Talk to Thorin: LS on What Holds the West Back (LoL)

[@InhauserProject]

Thooorin + LS should have a regular show. dudes insights are incredible. Good Job

[@Wizardi1111]

Nah, he's only good in short doses.

[@itznukeey]

Thooorin or LS? :D

[@InhauserProject]

in this case i was talking about LS. We all know Thoorin is brilliant :P

[@molteriet]

This

[@HiImKeelan]

Yesssss

[@EriYT]

"NA players would rather be ruined by praise than saved by criticism." That's a great quote that sums it up well.

[@puppetmaster8514]

yea couldn't agree more, I got reported for telling my teammate he was stupid and made a bad decision. The NA ego.

[@chronotian5991]

The LS - Thorin synergy is insane!

[@sspader4668]

MORE LS PLS

[@bonesh0ckerz]

YES !

[@abelgebru3959]

Ls i lowkey love you. You are funny but serious (with good facts) at the same time. Pls Thoorin can you 2 make a regular show it would be great

[@pelataan69]

Abel Gebru just watch his stream and youtube videos

[@blendon8]

Abel Gebru Like the fact he claimed Porn Star zilean can't get Challenger in Korea because he is hardstuck D2. Well he reached Challenger.

[@abelgebru3959]

Pure Shqiptar watch his video 2 pornstar zilean getting out of diamond. He basically just started 2 duoq with a pro challengerscene player after he realized that he couldnt get out of diamond. Then he also did alomst every gamd a cheese strategy. So i mean if you need help from someone who play in the challenger-league and also cheese.... I dont know... but that was ls reasining not mine

[@jacobkamp9564]

Pure Shqiptar LS was saying that porn star zilean couldnt get Challenger in KR without duoq and without a specific amount of draven games played. He broke both of those things and just said “look i did it”. Yes he could get challenger, that does not make him a challenger level player on the KR ladder.

[@fireemblemaddict128]

Holy shit did LS mention Melee and shield dropping? Dude I did NOT expect that analogy, good on you man. Also you guys know so much about the old StarCraft BW/2 scene it's honestly impressive.

[@bestnachos4964]

I am p sure ls was grand master and a semi-pro or something very involved with the sc2 scene. Also theres a video out there where he does an analysis on a ssbm match between randoms. Its funny how hes dead on about neutral game play and positioning/stage control but has no idea what the characters do.

[@ibrokethegun]

Called out Mang0 LOL

[@DarkwingDuc]

IMO Melee is actually a good example for a game where even western players have a good practive mentality. The whole "no johns" idea has been around since like 05. Even mid-level players often have practice schedules, they take care of themselves both mentally and physically through meditation and stretches/exercises respectively.

[@docreverb]

I agree about the higher level players to an extent, though they're definitely not perfect. Glad to know that nick shows some interest in our scene

[@ultearmilkojohn1145]

DarkwingDuc lol good meme melee has horrible practice regiments

[@Birkarl_]

As a Finn, that collectivist Swede thing is 100% true, it comes also from the days of the Swedish empire. We here in Finland are more individualistic(like America) which protects us from socialist extremities in politics, but inhibits team games. Germans too, very collectivistic, absolute monster football players.

[@Zeergruush]

Being a Finn too, I'd actually argue a little against this. We've just started moving towards that "selfishness" (which we funnily call individuality, don't be fooled) in the last two decades. I remember like 10 years ago that it was all about the community and doing the little things for someone who wasn't as lucky as you, where as this selfishness has arisen more like in the past 5-ish years to the point where it infuriates people. Everything is about "me me me!" In Finland this change was mostly led by politicians who showed the way to it. They would discard all regards to people that were not themselves and that has now led people like sheep to do the same f---ing thing. Because they saw that this was the way to money and believe it or not, in Finland money IS everything. We have a great supportive system for people to the point that they don't have to work to live their lives but god forbid if you do... You're going to be condemned to the deepest depths of hell because you're not making your own money. This is part of the "everyone does their part" mentality which is the strongest driving force in Finland and even tapped into in today's politics. Or I might've just been too young to understand this was going on and was raised in a family where helping was seen as a good thing and I could at least try to get better at the things I wanted to get better at as long as I didn't waste too much of my parents money (this is salty me talking). /rantover I hope XD

