SWTOR: Lord Scourge speaks of Revan and the Exile (compilation)

[@Trayusstudent1]

Kreia would spin, cause storms, and throw shit out her Trayus core if she found out the Exile was killed by a betrayal..

[@zeebooboo9663]

The Exile is a lot stronger than people realize. She is the death of the Force.

[@goldengoose6950]

Technically Kreia saw her death coming. She hints at the end of KOTOR 2 how "There must always be a Darth Traya. A lord of betrayals. Especially in the times to come." Scourge fulfilled the role as the new lord of betrayals, and was what Kreia was referring to. Scourge had to betray the Exile in order to eventually be able to stop Tenebrae. Her death was tragic, but necessary

[@DashunicornII]

I couldn't agree more, Revan and the Exile deserve better ends to their stories.

[@simpledanman]

Ugh. In kotor 2 kreia said that looking at Revan was like looking at the life of the force. And looking at the Exile was like looking at the death of it. The fact that Revan was imprisoned, and the exile killed, pisses me off quite a bit. It just seems unlikely that that could happen.

[@ArtemisKing2468]

Well you don't have to regard it as canon if you don't want to. That's what I'm choosing to believe. Honestly, its no different than what they did to Han, Leia, and Luke in the Sequels. They downplayed their importance and power level for the sake of making this weaker, less powerful character look more important and stronger than they really are.

[@ryuhayabusa4099]

@@ArtemisKing2468 headcanon is best canon

[@grikuomega]

​@@ArtemisKing2468You do have to since legally this is the story until Disney says otherwise.

[@codafett]

So in other words, they reduced The Exile to Revan's cheerleader?

[@arbiteras]

not only that,but they reduced Revan's character to the Stereotypical jedi

[@Necroskull388]

They also dismissed Kreia's teachings as "Dark Side corruption" and retconned away the Exile's status as a wound in the Force.

[@blodstainer]

Yes And Revan to a random Jedi

[@RyanTheDark]

I don't mind they canonized the characters, I wish the two of them were equals, not making them master and apprentice but I do mind how at the end of the novel. Scourge kill Meetra because of damn vision, they just rush it. If I made the Revan novel, we will not be having THIS!

[@Dragonmont]

ItsRyanYT It’s really tragic. It’s like they didn’t even know who the Jedi Exile was.

[@alxbinm5530]

I don't understand why the made iconic characters of Revan and Exile into weaklings... They were main characters of Kotor 1 and 2 , shouldnt they be pretty powerful ? yet as Jedi Knight you single-handedly defeat the Emperor at the end .. So.. Revan and Exile couldn't handle the Emperor ,as strong as they were,but Jedi Knight could? The Emperor,leader of the Empire , who lived and plot for hundreds of years, got beaten by a newly knighted jedi ? This is absurd.

[@Just_Varick]

that's called plot armour lol.

[@grimasialander7183]

Revan and the Exile did not fail. They just need the Hero of Tython of finish it. And face the Emperor on Zakuul.

[@ZeusSKF]

This came from the Kotor 2 scourge have the vision there so all that happen now was already planned and maybe the Jedi Knight is Just like Anakin the " chosen one" of this era

[@grimasialander7183]

Actually each one of the archetype is a "soul" of one or many canon characters. Hero of Tython= Anakin Barsen'thor= Yoda Meteor= Jango Fett Voidwolf= Han Solo Cipher 9= Tarkin Scree= Bobba Fett Kallig= Darth Sidius Emperor's Wrath= Darth Vader

[@ddsjgvk]

@The Meticulous Gentleman Yet Revan. the exile, T3 and this red guy couldn't touch him.

[@adamroberts878]

He wouldn't stand a chance against the exile

[@riches3581]

@DonkeyToll exactly he knew he wouldn't stand a chance in my country there is a famous quote from a movie that says "everyone can hit from behind"

[@tobiasziesmann1720]

While the book might not be canon, the situation leaves much room for those events to occur. He betrayed them in the middle of confronting the emperor, when Revan was in danger and the exile's attentions were emotionally focused on Revan.

[@Linkforlife199]

Speaking of Revan and the Exile, something that bothers me about TOR is the Endar Spire, if you notice on Taris in TOR, it is pretty much intact, however, if you watch the cutscene towards the beginning of KOTOR, it is completely destroyed, there would be nothing remaining of it.

[@AbyssalZones]

TOR is usually pretty good, but the what they did to both Revan and the Exile was just BAFFLINGLY terrible writing. No part of their story was fitting or fun or felt like it did them justice even slightly. And this is coming from someone who thinks they are both a little overrated. They didn't seem to understand or even care to understand either character and still shoehorned the into a story almost like they were trying to ruin their legacies.

[@DjDoxastic]

+AbyssalZones suck it revan

[@jokerplayz7436]

AbyssalZones its in the book scourge speaks the truthnits canon!

[@jaydamalley3398]

It's like what happened with Luke in TLJ.

[@goosesniper454]

It reminds me of what Disney did to not only Luke Skywalker, but the rest of the legacy characters in the movies. Revan and the exile are some of my favorite characters, but SWTOR ruined them. If they had only made a KOTOR III that had a good story...

[@skittleezz3269]

Facts

[@VaughnTheDruid]

Oh my Force, Lord Scourge killed the Exile, that bastard!

[@Terlin1466]

i never liked him for that. But I've come to accept the book and everything that happen in it as fact. They need to start using the dam thing better in the game thought.

[@Marxvnn]

Robert Vaughn More of a sacrifice...

[@LightStreak567]

+Revanth Vaughn He acted out of desperation, believing it was necessary, otherwise the Emperor would kill them all, based on a vision he saw when he tried meditating.

