The AMA Club Model is Failing. Here's Why.

[@davidhuryn575]

The AMA lost me when they grabbed their ankles over remote ID. They saw this as a way to further monopolize flying via FRIAs and AMA Club fields. They serve their own interests only.

[@wraith657]

You took the words right out of my mouth.

[@michaelcasella4774]

Came here to say this but you said it better!

[@bigdatapimp]

100% agree. The AMA sold out the hobby in hopes they would be exempted, and not understanding old retired dudes are not enough to stay alive anymore.

[@dooddrones6521]

Exactly this. I joined AMA so I could go to MultiGP IO. Figured I might keep it so I would be able to join clubs and stuff but let it lapse as soon as the FAA started pushing remote id. The AMA's response to it was completely unacceptable. It's was very obvious they only cared about their interests. I think I even wrote in an email to them that I wanted my membership costs back due to their lack of lobbying for us.

[@RobertCookcx]

As technology of R/C aircraft has advanced, especially with the proliferation of relatively quiet FPV electrics, the risks and/or threats of operation has grown. Remote ID is a way to ensure an aircraft and it's owner can be identified. FRIA is something AMA has worked to accomplish so that RID modules are not required if operated in a recognized area. So, go get your RID if you don't want to fly at a sanctioned site but you are not side-stepping the requirements.

[@That_Puppet]

Genuinely the only thing keeping AMA alive is the idea that you need their insurance, and that membership is required to join basically any club in america

[@mh53eflyguy]

It's secondary to homeowners insurance, ergo, useless for many.

[@old-rcplane-phart]

& it SHOULDN'T be! As much as WE pay for ama, their insurance should resolve our problems for all the $$$ we GAVE over the yrs! SHOULD be like a few companies; if u don't use it/have a claim in 5 yrs, they SHOULD reimburse ur money at least half, mostly ALL!

[@NiclasHorn]

here in Sweden we need the insurance by law. we cannot do the hobby without our version of AMA. and if something happens and you dont have the insurance you are literally F:ed for life with BIG debt you get to pay for EVERYTHING in the accident and then the fine you get for not following the law.

[@NiclasHorn]

@@mh53eflyguy Here in Sweden homeonwer insurance dont cover any kind of "issue" created due to the hobby. we need by law be members in Swedish version of AMA if we dont want to live our rest of our life bankrupt and every "dollar" being taken by the bailiff from you salary.

[@monchichis333]

Like many insurance companies, it's just a scam.

[@sacrificialrubber779]

I’m almost 47, been flying since I was about 13-14, didn’t fly at/join a club till about 8 years ago and it’s just not worth the hassle/cost. Just disappointing.

[@josephdaulton3726]

I’m 48 ,started flying when is was 15👍,windser beach ,lake Havasu, Az

[@jdove6883]

Agreed. But I have to go far in the country to be able to fly.

[@scable-eq7bp]

Great video guys, for many years I was an AMA member and belonged to a local club and really enjoyed it but in the last ten years I have seen a change of attitude in a lot of our club members, they all seem to think that they are the safety officer of the day and have become real assholes. And I feel like the AMA abandoned their members when they started kissing the FAA's ass, so for me their membership was and still is useless. So did I quit flying, absolutely not, I went out and bought 40 acres of very flat land with very few trees on it and created my own private rc flying site. I do let a few of my close friends who fly have use of the field and they help maintain it. It's nice to get together with a few friends and just enjoy the hobby that we love so much. This property is 10 miles from town, about 100 miles from the closest airport and the closest neighbor is about a mile away. Life is good.... No AMA required and no yearly dues....

[@tonyyimbo]

Wow I need friends like you that sounds awesome

[@hobbyhermit66]

Sounds like Heaven on earth.

[@g2rc]

@scable-eq Wowsers! That is a r/c dream for me! I hope to buy lots of property with a house for me and family in Tennessee someday soon. I would definitely share the field with other local r/c flyers. Your doing the right thing. Keep living free!

[@CrstnJdiKnight]

That is how it should be 👍

[@stevethomas-cc5lz]

thats a good set up you have. ive got 3 acres . not good for planes bacause there a giant oak tree in middle of it, but i fly helis now so im happy with it. . seems like people dont understand that you DONT have to fly at a club field. you can fly anywhere !

[@CR-rb5hl]

First year membership at AMPS Glendale AZ is $225 plus AMA fees. That more than twice what I paid for my whole setup starting out. $225 is the cost of 8 cases of foam board. That's a lot of planes I could build. Also it's a 40 minute drive one way and sadly they weren't very friendly either. I wish them the best, but No thank you. I'll fly at the park 5 minutes from my house. FliteTest is the way to go. Plenty of free online plans, foam board, BBQ skewers, popsicle sticks, hot glue, and creativitey keeps this hobby cheap and fun.

[@kerrybassett4468]

you mentioned a key point, if you want to keep a hobby alive, don't give a new face at the field the cold shoulder and not talk to them. I joined the AMA in 1975, and almost every club I have visited over the years has acted like I was trespassing.

[@bopapa_1979]

@@kerrybassett4468 agreed. It is miserable but true. Model aviation clubs seem to wish they could be private entities, but the non-profit status makes them at least pretend new people are welcome. I am VERY lucky to have a local club that welcomed our whole family, including heli and drone pilots. It was a while before I realized this wasn't the norm.

[@donrichter3523]

@kerrybassett4468, I’m sure you were SO helpful and useful too. Like when the club had events and needed volunteers, I’m sure you were nowhere around.

[@kerrybassett4468]

@@donrichter3523 Actually I was SO helpful. The club I belonged to for many years was mostly WWII and Korean war vets, and a couple of younger guys. I did most of the mowing and field repairs and any time a new face showed up WE did greet them. Many of them got their first flying lesson right there on the spot. My experience with that club and it's members at that time are what makes me wonder what the future of the AMA might be. So donrichter3523 my suggestion to you is this, if you see an opportunity to introduce a new person to this hobby, step up, otherwise after us there will be no more.

[@notme976]

@@donrichter3523 You are the problem.

[@sacrificialrubber779]

After the remote id issue and the AMA not listening to the members At All, I refuse to join again. I’ll fly at the park or anywhere else

[@gmeisteraurora]

Thats OK if you only fly small foamies but bigger planes need more room. Also flying at a park is illegal without a RFID.;

[@magiofthoth]

Im under .55, still illegal? ​@@gmeisteraurora Faa rules are overbearing and push people out. A 50 dollar airhog knock off from hobby lobby needs an rfid per faa. If you think anyone needs that to be safe... Real, actual piloted manned planes have crashed on runways because they don't have rfid correct on their planes. What makes you think people with less money will actively go out and screw themselves more? Meanwhile the faa implemented the worst version of the 4 possibilities for RFID. Money is all the faa wanted from this, and that's what they got. Now if you'll excuse the rest of the hobby pilots who don't care if they fly at a cemetery, Forrest, bando, or in an open field..

[@sacrificialrubber779]

@@gmeisteraurora it’s a HOBBY. The government has absolutely No Businesses criminalizing it. You know how many issues there have been with RC airplanes in the 30 years I’ve been flying? NONE. You go ahead and bend over for the government…ever heard of government overreach? This is a Prime example, if you can’t see that I’m truly sorry for you.🤦‍♂️

[@EmpReb]

⁠@@gmeisteraurorayou are the reason it’s worse. Stop saying RFID good and comply. That’s why I’m not going back into the hobby. They destroyed freedom I had in for no damn good reason.

[@RickEllis-w6f]

@@gmeisteraurora Well let's be honest... there's a ton of stuff that's "technically" not legal. Do you honestly think that's stopping anyone?

[@AchronTimeless]

AMA intentionally threw multi-rotor pilots under the bus when they were given preferential treatment by the FAA. Being the only CBO for a while, their rule book literally became law, and they made sure to effectively make common racing events illegal by limiting battery sizes, limiting FPV use until you complete a series of training (which you have to pay the AMA for) which doesn't even make sense for multi-rotor, rolling over on the whole Remote ID thing because they saw FRIAs as a way to force people to be members... What have they ever done for me that I'd give them a cent? May they crash and burn, we don't need them.

[@dooddrones6521]

💯

[@drewski6974]

Agree. This is the only reason the other CBOs have been forced into existence.

