Why Madoka Magica Still Matters; In Defense of Sayaka Miki

[@visliip.6306]

I saw this one dude attempt to tell his audience that Sayaka was dumb for falling for kyubeys lies. That it was her fault. That she should’ve expected her outcome. I never left a video so quickly. It doesn’t take a genius to note that the girls were GROOMED by that stupid cat 😭

[@TuxedoKamina]

While it's definitely 99% the Incubator's fault for being a manipulative dick I'll defend the One Dude. By the time Sayaka contracts it's not longer episode 1 with sparkles and flowers. Sayaka got a front row seat to Mami getting ripped to shreds and repeatedly had that darned Transfer Student give her and Madoka (but really just Madoka) speeches about why not to become one. Despite that she almost always contracts and is the first to become a witch. Even in timelines when Homura spills out everything Sayaka seems to always mistrust her and instead believe in the alien lifeform that loves to be vague. That being said while Sayaka is Such An Idiot, ultimately it's still Kyubey's fault.

[@beomkaslana]

Do we seriously expect teenagers to be able to fully comprehend strong and negative emotions in healthy and smart way? I guarantee 90% of them don't. No matter how smart and intelligent they are, their mentality and intelligence aren't fully developed yet and still have long time to grow and learn. And Incubator is really complicated. I'm disgusted with them but for them, even being disgusted is weird and "illogical". But instead trying to understand emotions, they milked the emotions for the sake of the world balance. But despite not understanding emotions they're able to emotionally manipulate and lying to the girls too...? Incubators are already suspicious to begin with imo...

[@beomkaslana]

TLDR; Sayaka is a fucking 14 years old with her parents whereabouts are unknown, goddamnit. Also i doubt Sayaka has a stable family functioning like Madoka had, because... where are Sayaka's parents this whole time? They're never mentioned or seen once, is she an orphan like Homura or her parents are just working overboard? At least Mami and Kyoko's parential figures are seen once and both are dead, it fucked them. Parential absence could contribute to someone badly, especially when they're teenager and having no other parental figure. Plus, Homura's is so DAMN aloof to Sayaka's liking, so i can i understand why she always doubted Homura. But at least she learned a lot in Rebellion. I could be wrong about Sayaka's parent but yeah, i'll forever defending her because no matter how annoying she is, she still deserves better. This is why i love Madomagi to death, the characters are so flawed and can be come across as annoying. But hey, not everyone has to be nice in order to be likeable all the time okay? Even the nicest person has their own oopsies sometimes.

[@nagisamomoe125]

give me a link

[@nagisamomoe125]

@@beomkaslana i hate the sterotype that adolescents can't think rationally. this is stupid, sayaka is clearly perceptive and does have a brain.

[@funyarinpa9464]

I just realized how disturbing the "I can't ask him to love something like me" scene is. Because what Sayaka is expressing here is that she doesn't deserve love, she CAN'T be loved, because of what's been done to her body without her consent. She feels dirty and undesirable because someone else took advantage of her. It's not too far from how many victims of SA rationalize their own situation at first. Of course, it isn't a 1:1 analogy (no analogy ever is), because Sayaka's understanding that she's a "zombie" is at least partially correct, but the implication is still very unsettling.

[@Asehpe]

True. And -- I may be wrong, but I get the feeling there is something very Japanese in this conclusion Sayaka immediately reaches and accepts without thinking twice. There is much that is outside of your control, but that you still should apologize for, in Japanese culture.

[@zoesequeira5388]

@@Asehpe it might be a thing in Japanese culture, but it's a pretty common feeling in SA survivors in the US too

[@c0mpu73rguy]

Oh no! I never made that connection but now it just makes too much sense 😢

[@bookbagfox]

The way I interpreted Sayaka Miki's story was that became so worn down and eventually died the way she did because she worked without any rest to do good within a system that fundamentally didn't allow her to. Her role in the story, ultimately, is to show why Madoka made the decision to completely overturn it.

[@AestheticGamer]

I'm happy you said that, and 100% agree, especially if you pay attention to the moment she turns into a witch. She already is at her lowest point because of all she's sacrificed to try to do good with very little return, taking a huge toll on her, but Sayaka adamantly wanted to believe that she was changing the world for the better, and that her sacrifices and desire to do and be good meant something. That all she was suffering pursuing to do good had some sort of impact. She didn't turn into a Witch when she lost who she cared about the most, though that definitely knocked her down to a low point. She turned into a witch when after having sacrificed and worked so hard, the good she tried to stand for still left shitty people who weren't good & didn't treat others like people, or stand for anything Sayaka thought of good. And though her end is tragic and she died thinking she accomplished nothing, we're also shown that's not true. Sayaka's actions directly affected Kyouko and Madoka. It brought Kyoko back from her own dark place to care about more than just herself, seeing the genuine goodness but struggle that Sayaka endured, but also helped Madoka steel her resolve that a system that punishes good people and corrupts them for trying to be good isn't a system worth keeping. So while Sayaka went about it wrong, taking way too much on herself, she didn't accomplish nothing like she thought when she turned into a Witch, its just she needed to not take on the world by herself, no single person can change the world alone. But Sayaka did change the people around her, and ultimately those people changed those around them, and so on. Which plays into the overall theme of the show, when the potential for someone to change the world comes because of everyone's sacrifices and affects they've had, to put someone empathetic, good, and with the backing of many wronged to initiate real change, everything comes together when all the pieces fall into place. Not that it solves everything, as the epilogue shows, but there is real change for the better.

[@micanikko]

Wonderfully said for both of you!

[@land3021]

And, if you consider the sequals to be canon, namely, the film where Homura overruns Madoka's decision that she made at the end of the TV Series, aswell as Madoka Magia... well, it all seems pointless... frick, I should just considered them non-canon just like I do with the second season of psychopass...

[@haewon.polarbear]

​@@land3021i think of rebellions ending happened really because the writers thought its such an idea to make madoka and homura enemies and nothing else than that. im with u with not considering the movie sequel "canon"

[@growingoaks]

Ehh, idk. She made a selfish wish to heal someone, wanting him to be indebted to her and she suffered for it. In a way, even Madoka made a selfish wish and they all paid for it. Her story seems to be a cautionary tale of “be careful what you wish for” mixed with “dont mess with things unless you ask the psychic magical space cat a LOT of questions” imho.

[@teatrap1846]

“There is no ethical consumption under kyubey” has made this automatically the best Madoka magica analysis

[@insertnamehere1398]

Kyubey’s karma got him 10 fold in rebellion

[@Christopherjazzcat]

This needs to be on a t-shirt

[@JavaManJoJo]

There's often a lot of talk online about if Kyubey is *really* the bad guy of the show (he's working for the greater good etc). And I think that makes sense if we see him as a representation of society as a whole because we're all so conditioned to just blindly accept the way that society works even if it's broken and hurts people. Maybe that's why there's so much blame put on Sayaka. It's all very "bootstraps". Sayaka should have just been a "better person" I guess.

[@antonioscendrategattico2302]

The show also sets up a very... textbook trolley problem with Kyubey's character. So it's natural it'd generate that discussion. It's a bit... cheap, and set up in a way that's not really organic, but it does set up a compelling moral dilemma without an easy solution, even if in a kinda cheap way by literally tracing an infamous real life philosophical dilemma.

[@takke9830]

Yeah exactly. Ppl always tend to forget that she was literally like 14 or something and also a japanese school teen who‘s been indoctrinated since birth into a deeply sacrificial tradcon society with nationalistic undertones. The way Sayaka is so self sacrificial out of some idea of duty she feels seems deeply societal specifically to japan and their culture of ovwrwork, high achievements and geoup thinking over caring about individuals. The more u know japanese society, the harder the show it specifically. Like how witches are mentally ill children driven to insanity by overarching pressure they couldn‘t handle and they are invisible to major society and only seen as annoyances and monsters by the girls on the same path as them. Just like how mental illness in japan is invisible and rarely treated and not really understood. It‘s really just a metaphor for all of these societal problems. And how life would be better if we wouldn‘t let ppl with these issues fall into a pit of dispair without caring that‘ll become of them.

[@charliepuppy.]

Honestly it felt like these girls were purposely Seeked out by kyubey Especially Mami, as she was literally dying But all the girls had one thing in common; and that was The situations they were in leaving them vulnerable espically due to their young age they never fully grapsed the concept of contracts. The girls wishes had 2 sides to it it felt. Madoka wanted to become a magical girl because she always felt worthless and useless and for her to becomr a magical girl she took this advantage to be able to make herself useful and worthy of her life. Homura's wish could also sound like a girl just wanting her best friend again, But her wish is based around her and it becomes a curse on her in the end of the show, and in rebellion. Her Once innocent mental state began to turn cold and almost intimidating because of how many times shes relived this month trying to save madoka. at the end of the show, homura realized that she pretty much caused madoka to be able to have this fate because of the timelines coming to one in the end. In the movie it shows that her love fo r madoka evolved into a toxic obsession to where she doesn't seem to care about madoka anymore and will just do ANYTHING to get madoka to stay with her, even if it means making madoka her enemy. She purposely makes madoka an enemy now because she WANTS to keep madoka in this toxic cycle because it just means it's the closest she will get to madoka.Her obsession caught up to her. Mami's wish could have possbily been used to revive her and her parents, but ive always wondered if her wish was out of impulse and if she would have chosen her family to live with her if she had better time. Literally as she is dying kyubey magically appeared.. Unfortunately for mami, despite her being a magical girl for the longest, its truly shown how Her wish ended up being the very thing she succumed to. Her loneliness. She was going to die alone, when she was revived, she WAS alone, and until her final moments JUST when she finally felt like she wasnt going to be alone anymore,she died, and died to her own friend(Charlotte/bebe is Nagisa). Mami acted as the older sister for madoka and sayaka, tryung to put on the front that being a magical girl was not what she wanted atall. Her wish to live was her curse to die. Kyoko's wish, while Not motivated by ill will, was still a bit inconsiderate of her father's wishes, because her father wanted followers that would actually be loyal to him and his beliefs, and I think she made this wish partly due to the fact that her family was living in poverty, and she saw the oppurtunity to be able to help her dad but also her and her sister, and it id later inplied when sayaka cause one of kyokos apple to fall to the ground and kyoko is upset . Kyoko is the only magical girl that eats food and snacks very often. She started only looking put for herself until she tried picking a fight with sayaka but saw herself in sayaka and wanted to bond with her because of that. Her wish that her father could have more followers was what caused her curse to have her father Killing the entire family and himself and leaving her to have everyone against her calling her a witch,as her father suffered rejection similarly she made a wish for her father to stop being rejected only for herself to be. Sakaya's wish was never fully selfless. She did truly love kyouske and could not handle seeing him not be able to do the things hed wanted to do. she was rhe onky one thag would come see him, and She felt that by making this wish, somehow kyouske would think that they shoukd be together. she made a wish for kyoske to be able to do what he loves again and get humanity back but she ends up losing her own humanity realizing that her wish really didnt mean anything , at least not worth Becoming a zombie. Nagisa's wish is The more silly wish out of the rest of the magical girls, (she is 8)but its origins could still be perceived as being selfish. after Nagisa was born, her mother had gotten sick. which led to her, blaming her for her sickness because of her birth.When kyubey discovered her, her mother was deteriorating, and nagisa originally wanted to to wish to cure her mother's illness, but she decided to waste the wish on cheesecake because she relaized her mom wouldnt be grateful for her even if she saved her. she seems to relaize that it was selfish, but its unknown if thise turned her into a wish, but her ultimate curse is rather strange. She ends of eating mami , and even the movie refrenced it in the cake somg, nahisa talked about cheese, and her hair is yellow like cheese which is probably why she was eaten😅

