Subwoofer Shootout | Budget vs. Midrange vs. DIY vs. Old School Subs

[@joentell]

My Subwoofer Leaderboard: bit.ly/subwooferleaderboard

[@ZeroCool-vn9bd]

Thanks for the volume warning regarding the test sweep. I have an isolated 12v (big AGM boat battery/battery tender, 2 farad cap, setup in the living room for bench testing automotive subwoofers down to 1.5-2 ohms @ 800w RMS. This is in addition to monitors and rack the setup I've made for editing 5.1 audio. For this test I ran a DVC Alpine Type-R 12 in a factory volume recommended spec sealed cabinet. 8g 2.5m speaker leads and 2g 30cm power delivery. The volume is turned WAY down, @ 20-23hz not only can you see the woofer working, but feel the pressure changing in the room, at 45hz, it's getting loud, at 60hz, I'm shutting things down because it's rumbling things off my shelves. Since I'm studying abroad right now I can't compare it to my trusty PARADIGM REFERENCE PDR-12. Which consider to be a really solid entry into the hifi game, if you are on a budget and don't want to tinker.

[@UPsideDOWNworld321]

1000% right about JL Audio some of the best woofer for YEARSSSSSS

[@tenvillagesahead4192]

I love the fact that you don't waste time with introductions and get right into the data and tests. Like Boom! Here's the meat and potatoes and here's why you clicked on the video. You deserve more subscribers tbh

[@joentell]

Thank you!

[@robertenn6818]

yes. Some sites take a third of the video telling you what they are going to tell you, and then go further, enumerating sections! An introductory couple of sentences and then you are giving us info. Thanks! Also, I learn a lot from your presentations.

[@kohnfutner9637]

Introductions are for people trying to sell you bullshits.

[@joentell]

🤣 I had this conversation with a fellow KZbinr earlier today. I hate it when I watch someone new and the first thing they do is ask me to subscribe. I'm like, "I haven't even seen what your video is like yet!" 😂

[@SVS_Sound]

Thanks for taking a scientific approach to this shootout, glad you enjoyed the SB-2000. Great insights!

[@ZHEER]

Hey can you send me one too, please? I like your products but can't afford the sub. I'll tell my friends about you (but can't guarantee they will buy anything from you cuz they also broke like myself.) Thanks

[@davidshowslsu]

Lol zheer

[@sneezingcatss]

@@ZHEER lol

[@lm6036]

@@ZHEER Damn. Has that ever worked for you? 😂

[@rakitakhan]

My best friend has an SVS SB13 Ultra...amazing sub.

[@adyandrey23andrey]

One of a few clips on youtube that actually places the viewer into the actual video. The fact that you gave us the option to test out our speakers/headphones made watching the video more enjoyable, as I felt like *I* was collecting all this data and making the these tests along with you. Great job man!

[@joentell]

Hey thank you for telling me that. That's what I was hoping for!

[@randyyyyyyy6977]

This is the best coverage of subwoofers I've seen anywhere on the internet. Bravo! I learned so much from this.

[@joentell]

Thanks. Glad it was helpful. I will try to do an update when I get more subs in.

[@cnash-xr6ce]

Confirmed my desire for a SVS subwoofer. Thanks.

[@MrKbarstad]

Do ittttt. And do 2. I got a pair of the pb 12 nsd's in december. Only regret i have is not having more money to buy their better products.

[@buttonman1831]

Frequency doesn't tell the whole story of how a sub will sound, be warned

[@MrLmp2109]

Go try a rel acoustic but not their ht range

[@ghostrecon3214]

Got an SVS Sb12nsd and it exceeded my expectations.

[@TheoneDragon51]

Check out Power Sound Audio Tom V. Left SVS and started Power Sound Audio ..Built in the USA Svs is now made in China and can't touch them.

[@jasonwhitehurst7576]

For an 8" sub, Joe, that's banging! Nicely done.

[@mr.vokits8757]

Rocking the Sauconys! I finally see someone else wearing them. Thanks for taking this seriously. Most people become a caricature on KZbin.

[@kevinweber5129]

You are the BEST reviewer because you are not scared to rank the speakers on the board.

[@joentell]

Thank you. Yeah why not right? It's just my opinion. Someone else might rank them differently.

[@madcrabber1113]

Great video! I have SVS, JBL, RSL and several Def Tech older (2009 ish) subs and powered speakers with subs although both Def Tech subs never really sounded very good for the short period of time that they actually worked. All at their price points when purchased (not the Def Techs) and for their intended uses are great. Watching channels like yours really helps when doing the research.

[@briangriffith261]

This is one of the best sub comparison videos, from the frequency side while not getting too technical. Learned a lot from it as a relative noob. Love that white gloss finish on the sub you made. I bet it sounds as delicious as it looks.

