THE LAST OF US EPISODE 9 REACTION | 1x9 "Look For The Light" | Finale

[@foulrot]

I love that they didn't play Joel's rampage up to be this triumphant thing, they keep it somber and subdued.

[@bevtsen]

Firstly, so glad to hear that Julia you are doing well. Health first, everything else second. This reaction was one that I was very much looking forward to seeing. Bonus points for matching up the t shirts 😂😂

[@testfire3000]

Yeah! They couldn't re-create the wall but they got the shirts right.

[@Sloofdme]

Welcome back guys. So glad Julia is doing ok. I'm writing this before watching the reaction. Looking forward to this one. 😊

[@R989D]

16:31 now anyone tell me Bella isn’t an amazing actress, this instant here. She hardly even moved an eyebrow and yet that look spoke a 1000 words. There was no misunderstanding her feeling to what Joel said. The unspoken love in that moment was brilliant.❤

[@Denashi]

Ok, I know this show can be intense, but send-you-to-the-hospital-intense??? Damn! 😮 Glad you're feeling better!

[@FandomZone]

Unfortunately we can’t blame the episode for what happened. But she’s recovering well 🙂

[@mitchmatt6002]

Loved your reactions to this show, and I'm glad Julia's feeling better now! Agree completely that this show has been an emotional, well-executed adaptation, and that each episode has been an opportunity to discuss the difficult choices made by the characters, and wonder what we would do in those situations! Divisive, dramatic and damn good TV!

[@evanbaracuda]

Good to see you back guys 👍🏻

[@TimmyJEuchida]

The nurse in the back of the surgery prep room was Laura Bailey (Vex'ahlia). Glad to see you're doing ok now Julia

[@LaCheeserie]

Happy that Julia is better! Priorities! And at least Trent didn’t have to do a smash and grab to discharge you from the hospital And as usual love your insights and reactions. You guys are a joy

[@ginster458]

Glad to see you back! Btw in case you didn't notice- the nurse who stood behind Ellie's head is Laura Bailey! She voiced the nurse in the game too ;) Also regarding the viability of a possible vaccine, it's not just would it work and could they replicate it, it's also how do you produce and distribute it? I also feel like their decision was SUPER rushed, I mean they have ONE person that is immune and instead of actually taking weeks to research, to do labs etc, they just want to cut her open and kill her immediately. Anything goes wrong and they just erradicated their one chance. Although, who knows, enough people learn immunity was created by being infected throught the umbilical cord in the very last minute, who knows what kind of laboratories people will build... Not to say that Joel was totally in the right here, but I feel like the Fireflies were super incompetent in the way they went about saving the world. Maybe they really should've stuck to graffity, they were pretty good at that

[@Ozai75]

Glad you're feeling better! And a lot of people like to "excuse" the Fireflies for what they were doing, but a couple of things stand out in this episode that make them (IMO) worse than Joel. A.) They weren't sure it was going to work. "The doctor *thinks* ..." Not good enough if you're going to sacrifice the life of a young girl. B.) They didn't tell her before hand. IE they (like Joel) gave her *no choice* in the matter. Now while this might seem to be even-stevens with what Joel did it hides a far more nefarious plot by the Fireflies. They were *never going to ask her for her consent* They could have waited until Joel woke up, explained it to both he and Ellie and then let her decide/convince Joel. But the Fireflies had already made up their minds that Ellie was *going* through the surgery and they would not have taken NO for an answer. To me, despite what they were doing was for "The Greater Good" It's still the old adage "The Road to Hell is paved with Good Intentions." At least Joel's reaction was emotional and fitting for someone in his situation. The Fireflies, despite what Marlene claimed, were the ones to truly treat Ellie as 'cargo.'

[@denilsondesouzabarbosa9870]

hello I'm from Brazil! I miss you guys in the last few episodes of The Last of Us. a kiss!

[@iamgroot2654]

Glad to see your reactions to all the new trailers. So happy Julia is feeling better. 🙂

[@catindigo9907]

I'm so glad your better, I really appreciate you guys ❤.