[@heycheckthatout]

Race events illegal by battery size? Limit fpv use until you complete training? And have to pay for said training? I don’t know who is telling that but, absolutely not true. Have been to many ama fields and flown at them (and not fpv only fields). Also have had ama a long time. Worked in the hobby industry for 15 years. Spreading stuff like this is what also causes people not to join the hobby. Check your facts before spreading something you heard or were told by some 80 year old at a field gatekeeping told you. Check yourself. If this is stopping you from flying, good news then as they are lieing to you. Go fly, have fun, and dont stress. Look at ama rules not bitter old men at a glider clubs rules.

[@AchronTimeless]

@@heycheckthatout Read it myself. At the time they limited race batteries to 4S, and no FPV without their certification. It was in their own documents on their own site.

[@MS-ig7ku]

The AMA killed the model airplane hobby too, they have made no effects to advocate for anyone. It is insane. They basically lost all the bones the FAA gave them under Obama under Biden.

[@FPVREVIEWS]

When the AMA stood there next to Michael Huerta of the FAA and stood silently while we were criminalized, with our clean record of safety, while people are dying almost every day in GA, and 737’s full of people are making smokin holes 🕳️ in the ground, that’s when they dug all our graves. Thanks 🙏 AMA

[@user-no1cares]

I’m a Part 91 pilot.I have significant experience with the FAA for that & also as an A&P/IA. I gave up the RC hobby when the FAA decided to control what I do with my toys.

[@MrCubflyer]

I did to becauseI knew it was just a matter of time before our flying hobby wa s going to be either gone or very limited.

[@MS-ig7ku]

Aluminumized mylar balloons do millions in damage to the power grid every year, and thousands of aircraft are hit by birds each year, yet they go after model airplanes that cause almost no damage to anyone.

[@magiofthoth]

​@@MrCubflyersad to see these comments. I got back into flying qwads recently, I'm actuvly doing what I can to stay flying as long as possible without a 107. Love this hobby. And hate to see people who know what they're doing, leave the hobby

[@sneezyferret6482]

@@magiofthoth I'd be back flying tomorrow and getting my kids involved, if it weren't for the MAAC and the FAA and what they did to us with the regulations.

[@rc-fannl7364]

They also didn't seem to do much when remote ID was being introduced, possibly because their terrains would remain exempt from the obligation to use Remote ID, so maybe they were hoping to get more members. But the modern RC flyer is more individual, either flies alone, or with a few friends, and look for info on the internet

[@old-rcplane-phart]

& THAT there is y the ama is absolute 💩 to me imo.

[@AchronTimeless]

Oh, they did a lot to ensure it would happen and be as annoying as possible for everyone else. I'll never join the AMA because of that. I don't need runways to fly.

[@JeffWok]

1987 - I got my first job. Dreamed of flying RC. Joined AMA, bought 2 pay checks worth of gear got no help at the local field. Did it my self, killed my plane. 2015 - I discover Flite Test and I'm a better pilot than your mom. The AMA has never done anything for me. In fact, it's quite the opposite.

[@dieterweik6858]

Exact same story here, only I started in 1980. The AMA membership fee is a tax you have to pay to join a club.

[@Premier-Media-Group]

+1 for Flite Test

[@gmeisteraurora]

I don't understand no help at the local field. Every field I fly at is open to newbees

[@JeffWok]

@@gmeisteraurora In my case there were two guys that acted like they were royalty. If you did what one said the other would chew your ass and vice versa. No help.

[@darrellcook8253]

I remember having to tell some club members to piss up a rope when they would put me down for not flying foam or arf junk, I design and fly better fliers than is currently on the market and wont take their abuse without resistance. The AMA is too expensive, it's insurance is shaky and some of the people running it are horrible jerks. Well guess what? I QUIT. No more time wasted dealing with bossy nothings. And I'm dumping the airplanes and equipment.

[@codemaster442]

No, i've had several friends try to get their vehicle fixed after a plane crashed into it. They tell you that you have to use your home owners insurance.....

[@TailHeavyProductions]

Yep! AMA insurance is secondary.

[@old-rcplane-phart]

Then y have ama if they're that useless!

[@RCwithJim]

@@old-rcplane-phart Cause a car accident or major medical injury and your homeowner's/renters limit will be quickly reached, this is where 60$ a year for secondary insurance makes sense.

[@dougboss6391]

@@old-rcplane-phart AMA insurance largely protects the land owner. WIthout it there would be WAY fewer places to fly. Legally or not

[@weseehowcommiegoogleis3770]

@@RCwithJim Keep eating the Goob you're fed!

[@MJPope3235]

The truth is, most clubs don’t want newcomers. They go through the motions and have an open house, or the young kids come out once a week. However, they are very happy to see them leave and not show up to the field regularly. There seems to be an attitude of “come out, look, don’t touch anything and go home”. Most RC club guys, make the model train folks seem down right friendly. Every club seems to have the one or two members that go out of their way to help someone new, but that guy is definitely the exception nowadays. Combine that with the occasional pancake breakfast and the know it all flightline peanut gallery, what’s not to love…

[@CR-rb5hl]

I have always been treated nice by train guys.

[@larrybremer4930]

I have had that experience too but its been a long time since I have been in the hobby. I remember with so few fields around I would hear of a club field and show up but then get swarmed by a bunch of Karens who first ask for your proof of AMA in hopes you cant pass that barrier, they they ask who is the club member sponsoring you to which I would respond "nobody, but this field is on the AMA list (or I was sent by the local hobby shop)" to which they would say something like "well you cant fly here unless your a club member". It was honestly easier and better to just find your own open spaces to fly. I eventually changed to Heli's just so I no longer needed to go to a flying field at all since you can literally fly from your own driveway. The old guard codgers who were not helpful and often protective of their turf are what turned me off the hobby and the closure of nearly ever flying field in Orange County CA finished off the hobby.

[@George-nt8uw]

😂😂😂 I actually dropper drones and went to model railroading wholeheartedly. At least here I will never have to worry about my trains running above the 400 scale feet altitude. I started flying R/C model airplanes in the 60's. After about a decade, I stopped flying due to change in location. Now I am in my late 70's, I wanted to take to the air again with something that didn't fly like a wasp that was stung by a hornet. I chose drones. Then came the incessant attack by the FAA. I just couldn't keep up with shower of rule-changes. I stopped again waiting for my flying area(within 5 miles of an airport) to be cleared by the FAA. that took over two years. I was about to purchase an under-250gm-model, but the open can of Karens and the ignorance of the local law enforcement people changed my mind. The new rules coupled with the insane potential fines did it for me. What I think about the FAA and AMA I can't say here as my mother would wash my mouth with Clorox!

[@larrybremer4930]

@@George-nt8uw This is where a good PC and flight simulator can scratch much of that itch. That is what I do now and have over time accumulated a pretty comprehensive home cockpit setup with physical switches, button, knobs, instruments, and controls. I am probably 10k into it but probably the best hobby money I ever spent and unlike an RC or Drone, a crash costs you nothing.

[@SobeMe86]

I would argue that part of the reason AMA did very little with the Remote ID and FRIA fiasco is to force people to join clubs again, instead of actually putting an effort in on their side to make it enjoyable and beneficial to join a club.

[@spindash64]

Then they grossly miscalculated

[@scottmilano2940]

The FAA gave the AMA FRIAs and to legally fly without RID you have to join both the AMA and a club. Their "lobbying" is very self serving. I'd rather join one of the other CBOs.

[@old-rcplane-phart]

OR not 'tell'. F em

[@dooddrones6521]

I'd rather just give the middle finger to everyone and go out to enjoy my hobby. Which is exactly what I do

[@drewski6974]

Which is bullshit. The AMA clubs gate keeping access to a FRIA should be reprimanded by the FAA. FRIAs should have some level of guaranteed access like airports, making them public use. After all they wouldnt approve FRIAs in peoples yards and private spaces. AMA needs to have their hand slapped by the FAA for their broken policies.

[@dooddrones6521]

@@drewski6974 Yeah, let’s give the FAA more power 🙄. I agree that FRIAs should be open to the public though.

[@asommer518]

@@drewski6974 LOL good luck with that. ANYONE can create CBO and get a FRIA get off your ass and do it.