[@mrjivester]

This blow my mind. Thanks for explaining the different frequencies.

[@kentlewis6604]

Great job of showing differences between a handful of different subs and explaining how they would fit in with a sound system.

[@RathOX]

I own the SVS PC2000 & love it, looking to buy a 2nd

[@texasbuzzard4970]

Amazing video!! Need to get more shootouts like this. I would LOVE to see the bic america f12, Polk psw505, and klipsch r120sw shootout. They are all $200 and nobody agrees on which is best. F12 has been popular forever and you still can’t find graphs or reviews as detailed as yours

[@justinbeamon6624]

I actually had the PSW505 and F12 and the Dayton Sub1500. The Polk is the loudest but is ruined by the insane port noise, it's excruciating. The f12 is also loud but much cleaner sounding and no port noise, but not as accurate as the Polk. I settled on the Sub1500. Not quite as loud as the Polk but goes sooo much lower and is accurate enough.

[@myfagan]

I own an F12.. forget it. Buy the Acoustech sub. It's a premium line of BiC and better than all of the prior mentioned subs. F12 sounds like shit when side by side

[@aussie8114]

We have a REL R328. Seriously a wonderful sub. Recognised also as one of the very best for music audiophiles. Can be connected to the AV amps low end output and also a second music amps high end speaker cable. Has seperate gain controls for low and high end inputs. I give it 10/10

[@samlee2562]

Thanks man, I live in Finland and most of the brands talked about in reviews aren't sold here so this was useful to get a feel of the landscape

[@matilija]

Those peaks you show are due to the fact that you had a port facing a hardwood floor, you were getting resonance peaks, put them on a rug and run the test again.

[@joentell]

Possibly! I didn't even consider that. Thanks! I'll pin your comment to let others know. Unfortunately I can't change the video.

[@matilija]

@@joentell I just re-read what I posted, sorry, that sounds aweful bossy, I meant to say you should try them on a rug, not "DO IT" lol, but no worries.

[@joentell]

It didn't come off as bossy to me. I thought you were making a suggestion. Some people say, you're doing X & Y wrong and don't even offer a recommendation to do it better.

[@ghostrecon3214]

You think the sub is vibrating the floor causing the floor to create its own sound? Could be, mine makes my windows sing.

[@duanerandleman2456]

Peaks have to do with the room dimensions. Wave lengths on bass are so long that any cloth material including carpet has no impact. You need mass like concrete to hold bass in.

[@Sonofholhorse]

I can not tell you how many times I have used to the bass frequency sweep with a microphone to do room adjustments, thanks as always Joe!

[@barfy362]

I like how you were trying not to blast the other subs before the SVS too bad: "85 decibels at 32.8Hz which is about the same as some of these... well not that one... no... never mind." I was also impressed by the Nice Cube. I'm not really looking for extension below about 27.5Hz anyway and that looks like it would be great for me.

[@jwiz1911]

Cool video, I like seeing measurements across a range of prices, including DIY. I went the DIY route on my main speakers and am contemplating it for a subwoofer. Great work!

[@arthurwatts1680]

Joe, I'm quietly confident that my 6-month old A-T headphones can 'hear' lower frequencies than my ~60 year old ears ;) Thanks for the video.

[@orangejuicepony6881]

I put 2x SB2000s in my home theatre.... OMG! I love them, so clear and tight. Cross over at 120Hz with my Pioneer floor standers.

[@Vincent79Vega]

Thanks a lot for the test. I have two SB2000 in the corner with an Antimode and I love them. After I see your results I like them even more :)

[@bobsmith8368]

Dude, you did a great job building that sub, I am really impressed with both the build quality and component selection. Of course the performance tells the tale.......fantastic job!

[@joentell]

Thanks Bob! 🙏

[@hansmayer7814]

Great comparison video Joe! All your videos are excellent reference and very well produced. I would have liked to see this before I bought my latest sub, the Dayton Audio SUB 1000, to go with my B652AIRs. I used to own a Klipsch KSW-12 and that I do miss.

[@charlesludwig9173]

This is the best video on this topic I've seen, in all manner that best can be described. My 15 inch passive sub (JBL B380) powered by a Sony TA-N80ES in bridged mode operating at 560 watts gets down to 24Hz -6db. I bought it back in 1988 for music and movies . Crossover is set at 6oHz for mains and 80 Hz for surrounds and center.. At any rate, the sub is awesome for dance music pleasure. I can't imagine listening to dance music without sub integration.

[@joentell]

Thank you!

