Super Best FriendCast - Adventure Time Game Argument

[@BbNaB]

"Telltale will be given money and time to make the game!" Matt Boy does *that* quote date things.

[@RememberJudas314]

I kinda see now what people mean when they call Liam a contrarian. The first Adventure Time game is made competently and is generally well reviewed despite having limited time and budget and Liam hates it. Mighty No. 9 is given $4 million dollars yet is panned by both critics and Mega Man fans and yet Liam will defend the shit out of it.

[@ronyncato7206]

The problem is that Liam and Woolie should be more realistic, seeing as how they've worked in the industry in some respect or another.

[@TheSergio1021]

Dont forget that Liam defends David Cage

[@Gungho73]

@@TheSergio1021 I can understand defending Quantic Dreams at the time because of their teams general modeling quality etc. But absolutely not on David Cage. For OP: Liam will tell someone their pledge towards MN9 wouldn't matter. Then in the 2nd breath, beg 50,000+ someones to donate, or donate more, to Indivisible in order to save it. I remember for a decent of people, that was a turning moment on Liam and led to outspoken frustrations against him. Some of it overly critical, some of it very in line and fair.

[@NamesSmeg]

​@@TheSergio1021yeesh.

[@CinderFall291]

I can't stand Liam

[@christianhansen2569]

Matt dropping truth bombs at the end; it's nice cause he typically just hangs around during arguments while Pat/Liam/Woolie yell at each other

[@stui8Bit231vamp734]

I just love how the most heated they've ever gotten on the podcast was arguing about a forgettable licensed adventure time game

[@diegomedina9637]

What about the Game boy has no games argument.

[@20marvelman]

And the western comics one

[@NamesSmeg]

My personal favorite, and seemingly the last argument they had, was the smash argument.

[@TheShockVox]

Mighty No9 was up there, but it wa more so just pat and Liam

[@notwhoyouthink1]

I had this playing on the background and shit, I forgot how aggressive it got.

[@Gungho73]

This was one of those aggressively stupid arguments where the longer it went, the more you couldn't believe how far Liam/Woolie were pushing. Literally pinch nose close eyes territory of "guys..."

[@NamesSmeg]

Liam fits that more, mainly because of his need to always argue with Pat.

[@gaiden8066]

Savage Matt

[@crazyinsane500]

Woolie didn't enjoy Adventure Time because he didn't grab his friends. IT'S IN THE THEME SONG! He could not go to very distant lands.

[@marcotalin6410]

An IP doesn't guarantee a good game, and neither does a publisher or a developer (coughPlatinumTMNTcough). However, I would argue that the quality of a developer and/or publisher would have greater bearing on a game's quality than the quality of the IP in most cases, even, and I would also argue especially, if it's an established IP from a non-video game source.

[@RenegadeY]

Marco Talin guess what, platinum was constrained by time and money

[@diegomedina9637]

@@RenegadeY Isn't Platinum always constrained by time and Money?

[@TheSergio1021]

​@@diegomedina9637 having several years of extra failed platinum games... I dont know.

[@garrettcarter2959]

"Adventure Time itself is about optimism and being happy" Dude, I've seen the show. That's a lie.

[@ronyncato7206]

"B-but it's Adventure Time..." -Liam I cannot handle his genetic fallacy here. And Liam honestly doesn't think Level Design takes time and effort? I can't even...

[@tailedgates9]

Well, Adventure Time is a mixed bag. There are episodes about goofy shit but the next few will be existential. Lol

[@NamesSmeg]

​@@ronyncato7206Try designing a track in ATV Off Road Fury. Shits rough, and we already have the textures and shapes. Fuck Liam on this. Dark Souls is basically just a giant level. And it's nearly immaculate. Jak and Daxter, is just a giant level, and just look at it.

[@nrdzilla]

Matt yelling is always fun, too bad the cost is his frustration.

[@zgSH4DOW]

If they know they can't make the game well, don't make it. It's not profitable; it's an arbitrary checklist someone marks off.

[@Manny-Prime]

I agree but I do believe that some companies make big mistakes once in a while. Way Forward also made Shantae and the Pirates Curse and that game was pretty spectacular in my opinion

[@patrickloureiro1403]

Yeah but that's kinda hard when you're in a contract with a publisher, especially a shitty publisher.

[@SeanBarkerNegaScott128]

Yeah, a small developer can totally afford to turn down a massive contract that will guarantee a ton of sales based on brand recognition alone. WayForward took the job because they needed the income to fund other projects like Shantae and Mighty Switch Force. It was a "one for you, one for me" situation. When they work on their own projects, they have all the time in the world to polish it and make it great. When they work with a good publisher, they can polish it and make it great. When they work with a shitty publisher that sets bad deadlines, they can't polish it and make it great. They have to settle for a passable or okay game instead of a great game, cash the paycheck, and hope the next game they make turns out better. That's how this shit works.

[@ronyncato7206]

What do Liam and Woolie not understand about the phrase "CONSTRAINED BY TIME AND MONEY"? Don't they work in the industry? Man this is frustrating for no good reason :P

[@Khotgor]

Yeah no. They were just beta testers. They were quite Beta.

[@ronyncato7206]

QA testers. Ergo, working in the industry

[@Khotgor]

One step above Beta Tester. Still means nothing. They never developed nor published games. This can be seen simply by listening to Woolie n' Liam day after day. Their opinions within the gaming industry are usually subpar, if not shittier, than Pat n' even Matt. Quote this n' Mighty Number 9.