[@catindigo9907]

So now about the episode. So here's how I see it. They kill Ellie, because they Might be able to make a cure, for which they don't have a distribution network, if it works? No wonder goes all The Contractor on them and saves his loved one. The cure is all chancy.

[@testfire3000]

@@catindigo9907 Way too chancy. #teamJoel

[@alexflores7652]

I laughed so hard when they finally ended up in Salt Lake City. The highway interchange signage I know so well because I have traveled it so many times while I was stationed there from 1998-2001 and when then I had to do inventories of stores for my job. The baseball they were in is called The Buzz Baseball Field. The Buzz is the minor league team in Salt Lake City and the Graffias would be from the local area zoo called Hogle Zoo.

[@GiantsJets718]

I’m glad Julie is doing OK! I was wondering where you guys were

[@paramitch]

I'm so glad Julia is all right -- that sounds terrifying! So happy to see you both well and okay, and reacting to this video. As always, loved your thoughtful reactions and commentary. Looking forward to your next show reactions -- meanwhile, Julia, please do continue to rest up and feel better!

[@auntvesuvi3872]

Thanks, Trent! Thanks and I'm glad you seem recovered from your medical emergency, Julia! 🧟‍♀ #FandomZone #TheLastOfUs #TLOU #TheLastOfUsHBO

[@undeenwrites]

Just so glad you're doing better! The late reactions are like a lovely little unexpected gift from you two, so no harm done. Most important thing is that you are OK. Can't lose my fave reaction couple! 🤗😍😘

[@Reece_Hart]

Like everyone else has been saying incredibly happy to see that Julia is doing well after the health scare.

[@PCallahanPhilly]

Thanks! I enjoyed this reaction series very much.

[@TerryYelmene]

My Goodness... Please take care of yourself (es)! Very good reaction and brilliant commentary afterward. Thank You!

[@G1Transformed]