[@rolandrohde]

Both Elac (I have two S12EQ running here) and the SVS (used to have the SB12) are great subs. Your results pretty much show that as well...😉

[@hj8607]

Took your advice and turned down my 48" tall ( Upward radiating into sloped ceiling ) cylindrical reflexed (out bottom spreading under sound cabinet into room) 12" sub woof . Good thing because at 26 HZ the sound started and by 33 I might have torn the diaphragm , otherwise . Great to know it works so deep . ' In The Air' made me think it might .😎 I drive this speaker only up to 75 Hz using an electronic variable crossover , Your test also verified for me that this was the best point for the rest of the amplification . Thanx .

[@joentell]

That's awesome. You're welcome.

[@0bzen22]

Was the Elac room-corrected? Because it will mean that the near-field response won't be flat. It'll be colored to fit the room.

[@joentell]

Auto-eq was turned off

[@PURESOUND4]

Thanks for the detailed tests! Something to consider for future testing.... 1. Don't have the other subs anywhere near the one being measured. The cones of nearby subs will move at some frequencies and change your measurements slightly. 2. Most people I know place their subs near a wall to get the benefits of boundary loading. I noticed that each sub was a few feet off the wall when being measured. This could introduce boundary cancellation at certain frequencies, screwing with the measurements. Still a very detailed comparison. Thanks!

[@joentell]

Thank you and you're right. I try to measure close enough to the source that any room interactions, or as you've stated, speaker cone resonances from nearby speakers, will have minimal effect on the measurements. It's not perfect because of the fact that I'm indoors and/or not in an anechoic chamber, but it isn't meant to be an absolute measurement, just a relative one.

[@djsoulfilter]

I absolutely love my ELAC Debut2 3010 sub. I bought it during Black Friday for half off plus had a $70 Amazon gift card. It hits lower than my previous 12" powered sub. It's very articulate and musical sounding. Perfect for music and movies. Very easy to blend in with my front towers.

[@joentell]

For the amount you paid...you can't go wrong. You have to admit, that SVS is crazy though. ;-)

[@djsoulfilter]

@@joentell that SVS sub is awesome! My next sub will either be a SVS or HSU. Thanks for this sub comparison video. :)

[@joentell]

I want to get some stiffer competition in for review. We'll see what happens.

[@jlongjr27]

I got the ELAC 3010 for $220ish from Best Buy in Dec. I really like the control the app gives you. I think you can manually tune it pretty flat, I just don't have the software to measure it. I'm pretty happy with it myself. Kind of disappointed more time wasn't spent with the app in this video, or with this sub in general.

[@joentell]

Well it wasn't a full review of that sub. I had a lot of subs. I think I covered most of what it does though.

[@Kyocus]

Joe..... Thank you for the very detailed information! Because of you I finally pulled the trigger the SB 2000 and finished my 5.2 setup.

[@joentell]

Whoo! Let me know what you think of it.

[@RAMtrails]

hopefully you could get in the Emotiva BasX and the Monoprice Monolith subs for review!

[@midniteoyl8913]

Edit: Now that its daytime and I can hit reference levels, the SVS SB12-NSD's start up at around 12hz and the 25 year old Klipsch KG5.2's @ 21-22Hz. I would say that's not too shabby. 👍 Just found you by accident tonight, Joe, but I'm liking the content and the short, no nonsense way you are presenting it. Subscribed. Keep up the good work.

[@lanjin]

Exactly what I was looking for! Thanks Joe

[@joentell]

👊😎

[@ganesh7hillsstereo373]

Excellent article

[@somebodynobody300]

waoh the bass test was amazing!!

[@Mrcloc]

Definitely my favourite YT channel. You're basically living the dream. What's your choice? Capable speakers or speakers + sub? Important with a sub is distortion. Cheap woofers you'll hear sub-bass because you hear the second harmonic.

[@joentell]

Thank you. Depends on the speakers and sub. Either one could beat out the other depending on how they respond in room.

[@Mrcloc]

@@joentell I take 2.0 for music. Even if they can't reach as far down, I just prefer how the bass is integrated. But with limited space dictating you must go with small bookshelf's, a well placed woofer can do amazing things. A friend of mine got excellent results with an 8" Energy woofer, I think it was an ESW-C8.

[@superjervis]

Great video as usual...I appreciate the effort..I'm sure it took a long time to do

[@sonicog7179]

Never been that into audio but ran into your video and now you have sparked the interest in me. Great videos

[@joentell]

That's great! That's one of the biggest compliments you could give me.

[@madmax2069]

sad that the dayton audio sub-1200 and sub-1000 wasn't in the video, they look about the same as the Micca subs but are cheaper than the Micca. would have been awesome to see their performance against the Micca subs.

[@beezaa]

Micca looks like it's using the same enclosure. I'm curious to see them compared against each other.

