Strength Compared V15 to V5. What’s the Difference?

[@JoshRundle]

Thank you for watching! What did you find most interesting about the comparisons? Can I ask 2 big favours? 1) Could you press the Subscribe button? It helps so much and allows me to continue making these videos. 2) could you tell me what sort of comparison video you would like to see next? Thank you for your support, J xx

[@antoniomolina3612]

your little mustache was magnifique

[@JoshRundle]

@@antoniomolina3612😂 thank you! I grew it myself

[@JoshRundle]

@@AnnaandMat if this comment gets 1,000 likes, yea

[@Chalkdust81]

It's the best demonstration you can do of the importance of technique. The "V5 climber" is outrageously strong (far, far stronger than any V5 climber I've ever met) and has the metrics to be doing V10+ imo. Reminds me of Emil's channel, which recently had another "V5 climber" doing BW + 50kg on weighted pullups.

[@Chalkdust81]

Oh and, for the next comparison: yourself vs someone significantly shorter but about as strong on a Moon board. I think the differences in beta would be super interesting, especially if you find someone who can't span the kickboard to row 10 without cutting loose. (Moon board would be better than Kilter since there are fewer feet options so it will do a better job of forcing different beta!)

[@davidpaulcl]

Most v5 climbers ain't gone hang 50kgs...dudes an anomaly

[@cyziostep]

Also he's huge

[@cartergerman2860]

It also might have something to do with a lack of technique. He probably could climb much harder if he climbed smarter

[@blindgeorged6386]

most v5 climbers would have tried using the crimp at least once on that yellow climb

[@DanielBParada]

Yeah that’s fucking crazy

[@Will-kt5jk]

I can’t even do weighted pull-ups yet at v5 & only e]recently started finger board after I found I was weak on crimps (got through, but needed to rest it a bit due to some warning pains)

[@shin10912]

Garston is definitely strong for a v5 climber. Watching him climb Boulder 2 makes it glaringly obvious he hasn't climbed much and just needs to work on technique to climb even better

[@TheValinov]

this sometimes can be true, in other cases his height makes the boulder very different and its sometimes easier to dyno stuff then try to put a foot somewhere where you just push yourself away from the wall. perfect example is in the last boulder. look how completly crunched he is when getting around the corner. no wonder he cant get further in this position. maybe he could have used a long left leg to reach the next foot hold, but i never heard of a the setters that puts down extra foothold for longer people...

[@maddhamstr]

i would say he is even too strong. And It's definitely hard to use technique when you have finger and arm strength 4-5 grades higher than you climb.

[@maddhamstr]

​@@TheValinov Talking about extra footholds for taller people - I sometimes do that as a setter. In order to make 6ft+ climbers feel same comfort.(my usual setting height reference -5.4-5.8). But i do it only on easy routes, up to v5-6. And i definetly agree it is not a common thing to do among routesetters

[@TheValinov]

@@maddhamstr okay nice to know. when you set hard problems, would you agree that it is most times hard for your specific height and arm-span and could be harder or impossible if the athlet is way smaller or taller? thats what i observed alot indoors. i have with my height a range advantage but on most routes this brings me nothing, because and can reach beyond on hold but not to the next one. and on the other side i often have foothold, like in the video, that are on very bad positions.

[@TheValinov]

@@maddhamstr he is also quite heavy. when i lost a lot of weight in the past, i reached a point where using my body felt super good and movements where possible that wernt before. that was amazing, but after getting the weight back, i lost this ability again. in his case i guess its the same problem. technique comes naturely with the years i would say. but i also wonder why he can pull up the same as he can hang... i think he should be able to hang way more if he trains that aswell.

[@JustinAstro]

This definitely goes to show how important and nuanced technique in climbing really is. Technique around how to hold certain holds, movement, body positioning, specific beta and micro beta. You can be super strong but if you're not using your body in the right way it's weighing you down. Loved the video!

[@slapthesloper]

Matt is also almost certainly stronger in all the other parts of his body that allow him to stay closer to the wall and reduce the strength his fingers need to apply. Even just looking at him you can see he is more muscular and more controlled on the wall and makes better use of his feet.

[@maffin1012]

A few simple and isolated strength tests don't say much. What is technique if you don't have the strength to hold onto the wall?

[@Ericxnugz]

100% dude , I’m 4 months in to climbing have climbed a 5.12 at my local gym and can flash most 5.11’s and climbed 3 v5’s , I’m pretty strong but don’t have the technical ability yet to crush anything above v5 , it’s so hard , just gona keep climbing and training everyday

[@UrsantaHoHoHo]

nah, ur not strong if can hang, ur strong u can pull from that hang to at least a lockoff. people get it wrong

[@hurmeli]

I climb about V4-V5 and I can hang on that hold maybe 1-2 seconds with no extra weight.