[@zgSH4DOW]

The entire indie games scene proves you fucking wrong They have an entire studio with professionals no less, corporate funding, and a world/characters that already exist. A "lack of time" is not an excuse for incompetency and a failure to create in a creative endeavor

[@zgSH4DOW]

I know this dumb fucking show was popular in 2017, and that's exactly why you're goosestepping to AT's rhythm

[@SadfaicMusic]

Man, I forgot how heated up the guys used to get back in the day.

[@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat]

My second favourite moments

[@tailedgates9]

At first I wasn't getting Pat's point, I thought he was being the usual negative nancy, but I think what he's saying is if a certain publisher, who is known for having bad business practices, is publishing a game with a license that people cherish, the expectations should be low. That is true in a lot of cases, because once a company, writer or whoever has built a rep for him or herself as being incompetent, the expectations for them actually coming out with something competent is very low. That said, I don't think a good Adventure Time game would NEVER come out, that's being a little too negative. But if it's under a certain hand then yeah, can't expect much.

[@TheChatterbox1991]

Can you make one of these for the argument about Nintendo Fighting Game Support for Smash from Podcast 28 or so?

[@magnumbadguy9354]

The adventure time game should've been breath of the wild

[@tailedgates9]

Oh my god!! I just had a boner from that idea. Lol

[@diegomedina9637]

Yeah... Nobody is going to try to develop that.

[@justinbelluardo4910]

I understand where woolie and Liam are coming from, this is something we love and it's being made into game so we have high hopes and expectations because we want it to be the best it can possibly be, but I side more with mat and pat that you should keep more realistic expectations based on who's making it and the restraints with time and money

[@rudedude7874]

Damn I actually like Explore the dungeon because I don’t know

[@FFGamer077]

OMFG someone actually posted this!! Hell yea!! Can you upload the Smash at EVO Argument on Podcast 27?

[@TheShockVox]

TechGamer I’ve been FUCKING LOOKING FOR THAT FOR YEARS. is that the one where Liam is a salty sally and devil advocating Nintendo

[@KeeBlade]

I remember being genuinely freaked out at how heated this got when I first listened.

[@MrDmoney156]

someone should make a Adventure Time vs Dragonball Z in the style of Marvel vs Capcom 1 or 2

[@MarlonMacielBrando]

Am I the only imbecile that liked this game? Sure, it wasn't The Binding of Isaac, but still!

[@TheShockVox]

Everyone is wrong

[@turboyabo864]

i feel a little racist for all was thinking lady voice was just moon speak because i never really paid attention to korean also no one else speak Korean in advenutre time besides jake . edited aslo i never expect them to pull that in american cartoon

[@890gig]

But she's Korean, that's a part of her character. How is that racist?

[@turboyabo864]

890gig because every time i hear her ,i go "woooow what the hell is this techno moon speak ,why don't they just actual do english instead" i didn't really caring for her character or for what ever reason why she was speaking in Korean when her parents don't speak it

[@890gig]

nemsis turboverdirve Then how about you Stop thinking that then, cause That is actually a bit racist. Are you the type of person that just walks down the street to tell Carlos to speak English?

[@turboyabo864]

890gig no never

[@890gig]

nemsis turboverdirve That's because Carlos is off building the Wall.

[@PR0MAN01]

The rare time Pat was right. This was before Crazy Talk awakened.

[@pepegon-zals7606]

So Pat can think in real world terms in this argument. Game dev has no time and money, so product is doomed to mediocrity. Got it. But for the new Smash argument, fuck contracts, laws, predetermined dates, preorder bonus characters, and common fucking sense. Gimme my game now cause it's finished. Also piracy isn't stealing and is the better consumer option in this case, but he's NOT advocating piracy. And Nintendo is to blame for the leakers actions and spoilers, not the leakers themselves, because they won't release the game when it's finished. I love Pat, but he really is self-absorbed in some ways. Yoshikage Pat strikes again!

[@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat]

Indeed, pirating IS awesome. But I’m not gonna *tell* you to

[@GigachadVTuberEnjoyer]

Back before adventure time was trash

[@doggomcpuppers4784]

Pats such a salty babby...

[@TheShockVox]

Doggo McPuppers funny enough he was the least salty of the 4.

[@chiyo-chanholocaust8143]

Wow I wildly disagree with Pat and Mat here, who gives a shit about time constrains and budget we shouldn't accept garbage, so Sonic 06 is okay since they had to rush it to meet Sonic's aniversary and port it to every platform?

[@ResidentMegamanX94]

Chio Chan Genocide but that game had plenty of budget and was plagued by wayyyyyyy more problems than time constraints

[@Khotgor]

If you don't accept garbage, don't accept Sonic 06. Don't buy it. Problem solved. Tell them 'better make a better one next time', n' not waste your money.

[@ronyncato7206]

Acceptance isn't the problem. Being surprised is the problem.

[@Khotgor]

They shouldn't be surprised in the first place either. Shitty Developers/Publishers usually make shitty games.

[@MahoganyVinceArchive]

They didn't accept garbage, though. It reviewed poorly and sold poorly. That's why the Adventure Time games that came after were at least decent, they realized "Hey, maybe we shouldn't just assume they'll accept z-tier garbage"

[@zeterzero4356]

I'm with Wools and Liam here even if only because I'm on the side of optimism over pessimism.

[@seraphiim444]

But they're actually just straight up wrong.

[@Gungho73]

@@seraphiim444 Yeah seriously.

[@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat]

Optimism is often confused with magical thinking

[@zgSH4DOW]

Wow, indie games smashed the fuck out of Matt and Pat's argument They have even less of an excuse being an actual studio