[@madmax2069]

@@beezaa the enclosure is similar, but not the same. There's been multiple brands before Dayton audio that has used a similar designed enclosure.

[@Callentay]

I have the Dayton sub-800 and it's a beast for the price that I paid for it. It easily fills a small room.

[@chasevineland1508]

Back in the day, I used a car bandpass sub box with dual 12” Pioneers. I used a Yamaha plate amplifier (removed from a busted up Yamaha theatre sub). I cobbled it together for $190 and I swear it was amazing. My two Sunfire subs are 10X (each) more money but not 10X better. Great video again.

[@Trdat]

Although the wealth of information was nothing new to me I was still captivated by your video, but if you really wanted to give us something extra for the real bassaholics or audiophiles for the lack of a better word you should of found out the QTC value of each. This way we would of seen a correlation of each sub woofer with it's roll off and frequency response in conjuction with price and other features. Ultimately understanding the transients of each sub, what really matters in a sub woofer.

[@SwaggyKillzz]

@@carlosoliveira-rc2xt correcting one another and coming up with such a sentence yourself, hilarious +1 Yoda

[@Darkcruzer23]

Thank you for doing this. I love that you had the diy dayton. Considering the price it's probably better to just grab a premade sub but for me I have a dayton 15" sitting around not being used and I'm glad to see it would be comparable or better than premades

[@Roof_Pizza]

Below 20 hrtz is wonderful when you can feel it in your chest. I'm not one to interested in wall rattling but high pressure is intoxicating.

[@GunnyPhillips]

Great video! Playing those tones is the perfect way to quickly make your point regarding speaker range.

[@TinchoX]

18Hz on my Sennheiser HD 598 I am impressed! 4:28 Oh so then it's around 20-22Hz

[@thomasschafer7268]

Hahaha. Open the bottles 🙃🙃🙃

[@gavinbarrett2093]

I love watching these videos, wasn't really into audio before but I'm way into it...

[@joentell]

That makes me happy!

[@danielalcorn9761]

What about the BIC America 12"

[@dattepo7534]

Daniel Alcorn that’s what I want to know

[@justinbeamon6624]

I have one, great sub! But I have to say I kinda like the Dayton Sub1500 better. It goes lower and is more accurate than BIC F12. Maybe not quite as much volume but it's not far behind.

[@raiderify]

@@justinbeamon6624 Since it's more accurate, would that make the Dayton great for music? I prefer orchestrated music but listen to just about every genre of music except for pop and reggaeton.

[@mikehanks1399]

Just now seeing this video. Very informative and eye opening. I was listening on my computer speaker set up but then decided to listen through my main system. It will definitely "get down." My system is in my den which is basically a home library, books on every wall but one. On that wall I have some vintage advertising signs. When I hung them I was concerned that I might get a sympathetic vibration buzz but I didn't hear any during a music test. But I did on your sound wave test. Fortunately, none of the music I listen to has bass that low so it's not an issue. Still, I probably should have used some mounting putty. I love the OBJECTIVENESS of your videos. Great job, as always. (Not surprised at how the SVS tested. Those folks have their act together.)

[@joentell]

Thanks Mike. Good to have you commenting here! Blutack everything! 😂

[@mikehanks1399]

Have you ever NOT done something when you know darn well you SHOULD. Of course, we all have. But us OWD really know better.

[@Vlican]

the SVS is a freaking beast! would be great if you can review some of the other brands you mentioned (HSU, Rythmik, etc...)

[@davidr9606]

A very informative review. However, there are other subs that would bury the SVS (even higher-end SVS models) such as the Seaton SubMersive HP+ (made in the US) and Funk Audio 24.0 (made in Canada). These subs are in an entirely different league than SVS, HSU,... and of course, the price difference reflects this.

[@Vlican]

@@davidr9606 at those prices, i'd sure hope they crush the SVS... the law of diminishing returns hurt those badly, especially those funk audio products...

[@joentell]

Oh yeah for sure. This is an awesome little sub.

[@Africker]

I am using an 18" Reference Dayton HO Sub in a sealed enclosure with 1000w. Extends to 15 hz in my room at reference. Thanks for the video, very informative and interesting to see the comparisons.

[@BryceandKyle]

Should have some HSU Research on here.

[@joentell]

I mentioned them in the end. Hopefully they're open to sending me something to review in the future

[@BryceandKyle]

@@joentell I saw that. Once they go on sale again I'll be picking up a VTF-2 MK5.

[@myfagan]

@@joentell acoustech is literally just as good and less expensive. It's a HSU rip off and it's legit

[@SquashPile]

I recently got the Monoprice THX 12. Thing is a beast.

[@DXCal09]

I have the 15 in, its a really good subwoofer digs down to 18hz, and very clean. The only problem is that the enclosure is huge.