Welcome back to reacting @Fandom Zone! Happy to see that Julia is well too =) 31:59 I always felt that Joel lied to protect Ellie from herself, her survivor's guilt. At the start of the journey, before reaching Bill and Frank's place, just after Tess died, Ellie tells Joel not to blame her for Tess' death. Fast forward to now and you see Ellie blaming herself for Tess' death along with Riley's, Sam's and Henry's. Ellie feels that she owes them, particularly Sam--she gave him hope ='( But where did Ellie get the idea in her head that her blood was medicine? I don't think she came up with that on her own. She mentioned several times that she'd give her blood to Firefly doctors and participate in tests until a vaccine was made. She didn't come up with this on her own, this is the lie she's been fed. This is what Marlene told Ellie to get her to go along with what she wanted Ellie to do. Ellie didn't want to be with the Fireflies, remember? They held her prisoner for three weeks and she demanded that they let her go every chance she got. Even when she sat down with Marlene she asked Marlene to let her go and Marlene made it clear that Ellie would never be going home. Rather than having a prisoner trying to plot their escape every step of the way, Marlene made Ellie feel important and fed her a lie that made her feel like a hero, one that Ellie bought hook, line and sinker. Marlene convinced Ellie so much that she honest believed that it would be as easy as putting her blood in to people to cure them, which explains why she did what she did with Sam. Marlene might not have known that Ellie would have to die, but she certainly knew that death was on the table. Ellie was Marlene's last chance to turn a losing war around. The Fireflies had been losing favor with the people and never gained any ground with FEDRA. They needed a game changer and Ellie was it, she was their last chance to right their ship. The Fireflies couldn't afford to lose Ellie, and that's why they lied to her and never gave her a chance to consent to their procedure. The irony of all this is had they taken Joel to see Ellie and let them talk it out like he wanted, Ellie very likely would have agreed to the procedure. The weight of the journey was weighing on her hard, and she looked as though she was ready to throw in the towel. Everyone that she cared about, save for Joel was gone. She was the last one left, and she was starting to believe that her fear was coming true, that'd she'd really be alone and that scared her. If others could be like her, no one would ever have to be alone, and she likely would have wanted that for everyone else. Ellie was vulnerable to manipulation. Marlene was too desperate and too pressed for time to risk everything on asking Ellie what she wanted that she couldn't be bothered with taking that chance, risking the very livelihood of the Fireflies. Joel couldn't lose another daughter, sure, but he was only anxious when he heard that Ellie would be going under. That quickly turned to fear and anger when he learned that Marlene didn't tell Ellie the truth. It's a shame that Joel didn't tell Ellie the truth, but I still feel that he did what he did to protect Ellie from herself. She might have sought out other doctors and attempted to do the same thing with them. He needed to kill the very notion of a cure, lead her to believe that it was a futile dream. If she accepts that no cure is coming, she's forced to move on with her life and that's all Joel once. He wants Ellie to live beyond her 14 years, something Sarah never got to do. Even if Ellie learns of Joel's lie and makes efforts to move away from him, I think Joel would be okay with that. He'd at least know that she lived and that she's okay. Joel's gift to Ellie is that she'll be able to decide at a later date whether to give herself to science, after she's lived a life, when she can make an informed decision. Is humanity worth saving? Joel made a pretty good point when he told Ellie that they've only came across bad things during their journey and he warned her early on that people were worse than Infected, and that proved to be true, time an time again. The only moment of quiet they encountered was in Jackson Hole, which was thriving. I don't know about you, but David and his flock seemed to be an allegory for Marlene and the Fireflies. They even have similar sound mottos that you can mix and match and still have a similar meaning. Both where wolves in sheep's skin. They were going to take what they wanted from Ellie, consent be damned! We know what Ellie did to David once she learned the truth. What would she have done to Marlene had she found out she had been lied to? David at least gave her the option to join him, but she saw through his BS. Marlene was just a better manipulator as we saw in Riley's story and Ellie's journey. Marlene made both girls believe that the Fireflies were fighting the good fight, because they wanted to return the power to the people...but why didn't the people support the Fireflies? Why did the people choose FEDRA over them? We did hear stories of one bad bunch of Fireflies, but that was the case in Boston, Atlanta or Pittsburg. In fact, David even told us in his story that the Pittsburg QZ fell because 17 Fireflies infiltrated FEDRA and destroyed it, leaving the people to fend for themselves. The Fireflies didn't save anyone! Why should anyone believe that these people would ever give FEDRA or anyone supporting FEDRA a cure? They wouldn't. They'd use any cure they had for power, power over everyone else. The Fireflies are terrorist. They blew up a quarter of a block nearly killing Tess and Robert in the first episode with a pipe bomb that was likely made by Riley...using them in the very way Ellie told Riley they would. The Fireflies didn't care because the people in that area weren't with them. Anyway, there are a lot of shades of gray here, but I agree more with what Joel did than anyone else. All because his way gives room for consent, the very thing Marlene and the Fireflies took from Ellie. Everyone at that hospital knew why they were there that day and they all agreed with what was going to happen. They all agreed that it was okay to kill someone immune to infections in hopes of possibly making them immune too in the unforeseeable future. Jerks!

[@TdScar]

They confirmed the cure would’ve worked but still, from the fireflies point of view they didn’t know for sure. It would’ve been a very welcome surprise when they found out it worked but they were still willing to sacrifice this girl against her will on a hope

[@antipodean1233]

Naughty dog have repeatedly said the cure would have worked that's the ethical point that drives the story...and Ellie would have absolutely volunteered but no one gave her the choice.. the fireflies didn't lie to Ellie she was unconscious from the moment they were captured.. ahhh consequences of actions.. roll on season 2...

[@toukie]

Julia, I am glad you are better! I don'tknow why, but the scene with the birth DESTROYED me. When she said "You f*cking tell 'em, Ellie" made me start sobbing, and then she tells the baby "It's ok, I got you", which are the exact same words Joel told her last episode. So the two people who meant the most to her told her the exact same thing. I don't know why but it really got to me.

