correction considering potential inflation?

[@DiegoRaphael-xw5dl]

James Clark's market insights have consistently led to profitable decisions.

[@gusforrester]

Celebrating a $30k stock portfolio today from a $6k start. Investing wisely has given me time for family and future plans.

[@DC.409]

He’s actually stating the bleeding obvious. The reason the legacy automakers went to China was because of less legislation, cheaper labour and potentially a significant new market to exploit. The Chinese have said thank you for training and developing us, we can take it from here. TFL London - The Mayor just approved a deal between Go-Ahead Group (a UK transport company) and Chinese automaker BYD to build over 100 electric double-decker buses for London's streets. Each of the buses will apparently cost around £400,000, which is supposedly around £100,000 cheaper than what can be offered by UK suppliers. The cheapest UK supplier was Alexander Dennis who ironically use the BYD Electric bus chassis and build their bus around it. So the difference in production costs is consistent with the Stellantis view.

[@biometal770]

We gave away our tech and lost jobs in return. Great!

[@DC.409]

@@biometal770 the EU are imposing trade tariffs, like the US, whether the U.K. follows we will have to see. Everyone is chasing the second BYD factory at the moment.

[@Arashiii87]

European manufacturers must focus on long-term competitiveness through innovation, cost reduction, and strategic alliances

[@richardbloemenkamp8532]

As long as there are sufficient other jobs with reasonable wages, there is no way that European workers will accept jobs with Chinese salaries and working conditions, furthermore the best batteries and rare earth metals come form China and the environmental regulations in Europe are a lot tighter and more enforced. Thus competing on cost is out of the question. Innovation has traditionally required venture capital. This you can find easier in the US and in China than in Europe. European innovation passes a lot through European subsidies. This has shown to be very political and ineffective. Plus Europe is divided in many countries with all their own little languages, thus scaling good ideas up is very difficult. I'd say don't count on Europe for innovation. Strategic alliances basically relies on using European pension money to buy Asian motor companies. This is what Stellantis and other European brands will do until the production will be shifted so far towards those Asian factories that in practice these brands will be Asian brands. Europe will probably give some subsidies to keep a few final assembly lines in Europe.

[@frogmoreit1]

@@richardbloemenkamp8532 Well said Richard, this is a real worry for Europe and the Western world, the skills and labour force required to sustain an automotive industry are very important during times of potential conflict. As people far more intelligent than me have already stated, the next big war will be over resources. Competing against a dictatorship which has close to infinite control over it economy and workforce like China does is impossible for any Western style government and it's economy. This, if left to continue will not work out well for the free world, it saddens me to say.

[@cuteandfunnyearthlings2863]

European carmakers just want to rip everyone off.

[@eddiemilne4989]

Strange that you've left out working a 12 hour day,6 days a week,with half the current annual leave,no right to strike and no pension provision..Face facts,Freemarketeer..We either go all in on protectionism or fast traction to Victorian working conditions..Personally I'd consider getting out the nukes while we still have the advantage..

[@richardbloemenkamp8532]

@@eddiemilne4989 It seems like you have never been in China. Conditions may not be great but they are not monsters there. I have seen quite a bit of China over the years (my parents in law are Chinese).

[@chillfluencer]

My dad now made 76,000 km...with his 20'' E-Bike within 10 years. Only replaced the battery once because the old one had only a 85% capacity and it wasn't enough range for my dad. Bike is alive and running. Only the usual tire and brake pad changes. And three spokes broke (not all at once) and got replaced. Motor and controller still are top!

[@tims8603]

I heard that e-bikes have reduced the amount of gasoline consumption in the US by a measurable amount. I really like my e-bike, I just wish our summers were longer.

[@laughinggas5281]

I was riding my e-bike to work 20 years ago. That was long before they were available in the marketplace like they are now. I had to buy a kit to convert my regular bike into an e-bike. Guess where that kid came from? You guessed it China. I think the original battery was a nmh chemistry. There were a lot of maintenance problems with that bike though. Things have improved significantly since then In any case I love my riding my bike to work. And for short errands.

[@chillfluencer]

...the bike from China did cost 536€ by the way. From this you can extrapolate how sturdy and cheap BEVs are on the long run.