[@ArtemisKing2468]

@@LightStreak567 He saw multiple visions though. It was a mixed bag of visions that included both Revan's triumph and defeat. Meetra Surik and Revan were two of the most powerful force users who ever lived and they are easily betrayed by someone who they considered an ally and a close friend. That's not only a misrepresentation of how powerful they were, but also makes Scourge look like a giant asshole because he betrayed them despite the fact that they had a 50/50 chance at winning. But instead he took the easy path, killed one of his closest friends and offered the other up as a lamb for slaughter.

[@LightStreak567]

@@ArtemisKing2468 Yeah, he had a Doctor Strange moment. When he saw the vision of the SWTOR Jedi Knight character defeating the emperor, he betrayed the Exile and Revan to reach that future, because all the other visions he saw resulted in his and Revan and the Exile's death.

[@davidmukarovsky2044]

As someone who played KotOR 2, I am like WTF when at 2:23 I hear Scourge say about the Exile, "Despite all she had done she never trusted herself. Wih Revan she was his student again." How come a person who resisted the dark side when all her comrades succumbed to it (Mandalorian Wars), cut herself from the Force so thoroughly it left a wound in the Force (she is the only being in history who's done that according to what Kreia says at the end of KotOR 2), with the help of just 2 people defeated a Sith of VItiate's calibre before (both Vitiate and Nihilus could wipe all life on a planet and threatened to consume the galaxy), and last but not least persuaded an invincible opponent (Sion) to commit suicide does not trust herself? It definitely deserves an explanation, yet none is given. And when it comes to her being Revan's student again, I must say I never thought of the Exile as a Revan's student. He was her superior in the wars, sure. But she never embraced his teaching, walked her own path and ended up not joining the Jedi Civil War. I would expect the relationship between Revan and the Exile in the unknown regions to be a partnership of equals. Revan is rightly the more prominent figure since he has been hyped to be a tactical mastermind in both KotOR games and also knows more of the true Sith but the Exile can still teach him a thing or two. Is there some explanation in the novels as to why the Exile distrusted herself and fell into the master-apprentice convention? Because, I mean, she seems to be above that based on KotOR 2. So, the explanation I find most logical is that Bioware degraded the Exile simply because her character was created by Obsidian. However, I don't think TOR did justice to Revan either although he's towering above the Exile.

[@davidmukarovsky2044]

+Vox Valentus I kind of hoped for a longer reply, saying in a nutshell what the books say about the Exile's personality. But thanks anyway. I know about the books but I've seen some people on the internet claiming they are good for nothing and others arguing they explain everything. Plus, I don't think I have time to read them anyway. So I guess I'll try looking for some sort of reader's digest on the web.

[@meninoscantoresdecam]

+David Mukařovský go to the zero tolerance 55 channel, he explains in a way maybe you undertand dude

[@blackroserevan6939]

In the book, it touches a little bit of how meetra feels about herself. She doesn't trust herself because of her ability to connect with her followers. They blindly follow her orders when she gives them, and would do anything she says. That's why she doesn't trust herself. Because with that kind of power, it is easy to succumb to the dark side. And she doesn't want that.

[@davidmukarovsky2044]

Blackrose Revan Thanks a lot. What you said kinda makes sense. Still, I thought the Exile didn't have many followers in the unknown regions. She and Revan wanted to keep a low profile so they would be able to surprise the Emperor, no? She could definitely exert more influence on others before she left the Republic space.

[@blackroserevan6939]

Darth Davus While that's true, she's considered a hole in the force and Revan is considered the power of the force. She's uncomfortable with herself around her old master, and with her own skin in general.

[@Berengier817]

Lol I love how when you rescue Revan with Lord Scourge in your party they don't even acknowledge the other

[@cheerfulgestalt3282]

Really? Revan AND the Exile working together, legendary battle tacticians and masters of the force were fodder, but you, a random ass jedi with no talent solos the emperor? This is why I don't play SWTOR. Even if I did like the gameplay the story would have me vomiting violently.

[@jshadowhunter]

+Cerus Serenade It's about the same as one of the greatest bountyhunters being killed by a blind guy by accident, so it's kinnda poor argument.

[@cheerfulgestalt3282]

Turmoil The circumstances are no where near the same. The Jedi Knight bested him 1 on 1, so apparently, he is stronger than both Revan and the Exile combined. Then later we need a group to beat Revan. It's terrible writing and an insult to the superior two KOTOR games.

[@lactobacillusacidophilus]

+Cerus Serenade Nowadays nobody respects anything. There is a great story behind Kotor 1 and 2. The gameplay and the atmosphere were amazing. The companions and the villains were amazing. But this is what they do, screw everything with a mmorpg game. Revan is probably the strongest ever and with the help of Jedi Exile, he is practically unbeatable but no no no, let's piss on everything and let 13 years old kids have some fun. Revan ends up being a joke.

[@stanrobinson3838]

have you read revan? that clears it up lots

[@fanmovie357]

+Cerus Serenade if you play the sith warrior story you would know that vititate was severely weakened thats how the jedi knight was able to defeat him, the jedi knight is most probable at the level of revan and the exile, that is actually something i love about swtor, if you play all of the 8 classes you get the greater picture, the way they are connected is really good, the fact bioware basically tell you play them all means that is the point, if you only pllay 1 class story you are missing out greatly.

[@92Beyo]

It so pisses me off that you have to take that scumbag with you and can't punish him for what he did to Revan and the Exile

[@brandonbarron6402]

If he had not did what he have done the emperor would of destroy the galaxy by now

[@92Beyo]

He only ASSUMED that. He had dozens of visions and selectively chose to follow the one where Revan failed.

[@I2dios8]

Well it's either betray your friend or risk the destruction of the galaxy. Would you gamble with all of existence at stake?

[@92Beyo]

Like I said, out of dozens of vision he took ONE where Revan failed. And let's not act as if he had any ulterior, moral motives. He acted solely out of self-preservation and fear of the Emperor. He is a sith. Altruism isn't in his vocabulary.