[@testfire3000]

I am so glad to see you both back again! Julia! I know a hospital stay is *never* fun, glad you are doing well. Hey Trent, what is that comic above your shoulder? The one above the two Batman comics? I don't recognize that. This was a terrific episode. I never played the game although I have watched a playthrough of it while keeping up with the series. I really liked how morally gray everything is. There was no right choice, especially since the Fireflies didn't know if killing Ellie would really result in any kind of useful medicine. They just seemed way too rushed. I love how at the end you can see in Ellie's eyes that she knows Joel is lying to her, and her "Okay" is her accepting that change in their relationship.

[@FandomZone]

It’s a new comic from Mark Millar & Frank Quietly called Ambassadors. It’s a 6 issue series, which just released issue 2 a week ago. It’s a really cool concept of a billionaire gifting superpowers to just 6 people in the world and the problems that causes at a political and social level

[@testfire3000]

@@FandomZone Excellent! Sounds like a great time to check it out. Stay well and keep it nerdy!

[@daven4297]

A real moral roller coaster. Marlene was able to sacrifice the life of someone who was in some way close to her. Joel sacrificed humanity for selfish reasons. He couldn't imagine experiencing the loss of his "own daughter" again. Nothing else mattered to him. Throughout this story told, what is also interesting is the fact that everyone glorifies the murders that Joel commits while protecting Ellie and also everyone condemns others who try to kill Joel and Ellie. The truth is that Joel protects his group, just as Tommy and Maria protect theirs, even David and Kathleen protect their groups... Each of these groups does exactly what Joel does for Ellie. He protects his own people. And you can't blame them for that. They did exactly what Joel did to protect Tommy or Ellie. They protected their own "herd" from outside predators. Getting off topic a bit, I'm reminded of Agent Smith's statement to Morpheus in the movie The Matrix. Our species is not mammals. We are behaving like a virus. We conquer some territory, occupy it, and then attack another. That's what we did in our history and that's what viruses do. We are the biggest parasite in the world and as my friend once said: "Let's praise war - the only hygiene in the world". At this point I come to one very disturbing conclusion. If such or a similar pandemic ever happens, the biggest enemy will not be a virus, a zombie or something like that. The biggest enemy will be the other person, other group, other human. Every group and every person, because their goal will be only to save their own people. Marlene was the only one willing to sacrifice Ellie, whom she raised as a daughter, for the good of humanity. Ashley Johnson did a great job creating the character of Ellie in the game. And the show also created Ellie as her mother giving birth to her... Great symbolism showing that it all started with Ashley... Very clever. And the last and most important question. Was Elli immune because her mother was bitten before the umbilical cord was cut, or because the umbilical cord was cut with the knife she had used to stab an infected person moments earlier? By the way, you know that Ashley starred with Mel Gibson in the movie "What Women Want" in 2000? Still a teenager. A bit off-topic. I've never played the game. I saw a Polish KZbinr's game play, who added an extra atmosphere to the game with his voice. Through that game play I fell in love with the title. My teenage daughter (actually she was a few years younger than Ellie at the time) also fell in love with it. ). The game version was of course with Polish dubbing, which I have to say is at least as good as the original. The Polish voice actors who voiced Ellie and Joel did a great, great job. They really did it brilliantly, especially now that I listen to the original, the more I think that the Polish actors did an amazing job. The sadder news was that on August 1, 2024, the actor who lent his voice to Joel in the Polish version of the game died. He was 54 years old (RIP Krzysztof Banaszyk).

[@daven4297]

I also noticed how tightly you squeeze your partner's hand. It's charming and beautiful, because it shows how much she is worth to you... May you also be able to find these traits in yourselves in the post-apocalyptic world.

[@Mickey911-o3j]

The Last Of Us TV show part 2 Will Be Filmed in Canada in Vancouver this Time and there be 2 Seasons with Big Changes To The Story in The Last Of Us Part 2 Will Start filming at the end of the year

[@rx7dude2006]

Not going to be big changes.

[@phoenixrising8231]

​@@rx7dude2006 big changes in that instead of flashbacks. Many of them will be actually scenes between Joel and Ellie. Joel will probably last the whole season. They will have to develop Abby and her crew' characters. Something they didn't do in the game.