[@advancedbodydesign]

Can't Restructure when Union Wages are $80 hr

[@jamestucker8088]

Wages only account for 7% of the cost for a new car. Even if the CCP was using slave labour they would only have a small price advantage. This is just another case of the Communists trying to take over another industry while pretending to be capitalist. This is classic Mercantilism. And the way to fight back is with tariffs.

[@norvellharris1792]

Sorry if these legacy automakers are just figuring this out then they are really lost.... The Chinese have been planning this for far to long to fail and they are progressively aggressive...

[@taylorc2542]

You have to have tariffs when you're competing with massively subsidized. A recent study showed they have 3x-9x more subsidies.

[@danielzhao5471]

@@taylorc2542No one can outdo the American EV subsidies via Inflation Reduction Act. Which is more than $800 billions.

[@taylorc2542]

@@danielzhao5471 Tiny compared to having an intel agency spy for your companies.

[@markuc]

The best thing for Europe is to do better. Innovate, design, engineer... We asked China to end its reliance on oil and fight climate change together, or did everyone forget?

[@demomano9915]

@@markucThey were supposed to talk about it for years on end like us and doing nothing. Not actually taking action! China took it seriously.

[@jjamespacbell]

Top car executives' ONLY concern is how much can I funnel into my own account in the next 2 to 5 years.

[@bartsolari5035]

others become politicians and milk the system to the grave

[@frenchydampier2209]

Heck, how come Tesla can do it? They are selling a lot of Tesla’s in China. And all over the sorld Maybe Legacy auto makers need to change their methods of operation.

[@Fred-Jai]

The real reason for this doom, is that EU and US auto makers are being crushed by Chinese auto makers in China. There has been a big shift away from the likes of VW and GM. The cost for a vehicle in the west are some what mediated by sales in China which are now in decline. Chinese auto sales and cheaper manufacturing has been keeping the EU and US auto industry profitable for so long, this is coming to an end. Suck it up, either pay a lot more for your locally produced vehicles or let the market decide. With the advent of AI and Robots in the workplace, wages will not be the determining factor of the price of a vehicle but the cost of energy and commodities will be.

[@drtk722]

Politics beats economy, always. Car manufacturers are stuck btw a rock and a hard place. Complaining is futile. Prepare to deal with reality, hurry up, dear CEOs!!

[@appleapple7372]

not 30%, however, they are willigly to get a very narrow margin, because their CEO is and not getting pay 2 billion a year, and if the world do not want it, they do it for their residents and CN

[@chrisheath2637]

Pure economics. Legacy Auto will have to partner with Chinese brands to create affordable, desirable EVs. US, Europe - they cannot compete on cost with China. Result - Legacy will re-badge Chinese cars, and their own manufacturing will dwindle. To me, this looks inevitable, no matter how disastrous this is for Legacy. But the execs will still exist in their shiny suits, - dealerships too, will shrink...(less maintenance / parts required for EVs)...I expect a big push for hybrids from Legacy, and a serious lobby against the introduction of tighter standards on emissions...

[@Fred-Jai]

Assuming a trade war doesn't get out of control, your argument stacks up. The Chinese government has a long term strategy, that is to be the #1 economic superpower and to destroy US hegemony. Chinese auto makers will attempt to flood the US and EU auto markets with cheap EVs as part of this long term goal. Partnering with local Chinese brands may work if the Chinese govt strategy allows it. Its not straight forward. 80% of Chinese Evs are sold locally, just let that sink in!!

[@user-ry5rt4yo1d]

It's either China can indeed make vehicles at only 30% rate cheaper or the European auto manufacturers have being milking customers making insane profit per unit over the years!

[@hanswitvliet8188]

We have been ripped off, while they were flushing margins through the drain.

[@hansmaulwurf9051]

Levels, levels.

[@biovmr]

The public statements are not to be viewed as the entire story for any of the major manufacturers. Their plans to save their companies (or trash them) will remain private in order to secure whatever advantages that secrecy allows.

[@user-et5wt6sr5s]

Consolidating my portfolio to focus on BTC and Revux, maybe a touch of LTC.

[@francisdebriey3609]

Tavares for once is right about tarifs... and your analysis is right as well, Sam. Advantage of chinese is 50% Minimum !!!

[@hdoakville]

Probably 30% net of all regionalized costs. That means shipping, regulatory costs, service costs, etc are already baked in.