[@zstanman482]

Stop waiting for the AMA to grow your club. That's like waiting for the government to make you rich. Put your big boy pants on and get to work. Our club has grown over the past couple of years after a long downslide. We simply got to work. We began networking with the community. We have a booth at every air show, public event, hobby show, etc. We chose a charity to support for every event and invite charity representatives to every event. We also aggressively went after youth. We started a whole youth division and created their own events, instruction and budget. We also raised our dues...which is no problem when you're offering something worth while, just ask Apple. Now our problem is too many people at the field.

[@TailHeavyProductions]

That’s the only way to quick progress right now for sure - which we mention at 13:14. 👍

[@Catfoolyou]

Man, I wish I had a club like that nearby.

[@FlyingBuzzard]

BUT thanks to your AMA sell out comrades , you will have to PAY to fly no matter where you are and have to have NETWOK ID equipment to do so...Yes it is coming and SOON

[@hotheadedfilmshhf6734]

@@Catfoolyousame. My club president just embezzled over 9 grand and now the air field will probably get shut down. Im about to turn my 130 mph F-16 into a park flyer. Im tired of all this bullshit.

[@George-nt8uw]

@@Catfoolyou Start one!

[@twillison8824]

There's only one hobby store left in my area, and they only stock vehicles. When I was young, there were many.

[@ModelA]

I started flying in 1970's. Joined WAM in 1977. I was 9 years old. Joined AMA in the mid 80's. My AMA number was 153827. I used to fly competitions etc. I flew pattern and IMAC. All was good until the drones took over. I ditched AMA when they failed to push back against allowing the FAA to require model airplane pilots to "register". Absolute FAIL on AMA's part. They didn't push back at all, they just totally gave in and "helped" negotiate the FAA rules. To heck with AMA. The FAA doesn't know the difference between a model airplane and a drone thanks to you. Instead, I paved a runway on my own property and I fly at home. Done. No, I don't do the ID crap. And I still use 72 MHz.!!

[@superscottorama]

I guess im a lucky one. I am a board member of my club and we work hard and pretty much non stop on being inviting to potential members, keeping the website updated, being visible to the community with flight training and events we have, participating in community events to try and inform the public of what we do. This year we have 15 new members because of all this hard work. It takes some special people to do all of this and it does take effort but it can be done!

[@101sabre]

As being a part of a large club , and a board member, we have worked hard to get new members . We signed up 6 new members in the last 2 weeks . Same stuff you are doing. Thanks for making the hobby great again.

[@ModelA]

Does your club allow people to join who refuse to comply with the tyranny of FAA registration?

[@superscottorama]

@@ModelA we dont police faa registration, we leave it up to the individual to comply...or not.

[@andyerwin3535]

The AMA has lost its way and traditions, Bending over to the FAA didn’t help

[@0BirdsEyeView0]

Word.

[@benjaminnevins5211]

AMA is spineless. I started doing rocketry when the NAR/TRA sued the ATF and won. AMA never did anything for their pilots.

[@arielr9614]

THIS!!, The AMA, EAA, and corporations actively colluded to bring down the FAA into a realm the FAA never belonged in. Then they tried to turn around and blame non members for the regulations. The FAA has really done a great job tough...... Completely giving away the drone industry to DJI and all the overseas outfits making Remote ID pods. Hopefully with the overturning of the 40 year old Chevron deference case, someone will take the FAA to court and get them out of model hobby. Since them extending their paws into the hobby is not what congress put them there for. Don't forget, Remote ID was an idea brought to the table by them as a "You can't ban us here, we are the good guys", look we have this nifty Idea called Remote ID, sends out a beacon that can be read and you can track drones. FAA goes "really, when can this be ready" DJI "Well, its already built into our drones, and we can even pre program rules on them". The hobby as a whole was sold out by major clubs and overseas companies looking to corner a market while the FAA charges a $5 dollar extortion fee.

[@JordanColeman-r8w]

Went to the local field one time and decided it wasn't for me pretty quickly. As a scratch builder who uses foam board I had a lot of people giving me weird looks. Taught myself to fly with zero help and enjoy my time flying alone.

[@MS-ig7ku]

@@JordanColeman-r8w That is the issue the AMA Clubs are for old guys flying giant RC planes, the average small balsa and foam planes are quite different. Their regulations were made for large and heavy planes.

[@zone6eric13]

Ditto. There is an AMA field 1 mile from my house. Visited 15 years ago and was turned off. I learned on my own property with foam airplanes and never visited them again. They are still there with half the cars in the parking lot now.

[@MS-ig7ku]

The problem started when they didn't oppose registration of small model airplaines. Also the AMA did nothing to fight the unfair demonization of model airplanes over the last two decades.

[@Mode1RC]

they did oppose it, and the result is that small model aircraft do not require registration. Or RID if flown at a FRIA.

[@AAronFpv]

You forgot the FAA closed a bunch of long-standing flying fields, too. Some clubs are no longer accessible due to the FAA as well as gatekeeping, not allowing fpv or drones

[@tonyyimbo]

Idk why people would wanna fly fpv drones in a n empty field though that seems really boring

[@AAronFpv]

@tonyyimbo chasing rc planes is a lot of fun, actually plenty to do if you're creative. Yes open fields are definitely not our cup of tea but the reception I got 8yrs ago was not a warm one. I was told I had to fly in a little box next to the parking lot. I never went back

[@magiofthoth]

​@@tonyyimbobecause we aren't in an open field. 😅 Also we "always have line of sight" and "Always have a spotter" Faa has no care for a hobbiest, treat the hobby like it's skateboarding. Respect where you do it, be safe of you and those around you, leave the place nicer than when you came. And gtfo without being told to leave 😂

[@mirandakarr-paepke2362]

​@@magiofthoth that's a great example! And before you go getting pissy, i'm a drone racer, and i enjoy freestyle flying too. But the influx of drone flyers act like the skateboarders in the 90's. they don't respect where to fly, they fly over people, They have a place they can go fly(like skaters have skateparks), but still choose to go all over the city, and into places they know damn well they aint suppose to be to flying. Whenever i show up i have to specifically tell them i am not the bad side of drone pilots. and see that is never like that with airplanes. The drone people went out and gained a negative stigma on themselves. So don't come complaining that the group is getting treated badly. the plane guys aren't out flying in random places. the plane guys aren't smashing into kids. the plane guys are not smashing into helicopters. the plane guys aren't flying near prisons or airports. So dont get mad at the FAA for having to treat us differently. WE did it to ourselves. I dont like it either, but the blame falls on the crappy fpv pilots. And the plane guys have a legit reason to be mad. until the drone ppl came around they were free to enjoy their hobby. everyone blames delivery drones, but where are they? if they created the laws wouldnt we of seen them by now?

[@Mach3RC]

Love this video. This all needs to be talked about more. Or maybe just listened to more. I got into the RC hobby this year and everything said in this video is 100% accurate. The entire hobby feels like it's generations behind and there are simple things that can be done to update or at least make it not so intimidating to get into. Really appreciate this video and I hope the AMA gives it a watch. Would love to see this hobby get a breath of fresh air!

[@skylarking12]