[@scoopdogg2920]

Daaaaaaum my laptop started at 230hz! what a pice of hifi gory.

[@joentell]

😂😊

[@that-midas6781]

Even my smartphone can play lower hz😂 86 and up (huawei p20 pro)

[@brucegarethgeorge]

@@that-midas6781 I heard down to 10 hz on my headphones seems impossible. It must be down to compression

[@SolarAbyss]

@@brucegarethgeorge 14 with my earbuds. I don't know if I should believe that either, seems crazy

[@Toid]

Another great video. I can't wait to have those speakers out to you.

[@joentell]

I'm excited too! Thanks btw!

[@ToneCabinet]

Very nice review! You earned a new sub.

[@npn2463]

woofer

[@MrTwisted003]

I have an old (~18yrs old) Yamaha 5.1 Home Theater system. It was the one that has the five 24" high 7.5" wide enclosures mounted on on a 3' stand (center is laid on it's side like a sound-bar under the TV). Each enclosure is fitted with a 1" tweeter on center between four 3.5" mids, with a powered 8" sub. It's a down facing, side ported enclosure, for the sub. The system has worked well over the years and gets loud for what it is, and currently I have my PC hooked up for sound. I don't know all these details you've spit out, a technical subject I'm still learning, and I always thought the sub lacked a little. I have it's volume control turned up to about 3/4, because when it's turned all the way up it gets over powering, and too low and it doesn't keep up with the volume of the other speakers. It seemed to always punch hard at around the 50- 60Hz and never hit hard on the lower frequencies. But I was surprised with the test sweep you did. On the up-sweep I could hear the sub start in at around 22Hz (could barely hear it), and the thunder rolled from a peak of about 35Hz and rolled off from there... But on the down-sweep it punched in at around 65Hz with a small fade, up to another peak at 35Hz before it fell off. So now I think I just need to tune down the EQ at that 50-65Hz, where it always seems to be louder than the rest of the frequencies when listening to music. And then it can be turned up more. Great videos btw.

[@utakatikmobil]

Joe could you do those 2.1 PC speakers like logitech and klipsch?

[@nurbsenvi]

usbdevice waste of time

[@joentell]

Not in the near future, but I will keep my options open

[@arunkalsi8002]

Also pls review edifier s350db 2.1 system if possible

[@blech71]

Paul Carmody!!!! The MAN THE LEGEND in our coveted DIY!! I still love my SPEEDSTERS. 4” TB and that Fountex Ribbon! Whew it’s amazing and now he has a small sub to go with it?? Awesome I’ll build that! Awesome vid man!

[@lakorai2]

DIY all the way. Car audio subs are way more beastly for the price. Put a sundown, Image Dynamics IDMax or Dayton Ultimax in your own enclosure an an external Crown subwoofer amp...

[@joentell]

Agree. With some of the car audio subwoofers, you just have to make sure they aren't sluggish sounding. I used to have 3 x 10 JL Audio W6's when I was in high school. Loved them. Then later I got the Orion HCCA and it had more SPL per sub, but not as "musical". It was loud, but didn't blend very well with my speakers.

[@redvivid]

@@joentell lol hcca are competition subs.

[@joentell]

My mistake. That thing sure sounded like it to. ONE NOTE BASS! 😂😂😂 We didn't have the access to info we have now.

[@joentell]

Were those Kicker Competition subs for competition? 😂 My friend had one (before they started doing weird square Solo-barics) in a bandpass box and it sounded pretty good for a single 10". I think his was a C10. I brought over my JL Audio 10W6 and he 😢. Then I ended up getting 2 more and running it on an old school Soundstream "cheater amp" that claimed like 25 watts but putting out over 500w.

[@lm6036]

Do note that many "car audio branded" subs are often build for high SPL output and not flat linear response.

[@michaelknight5607]

@Joe N Tell Your video on sub was the best I've seen so fare. Keep doing your great job.

[@harchihiarchi]

i really enjoyed this. I was listening on the laptop and didnt hear any tone until 240hz..., then i stopped it and got my older Sony MDR-XB700's and picked up rumbles from 16hz, however true tone @ 21hk ! I just love those so much. I look like an idiot...., but such an underrated haedphone. Watch them get picked up all over the world ..,now. The other 3 earover phoned were up in the 38-42hz range.. Ta.

[@mercadiesbrooo6383]

Trius Betrons are good budget headphones

[@ziggy8757]

oh boy great video...do another one like this one, including the bic f12 and the dayton sub 1200....those are very similar in price point and many people seem to love them

[@joentell]

I'll make a note of your request.