[@sonic8005]

Question: did he see a vision of Revan winning? I ask because in many stories (outside of Star Wars) when a character sees several visions of the future, what ends up being the case is that the powers that be show them many futures but in the end there's truly only one. If literally every one of the visions saw Revan failing in some way then he'd have had little to no choice whatsoever. Though I'm also open to the possibility that his visions were more of a self-fulfilling prophecy

[@kashattack]

I wish they had left Revan and the Exile out of this game. What a way to ruin iconic SW characters.

[@XellDincht]

i never played KOTOR 1 and 2 but i can understand your anger. The same thing happend with the Lich King in WOW. This iconic villian (the Darth Vader of the Warcraft universe) turned into a cheap raid boss and than Blizzard killed him. Revan`s return in the new expansion was a bit weird (i kinda like Shadow of Revan because of Lana Beniko). Maybe i should play KOTOR 1 and 2 to understand it...

[@CustodianArchra]

XellDincht To be honest they couldn't use Arthas or the Lich King for that long. The story should of been improved overall and as a final boss fight should of been better, its a bitch to solo but enjoyable in the end.

[@XellDincht]

Archra Blizzard could have at leave open the possibility for the return of Arthas. I never played WOW but is the new lich king (which is frozen in ice) as carismatic as Arthas? And now Blizzard will have problems if they want to make a Warcraft 4 (or WOW will be an alternate Universe)

[@AnotherAntonio]

It's a completely different scenario. It's not that Revan got turned into a boss encounter, but that the writing around what happened after Kotor 2 turned to trash. It got handed off to different writers that are no where near the calibre of the Obsidian staff and it isn't even true to how those characters previously behaved. At least they go out of their way in WoW to create a storyline for fighting the Lich King. If you're one of those people who don't read quest logs then I'd imagine that's why you think the Lich King died so easily. But the entire plot of Ice Crown Glacier was that it was his last stand, in the heart of Northrend, and you as the player were slowly chipping away at everything that gave him power. You disrupted his army, his supplies and his weapons - and his power was slowly draining. So it gives some credibility as to why he can be defeated by 20 people.

[@Darkwolf523]

kashattack it’s fine swtor isn’t canon. I like to imagine kotor 1 and 2 are still canon cuz it doesn’t ruin the current lore

[@TimberedHarborHero]

The exile is my favorite

[@DarknessBringsLight08]

Did you ever read the Revan novel?

[@christien6230]

@@DarknessBringsLight08 no whats it called so i can lol, give me spoilers

[@BigUriel]

Revan - the most powerful Sith Lord in the galaxy at his time - and the Jedi Exile - who took out 3 Sith Lords - together did not have the strength to complete the task. Enter a small group of random generic nameless people who defeat the Sith Emperor. Fuck you SWTOR.

[@jakobrenner2230]

Revan, the Heart of the Force, enters the Emperor's sanctum accompanied by Meetra Surik, the Death of the Force. A unique duo with unique perspectives on the Force who have battled powerful Sith, learnt many profound lessons and discovered greater truths about the galaxy and themselves. What will they do now? Emperor Vitiate: "Lolz, I just kill them! Easiest sh*t ever!"

[@xenon333]

Karpyshyn didn't realize (which is strange) that the rules of genre differ from the rules of the real world. It is normal in the real world that a Hero comes back home to his wife from war, and then one day slips on ice, falls, and dies. That kind of shit happens in reality. But we don't want this shit in a book. That book was about our two favorite heroes, and it was supposed to have given them glorious endings. Instead, one is stabbed in the back and dies in the blink of an eye, and the other one is slowly turned into a lunatic. Worse yet, there was absolutely no reason for them not to succeed in their mission. So what if they killed the emperor? The Sith would get scared. Eventually, they would elect a new emperor and postpone the attack on the Republic for 300 years. See -- same result. Of course, now that Disney is probably going to retcon the entire EU, I'll just pretend that Kotors 1 and 2 happened, and that THIS shit did not.

[@SuperRegic]

Kirill Nielson Holy shit, that's perfect, it would keep everyone's visions of the two alive and allow the events of TOR to happen, they could do what the lord of the rings did with Sauron or the neverending story did with the nothing and let you feel the old darkness's... darkness by how the survivors or the scholars talked about it, as this grand, eldritch super evil that was only stopped by the greatest heroes.

[@SvenQ45]

+Kirill Nielson I read the book of Revan which I liked. And read about (very little) of their companions. But yeah the ending was a bit dissapointing. :( And T3M4 had deserved a better "dead".

[@ArtemisKing2468]

@@rocknenicks4129 Very much agree. Meetra's death was horrible and not to mention pointless. Scourge literally lost an ally (two technically as he lost Revan's trust) who would have been very useful in the final fight against Vitiate. I honestly think they killed Meetra off just because they were lazy and didn't want to deal with her character.

[@owenc.8288]

scourge is a coward! while meetra and revan were willing to sacrifice their lives, that sob cared only for himself. the least he could do is die with honor by meetra and revan's side.

[@revangomez1087]

Honor is for the living. They were about to die. He cut his losses. They would've all lost anyways(supposedly). He saw an opportunity and took it. I saw it coming. I don't know why everybody's so pissed off that a SITH betrayed his allies for power. I would've done the same.

[@revangomez1087]

Exactly. People treat it like some crappy story twist when it actually has a good reasoning...key word: SITH lolz

[@Necroskull388]

Stephen Gomez Except Revan and Surik were winning. Scourge's betrayal meant that a chance to stop the Emperor was wasted just so he would live in the case that it failed.

[@revangomez1087]

We don't know if they would've won though. Meetra had a chance 2 kill him by throwing her lightsaber and didnt throw it at his head, so she wasn't in the mindset of killing anyways like Revan and Scourge. Revan was still hurting from the Emperor's lightning and all three were winded from fighting his honorguard. T3 was destroyed and it would only be a matter of time till more guards showed up. They were in a palace, I doubt they could've killed him within the few minutes it wouldve taken for the rest of the palace to be alerted and kill them.