My perspective is, the hobby is jeopardized over increasingly strict FAA regulations and Dwindling access to flying sites and parks, leaving dwindling farm land for sites. The parks don't want the insurance liability of planes mixing in spaces where little kids play, and the AMA insurance no longer impresses them, because insurance is for after something terrible has already happened. The FAA rules are creating no-fly zones all around and in town as well. That farm land oasis for RC operations is shrinking due to developers, and so you have to drive farther and farther out to find an unplanted bean field you can rent. That field rental was relatively high back in my day, and I'm sure it costs even more now. If you can find enough members to create a club, their dues, just for the land to fly on, become untenable on a middle-class salary. That was how my club died: the majority were good old boys with ugly sticks and introductory pattern trainers. Most of them made a middle class or lower wage, with a couple of doctors or car salesmen mixed-in who flew expensive scale and Pattern planes. Their first field cost members about 50 a year in rent per member. Life was good, the club was popular and tied to a local hobby shop with good synergy. I told the guys; "we need to do what the golfers did: own our land, before someone else takes it away from us." To a man, none were interested in spending money on land, versus spending it on more planes. They kicked the can down the road. $25- $50 a year for field rent and the AMA membership was all they wanted to spend. Remember, they weren't rich guys; good radios and servos and motors and good engines and fuel were relative costly. Then the Big mail-order houses like Tower Hobbies started running the local hobby shacks out of business. The internet came soon after, and not only exacerbated that decline, it added new distractions and attractions for youth to compete with our hobby. And you could do that at home, no driving out miles to a field, no needing your parents to drive you there and hang out and bring you home, we lost the youth market there and then. No hobby shops to drive new members, no kids wanting to get into it, the hobby became demographically top-heavy with ever-older guys with no new blood coming in. Then the railroad right of way came through and chased us out of there. The next field they found was a half hour drive further out of town; "The developers will never come out this far!" they grinned. Member dues went to a hundred. We put in money and a lot of sweat equity to install a gravel drive and parking pad, add an access gate, Raise a hard-roofed sun shelter, emplace a shed for the field mower, set up an old scary porta-john over a trench in the corner of the lot, which the spiders and wasps enjoyed thoroughly... Our new club's land was bought out from under them barely two years later. Field three was a barter situation with a farmer who also wanted to learn to fly, and who had conservation acreage he couldn't grow on, and was getting a stipend for from the government. So the land was "free", but his landlord needed a cut of the income so dues were still in place, some for the landlord, some for mowing the grass. Dues still a hundred per year, no amenities, like a gravel drive from the road to mud-free parking, no hard sun/rain shelter structure, no porta-potty, no electricity or water. And it was now 45 minutes drive time one-way. Even with long summer evenings, anybody with a job was hard pressed to get done with work and make the commute out to the field and have enough time to get some flights in before sunset. Without the gravel drive and parking pad, the field was impassable most of the spring and part of the fall due to seasonal rains. Too far, too expensive, too limited and unreliable. Then the farmer got bored with RC and pissed off after the selfish pattern pros flew over his roof one time too many. We got the boot, and nobody could find another field, so the club folded, and some members joined another club what had bought their strip of land years ago.

[@gregbrigden2909]

The first club I joined had purchased 40 acres of land a few years before I became a member. The field was close to town and the club was in control of their own destiny. I moved away a number of years ago but went back this summer for a weekend to do some flying. Had a great time visiting the field where I got my start in the hobby.

[@mirandakarr-paepke2362]

@@gregbrigden2909 since they own their own land, are they their own club or still make ppl be ama? My club owns the land and we aren't an ama club.

[@gregbrigden2909]

@@mirandakarr-paepke2362 The club is in Canada. They require membership in MAAC which is the AMA equivalent.

[@obtv6827]

I quit AMA when they complied with remote ID.

[@old-rcplane-phart]

There's 12 in the group I fly with bi-weekly. Of all of them that were the full members, I kept mine but I'm park pilot now. Just in case. Hopefully, soon, 1 day, eventually, we'll have our own spot.

[@larrylaitner3473]

Me too. My nearest flying club would be a forty minute drive, and they have never welcomed electric planes, so I illegally fly at a local soccer field without remote ID. I don't really need a national organization that sold me out, and I don't need a local club that doesn't want to deal with electric planes.

[@MS-ig7ku]

Going along with registration was the real problem.

[@JN24185]

I’ll pay a ticket before I put a remote ID on a single plane. That being said, I’ve never had a single person complain or bother me. A little common sense and respect seems to go a long way when it comes to choosing places to fly.

[@magiofthoth]

​@@JN24185this! For every pilot, fixed wing to gas powered scale modules, qwads to DIY aircraft. So long as we aren't Philly drone life with the 190k fine for flying whoops in a city.

[@gryfandjane]

Excellent video! I got into RC via Flite Test, building my own aircraft from their plans and buying a few of their kits. I’ve also been to every Ohio Flite Fest to date (ten years)… I love the atmosphere, seeing entire families embracing the hobby, kids building planes in the STEM Tent, the crazy experimental builds, and the simple joy of making things that fly. Flite Fest has become an annual pilgrimage where I can rekindle my enthusiasm for RC flight. I love the whole grassroots feeling. Even though I’ve kept up my membership in our local RC club, I haven’t been to the field in over a year. Let me state up front that I’m a bit of an introvert, and not the clubby type. That said, the atmosphere is so different at the club field that I just can’t get that interested in going anymore. I can understand the good-natured razzing about my “cardboard” FT models… I just tell them that I fly the boxes their store-bought planes came in 😊… but the overall impression is that of a handful of older guys (and I’m 68 myself) keeping up traditions. There are usually no kids or younger folks present, and I miss that a lot. I’m just a big kid at heart. Again, I feel bad saying this, but the club approach no longer appeals. Your video nailed many of my feelings, and I wanted to send you a big thumbs-up and a Thank You.

[@wraith657]

I was part of a club for years. Owned and run by a bunch of geriatrics. Literally was run like a military facility. Had to lock and unlock the gate in and out. Only one person at a time was allowed to fly, and only allowed to fly in one pattern. I'm a 3D pilot. ONLY members were allowed. So when I wanted to show my wife the club, and my flying skills, She wasn't even allowed onto the property. Sometimes, I liked to just hang out, and watch others fly. They had a rule, that if you were there at all, you had to fly at least once an hour. Screw all of that. I just fly at the high school behind my neighborhood now. Best part, I don't need to participate in their stupid events, and no more expensive dues.

[@sps3172]

Sounds hard to believe. Name some names.....what club was this? What city?

[@asommer518]

@@sps3172 I agree exactly NOT how are club is.

[@Neuguy69]

The one that isn't getting his money.

[@iclmb510]

@@sps3172Not hard to believe for me. I haven’t seen rules for visitors as strict as what he described but I can easily image a club being like that. I was Ana AMA member for years and I’ve seen a couple clubs where the rules were close to what he described. Clubs can do whatever they want and have whatever rules they think they need. I choose not to be a member of the AMA or clubs anymore because the AMA doesn’t represent me and a lot of clubs can be unwelcoming for newcomers. That’s my experience. If you love your club that’s awesome, stick with it. Some of us are done with clubs and the AMA.

[@gregbrigden2909]

That club sounds like the exception rather than the rule. The first club I joined was very welcoming of new members. There was 2 or 3 members that taught me how to fly. Family members were encouraged to come out to the field. It was the best experience for someone new to the hobby.

[@RocketBurn11]

Local club near me also requires a fee and permit from the local parks and rec department in addition to all the barriers to entry you listed. Flying my paramotor is way less of a pain than flying my big planes, and guess what I never fly my big planes anymore.

[@drewc7389]

I only fly sub 250g aircraft now. Plenty of them out there, don't need to be a member of a club, the AMA, no FAA registration and can run to any number of schools or parks in the area.

[@logo10flyer]

“… and can run to any number of schools or parks in the area.” If it’s legal where you live. It is not where I live.

[@George-nt8uw]

@@logo10flyer Change that, don't just accept it.

[@warmfreeze]

plane= $300+ on average then they go to the local field who wants you to be an AMA member.. AMA=$85/year.. then then the club wants dues anyware from $65-$200/year.. by then people are usually too discouraged to even fly.. people are struggeling to buy food much less dump $500 in an attempt to fly a plane. Back in the 90s when i was a kid i was lucky to have a great group that would just throw a radio in your hands with a trainer cord.. there was no one standing there spectating, if you came there from curiosity, you flew.. no questions asked..

[@DanielCValot]

The problem is that you need to belong to a club to buy the insurance for aabout $80.00 per year here in So. CAl. I never go to any meetings, I do not have the time nor interest You really need ins?????? YOUR HOMEOWNERS INS PAYS! This means the AMA ins will only cover the extra if your hmeowners ins comes up short, which most likely never happen! If you live in an appartment or rent a place and do not have renters ins, you are screwed! At the flying fields where we fly or on the slopes at the beach or hills, there are always people there and happy to help you, just ASK! This is a great video, just go with your friends and have a good time

[@David-hm9ic]

Many homeowners' policies expressly exempt aviation activities from coverage. The AMA does not require that someone belongs to a club to become an AMA member and have insurance coverage.

[@mattthomford4462b]

Great works guys, I know a lot of time & research went into this, so TY. I have been piloting RC planes for 20 years now, and yet to have seen any club offered event to visit or fly at that would allow anything other than the traditional 1 pilot, 1 plane out flying at a time. I suppose this is why I envy watching your videos so much. I could imagine walking passed the imaginary line at my club and being screamed like I was 4 year old. I can't even bring my kid to the field to see if they want fly, there is another rule, needs to go.