[@TheFuriousScribbles]

I once had someone tell me her idea of the overarching themes in Madoka was one of how a patriarchal society sees women. Poorly remembered and paraphrased: Young girls, ie Magical Girls, get to be virtuous, pure and innocent. Women, ie Witches, are seen as manipulative, destructive and incomprehensible. There's a certain existential horror in knowing that in the eyes of society at large, you'll eventually lose innocence, not because you did anything wrong, but because you grew up. In any case, it's an interpretation that I'm sort of fond of. This is why I'm glad that you mentioned "feminine responsibility" in your essay so much. The notion that women and girls are expected to give all they have until they don't have anything left of themselves, and when they don't have anything left they become disposable, and even begin to think of themselves that way. ...You know, for a series that has a lot of horror elements, some of the scariest parts of Madoka are just reality.

[@familyguyfeline]

Really? I picked up on none of that when I watched it. They should have made whatever allegories they were trying to make more obvious, since it seems very one dimensional from an outsider perspective. I actually hated it when I watched it, and only clicked on this video out of curiosity, but this comment piqued my interest to how much I may have missed.

[@TheFuriousScribbles]

@@familyguyfeline Fair enough I suppose. On my first viewing of the earlier episodes, I wasn't looking at it much deeper than a simple surface read either, though I suspect that was deliberate on the creators' part. Early on, there seemed to be great pains taken to make it look and feel like a vapid, cookie-cutter moe anime. This mainly serves to make it more shocking when the series takes a turn.

[@saidwithhyperbole6894]

@@familyguyfeline Well they didn't make these allegories obvious because this wasn't the main purpose of what the author was trying to show. Urobuchi was just trying to make a story that dissects what humans would do when faced with an enemy that can't be defeated no matter what we do: despair. Although you could also say that he was just making a story about how good can't exist without evil. Without dark, light can't flourish, and evolution would be halted, that's why the incubators just want to maintain the "karmic balance" by sacrificing the lives of the "innocent"

[@meguca201]

I really like that interpretation

[@RandominityFTW]

How is there existential horror in realizing that you will eventually grow up? "Innocence" is just a cutesy way of saying you're too dumb and inexperienced to know better. Loss of innocence is often brutal when it's done like flipping a light switch, but it's perfectly normal and desirable thing when it's slowly lost as you grow up and learn more.

[@rebeccaking7274]

"Expressing self-disgust at the idea of desiring her own happiness" is a line that literally brought me to tears. The comparison of the arc of a magical girl to that of the heroic lives of those who work in medicine is also a comparison that needed to absolutely be made (this is not a sarcastic statement, please do not interpret it as such). I will likely have more to say as this is a long video. That is what comes to mind. This account is under my deadname and I don't know how to change that (I have life circumstances that affect my ability to understand things at time and cannot fix it at the moment) so you'll just have to take my word for it but I'm a trans man (he/him, preferred name Avery) so hearing from a trans person in medicine meant a lot to me. I am so sorry that you were pushed so hard. I am so sorry that you were treated so poorly.

[@TRaWi]

After having witnessed the labors and tribulations of my mother - who spent 40 years as an Intensive Care Pediatrician toiling to manage excellency into a third-world shabby hospital ward, I can say it's a sad world one in which we have to make clear calling a medic a hero is not an irony because so many unscientific deadbeat morons think that railing the medical science makes them look good and not the opposite.

[@rebeccaking7274]

Hey genuinely doc? Thanks for saving my life.

[@Salad531]

I think Sayaka definitely had selfish intentions with her wish but saying her wish was completely selfish would be kinda dumb. To me it’s really a mix of the two, she genuinely wanted to help but also wanted kyousuke to be thankful for her action even if she doesn’t want to acknowledge it and hides that part of her wish deep within her. To me her downfall has always been more about her idolization of Mami and the ‘’hero of justice’’ she saw in her and not as much the whole kyousuke thing(even if it’s definitely still important, just not as important). What really breaks Sayaka is the realization that she can never be Mami, she can never be truly selfless.She won’t acknowledge that as well so she continues to completely sacrifice herself for the sake of others, worsening her mental state and making her do even more selfish things(yelling at Madoka or straight up killing two guys on the train) With that said, Sayaka isn’t selfish,she’s 14 and doesn’t know any better, labelling someone as selfish for one or two things they did is stupid.

[@jouheikisaragi6075]

You hit the nail on the head. Though clarification: Sayaka only murders people in the manga. Gen and Shinbo both clarified she didn't lay a finger on them in the anime(whereas the manga shows her leave the train already transformed and with bloody blades). Sayaka should've read Fate Stay Night and realized that a hero of justice is a dumb idea that takes being utterly insane to actually follow to the letter. Maybe then, she may have only died at Walpy.

[@edgystuffretarkidnormcring330]

If I were her I wouldn’t have felt like a terrible person murdering the dudes in the train. She probably saved their gf from rape and abuse or any other girl really. But I guess a young girl murdering two dudesbros and it being presented as good wouldn’t pass...

[@edgystuffretarkidnormcring330]

I mean it’s gonna make the dudebros uncomfy and mad that’s for sure.

[@sinceritynature202]

I wish that Sayaka could've had a one on one moment with Mami, the way Madoka did right at the end, when Mami opened up and was truly vulnerable with her...... Sayaka never got to see that side of Mami, and in fact, the very last she ever saw of Mami, she was at her most authentically happy, truly excited and Hopeful for the first time in a long while...... showing off a little, even. While Madoka probably came away with a more nuanced understanding of Mami, Sayaka came away with an Idol, or maybe a spectre, looming over her head.

[@Salad531]

@@sinceritynature202 I see where you're coming from but Sayaka's delusionals perspective of Mami's heroism is such a major character point that it can't be really rewritten around without hurting her characterization in my opinon With that said, magia record season 2 episode 1 kinda gives us that but obviously it's not really relevant to the madoka storyline as a whole

[@avej99]

Sayaka’s character journey is a sad reminder that you need more than just good intentions if you want to change the world for the better

[@swimmyswim417]

This is a beautiful analysis of such a complex character. To over share a bit-I first encountered PMMM in 2016, after I experienced a horrible anxious breakdown and left college to move back home and find some purpose in working as a healthcare aide for my disabled sister. The past six years since (especially after a health crisis at the end of 2019) have bombarded me with all sorts of conflicting feelings regarding self-worth and altruism. I keep putting off my professional/educational development to serve a very real need for the people I love. I get a paycheck and the satisfaction of knowing that my loved ones get the best care I can give, but what outlet do I have to compensate for the emotional toll when my ‘work’ is at home and tied directly to my most significant familial relationships? Compassion fatigue is a thing. It’s a unique sort of emotional burnout that disguises itself as a necessary consequence of selflessness and preys on an intrinsic desire to serve others. It’s something that I struggle against every day, and my heart goes out to you, Sayaka, and everybody else who also faces it. On another note, I find the twist about witches’ origins to be particularly insidious in the way that it’s yet another way of exploiting competition between girls. Magical girls have to compete to obtain grief seeds to boost their power, and those grief seeds are the remnants of other girls just like them. It’s more than just a horrific and inevitable destiny, it encourages toxic behavior between female peers and reduces the victims (witches) to faceless monsters who deserve to be destroyed, all while the real villains (Kyubey) sit in the background and watch, unchallenged, until Madoka makes the move to break the cycle of toxic feminine exploitation and free the witches.

[@sinceritynature202]

To note; the composer who wrote the ending song following Sayaka's death, his most famous song World's End Dancehall, is about two lovers (coded as girls) being rejected by society, become enmeshed in their unhealthy relationship by the forces trying to pull them apart, and ultimately commit suicide together rather than face the future apart. I think it's very interesting that they pulled a very unknown (in the anime industry space, at the time) artist for that one ending song in PMMM, I feel there must have felt the connection there, I think it was intentional......... edit: sorry if this comment seems disjointed or messy, im very sick but wanted to point this out before i forgot ;;;

[@theinfantmetroid]

im not sure i would call world's end dancehall wowaka's "most famous song".

[@Lunarrbase]

? you saying wowaka's most famous song is "world's end dancehall" is a bit silly

[@LunaticTrumpet]

Wait Wowaka worked on Madoka Magica?

[@sinceritynature202]

@@LunaticTrumpet He was commissioned to write the ending song for the 9th episode! So while not 'technically' part of the PMMM staff, he did contribute :)

[@LunaticTrumpet]

@@sinceritynature202 that’s amazing

[@pattyputty7784]

The fandom's interpretation of Sayaka as selfish never sat right with me, and this is the first time I've seen anyone manage to put my thoughts into words plus some. Sayaka is so relatable and sympathetic because she *wasn't* selfish, and any accusations of selfishness from viewers really fails to see the story from her perspective. I have felt such a deep personal connection to her since I first saw the series in 2013. Many of her experiences, especially of her disgust of her own body after a deep violation of bodily autonomy, really resonated with me. I've felt the need to put my own self-worth on the sidelines for the sake of protecting others, some of whom were certainly not worth protecting, and it took a long time to unlearn that behavior. Heck, I'm still in the process of it. But it's so liberating to see those same kinds of struggles represented in media, and seeing how Sayaka's friends do nothing but support her and try to help her gives me hope. I think the reason so many fans (mostly adult men....) seem to think of her wish as selfish is because they fail to notice society's expectations of women and girls to sacrifice themselves. They accept that expectation as normal, they've internalized it, and they have no reason to question it because it benefits them. Thanks for taking the time to make such a deep dive into Sayaka's character. You've definitely gained another subscriber!

[@militarydeviltube5014]

Sayaka to me is the most relatable character in any media. What you said - " I've felt the need to put my own self-worth on the sidelines for the sake of protecting others, some of whom were certainly not worth protecting, and it took a long time to unlearn that behavior.", hit very hard lol... Kind of off topic, but the first time I watched the anime I felt really proud to see Sayaka lose herself like that. The reason for that was because I was doing the exact same thing, except Sayaka wore a white cloak and had a sword. She looked like some sort of hero and that completely hypnotized me, I thought I was going down the right path. ( *I still kind of think so.* )

[@lamaziqali2121]

THANK YOU for this comment .