[@lamhotsimamora9189]

@@Necroskull388 revan is tired his not in full power

[@adawong9486]

Bullshit that's not what really happened. They ruined the lore and my favourite character: The Jedi Exile. Well they could have made KOTOR 3 instead of this stupid MMO.

[@chloesaunders7526]

agreed

[@arbiteras]

Ada Wong Truer Words Have Never Been Spoken i agree with you,these characters(Revan,Exile,Kreia,Carth,ect) are better than the star wars original saga,and i don't regret these words,and see them ruined fueled my hatred towards Disney\Lucasarts and EA\Bioware fuck this MMO but now that Disney has erased everything a Kotor 3 would be worthless,since Disney\EA would need to approve the project Disney has erased Naga Sadow,Marka Ragnos,Luudo Kreesh,Tulak Hord the ancient sith that actually was what kept Star Wars alive i fear we will never see Kotor 3 but i want to kickstart a project about the mandalorian Wars and 'reboot' revan's character

[@khalduras784]

I always have disregard the scourge betrayal thing but even years ago when i first tried out kotor 1 and 2 i always knew there would be a canon version of them.

[@TheAusugn]

Totally agree. The swtor events didn't happen whereas Kotor 1 and 2 did as far and I'm concerned.

[@ironjeff3277]

I expected Scourge to sound more like Savage Opress

[@tobiasziesmann1720]

At the very least he should sound a bit more, idk, dark? he sounds like a light child that lives in silks all day.

[@trevorrobbins110]

I expected him to sound like Scourge in the Revan novel's audiobook.

[@GhostLink92]

@@trevorrobbins110 This. They really could've gotten Marc Thompson to voice him again. I don't know if he voices Revan in this, but there were a couple lines that sounded close.

[@trevorrobbins110]

@@GhostLink92 Forreal.

[@OkIPullUp2915]

@@trevorrobbins110 same I just finished the audiobook

[@117Jorn]

Well, they lived out their lives. Mission and Zalbaar started their own trading company, Carth became an Admiral, Bastila, Juhanni and the friends of the Exile (aka Meetra Surik) who became Jedi helped rebuild the Jedi Order, Jolee sorta disappears from the galaxy, and Canderous would succeed in reuniting the Mandalorians.

[@adamsamess2163]

Words cannot describe how much I hate The Exile being described as Revans “student”… she was literally stated by Kreia as being like looking at “the death of the force”… but she’s supposedly Revan’s student and Scourge just kills her with a total coward move… such a disservice to the character

[@opo3628]

Dude, The Exile was a dead woman either way...had Scourge not made the decision to betray his friends, both himself and Revan would've also died.

[@odd-eyes6363]

She wasn't a student, but she was one of the OG Revanites, the lightsiders who followed Revan into war with Mandalore

[@BlyUehara37]

The Revan book was so bad Revan deserved a better ending

[@cindywilliford2878]

:::SPOILERS::: . . . . . If you finish the Sith Warrior story you actually get a mail from the Emperor telling you about how he was attacked by a Jedi Knight, or at least, one of his decoys was. Meaning, Scourge was wrong the whole time. Yes, the Jedi Knight does kill SOMEONE, but not the Emperor himself. One of his Hands, I think they were called.

[@combinecommando001]

it was the voice

[@hll9535]

combinecommando001 Isn't the voice you-know-who, and they look nothing alike, only the darkside in their face... Sorry if I am incorrect, can you explain to me if I am?

[@combinecommando001]

Heroic Light Lion Consider the fact that the voice you meet as the Sith warrior is much later after the original voice was killed.

[@hll9535]

combinecommando001 I remember now, thanks!

[@Sound613Wave]

Scourge... we're going to have a lot of fun together

[@williamkennedy9082]

Imagine if Bioware had just made Kotor 3. In which you play as Revan and The Exile, both of you as the starting party members. Possibly get old favorites back like HK and Atton. It would have been so much better than this pay-to-play horse shit that destroys storylines lol.

[@erin_3569]

I read some things about what Obsidian intented with Kotor 3. I wish they had made the game, it sounded so promising.

[@TheAusugn]

I've been saying this for years I'm glad someone else thinks the same.

[@saeglopr]

I remember the times when this was actually SUPPOSED to happen! Words cant describe how bad I've felt when I heard KOTOR 3 wouldn't happen and then... THIS!

[@909bkaby]

William Kennedy swtor is actually a good game with great story .....

[@eccentricjoe5410]

@@909bkaby Swtor is really fun without a doubt, and all of the class stories and companions are very well done. I just don't believe how they fit Revan and the Exile into the story made all that much sense in the end, and it was not all that satisfying hearing what happened to them.

[@PeoplesGeneral]

The Emperor should have been a 16-man Operations boss...

[@TheBozkurtreis]

I just can't agree more. The greatest force user that ever lived who literally became a god in the force is interfered by a young jedi so easily and the jedi knight defeats him in his own temple. Even Darth Jadus or Revan would defeat the knight with no trouble and they were both weaker then Vitiate. I hated it when I saw the JK ending.

[@Ricosuave98541]

TheBozkurtreis(contains spoilers) I would agree but how would that fit in for imperial? It would most likely be more for republic considered imperial respect and would die for there emperor wether they knew his intentions or not. I do dislike the jk ending a bit because seriously you just whacked off one of the most powerful sith in the universe in that era with ease. I do like the fact that they made it feel some what like revans story (ending is similar if you read the book droid/jedi revan/t3) Also in the regards of chapter II where you lead a strike team (ironic since revan was assualted by a strike team and the emperor was attacked several times by revan and his strike team lol) You also turn into a sith acolyte etc etc. They were trying to make you feel what he had to go through and couldn't accomplish but as the player you were.