[@dougboss6391]

Sorry thats your experience. Most clubs have multiple flying stations and allow multiple people flying at once. Often they try to keep fixed wing with fixed wing and Helis with elis etc but Ive often seen 6 orr 8 people flying at once at clubs her. Sometimes the clubs know that some pilots are underskilled and they don't fly when those pilots are up but that becomes pretty clear pretty quick

[@paulboberg5512]

The clubs the problem I have just returned from a event (non AMA) were a young teenager flying my Voltec Corsair and I flying my Voltec cub were chasing each other all over the sky and it was a blast. Did discover a new danger, trying to watch the other guy while all so flying your plane. No disasters but some thrilling saves.

[@Contraption2112]

Once again an excellent video. Thank you, and keep up the good work!

[@Poolguppy101]

fuck the ama, fuck remote id, fuck clubs(for annual fee's to use the property that for the most part my taxes paid for anyways, our local club is on a state lake and is owned by the core off engineers.) fuck any kind of regulation that is aimed at any of our freedoms. I fly at home on my 5 acres and I fucking DARE the FAA to show up at my house. 🤷‍♂️ we already get taxed multiple times for single purchases, even small purchases. more and more regulation comes down on us every month. I'll fly my plane on my property whenever the fuck I want, if I hear a real plane or helicopter in the distance, I'll always get my plane on the ground, and give the right away even though all the flights over my house are at least at 3k ft. I understand the whole lobbying for us, but at the end of the day, it's hard to really see what they actually do with the money that they make off of members, I trust them as far as I can throw them. THE MAIN PROBLEM IS HUMANS. HUMANS ARE DISGUSTING AND WILL DO ANTTHING FOR POWER OR MONEY, EVEN IF ITS WRONG.

[@pauljohnson3454]

What shitfight it is in Australia. You can't even get model master paint.

[@matthewstacey4123]

Yeah I joined the ama just to try and get access to more flying information. I do large motor gliders, fpv quads, and small fpv planes. I went and checked out 2 clubs in the Pnw and it was one of the least welcoming experiences in the rc hobby I’ve experienced. I race 1/10 buggy for fun after getting in to rc crawling in the late 00’s. Crawler scene everyone welcoming and helpful. Rc race buggy scene helpful and welcoming. Fpv quads and planes same as above. Show up at an ama club field to check out if it would be worth joining and at one club the first thing out of someone’s mouth was this is a private club and I needed to be a member to be there. Also it was a Saturday afternoon and there wasn’t a person under 60 in sight and knew it wasn’t for me. Other club had so many rules and regulations to join and fly with an expensive membership and lost interest. I’ll continue to fly at gravel pits and locations in the middle of nowhere with people who are enjoyable to be around.

[@HikerDave57]

I may eventually graduate from my little trainer airplane and join the local AMA club but when I was investigating the hobby at the big local AMA field (on county property) I rode up on my motorcycle and watched for a while but was given the evil eye as if I had leprosy. I guess that the time of the fellow retirees was precious. Others have told me they had similar experiences. My experience going to the much closer park was that the aviation enthusiasts (ex airline and air force pilots) were very welcoming. They had nothing gain but were pretty friendly and gave me the advice I needed to get started. I could have gotten dual instruction and still could. Since then I've been to another popular local flying field and also had great experiences and acceptance. People who belong to the first club told me that it takes a lot of time to break in there but also that I might just have gone on the wrong day; there isn't always a good vibe. Nice to know that they will be there when and if I need them but for now no way am I going anywhere near that place.

[@maxsmodels]

I love that you used Hurricane Hobbies in Jacksonville, FL. It is a great shop.

[@gewglesux]

That the place that's packed liked my colon with models? top to bottom? I heard about that place

[@redwineisfine]

Rc clubs have managed to turn people away more than they have created assistance. Rules for thee but not for me... is absolutely the moto at my local field. Abysmal relationship building

[@davidkimbler4744]

I never relied on someone else to teach me anything. I have always successfully taught myself!

[@old-rcplane-phart]

I can't learn by reading or being taught. MisTtakess is the best teacher.

[@rcflugzeit8420]

👍 Me too!

[@VelezBiH]

This video was very relatable. As a brand new pilot interested in learning to fly RC planes, i ended up going to my local club asking them for help. This was my experience. I reached out to them over the email and i was told their member in charge of training new pilots would respond and give me all the details needed how to schedule training and get going with the club. I waited a week and never heard back. I decided to visit the club and their flying field and talk to some members there and i can say that my feeling of welcome there as new pilot were mixed. Some were nice others were reserved. I talked to one there to see how to go about getting the training and he mentioned to stop by during the monthly club meetings and he would introduce me to the members there. The meeting that day was scheduled to be held at the flying field, and when i showed up to my surprise no one was there. I waited about 20 min and left. I reached again over the email to the club member and the guy that was suppose to give me details on the training and actually train me to fly responds and says they moved the meeting to another location that day. I had no way of knowing that and so at that point i was just frustrated and gave up. I am still intrastate in rc flying and honestly i want to go the solo route now and just learn myself. Going through the clubs is to much hassle in my experience so far. I also have small kids at home which allow me only so much free time if any for hobbies. I dont have time to run after people and hope they will give me information or hoping they are willing to teach me to fly in the first place. The tech in the new trainer airplanes makes it much more easy to successful flying on your own, and information available on you tube i think there is greater chance to succeed on your own then ever before.

[@russc3288]

Your experience unfortunately is more prevalent than not. And with small children to consider makes it even more frustrating. I would warn you though that without an experienced pilot to guide you through some of the Safety considerations involved, would be taking a risk. LiPo battery usage, charging and storing is just one. Surrounding crowd exposure another and most important - knowing when and how to avoid damaged fingers from a rotating prop. Yes you can lose fingers. Something often used and would be something your children could enjoy too would be a Flight Simulator program. Excellent tool for learning rc control and flight education but not a replacement for hands on with a trained pilot beside you. These radios's, planes, and parts are not cheap. It's not IF you'll crash - ITS when. Keep after the club guys to find that certain individual that will help. It will be well worth your time. I know from my own experience. Good luck and stay SAFE.

[@MrFester63]

I'm one of the fortunate. I joined a great club, the Arizona Model Aviators in Mesa, AZ. They helped me get started with a great instructor (thank you Tim Dickey), and lots of support. I now live in WA and come across another excellent club, Mt. Rainier Radio Control Society (celebrating their 60th anniversary!!). These clubs offer great locations, tons of support, events, & outreach programs/events. I'm grateful for these groups and look forward to being a part of them for as long as I can. ✌

[@CR-rb5hl]

I've heard good things about the club in Mesa. It is just a long drive (50 miles) for me so I have never been there. I'm sure AMPS has good people in it too. It really was the membership fee and AMA fee that killed it for me.

[@101sabre]

Thanks for the kind words David, we put in a lot of work to keep the club functioning. We owe a lot to our founders and generations before us . We strive to make at least one capital improvement every year. Keep members interested in the club and coming to the meetings. We have lots of new faces this year. If anyone is in the Tacoma ,WA area and want to fly or just want to visit , contact us through the website , You are welcome here.

[@MichaelRoberts-t7c]

I generally do not join anything, the last club I joined was the US Navy in 1975. I have been building large scale models sonce I was 9 and I am 68 yrs old now. I did check into joining a club and learned all the negative aspects, drive time, expensive dues, insurance requirements, waiting hours to fly, club rules, etc. I bought a 40 acre farm to fly on and eliminated all the problems associated with clubs. I don't miss being hassled and field maintenance is now all me. Fair trade off, in my opinion I win.

[@wjadams2]

All great ideas. I've been an AMA member and have flown r/c airplanes for over 30 years. I've been flying drones for about 8 years. I've been to meetings where they discussed drones and they do not get it. They would rather protect their own interests and not branch out. They tried to sell people on dedicated drone parks and not push clubs to embrace drone pilots in to their clubs. They consider them the enemy and why government regulation is in place. They did it to themselves and they will either adapt or cease to exist.

[@BillLeake-k1m]

So what’s the next step to fix all the shortcomings identified in the video? I suggest creating a to do list and prioritize it.

[@Squid_Wizard70]

I have not joined one because of the price to just get to the club.

[@DaAznPrince]

The points around 4 minutes are on point when tried to rejoin my old club after 7 years. 125 members in the 2000s to now 55.

[@BullyBreedRC]

The overlap is real. I'm a basher that got into flying last year. Our local flying club used to have a couple basher ramps... but they stopped allowing cars/trucks "due to insurance" 🙄🙄

[@Tobashadow]

Local flying club is $85 a month plus mandatory AMA membership and mandatory "instruction" and mandatory checks. I went good luck to yha and went five miles away to the local soccer field which had more room.