[@justinbeamon6624]

I have the Sub1500 and F12, I chose the sub1500. Yes it's bigger, but it's the same price, $200. Goes lower and seems more accurate. Would love to see a comparison of those.

[@PBmaker97]

30hz I hear it but I hear air too

[@ry4n335]

great video bro... thanks for the time taken. comparison starts at 5:00

[@mazda2284]

dang i should have wore my headphones ... my GF wasnt very happy with me shaking the walls @12hz lol! my sub picks up all of it ! i have a custom built Digital designs 1500 series 10'' motor that i turned into a 15'' , the cone and dustcap is aluminum , custom dual 8.5'' spider landings ''2 spiders per landing'' , Custom PE voice coil round wire copper 4layer , its in a ported 3.5cu ft net box tuned to 28hz ''placement in my house actually drops the tuning abit lower than 28hz'' its powered by a Sony 700RMS amplifier

[@joentell]

I know people DIY their own enclosures and crossovers, but did you Frankenstein your own drivers?

[@mazda2284]

@@joentell yes sir , if you havent you should check out my insane 6'' peak to peak driver i built , sounds like crap but it will smash 15hz like nobody knew ! it was built more as a fun project and not very usable , i do love building usable drivers , take something basic and redo it from the motor up to make a totally different driver

[@joentell]

Subscribed! When I saw your channel name, I didn't expect you to have a channel with 14k subscribers! 😊

[@joentell]

I have a question you might be able to answer. What's a good car subwoofer for SQ? I used to run 3 x 10" JL Audio W6's and I liked the way they sounded. Any other companies now that good sound for a lot less?

[@mazda2284]

@@joentell NVX VS series , Dayton ''which you know about '' , Hutchinson car audio ''they are expensive but hand made and worth the cost'', digital designs , DC audio , really hard to list them all but it really depends what you are going for and budget . and as you know the box makes a world of difference .

[@stevenock2722]

Strong videos lately! I think you are getting better and better. Really appreciate the work you put in! Question - sorry if I missed it here - did you test these all in the same place in the room?

[@barfy362]

there is footage of all the tests in the video... Joe wouldn't make such a rookie mistake anyway

[@stevenock2722]

@@barfy362 yeah after a rewatch it looks like he kept the mic in the same spot (i thought at first he moved the mic down down the line) and dragged subs to the testing spot. good stuff.

[@dovydasvilcinskas3834]

My headphones start at 30hz but normal bass at 40 :/

[@michaelhony1645]

Dude! My antique (1991/1992-ish) MTX 10” powered subwoofer went down to 21 Htz! I’m stoked!

[@Crushonius]

this is not a complaint or anything but if you really want to go deep you need 15 or even 18 inches thats not to say smaller subs cant go deep its just that the bigger subs are just naturally better at it even a budget car audio sub like the mtx rt15 can hit 27 hz -3db without any dsp whatsoever in a nice custom built ported enclosure . now dont get me wrong the svs subs are amazing but they also cost a pretty penny

[@Crushonius]

what i forgot to add the frequency response is almost flat down to 30 hz where it slowly starts to roll off now considering that 27 hz -3db is amazing for a chassis that cost around 120 bucks and if you can afford to build the box a bit bigger you can go down to around 24-25 hz -3db of course the enclosure is not small by any means we are talking 3 cubic feet for the 27 hz and 4 cubic feet for the 25 hz version

[@lowerthetone]

Big subwoofers take up soooooo much room though... It's not even necessary! Devialet's Phantom speaker plays down to 18Hz as does B&W's PV range of subs. These both use 6.5 inch woofers in an opposing SEALED cabinet. The only thing that makes an 18inch woofer better than them is that it doesn't need a lot of amplification before it moves enough to play a

[@joentell]

The B&W's have a 6.5" woofer? And it goes down to 18hz?

[@vincentrobinette1507]

You're exactly right. For every octave you drop, you need twice the displacement of air, to maintain SPL. A small sub can produce the same frequencies, just not as loud. For a near field multimedia set up, a 6" sub can do very well, because it just doesn't need to be so loud, when it's within arms reach.

[@notjustanydad]

Dude you just made me fall in love with my momentum 2 headphones all over, I heard the entire range especially after 15. Not even at full blast. Best between 20-35. Going to test my subs when I get home.

[@notjustanydad]

Maybe I felt the lowest frequencies...

[@RowynOfficial]

I can hear My Logitech G233 at 17hz but mostly hear it at 20hz and up

[@damonm3]

Love my dual sb2000s with 4 paradigm studio 100s and a center as well. For a total of 14 7in subs. The SVS’ extend under 100hz perfectly. Such a great system🔥🔥

[@troybateson]

Running 14 12” subs in my tiny bedroom. I think I’ve got the low notes covered lmao.

