Telomere Length Test #16: My Best Data Yet

[@markemdee7311]

Your effort into this helpful KZbin channel should have and get more subscribers !

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks for your support, @markemdee7311! No worries on more subscribers, I'm in this for the long run, 70+ years of videos is the goal!

[@eliaspfeffer]

Love these videos. Looking forward to the app

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @eliaspfeffer!

[@sooooooooDark]

congratz 😎 ur hard work is paying off

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

There's always stuff to try to fix, though...

[@gregoffner]

love your content! would you be able to make a video on what you currently eat daily, with short explanation for what biomarkers the foods have impacted?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @gregoffner. The daily diet is posted on Patreon, as are the correlations with biomarkers... Aside from that, the most recent diet composition video is here (kzbin.info/www/bejne/gn2rY4egjax4ZsU), and many videos show correlations with biomarkers, albeit not as comprehensive as the Correlations Tier on Patreon.

[@gregoffner]

thanks

[@barrie888]

what i find reassuring is that telomere shortening can be halted and even reversed with lifestyle adjustments

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Yep, at least the epigenetic approximation of TL. I think I can further improve it, but there may be an upper limit (not 7.75kb) where I can't go past that because of chronological age.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

It looks like cloves, SFA, and selenium might be involved here as they have been showing up for many tests now. When you mentioned the way cloves were taken in larger doses, I wondered if clove oil might be the mediator. You could consider trying rosemary and then basil as those (along with cloves) have been shown to increase telomeres at least in lymphoblast cells lines. Rosemary seems to be a worthwhile candidate for other reasons as well.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Interesting, thanks James, I might try rosemary and basil

[@musaire]

As fasting lengthens telomeres, it also depends on how you eat, at what regularity. But I guess you have an exact every day routine for this, though probably some irregularities and cycles of gorging on food may be more optimal as in ancient times our bodes were used to - food not daily present or just 1/3 calories on some days, eating some leaves only that we could get our hands on.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Calorie intake is not significantly correlated with telomere length through 16 tests.

[@PaulRigoni]

What great idea the one that can automatically correlate bloodwork with diet, hope it will be available as soon as possible!👏

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @PaulRigoni, yes, sooner rather than later is the goal!

[@ultimape]

Your correlations between diet and telomere length would overlook gut health factors in nutrient absorption. Ideally you need to be measuring SCFAs in the blood to see if stuff like Butyrate and other SCFAs are active on Histone Acetylation / HDAC inhibition, or at least correlating food with measurements of SCFA production potential and estimates of metabolome.

[@schattenskorpion]

Are you sure the variance could not just be within the accuracy of the test? I doubt these tests are accurate enough to make the inferences in regards to correlation etc. I'd appreciate your opinion on this.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

If that were true, why haven't any of the previous 16 tests exhibited variability in the 7.24kb direction? It's definitely possible, though, but if I can repeat the 7.24kb result, it argues against test-to-test variability.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

Hopefully the good people at trudiagnostic have measured and algorithmically corrected for sample to sample variation. That was certainly a problem with some of the early epigenetic calculators and was (eventually) fixed.

[@justsaying7065]

Is saturated fat correlated with any biomarker going in the right direction or is it always in the wrong direction?

[@rogerreich2721]

Please continue to track and report on these specific correlations to telomere length..

[@markemdee7311]

A trend line of your data would be better than comparing each calendar year average data.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

You need to account for the seasons and a yearly average does that in the simplest way.

[@douglas2835]

I'm relatively new here, you may have addressed this but if you have clear signals certain foods are negative, why not experiment by 100% removing those foods and only having foods with positive corelation. Just to test it out. I may get a some heat for this, but I think there is nothing worse than coconut intake. Almost 100% sat fat directly ingested with no buffer.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hi @douglas2835, for this test, I came as close as possible to doing that for coconut butter and cacao beans (1.65, 0g, respectively). Sometimes complete elimination isn't necessary, it's finding the lowest dose that may do no harm. For example, red bell peppers have a net negative correlative score, but I like them-to follow the correlation, current intake is about half of my highest since 2018.

[@giannidiolosa8804]

Cycloastragenol NMN

[@alessandroVenturini-n6d]

Very amazing the idea of a things that correlate automatically the diet with biomarkers etc! do you already are work at it or not yet? can you know approximately when it can come out? thank you!

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @alessandroVenturini-n6d, and we are working on it-we're close to completion, but we also want it to be perfect. Sooner rather than later is the goal. Once I start using it (instead of manually computing correlations, which takes 7-10h after each blood test), then we'll be even closer...

[@stefan-cosmin.ionescu807]

The negative correlation between copper and telomere lenght seems strange prima Dacie, at least to me, since copper is an essential trace mineral and a cofactor in the Cu/Zn SOD1 and SOD3. I wonder if this negative correlation is driven by a higher Cu/Zn ratio, if that even makes sense, or by other confounders.