[@viniciuscollaco]

In a recent video on lattice about plateau on V5, the average is 133% bw on 20mm edge if I remember correct

[@ComputerManDanMiller]

@@viniciuscollacoSounds like on average people who climb V5 are way stronger than they need to be to climb V5. I've climbed a few V6 and done quite a few V5 on the Tension Board and I can only hang bodyweight on the 20mm lattice board. My technique is fairly good but still has tons of room to grow, I'm not some amazing climbing savant.

[@TheValinov]

@@viniciuscollaco uff thats already 33kg in my case :S

[@Hailsatan13]

@VoiD323 I weigh 150lbs and could hang on a 20mm edge with an extra 50lbs for 5 seconds. It's definitely possible. Haven't ever tried but could probably do a pull up with close to 50lbs on a 33mm edge🤷‍♂ And I'm not a very strong climber either, far from v10

[@ramnisimov1146]

same

[@basilpappas9700]

Something that was not brought up here was core strength, and this ties in a lot with the technique discussion, as it is a place that really matters for keeping tension through the body on the wall. Maybe this is a factor in what allows stronger grade climbers to differ themselves.

[@La0bouchere]

@@rleften5788 yeah, the amount of core strength needed to hold even the most insane positions isn't actually that much. Anyone that can hold an l-sit well is pretty much maxed out in terms of core strength for climbing except for very unusual positions. Lat strength is much more important for keeping body tension than core.

[@bobbob22146]

except body tension and core strength are not the same thing. Actually back and shoulder strength matters way more when talking about body tension than core strength itself

[@LadyLaddy]

I love watching how Anna moved on the yellow boulder. Really impressive

[@bullydungeon9631]

A bet a power endurance test would show matt blasting everyone else away

[@JoshRundle]

Definitely! I reckon Anna would do really well at that one too!

[@tjkim1999]

That and contact strength. I would bet that Anna would have a much more comparable rate of force production/contact strength with Josh. And I’d expect Matt to blow Josh away in this metric. At a certain point, it doesn’t matter how much force you can generate, since it’s already more than enough. It matters how quickly, and for how long, you can generate.

[@Kraaketaer]

Really fascinating to watch! And super cool to see someone contrast the frequent focus on finger and pulling strength in climbing to the real-life similarities and differences between climbers that factor in a lot more than this. Seeing that last boulder was especially cool - watching Mat at the bottom of it, he flowed through it so fluidly, going between tension and flexible movement, while Josh was tensed and much stiffer throughout the whole climb. To me that section really highlighted how strength only matters inasmuch as you can apply it and combine it with the ability to apply it to the wall. Which is of course also well illustrated by Anna being seemingly much weaker in the initial tests, but climbing really, really well. Things like pull-ups and weighted dead hangs themselves have important technical elements to them too, of course. So, again, really great video!

[@alexgreaves4526]

Really great video, Josh! Matt (14:35) touched on it being good to repeat climbs to perfect it, it might be a cool video to see you all do hard flash-level boulders, then showing perfecting the beta and what that process looks like. I admit it probably wouldn't be the highest viewed video for the non-climbing portion of the audience. Also a video with Matt on drills would be great to see. Seeing the contrasts in the way you all climb for your given grades, especially with Josh and Garston being strong for their grades, as well as Anna and Matt strength-wise being very good representations of their grades (based on stats from multiple benchmarking platforms e.g. powercompanyclimbing and climbapedia). The differences in the way you all climb, really showing the technique and nuance, and the approach to body positioning. Seeing Matt climb in these videos is always so good for highlighting how to keep your hips into the wall and how to use your feet while moving around mostly straight arms. The last boulder in particular was so good for this, seeing Matt do great 3 point-of-contact climbing, establish both hands, walk feet, drop foot to get hips in, then hand move, walk feet etc. and how calmly Anna takes the next hold (28:05) establishing really far over her heel, hips past the arete/over her heel. Then comparing to Josh (27:15), just slightly more snatchy, obviously not meant to be disparaging to Josh, he's a giraffe and has a lot more human to get over the heel. It's also a great example of how filming yourself as a climber can really help you refine movements!