[@ultimxtemiracxler]

She was very self sacrificial but there was probably some underlying selfish intent that she never noticed as she expected that Kyosuke will be with her once he's walking back up again and probably be together with her because she sacrificed herself. However she gradually realized that it will never happen after realizing the cost of her own wish and that her crush will be stolen away from her plus the reality of the expectations for women at the time like the scene with the 2 teenagers on the train.

[@haewon.polarbear]

yeah me and my friend who got me into madoka, i told him "its crazy i found a lot of people actually dislike sayaka, how???" and he was like "PEOPLE HATE HER?" but yeah ur right most of people who disliked her are just older males incapable of relating, which stinks.

[@melty1572]

I think that all the 5 girls of madoka are selfish in their own ways, but I can't really blame them. Everyone calls Sayaka selfish because they think she's annoying, I think she is selfish because she isn't truly selfless. Nobody is actually. They are young girls, barely mature adults that were pit in a world of fighting witches, self sacrifice, and generally regretting the wish that they make (except homura). Mami and Kyoko even know that they are selfish, with Kyoko embracing it and Mami hiding it under a false bravado, Madoka being selfish because of her desire to be useful resulting in a selfless act, Sayaka's ideals contrasting with the true world of magical girls and wanting to get with a guy indirectly, and Homura paralleling madoka once again by making the most selfish act with the most selfless intentions

[@fantasy4500]

I binged Madoka Magica back in 2019/2020 and I was in a very toxic situation at the time. I related to almost every single thing Sayaka did. I, for years, bent over backwards for others until I burnt myself out to a point I could no longer physically due anything due to illness. While I've largely healed, I know others are not so lucky, and I still have my bad days. My fiance and I went through old messages I went to my ex in 2018 and I spoke largely the same way Sayaka did while having intense PTSD flashbacks and depressive episodes, referring to myself as a corpse barely worth saving. Knowing that people view Sayaka's actions as selfish hurts in a deeply profound way as someone who likely would have made the same choices, same actions. I have healed from that point, and no longer will help others at the cost of my own sanity, often letting people know when I am not in the correct headspace to help, while simultaneously offering them the choice of stepping away from my own vents for their sake. Sometimes life can be too much, and it sucks. But part of growing up to me has been realizing that you don't have to fix everything yourself, and that's something I still struggle with. Madoka Magica shows themes of all of this to me. While Madoka ultimately makes a choice that fixes everything, the other girls don't have that option. In trying to be the Madoka of our own lives, the one who can solve everything simply with little to no consequences save maybe ourselves, we end up like Sayaka, someone trying to no avail and burning themselves out to the point of extinguish at the end. And well, you can't put the fire out from inside the house. Sometimes we need someone to save us, no matter how much we hate it.

[@icravedeath.1200]

Isolating yourself from others won't help anyone, that's a lesson I had to learn the hard way during the last couple of years.

[@ThePuppyTurtle]

When it comes to Sayaka's motives, it's not one way or the other. She altruistically wants her friend to be better, and personally desires his gratitude and romantic affection. She is both benevolent and self righteous. These things don't compete with one another. They just are simultaneously true.

[@magicalgirl4]

completely agree!

[@tirirana]

I always felt like Sayaka longed for a happy ending, a world where everyone was safe, where Kyōsuke loved her and all her friends worked together as magical girls. But rather than being selfish she would always put her own wellbeing last and prioritise other people. Combine that with the exceptional feeling of betrayal and disgust with herself for having been turned into a walking corpse without her knowledge and consent, how is it even possible to see her intense desire to just leave all that pain behind and just live for others as selfish? Is that healthy? Definitely no, and that's a major point of the series, but it's not selfish.

[@madgreensonunbound5801]

Mami was so happy at the idea of no longer being alone that her happiness killed her.

[@jouheikisaragi6075]

Girl missed Kyoko so much it hurts.

[@magicalgirl4]

@@jouheikisaragi6075 she would've seen Kyoko in Madoka in that moment, makes me so sad when I think about that

[@jouheikisaragi6075]

@@magicalgirl4 and in Sayaka, Mami was determined to not screw it up this time and either she got herself killed or she lives but Sayaka self destroys anyway cause Sayaka is that kinda kid who hates other people being better than her at things but also doesn't work hard enough(cause she CAN surpass Mami and Kyoko, she's just too far up her own ass)

[@lidu6363]

"There is no ethical consumption under Kyubey..." excuse me. I am taking notes. Also, putting Juri's theme under Sayaka's speech? Big brain 🤯

[@匚尺丂乇-k3v]

Who's Juri?

[@cloverbuns8800]

@@匚尺丂乇-k3v a girl from magia record

[@lidu6363]

@@匚尺丂乇-k3v Revolutionary Girl Utena character

[@THATGuy5654]

Man, even a recap of the plot of this show makes me tear up. "Madoka Magica is an anime abou-" "ABLUUHUHUUUUU😭😭😭"

[@Armeniussa]

Fantastic essay, I think we are past the worst wave of Sayaka-bashing, but it's still awesome to see such an examination of who I think is my favorite character in fiction. There were two arguments I didn't see you list that are often used by people who didn't like Sayaka. Using them as evidence for "Sayaka is bad, actually" is ridiculous, but I do think are more legitimate character flaws that flatten her characterization when not recognized: 1. Sayaka ultimately refuses Kyouko's apple because it was stolen. She claims she doesn't judge Kyouko anymore, but accusing someone you just learned is a homeless orphan of stealing an apple IS self-righteous and absurd. At that point she is fully in sunk-cost fallacy with becoming a magical girl, and I don't think the Sayaka in the first episode would have been that judgmental, but it's a moment where I understand where people get the idea of Sayaka being a sanctimonious and privileged character. 2. Sayaka completely twists Mami's death into Homura being responsible for it, even though Mami is the one who incapacitated Homura when she wasn't even hostile. It's some mix of traumatic memories being confused and not wanting to think badly of Mami, but it's still Sayaka abusively lashing out specifically towards Madoka and unlike the later scene she never self-reflects or feels bad about it. And speaking of Mami, I feel like a lot of people misinterpret her as the wise senpai, when the point of her arc is that she *isn't*. Mami's advice to Sayaka and Madoka, specifically telling Sayaka her proposed wish is a bad idea, is supposed to be just as if not more flawed than Junko's advice to Madoka or Kyouko's advice to Sayaka. It ultimately backfires, because Sayaka still makes the wish but now she has Mami's voice in her head telling her that she might regret it. The girls treat Mami like she's some wise veteran but she's what, a fifteen year old girl trying to give extremely consequential life advice to some thirteen year olds? The story directly shows Mami's flaws first by having her straight up tell Madoka that she just tries to play the cool mentor when she really isn't, then by having her be taken by surprise and die, and then later by showing a timeline where they learn that magical girls become witches, and instead of giving a rallying speech Mami is the one that snaps and tries to kill everyone. This isn't a "Mami bad" thing but the fandom at large tends to put Mami on a pedestal just as they discard Sayaka, and both are dehumanizing.

[@magicalgirl4]

this!!! although I need to mention that Sayaka wasn't there when Mami tied up Homura, she didn't know that happened but she still blamed Homura (no didn't correct her and neither did Madoka)

[@SusannaBarrett]

Thank you so much for this. All the "discourse" about the girls' assumed selfishness really bothered me. Your reading of this show is quite frankly brilliant. Thank you - I for one really needed to hear that wanting to be loved is not a crime.

[@dominiccasts]

One thing I noticed Madoka Magica do which seemed a bit more unique was that it went into a lot of detail regarding the mechanics of its magic system. Not so much because of the lich element or Kyubey's whole explanation speech to break down Madoka near the end, but things like the way the soul gem can be used to access the girl's powers without transforming, implying they contain some kind of pocket dimension or otherwise that transformation is more just a matter of turning that gem inside out and wrapping the body with it and the things it can access, rather than it being a single tool. ...And now watching all this I realize just how badly I interpreted the series and what I took away from it. Also reminded me why it was it mattered as much to me in the first place as it had.

[@movabletypo]

This is a really great video essay, and expresses a lot of thoughts that I had myself, both when I first watched the show when it aired in 2011 and when I rewatched it relatively recently with a friend last year and whom I bounced quite a few discussion points with that you've addressed. One thing that developed in the ten years since the series first aired was that it was easier for me to see and articulate the ways in how systemic oppression is expressed in a lot of media including in Madoka, and I think this series contributed very well to that discussion in the years that follow. Forgive me for the long comment that follows, but this was a thought I always had ever since the show aired. One of the things I wished Urobuchi did with the show was to go further with the idea of class privilege in Madoka, since that was one of the central themes of Sayaka's character arc. When Sayaka talks about her relative privilege and lack of want, it's in juxtaposition to Kyosuke's hospitalization. I used to think, "well yeah Sayaka, there's global poverty and hunger," but I realized that it might have been very shocking as a young teen to see a close friend suffer a debilitating accident that drastically changed their lives, and it would have shaken her worldview of being in a safe community and lead her to question why something so awful would happen to someone so blessed. Suffering in another part of the world feels abstract, but a friend who is hospitalized with mobile disabilities, and might even have died, would feel very personal and maybe even catastrophic. I also think that her relative privilege would manifest in being a little short-sighted and which would contribute to her internalizing ideas of self-sacrifice and being in service to someone else, ideas which Kyubey exploits and worsens when he suggests that even her service as a magical girl is not as good compared to others, like Mami and Madoka. But one of the reasons I bring up class is because one of the scenes that stood out to me the most was in the church scene when Sayaka questions how Kyoko got the apples. I understand that in the context of the scene and the conversation, Sayaka doesn't want to partake in ill-begotten goods because she sees it as an extension of Kyoko's contradictory goodwill while espousing social darwinism and giving into an exploitative system, and because she doesn't want to give up her ethics. There's also the imagery of the apple and the church and temptation. However, viscerally to me, and I understand it might not be a good reading of the scene, it sounded like Sayaka was shaming Kyoko for stealing food, which I thought like "whoa, dang," considering Kyoko revealed that she was poor and starving. It's actually really hard for me to decouple that scene from how in real life people are punished harshly for stealing basic necessities in order to survive, and that teens felt a lot of shame and lack of support about being in poverty. I actually thought it was a very grounding moment in the show because the heavy discussion about altruism and self-sacrifice in the show can sometimes feel abstract, but here is a very mundane bit of dialogue that lands a little too close to home. I thought that as much as Sayaka feels bad about herself being better off compared to other people, she used Kyoko's past trauma to hurt her, but the show doesn't do more with it after that scene so I'm always left wondering how I'm supposed to interpret that scene sometimes. However I do think that this bit of dialogue makes Sayaka more well-rounded as a character, and makes the audience consider the fairness of the question, especially it took place after the revelation of a magical girl's not-alive physical state. Maybe Kyoko doesn't need to eat anymore, as starvation wouldn't affect a magical girl, but maybe for her how do you know you're not hungry if you don't feel full?