[@LaBambaCL]

UBS took apart a byd seal and said it has a 25% lower cost than legacy car makers. byd makes their own battery tho. as said in vid, the cost of shipping is quite high. cost of a sales network is also high, so byd seals in germany cost similar to teslas.

[@Sacto1654]

Cheap is one thing. But the quality control is something else.

[@LaBambaCL]

@@Sacto1654 if you are referring to the quality of chinese oem cars, they match us market cars according to jd powers since 2014. similarly safety test scores on ncap.

[@philiptaylor7902]

Restructure = move manufacturing to China?

[@andreandre1051]

👍👍

[@ljs444]

EVs should be an option - not a mandate in order to buy a vehicle. Nothing is a bigger turnoff than the government telling you what to buy.

[@ConstanceCox]

The legacy auto companies have been fat and lazy and costly and shit quality for decades. Them and their planned obsolescence

[@Tigerex966]

500.000.000 cars owners in china only 20.000.000 ate EV s 2 percent

[@carlosorff]

The problem with the EU car makers is just one, and it is called greed.

[@MgMreast]

He meant that he can't compit with China so the strategy is now to buy part of China EV and 100% tax in USA might block this expected income from investment

[@truebrit3670]

Stelantis are correct about the change. We've seen this change happen already in the electronics industry. Electrical & Electronic companies were decimated when the Chinese moved in. The only option for manufacturers was change or die. Even a company as big as Philips sold its consumer electronics business in order to survive. No company is safe from Chinese competition. Even with tariffs the Chinese will operate at a loss until the competition is gone. You work with them or they will see you wither.

[@allankoivu3263]

Did you earlier say that Chinese EV makers are not paying their suppliers and are going out of business.......Now you say they are robustly out competing their European competitors... What is it?😉

[@amandagrant4331]

The closure of some manufacturers will not weaken the overall competitiveness of China EV. The same story happened in the photovoltaic industry. Many China enterprises closed down, but those who survived still dominated the market. China follows market rules more than the West.

[@allankoivu3263]

@@amandagrant4331 Actually the way the article states it the vast majority of Chinese car makers including the foreign ones are losing big money. EV panels are a different story as there are no large foreign suppliers to compete with. ie there is no Ford of EV panels.

[@apsmith1635]

Put 200 percent tariffs on the cars fom CCP. Do not give them any money to undermine your free country

[@morbid747]

China aren't selling EV in the US.

[@vikaramkumar4393]

If you’re into presales, Revux is a must-have. Early birds get the biggest worms!

[@aldogrech55]

I disagree with most of the things Tavares says, but here I agree with him.

[@royphillips7644]

China will do the same thing that Japan did. Copy the vehicles, then set up manufacturing where they want to sell them.

[@donblythe3766]

According to KZbin Brian of FutureAza none of this will make any difference because universal income will have to be implemented because the robots that are just weeks away are going to be replacing humans in the manufacturing of everything from mining to transportation to assembly and artificial intelligence is going to be doing all the design work

[@nordlandak6853]

The man a communist environmental wack job.

[@khengarahir9813]

Moved all my funds into BTC and Revux. This presale is too good to pass up.

[@leulgeorgis3216]

When he says a 30% advantage he most likely means all in including logistics, marketing etc.

[@marlan5470]

The problem is this: European car companies (or their 4 wheeler manufacturing arm) should focus on ONE car. One. And do it right. There's too much fuss about making so many varieties, when they should be doing one and doing it Well. Then the consumer will purchase it. You have the Chinese making tons of models and expanding their market, but the Europeans can't seem to get the blinders off their eyes (like those donkeys have to keep them from straying)...

[@StormyDog]

Tesla's model...

[@tomh1727]

@@StormyDog or Fords model in the early days lol

[@bobcornwell403]

Tarrifs should reflect the cost advantages only. And they should do that, if we don't want the average American to live like the average China man (if that's even possible). Does the average China man drive to work like the average US worker has to? Can the typical Chinese auto worker afford to own an auto?

[@Supergiuggiu]

I think that they simply put an hypothec on Chinese brands in difficulties , buying partially them (saving them from the bankruptcy) and to sell them in the European and American market with their names..

[@5wys17-cv7dz]

Stellantis CEO does not see any hope. He should take a break. Stop thinking and do what he should do. He will eventually will be able to bring out an EV that will be sold in the market like a hot cake. These days he seems to be living in despair, hopelessness and frustration.