[@TheBozkurtreis]

Ricosuave98541 In that case, he shouldn't be the final boss of any class. We don't kill the Jedi Grand Master as a Sith Warrior do we? Emperor could have been in a story with a more superior position and he could have been stopped during his ritual but to be able to kill him? That's too much. If they wanna kill him so easily then they shouldn't have made him so strong in the first place.

[@Ricosuave98541]

TheBozkurtreis I know what you are saying in general this mmo made everyone from kotor 1-2 underpowered or messed up their character just awfully. The emperor I believe is not actually killed because the of the mail you receive from sith warrior class and I believe those two classes jk and sith warrior intertwine a bit timeline wise. The right hand man scourge leaves and so the sith warrior takes his mantle as the new wrath etc etc. Honestly they kind of just messed up the lore and the implementation was awful. I would have accepted a kotor 3 to compete with mass effect witcher and dragon age. Then a star wars mmo with much more work into it instead of a copy and paste with 1000's of hours of voice acting.

[@TheBozkurtreis]

Exzactly, if they wanna make a SW mmo it should have a story like the clone wars or something which doesn't effect the galactic history that much. Clones fighting separatists, jedis slicing droids. Stuff like that. Characters like Vitiate and Revan shouldn't be ruined by a game to make it more exciting.

[@tensachan]

"-138 approval" well that was impressive

[@Varyaggaming]

Commend you for the good resolution and everything!

[@jakenorton8393]

Fucking bullshit how they destroyed the characters of Revan and the exile just so some shitty nobody Jedi can kill the emperor. Bioware should have just made a kotor 3 and had the war take place in that with Revan back as the main character and the exile as a party member instead of making a mmo

[@LairdEJM]

I agree. Let's pretend that SWTOR is non-canon.

[@LightStreak567]

LairdEJM Deny reality all you like, Star Wars is nothing like Dragon Age and Mass Effect, and what I mean by that is even if you could customize the protagonist in an RPG Star Wars game, the protagonist will usually have a canonoized gender and appearance, unlike DA and ME, those games were made for us to shape and control what the protagonist looks like and what he/she does, but also the direction of the story to some degree. Star Wars is not flexible like that, its more definitive.

[@Necroskull388]

Having the Exile as a party member would be a terrible idea. She barely has a personality--she's interesting to play as for what she _is_, not what she's like. Same thing with Revan--it's the reason why Revan was gone in KotOR II. Playing as Revan again might make sense, as he didn't really resolve any sort of character arc, but for a KotOR III, there needs to be an excuse not to directly include the Exile.

[@Necroskull388]

LairdEJM I actually like TOR for the most part--it's just the way they handled the stories of KotOR I and II that piss me off. I'd prefer a rewrite or a retcon to just decanonizing the whole thing. Though, technically, TOR is in a separate continuity according to Disney.

[@43rgwerg]

LairdEJM unfortunately lucasfilms & disney have said that unless it's a movie, it probably isn't canon. Which is a huge middle finger, all those books and games, all for nothing.

[@mickhack8034]

The way Revan and Meetra Surik have been downplayed in this game is absolutely shameful

[@Darkblaze4000]

I never got Scourges betrayal, I mean he's prepared to try and kill the emperor, even with a vision that losing is a possibility. But when he gets a vision that someone else might kill the emperor, he betrays Revan and Surik.

[@InfiniteBeak]

He didn't betray them, what I gathered is they got overwhelmed at the last minute, and when Scourge knew they couldn't win, he lied to the Emperor so at least one of them could continue their cause to kill him.

[@Darkblaze4000]

Hell No I read the book, I'm pretty sure it didn't look like they're losing. And yes he did, he killed them while they were distracted. BETRAYAL.

[@BlazeIgnitus]

Hell No He impaled Meetra Surik from behind and, in his shock over this turn of events, Revan's guard was lowered and the Sith Emperor blasted him with powerful Force Lightning. Is it possible that the three of them together might have defeated the Emperor? It is a possibility but we'll never know.

[@DuskDismantled1]

BlazeIgnitus I believe he had a vision moments before they were to charge at the emperor which showed the person to kill the emperor was infact, not Revan so he decided to betray them so the Emperor would spare him so he could find this mysterious jedi. He says in the video as well, "the jedi from my vision had your face"

[@BlazeIgnitus]

Shellscream Scourge had three visions actually. One in which he, Meetra and Revan were successful and slew the Emperor, one in which they failed and were slain, and one with the Hero of Tython.

[@johnathancrane9233]

I hate what this game did to Revan and the Exile.......

[@FluffyNinjaLlama]

Those are post-KotOR and KotOR2 events; from the book.

[@Nappanaia]

"And here I thought you weren't listening." great way to end the video.

[@Владислав-ы9м5у]

What many fail to understand is the reason why Scourge stabbed the Exile. He had a vision of the jedi killing the emperor. The Force manipulated him into cutting off it's wound that could destroy it.

[@davidalejandrogomezfernand2730]

perfect headcannon for me

[@S.E.-hw6zh]

Is it possible, that his first love is Meetra Surik?

[@louisduarte8763]

AT least it's nice to hear some acknowledgement of KOTOR II, since BioWare didn't develop it.

[@jsvaldes88]

I wish this game wasn't cannon...

[@KitchenSinkSoup]

Hey you got your wish...

[@blobber51]

Roland Deschain how?

[@Deranfan]

It isn't canon. Every piece of EU material got thrown out of the window after Disney took over.

[@kylorevan7116]

Disney isn't canon.This is still canon.

[@chadkingoffuckmountain970]

@@kylorevan7116 ding dong you're wrong

[@Rob774]

Read SW: Revan. This explains alot, connects KOTOR and this game.