[@SulMatul]

I honestly have the exact same reaction to that scene now - and I guess my overall realisation is that social class is just something that Madoka doesn’t end up really addressing much at all, and kinda just uses it as set dressing. It’s… frustrating, to say the least. It leads to these awkward interactions where Kyouko is effectively being judged for her outlook - but her outlook has been heavily informed by poverty.

[@movabletypo]

@@SulMatul Hi, thanks for the taking the time to reply! I'm a bit glad that you thought so too, since I don't always see this bit of dialogue discussed much and so I thought that I was reading a bit too deeply into it. I tend to think that Urobuchi is purposeful in his dialogue, since so much of his work involves direct discussion of his themes, that I can't help but think the audience is supposed to get something from Sayaka's dialogue, especially since ethical discussions on stealing basic necessities is a pretty loaded topic no matter how briefly spoken of and we also see how visibly hurt Kyoko was once Sayaka made her accusation. I look forward to more of your videos and deep dives into games and media! I first ran into your work through your Pathologic 2 let's plays, and I still rewatch them from time to time. I'm also grateful for your continuing work in emergency medicine, and I hope that you'll find the time to take care of yourself.

[@meepmorp6201]

😊😊

[@meepmorp6201]

😊😊😊

[@wiolettaziokowska1912]

I honestly consider Madoka the "Evangelion for her™"

[@CastiellaXIV]

So fucking accurate Eva stans 🤝 madoka stans

[@bruh-hr1mt]

I think calling it "Evangelion: Magical Girl Edition" would be more accurate. my (male) friend got me into eva and i got him into madoka lol. these two shows are so amazing they are for everyone, but of course Madoka hits harder when you're a girl yourself and you learn about the metaphor for patriarchy

[@alainajohncour8850]

shevangelion, if you will

[@dragvrallass1658]

implying evangelion isn't for her smh

[@RedSpade37]

​@@alainajohncour8850 Shevangelion! I am slain! Perfect.

[@michimatsch5862]

2:32:33 It is easier to blame individual mistakes rather than the systems. It's what people do every day under capitalism, under patriarchy, under their gender-binary. The world is wrong because there are bad people. It is so much easier.

[@TheDJman248]

I wager it depends entirely on which situation. Are there plenty of aspects on the macro level that encourage harmful tendencies on the individual level? Absolutely, and Sayaka's mental process is chock full of them. But I wager individual mistakes play a role every now and then...not that necessarily means that the bad things that happened as a result of said mistakes means that the person who made said mistakes is bad themselves. It's just that...we can't deny that bad people exist. Some people act with malice even if the system had a hand in their mindset. I think some of the side material for Madoka magika showcases this. So basically...the systems need serious work, but this doesn't entirely discount bad people or individual mistakes. That's my take.

[@Skulblakahjarta]

I hope you don't mind me saying so but your voice is absolutly gorgeous and a joy to listen to. Madoka is such an emotive series and Sayka always resonated with me, its refreshing to see a take focusing on her.

[@miraprime474]

Hey, I'm working on the captions. My weekend is a little busy, but I should be able to finish them next week.

[@hachikoek]

I've listened to quite a number of essays and analysis on this show, including a couple Sayaka defense style ones, and I have to say this is probably the most insightful, deeply pondered and well excuted one I've watched to date. I was around the same age as these girls when I watched this show for the first time, a lot less reflective at the time and was fairly quick to dismiss Sayaka's actions as beinn 'foolish' and 'overly emotionally charged'... but as a mid 20s adult now, it terrifies me how much of myself I see in her, and just how conditioned we are to be alruistic to self destructive lengths. Absolutely love this, thank you

[@amberlyveil8856]

Ah... it's so refreshing to see someone else who sees past the horror genre tropes of House of Leaves and sees the core emotional themes behind it... despair, grief, love... and empathy after it's too late

[@malachorfives]

this show sounds absolutely insane and I need to start watching it immediately (this is one of those things I would never have watched without having seen this video first, sometimes it's good to choose spoilers)

[@JabamiLain]

The show is on Netflix. The movies are on KZbin.

[@malachorfives]

@@JabamiLain it is? I couldn't find it :( in which country?

[@JabamiLain]

@@malachorfives oh ! Maybe it's just in Portugal then ?

[@malachorfives]

@@JabamiLain thankfully I can trick Netflix into thinking I'm in Portugal! edit: it's still not there :(

[@alikari]

It's on american netflix, I watched it a few weeks ago unless they somehow decided to remove it between then, but I doubt it

[@jollyskull07]

First pathologic now madoka? You won my heart

[@wiolettaziokowska1912]

And uses Disco Elysium music? Your videos live in my heart rent free

[@rjtillery]

I'd like to thank you for writing this heavy but beautiful essay. I socially detransitioned during the beginning of covid lockdowns after a combination of guilt, self loathing, trauma, and fear. I cut myself from my friends both cis and trans out of shame for being trans myself and bitterness bc i couldn't medically transition and I told not a single soul of why. Fast forward to 2 days ago where i finished this video, and something clicked within in me to take the first step to being my authentic self. A self not born out of fear, guilt, or ignorance, but rather a self born out of mercy and care. I took a leap of faith with one of my friends and came out [again] to them, not just about still being trans, but also about why i detransitioned at all. I was met with compassion beyond what i could've fathomed a week ago. I know i'm a stranger, and you never intended this essay abt candy color haired magical girls to be specifically for me, but thank you for writing something that helped free me from that cycle of guilt, denial, and isolation. 2024 update: excited to say I'm in my first week of hrt and my friend i mentioned and I are so much closer. Things got better. I left the environment i was in and can dress as i please/sound as i please. Lots of things have happened since, good and bad, but I will never forget the steps this video inspired me to finally take. Things changed even after I'd lost hope that things could get better, even when I believed I was unlovable I've been proven time and time again I am not. So as sappy as it's gonna read, please take these words to heart: things can get better, you are lovable, and the art you make can literally change someone's life for the better. Take care ^^

[@icravedeath.1200]

I'm still in deep denial about it, I want to be a woman, but I don't know whether it'd be right for me.

[@icravedeath.1200]

I want to talk to someone.

[@reflectingPastChoices]

So many kids - and adults - need to watch Madoka. As many others, I suffered from childhood depression. The causes were many but besides the point. What is relevant is that she taught me that *hope matters.* _Madoka set a clock that had stopped back in motion._ For so many years, my time had been halted, but she unfroze it, in a mere 12 episodes, and a lot of tears. She became the leading principle by which I live. The reason I breathe, the purpose being every step I take. Hope is what moves us forward. And while sometimes we get bad endings, it is NEVER worthless.

[@Ammiteur9]

Fun fact about Icarus, it wasn't actually *his* hybris that got him killed. Ikarus's death is the punishment for Deadalus's (Ikarus's father) hybris. Icarus often get's portrayed as a young adult, but far more likely, he was 12 to 14 years old at most. He was a young, childish, excited boy, who didn't know what he was doing. I think this misunderstanding of Ikarus is similar to what you said about punishing the puella magi for their wishes, because the wishes are seen as hybris. Meanwhile Ikarus get's called out while it was his *father's* mistake that he died. He was the one that build the wings in the first place, not because it was necessairy, but because he wanted to go home (though I can understand his motivation here). He also previously did some other things that were concidered disrespectful to the gods, and him flying through the sky was the last straw. Daedalus became careless after a while and stopped watching over Icarus, as a result Icarus died and Daedalus stopped disrespecting the gods.

[@silvieserene]

Really relevant point in light of the Titan sub.

[@jbpeony7872]

i grew up watching magical girl shows and yeah Madoka feels more like a conclusion of the entire genre. I came to this series hoping for a cute show but at the time i had forgotten that magical girl shows have never been just fluff and I thank this series of reminding me why i love this genre. Your take is very nice

[@000Dragon50000]

Mami also knows Kyouko's story when she's warning Sayaka about making wishes for another person's sake (the two were close for a while and then drifted apart, before the events of the story, there's a spin-off manga about it)

[@Cruznick06]

I always love hearing different perspectives by people outside of the anime community. Madoka Magica came out during a very interesting time for anime. It was before we had our current seasonal releases and when manga/novel adaptations were often written different endings (as the source material was incomplete). Legal simulcast anime streaming hadn't become avaiable. I watched fansubs that still contained the advertisements and were cranked out within hours of the anime airing in Japan. I watched it COMPLETELY unaware of how things would turn out, as it came out. It was an incredible ride. Sayaka originally frustrated me. Then I realized she frustrated me BECAUSE I would likely go down that exact same path. I had just clawed myself out of clinical depression from middle school and my freshman year of highschool. I was a naive romantic. Her arc made me think. I dont know if I'll ever have the same sort of experience I did with Madoka Magica. I'm glad I had it though.

[@cowzmoon]

Did I expect to see a 2 hour long analysis of Madoka Magica today? No. Will I be watching the entire thing today? Yes.

[@michimatsch5862]

I never watched Madoka Magica but Sayaka reminds me a lot of myself. I struggle a lot with accepting kindness from others (just yesterday I debated with myself whether I could accept a five dollar gift on steam a friend had sent). In my childhood and adolescence I was always bullied and beaten by my father. My disabilities were not accepted and I just learned that I was only worth something if I could offer support. Be it due to me being good around legal and science stuff or offering emotional or physical labor...I had completely internalized this made me worth something. I have gotten a lot better. Got good friends and learned that I deserve their care which I often need. But accepting gifts is still so tough for me. I always need to tell myself that I deserve it as a person because my instinct is always to want to make it up to them. I'll get better with every gift though. And I am not a witch with a murdered German name so I guess I am good.

[@JabamiLain]

I relate more with Homura and Kyubey (especially Homura).

[@michimatsch5862]

@@JabamiLain I can sort of se e Homoura. But I can't say I understand Kyubey. Could you explain?

[@JabamiLain]

@@michimatsch5862 I always valued logic over emotions. Not to the point of arrogance like them. But I still value it.

[@Yahooooo9999]

Im so sorry for what happened to you, but im happy to hear you're doing better! you're doing great! 👍

[@willowarkan2263]

This reminded me of She-ra. Of when Catra asks Adora: Why do you always have to sacrifice everything for everyone else? When do you get to choose?" And later the words of Mara telling her she also deserves to be happy.