[@BMWHP2]

Stellantis already did bring that EV, and it is indeed selling like hot cakes. The first sub $25k EV that can do 320km range, has LFP batteries and is totally build in the EU.

[@TheDirkdams]

Are they doing it like DR does in Italy building Chinese cars under a Italian brand

[@bartsolari5035]

interesting

[@Lawiah0]

I want FSD, so that rules out anyone but Tesla.

[@StormyDog]

Ditto.

[@ScottOstr]

Nice to see them finally make a reliable vehicle 😏😒

[@sneakymove]

Stellantis CEO didn't lobby the lawmakers hard enough? He gotta learn more from Ford and GM.....that's how "democratic" system works in US. "Majority" of Kaching wins eh.

[@randy74989]

Tariffs are OK if negotiated fairly by both parties. Competition is good, it creates innovation, creates upgrades to plant & equipment, and ensures first-class quality control. Costs must be measured against reliability, innovation, and what the customer desires. Customers will decide what BEVs, PHEVs, or HEVs they want NOT the government, so Toyota has the correct idea, go slow, let the consumer decide, and then make "smart" investments in manufacturing and engineering. I know, I have a 2023 Lexus ES300h, a hybrid vehicle that is spectacular and I don't have to rely on a Super Charger or home charger to get fantastic mileage with plenty of horsepower. HEVs are the bridge to better battery technology, better manufacturing processes, and more cost-effective EVs in the future. They are just NOT ready today unless you just want to tool around town or back and forth to work.

[@douglaswatt1582]

Utter nonsense

[@sailing7seas]

What about instead of 102 percent tariff, Maybe we should have a fifty percent tariff to fast track GM and Ford investment in EVs

[@2chuck]

Stellantis vehicles have such a poor reputation in the U.S. that I'm beginning to wonder how they can compete with anyone. Their cars and trucks seem to always be the lowest rated with Customers, Frequency of Repair Stats, Dealers, and Consumer reports. I wouldn't even consider buying one of their vehicles and I'm not the only one considering at how many unsold 2022, 2023 and 2024 vehicles that are rotting on their lots even as they have increased prices. I've never seen stats for the Chinese brands, I would need to see a whole lot of research before I ever bought one. I would want to know if they meet U.S. crash safety standards, their Frequency of Repair record, Battery Fire Stats and availability of parts and costs of repair at the very least.

[@sergiu0678]

The price difference is so simple and obvious. The problem is that Europeans in particular, pretend not to see. The demands of the Europeans for high and very high salaries, (nothing to say because everyone wants them) but unfortunately, with these demands, productivity decreased a lot. Claims to work as few hours a week as possible combined with unjustified welfare claims. All this leads to excessive expenses on the part of investors, expenses that are reflected in the final price of cars or any other product manufactured in Europe.

[@tedb5432]

So, if the VW car costs $10K in China and $13K in EUSSR, the Chinese will sell that VW car for sub $20K with a margin of $10K. and the same car sells in EUSSR for $40k, margin of $27k

[@jason-us8pc]

SELL THE CAR BUT NO BRAND - DEALERS ENCOURAGE TO PUT THEIR OWN LABEL?

[@nicksallnow-smith7585]

I don't follow why there is panic and criticism of China for building car plants in other countries and shipping parts there to be assembled. All the western car brands have been doing this for decades. It is neither a surprise nor a genuine cause for complaint.

[@JamesJacobson-ov4ps]

Some Stellantis vehicles, like the keep and another e vehicle have a tendency to burst into flames, or even explode. They design the battery so it off gasses into the cabin. Stellantis has it’s own problems with evehicles it needs to fix before it looks outside of itself. It is it’s worst eve,y

[@TheCostofAutism]

I think that 30% number is about right will China does have very low wages on average the reality is that big manufacturing centers like Shenzhen do end up with much much higher costs of doing business not Justin Bieber but the cost of goods the cost of electricity the cost of everything is much higher in these big manufacturing centers for now a lot of those costs are offset by government incentives but at some point you can't continue to spend unlimited amounts without consequences in considering that as it is no one is making any money here once those incentive start to get rolled back there will be massive problems with the Auto industry in China

[@billwoznicki1012]

The same thing will happen that happened with riding lawnmowers at box stores. All EV,s besides Tesla will be Chinese. Maybe 3,4,or 5 companies will make it and the EVs will all be the same just a different front bumper and grill for GM, Honda, Dodge, and the rest. The rear end molds and emblems will be different but the cars will be Chinese tech.