[@arbiteras]

you mean that it ruins KOTOR

[@arbiteras]

agreed,but even KOTOR lore was ruined

[@keithherondale5865]

DO NOT READ IT! IT'S SHITTY BOOK THAT DESTROYS REVAN AND EXILE. AND IT'S POORLY WRITTEN

[@anniesmith3326]

I read the book and I liked it. But I wish it had a better ending. I know not all stories have happy endings but it doesn’t necessarily have to be a happy ending. Both Revan and Meetra were powerful Jedi. Their story could have had a better and more acceptable ending. Those two are not easy to defeat. How could two powerful Jedi not have a better chance at beating the Sith emperor compared to single Jedi knight? It makes no sense.

[@GhostLink92]

Not really important, but I greatly prefer how he sounds in the Audiobook. Lower tone, bit more gravely. For doing all the voices, Marc Thompson did a great job, even with the female characters.

[@owainglyndwrlastprinceofwa2486]

Damn. It’s really jarring to go from the Audio book narrators impression of scourge to then listen to, this, lol. Caught me off guard a bit

[@Starwaker]

Well, it wasn't really Revan, it was just a Force Vision. Such thing is in TOR (when you pick up Revan's mask the vision of him coming through fire appears). Not enough for me personally. TOR didn't really ruin anything, it acknowledges how important Revan and Meetra are, but when it came to having them personally in the game they didn't do much with it, just couple flashpoints. Yes, they were cool, but it's just a tiny-tiny bit of what they could have done with Revan, Exile and HK-47.

[@whoami30204]

Be happy its not canon!

[@Darkwolf523]

Boris Hitler eh. Part of its canon. I said part

[@StrikeTeam99]

Exactly I can't wait, thankfully dice seems like it won't die any time soon.

[@goose4781]

I know they were caught by surprise and betrayed but how the fuck could Meetra Surik lose that battle anyway; She killed Korea and Nihlus who were practically a sith emperors. The same goes with Revan, who defeated Malak.

[@Darkwolf523]

Goose she killed Korea? I see.

[@ThePrinceofElPaso]

Darkwolf523 only the exile could wipe out two opposing nations

[@Yes_Fantasy_419]

LMAO Korea? What kind of crack are you smoking!

[@goose4781]

@@Yes_Fantasy_419 Bruhh this was 6 years ago I dont even remember writing this dumb shit My teenage years have come back to haunt me yet again

[@Trunksxswordx]

I read the book on it, Scourge's choice was a good one, if he hadn't done so, they would have all died and nothing would have been gained. I had no idea the Jedi actually got Scourge as a companion thouhg, now I have to make one.

[@Silrian777]

I really wish I'd read Revan before playing the Knight storyline. Only when I read that book did I appreciate the story and the character of Scourge.

[@randomonio]

How much would it cost to obtain a license for Obsidian Entertainment to develop KoToR 3?

[@raijyn2452]

The emperor would have died a long time ago if Lord scourge didn't stop Revan and Meetra.

[@yougonasorry]

all killed... If you play as sith warrior and do the foundary mission Revan will reveal that to you. he also says that he was betrayed from his inner circle, so i would assume he was referring to lord scourge

[@HarryBillyBobGeorge]

The Force has been known to have sentient tendencies. It sent Scourge the vision. I blame the Force. And BioWare.

[@jokerplayz7436]

Bring back memories from book

[@jokerplayz7436]

Hes refeering to The part in the book where there alies

[@jokerplayz7436]

The emporer is an all powerfull sith lord who did a ritual on nathama that made everything vanish even the force thete is some info

[@jeffreyaguilar8028]

If he makes one more fucking hand gesture I’m gonna lose it.

[@Ricosuave98541]

I like how scourge said they did not have the strength the complete there task when in all actuality he could have helped and slayed the emperor right then and there with them. Instead he is consumed by I believe 2 visions or 3 I can't recall and he sees "us" the player as the one to slay him ( in all honesty I dont believe he was slain). Either way commendable story telling good hd vid and such :).

[@Darkblaze4000]

Scourge had three visions They kill the emperor They're killed by the emperor Another Jedi kills the emperor And he only acts on the third vision, WHILE THEIR WINNING THE FIGHT

[@Evren_]

@@Darkblaze4000 honestly? scourge took the safest option to ensure the emperors death

[@balrok99]

Might be very late but if Revan and Surik killed Emperor then there would be no Original trilogy. Sith Empire and its ideals and all iz stood for was because of Sith Emperor. Otherwise you soul have Sion and Nihilus scenarioall over again and again where few Sith somehow bring republic to it's knees. Sith Emperor is ruler of all Sith. He is the one who killed entire dark council in single blast. Vitiate remade the Empire that would once return and be a threat to the Republic. The same Empire that would be defeated houndred or thousand years and then make way for Darth Bane and rule of 2. If Revan defeated Emperor the Entire empire would go along with him. There would be no Darth Malgus, Baras no treaty of Coruscant and probably 90% of Sith would not exist. Besides just because you are this living legend Revan and Exile who defeated Nihilus does not mean you are the best. It does not show his weak they are. It Just shows how Sith Emperor is truly powerful. And by the time Hero of Tython kills his body, Arcann and Thexan are in their teens on zakuul and Vaylin still closed in a cage on Nathema and Entire Zakuul Empire is there ready. Threaty of Coruscant was made so Valkorion ( Vitiate) can raise his children. And if they did kill his body his spirit would remain. He could eat more worlds and release Eternal Fleet early. We killed Vitiate it was not enough Arcann/Outlander kills Valkorion it was not enough Scourge and Kira destroyed Tenebra. It was not enough. Again this is not about how everyone is weak. But how Sith Emperor is powerful. And also this is 300+ years after KOTOR 2 Galaxy will not see or remember people from back then as they did back then. Most people have no Idea who Kreia or Nihilus are. And Jedi even says that Revan and Exile were legends. But we as players were there. We know the details which people in this era dont know. So we cant blame people for not knowing how Kreia spoke etc. She woukd be seen as Dark side by Jedi and ad heretic and madwoman by the Sith And in recent update it took Hero of Tython, Child of the Emperor, Senya and Thexan with Arcan and Vaylin, Scourge and Revan with Exila along with Darth Marr and Satele Shan with her son Theron to defeat him. And at the end it was the Force that ended Sith Emperor. And everyone there can be seen as total badasses and Legends. It was never job for single person. Revan or hero of Tython. It was for the Force to decide.