[@Katbumm]

The Disco Elysium music? The references to House Of Leaves? An extensive look into Madoka Magica and Sayaka Miki? This was truly a masterpiece, immediately had to subscribe to the channel. This is amazing. I can't wait for more in this style !! Thanks for making my day

[@artemisoroji4856]

thank u so much for ur thorough defense of sayaka. she is easily misunderstood (for no good reason) and she either ends up being "uwu baby"ified or "god ur so fucking selfish, die" while shes literally a kid. i think her character, between the whole cast, is the most intriguing one. i mean i love homuras story as well!! rebellion was just. (chefs kiss) like i dont care if people act as if homura is the most horrendous selfish person, she can literally end the world and i will say "yay girl kill everyone". she just deserves that, u know? wait where was i ah yes. i love how the anime takes time to explore sayakas character, like her fall doesnt happen quickly enough to reduce it to pure shock factor. ofc her transformation comes as a shock, its a huge twist! but it took around three episodes as we watched her drowning more and more and trying to claw her way out all to no avail. it really hammers home the bleakness of that world (and, the patriarchal/capitalist society) that forces u to a corner and then treats u like a monster when u start to lash out and try to free urself from the chains. and upon rewatching, i like how u can see certain things that show shes already altruistic (bc she doesnt regard herself as a human deserving of good stuff), she jokes self-depreciatingly and never takes time to reflect upon her own wellbeing. its a clever piece of media!!!! again thank u so much for ur video, hope ur having better days!!! (also i know u might not actually read through ur comment which, valid, good for ur mental health imo, but id love to know what u thought of rebellion!!)

[@SulMatul]

I have complex thoughts on Rebellion - I love what it tries to explore, though it does feel jarring when you watch it immediately after Madoka’s original plot. Given the original story was a 12 episode confined tale, Rebellion feels like it re-opens a closed book, and by necessity has to undo a little of Homura’s positive / healthy growth by the end of the 12th episode in order for its story and conflict to work Having said that, once it gets going I think it’s a very good exploration into the moral ambivalence of Homura and how her “fall” works - that it’s just the same process of burnout and disillusionment as it was for the other magical girls, even if she seemed to be initially coping well with the fate she locked herself into I’d judge Rebellion as a stand-alone piece of work rather than too closely in comparison to Madoka, *but* as a stand-alone piece of work it’s exceptionally good at what it wants to explore

[@A6by]

I've always seen Sayaka and Kyoko's story as one of unlearning compulsory heterosexuality. They both gave up their own lives for men, because society says that's what you *do*, but in the end (especially post-movie) they find far more fulfillment in being with each other.

[@jouheikisaragi6075]

I actually disagree here. As Kyouko basically goes out giving her life for someone else in all media but Oriko Magica and Magia Record. In Different Story, she sacrfices herself for Mami to survive, not have the guilt of killing a Witch she has personal attatchment to(Oktavia) and give that Grief Seed to Mami as both an apology and a sign of gratitude, she also gives her life to save Mami in Wraith Arc. A lot of what Kyouko directs at Sayaka is actually for Mami, Sayaka is merely a convenient replacement for Mami because she's kinda deader than disco in the anime. It's not even crack theory as it happens in Different Story and in Oriko Magica, Kyouko tends to tell Yuma Chitose(basically her daughter) things she directed at Momo(her dead sister) and even sees the image of Momo over Yuma in many scenes. Heck, when all the truths are dropped on them in the climax of Oriko Magica, Mami goes mad with grief again and Kyouko is basically so broken she gives up and is ready to die for Yuma to escape from the seemingly invincinle Oriko and Latria, until Yuma basically scolds the two for despairing over something so obvious like a limited lifespan "Someday is not now" as she said. Personally, I think Kyouko had that figured out since Mami(especially since the two act like an old couple a lot when they argue).

[@AllyInReality]

I'm sorry but how does the current society say that you give up your own life for men?

[@jouheikisaragi6075]

@@AllyInReality a lot of messed up ways really. Patriarchy tends to demand women's eternal servitude to men, one example of women being demanded to give birth no matter what consequence

[@starlaphantom2642]

@@AllyInReality have you ever heard of a man making his wife have her baby even if it kills her, makes her depressed, that is an example.

[@AllyInReality]

@@starlaphantom2642 same for a woman who try to use the baby as a way to lock a guy into a marriage though ;-;

[@isabellavillarreal3151]

while sayaka's believe that without use she doesn't deserve to exists doesn't exactly line up with some of my former believes it still hits me hard. I felt so worthless, I felt that because I couldn't be the best because I couldn't provide a use to people I had no reason to live on. So seeing her continue down the same path I was pushing for hurts so much because i can see myself in her and i can see what the end would have been for me if I never got help.

[@TheJollyLlama875]

I don't know how to read Japanese, but I feel like Urobuchi just took the opportunity to explain the themes in his show. I don't think he's making any direct comparisons, just trying to explain his broader point that someone else can believe they're doing the morally correct thing while doing something terrible to someone else - and I think that if he were going to spell that out, he would be pointing at Kyubey, who does make the case that he's trying to save the universe somehow while being terrible and awful, as his example of how "moral" actions create immoral results. Maybe I'm being overly generous, but this interpretation makes more sense to me than the "hubris of the wish" explanation.

[@tesswainwright845]

This is my new favorite analysis of Madoka Magica, and I wish I had it when I would defend her on a fan page I used to run. I think too many people read the condemnation of self-destructive altruism as a condemnation of altruism as a whole, and therefore Sayaka is vilified under the lens that she *must* have had ulterior motives due to the belief that that's all altruism is. The take of Sayaka being a young girl who simply wanted to help the people she loved and was taken advantage of because of that love is a refreshing one I've waiting far too long to see come out of this fandom in such a well-articulated way.

[@BlueMagicite]

Appreciated the disco elysium music throughout it, both it and Madoka got that vibe regarding living and trying to flourish under dysfunctional systems. Really good stuff!

[@MordredPendragon7997]

This was a really interesting analysis of Madoka Magica. The idea of Kyubey representing both a personal abuser and an abusive system flew right over my head when I watched the series, but when you mentioned it, it made total sense.

[@lizandre2995]

this was such a great video! i feel like a lot of bad takes in regards to madoka magica are made at least partially out of a refusal to analyse the show from the perspective of gender. the magical girl genre and, as such, madoka magica, is so deeply stemmed in how girl are both interpreted and portrayed within society, as such any analysis necessitates the addressing of misogyny and the effect their gender has on these characters. i feel a lot of people miss the point of the violence, and think the violence is the point, and that the contrast of the violence with the girliness serves to subvert or somehow desecrate the latter. and it's interesting, because i feel like anybody who has experienced womanhood or girlhood often feels like both of those heavily involve, or are even inherently linked to violence. to a lot of people, representing the experiences of teenage girls through violence makes a lot of logical sense, because it feels like a visceral representation of the experience. so a lot of criticisms towards sayaka play into the "crazy girl" archetype: she's jealous and love obsessed, or she has selfish ambitions. and that's where they fail to comprehend her character: they fall for the misogynistic stereotypes sayaka is consciously, textually scared of becoming. a lot of sayaka's character is being genuinely terrified of being "secretly horrible" for experiencing normal, human emotions, and it would be a failure of analysis to not contextualize this as a real fear a lot of marginalized people experience on a daily basis. in this context, it's specifically misogyny: she's scared of experiencing jealousy over not being with a boy she likes, something human and normal and morally neutral if addressed as negative and not acted upon (which is what happens in the show), because so often women expressing any sort of upset at experiencing romantic failure are characterized as "crazy", "jealous" and "obsessed". the same happens with her wish to heal kyosuke: she's afraid that even wanting simple gratitude over doing something for someone makes her a bad person, again, something completely normal, and yet something that often gets women labelled as "entitled" or "obsessed". it's no wonder the characters that lead her to her breaking point are two misogynistic older men talking about young girls they view as expendable sexual objects. so much of sayaka's character is about how girls are expected to navigate romance and love for other people, specifically men, and how they are expected to be selfless and let the men treat them like dirt, without them being acknowledged as people, how girls are expected to be content with being used. failure to consider this aspect of her character is what leads to a baseline misunderstanding of her character.

[@jouheikisaragi6075]

Ironically, there IS a "crazy jealous and possessive girl" character in this series. Homura, while heavily restrained until it all blows up in Oriko Magica and Rebellion is that stereotype(and as MagiReco shows, she's always been that way, she just didn't have a chance to act on it).

[@annaemaire]

What a beautiful exploration of this series. I've never been fully able to voice my feelings on Sayaka and why I found her journey so impactful, but this pretty much covers it. Thank you so much for all the time and energy you put into this SulMatul, and for what it's worth from a stranger I'm glad that you continue to make it past your own personal burnout and didn't lose hope. I wish you the strength and support to continue to care for yourself and others, and thank you for staying ❤️ "Do your best..."

[@peiithos]

Im only 4 minutes or so in but I remember watching madoka magica thinking that it would be a wholesome magical girl anime then getting pulled into the ride that is madoka magica. I loved the art style from the way the cutesey magical girls die and experience so, so much to how unsettling the witches are and how out of place they look in this world. The witches look like they were cut out of paper compared to the magical girls who are anime girls. It's a really obvious and jarring detail I love.

[@permanentblur]

Thank you for the beautiful video essay, it contained a much-needed message for an idealist questioning her idealism. And your Utena cosplay was gorgeous. 🌹

[@bbyheart]

I like to believe that in the moment kyoko is sat seconds before her self-sacrifice, she is reminded of the moment she became a magical girl. How she sacrificed her actual soul for another person, which is why she is sat as if she is praying.

[@madelynmurphy6388]

I came to this video already being an avid Sayaka defender. She has always been my favorite character in the show; though her personality is quite different than mine, I found that I keenly and intimately understood her struggle in ways I could not wholly express prior to viewing this analysis. Even still, this video challenged me to question my own internalized shame and misogyny in ways I wasn’t expecting. Though I don’t know if I’m quite yet ready to confront the depths of my own self-hatred, this was a refreshingly radical and rewarding watch. Excellent work!

[@vamp-shy]

the actual pain in my heart when the soundtrack from disco elysium popped in at some point around 1:38:00 was insane, thank you. this is an incredible analysis, and i am so happy to hear some commentary in defense of sayaka for once. thank you, thank you.

[@SilverKyria]

Thank you for this analysis. I didn't know how much I needed this right now. I've burned myself out, and I've been trying to recover for the last 2 months. Is it ironic that my favorite character of the show is Kyouko? I watched the show when I was 16. The stories of these girls really resonated with me. I guess I should've have a queer awakening while watching it, and while I picked up on some queer subtext and openly shipped KyouSaya, I didn't realize I was gay myself until much later. Years later, I watched Rebellion, and I was shocked by it in a way. I know it's divisive within the fandom, but I actually enjoyed the contrast with the original show.