[@SWEMartin]

On the theory why Swedes were so good @54:05. I think its an interesting thought and might be some truth to it; I mean Sweden managed to finish 3rd in the World cup 94, and almost always went through to knock out during the 2000s, much credited to "the strong collective". Superstars like Brolin, Thern and later Henrik Larsson and Ljungberg all worked for the team (a mentality that went down the drain thanks to the Ibra-effect, for better or worse). But honestly, I think Swedens dominance in CS, and many other games, had more to do with two things 1) Sweden was/is a very wealthy country and many kids when I grew up (Im born 84) had access gaming computer at the age of 9-10, which I believe wasnt that normal in the rest of the west. My family bought our first computer when I was 6 years old the year 1990, a 486 MX , 33 mhz cpu 124 MB hdd, and I got my first own computer, a Pentium P90 when I was 11. 2) Sweden developed a gaming culture early on. It was socially accepted to be into games. Girls didnt brand you a geek and parents didnt bother if you played a lot of computer games, because "it was at least better than partying". I remember that I played games like Crystal Cave or Commander Keen in Invasion of the Vorticons for hours as a 6 year old kid. Later, around year 2000, the Lan-party culture really grew in Sweden. In my small town of 20.000 inhabitants, there was at least one Lan party available every weekend, sometimes just 4 friends and sometimes 40-.50 people. Also, I just think CS was the perfect game to attract a big player base. The skillcap to have fun isnt that high but the skill cap to master it is very high. I mean, games like LoL is pretty tought for a first time player but when it comes to CS, I remember you still could have a good time as a noob.

[@leroy_sopacua]

Would be interesting if you have a video with Ocelot and LS. They have both angles that are interesting and intertwine on the improvement of the game. Ocelot more on the industry stand point. LS more from the coaching/analytic perspective and being a competitive player as well. I'd even argue to have LS as a sub for Narrative Awake if Kelsey can't go live due work or just life. With LS being Batman and Thorin as Commissioner Gordon with his Bat-signal.

[@brad8670]

Great show! Big LS fan... LS is basically my bible for LoL! Thorin growing on me :) great video again guys would enjoy more like this!

[@aleyzr]

This is probably my favorite combo. LS is my coaching Idol, and he has amazing knowledge about the game. That combined with one of the best interviewers and someone who's really good at breaking down topics is just a phenomenal combo!

[@Zeergruush]

Watched the whole 1,5 hours and now I'm just hoping there was more of you two. Whenever you feel like it, would be nice to have more of your words together ^^

[@lnt3ch]

This is going to be straight fire

[@danijelgrubic3122]

this is more what is holding NA back

[@yaboi-bosi3177]

Well NA is in the west.....

[@Brqinstorm]

NA is holding the West back. They are importing players left and right and do nothing because their region has literally not local talent.

[@deelohseason]

Na west ping is trash if servers went back to the west NA will have a chance

[@colespur]

1 2 keep listening to brain wash material. If C9 wins I would love to hear the excuses.

[@clickbaited174]

@@user-br3fk8dx8o Shut him down

[@LZHU012]

“Korean Challenger Team, Griffin, probably better than most NA teams in the LCS.” - LS Currently: Griffin = Best Team in LCK ~ Undefeated

[@themlgbrosftw4960]

And now they are in relegation

[@themlgbrosftw4960]

@@user-br3fk8dx8o yes, probably all of them except c9, but even then I would give them like a solid 35-40% of that happening

[@InstancesKMS]

thorin even in gradeschool we have coaches teaching basketball and definitely middle school or junior high and highschool. most kids growing up playing basketball will do something over the summers aswell that may have a coach basically just coaching is very ingrained in sports in american culture. such as even in gradeschool we are attempting to learn 'concepts' you know about basketball (obviously toned down for 5th graders but still)

[@NarcolepticNerdProductions]

Pumping out that amazing content! Thank you Thorin!