[@rx7dude2006]

@@phoenixrising8231 They absolutely developed Abby in the game!

[@system0fadowner251]

​​​@@rx7dude2006 yes, AFTER a major moment. I think the point alot of people criticize is that that happens before shes developed and I think it'll improve the story majorly if they give us that development before those events

[@rx7dude2006]

@@system0fadowner251 No the point was to learn to understand her after the major event, that way you are completely against her 100 percent at first and then come to understand her motives.

[@mholly1389]

It really adds to the weight of sam and henry's story when joel was asking for that gun, when he says how he got the scar. As for the cure theory, the more i think about it, the more irresponsible i think it is. If it was a chemical, they could probably synthesise it without needing to take it out of the body, but even if they did, they have to do so much r&d to make sure it actually works and doesn't just make more infected, you would have to test to see if it works, and you would probably have to get a booster every so often to keep it going. Production would be a massive undertaking with basically no fully functional laboratories. ability to distribute it would be so limited if there is any special handling required. Its not my comment but based on how covid impacted society and how FEDRA is portrayed and even the fireflies, im sure there would be a lot of anti vaxxers to deal with.

[@Glisern]

There is one slight plot hole that I find difficult here. How did they put Ellie under, you know? Was she first drugged in her food so she just thinks she got sleepy? Or was she attacked with a needle and was terrified/fighting for a few seconds? One could explain the confusion/not knowing. The other I would imagine would make Ellie question why.. It's a bit too complicated a thought process to do in a youtube comment.

[@testfire3000]

They probably lied to her. "You will feel a little pinprick as we take some blood..."

[@toukie]

one thing I had an issue with when I first played the game was that it was implied that Marlene had looked over Ellie her entire life. That there was a bond there. Ellie was Marlene's BEST FRIEND'S child. And the reason why it resonated so much with me was that I raised my best friend's son with her. He's my son just as much as he is hers. And I couldn't phantom just handing him over like 'here, kill him', even if it was to save humanity. When I'm in the dark, he is the light I look for. He has been the love of my life and f*ck humanity if I would have to willingly sacrifice him. THAT BEING SAID, however, I told myself I wouldn't be able to do what Joel did, because the life of every single one of these people he killed was worth just as much as my son's life. They were loved by someone, someone was going to mourn them just as much as Joel mourned Sarah. So I wrestled with the fact that I would probably not be able to kill all those people to save just one life. That was when I played the game back in 2016. And then, in 2020, my son got sick. Right before Covid happened, we learned he had cancer. My son was then a 26 year old man, not a child anymore, but I would have done anything, went anywhere, killed any m*therfucker that stood in my way (to quote Bill) if doing so would've saved his life. Luckily, he responded to treatment, and he is still with me, he's still my 6'1, 300 pounds baby boy. But still, in that moment, that scary, terrifying, completely overwhelming and yet numbing second of understanding I might lose him, I would've done anything to save him. This story is so good at showing the ambiguity in people. Just because you do bad guys thing don't mean you're a bad guy... And Everybody can become the villain in someone else's story. Great reaction to this series, I binged watched it since yesterdday. Now I will go and check the rest of your videos

[@mjdaniel8710]

I do not blame Joel for taking Ellie out of there, that treatment sounded like terrible medicine, they did not show they knew it would even work

[@mi-kv3vm]

Neil Druckmann confirmed that the cure was viable and that Joel fucked mankind. I don't know why people validate Joel's decision based on that fallacy. We understand why he did it, he still knowingly and selfishly doomed mankind.

[@keithbird8910]

Joel a stone cold killing machine.

[@PCallahanPhilly]

And even if they created the cure how would they distribute it?

[@bestistmate]

[@JRush374]

Joel kept stopping to test their reactions. Just like fighters do with opponents. Do the same jab a few times and watch how they react. Do it again and respond accordingly.

