Systema vs Kickboxing (?)

I found this video in my collection, I downloaded it several years ago.
It's from an old Bullshido Throwdown but I don't rember the year nor the names of the guys on the mat (neither the style of the guy on the left - Kickboxing? Muay Thai? MMA?).

[@wolf3001]

He dropped his damn hands like a pro.....

[@PaulGengeCombatLab]

He was a brown belt in Judo and trained Vale Tudo for a year. A nice guy when we were not trying to hit each other or pull each others arms and legs off.

[@alteye1]

@ennot well I can tell you by my personal experience. I had the enormous pleasure to train with an officer of the russian army who was a passionate Systema practitioner and my attempts to attack him with judo and Krav Maga techniques were of no success (and I'm not a complete rookie, as I'm a soldier myself with hand-to-hand combat specialisation).

[@alteye1]

@scarred10 Because the founders of Systema are former Spetznas. Guess where they got their knowlegde from? Proof that they successfully use it, is that its completely safe to state that the Spetznas are still one or even the best Special Forces Unit worldwide. If Systema was rubbish, there was no need of using it. Plus I can confirm Systema's effectiveness myself, because I had to fight three practitioners at a Military Sports Tournament.

[@marineninga]

I like that this video is 18 seconds and if that wasn't long enough, it was slow mo.

[@shapedthought]

The guy getting punched is a mate of mine called Scott, nice guy, not bad on the ground but stand up has never been his strong point.

[@berner]

@muaythaijunky Try telling that to a UFC fan "D'urr only thu best fighters in the world make it to thu UFC! You don't know what yur talk'n about!!". Glad to see someone else who thinks the same way about the UFC.

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter relaxing is big but from what iv heard so far is it takes hardly any training. its true on bruce but even he goes into stance. he is free most of the time to menuver. without a stance you loose extream amounts of power. only with power enugh force can you win a fight besides a submission. speed is great but if its weak you only chip away and risk too much. in the end even bruce goes into stances. id like to feel the hit to beleave that it bounces around as so. dosnt sound real.

[@alteye1]

@scarred10 And there IS a use of unarmed combat techniques in modern warfare, as Special Units are an important part of the latter. Units like the Spetznas operate at close quarters, hand to hand combat is often inevitable.

[@alteye1]

@scarred10 if systema is fraudulent rubbish, why do the Spetsnaz still use it (successfully) ?

[@pejjokar]

kickboxer was just trying to hold hands

[@MarcinWarsaw]

the other guy is not boxing, he just lets the other guy hit him.

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter theres no doubt in my mind that you felt some thing or else you wouldnt bother with it. but what you felt was it real or in your mind? alot of those tricks like the human stun gun guy and the no hit KO guys use mental tricks. look up "no touch knockouts" and watch all of it and youll see what i mean. im a big skeptic on most things that seem a little iffy. iv seen one of the upper systema training guys try to fight a kick boxer and he kinda just ran around the ring and defensless

[@JoelHuncar]

I dont doubt systema, however I just saw a guy get tapped once, that does not tell me what the outcome of the fight is at all.

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter yes you get tired in real fights. iv been in many and with multiple people coming after me. i live in heavily gange affiliated area. pivoting and actualy moving around helps avoid getting swarmed and close quarter combat helps quite a bit. i know what i do works and muay thai(older style mostly) works due from back then from wars and now on the streets not just the ring. no stance with legs together means throw me around and no power at all. no defense at all.lets see ufc systema

[@competent-ninja]

I am almost positive that t-shirt guy is my friend Paul Genge :-) So sure that I could put my money on this.

[@scarred10]

@alteye1 what evidence is there that they either use it or if they do ,use it sucessfully,theres virtually no unarmed combat in modern warfare.The cops would experience far more combat than a soldier.

[@Zeroichiz]

That guy didn't know how to kickbox. If he would have had his guard up, then the other guy would have never even got that sloppy punch off.

[@ALEK010278]

Its Paul Genge

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter im not shure what this zen mind thing is. tunnel vision is very normal and its your brain shutting down. its basic primal instincts that are left. often to tell when this is happening is right before fights people repeat the same words. most training is actualy muscle memory. when your bain shuts down its what you trained to do without little or any thought to survive. some people just shut down and dont even fight back. im often relaxed enugh to keep from shutting down.