[@Gork862]

I just want to second the idea of flash-level boulders and then repeating the climbs. Would love to see that in a video. Seeing a video on drills would also be pretty great

[@boulderup9c]

That was very interesting, educational and entertaining. Note to videographers: Always always always keep the "next" hold in frame. So annoying to not be able to see the hold that the climber is going for.

[@RossPotts]

@JoshRundle, Huh. In the start On that yellow (Boulder #3?), Garston seems to drop from the same place every time. Where everyone else matches, then bumps their right into the blocked crimp, he skips that and just tries really high on the left crimp. Did anyone think to have him remember that beta? He definitely looks strong enough to complete it.

[@heididixon165]

I really enjoyed this video. It's so interesting to see how much technique contributes. What's most interesting is to watch and see if I can see the difference in technique visually. I can but it's so much more subtle than you expect. It's a quality more than any particular beta choice or strategy. Matt and Anna have a smoothness to their movement and a precision. They hit holds with very little extra movement (both when they move dynamically and statically.) They have a rhythm and pace to their climbing. It's a snake like quality.

[@wunba]

I don’t understand how is it possible that both of these guys are climbing the exact same route at the exact same time!!!?? 🤯 10:27

[@Kraaketaer]

Some posh climbing gyms have these fancy spacetime-warping walls, so you can climb the same problems as your mates at the same time. The only drawback is you get sent off into branching timelines and never see each other again.

[@Josh-je9bd]

@@Kraaketaer I lost my best mate like this, he’s not lying

[@ScottValler]

The more you can mix heights in the videos really helps me see different ways to move. I'm very early in my climbing journey and learning how to move my center of gravity so that I'm not stuck in a position is where I get tripped up most often. The comment from the V5 climber really struck me as that is what I think very often. I hope that watching other climbers will help me learn how to move through positions instead of getting stuck.

[@faarao44]

I am a V5 climber and can barely fingerboard 5s with my bodyweight

[@MyMusicSosa]

Same, I feel like if I had those stats you’d see me on a V8 at least

[@JoshDoes]

what? no way lol im v5-v6 and can do 7 pullups on 20 mm edge let alone hang.

[@davyvanderschoot6406]

Mate I can't even add 10 kgs to my deadhangs and I can climb v4 on the moonboard and v5 in commercial gyms. Where do all these ridiculously strong v5 climbers get their finger strength

[@thenayancat8802]

lol yup, I was doing about 12kg on the ~30mm edge on the beastmaker 2000 yesterday. Absolutely limit for me, and I climb about the same as you

[@matthewv8226]

Literally exactly the same for me, no idea how this dude can be called a V5 climber hanging with 100lbs on his waist on 20mm

[@iantaakalla8180]

Apparently, that v5 climber sucks at technique, so he does his best on v5 boulders on average.

[@SP-rk9ht]

I would assume excessive fingerboarding because they think climbing harder = pulling harder.

[@crawfish5220]

Some people are just strong🫤

[@milksushi6640]

It seems like the biggest difference between Mat and Anna vs Josh and Garston is that, from the second they get on the boulder, it seems like every movement they make has a positive effect on them getting up the boulder. Obviously Garston just needs to climb more and gain some intuition for body positions and feet and stuff. For Josh it kinda seems like, at least compared to Mat and Anna, he runs out of ideas more quickly on the wall, then either jumps down or half-commits to a method he doesn't think will work. It's almost like they more quickly optimize everything their body is doing, whereas Josh senses the bigger movements but some smaller things like very specific body positions don't fall into place as naturally. I do think there's also a difference between him and Mat in shoulder/lockoff strength, like how far you can pull your body with one arm when your body is sideways (especially while keeping close to the wall or maintaining body tension), which I think uses quite different muscles than pull-ups. That being said though, it does kinda seem like the difference between Josh and Mat is mostly just a more advanced version of the difference between Garston and Josh

[@chaozzah]

It looks like there's also just a lot more muscles at play than the two you tested. If you look at Anna and Mat, they climb with such control. Sure that's experience and technique, but I reckon just because of how much they've climbed, they also trained all the muscles in between? More back, shoulders, core, legs... As they say, full body sport.

[@jmb9701]

Goes to show how much technique matters when you hit a certain level. Climbing is certainly really multifaceted.

[@Ragin__Cajun]

Something I’ve discovered recently is just how much my strength plays into my skill level. My first day at a climbing gym I muscled my way through a v5 thinking that was about average skill level. I’ve been maybe a dozen times since then quickly learned if technique is needed over strength I can’t do v5

[@biggussconnus]

Matt looks like he has completely unweighted each limb before moving it. That is something I am going to keep working on. I can hardly hang on a 20mm crimp without added weight. I now know how important my feet must be. I climb most slabby V4s, but can't do overhangs. Maybe my lack of finger/arm strength is my weak link to work on.