[@lynetteoliva1256]

This was the moral dilemma episode just like in the game. I do kind of side w/Joel because the Fireflies never gave Ellie a choice. Don't know if u know this, but Ashley Johnson was a series regular on the TV show BLIND SPOT, where she portrays an FBI forensics expert. It was a good series. Hmm, favorite episodes was Long, Long Time aka The story of Bill & Frank. I am a sucker for a good love story even in a post-apocalyptic setting.😊 I had 2 favorite episodes w/Infected, Episode 1 & Episode 5 w/the horde of Infected coming out of the ground. The child Clicker was extra creepy. The episode I hated because of how angry it made me & completely grossed out was Episode 8(w/David) I saw him as a pedophile in the game & even more so in the series, plus I dislike anything w/cannibalism. That's part of the reason I haven't seen the series YELLOWJACKETS or HANNIBAL. Human beings eating other human beings makes my stomach turn. Anyway, I loved this series as a whole & can't wait to see what Season 2 will have in store for us. I don't know if it's true, but I heard that the 2nd game might be broken up into 2 Seasons. We'll see. I have really enjoyed your reactions & looking forward to seeing some more from u guys.😊

[@Cabur_Skirata]

I've always loved the ending of The Last of Us. If I had been in Joel's position I can't say I'd have done differently. Humanity had destroyed itself, the fungus had merely given it an excuse to reveal its true nature. So, say Ellie's brain was able to find a cure, who'd distribute it? The military faction that ruled as an autocracy? The raiders who'd be trying to steal it for themselves? No, humanity was beyond saving. Who wasn't beyond saving was the girl that had rekindled his desire to live life to the fullest again.

[@evacombs9720]

I don't know the story going forward, but it's quite obvious what will happen at Tommy's because Marie and Tommy are right about Joel, and Joel can't exist with a settlement or group of people because he really doesn't care what happens to others and in order to live with others (unrelated to yourself), you have to. They will kick them out or Joel (and likely Ellie) will leave, or both. Joel doesn't get to have that safety or comfort by his choice.

[@TomTomson81]