[@monnoo8221]

Cu is a sword with 2 edges, regarding the rOS status. If the ROS status is very good due to other factors, a negative correlaitn may appear...

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Good point-it could be that copper is a part of the cacao bean (and SFA) story, though, as they're a major source. Alternatively, maybe too much copper (how high above the RDA?) is optimal?

[@tdswedish]

Have you tested ceruloplasmin to see if the copper that is taken in is actually bioavailable?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

@@tdswedish not yet

[@tdswedish]

Gotcha, any chance you tested vitamin A? It seems that it is also involved with ceruloplasmin

[@robbiehoff906]

A relatively new subscriber here and absolutely love your content. Are you literally eating raw cacao beans as they come or is that coming from the 4 ingredient brownie recipe (and others) on your website? Best wishes.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @robbiehoff906, and welcome! Yep-it used to be the cacao-date brownie mix, but more recently, I've mixed them with flaxseeds.

[@GiacomoCasadei-n2x]

Very great idea the one for the system that associate the blood markers with Cronometer, do you think that can be available in this or next year or you need more time to make? Super!

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Thanks @GiacomoCasadei-n2x. The goal is sooner rather than later, we're not far, but including myself, this is a side project for the team, but is a top priority! Not just Cronometer correlations with biomarkers, but HRV, RHR, sleep, everything that can be tracked...

[@GiacomoCasadei-n2x]

​@@conqueragingordietrying123 fantastic can't wait for that!

[@paulcohen6727]

It would be interesting to see what would happen if you substitute cocoa powder for cacao beans. since cocoa powder is somewhat lower in saturated fat.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Cacao powder sold in stores = roasted cacao beans, which could be as bad (or worse) than SFAs (in my case) via AGE products

[@paulcohen6727]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 Cocoa powder has so much antioxidant in it that I doubt if AGE’s would be a problem. In addition, you can prevent AGEs by taking a supplement called Benfotiamine.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 You can get "raw" versions of cocoa powder and nibs, which are sun dried rather than roasted but some heat treatment is presumably needed for food safety. The next best option are presumably the supplements using cocoa extract.

[@michael-qp9xd]

Hello Michael - much as you know about telomeres. Much findings indicating long length not most important for longevity. With maybe shorter protective as body ages with issues and if telomeres length shorter then easier for cell to shutdown or die so not to cause cancer or other problems. With cocoa much research on many benefits but your graph saying opposite at least for telomere length - maybe benefical research just by cocoa companies so then overlooking all the negatives. Looking forward to your next video.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hi @michael-qp9xd, a relatively short DNAmTL is associated with an increased all-cause mortality risk (paper link in the video's description), which highlights the importance.of longer, not shorter TL.

[@monnoo8221]

getting out the data from cronometer would be huge... I was requesting that from them abut a year ago...

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Exporting macros and micros is easy, but exporting foods isn't collated, and needs to be manually performed. We're working on fixing that...

[@markthornton9128]

Interesting that green tea did not make the top of the list here

[@monnoo8221]

some of his foods do not change a lot, or not a lot since the telomere measurements.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Ah, green tea is a constant (20 oz for every test), making it impossible to evaluate correlations...

[@jamesgilmore8192]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 It would be interesting to do a 3 and 5 cup test. Looking at the green tea/EGCG omics studies is on my to do list.

[@HvdHaghen]

What could there possibly be in cloves that has anything to do with telomere length? Is it killing certain bacteria in the mouth and/or gut? Or is the explanation that those cloves were taken in stead of other spices that were shortening the telomeres?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Eugenol is found in cloves, which could reduce oxidative stress, which is known to shorten telomeres. I'm not sure what the mechanism is, though. I eat other spices, including cardamom and cinnamon at the same time as the cloves, which are not strongly correlated with TL.

[@thomasmuller1850]

From "Effects of Essential Oils on Telomere Length in Human Cells", cloves oil was able to reduce the telomere shortening effects of H2O2, a form of oxidative stress, in vitro (other successful herb oils were for example basil, rosemary, marjoram, all Mediterranean sounding). The telomere of treated cells were also longer than not essential oil treated ones, when not being exposed to H2O2.

[@antontreeofwisdom]

Have you tried measuring the best time to work out by its effect on biomarkers?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Hi @antontreeofwisdom, I haven't-the current workout time is ~11-1PM. Later than that leads to later eating, which can negatively impact sleep quality. I could do earlier, but I have to juggle in-person work, at least for now...

[@antontreeofwisdom]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 Theoretically an early morning workout can kickstart metabolism and reduce cravings during the day. What are your thoughts about that?

[@Markt790]

The real interesting stuff is just on Patreon...

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I put out a lot of free content...