[@Max_Alive]

Just started watching and I am surprised, that you used total kg for the first test and not bodyweight percentage. Is there a reason behind that? But as always, I leave a thumbs up and am happy about a new Josh-video. 💪

[@JoshRundle]

Hi 👋 good question. So I thought I would add just the weight added so there was a direct comparison between each climber. And then after each tests I put a slide with the body weight percentage so you could see the difference there. Sorry if it was confusing. Thank you 😃 I really appreciate that!!!

[@climblikeagirl]

@@JoshRundle this is exactly why there is no direct comparison between the climbers in your test. The methodology introduces bias and the results you got are not representative. Also the sample is wrongly sampled - the V5 climber does not represent group of V5 climbers at all.

[@JoshRundle]

@@climblikeagirlI understand your point but there is a direct comparison because I put body weight percentages in at the end of each exercise unless I am misunderstanding you? I agree the V5 climber does not represent all V5 climbers. He was much stronger than I thought. But then again it also shows that strength is not everything. I tried my best. I’m not a scientist nor a coach but tried to represent everyone as best I can. If it wasn’t for a video the best thing to do would be to have loads of people at different grades.

[@M0dElite]

@@JoshRundle The slides could have been shown a bit longer. I had to find the right time stamp and quickly pause the video to have time to see anything. I think other people might have entirely missed them if they were not paying attention.

[@JoshRundle]

@@M0dElitesorry I’ll make sure they are longer next time!

[@mattsmitt00]

Now THIS is a great video, well done Josh! Really helpful stuff in this video.

[@Tzar147]

Quality as always dude, loved it!

[@JoshRundle]

Thank you 😃

[@Jeremysamways1]

Nice vid Josh, great to see Matt & Anna in action. Cool to see how skill plays such an important part.

[@WrokkerGaming]

This is the first time seeing one of your videos, and I gotta say it's made me super motivated to train all aspects of my climbing, from strength to technique! I need to make a better habit of focussing on things off the wall as much as on it. Great video, can't wait for the next one :D

[@JoshRundle]

Aw thank you for watching 😃. That’s awesome 🙌. Thank you 🙏

[@BoffaG1]

Love the vids Josh, you inspired me to start climbing in July and now I'm climbing V4's!

[@JoshRundle]

Thank you 😃. Yay that is SO AWESOME!! Nice work 😃

[@rez4437]

Great video. Always love seeing different types of climbers compare and contrast their skills and abilities. Videos like these also always makes me want to get back into the bouldering gym lol

[@powdah12]

Can we have the weight added numbers as a percent of bodyweight? Anna is obviously the lightest so a 50kg additional is almost her whole bodyweight again, only required for very rare moves; but Josh would probably pull 50kg over bodyweight on most bigger moves.

[@JoshRundle]

The body weight percentages are at the end of each exercise

[@keelferm]

absolutely second that.... the climbers weren't ranked according to this metric and I wonder how Anna would have performed under that lens.

[@powdah12]

@@JoshRundle thanks for including it. And indeed - the performances were more reflective of grade, barring your and Mats comparisons where technique and precise muscle activation seems to matter more particularly at higher grades. Super interesting video. I was only listening to the start section and only heard chat about max added, no bw% :)

[@MyMusicSosa]

Aren’t there normal V5 climbers on yt? If he can hang that he’d have to be terrible to only send V5, if it’s indoor a more representative guy would hang somewhere between 100-120% bw max

[@viniciuscollaco]

I think is more than that, in recent lattice video, they show the average bw on 20mm V5, I think its 140% ish (dont remember exactlly)

[@dirkneuhauser8213]

@25:31 or maybe that he is like 3 times as heavy?

[@pauljakeman]

Awesome video as always josh! Can i just say too mat has some serious biceps in that thumbnail blimey!

[@Matthew-q4d]

Body weight is a big one - that is - ratios are really important. When people ask me what makes a good climber I say "be 140/150 lbs." Many factors of course, I am simply pointing to one that does not seem to get much attention. If you watch dawn wall, there is a bit that talks about the "dark side" of climbing. The dark side being; eating disorders/people starving themselves to climb harder. Eat lean for a few days and see how much easier it is to pull/push your body up the wall. Be safe out there:)

[@thenayancat8802]

v5 climber doing 40kg on a 20mm edge. Bruv what

[@LawrenceRowles]

Tbf he does weigh 91kg according to the scores at 7:45, still - strong for the grade!