[@meguca201]

This comment turned out to be an essay, so fair warning. I have a philosophy background and am a huge Kierkegaard enjoyer, so watching this brilliant analysis simply led me to an interpretation of my own regarding Sayaka and Kyoko. Connecting Kierkegaard's understanding of despair into Madoka Magica's portrayal in Sayaka is absolutely spot on, but I'm not sure the connection lies in Sayaka's self-neglect, her desire to "be rid of herself." While this may be true in a literal sense, ie in her apathy at the thought of death, I think it is more appropriate to diagnose Sayaka, not in wanting to be rid of herself (which Kierkegaard considers to be despair at a lower stage), but in despairingly willing to become herself (the final, highest stage). Like you perceptively notice in Sayaka's conversation with Kyoko, the one thing Sayaka absolutely refuses to sacrifice is her ethos, or in other words, her Self in the infinite sense. What seperates Kyoko from Sayaka could be interpreted in Kierkegaard's own terms of the ethical and aesthetical modes of life that we see in Either/Or; Kyoko indulges in pleasure and self gratification, Sayaka commits herself fully to something transcendental. Kierkegaard argues that the ethical is closer to a fulfilling life than the base aestheticism of a hedonist: the ethical dimension means that you've arrived at a coherent Selfhood--one rich with values and beliefs which consummate the subject's identity. If we ask the question, "Who is Kyoko?", there is really nothing there. She is a broken shell of a person who, in Kierkegaard's terms, might 'wander from star to star', aimlessly adrift, creating nothing and leaving nothing behind, like an animal--alive for no reason other than fleeting sensory stimulations. Sayaka on the other hand does have a coherent identity which she refuses to abandon: she is purposeful, she may not see value in her biological life, but she sees herself as the conduit of something Eternal. Like Abraham, she is willing to take Issac up to the mountain because there is something which she cannot simply discard: her beliefs, her "God", her Self. If we were to read these two characters through Kierkegaard, we must conclude that Kyoko is actually stuck in a more base form despair, because she is actually wanting to be rid of herself (in the Infinite sense). She gets rid of herself by abandoning an ethical dimension altogether; thus, while she treats herself better than Sayaka in the physical dimension, her Self is fundamentally vacuous and without substance. She has succumbed to the narcotic stimulate of, ironically, self pleasure. But precisely in this self service, she has lost her Self. Kyoko's despair is the lowly despair of the common man, someone who knows not that they have a Self, someone who refuses to become themselves. Our noble Sayaka, however, DOES want to be herself. Sayaka knows who she is; Sayaka refuses to give up what she knows to be her self. And even if her body is destroyed, she would never allow her Infinite Self to be destroyed in the perverse self effacement that she sees in Kyoko. What Sayaka really is (again in Kierkegaard's terms) is the 'tragic hero', described in Fear and Trembling as follows: "The difference between Abraham and the tragic hero is obvious enough. The tragic hero stays within the ethical. She let's an expression of the ethical have its telos in a higher expression of the ethical; she reduces the ethical relation between father and son, or daughter and father, to a sentiment that has its dialectic in its relation to the idea of the ethical life... With Abraham it is different. In his action he overstepped the ethical altogether, and had a higher telos outside it, in relation to which he suspended [the ethical]." In other words, whereas Sayaka's action is in service to some higher ideal, she does not recognize that this higher ideal is in fact her Self. Her relation to the ethical is purely to the ethical (which Sayaka symbolically understands in the icon of Mami, whose gaze she is ashamed of in the clip you presented). It is a purely external relation: with Sayaka on the one side and the gaze of the Symbolic Mami on the other. In contrast to the tragic hero, Kierkegaard thinks of Abraham's faith as a "purely private undertaking"--ie only as a relation to the Self. Abraham is in fact not killing Issac for the ethical, or even for God--it is because he has faith. Sayaka, whatever else we can say about her, does not have faith. She ultimately doesn't believe that any good she does will have an effect. She believes that she must act according to an Ethic, but thinks it's impotent. At the end of the day, the world is too corrupt, people are too debased, and her efforts are drops in the bucket. She can't change anything. She is too weak to carry the weight of her Ethic. She has no hope. So she despairs. However, Abraham does not kill Issac because he is carrying an Ethic (some zealous fanaticism towards God). It is a purely private affair: a "higher telos", faith. And faith, Kierkegaard says, "is a passion". In a purely private moment of overcoming the ethical via passion, Abraham attains a Self in the highest sense. He strikes Issac, not for God, but for himself. This parallels your analysis of Madoka in making the decision to become a Magical Girl, not out of a sense of duty (self sacrifice, ie, the Ethical), not because of Kyubey's bottom line, but because she wills it. Both Madoka and Abraham rest, as K puts it, "on the strength of the absurd," and believe, impossibly, that all will be well--that God will stop the knife, that the laws of the universe can be rewritten. Out of passion, they become themselves in a way Sayaka does not, nor ever, since she always succumbs to the higher stages of despair in every timeline, whether Kyubey is exploitative or not, whether she is supported by her friends or not. Sayaka despairingly wants to be herself. Kyoko wants to be rid of herself. Both die together having failed to attain a Self (although, in the main timeline, Kyoko arguably makes a leap towards passion and faith by trying impossibly to save Sayaka). As Kierkegaard shows us, both the aesthetical (living for self) and the ethical (living for others) will come up with regret, ie, will face despair. Either/Or. And this dialectic can only be overcome in genuine faith, which arguably is what Madoka exemplifies in her act of extreme faith at the end of the series. Could Madoka then be the knight of faith in this fable? Could that be the meaning of her wish for infinite hope?

[@SulMatul]

This is one of those shining comment-essays that I love reading, thank you for composing it!

[@meguca201]

@@SulMatul Thank YOU for your awesome video essay that reaffirms why PMMM is absolutely goated.

[@icravedeath.1200]

@@SulMatul I'm tearing myself apart for the sake of other people's happiness and comfort, I relate to this character so much.

[@AnonymousWolfie]

Certain parts of this video make me very glad I did not engage with the greater fandom for this anime. Some of these “common takes” on this character are horribly immature and short sighted. I much prefer character dissections like this video. Fantastic work as always from this channel.

[@flappletarts]

I needed to hear this essay… I just left a horrible situation two days ago.. and so much of this.. so much of this makes so much sense. Thank you so much for sharing this.

[@MultiAnime4U]

Humans can not comprehend the complexity of this story. Maybe one day.

[@morank3]

Thanks for the great video! Really enjoyed your analysis of the show, I've found most Madoka criticism to be a bit too fawning or to miss the point completely (especially regarding Sayaka, I always read her tragedy as you did here and for me she's the heart and soul of the story). I can't really unabashedly love Madoka because of the ending, but it's so fascinating to dissect and the highs are truly spectacular. For all its deconstruction of the Mahou Shoujo genre I think the writers dreamed a little too small for Madoka's wish. The bizarre specificity of dismantling one tiny piece of the magical girl system has never sat right with me as something she would want, especially given the show's insistence that she can wish for literally anything. I think Gen is a bit too cynical for his own good, and can't fathom a world beyond the patriarchy. That the girls no longer turn into witches but still kill themselves trying to save a cruel world is maybe a bit darker than the show realises, especially with the motivational poster quote about Madoka watching over you at the end. Yet despite all that, the middle of the show is so good and drives straight to the heart of so much about these girls' worlds that it really is worth watching, flaws and all. I wish the ending had resonated with me, it would have made it an all-timer. Really hope there is someday a successor that has something to say and can dream a little bigger instead of the parade of knockoffs obsessed with misery porn. Thanks again for the heartfelt exploration of one of my favourite characters, looking forward to your future work. Slán go fóill!

[@SulMatul]

If I may recommend Revolutionary Girl Utena, I believe that show has exactly what you’re looking for - and has a far better ending with far more important and far-reaching ambitions

[@goregia764]

I would really suggest watching the Movie rebellion that takes place after the main series I do not want to spoil anything but I really would suggest watching it and going in as blind as possible im pretty sure it's available on KZbin so it's not that hard to get to

[@Marrianno]

I never realized how much Sayaka's vorries about her soulgem sound like conciquences of SA. Like, Kyubey unconcentualy tempered with Sayakas body, and it resulted in her feeling disgust over her own body, plus being unable to pursue her feeling for Kyoske pver fear of being judged.

[@APaleDot]

This was a wonderful video essay, probably the best I've ever seen on this series. Soaking in these finely delineated thoughts for nearly 3 hours has been a real treat. But I want to push back on one characterization you make of Sayaka which you really dig your heels in on, but I think the face-value "bad take" reading of her character actually gets right: Her desire to be with Kyosuke _is_ selfish. Selfish in the sense that she wants the relationship because it will make her happy, and if she was honest with herself, she would push aside Hitomi or anyone else that got in her way. Her actions towards Kyosuke are similar to one of those "nice" guys, who will spend time with and do countless favors for a girl on the expectation that it will lead to a relationship. When she finally realizes that those desires underlie her sacrifices, rather than simply being honest with Kyosuke, she represses those desires. Thus avoiding the trap of entitlement that the "nice" guy falls into, yet falling into another. You can't simply take her actions at face-value and conclude that she is completely selfless. One of the key aspects of her character is that she is not honest about her own feelings. She represses her desires, she represses her pain, and this repression is what boils up inside her and turns her into a witch. Say what you want about Kyouko, but you have to admit she is honest about what she wants, and this is what saves her from turning into a witch. Her selfish attitude is not portrayed as villainous by the show but rather as a rational response to a cruel system which seeks to extract as much as it can from her. So you're right in the main point, clearly Sayaka cannot be condemned on the basis of her selfishness. Kyouko would be orders of magnitude more condemned and yet it is only when Kyouko starts making sacrifices for others that she herself is killed. So, is the message that sacrifice is always bad because it leads to self-destruction? No, clearly not. When Kyouko gives up her life, it is the culmination of her character arc and is framed as a noble, almost loving gesture to Sayaka. Kyouko is honest with herself, about what she wants, so when she gives up her life it's clear that its what she wants to do. Kyuoko wouldn't do it any other way. The difference is, far from Sayaka being punished for being impure, she is _too_ pure. Her obsession with purity is exactly what drives her to hunt witches, and to hate Kyouko, and to hate herself. Precisely because Sayaka can't admit what she wants and sees her own selfishness as an impurity to be cleansed, when she sacrifices herself it is equally clear that it is a form of self-flagellation in a vain attempt to live up to the ideals given to her by others. So, I don't think the story really works unless you concede that Sayaka was selfish. If she's not battling with her own genuine selfishness then all that internal struggle goes away, and her story is merely the story of being crushed by a cruel system, which is what you portray in your video essay. There's no hope in that story. The obvious takeaway would be to become like Kyouko, because that's the only way to avoid being crushed. But if her story is about being honest with yourself and your loved ones, then there's all sorts of things you can say about the other characters and how they realize their authenticity in different ways.