[@stefanpredl6849]

better start retooling yesterday

[@bjAsfaqueking]

My bull run picks: LINK, UNI, and SOL. Best presale? Hands down, Revux.

[@mrmawson2438]

Cheers mate

[@BillMitchell-lm8dg]

Ummm.... making a car for 50% more than Lee Motors is the SAME as Lee Motors making a car for 30% less. It all depends on the starting point, i.e. the denominator in the equation.

[@markmd9]

Since when Stelantis can predict the future?

[@jonathanbradshaw2575]

The only way I see European car manufacturers surviving is if they absorbed a Chinese manufacturer that is not doing too well, take the tech/ innovations, improve and manufacture in Europe. I know this is simplistic but they need to get their arses in gear. I am really surprised that Ford or GM have not jumped at the opportunity to acquire Fisker or Lucid to get the tech. Even Canoo would have been an opportunity for the Ford Transit/utility vehicle.

[@Fred-Jai]

The only way they survive is through protectionist policies ie tariffs. Which will mean higher prices for you and me and also less innovation. If they can't make a competitive vehicle then they need to get out of the business. Does Europe or US make phones or TVs no! , if they did it would 2x the price. This may be our future, only supplying certain components to the Chinese Auto manufacturers.

[@MudflyWatersman]

Don't think some of y'all understand just what unfair competition is....... When companies don't have to pay their employees equally, or worry about pollution, meeting standards, being sued, yeah it's a lot cheaper to make things.

[@Hookeslaw]

I get what you are saying but sweat shops and components for I phones etc are made in China.

[@galaxiedance3135]

Stellantis is doomed cuz the vehicles they make is crap!

[@BMWHP2]

In the BEV market (PC+CV), Stellantis is growing with a 20% increase year-over-year, seizing a 13.7% market share in Europe. And in 2023, Stellantis was the world's fourth-largest automaker by sales, behind Toyota, Volkswagen Group, and Hyundai Motor Group. On top of that, they are the first to bring a sub $25k EV with a 320km range. VW and Tesla couldn't do it, that was always just a lot of talk.

[@vartulia]

How about they sold EV cars for a profit? Then compare.

[@user-vp6vf8wm2s]

Structural problem? Where are your primary materials come from? India? UK? Australia? Hello China, 80% of battery primary raw materials

[@kamra99a]

The ability to pay workers less is not a virtuous characteristic. Except for government financing and subsidies, it is the only reason Chinese manufacturers can sell for a lower price. Evolutionary "fitness" must not be left to chance. As in eugenic selection, fitness must be defined by our own human values. Tariffs must remain in place until Chinese auto workers can join the UAW and get wage parity with every other UAW member.

[@kamra99a]

@@kenbehrens5778 China offers a deal: "We pay low wages. Therefore, you must give us your auto industry." To this the world says, "Ah, well, OK, I guess we have to give it to them, don't we?"

[@EmmanuelJotterand]

Stellantis has lot of fears to have, as they do not have as Volkswagen a contract with Xpeng Motors, they best brand ever in the global world, the new BMW Group. They never robbed anything to BMW Group in contrary if others brands, but did better than BMW Group and did EJFJ Autonomous Driving to help all drivers, better than BMW Group and Mercedes Benz ever did!

[@vincentrobinette1507]

China doesn't have labor unions, like the USA. Because the labor is only a fraction of the cost of building in Germany, USA, or even Japan, they can easily do that well. My big concerns with Chinese cars are reliability, safety, and parts availability. I'll have to see how their warranty is as well. My experience with the Chinese is customer service is virtually non existent. You may be looking at an inexpensive, but disposable car.

[@cosmoobserver3416]

China's automakers are built on the cheap labor of robots, not human workers. Check videos about the body factory of Xiaomi Su7. In a huge workshop, there are 381 robots and only 20 ppl. Made-in-China cars are actually better than European cars. Bigots like you should open your eyes to see the truth.

[@demomano9915]

Unions are commies.