[@thenayancat8802]

That's still +50% BW, that's bonkers strong @@LawrenceRowles

[@Asdfghjkl-ls1or]

​@@thenayancat8802and relative strength always favours lighter builds

[@gingobingo1567]

Strongest V5 climber on the planet 🤣🤣

[@JoshRundle]

Haha agreed!!!!

[@marcusboxall7383]

I think some context is in order for the v5 climber. This guy used to easily flash reds (the v5 climb) and sometimes whites and would often project yellows, i was surprised when he said he never climbed a yellow. For context the gym doesnt do grades, the difficulty is set in the colours and goes; purple,red,white,yellow,black. Hes just been super busy doing his degree so hasnt climbed much.

[@Andrew-qb1rc]

I was already doubtful of the Lattice strength test, but this just reaffirms the reasons to doubt it. I’m technically stronger than all of these climbers. Yet, I’m only projecting V7. Though, I will say that when I tweak my technique, my strength doesn’t seem to ever be the issue. I always find I’m able to hold what feel like impossible holds at the beginning when I find the right beta.

[@obscurelines]

Such a focus on upper body. I'm a good lead climber who struggles bouldering because it asks so much more control and flexibility in the hips. It feels almost completely different.

[@hannibal3143]

Great video!

[@gatosospechosop3]

Is that a 20mm edge? I haven't done any weighted hangboarding, but holding 50kg + bodyweight for 4-5 seconds doesn't seem like v5 strength lol

[@junkyardjohnny8836]

Awesome video!! Would be cool to know what the added weights are as a percentage of the climbers body weights, obviously Josh is going to add more kgs than Anna but body percentage wise would be interesting!

[@Battl3Royal3]

Precisely what I was thinking. Surely strength results are skewed by not considering the weight of the individual.

[@Battl3Royal3]

Saying that.. it just came up!

[@mythic1107]

It's funny, when I first watched this video, I was a v3 climber after a little over a month of climbing. Now I'm 2 moves off of my first good v6 and seeing it pop up on my feed again. Training technique did so much more for me than training strength has.

[@gryphon940]

That 11:50 climb looks like so much fun

[@biggussconnus]

Josh. You forgot to add the weight of your moustache. Awesome from everyone and a great video.

[@JoshRundle]

😂😂 must be at least an extra 20kg. Thank you 😁

[@iMaDeMoN2012]

It would have been nice if you had some kinda conclusion and some figures. Perhaps a figure plotting strength to body wieight ratio versus V scale.

[@simonasp1465]

Good video! It would be interesting to see differences in core, leg, shoulder strength as well :o

[@strawhat8070]

You put the most atheletic v5 climber you could find lol, he’s a unit. But I guess that just shows how important technique is

[@AlexAndersAuthor]

Josh, I'm a 6'5" climber and what I've realized is, it's not just hanging strength. It's physics. Every inch pass your center of gravity is away from directly over your feet creates an exponentially increasing downward force. So if a short person bends at a 45° angle, it'll take less raw strength to hold on to the wall then when a very tall person bends at a 45° angle because the center of gravity shifts further and the downforce increases exponentially. So, a shorter person doesn't need to be as strong as a taller person to have the same effectiveness.

[@chris_bc]

Except that a shorter climber generally needs to be relatively stronger to concentrically and eccentrically move musculature through a larger range of motion beyond the optimal tissue length for maximum force production to reach the same holds. I think you also aren't taking into account the force vector generated that will typically travel at an angle through the feet and into the wall - we don't usually think of the force increasing exponentially with an increase in height because that's where technique comes in ie keeping your hips close to the wall. All that to say that locking off a hold down to your waist is exceedingly more difficult than locking off to your chest because you can reach a hold. To be fair at 6'5" you are well outside the norms as well, I can imagine there are a ton of moves that would feel much more difficult.

[@AlexAndersAuthor]

@@chris_bc Haha!😁 Are you saying that shorter climbers have to reach further? I would agree if climbs weren't set by setters between 5'5" and 5'9" for climbers of the same height. Everything is easier when holds aren't set to put your knees at your chin. So many times I watch climbers do climbs that I have to fight on. And then I try to use the foothold that's just 4 inches lowers and it becomes cake. At least at my L.A. gym footholds always feel slightly too close or slightly to far and I have to compensate with considerably more strength to do to the thing that the 5'5" 120lb person cruises through on. Taller climbers have to be stronger and more flexible to do the same as weaker shorter climbers. Just look at how flexible and strong Josh is compared to the people he climbs with. The man's practically part spider. Ha!