[@serlinsorcer]

Thank you Universe, for giving us someone like Thorin and LS. Great talking

[@theraybeam7581]

so funny hearing them talk about making a super server near lcs/ an fpl for league and now we have that exact thing and most lcs players dont even care enough to play lol

[@botesz20]

Oh boy i love this "lineup" so much! More of this!

[@ElliotTheMaker]

also something u didn't mention that in the NA LCS plays about half the games during their splits that LPL and LCK plays. Like just being able to play more games as a team against high level teams will make you a better team

[@user-dc5ti1is1s]

It would be great to see a series with you guys.

[@zionzorshin1579]

league needs a 3rd party site, to make people actually care about the games, like csgo has esea and faceit

[@xakashi12123]

what the fuck why would youtube invert your comment

[@JosemiPR]

Thorin is killing it!

[@seansmall9910]

the solo Q, which is also a part of culture, is also arguably infrastructure as it impacts the level of individual practice of the players as well..... its why the players always marvel at the Solo Q

[@HerbertDerBarbar]

please more of this collab i love it

[@SweedRaver]

In general, I really liked this video! Some thoughts: You quite quickly began drifting towards issues that are specific to NA (which is good), however the issues that were specific to EU were left out. I understand that you probably had a limited amount of time (one and a half hour?) and ending the discussion where you did was the most convenient. I hope the two of you can return to this topic at a later time and discuss the issues that EU, both as a server (actually two servers) and as a competitive region has. It would be very interesting to me as an EU fan to hear what your thoughts are about what is holding EU back specifically (obstacles they need to overcome), what your thoughts are on the recent experiment that was the EU masters tournament, how EU has developed over the last few years and what you would like to see from Riot Games going forward in order to improve EU as a region.

[@VentiLator7]

29:00 SO fucking true. Just recently I talked to my friend about maintaining high APM in league and he made fun of me and said shit like "That's dumb, league doesn't need high APM, this isn't Starcraft" etc, etc. I can so relate to this statement.

[@plutone220696]

"QTPie is good." -LS

[@thacallofdutygamer]

Ordo ab Chao consistently Challenger through many seasons GIGABAD PLAYER BTW XDDD

[@ziggle5000]

Duchiee Challenger in NA and you think he’s so good lmao. I like the guy but don’t delude yourself thinking he could come back to comp

[@thacallofdutygamer]

I didnt say he was good enough to play pro delusional????

[@docreverb]

LS complimenting QT? WHEW

[@blendon8]

Yes he is good in solo q, so funny how these low elo players claim he is bad.

[@Aaron.Church.Solomon]

Been on a good roll Thorin! Keep it up!

[@alligatorcrocalligatorrox890]

Some strong points made here. Makes you wonder how much stronger players like Bjergsen and Jensen would've been if they stayed in EU.

[@Vendrix86]

then why didn't they?

[@baptisteshorjian9292]

@@Vendrix86 There is something called money in this world. Would you rather get better solo Q games/ a better environnement to play or ten times more money. This is a rhetorical question.

[@Vendrix86]

@@baptisteshorjian9292 There's also something called being an asshole. You're an expert at that, dipshit. That's not an opinion, it's a fact. I'm sure the players playing in NA are paid more but I doubt it's to the extent of pennies to the dollar. Some people actually care more about the environment they play in rather than pure money and greed. I don't expect you to understand that.

[@firstlast5630]

@@Vendrix86 Oh you're one of the idiots that thinks trying to make more money is greedy lmao. Fucking idiot.

[@buntaichosaber3121]

Vendrix You don‘t throw away your chance at a raise like that, dipshit. You gotta learn how this world works, kiddo.