[@stevenwu9995]

Get real. Customer is king. Customer wants quality at affordable price. And choice. If a company can't meet this bare minimum requirement, it's time to close shop. Customer will look to imports, yes from China and elsewhere

[@briancampbell179]

A while ago Sam said that Tesla and BYD were the only two EV manufacturers who actually made a profit on each vehicle sold. Whether it was true then is less important than whether it is true now. If the majority of cheap Chinese EVs are still being made at a loss, then that is not a sustainable position, even if European auto makers are in the same position. There needs to be a day of reckoning where those auto makers who survive are making sustainable profits from their EV sales before any realistic picture can be formed. While manufacturers are accepting losses, apparent price differences are just an illusion.

[@royhuijsmans6117]

We in EU have regulation it's mandatory for all companies and labourers. Safety, working conditions/max hours, minimum wages, Environment etc. We both, manufacturers and labourers benefit from it. But products made in countries with no regulation, low wages and who don't care for environment, are allowed to enter the European market. That is false competition. Most EU/ US multinationals, make huge profits, by also use Chinese cheap labourers and poor regulation. why is that allowed? I dont say we should not be trading with China, or other countries that but on other terms. And we dombos are buying these cheap Chinese stuff... and killing our industry and market.that hollows our economy. Trade fine! both on different conditions.

[@amandagrant4331]

But this can't explain BYD's factory in Hungary and Chery's factory in Spain. I believe these factories must abide by EU laws.

[@pauldby1479]

Electric cars are just appliances like a fridge/freezer -especially in white

[@nicolajoanna4707]

Cheap Chinese cars have existed for decades, but Western countries have had little interest in them. This is partly due to safety standards. To date, none of BYD's models have rated in Europe. I'll be surprised if cars like the Seagull/Dolphin Mini suddenly surge into the top 10 there, no matter how cheap.

[@Wiscotac]

He seems more concerned about tariffs than the cheaper cost advantages, where those advantages could be bogus information. Another thing, he's probably right about the Darwinian times for the auto industry. I think he was looking for an auto industry money printing press and he might be one of those left holding the bag of debt. Meaning he's possibly a decade late to the EV change-o-thon.

[@nordlandak6853]

If you’re about ev adoption then open up the floodgates.

[@enriquemino9963]

FIrst lets look at the Chinese CEO pay of any of these manufactures and you will see that they get about 188,000 per year with no stock options. Look at the big 3 ceo and they are paid in multimillion dollars salaries which is why the rank and file went on strike do demand more pay. There is no reason to pay any of these persons that much amount of money. So you wonder why chinese cars will make inroads into these markets, look at all the money you pad yourself and bring out very expensive crap.

[@alko_xo]

Tariffs! Tariffs! Tariffs! Tariffs!

[@drew-azureperthwestaust4818]

Who the hell is leap motors ? Noone has heard of them. Chinese cheap EVs are not of the same quality as Western Safety standards. BYD EVs have burnt down 8 of BYD's dealerships in China.

[@BoogabooTheFlea]

Lower costs are the result of cheaper raw materials and cheaper labour. I understand China makes their own batteries with their own raw materials. If they build in Europe the second advantage no longer applies. So the carmakers in Europe should get aid from the governments to make their own batteries and get access to a complete supplychain for batteries, just like in China.

[@12345anton6789]

The EU pays out huge subsidies to those who build battery factories. One big problem is that the battery technology is more or less developed in Asia, they are far ahead of Europe. Is not much to do about supply chain for batteries since China has huge control over the raw materials and the process plant.

[@BoogabooTheFlea]

@@12345anton6789 you’re right . So there is no time to lose to do something about it.

[@hkmp5kpdw]

People don’t think slave labor be like it is... but it do.

[@potuspeck6991]

Never buying a privacy invader

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Musk will be beside himself with joy.

[@WM12329]

Again, money talks...... Does this guy want tariffs or not? He's changed his mind to what he was saying a while back. Seems like Western manufacturers moans about Chinese made vehicles BUT, all want to shift production to China or go into partnership with a Chinese manufacturer if it means they benefit financially (and they know they're so far behind).

[@haoruchen4216]

He’s head of Guangzhou Fiat which failed in china, got his butt kicked, bitter and scared of Chinese evs

[@SanjayMeena-od2kb]

Who else thinks Revux will outperform XRP soon?