[@whatthefunction9140]

Curious us you have tried oysters or clams or anchovies instead of sardines? What brand of sardines do you like?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Not as a substitution, but I've had oysters and clams in the past, smoked, in a can. Sardines have O3 (EPA, DHA), which makes them a staple, and their correlations with biomarkers are good (+8 currently), justifying their inclusion. it helps that I like them, too

[@whatthefunction9140]

@conqueragingordietrying1797 I avoid anything smoked. I think the potential for unknown compounds are too high.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

@@whatthefunction9140 Yes anything smoked should probably be avoided. Its clearly not good to inhale smoke, that's been shown over and over, and the evidence for smoked food is a little weaker, but still best to avoid when there are lots of good substitutes.

[@vdkhvb]

how do you think your levothyroxine supplement affects aging? i'm a bit conflicted about thyroid because it's supposed to increase BMR and body temperature. not sure if that could be deleterious

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

In terms of L-thyroxine or thyroid health, I place the most value on the FT3/FT4 ratio: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWWYp59naMakbqs

[@allurbase]

I imagine you consume cacao and coconut together, have you tried messing with their proportions to get clearer independent correlations?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Not usually-cacao is mixed with dates and lately, flax

[@arthurcard1152]

Astragalus! Health Guru!

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

No astralagus for this test, extended DNAmTL, nonetheless......

[@thomasmuller1850]

@arthurcard1152 From self-experiments I have seen, the whole root powder, the astralagoside IV extracts and 50% polysaccharide+5% astragaloside IV extracts do nothing or even shorten telomere faster. Only cycloastragenol and 70% polysaccharide+0.5% astralagoside IV extracts were slightly beneficial

[@arthurcard1152]

@@thomasmuller1850 TA 65. Powerhouse for lengthening !

[@ultimape]

I was under the impression that cronometer does not offer an API and is why I stopped using it. Looking forward to your app!

[@zerozzable]

Don't get your hopes up too high. In a recent video, I asked him in a comment if his app would be Proprietary or Free and Open Source, so that we (as a community) could examine the formulas, methods, and calculations for ourselves, and the comment was deleted. He wants to maximize profit for his work, no different that Cronometer, so expect little. I don't even blame him for wanting to maximize profit, but the dishonesty in deleting my comment just for asking about it makes me highly skeptical of the real usefulness of his future App.

[@ultimape]

@@zerozzable I mean, I paid for chronometer... there is a lot of value in using it but I specifically stopped because I couldn't do that kind of analysis myself easily. I can see why he thinks there is untapped value there.

[@ZulOCurran]

Is it canned or fresh sardines?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Canned

[@ZulOCurran]

@@conqueragingordietrying123 that’s is going to be my staple from now onwards.

[@ultimape]

@@ZulOCurran On twitter many people report having 'histamine reactions' to canned sardines. Not sure why, but worth keeping an eye on. Consumer labs did a report showing many brand are high in lead. I have no problem with them, but I also have a lot of fermented foods in my diet that work to fight histamine / heavy metals. In this case the selenium intake may be countering some of the heavy metals as it is a natural chelator. I get mine thru garlic.

[@AmarSingh-uc7px]

Telomere tests r quite expensive abt US$700 per test here.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

The test that I'm using is an epigenetic approximation, which may be better in terms of ACM risk, and comes with other epigenetic measures for a lower price.

[@nickmcdonald3083]

It seems like you have age expected biomarkers for all of these within a few SD, and what seems to be an outlier. Do you think this is a strong argument against the success of your endevor? Why or why not?

[@nickmcdonald3083]

7,118.125 ±27.349 is your 95% CI. There's barely any statistical significance to this data. We haven't considered measurement error either.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

@@nickmcdonald3083 Prior to this test, TL average was 7.1, SD = 0.05. Within 1SD, = 7.05 - 7.15. Within 2SD = 7 - 7.2. 7.24 is at least 2SDs from the mean, which is close to outlier status. Was that test-to-test variability or caused by an intervention? We'll see, especially if I can repeat the result or further increase TL beyond 2024's current average, 7.13.

[@jamesgilmore8192]

@@nickmcdonald3083 The approach is Bayesian and doesn't much care about making claims based on a p-value threshold. The approach breaks nearly all the frequentist rules regarding sample size and sample construction. p values are used as a strength of evidence measure in the approach. I'd also be including variable range, detected outliers, and sample clusters to deemphasize the p values. However, most people are not well versed in such things so Mike just presents the p-values for simplicity.

[@2piecesofwood1pieceofrope]

6500 mg of potassium a day?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Yep, it used to be more

[@georgesamaras2922]

Doesn't sardines contain saturated fat ?

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

Relatively small amounts compared with coconut butter, cacao beans...

[@johnhancock5542]

I am looking forward to your app which can take cronometer data & blood data. This should be a very useful tool.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

I agree, and thanks @johnhancock5542!

[@newdata]

omega3 and polyphenols and fats. a story of inflammation.

[@conqueragingordietrying123]

O3 is significantly correlated with a longer DNAmTL, but much weaker than cloves or SFA. Nonetheless, it could be involved... hsCRP and the kynurenine/tryptophan ratio are relatively low, which argues against inflammation in my case.