[@julien-5394]

Always great to see you two talk about the west :)

[@everything-has-a-handle-now]

it's kinda sad how accurate this still is 5 years later..

[@zellezxelece9016]

yeah kinda F up how much money they spend on this NA players

[@Godzillaaaaa11]

I really vibe with the idea of performance driven culture over results In studying kinesiology we learn about how time and time again, if you start with a results based approach without developing an athlete's performance production measures, or developing their ability to identify and workout their own mistakes, theyll sit at low tier garbage.

[@RyoMRH]

oh I lost it when Thooorin said "I hope Hyung thinks I'm good enough"

[@nikolairaisa3114]

The law of Jante is Danish btw, analogy still works as the best CS team is currently 5 Danish people, Astralis ftw.

[@loutripeloutripe7882]

Humm Stephano was actualy in the proleague and korean Player were respecting him a lot. He is the only western player to beat Korean player in a regular basis.

[@notinvited5148]

how bout Scarlett?

[@fergy5604]

I think I see somethings that are quite similar in all sports. Like taking football for an example when Man City nearly went unbeaten the moment Liverpool beat them people started acting like Liverpool were godlike and Man City were going to go on a losing streak. The fact is a lesser team can beat a better team through better coaching, better tactics and occasionally some luck. Just stating simplistic comparisons such as I beat you therefore I am better is pointless if you dont look at it deeper "Did I win because I counter picked?", "Did my opponent miss key skillshots?", "Did I get good genks or control CS" etc. One win means jack, a series of wins means a bit more, but understanding your play and why that play works/ doesn't work gives you a better platform from which to improve.

[@aleks1980]

Awesome insights. Synergy bn u two is great aswell.

[@Soudrah]

Thorin LS League show??? I love it.

[@MaiHead92]

EUW server has become so much less toxic over the years. Even in lower elo like gold and plat, people rarely let their ego get in their way and actually play to win. Flaming occurs less and less. It's a very refreshing thing to see.

[@stinglerder7845]

we started to mute everyone who is annoying. it helps

[@ahung11hk]

I believe coaches of Chinese teams are seizing power gradually. There were incidents where players were punished for their disobedience against coaches reported which made the public aware of the practice environment of pro players. Chinese viewers are extremely strict towards players since they were expected to rival Koreans but were not able to achieve much prior to last year worlds.

[@jensgabler9958]

LS is one of the best analysts there is.

[@blendon8]

If I was a team owner I would have sessions of moral teachings for my team. How to play together , respect each other, aim to improve. Learn the macro and meta game together. It feels like team owners dont get it.

[@FrederickThe3rd]

Love the content.

[@toonex5399]

Definitely agree, super love this content, allows the thought process to flow. As a British Esports Championships player (A College League and I'm in The Sunderland College Seers team) I see this issue with toxidity in euw way too often, it definitely makes everyone try to get better and play to win, however this causes alot of players to tilt and make more and more mistakes, and this mindset causes alot of players to focus on other people's mistakes rather their own which makes it hard for them to improve themselves as players

[@kristopherthewikkid]

I think the reason why koreans are so much better is partly because korean culture have a bigger empahis on the group while the west and especially NA has a culture of individualism where what matters is your own result. The emphasis is winning and winning by your own performance. Take for example the classic american idea of the self-made man - the idea that you can through your own means achieve anything. Even this idea is based on one man doing everything himself. I know from studying psychology at university level that there has been multiple studies that has backed up that koreans have a highly group focused culture and that their braines are wired in ways to focus on the group becauseof their culture requires that. There was for example a study that showed that American would focus on the central objects of an image where koreans would pay more attention to the picture as a whole. This is probably why koreans care more about their team winning than their own performance in contrast to Americans or even Europeans. I also belive that Europeans flame because they care way more about the game than NA, and it seems fair to me that, that would also be based of culture. Really interesting how the culture shines through in something as random as playing games competetivly at the highest level.