[@maximus431]

Been flying for 60 years and never joined anything. Find an empty field parking lot and go,never had a problem

[@lienmeat]

I have an AMA membership and used to fly at Mar-c in Redmond, WA very regularly, and did training there, which was a good experience, and it seems like a well-run club (I have no experience with others). But, I more often fly small scratch built foamboard planes at parks much closer to me (Mar-C is a 30-40 min drive). But flying at any old park has a serious downside, and that's having to be even more careful about dog walkers and children when you want to take off and land. Not a huge deal with a 250g foamboard plane, but it means I don't fly my Timber X very often anymore. The other downside is no community around it at a regular park, where a club there will almost always be someone there that will probably talk your ear off. The AMA honestly isn't a factor for me, as I have the money to not care about the fee, but it's a big deal to younger people that are cash strapped. Clubs really need IMO to have a day on weekends, every weekend, where anyone can come fly with club member supervision without the AMA membership (like a weekly fun fly). I know that's a lot of cost and potential risk, but that's what I think it would take to get new people into the hobby AND make them consider joining a club before just flying at any old park.

[@ShadowVFX]

I completely agree about having "free fly" days for non-members and beginners to check out a field. But the thing I always hear club members mentioned is that without ama, there's too much liability. I personally don't believe this, because I have never met anybody, ever, who actually utilized the AMA Insurance when an incident occurred. It always took a hit on their own homeowners insurance. So, I don't believe the AMA insurance excuse is valid, but it's what you'll hear repeated over and over again.

[@lienmeat]

@@ShadowVFX yep, homeowners or I think renters insurance will generally always be what gets used first if at all possible. I think the AMA insurance aspect is a scam. I've never heard about them paying out.

[@coffeejoe3494]

You only touched on one subject. I’m in the Chicago area, and the clubs only have old men that are assholes. I won’t back down from these old jagoffs, but what about the new people that get run off? I know there are days where I want to fly, but decided against it just because I don’t feel like dealing with the old dogs……..

[@bradrock7731]

I'm 70 & feel the same way! Heh..Heh I have a hayfield about 10 acres. So I use that when the grass is cut short a couple times a year. And no one sees my mistakes ................

[@coffeejoe3494]

@@bradrock7731 I’m jealous

[@tonyyimbo]

Same to Minnesota .

[@alberry4201]

I also live in the Chicago area and not all persons of the club where bad but had it’s share of arrogant a##holes and said enough when my father in law passed and my planes are hanging in the garage for almost 15 years.

[@SturdyOakTree]

Excellent commentary. I’ve experienced much of what is mentioned and your examples of what could help are right on. Oh-I’m 67 years old and still feel this way.

[@aja9469]

Ive been trying to break into the hobby for several years... I was put off by the few visits to the two Local clubs near my location by the poor interactions I felt like I was getting... So I built a FT style fomie and have had to do alot of research and building on my own, as well as trial and error... Im working on learning to fly with the $40 foamie, but would like to get into more serious models and modeling, but gotta learn to not dirt nap it first.

[@kinikinrd]

buy a flight sim program. best $ you will ever spend

[@j.d.farmer6164]

AMA member since 1971 (as I remember). I have never heard of anyone filing an insurance claim with the AMA (and definitely have never heard of someone getting a payment). I assume such things have happened. The only time that I saw a model hit a car happened many years ago when a flier lost control of a 40 powered piper cub, and it went into a line of parked cars. In a strange twist of fate, the model hit only its owner's car. This left a ding in the driver's side door. In another odd twist, the unfortunate perpetrator/victim was an insurance agent. I still pay AMA dues, but have not been a club member for over seven years. With all the new hassles with flying models, I will stay with the under 250 gram models, and fly in a park (for as long as I can). I don't think that the AMA has helped modelers in decades.

[@joncox9719]

I don't do "Clubs" period! My experience is you ALWAYS have "That Guy" who needs to be Large and in Charge on a power trip! Had a friend come out to the club on a motorcycle and did 30 mph on the 25 mph little road. OMG! The COMMANDER of the club went out and berated the guy and just made a scene! Here a guy who was interested in getting into the hobby and he simply turned aroundand did 50 mph leaving! HA! The Commander did a snap roll on the ramp! Loved it! Also, he constantly snipped at guy's who did not fly an exact pattern as if he were an FAA Controller! The guy's were just having FUN, and this was a small club, no need for that kind of controlling behavior, they did nothing unsafe or dangerous! These type guy's tend to gravitate towards Clubs and ruin it for everyone! So I simply stay away, go out to school yards and fly if I want to and be in my Happy Place without being barked at!

[@carlmiller5222]

I’m 77 and flown rc for 60 years. Enjoyed every minute of it. Cheaper than a bass boat and fishing or golf and a hell of lot more fun.

[@gewglesux]

Lemme guess... Made yer own glue called"dope"? I have a few guys in my club who talk about the good old days... I have a buddy who just retired to florida bought his life long dream of a Bass Boat used.... it was still $90k

[@upperechelon3456]

Yep… I’m in the same boat. I even grew my own balsa tree.😂😂😂

[@r3beatty]

My local AMA field has a beautiful location, great facilities, eleventy members only signs, and it seems like folks are only there 2 days a week. I have parked in front of their locked gate and flown over the lake across the road, though. Does that count as visiting an AMA field?

[@atticusrallye702]

I learned on my own with a little Hobbyzone Sport Cub, then moved onto the larger Carbon Cub 1.3, with minimal and repairable crashes on my own. I joined the local club, only buddy-boxed once, where I only showed my current knowledge, didn't learn anything new. Oh, that was also the youth discount for $15. Now, if i want to renew either my AMA and club membership, it would be $85 EACH. No thanks. Especially with the cost of airplanes and new parts, I cannot afford a $200 annual fee for "insurance coverage".

[@mrbmp09]

Has anyone ever heard of the ama actually paying a members insurance claim? Soooooo many hoops to fly thru.

[@rcnewsupdate9435]

Since none of you have touched on it.... "God forbid you be a Heli guy" They absolutely hate us. lol

[@bopapa_1979]

I'm a heli guy, fly pretty hard, like to be over the runway down on the deck, and am blessed with a local club that puts up with me. I do self-police in terms of safety, and that goes a long way. When I go to a club I've never visited before, I always "fly the pattern" for a couple of flights and make sure the older members who have had bad experiences understand I'm in control and safe to be around. Even then, you're not wrong. Sad but true.

[@mirandakarr-paepke2362]

lol as a newer guy to the hobby, i dont see why ya'll go to the field anyway. planes need that open space, most chopper pilots dont. i only take planes to field myself. drones and choppers stay at home.

[@sjoormen1]

Problem is greed. A lot of theese things starts with good intentions, then greed takes over... At least here in EU .

[@stejer211]

Explain?

[@old-rcplane-phart]

​@@stejer211 AMA is in it only for the $$$ to line THEIR pockets. Not unlike any other million dollar businesses.

[@sjoormen1]

@@stejer211 Well I've seen in few hobbies I was interested in- Usually there is a group with same interests, then starts as a club and sooner or later someone joins who takes it over and tries to overprice things. So people slowly loose interests and go their own way. I've seen in modelling, shooting, few other things...Idk...

[@john9663]

Thanks for caring. Thanks for the proding to get better. Thanks for your ideas. Hopefully clubs and the AMA are hearing this as well.

[@MD-qd7np]

Lobbying??? LoL! Yeah, funny how the majority of R/C pilots absolutely hate RID yet the AMA did absolutely nothing to speak against it. Far as I'm concerned, when we really needed them to be our voice, they were silent. Either speak for the interests of the hobby or simply disappear. AMA has a long uphill battle if they want to earn the trust of enthusiasts again.

[@williamhoenstine5057]

I appreciate the thoughts offered in this video regarding WHY the hobby is shrinking but one of the MOST important factors not emphasized enough is the COST! I don't know of any hobby in today's world that's 'cheap' to engage in - if there is it's most obscure! In my humble view, it's difficult for most families to shell out hundreds if not thousands of dollars for hobby supplies, airplanes, club membership including AMA that is greatly overpriced, and whatever else might be needed to enjoy this hobby. RC airplanes are not cheap nor is the radio equipment needed to safely and/or efficiently operate them! When an RC vendor offers a holiday discount of 10%, or $50 off the cost of a $300-$500 airplane, I cringe thinking they need to keep their discount because they need the money more than a potential customer. Discounts aren't really discounts! They're sight reductions that generally don't amount to much savings at all. I think I've made my point so I'll get down off my soapbox. There's lots of reasons WHY things are as they are but COST ranks up there at close to the top of the scale!