[@Ricosuave98541]

Also as I recall I never heard of the exile being a student of revan but a general for him in the mandalorian wars. She had severed her connection to the force out of survival and became a hole or the "death of the force"(by the way many people don't sever the connection to the force its pretty much like death itself since everything is connected to the force pretty much) kreia then begins to tell her she leeches off force sensitive people and becomes stronger and all that honestly I am not sure I believe it if you are light side. None the less she exiled herself by coming to the council and giving up her lightsaber and her ways eventually returning and killing a sith lord that resembled the emperor of today (consumed literally everything nihilus consumed worlds like emperor did) and a force zombie that literally never died from sheer will power and force. In the end she dies (ironic I guess) while revan lives seeing as he is like the "life of the force".

[@arbiteras]

fuck this shit MMO Revan and the exile were the best damn characters in the Star Wars EU along with all other guys in Kotor if i think that this game was possible because the devs destroyed Kotor,,,, they didn't even respect kotor on the anniversary,they just gave you a 'title' and the original clothes of kotor in the cash shop,but they're just awful instead of making an HD remake of Kotor

[@DraconicHart]

Mission and Zalbaar start a trading corporation that grows to rival Czerka Corp. Canderous becomes Mandalore the Preserver. T3 dies tragically, but heroically in combat with none other than the Emperor in a successful last ditch attempt to save Revan’s life. HK-47 goes off looking for Revan again and leaves numerous dead meatbags in his wake, eventually getting disassembled again not to be activated again until Revan finds him again.

[@Lion-ws5xn]

(sorry for my english, i'm french ^^) Like many, I'm an early fan of the Kotor on xbox-PC, especially the 1. The story of Revan, his relationship with Bastila, his endearing friends, the story very well put together, etc. But then the MMO The Old Republic is a betrayal against. Instead of giving Revan a nice ending, we pull the rope, and EA finds a bogus excuse to find it 300 years later. And go it back, die, but not totally, then again because it was "split in two". Frankly, the best thing for Revan would have been to kill the Emperor with the exile, and then return to the galaxy. Revan would have ended his life with Bastila and their child (ren), the exile would have been reintegrated into the Jedi order, and all the old ones (Jolee Bindo, Vao Mission, Carth, etc.), all those surviving friends, would have ended in the joy of being together to celebrate the victory of the Light, the Life! Unfortunately, just as Disney has messed up the end of episode VI by sabotaging the Han / Leia wedding, sabotaging the future of Jedi Luke, and the story itself (yes Anakin must restore balance in the Force and now we find ourselves with new sith and a "pseudo-empire" in episode VII, basically Anakin was useless), so EA sabotaged the end of the Kotor and messed up the happy ending Revan would have had with Bastila, the end of the exile etc ... to lay us, in addition to a pitiful story of a Revan quoted above, the story of an emperor who never dies ... and so Here again, like Anakin, Revan was useless, since the other ball on the dark side changes body as shirt. All this for a question of money, as always. Disney wants money and we sabotage the Star Wars saga of George Lucas. EA wants money with his MMO and ransacked the saga of Revan. In the end, it's sad to say, but it would have been better to stop everything after Kotor 1, simply. Or at the worst finish the trilogy Kotor with a third game so, on PC and console, like the first two, where we would order Revan and the exile in the wilds, killing the emperor, and returning to the end in the galaxy towards theirs. There we would have an end worthy of a Lucas, worthy of Star Wars.

[@amberlyveil8856]

The exile was never Revan's apprentice that's actually an important point in her story

[@StrikeTeam99]

Well as some one who has played games since super mario bros, I really don't see that as a bad thing as long as you can toggle first and third person like in the old ones I will be happy.

[@Oliverkor]

they died from old age this is 300 years later

[@Zukoiu]

Apparently a part of the ones in KOTOR 1 were killed before Revan by the Emperor in order to break him...

[@annaanderson6671]

Omg she sounds like Serana (random skyrim reference)☺

[@woodwyrm]

They're dead by the time SWTOR takes place although Revan and Bastila Shan had children(or a child) as evidenced by the existence of Satele Shan. There's a sprinkling of reference's to the KOTOR-games in SWTOR(for example the smuggler has to deliver the preserved head of Darth Bandon to a curator on Alderaan^^).

[@Pete_From_HR]

**ghe emperor saw that Revan was too powerful in the Force to just kill. So he imprisons him and feeds off his mind for 3 centuries. But the connection works both ways and using that same link Revan learned countless new things about the Emperor and was actually the chief architect in making the Emperor agree to the Treaty of Coruscant

[@conman31598]

yeah i kinda wish theyd do like they did with Revan in Kotor II where you saw him/her back on Korriban

[@ZlyKanal]

Bastila died of old age, first gave birth to Revan's child. Carth died of old age or on war. HK-47? You can see him. T3? Probably thrashed or something like this. Jolee died in Jedi Hunting as well as the Cathar woman. Then you have Mission and Zaalbar, who probably died helping Revan. Canderous? Probably ended up dead when having a bounty hunter mission.

[@Kyfas7]

This is a typical Anakin situation. If Scourge hadn't betrayed them they could have beaten the emperor. Sourge had visions of Revan wining, loosing, and of the future jedi. He made his choice based on uncertainty.