[@alteye1]

@ennot I understand that my experience is not an ambivalent proof but it's an explanation for my comment, which is why i told you about it. I totally agree with you on that one, it's indeed the only way. But there are opportunities where Systema fighters face fighters from other styles, this experience i told you about took place on a mutual training of the british and the US army, where this mentioned russian officer worked as instructor...-

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter its till tiredness kicks in do i shut down. iv been in very small cage sparring till they call it off. its a good 5 minout go or longer and not much space to move around to avoid the other guy. close quarter combat training realy. being tired dose not help at all. im trained in breathing its our lowest of basics. breath out when throwing and taking hits basics. its how to hit hard without using too much muscle and more of your hips for power saving soo much more energy.

[@Nivenchy]

@TheShadowalker5 Spetsnaz can be referred to different Russian agencies, since its core meaning is special forces. As far as I know the only units who train in portion of Systema are law enforcement, such as OMON and SOBR. True military units such as GRU Spetsnaz train ONLY in Combat SAMBO with some Karate, as it's more practical. Also note that Systema is not a sport and along with many other styles such as Kung-Fu, falls more into "pokazyha" (show-off) category.

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter i dilike the ufc honestly. they water down and its all ring and not actual stuff you at most times could use on the streets and the rules handy cap alot of martial arts. so i know what your saying. its the ultimate Mcdojo creator too. i like to drink myself and watch it but iv never had any violent conduct. if you know of anything in California id like to see first hand and know to an undoubted experience

[@alteye1]

@qwertyuiop298 Who else? About a hundred combatants from USA, UK, Ireland, Germany and Russia in my weight category. Most of them were trained in military Krav Maga, Wrestling, Muay Thai and this one crazy German guy who used Wing Chun. Winner in my category was a former SAS officer, who had achieved in his training a specialisation in hand to hand combat (expert in pretty much all popular martial arts, Judo, Muay Thai, Ju Jutsu... etc). A real beast. Greetings.

[@Nivenchy]

@ennot I'm sure there's no agency who officially endorses Systema. However, the only Systema supporters I personally know (and who incorporated some portion of it into their training) were from OMON. I'm not a big fan of it myself.

[@joergus]

Amen!

[@valgorlin]

@alteye1 at the same time we know how systema makes all styles and levels look like goofs. its a very strange yet logical system

[@alteye1]

@scarred10 I never said it was a tournament for systema. A military sports tournament is a tournament for military members wordlwide where they can compete with other soldiers in numerous disciplines. One of it is military combat, a freestyle match. Those three fighters were Russians and went through a additional Systema training. And there is proof that they use it. Check wikipedia (the article includes quotes). At first it was called Combat Sambo Spetznas, even Stalin's bodyguards used it.

[@alteye1]

@Rakombo Look at other videos, this doesnt seem like real systema to me. In systema, you attack your enemy mostly on highly sensitive spots and you learn to concentrate an extreme amount of power into one single punch. Once you mastered all of this, you can knock your enemy out on numerous points of the body with one single punch or even touch/push.

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter i noticed it looked like a regular punch with poor foot choices any punk could do. not thai at all note the kicks begin with the leg raised strait up and then the hip is turned over to set motion the torque will on the ball of the foot with a full spin motion like a bat with a strait or bent leg(close muay boran style and much more powerful) that is solid. even ring style its thrown skiping the hip turn over for fast and less powerful.clearly the guys wiping it with none of this

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter the front kick is all around a bad choice due to lack of power and not worth it if the guy has fists. you need a kick that couses damage and fear. van dams thing was in a movie.... he had alot of things not even muay thai.example scean is how high he can raise is legs for tie kwon do kicks. muay thai was used after being disarmed in actual combate to the death and still defeat the oppenent. it was made for unarmed fighting. systema is kinda... a scam. i looked into it

[@gaborlive9737]

Nice!!!!

[@recshooter]

The guy getting hit had a background in judo and vale tudo according to the systema guy. Look up /user/RMANW he can confirm and tell you more

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter i know of a few underground fighting styles like jail house rock(native american stle mixed with prison i beleave?) but any way so i dont doubt in underground styles.