[@propabilityfpv]

I don't care what anyone says, Horizon, FliteTest, and all the other "newer" groups have immensely HELPED our community. Things changed, tech has evolved, and that's a good thing. It's easier than ever to get into RC because of companies like Horizon, FliteTest, etc.. That's exactly how it should be!

[@16-BITFPV]

Horizon has sued or bought out all the companies that actually mattered to real RC people

[@propabilityfpv]

@@16-BITFPV define “real RC people”

[@bopapa_1979]

@@16-BITFPV if you fly RC planes, anywhere, under any circumstance, you are "real RC people." Having said that, I'm not a big fan of Horizon.

[@mirandakarr-paepke2362]

horizon hobby puts on an "rc fest" but wont let anyone who doesnt work for or advertise for horizon fly. That in itself is bad on horizon. They also take advantage of new pilots selling them overpriced crap just so they can fly fast. Then you get onto plane 2 or three and realize your stuck in this crappy horizon ecosystem. do you throw way that money trying to get out or just stay paying more and more to have lower quality products? Flitefest is the best thing to happen to the hobby though. Hands down the best group of guys out there supporting the hobby. This isnt about those groups though so you just pulled your statement out of thin air. Thats like saying i dont care what anyone says china has helped the hobby immensely. I mean they are the number one producer of RC planes right? Also its arguable that anyone should just be able to get into the hobby. I am an FPV flyer, but a lot of the FPV guys jumped into this hobby with so much disrespect. They just go buy a drone and go do stupid shit. and they had no one gatekeeping if you want to call it to be like eh this aint right, your going to draw attention to us. And they did. and now we all have new rules. And fpv pilots are still out there doing dumb chit. I almost dont fly fpv at all anymore just because of the negative associations.

[@RichardAmesMusic]

I’ve been out of the RC world since the early 2000s but during the 90s I was a member at the Georgia Model Aviators north of Atlanta. I didn’t appreciate it at the time but I now realize that club was incredible - such a great and active community that constantly brought new members in. We had pattern guys and IMAC guys and heli guys and scale model guys and pylon racing guys and pretty much every kind of model aviation you can think of. If it flew, it was there, including the occasional visit from some manned aircraft. We also had good representation at various contests across the southeast and at the Nats. I probably spent more money on fuel burnt at that field than on the college degree I was getting while doing so. If this video is representative of the community these days then I’m truly sad to hear it.

[@kyqx]

I know that at least on Cherokee did a touch and go there. I landed my Kolb there in 2000 or so. Great Club.

[@mikebergman1817]

My relationship with model flying clubs came to an end when they banned drones after some jackass was hovering right next to the backyard fences of the surrounding subdivision. Never mind the fact that I had flown planes and drones there for years, and never caused a problem. They started to kick me out when I would bring out the fpv goggles. The issue had come from a Phantom/Mavic pilot who had never been to the field before, and everyone knew that. They were basically waiting for a reason to "other" the small handful of us fpv guys who would come and fly both fixed wing and drones. They were not interested in using some FREE WILL, and recognizing the difference between an AP drone flyer with no history, or the rest of us guys who build everything and were all on a first name basis with the rest of the fixed wing boomers at the field. The RC flying club reminds me of how Ham Radio operators/clubs interacted with new people.

[@mikeashton2628]

This video describes my experience exactly! Introduced by picking up a Carbon Cub from local shop and it currently sits with several issues next to my 4 broken 400mm WarTurds (thanks for nothing RCSailors!) and I couldn't tell you where my nearest club/field would even be to go for help. I hope AMA was listening to ur great suggestions!

[@jeffpv7468]

AMA died when it rejected the new era of pilots using technology to their advantage, seeming to ONLY provide support for "true" RC folks. God forbid if you have a Flight Controller in your aircraft, the major aversion to this along with the majority boomer crowd supporting it has pushed younger and newer pilots out of clubs and the traditional RC crowds. Theres a HUGE sigma against newer, tech-ier pilots because the older folks just don't understand it and its a real shame. Every flying club I've seen has either had abysmal accommodations for, or just outright bans anything with a flight controller, FPV, and multirotor flight. If its not a scale model direct PWM model, then you might as well be the devil. Its really funny being yelled at by an 80yo geezer that's had cataracts since he was 8 about my plane that's flying a perfect pattern on its own while he bombs over the pits at 90mph because he "just lost orientation for a second." Theres a real sigma in the RC hobby and it leads to a lot of gatekeeping and pointless rules that we would just rather not deal with. Instead of airfields being fun places to fly like they used to be, they now feel a lot like exclusive old folks club houses that I have to pay up to $200+ yearly to be in. NO THANKS. On a separate note many people have been fooled into thinking that NEED to be an AMA member to fly anywhere in the USA, like its a federal agency that gives you permission to fly. This is mostly the fault of the members not understanding how FAA law and airspace works, but AMA hasn't done enough to disperse this as it helps them in the short term. Members that realize that they don't actually REQURE one to fly feel like they've been lied to and often end up leaving, and telling their friends to not fall for it, which snowballs the issue further. This issue has only gotten worse with the god awful Remote ID rules that were put in place, and now oftentimes the only places to fly without jumping through the FAA's hoops is AMA fields due to AMA's lobbying.

[@RodneyHayes-d3y]

Well, I know what drove out about seventy percent of the club I was in away. You showed many times in the video of what it was. I was a member for almost thirty years and a trainer for many of that. When another close by club that catered to giant scale lost their property due to noise complaints, they joined ours. The problems started instantly. Noise complaints from neighbors. Police visits from motorist complaints of planes flying over the nearby interstate. Not being able to fly anything approaching a pattern with giant scale acrobatic planes hoovering down the middle of the runway. Spring 2022 everything I had acquired over the years was loaded up and went to Perry Ga Rc swap meet and it went home with new owners. Haven't been back to the field which is a shame as many people don't get to live three miles from there flying field

[@echassin]

I put up with club antics until smaller electric planes began to outperform the big nitro stuff... in my back yard. After that no more "safety officer" up my a$$ for flying anything but left circles (and who was usually the same guy who'd regularly crash his gas warbirds unto the pits, onto the street, etc...)

[@tonyyimbo]

This is the part he left out. Even if you do get to fly at a popular club you have to be there for a social reason cause waiting an hour between flights sucks and even when you get in the air you have to fly within their rules . Besides being there to learn I don’t see much benefit

[@mirandakarr-paepke2362]

@@tonyyimbo not all clubs are like that. i visit clubs regularly. Ive stayed away from some clubs hearing they are bad. But then ill find one thats the exact opposite. I know they exist but ive never came across a club that only let 1 person fly

[@randalljames1]

I went to a club and other than being mostly ignored.. it was fun to watch some of the old timers with planes that were easily as old as I was.... never went back...

[@acdii]

The AMA Screwed up when they failed to separate those who build and fly LOS at fields from those who fly wherever they feel like flying with their self flying drones. That is what is killing the hobby. Now in order to fly my hand built planes with hundreds of hours spent building it I have to spend extra money to add weight. The ARF are OK when you want something cheap and quick to fly, but there is no joy in them. For me the joy comes when something that arrived as a box of sticks and glue takes to the air looking like a miniature version of a real plane. The problem today is, no clubs anymore, they all shut down, so I no longer have a place I can fly my twin engine bomber, or my 1/4 scale Mustang. What I fly are not park fliers, but scale model aircraft, that which the AMA started from. They should have kept the scale model part separate from the multirotors that were causing all the issues with interfering with full size aircraft. AMA had its purpose, but not anymore. Not worth a few hours drive to fly, thats what it has become. That and those like me are passing away from old age, so that skill is also being lost to others.

[@David-hm9ic]

The AMA didn't just fail to separate drones from airplanes; they pushed for them to all be viewed the same by the FAA.

[@acdii]

@@David-hm9ic Exactly and why I "failed" to renew my membership, because AMA failed to support me and others like me.

[@TimsDrones]

Besides all the good points in this video … The AMA doesn’t really like drones. FPV leaves it cold. And it still treats control line as mainstream.