[@sharonchristensen]

Please notify me if you find a fanfic that's considered a proper ending to both Revan and Meetra.

[@Starwaker]

Spoilers! T3-M4 was destroyed by the Emperor. HK-47 left to look for Revan (met only after 300 years in SW:TOR). Carth and Bastila grew old. Bastila had son from Revan, who became a good politician. Exile's crew just lived their lives in the Rebublic, helped rebuilding the Jedi Order after the Triumvirate. Mission and Zaalbar had their small business (selling droids, or something). Not sure Jolee and Juhane, they might be Jedi again, if they've survived the Jedi Purge by Triumvirate.

[@cedarsever]

Those are some strange hand gestures he makes...

[@addyaz91]

Bastila had a kid which is S. Shan who was the farther?

[@DashunicornII]

What difference did the treaty make? They still went to war in the end.

[@TheCornFarmer1989]

Well the republic was almost definitely going to be crushed in the first war. Revan using his influence to get the treaty of Coruscant allowed the Jedi and republic to regroup, re arm and breath. And most importantly, time for the Hero of Tython to be born and trained as Scourge had foreseen, though I doubt this was Revans intent since he was pretty determined to do it himself.

[@MrPYROplays]

This plays hundreds of years after kotor 1 and 2, Most of them are dead

[@RamixTheRed]

they died of old age and lived happy peaceful lives. Which is exactly what Revan wanted to accomplish.

[@bnop]

Came here after reading the Revan novel.

[@colt4531]

Stupid story telling just to make ur swtor char feel important no doubt

[@HazarTulum]

don't worry, it was just the Emperor's Voice

[@AlexOfMacedonAOMH]

Hah, that guy makes me really wanna try out SWTOR, just for the story. What an incredibly well-made character, I'm surprised at all the ''OMFG HE KILLED A CHARACTER I LIKED, HE BAD'' comments

[@Zero0911]

Cause he betrays BOTH characters we play as in both KOTOR games. I mean you go play Halo and watch teh Master Chief and Arbitor die because of some betrayal. That is what happened. They went to fight the Emperor. Betrayed. The Exiled is killed and Revan is imprisoned for 300 years. Only to die to some scrub later on. Leaves all his love ones. Lost a lot of close friends, captured for hundreds of years. And still fails to do a thing against the emperor. Can't help but be annoyed.

[@rockluee37]

Fuck you Alex

[@woodwyrm]

Smuggler storyline, first third of the game, planet: Alderaan.

[@Bezelle]

Were lucky that Battlefront 3 is starting to be designed AGAIN. Hopefully the company making it this time doesn't crash and burn.

[@aguteempasil]

poor bastila, their son deserved a father

[@joshheath6291]

Is the exile Bastille Shan or the woman who goes with him 2 kill the emperor

[@grienardus12]

+Josh Heath The protagonist of Kotor 2

[@joshheath6291]

oh right thanks

[@Pete_From_HR]

Read "Revan" he says it as Scourge confesses his loyalty. The Emperor claims Revan has immense knowledge of both the Sith and Jedi and that he could use that power for his own.

[@zingodoom]

So that explains what happened to everyone? It revelas the fates of characters like Mission, Juhani, Visas, etc.

[@Bagrah10]

@0AllThingsAwesome0 Actually, I understand full well that Bioware thought they were the same character. My point was that this Jedi Exile from the novel was so different in powers and abilities from the player character in Kotor 2 that I refused to accept it.

[@agmnii]

Let’s get a Kotor 3 and ignore this.

[@StrikeTeam99]

she would turn in her asteroid field lol

[@aubreyhuff46]

Revan of course is the father they did it before he left

[@DefecTec]

At least you get to set are an free and undo some of the stuff Scourge did

[@tobiasziesmann1720]

Man Scourge sounds so flat. In the book, the reader at least made him sound the part.

[@StrikeTeam99]

Thank you good sir I served a good purpose in world war II feeding the gi's. You can believe swotr is a masterpiece and I can believe it's a sad end for the kotor characters that I personally do not like. There is room on this earth for more than one opinion.

[@lukewestwest]

I hate when Fans speak about Revan’s storyline BUT HAVENT READ OR LISTENED TO THE AUDIOBOOK! Thats the best version of Revan in my opinion, right when he regains his mask/memories and says “I am Revan Reborn and before me YOU ARE NOTHING” … spoilers sry

[@banethesithari]

someone doesn't get sarcasm and its not like they'd be able to cram what happened to everyone else form kotor 1 and 2 in the story lines its old republic not kotor 3...

[@BigDave15]

Jedi can see the future. Particularly what is just about to happen. This would them difficult to backstab methinks.

[@Jake50892]

this is what i know Carth he stayed with the republic Mission and Zaalbar opened a business Bastila and Revan had a child but Revan left so Batila was all alone Canderous became the new Mandalore the perserver and helped the exile on her mission and T3 dies because he was helping revan and the exile along with Scourge and he saved Revan but died and HK 47 stays at revans side Juhani and Jolee started up a new order.

[@Bagrah10]

0AllThingsAwesome0 You still don't understand. I'm not refuting that within the canon they are the same person. I'm saying that changing elements of the Exile's powers and then killing her off with the minimum of fuss was so disrespectful to the fans I would prefer to keep them as separate entities in my head. I can assure you that I'm not the only one who thinks this.

[@Pete_From_HR]

Revan actually doesn't die in the flashpoint in SWTOR. When he reaches 5% he stops fighting and disappears in a cloud of violet smoke and lightning, leading some to believe he wasn't really there. And Scourge DOES kill The Exile. It takes place in the Revan novel. He only does it because he begins seeing they cannot defeat the Emperor as they are then and pretends to betray them in order to buy Revan and the Jedi some time. Scourge knew the a emperor saw are an was too powerful to simply kill.