[@timbradshaw5481]

I think partly why the asian countries do better at league of legends is their alphabet and writing style. Asian characters require agility and quick movements and training of the hand in muscle memory. I think this spills over into their game play, making them just very quick and precise in their movements.

[@_ketosucks1355]

Now this video is good

[@dangohohoh5655]

Maybe what holds the west back, is the ability to adapt to what is working inside of tournaments. the meta can literally change multiple times in the time span of just 1 week even on the same patch. The way Uzi was funneled rescourses was unlike any other region, they even showed he was hitting 10k gold marks before 19 minutes... which is easily 3 solid items + boots. North America is playing around jungle specifically, and how they work with the jungler when they make rotations, meanwhile the korean teams are hard focused on lane quality and giving the bot lane the most care, with fuckin shen galio kogmaw comps. UZI LITERALLY SHOWCASED KOGMAW CARRY ABILITY JUST FROM FARMING ALONE!!! and that champion wasnt even considered strong in the meta UNTIL MSI!

[@dangohohoh5655]

sorry for the rant lol, i just want US to be successful -.-

[@dannyzhang6336]

Sorry for replying super late, but I have to disagree with ur opinion. Most of the regions have the same time to adapt the meta, in fact if you have checked out LPL, RNG won the champions in lpl, only had 3 days to adapt to a new meta with a different patch at a totally different timezone, and yet they were still able to adapt to it and pull out a 7-0 run at the second half of group stage. After all I think it still comes down to NA not being able to prepare well enough, and even knowing the meta, just because they might have won in scrims, they decide not to adapt, which was the reason they dont get out of group stage

[@Vuosta]

Man every time Azubu Frost gets mentioned i get these mad "what if" scenarios of what could have happened if Shy and Madlife actually had good players around them. Had they gotten some good players like Pray, Imp, Ryu, Faker, Piglet, Dandy, Dade etc. etc. on their team (some player similar to their skill would join frost for sure, who wouldn't want to play with Shy and Madlife?) They could have had sooo many titles. Madlife and Shy dragged Rapidstar and Woong to semis way more than they should have been able to, with some good players in the midlane and ADC (and eventually jungle) Frost, Madlife and Shy would still be household names.

[@DisastrousCake]

As an esports fan in NA, I have to say that this has been extremely eye-opening. I used to dismiss LS when he would say the issue with NA is cultural more so than things like ping and bad scrim partners, but it’s hard to dismiss this when giving examples of just how different Korean, European, and even Brazilian esports culture is especially when they were talking about scrims, practice, and SoloQ. I always thought the SoloQ argument NA players threw out was a self-fulfilling prophecy though. It’s sad to see the reality of the situation. I think the whole “SoloQ actually doesn’t matter” mentality partially comes from pro players and streamers just trying to protect their ego. Riot could also do a better job by cracking down on wintraders and boosters. Also it’s sad to see LS talk about how maybe our own “super server” could help the SoloQ issue, when it didn’t because players just didn’t want to play. They didn’t want to put in the hours.

[@MrSchmuseKuh]

i wish you would have brought dota into the topic. its like the one exception for almost all of your points. would be interessting to talk about why.

[@UlquCiffer]

Top players in Asia give up on life and channel everything for getting better in game, as they are encouraged to. That is not the case in the west. No need to stretch it out.

[@juegos865]

mahir "Yeah I might be worse in this, but it doesn't matter because I say so and were better in this I value more

[@djcasual3164]

When Thorin is listening to LS, he looks like the Tech Tips meme.

[@johnreeves3876]

This talk hits where it hurts, I gave up on the game seriously a few years back when riot started to stigmatize players who were serious players. Flaming players who troll with their picks and their stubborn play style. I climbed the ladder in search of competitive games, learning meta champs and grinding games to get better mechanically just to find that at the top nobody is trying.

[@roton6472]

I like the server idea

[@beauneo]

Well this didn't age well...

[@ownashi]

how so?