[@JasonWh]

Joe, have you considered adding a servo sub to your comparisons? Rhythmik makes incredible servo subs that perform on par or better than SVS at roughly the same price or a bit less. They have a 10" sealed servo sub that's an incredible performer. It's the one I currently own in my office with my Kanto Tuk (based on your recommendation). If you've not heard of servo subs and why they are often times preferred, check out the logic for them on the web. I think Rythmik site explains some of the science.

[@dopamining7621]

Have you ever seen Phil Jones Bass amps for bass guitar? They make arguable the best bass amps in the world, and instead of massive 12" or 15" woofers, they use ever increasing arrays of 5" drivers.

[@joentell]

Interesting!

[@ghostrecon3214]

Very interesting... Google here I come. I can imagine if they were loaded with somr Scanspeak Revelators, whoa boy.

[@asthecrowflies1201]

The general range of bass guitars is much different than the general range of a dedicated subwoofers. Bass guitar is a mid-range instrument. 40Hz @ 120dB is much much easier to achieve than 20Hz @120dB, and the drivers reflect this. This is why you still see giant subwoofers bins at every major concert where price is no object, even when they are also flying MASSIVE line arrays just like you're referring to in the ceilings. There are actually a few bass cab companies that design their bass cabs to be truly full range, though it's a rarer niche. Check out greenboy's fEARfull enclosures, they are absolute monsters. They don't get the respect they deserve as a small company.

[@ghostrecon3214]

@@asthecrowflies1201 never heard of him but I am interested and off to search it ty.

[@vincentrobinette1507]

This video verified some of my suspicions. Any sub with a port, is basically a "one note wonder". The sub with the floor loaded passive radiator is basically like a ported box, but without the worries of port whispering, or exceeding mach. It won't make a chuffing noise when sweeping, but still follows the characteristics of a ported box. I've always favored sealed boxes, even though there is often a little more cone excursion. For linearity, there's no replacement, for displacement. Big driver, with high X-max in a sealed box, with lots of acoustic stuffing. That's my speaker. Amplifier power is easy to come by these days, especially with class D technology. When I decide on an enclosure volume, I choose it so the whistle frequency of the box, nearly matches the free air resonance of the driver, so the resonant frequency is acoustically dampened, so I don't have to rely on the voice coil quite so much. (I'll bet that the SVS is built that way). That results in a flatter sound. I'm not much about 'BOOM', you shouldn't be able to tell that the sub is even working. It should be present, NOT prominent. I just want to extend down another octave(or 2!). As such, I need a good size driver, but not all that much power. a couple of hundred watts is more than enough.

[@joentell]

I'm sure there are ported subs that have a flatter response. The ones I tried are budget subs so they might not be tuned to be flat

[@vincentrobinette1507]

@@joentell Ported boxes do a good job of limiting cone excursion, which allows more power, to produce more sound, from a smaller driver. They're great for home theater systems, playing movies with explosions. For that, a "one note wonder" works fine, for non discerning ears. I'm a little more of a "Hi-Fi addict". I don't want every base drum to sound the same, or every impact sound effect to sound the same. If you take a ported sub, and seal off the port, you will see the cone excursion increase. The sound will be deeper, but, not nearly as loud. Once you get below the port frequency of the box, there is no longer any load on the driver, other than suspension stiffness. They need to use a high pass filter in the amplifier, to protect the driver from over excursion, thus, the sharp roll off in response at the bottom end. That, and the fact that the pressure waves coming out of the port are out of phase, with the driver, causing back cancellation. A sealed box cannot cancel, which is why they call it an "infinite baffle". At a certain frequency, the wave from the port is in phase with the driver, causing a huge increase in output. The acoustic loading on the driver is the highest at that point, reducing excursion. The tuned port frequency. They're more efficient, but in a much narrower band width. Second order box. sealed is considered a first order box. There is less need for electronic high pass filteration in a sealed box. In the ported design, that high pass filter adds another order of roll off, creating an effective third order roll off. The graphs clearly illustrated that. That's why your N'Ice cube, and the SVS sound so darn good. Maybe your N'Ice cube isn't as loud, but for the money you've got in it, (not counting your time)is by far, the best bang for the buck.

[@bonzainews]

about 3 db down at 90 hz with the infinity minuettes connected to my computer... not impressive

[@jm.4071]

I'm a bass head in car audio...I would like to know what you think of the new bose sub the one with the glass on top... did you can make a video comparing that one with others to see which one can simulate that one ?

[@joentell]

Which one are you referring to?

[@jm.4071]

Bose bass module 700

[@jm.4071]

The only bad thing is that you need the sound bar too

[@robertpaws]

Mine can go to 10hertz

[@TheGetmoneyman]

Me too i heard it from the start

[@billreacts-n4x]

Same

[@billreacts-n4x]

Except I'm using headphones

[@JasonWh]

That glow in the dark "mistake" is awesome bro!