[@milksushi6640]

@@AlexAndersAuthor The grades they put are their outdoor grades, setter doesn't really matter there. Obviously there are sometimes advantages for being taller, at any grade. For being shorter, it's usually less obvious, but advantages definitely exist and they become more apparent as you climb harder and become aware of more body positions. Different climbs are far too different and the sport and body movement in general is way too nuanced to put forth some two line proof that taller climbers always have it harder.

[@SP-rk9ht]

@@AlexAndersAuthor it just sounds like your technique is bad, that's all. Josh is strong, but not freakishly strong for a V10 climber. He's within the normal range. And, considering the fact that he's not a pro, I can imagine for what he lacks in technique (due to not having as much time to climb), he compensates in strength.

[@AlexAndersAuthor]

@@milksushi6640 no, there's never one explanation that fits all situations. Last night I did a standing jump for what was intended to be a parkour start. 😂 But, let's be real here. The taller you are the larger hands tend to be. That means that you will always have less surface area for crimps. That means you're going to have the compensate for it in some way. Can't deny that! Also, the longer your legs, the less opportunities you have to press downwards into a foothold because your legs have to be folded to get to the same footholds that other people can just shift their bodies and stand on. There's no denying that. And, yes, of course we can often skip holds. But the harder the grade, the less opportunities we have to do that. And because of our larger hands and longer legs, we can't fold into positions that shorter people can and we have to compensate by either being stronger or a lot more flexible. Those are just facts. 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@leBlonk]

Really liked this one @JoshRundle! Comment for the algorithm 👊🏻

[@JoshRundle]

Thank you 🙏 really happy you liked it 😃

[@SirCharcoal]

Would be cool to watch the same comparison but with some outdoor boulders

[@george1303]

interesting results - shows that there are many factors outside of just strength!

[@sofiaspassova9587]

Can we get a V5 climber that doesn't have an 8a finger strength to make this make a bit more sense? (I volunteer) :D Still a v fun concept and fun to watch

[@_michaelyuhhhh]

The finger strength on Garston is crazy for his level. I've climbed V6 and I can't even hang bodyweight on that edge yet

[@beastofackworth]

Showd the importance of percentage of bodyweight when it comes to testing.

[@babsds0]

Wait there's vids of Matt doing crazy feats of fingerstrength like pull-ups on a 6mm edge if you go back through his Instagram. I feel like without knowing how well rested he was prior to doing the test his results aren't that comparable to yours (i.e he could have been third day on).

[@TheBlackJewelz]

IMO core strength is more important than any others once you hit V10/11 level

[@mahlercarranca1776]

Loved the content!!! I have a question, wouldn’t it be fair to use comparable weight, like for 160lbs guy 16 pounds it’s 10%, so somebody with 140 the test would be done with 14lbs so it’s fair to the participants, instead of using the same weight for everybody ?

[@JoshRundle]

Thank you 🙏! I’m not sure to be honest, I haven’t heard of anyone doing that before. I think the best way to compare is body weight percentages.

[@M0dElite]

@@JoshRundle I think that's how they do it in the 9c strength test popularized by Magnus

[@JoshRundle]

@@M0dElite when I did it I remember it being body weight percentages but it was a while ago.

[@M0dElite]

@@JoshRundle But isn't that exactly what the OP is suggesting you to do? 🤔

[@JoshRundle]

⁠@@M0dElitethat’s what I did here too.

[@Lumi_nance]

what am I doing wrong? I climb 7A-7B (indoors) 6B outdoors and can hang 55-60kg with 60kg body wheight at an 20mm edge 7s.

[@bendtbendt1]

Anna's technique is fire

[@hgmaniac29]

That's a very strong v5 climber! I myself as a v5 climber can't even hang bodyweight!

[@iggimoore]

I think Mat would do much better in core for sure; which helps enormously on routes...

[@Juanperez-nm9kj]

its not about technique is body positioning which in some weird positions u just have to work intuitively with the levarages, and a lot of lock off strength, shoulder, and upper back connective tissue well recruited and trained for climbing (coordinated) which is mainly worked by just climbing and probably some specific conditioning exercises. And I forgot about some calve muscles and hamstrings which helps with putting the most pressure and weight on holds. I think hangs only helps to get used to hanging with bodyweight on small edges, adding more weight i think it wouldnt make sense, cause ur not climbing with lots of weight on wall never. (just my opinion based on my personal experience)

[@Pixelspricoo]