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter your mind set is very important. yes. fight to win and destroy the opponent. but don't allow yourself to be fooled by trickery and think its acceptable to let yourself believe in nonsense. whether you believe it to be real or not is it realy real. not because you believe, but because it is. reality is best not distorted or you may be susceptible to bullshido and other delusions that may be quite harmful.

[@Andhaira]

Actually, there are quite good systema vids on KZbin. It does appear to be effective.

[@PressurenFlames]

You said it. It "appears to be effective". But only during their demos in slow motion.

[@brianholland5447]

SlickRickOne Have you eyes but see not?

[@alteye1]

@ennot I could try and ask my mate who recorded the fights to upload his footage, so you can see it too. But I'm sure that if you dig well enough, you'll already find some useful videos on the internet ;)

[@alteye1]

@yamasnik well, actually, systema is a highly accurate and effective self-defence, but this video really isnt high-class... :-(

[@Ekztabar]

@wildjew Whats just because he doesn't suit American stereo type... Well no wonder klitchko brothers own the boxing ring:)

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter i say that mearly couse actual spetznas people said it wasnt true. the videos of the guys and even the top Russian guys are redicoulous. the KOs they do arnt possible to do. theyv even paid people to say it works. the fact they say it requirs no training is a huge eye brow raiser.muay thai takes stance for power in hits like a boxer would do. no or bad footing = no power and loosing fight. even bruce lee jumped into stances that suited the moment like the wide leg fenceing stance

[@kurirboy]

this is Wing Chun,not KB :)

[@arthuro13]

yus systema is great self defence but this guy aint kickboxing, if he was he'd trow him a couple of good combo's, knees, lowkicks, forward kicks to push him where he wants and highkicks w/e. systema vs human, im thumbing that fucker up.

[@sovietito96]

problem?

[@scarred10]

@alteye1 there are no tounaments for systema,its not a sport so you fought nobody.Theres still zero proof it was ever widely used in russia apart from anecdotal reports

[@DarkGuitarKid]

more like sytema vs Human

[@MrTalonmaster]

Systema got to have the weakest guard ever. They stand with their hands down? wtf? If a systema person can be fast, the opponent can be JUST AS FAST! So if you have your hands down, thhe opponent WILL bish slap ya fool!

[@Sleepy-ZTV]

guy on left is nothing. if he was a kickboxer he wouldnt have kicked like a 12 year old girl. and guy on right cant punch obviously or he woulda had that guy on the floor. for real for real!

[@muaythaijunky]

@NewZealfighter i took no shit. i mearly showed the scientific side of fighting and what happends. im seeing too much hocus pocus taps and falling. i never said kick boxing is the best. just better. and shin bones? ya happends when you dont condition long enugh or your unfortanant. its real and happends. ya stance gives away and iv studyed others so its not an issue. or should i just throw hay makers and forget it all? yes strong sides have weak. its called 45 degree angling fighting.

[@Afganspec]

Kickboxing????? :))))

[@InfiniteHR]

this guy Trainer what ever from New York is bad teacher he never move his legs he stay like tower in every video what i saw some exp fighter would brake his legs

[@Corvus___]

SYSTEMA VS NOOB

[@MarcoTUV]

kick boxer does not have very good stand or guard... thereby pwned

[@muaythaijunky]

@berner ufc has alot of slop and shit that wont work out on the streets. plus the rules. if you dont come from a mc dojo you start to see all the little details. but ya ufc fans love what they see on tv and tell real figters they dont know. iv seen a few good fighters but alot have basterdized half aborted martial arts goin on. look up "donnie b" hes one of the trainers at the place im at. its old style muay thai and a mix of boar bando(stuff youd see in a lethwei fight). we aim to !#%$ u up.

[@moushmoush]

Love systema and practice it religiously, but this is a very poor example. Also, the "boxer" or "Kickboxer" doesn't seem to know what the hell he's doing. What a waste of an upload...

[@kevinchris2361]

gay

[@alteye1]

pointless vid, kickboxing is a part of systema.

[@IntrospectiveBizz]

So stupid never come first with a leg , amateur Kickbox ........