[@tannermeyers]

Another excellent video! Just found your channel today and I’m definitely subscribing. You’re one of the few honest and fair youtubers out there👏👏

[@joentell]

I sure as hell try! 😊

[@jacobbecker5122]

Awesome review, very helpful. Would love to see F12

[@one2moja1]

Something for us paupers...

[@gamebent]

In my setup my Yamaha NS-1000's give healthy bass down to 25hz no eq. The PB SVS 16 ultra tracks down to 11hz couch vibrating standard setting. The PB is crossed at 30 hz. Center position to the 1000's. The 1000's are 3 ft from the back wall. 3ft from the side walls. Room is 12 x14. 9 ft ceilings. Very impressed with your DIY whites. Nice flat curve.

[@jeffperkins6514]

No doubt the SVS Subwoofers are great. It just seems like a couple of diy kits from Parts-Express that are pre cut and easily assembled could take sub bass to another level. That Dayton Ultimax looks like it could do some great low bass in those kits.

[@haris525]

Man nice work Joe! Thanks for all your work

[@joentell]

You're welcome. I had to sacrifice a bit of quality to try to include more subs in this shootout. I tried to make it up in quality of the content.

[@lynnpoole7830]

Good job. The grafts were super informative. Good job on your DIY sub too.

[@itsJoshW]

Can't believe this video is this old, however you provided me with exactly what I needed to know. I've been building some speakers for my surround sound due to wanting to do something unique with the living room, and I was onto the Subwoofer next. And this is where my issue comes in... Every subwoofer on parts express, every single review, Q&A, reviewer and youtube video is claiming you "need" a massive, like 2CU FT + box, in order to run a subwoofer below 40hz. And I simply questioned that, as every "off the shelf" one claims it can go far below 40hz for the same cost as the DIY ($300 or so). Which leads to where you helped me here. Your Nice Cube build just helped me decide which one to go after, rather should I say two. What was the overall dimensions of that box? From a rough estimation, I'd presume it's somewhere around a 13" cube? I'm looking at about a 14" cube if feasible with the 8" sub. It looks like your build guide is exactly what I need to bite that bullet, rather than buying a Polk subwoofer and repurposing it all and building my own enclosure from that. (I'm going after aesthetic as well as sound, living room after all lol).

[@rich00273119]

Great comparison video! Thanks for all you do, peace!

[@Pivotal_Moment]

Thank you for this straightforward video--how is it I'm only discovering your channel THIS WEEK!!

[@joentell]

No, let it be known! 😂 More is better for me.

[@errormachine5056]

It's nice reading alot of comments about the SVS. I've been nervous, I just ordered an SVS pb2000 pro and it's pretty pricey for my budget. I'm nervous because I'm replacing a Cerwin Vega 15 inch sub with an SVS 12 inch. I still want the room to shake but hoping to increase the sound quality. My Cerwin subs amp died and I can't find parts. I keep telling myself to get excited about better sound quality and not to worry, my living room will still shake when I want it too... I've just never seen someone compare an SVS to a Cerwin; but I've read the odd forum where people say, "definitely go with the SVS over Cerwin" and I've never heard a bad word about SVS. Fingers crossed.

[@jamespavier1624]

my Tannoy 10in 300w sub has just died have a SVS SB2000 on the way your review makes me smile.😁👍

[@Enemji]

Plate Amplifier? I learnt something new today :) Thanks for the video. Very cool and appreciate your efforts to provide easy to understand tech knowledge.

[@basspig]

Could hear it down to 13 hurts felt it down at 10 Hertz.

[@taxi615]

very interesting and this convinced me to change my dual Martin Logan 700 subs for dual SVS 2000's. They will richen my sound loads more for sure.

[@joentell]

Let me know the outcome.

[@taxi615]

@@joentell for sure I would like to know what would you buy for bipole speakers im shopping for this now and many have told me the fluance signature is good but I still want to have other options have you tried any of these type of speakers

[@davepastern]

one word: REL best subs in the business.

[@1999Valkyrie]

GREAT video, Joe!! Very helpful, honest content.

[@joentell]

Thank you. Glad it helped

[@thecliqueshallsetyoufree8745]

Well done bro....I learned some stuff today and your sub was quite impressive.

[@richardriley4415]

This was really good. It seems that picking a sub is more tricky than picking main speakers. I got some advice from an audiophile friend which helped a lot. getting the speakers in phase can be tricky.

[@nflisrigged1395]

Phase is just delay Set one to 0 and there other 180 You can find tune them with the dub has the option Svs subs are best.