There's pretty good justification for hanging with added weight. If you can work your way up to hanging with a weight greater than your own bodyweight, then when you are hanging without that weight, it will be much easier to hang (and pull) with just your body weight. This applies to most kinds of training. If you're able to do a much harder variation of a movement (or static move) you will be able to do the easier version better. Also, there are times on the wall when you are hanging mostly with one arm on a small ledge, and incorporating two-hand-weighted hangboarding into your training can be a good stepping stone to being able to hang with just one hand at body weight. There's a big jump between doing something with both sides of your body and only one. Some may think that you're about half as strong using only one side, but it is often the case that you are less than half as strong using only one side because there is a lot more stabilization and coordination that has to be managed by that one side. In short, adding weight is a great tool to incrementally improve at various movements.

[@Preserbius]

Why isn't the weight for the strength tests based on bodyweight percentage? That's the standard for a reason, climbing is a bodyweight sport.

[@samj.9390]

The body weight percentages were shown at the end of the tests such as at 7:45

[@samil9122]

Nice video but I wish the strength test weights were done in percent body weight instead! Isn’t that how these tests are typically conducted since it’s a body weight sport?

[@JoshRundle]

Sorry I should have made them more clear. I did put the body weight percentages at the end of each exercise

[@gatosospechosop3]

Not gonna lie, this feels like a psyop lol, some dude of the street that says he climbs v5 yet is stronger than most v10 climbers, then proceeds to climb with almost comically poor technique. I guess it's just an anomaly, but that's really strange.

[@adrenalinjunkie9682]

I think a max hang, especially on some kind of edge, would be the most interesting statistic to have. If you're doing something that is crimpy the whole way up then you're exerting pressure on your fingers for a really long period of time which is to do with hanging rather than pulling. It's also not something you really train for at the gym - it's a climbing specific skill so would probably correlate more with technique than other strength tests do. Furthermore, you can see on the second boulder that Garston and Anna both fumble the second move - the main difference is that Anna holds on for a really long period of time which allows her to save the move.

[@paulmitchell5349]

Matt Wright has very strong fingers. Amazing boulderer. Problem with V grades is that the UK is out of kilter with USA V grades. I've never seen anyone in the UK climb harder than a V12,and that includes Matt. But USA climbers have 5 grades above that. We see Americans spraying about V17 , but for me that grade would have holds pretty much invisibly small, yet we can easily see the holds they use. I guess using the Font system might help. Anyway, so few climbers climb above V8 ,here in the UK, that the debate is irrelevant to most.

[@JoshRundle]

Will Bosi and Aidan Robert’s have both climbed V17 and they are both from the UK. I think the UK has some insanely strong climbers, some of the best in the world.

[@babsds0]

You have to be trolling. Two of the best outdoor boulderers in the world (Aidan Roberts and Will Bosi) who have both climbed v17 are from the UK. Matt has climbed v15 and yet he isn't even one of the top 10 best boulderers in the UK.

[@RobertoHernandez-kf8nn]

Im a v8 climber and I’ve never been able to hang body weight ngl my fingers are the weakest part of my climbing

[@KungFoo1]

Are Mat and Anna siblings? I’d take a DNA test.

[@AnthonyClimbs]

I’m gonna be honest, everytime I see a video on strength benchmarks for v5 climbers im so discouraged hahaha. I’m climbing about 50-75% of the v5s in my gym, which from what I’ve been told usually sandbags quite hard. Despite that I can’t even hang on a 20mm edge period with body weight. Everytime I watch other v5 climbers I’m so surprised they don’t climb harder, for me strength just seems like without a doubt my biggest limiting factor, and I’ve only been climbing at this grade for the last 6 months or so.

[@JoshRundle]

Don’t be discouraged, it’s actually a good thing because it means you are a really good climber with great technique! And technique is harder to get than strength

[@BOCHEN-lg2ys]

strength is easy to build up tho！ technic is harder！

[@dojanglesclimb]

Probably means you're able to distribute more force into your feet which is a great skill to have. Gaining more finger strength may shoot you up a grade or two quickly.

[@fabian5422]

What is the name of pants that Josh is wearing? They look nice

[@carlosdumbratzen6332]

People always talk about technique vs strength, while forgetting one more factor: flexibility.

[@JoshRundle]

That’s a good point

[@asmodeusnine1451]

What is V15 Climber, V11 Climber, V10 Climber and V5 Climber mean? I saw in video even for V11 Climber seem no hope doing V7 challenge. Hmm really confuse

[@JoshRundle]

It means that they have climbed V15, V11, V10 and V5

[@lutherbrown8873]

the V5 climber is abnormally strong for the grade. if he keeps working on his technique, he'll send much higher grades - probably like V10.