[@jameshooker1730]

n a s h i is this Nashi from ls discord LOL

[@simdecog]

aged pretty well imo

[@richardandras9215]

simdecog not rly

[@robertechternach4676]

Great insight

[@HennyGod420]

need more LS

[@kinggrantking]

EUW and KR aren't toxic in the same way. Koreans will roast a teammate for making boneheaded decisions or plays that waste not only time but literally money with PC bangs. EUW will roast players who have not even done anything because they just get angry and on tilt. It's not the same productivity wise.

[@ACE112ACE112]

Grant King Koreans open mid and ff@15

[@nonfaktor5215]

more ls please!!

[@jack722RS]

Please try to get LS to be another cohost on leagues next world champion

[@willho4202]

It always feels like Koreans have a better Macro than anywhere else, look at Samsung at the last 2 world championships, just the way they systematically bleed you out is outstanding

[@CatnamedMittens]

I love LS

[@ryad63]

Which LCS players had negative winrate on kr soloq?

[@thefetherd]

I'd like to hesr what would have been Ls' ideas for improvement in Eu. He did mention some things, bit not to the extend of Na.

[@corneliusnicklasgandlse6595]

The law of Jante (Janteloven) is danish plz. It literally stems from a 20th century novel by a danish writer called Aksel Sandemose.

[@nysq]

The law of Jante was written by a danish-norwegian author but it's valid for the whole of Scandinavia. The culture of Scandinavia is based on lutheran protestantism, not socialism. It can look like socialism at times, but isn't.

[@maerz100]

28:27 queue the Afreeca vs. C9 at worlds Series

[@vghsfan]

Holy shit griffin reference

[@Drakshl]

The points here are very interesting. The end of MSI puts a spin on this whole story, I mean Uzi being Uzi and rng being as good as they are doesn't at All chalange or invalidate any of these points, but they are very likely the best team in the world and it would be interesting to see how their team culture compairs to top Korean teams behind the media veils. NA also sees much the same issues in Dota, their are always a couple of top teams (usually have PPD on them since he is very serious, thorough and thinks the game through), however whilst they do have some amazing minds for dots like blitz, aui, bulba, ppd, and many others, alot of the teams have stars who just play a pub style (looking at you artour). Na pubs are silly aswl.

[@plutone220696]

Drakshl All the chinese pros play Korean soloq, and RNG is run by two Korean coaches

[@Drakshl]

Ordo ab Chao ah, this makes some sense I suppose. Im not super into league so I don't know much about how the sausage I'd made so to speak.

[@raiborn817]

Ordo ab Chao not any more all Chinese pros are playing on Chinese servers since being of split due Chinese people weren't happy with the fact that they were playing in Korea soloq and not Chinese and there were discussions that it is impacting Chinese rookies etc not all Chinese players are playing in Chinese highest server(they have a few servers with different levels(if remember correctly they are playing on demacia server))

[@raiborn817]

+ it's also because of new Frenching requirements

[@BlizzKrieger]

agree with what evryone else has said but also kingzone played absolutely horrible had a realy bad day

[@liamdillard7331]

***TOUCHED BY A LEGENDARY COACH***

[@calima3]

Do you know about Jean Piaget?

[@ehmayex55]

is it just me or should the title have been "what holds NA back"?

[@DaShooter12]

LOL, "not touched like Sandusky style" wtfff lmaooo

[@XxXsemonXxX]

"It's focking amazing"

[@jackmitchell5886]

LS saying ASL instead of TSL... Rolls off the tongue doesn't it :3

[@kirinkappa5662]

I'm actualy stunned by how often everyone talks about culture. LoL at the highest level is pretty much an IQ test - how much variables you can track in your mind simultaneously, and how quickly you can manipulate abstractions - thats pretty much IQ. On average South Koreans have IQ higher by 6 than Americans. It doesnt make a big difference between an average american and average south korean, but on the extremes, like 170+IQ, there has to be like 50:1 ratio of south koreans to americans, who knows, maybe even 100:1

[@kirinkappa5662]

In America, 171 IQ is one in a million and 177 is one in 7 millions, thats what 6 IQ means in the upper end of the distribution.