[@magicalgirl4]

Thank you for saying this I completely agree, she definitely had her own internal battle of accepting her selfishness, which is what many need to come to terms to with eventually. I believe she wanted things so badly but saw them as wrong for wanting them (she did want them, it is selfish, but it is not *bad*) and held bitterness towards some people, and wanted to completely purge that, but that led to her downfall

[@PureMagic101]

Sayaka is my favorite of the holy quintet Her journey to self destruction seemed so real She was a child and her wish and wants and eventual disregard for her life as a result of those things makes complete sense for someone her age I love her and will never understand the hate she garnered from some sections of the fan base

[@yayimdancing]

To this day madoka magica is one of my favorite pieces of media i've ever seen. I watched it for the first time back when I was about the same age as the protagonists of the show, and i have rewatched it over and over again dozens of times since. when I was around that age I connected with the characters so deeply and nothing else quite captured the feelings i had like what many of the characters express. sometimes you do your best to do a good job and be a good person and you and your friends still suffer, and there is barely anything you can do about it because you are all just kids. madoka has always been my hero, changing the oppressive systems that have caused her and those she cares about so much pain. the messages of hope and revolution have carried me through some of the most difficult times of my life. Every single time i watch it I get so emotional. a phenomenal essay on a phenomenal show thank you for this

[@maybunny25]

I just wanted to thank you for your work during the pandemic. I've never Madoka Magica so I thought all the voice acting was clips from the dub! It was really great. I for sure see parts of The Little Mermaid in Sayaka - though I don't feel the entire end for The Little Mermaid is only because the Prince didn't return her feelings. I enjoyed your take Madoka Magica and plan to check it out.

[@vesface5651]

Have you considered balancing the themes of this show against neon genesis evangelion? I find it interesting that both have the element of unconsensual self sacrifice and the horrors of being a hero. Yet the difference is that Shinji has no hero complex, is fully aware of the horrors, and fights only because he is told. Also Rei is practically a parody of the perfect female self-sacrifice you mentioned here, as [SPOILER] she is revealed to be cloned over and over again, designed to serve and designed to die. She is not even human, yet is the envy of Shinji, for both her capacity of suffering and his father's love. These are just some loose thoughts, but I feel there's a lot that could be revealed about both shows when contrasted against each other.

[@thatscarletmoth]

This may perhaps be my favourite video of yours so far (which truly is saying something, I adore all your content!) I feel like I have also gained a greater appreciation and understanding of Sayaka's story, and truly is a beautiful homage to a complex and misunderstood character

[@JabamiLain]

This is just one of those stories that just sticks with you, you know ? So much to say. Where to start ? What would you like me to talk about, people in the comments ? Maybe about the delusional Nagisa ? The tortured angel Mami ? The self-hating demon Homura ? The theory that Madoka had already been planing her suicide ?

[@Nakama4Forever]

Oh man! I'm totally in tears right now. This is such a moving and poignant essay. I like to watch these kind of videos to learn new perspective and understanding from the shows I watch. I totally feel like a learned a lot from you so I'd like to give you my thanks. One thing that really stood out to me is how kyubey is the personification of the wider societal problems. My favorite storyline is Homura and Madoka mostly cause I'm a sucker for time travel in stories. But if I had to pick a second favorite would be Sayaka's story. There are only 2 moments in the show that made me tear up. The first being Sayaka's death and the second being Homura hugging and telling Madoka everything in her apartment. Now I'm gonna cry even more when I watch it over again with all this knowledge

[@historymax5479]

Madoka Magica kept giving me Attack on Titan vibes, because of the whole exploration of the expectation of self-sacrifice thing. Great vid! You summed up all the important discussions beautifully.

[@matusjansta]

I cried a lot watching this Show but even more with your Interpretation stressig additional dimensions to the tragedy. Thank you So so much!

[@andreajones65]

"There is a line between noble self sacrifice and self destruction born of self loathing."

[@ameliawilliams305]

Sayaka, who literally tries to be so SELFLESS that it kills her, who criticizes characters whose philosophies literally are "be selfish," being seen as selfish by the fandom is ... strange. Especially when she doesn't claim to meet her expectations either. This is an amazing video and it gave me a newfound love for Sayaka as a character.

[@spookcat-]

I'm sorry for putting it in a very non eloquent way, but... yes. Finally. Thank you so much. This is the best analysis of my favourite show that i have ever seen, and the one that really gets to the core of it. Sayaka and Madoka will always be among the characters i feel closest to, exactly for the reasons you stated. I wish you the best in life.

[@konikai]

Who ever captioned this, I love you

[@koryndv]

I watched this show as a middle school student enamoured with the magical girl genre, and this essay has brought to my attention how formative it was for me. I’m feeling prompted to give it another watch. Thank you for such an insightful take!

[@smart_c00ki3]

I’m so glad I finally got around to watching this video! Whenever I first realized that it was Sayaka who I had favored the most out of all the cast, I did as what I had with anything else I’d take a particular interest to and sought for people’s opinions, views, interpretations, and so on of her character. However, what I would hear and see from such never quite sat right to me. Why I liked her so much was not only for how interesting she was overall as a character, but also because I felt some sort of understanding from her which I couldn’t completely see because the perspectives I was finding weren’t seeing or displaying this either. Although, this is not at all against those perspectives and if anything I was happy to even find people who cared enough about her character to such an extent to give those viewpoints or interpretations in the first place. What I’m actually trying to say is, this analysis really helped open my eyes as to why I feel so deeply connected, attached, and understanding of her. To say the least, I can completely understand her struggles in both how she views herself and the world around her as well as desperately trying to push on despite it all. You truly did wonders for my appreciation towards Sayaka’s character. Overall, your dedication to taking such a deep and personal as well as new look into both Sayaka and Madoka Magica as a whole is truly admirable. I aspire to come even close to the wonderfully great lengths you went through for this video!

[@doctorwholover1012]

The thing that really interests me about Sayaka's arc is that it's a version of Homura's original wish being played out for us in real time, instead of in flashback, and we get to see how the minute details in their wishes ripple out into their devastating consequences. Sayaka is saved by Mami, a magical girl who appears like everything Sayaka wants to be (a mature, responsible, morally upstanding, glamorous superhero who gets to beat the shit out of monsters), someone who is kind and compassionate and (appears) to be full of hope! Feeling powerless to protect her loved one(s), Sayaka makes a wish with Kyubey to save someone she loved from a horrible fate, and is then trapped in a hell of her own creation when this wish pushes her loved one away, creates barriers in her other relationships, and puts her in increasing danger until she succumbs to her trauma. Likewise, Homura met Magical girl!Madoka who was everything she wanted to be + saved her from danger, and as Homura's feelings for Madoka grew, she desired to become a magical girl to help protect her, with the catalyst of her wish being Madoka's end at the hands of Walpurgisnacht. As she repeated the same time loop over and over again, she is trapped in a hell of her own creation, destroys all of her other relationships, and puts herself in danger repeatedly to save Madoka until she buckles under the weight of her trauma (as seen in Rebellion). Both girls wish for the ability to save a loved one from a terrible fate; but Sayaka's wish was better then Homura's - because hers WAS selfless. She wished for Kyousuke to be healed, not for herself to heal him. While she regretted her wish afterwards, it was the better version of the two 'selfish' wishes. Homura didn't wish for Madoka to be saved from Walpurgisnacht, she wished to SAVE Madoka from Walpurgisnacht. An EXTREMELY important distinction. Homura WANTED the credit, WANTED to be the saviour, WANTED her sacrifice to be known by the person, so she would be important. Would matter. Would be loved, be special, be worth something. I'm not saying that either Homura or Sayaka are better or worst than each other, they're both 14 yr old sheltered girls who did their best with limited information and in high-stakes situations, and I can only praise them for their desire to help others + hope for a better world. That said, the comparison between their wishes + the effects of said wishes is staggering to witness, as we learn more about Homura as a character through the differences between their wishes than the flashback episode alone provides. I could go into more + better detail but this is ridiculously long already + it's 4am lmao 😅 if anyone notices anything else or smth I'd love to see it 👀

[@anamariaramirez9341]

Well-said! 👏👏👏

[@elenamilin7445]

Warning: spoilers for Rebellion movie below! Oof so much to say, but first, I’m so glad you talked about Madoka Magica! It’s one of my favorites because, like you, and the girls, I struggle a lot with the limits of altruism and the balance of self-care vs altruism. And as an aspiring medic myself, and someone who worked frontline during the pandemic, a lot of your reflections on medicine are invaluable. Re: Madoka, I really love that you focused on Sayaka because she wasn’t actually the character that I found most thought-provoking. I actually thought most, and still think a lot, about Homura’s story, and particularly about her story as continued in Rebellion. Rebellion also continues the idea of what self-sacrifice costs, when it should be honored vs not. With some of the perspectives you included here I can now see that there are aspects of Rebellion that could be read as problematic-after all, Homura literally becomes the Devil because of her queer love for Madoka-but I just never really saw it that way because I think that even though Homura is wrong to disrespect Madoka’s wishes/agency-in other words, in failing to do what Madoka did for Sayaka-she is sympathetic. In rejecting and trying to contravene Madoka’s sacrifice, I think she is asking an important question, which is: is it okay that this one little girl gave up literally everything? Is it okay to ask her to do that, even if she wants to? Is it okay that that happened? In Rebellion, Homura answers those questions with a hard no, and I don’t think that she is less right because she is also motivated by her love for Madoka. Where I think she goes wrong, and what I think the movie portrays as the true betrayal, is that she prioritizes her love of Madoka over Madoka’s own wishes, at which point the question of “is this about love or about control” arises. But yeah, honestly, I do not understand anybody who reads these young women as selfish for having wishes or for making complicated choices in order to do what they think is right. I don’t think the story supports that reading at all. I get the sense that the inevitability of transforming into a witch is more about the unfair bargain they were tricked into and a metaphor for the fact that if you keep pushing yourself beyond your limits you will end up hurting yourself and others around you. Madoka Magica and Rebellion especially will always stay with me because of the questions they ask about what love, self-sacrifice, agency, altruism, and honoring others really mean. I’m glad to see a reading of it from someone who gets both very similar and very different things from it ❤️

[@Probably_JENOVA]

Yeah. Homura becoming The Devil to Madoka’s God makes more sense and was smart when you look at Rebellion again. Homura became The Devil as a way of taking the incubators’ plan to capture and control Madoka, and used it directly against them so that they couldn’t go through with their plan of hurting her as well as bringing back the witch system which would pull magical girls back into the cycle of suffering again. Had Homura not have used the incubators’ plan against them and instead went to heaven with Madoka, then the incubators would’ve just used another magical girl for their plan and the conflict of Rebellion would’ve reset, creating more of a bad ending. They also would’ve taken more clever and disturbing steps with their plan after the moment where they were able to observe and confirm the existence of The Law of Cycles. So Homura becoming The Devil to Madoka’s God was actually justified in preventing the incubators from starting over with their plans to capture and control the Law of Cycles by using another magical girl as bait this time. It’s just that fans tend to misunderstand the meaning behind Devil Homura. Plus Urobuchi believe it’d be a way more interesting twist than the rather predictable outcome we expected.