My opinion it's a long one. 😁 No one has to share or read it. Maria said to Ellie: "Be careful who you put your faith in. The only people who can betray us are the one we trust." That's what Joel is doing here. Any parent would try the same and so would I (but I wouldn't have lied), but Joel is not Ellie's father. He only considers himself to be so, but this is not based on reciprocity. For Ellie, Joel is her closest and only friend, but at eye level. And neither of them would change that. Ellie wouldn't limit her autonomy and independence and Joel wouldn't expect that from her. And then there would no longer be a relationship on the same level. In this respect, they have never called their relationship as father and daughter. Ellie also doesn't seem to like the fact that Joel constantly compares her to his daughter. This clearly comes through in addition to her depression. In this respect, he never has the right to do what he has done, NOR DOES MARLENE. But both know the answer Ellie would give. Why did Joel lie to Ellie in the end? Because he actually knew better and still acted out of selfishness. The hole Sarah has left in his heart has been filled by Ellie and at no cost he gives that back. Regardless of Ellie and the rest of the world. Marlene, on the other hand, did not tell Ellie what they would do with her so as not to scare her unnecessarily. Marlene doesn't need Ellie's consent either, she would do it against Ellie's will for the world. Therefore, the argument that many bring that Marlene would be afraid Ellie would say "no" is nonsens. This is not decisive for her. Marlene is simply doing the same thing as the Fedra officer in episode 1 did with the infected boy. She also says this in this sense. We didn't tell her anything, she won't be feel fear. Ellie knows that Joel is lying. Nevertheless, she chooses him over the lies. He means the world to her and all she has is him. Her greatest fear of ending up alone certainly plays a role. She means just as much to Joel. They love each other and would do anything for each other. Or is it rather dependency. An important difference to the game is the feeling you had when you freed Ellie. In the game, on the way to Ellie, you felt like a hero saving your daughter. Here in the series it becomes clear that Joel is not a hero. Supported by the score. Joel is the one who wipes everyone out and extinguishes the hope of saving humanity. Now there is no longer a resistance movement. He killed all the Fireflies. This means not only no cure, but also no more resistance against Fedra. So they can continue to starve and hang people in the future. I think it's good how this is presented here. How Joel is shown as he was for 20 years. Ruthless, unscrupulous, cold-blooded. And if for 20 years he had the reason to be like this so that his brother and Tess could survive, this is now replaced by selfishness. He has rolled through the hospital like a bulldozer. And that Ellie would have wanted this operation is not a question, after what she experienced and had to do. This was her chosen destiny after losing so many people to the fungus. She made a decision on the day Marlene told her about her imunity. Reinforced by the deaths of Riley and all after her. The first and only decision Ellie could ever make about her life. So far, others have always been determined over her live. Joel took that away from her. And not only that, he took away everything she fought for and what she went through. 3 weeks after Riley's death, which she had to cause, Marlene has given her a meaning that could have saved all humanity. Joel gave her a life with survivor guilt multiplied by all humanity. She has to live with the fact that all the people who died for her died for nothing. Marlene has another thing in common with Ellie. Ellie had to kill her friend and for her it must all have some value. The same goes for Marlene. She had to kill her best friend and for both applies it must not have been in vain. Both lost their friends to the fungus, both had to end their lives. So yes, Marlene understands Ellie very well and she knows what Ellie would have wanted. Joel knows that too. The argument Ellie is still a child and cannot make this decision is not. Ellie hasn't been a child in her head for a long time. She has made mature decisions several times. The last of these was to stand against Joel and go on with a very grown-up reason. She is the only one who can and should make this decision about her life. Nobody needs to come with the reason that it was not certain that the operation would succeed and that a serum could be produced. Everyone involved believed in it, including Joel. The motives of the characters counts. People like to invent ways that the show or game didn't bring in to justify Joel's actions. In fact, the only thing Joel said was "find someone else". So if it were up to him, another child could die instead of Ellie. Joel has accepted that Ellie brings the cure to the world as a fact. And even if there were other immunes out there, Joel also killed probably the only brain surgeon with that kind of knowledge who could have done such an operation. That was a decision he was not allowed to make for Ellie. No matter if he feels that way, he is not her father. And because Joel knows all this, he ends up lying to Ellie. And Ellie already knows at the moment that he is lying, when she asks for Marlene and he says nothing. She got the same answer when she asked if Joel had killed innocent people. He lies so that he can continue to be a Daddy without consequences for himself. So he takes another decision away from Ellie. Namely, whether she still wants to continue to be connected to him amicably, trustingly. But what is really shitty is that he interrupts Ellie when she wants to say him how she feels, and then gives her a piece of advice that he himself has just not followed. She wants to open up to him for the first time ever, share all the burden on her with him and he interrupts her in order to be able to justify his actions for himself. Regardless, I would like to point out a very interesting conversation that took place in the pilot episode between Tommy, Joel and Sarah. This was about love and dependence. Tommy comes into the kitchen and greets Joel and Sarah with a not so nice word. Sarah to Joel: "Oooh, he loves you" Joel: "He is dependent on me. It's not the same." Sarah: "I think it's the same" I think this conversation is very interesting in connection with the dynamic between Joel and Ellie. To what extent is this love. To what extent is it dependence. To what extent do the two things go together? And are Joel and Ellie even on the same page when it comes to that? Or confuse both love with dependence. Well, the authors of the game had not thought of a continuation of the game at that time. That's the advantage of the series. They can prepare much better for the upcoming season and thus make everything that comes in part 2 more comprehensible for everyone. This was an excellent but unfortunately much too short episode. The whole series was just great. I'm looking forward to the second season. Ellie not only has the knife from her mother, but also the jacket she lay in as a baby. The giraffe was real. Her name is Nabo or Nobu. Something like that. Ashley Johnson (OG Ellie) played Elli's mother. Laura Bailey the voice actor of Abby from TLOU2 was one of the assistant doctors. It has been confirmed that season 2 and 3 are ordered and both should include part 2 of the game. But with big changes. Which unfortunately makes me very skeptical when this change affects a certain major event. I think part 2 is the perfect game as a perfect sequel to the events of part 1. If this event is omitted, it will ruin the entire feeling. Then this would no longer be part 2 if the basis for it is taken away. I've played both games together 20 times and I love them. I love this series. The best I've seen in a long time. I love Joel and Ellie. I feel the need to play again now with the knowledge of what is now added by the series.