[@FirstShootdown]

more vids with ls pls

[@deeroberts8090]

NA players don't treat it like sport, they treat it like a game/entertainment. The only time you see pro teams with HUNGER to win worlds and be the best is if they BELIEVE their team is good enough to make it their. Lower ranked teams you can tell aren't trying to improve and be the absolute best at every possible opportunity. You ever see a high school team that regularly competes in a sport at the state or national level? There is NO money in it for them, but they push themselves in AND out of games to improve. NA players play for enjoyment and fame, not driven by the hunger to be the best overall.

[@abonynge]

Europe has double the population of NA, if the skill levels are equal EU should have double the number of competitive players. They tend to have less than double. You missed a major factor in that discussion. China has a larger population than NA and EU combined, they should have a higher number of competitive players. If you look at performance by the population numbers the stats hold pretty close. Top 10 NA = Top 20 EU = Top 40 China

[@abonynge]

Korea is the outlier when you look at pro gaming more analytically. Very few other regions (if any) show a trend towards higher pro players per capita.

[@3df6c]

best bois

[@brizcooo]

who is LS and whats a thorin

[@BerlinerSoul]

just remember svens first interviews about how is it in NA soloQ .. he said it him self .. alot onetricks ... and thats not how you ll get better vs onetrick ponies

[@noaffiliation-x8w]

Never clicked faster

[@senjy3097]

I would love to see what he has to say about TSM now... seems like sven and mithy does not work for them and with them

[@papi-sauce]

Do it for the culture way back when We was puggin on dial ups. Bruuu

[@XxXsemonXxX]

where is thorin from?

[@Emilmossing]

Didn't Idra play terran in BW? Other then him yeah, no western at a decent level really played it :(

[@lequack7399]

LS waking up :D

[@JohnnyYeTaecanUktena]

The only reason that i would ever think about getting good enough to become a pro is if it was the only way i could get a Girlfriend but even then i would be too busy grinding games to even spend time with them so no point.

[@matthewwiles2996]

because its a video game ls

[@gnralZTT]

Why does every YT video involving LS last 1h+?

[@N19HT-1]

THE GAP IS CLOSING!!!!!only between China and Korea tho lol

[@husseinpoliphilo]

Culture culture culture

[@husseinpoliphilo]

For years I've been said America is for care bear fucks who just want to troll and play the game kr or EU and China play to win

[@neobirtha7729]

Genetic genetic genetic

[@fishersofmen4727]

If it was Genetic why didn't LMQ win a NA LCS split ? If it was Genetics why do full Asian teams fail like TL ? Its the laid back, selfish,Hollywood, me first, passive culture that has infected the West.... Its like a Cancer that infects everyone around it!! It starts at the Lowest level of competition and moves it way up into the professional scene! This has been seen before in American College football when the South Eastern Conference won 7 National Championships in a row! The Southern Sates at the time had much tougher and serious outlook on middle-school football as well as High-school football thus producing greater competition moving its way up into the college level! This has now Changed as the Northern states started caring more but the fact is the Lowest level affects the highest in a trickling up affect That being said the highest level helps set standards of how serious the game will be taken thus creating a circular mode of improvement... but in NA we get random streamers teaching lower rated players to not give a damn not understanding that will catch up to them in the long run.

[@tompossessed1729]

I like lol

[@phoazmurais4991]

me 2

[@syphyt808]

Yet a good 20% of this episode is about Starcraft LUL

[@Klosterhasi]

i like starcraft

[@diplomaticzz4582]

Froggen made top 10 on the KR ladder

[@bullsmoothtime]

The word "tryhard" in NA is an insult

[@884-1]

TLDR; they dont press esc enough

[@maxfriis]

There is a difference between "want to win" and "want money". Franchising and America is about the latter.

[@maxfriis]

And Riot is even forcing EU to adopt there business model. No more sports in EU - just entertainment - so sad :(