[@viniciuscollaco]

Not sure, the gap between V5 and V10 is huge

[@nope110]

Maybe not v10 but yeah the guy is insanely strong, but his technique is really lacking. More time on the wall and the guy will be sending super hard

[@ComputerManDanMiller]

He already has v10 finger strength, but it takes a lot more than raw strength to climb v10. He'll get there pretty quick if he really puts his mind to it.

[@SP-rk9ht]

Saying it's strange being stronger doesn't necessarily make you send harder, is like saying it's weird you can't do a handstand even though you have the strength to do it. Climbing is a skill. You've got to have strength, but it's useless if you have no idea how to apply it (V5 climber's case in point). Climbing isn't just about pulling hard as much as doing a handstand isn't just about pushing hard. I find it endlessly amusing when climbers are confused about this.

[@Nayeli-ee3bb]

It would have been nice if you knew how much extra weight of their body weight that was what they did. As an example, someone who weighs 60kg and does pull ups with 30kg is more difficult than someone who weighs 80kg

[@JoshRundle]

That’s why I put the body weight percentages at the end of each exercise 😃

[@philipashton6657]

I subbed, even though you didn't quite make 70 on the finger board. :)

[@JoshRundle]

Thank you 🙏 I’ll try get 70 next time

[@ethanorbock1063]

I climb v5-6 and i cant even hang for one second on the 20mm edge with no extra weight

[@Muaahaa]

When comparing added weights between climbers the added weight should be relative to the weight of the climber to get a more "fair" comparison.

[@JoshRundle]

I agree that’s why I put body weight percentages at the end of each exercise

[@tallgeese9715]

how did you forget to add edge size

[@JoshRundle]

I know 😅 big L on my end. Sorry!

[@Xzyla]

I feel like if you threw in like a v7 climber as kind of an intermediate it would be more interesting Very solid video over all though

[@climbhangout]

70kg is definitely worth a sub Josh

[@mrorganic13]

@3:15 HOW?!??!?

[@Ian_climbs]

Josh I feel like you could climb really hard. Just gotta project haha

[@RobbieLobster]

campus challenge video next

[@maciejszpakowski9037]

I'm V5 climber and I can barely hold on 20mm with +0kg

[@mdasikkhan1610]

technique and experience

[@KungFoo1]

This suggests hangboarding strength training isn’t as important as everyone makes out.

[@Kevin-tp4gl]

I wonder why you didnt % of bodywieght instead of kg. I mean someone hanging on a 20mm edge with 20kg and having a bodyweight of 80kg is clearly not the same as someone who is like 60kg one is holding 25% and the other one more than 30% Would be more accurate I think to do this way

[@JoshRundle]

I did. The body weight percentages are at the end of each exercise.

[@Kevin-tp4gl]

​@@JoshRundleoh , my Bad then I was not careful enough

[@JoshRundle]

@@Kevin-tp4glno I should have made them more obvious. Next time I will 😃

[@gingobingo1567]

What shoes does Matt have?

[@JoshRundle]

La Sportiva solutions

[@johnclip88]

that pinky front lever wtf

[@Mylada]

V5. How can you be that strong and climb so bad without even hangboarding? I climb V11 with those stats.

[@raebe7117]

Isn't that Nam from Dapsekzak at 27:07 ?

[@ChaoticRain1]

garston isnt a typical v5 climber haha

[@JoshRundle]

He is definitely strong isn’t he! I was very surprised

[@nomad_manhattan]

The finger strength one is not scientific - should not base on absolute weight but proportional to body weight. The same 50kg is different to someone weight 50k and 70kg, and different for male vs. female

[@JoshRundle]

The body weight percentages are at the end of each exercise.

[@nomad_manhattan]

@@JoshRundle saw it now at 10:15 point. Thnx

[@steffen1405]

Glaring omission: climbing is about strength:weight ratio! Whole thing should be % bodyweight, not arbitrary KGs

[@JoshRundle]

There is body weight percentages at the end of each exercise

[@A_CatgirI]

wow that v5 climber is super strong

[@sessionmediaa]

Exceptional video! I saw the thumbnail and thought “this is going to be an absolute banger!” Not disappointed!! 🎉🎉👍💪💪

[@JoshRundle]

Thank you!! So happy you liked it :)

[@jawsrocks7509]

What v15 did mat send ?

[@frederickmead7943]

Serenata

[@jawsrocks7509]

@@frederickmead7943 is there footy anywhere ?