[@Dark__Thoughts]

Joel didn't do it because of it being vague, in fact he himself said if Marlene thinks they can do it then they can, and Marlene also made it even clearer in the show that they would in fact had made a cure. It was a selfish act, as he did it for himself, because he didn't want to lose another daughter, which Ellie now became more of a surrogate Sarah rather than being her own. He's just feeding further into her identity crisis, especially by taking away that one thing she thought was her purpose and meaning. Bill and Frank are actually a very good example of how humans are NOT thriving. Because before they started trading with Joel and Tess, his fence and other things would have degraded over time, and they would not have the medicine needed for Frank either. It shows that humans are kind of fucked if they don't come together, and they can't come together because of how the world is, and that is something that Ellie could have changed. That's the motivation of the Fireflies and their decision to sacrifice Ellie. For them it is justified because this would not just give current generations a chance, but humankind as a whole, with all its future generations to come. Joel potentially doomed humankind here, which is now just going to continue to further degrade into the dark ages. Every person lost is also knowledge lost. Even Jackson which looks like it is thriving will break down. The turbines will break, the cabling will corrode, the dam itself will eventually erode. They thrive because they had the opportunity to be able to salvage a lot of what humanity was able to leave them after the fall, but that's not an endless supply. Meanwhile, infected will further cull the populace down to an absolute minimum, even more so when people have weaker defenses & weapons due to degradation. It's quite possible that humankind even goes extinct and that's what the Fireflies wanted to prevent. All this loss, just like the loss Ellie experienced, as well as her trauma, was a consequence of this world they are living in. Curious how well you two as Joel apologists will take Part 2. 🏌

[@jaylaedits1867]

Stop making it seem like people aren’t allowed to enjoy Joel and Ellie’s relationship even despite his selfish decision.

[@MrPicklerwoof]

Marlene chose to murder Ellie without giving her a choice, which left Joel no choice but to prevent that happening. I don't think it even got close to the stage of Joel debating and weighing up the future of mankind, etc. He was just responding automatically after that point in full father-protection mode. Marlene screwed up basically. They were unethical, inhumane towards Ellie and this set off the whole chain of events that followed. It's not even about being a 'Joel apologist', it's just accepting that you will always protect the ones you love, at any cost.

[@gailseatonhumbert]

I am team Joel and international medical ethics are on my side. Nobody gets killed in medical experiments for others!

[@Dark__Thoughts]

@@MrPicklerwoof Joel also did not give her a choice, he even murdered the doctor, which might as well is one if not the last expert on this topic that could've made a cure. And let's not act like if they asked her, which she would've agreed to, that Joel would have done any different. He still would've stopped it, because the only other option was him losing his child again and consequently killing himself. And yes, it is being a Joel apologist, because he did it for selfish reasons, knowing full well what Ellie would have wanted. This fact has absolutely nothing to do with Marlene or the Fireflies decision. This was Ellie's fate, and he took this from her.

[@Dark__Thoughts]

@@gailseatonhumbert And I'm team Ellie. International medical ethics don't exist in this world. This is post apocalypse. You act like your ethics apply there, but they don't. You're speaking out of a privileged position of where the world isn't complete shit, and our world is just as much built on corpses, so please stop this hypocritical nonsense.

[@analmf1210]

And that's why i don't like Marlene, she is using a girl with survivor's guilt, vulnerable and ultimately a kid that doesn't know about life, for the probability of a cure because is not even a certainty. At the doesn't matter for me as a parent, her purpose. So many Marlenes in its life which purpose is to convince the weak, Raley, Tommy (weak mind), Ellie. She is a girl, naive, optimistic for the future after that, why anybody expect a 14 year old make that kind of decision?I just hope next season, Ellie since she knows better about life, I hope she is not that harsh, sometimes unreasonable to me, with Joel, like in te game, for me that was too much, specially for a 19 year old with different experiences now.