[@elenamilin7445]

@@Probably_JENOVA legitimately I had never thought of that! I’ll have to watch it again soon with that reading in mind. But yeah honestly either way, justified or not, I think Homura becoming the Devil is just a choice that makes sense for the character, and gives us more to think about, as you mentioned. It also strengthens the allegory, and reminds me of the story Three Versions of Judas, by Borges. In Three Versions he describes a heresy basically where it is believed that the one who truly sacrificed was not Jesus but Judas-he had to be damned in order to effect the miracle of the crucifixion and resurrection. And I think Homura was doing something similar, was becoming the villain in order to preserve something rather than out of pure selfishness.

[@isaacevilman7586]

I wouldn’t describe Kyubey in the new universe as “more benevolent,” but simply as “more benign.” They are still using magical girls as a way to counteract entropy, it’s just their new system has less harsh consequences. The movie shows that should witches become possible in the new universe, they would gladly become the exact same monsters they were in the old universe.

[@saturninexx]

sayaka is my absolute favorite madoka magica character; i related to her so much. i'm so glad you made this video, i was shocked to see people didnt like or understand her! i think you explained her character and her descent so eloquently. thank you ❤

[@Puddle]

37 minutes into this and I love it already... and then you had to drop the house of leaves quote on me?? incredible video! thank you for making this!!

[@youssefbaati4372]

OMG YES YES YES 😍😍😍 Top tier anime, by one of the most soothing voices i've ever heard

[@silly_goob]

Thank you for this video! This analysis is so good that i will rewatch it several times to understand more of it's points. I think a lot of people can relate to Sayaka's story of harmful altruism and i wonder why there aren't much media that covers these themes of guilt and shame for simply wanting something in return for all the sacrifices that've been made

[@basilgum]

This is a fantastic video, I'm so glad to see people appreciating Sayaka. I think she is the true heart of the series. Also, your voice is gorgeous and very soothing to listen to.

[@ddosia2412]

I genuenly cannot thank you enough for this essay. I cannot even imaigine, how hard it was for you to pour your really heart and soul into the all explanations and responses to the critics in the way that just has no flaws to say the least. Honestly, I found myself dumbfounded, absorbing all of the arguments that you have shown in this incredibly powerfull video and honestly - you put me on the spiraling session way deeper than I would've expected, and I really appretiate you doing that. My ultimate goal is to make my mind a place where I can rest in peace while the world is burning down and crutial part of process of getting to this is to destroy and question the most fundamental parts of your contiousness and worldview and rebuild it very consciously. I've done this in the past and I will keep doing this in the future, but what I can say for sure - this video will be one of the biggest sources of influence for my growth. Thank you with my whole heart. PS: as a non-native english speaker, it was quite challenging to really get all of the points from the first try because of refined vocabulary that was used to write the script. Eventually tho, with some help of a translator, I achieved in making myself cautious in my incompetence in one of the most groundbreaking way. The process is unstopable, and only thing you can choose is to be stuborn about it and eventually find yourself in morally wrong place of help it and grow and heal from thing that you woldn't suspect that you would need to heal from at the first place. Thank you soo so much one more time!

[@dizehjvegnomis]

this is an excellent presentation and analysis, thank you to everyone who helped sul!! also, i just heard "twin suns"in the background music ❤️‍🔥❤️‍🔥

[@dizehjvegnomis]

also, i've only heard the name of this anime once, in passing, on a stream - i am definitely going to watch it now. and i absolutely didn't shed even one tear during your video. 🥺

[@chasewighton4064]

Damn, this is genuinely one of the absolutely best video essays on Madoka Magica I’ve ever seen. There are so so SO many people who fundamentally misunderstand or misrepresent the show, but you *get it* and brilliantly articulated why this show resonated with me and so many others who have experienced toxic, abusive, and/or exploitative relationships that preyed on my need to be of value-to my partner, to my friends, to my university, to society in general-to others at the expense of taking care of myself. And to also contextualize PMMM as an incredibly relevant show right now for its commentary on burnout and self-sacrifice in the wake of the pandemic and increasingly urgent activist movements (BLM, trans rights, reproductive health care, the climate crisis, pushes for unionization and workplace safety, gun control, etc) is a fantastic take that I hadn’t really considered until you pointed it out. Yeah, more than a decade since it was released and it’s more relevant than ever. I can’t wait to see what you have to say about Revolutionary Girl Utena!

[@criminalsen2441]

Thank you for this absolute unit of an analysis, I enjoyed every second of it and totally didn't get all teary-eyed a few times😂 You said a thing that really meant a lot to me, it was "...for a victim, having the agency of your own story is the most important thing that *is*." This really struck a chord with me and it's been very true in my own life. I appreciated your analysis as a whole - it is positive and sympathetic, truly from the viewpoint of someone who understands the girls' plight. So anyway, thanks again💜

[@sammy5068]

This is such a good analysis of the story. Honestly props to you, I've put this on as background noise and listened to it all while forgetting about what I actually wanted to do. Madoka Magica is actually my favourite anime, simply because even the smallest details seem to be intentional. This is once again proof to me. I have to admit I never thought about Sayakas story this much, especially through the lenses of our society and its norms. I agree that many people misinterpret her story a lot although I think it should be obvious that her downfall was not caused by not being loved but by her own self-loathing. I however never thought about her as selfish. I always believed she was too selfless while trying to resist her own selfish desires (I use selfishness as a positive trait in this as it is important to look after one's own desires as long as it doesn't harmfully overstep others boundaries in my opinion). Now looking at it through the lense of the expectations of society it makes even more sense to me why she acted that way. There is so many ways we are expected to more or less destroy ourselves to fit in or to fulfill these expectations that I can truly empathise with her suffering. Thank you for shining a light on this aspect of the show aswell as others. The way kyubey acts as an abuser is also something I noticed I didn't realise while watching the show, even after it was established as a villain. This may be because I have gone through abuse myself and it has shown me that I might be blind to these behaviours because they seem more normal to me than they should. I'm glad I realised this while listening cause now I can actively try to change that. Thank you once again.

[@Aurabolt]

Appreciate this video a great deal, as a friend of mine sent me this video essay after I expressed feelings about Sayaka and her caregiving which resonated with your take. Her, and Madoka, are parts of why (as both autistic, and a caregiver myself for neurodivergent adults) I want to see more heroes and for that sense of caregiving through warmth, action and communication-in whatever way that takes-to be expanded upon. For me, there’s a lot of stories right now about the nature of heroism and doing one’s part being seen as a net negative, which burns and makes me feel like people want that sense to die. PMMM-for all it’s brutal tones and general takes on doing too much at the sake of self-didn’t make me feel that way with Mami at her best points, Sakarya and Madoka (my favorite character in the show.) Homura grew on me after the reveal, but the cynicism felt off, and at least Kyoto managed to grow. In many ways, this is why I’ve prevented myself from watching Rebellion as of yet. I feel like Madoka’s effects had to stand for what was the new norm, and allow for reasonable care to be given without overdoing it.

[@christopherwiley5859]

Came here directly from the Haruspex's walkthrough of Pathologic Classic HD. Nicely done, Sul!

[@EnviousGreen]

Wow I’ve found you twice in a row while searching for videos about very specific pieces of media that I love. First KOTOR 2 and now Madoka. Consider me subscribed. Looking forward to this video!

[@ange7500]

Dang...you've got me in tears with your closing comments. You've put into words what I could not express working in critical care during the pandemic, and how the story of Sayaka echoes that struggle.

[@namtellectjoonal7230]

Thank you for this video I have been watching alot of analysis videos on Madoka Magicka lately and yours is the first one that acknowledges how young these characters are and how they have internalized toxic standards of feminity. Many of the videos I have watched so far outright blamed these 14-year-olds for wanting something, so your take is very refreshing to me Also I love listening to your voice so much, it's really soothing to me

[@thegayesteisner6744]

Such a fantastic video, I really appreciate all the effort that went into this!! Stumbled on it, and watched it on my own, and just finished watching it again with my fiancée. To quote her, "I've always loved Sayaka as a character but this made me appreciate her more as a person." I've been falling into the Madoka hyperfixation again recently and this essay is partly to blame for cementing Sayaka as my favorite character. (The breakdown of criticisms at the end was also extremely good and amusing btw). Very much loved this and we're both looking forward to the eventual Utena video!

[@TheGerkuman]

I love that you said the 'no ethical consumption under Kyuubei' line part way through, and then when we got to episode 7 I realised that one reading of the text is that Kyuubei literally IS capitalism.

[@thatonedabifan]

I've always enjoyed that in just 12 episodes, they made these characters feel like human girls. They are flawed and their selfless actions are never COMPLETELY selfless. Even when Madoka sacrifices herself, an ultimate act of selflessness, you remember she has been lamenting throughout the entire show how she has never been anything much and wishes to be more. Mami is lonely and doesn't want to fight alone, so she naturally drags Madoka and Sayaka in. Sayaka does want to help Kyosuke when she sees he needs it more than she does, but a part of her hopes to win his heart in the process, which Mami points out, but she still does anyway. Homura's entire plotline is about her acting selfishly for the sake of one person she loves. Kyoko made a wish for the sake of her family, lost them all, and worries about survival above all else until Sayaka enters the picture. These are flaws. They are not ones that makes any of these characters terrible people or unlikeable. They are just human. They make mistakes and look out for themselves a bit, even if they don't realize it. Sayaka is considered to be annoying by some, but that's why I love her. This is exactly how a girl in her shoes would act. Mami would be lonely and look for ANYONE to lean on. Homura is in love with Madoka and would do anything to keep that loved one safe after watching her be broken, die, turn into a witch, and even killing her in several timelines. At this point, she's lost the ability to care about anything else, which comes back to bite her when Kyubey explains how she's accidentally powered up Madoka. Kyoko and Mami are opposites, yet neither are wrong in the way they go about being a magical girl. It's all written so well and Mami is dead for half the series and they still made her more compelling than a lot of characters in anime that have hundreds of episodes. None of these girls are perfect, and that's why I love them. You can understand and even sympathize with every decision being made, and that all of them are inherently good people who are burdened by having the power to change fate and what that will bring if they decide to do so. Selfishness is always painted as a bad thing, but it is unhealthy to be completely selfless. This was a really good video! This is my favorite anime and it always amazes me every time I see it. Thank you for letting me hear your take. I love hearing it.

[@thedorkycider]

I loved Sayaka when I first watched the show and it was really frustrating to see the take of her being bad and selfish. I identified with her a lot and well, yeah. This is a beautiful video and it gets across my own feelings more eloquently than I think I could manage without getting emotional about it

[@scatmanjohnfan22]

i like how mami makes the suggestion that madoka wishes for cake in the sweets witch's labyrinth, because that's exactly what the witch made her wish for. the small details in this show are so clever.