[@IndyHobbies]

One aspect you are missing is many of us ENJOY being part of a club. Same with AMA. Maybe you’ve had bad experiences with a club? I have and changed clubs for that reason. The points you make with this video are good and specific. But kinda arm chair quarterback in many cases. Clubs are comprised of volunteers. As such they give back as they can. When someone starts a sentence with, “You know what you ought to do…” I always ask if they are willing to help do it.

[@TailHeavyProductions]

We’ve had good and bad experiences with clubs. We’re sharing a viewpoint that many share in a way that allows us to also present counterpoints and solutions. We worked with many folks of varying backgrounds and experiences in clubs (volunteers and non-volunteering members) to put this video together. For reference, we have and continue to volunteer. Zach volunteered and eventually became president of his childhood club in Seattle and even created and added a youth board member position to the bylaws to expand the youth presence and give them a voice. We continue to volunteer at our local clubs in New Hampshire as well. Happy landings!

[@tb6638]

My local club is full of racist boomers,. they love being in a club of like minded people

[@doggogaming6895]

My local club was amazing to join, all you had to do is have an AMA membership and training was offered but not required.

[@MichaelSitzmann]

I'm 13 years old, I'm from Italy and I am in a wonderful RC club but i never heard anything about the AMA😅😅

[@Acemechanicalservices]

The first A in AMA stands for American, so that’s probably why.

[@MichaelSitzmann]

​@@Acemechanicalservices Oh ok 😂😅

[@briankelly4292]

Zach and Ben, you’ve put a lot of thought into the state of our hobby, how it got here and where it might go if we don’t keep open minds and work for it. Judging from many of the comments, you hit some nerves. You’ve described the problems. Now to move forward. Working from the model you’ve developed regarding the interdependence of clubs, manufacturers and CBOs like AMA, I look forward to stories of clubs or CBOs that are doing some things right. None of us do everything right, so we all need to learn from the successes of others. The problems have been described by many ad nauseam. It’s time to roll up our sleeves, listen, and work for the success stories.

[@douglascook258]

It is probably going to make the full circle back flying clubs. Most of the towns in my area have already made ordinances prohibiting flying models in public parks and people are not allowed on schoolyards at any time. If you don't have enough private property to fly over, its back to the club flying sites.

[@DerMaje]

In Germany we have allmost the same problems. I´m happy that, after 6 years of me getting into the hobby, i finally found a nice club with nice people. They dont belong to the DMFV instead they are part of the DAEC ( yeah, we have two "AMA"s to choose from ). They got some rules, but not nearly as much as the others had. And the guys there are really great, they dont care what you fly as long as you have fun with it.

[@Beef3D]

I think it also is relevant to give a little bit of that honorary praise to Flite Test and their annual Flite Fest for bringing in a lot of new people to the RC hobby as well as forming international bonds pre-2020. These guys certainly did make waves in the RC community because I heard a lot of random RC people, even well seasoned old farts with decades of experience you wouldn't normally expect to talk about them did to the point it even spread outside of USA. even if FT doesn't feel the same as it used to, I still have massive respect for Josh Bixler for what he managed to accomplish as a whole. I've made so many new IRL friends because of them.

[@TailHeavyProductions]

Absolutely! We mention Flite Fest, FPVFC, and Flite Test’s CBO in the video.

[@mirandakarr-paepke2362]

man you remember the old FT too?! So weird how they changed so much, so fast. I remember waking up like i was a kid again to go see FT vids. It was like they were family for awhile.

[@bluhammer06]

Been bootleg flying with my group of friends at empty parks, schools, and industrial areas for over 12 years. We have a blast. In that time I’ve been a member of 3 clubs, currently one of Californias largest, and every one of them have been elitist, hardly friendly, and not very fun. If I started at one of these heavy ruled clubs I would definitely not be as good a pilot as I am, and I probably would have moved onto some other hobby. Lighten up a little clubs!

[@TheOneAndOnlySatan]

Clubs should have no rules other then send it !

[@acf951]

I just got back into the hobby after 30 years. Didn’t know my local club still existed (found out later they did); their website was down and no social media pages. After getting an email response back, found out they required FAA registration and AMA membership (+ club fee). I figured it was cheaper and easier to buy a plane with SAFE and fly solo at my nearby park. I’ll still join the club mainly to network, but flying at the park is better. I think the AMA is also struggling because most of the younger generation like Gen Z aren’t interested in the hobby.

[@Roundawg]

FK AMA. We just lost our club because of an ill advised county tax accessor. Many members tried to contact AMA for help. Not one member received a response from AMA. I am now in a private club and they don’t require AMA. Best days of my life.

[@joedonbaker1673]

Well said THP. (Uxbridge Oct 6th. Hope to see you there). Our club has about 15 members. We have very little rules, but the land owners require us to keep the access gate locked, meaning people can't just show up to watch, fly or ask questions. It's kind of a bummer, but it is what it is. With only 15 members, it's difficult to keep the field mowed. I've been doing it quite a bit, and it gets old. Other than that, it's really fun there with the only rules being #1 HAVE FUN! #2 Don't get us kicked out... HA!!

[@tonycalvert2951]

When you’re right. You’re right!

[@ShadowVFX]

I'd love to know how the AMA grabbed every RC Club by the marbles and talked them into making AMA mandatory to become a member. No matter where you are in America, it seems like every single club requires AMA to be a member. They claim it's because of the insurance, but my homeowners insurance policy, and many others I've talked with, would cover damages in case of an RC crash.

[@Resq_U]

200 % nailed the truth!

[@SlowFlyer85]

You are so right on everything you said and showed great Video😊

[@kadegreen5356]

I'm going to be honest.. ive built my own quadplane and have came into contact with a few of the clubs. I don't join because I don't need to, and they aren't doing anything that I'm interested in. I want to fly m quadplane and collect aerial footage, while they want to fly low powered gliders on the side of a hill. They have a few specific spots they can fly. I can fly anywhere because I have RID. Anything I need to learn or figure out, I can look online and learn myself. I enjoy this process. If there were local clubs that did fun stuff related to what I wanted to do, I would.

[@mikebergman1817]

Hey man, tell me about this quadplane you speak of. Never heard of one before.

[@kadegreen5356]

@@mikebergman1817 it's a Heewing Ranger T1 VTOL with a bunch of customizations I've made and 3d printed.

[@kadegreen5356]

@@mikebergman1817 quadplane references the ardupilot firmware.

[@PartScavenger]

I have been researching RC airplanes for a month now every day and this is the first I've heard of the AMA

[@CyclingMikey]

It's much the same over here in the UK. Good video!

[@haroldpurser4543]

Never a truer word spoken.

[@joe60000]

34 years old been flying RC in one form or another for about 20 years. Was a AMA member up to about 4 years ago. They have lost the youth and have failed at evolving with the hobby. In my opinion the AMA is beyond saving at this point, hopefully some other organization will step up to represent RC hobbyist in an all encompassing way. Would be nice to see FPVFC take a broader stance in the hobby to represent those not interested in the FPV side of things.

[@frankienv3906]

rc flying is suppose to be fun and relaxing clubs are a hassle.

[@CR-rb5hl]

It is. I just don't do it at clubs. I just have a few friends and family I fly with. I went to FliteFest with a family member this year.

[@moepow8160]

There's a lot of comments about remote ID, and AMA did not do much about it. A subject that really made a lot of members upset. I chose this topic because my club had a similar regulatory fight, except it was the Tripoli High Power Rocket Club, different club, but the same issues. This club was around for years, and all was going well, we had some issues with it. membership, but when the ATF stepped in after 911 and out of nowhere, stamped rocket motors as explosives then started to regulate it. The main component of your hobby is the motor. Overnight, everyone who launched a model rocket was a terrorist. Talking about lighting a fire underneath members' back-ends. The club wasn't having it, nor was the public that had no membership, which included AMA, yes AMA insured model rockets as well. Well, the club members, the public, and educational sciences in public classrooms got involved. The biggest help was money, lots of money, and attorneys that would probono the fight. And that's what it turned into, a big fight. We, the members, and the free attorneys put our all into it. Our main question was Who gave ATF the power to rubber stamp our rocket motors and say their explosives ? It tuns out ... no one, ATF, broke the law because they had no business making laws and, in turn, destroy our hobby. No way we or Tripoli was going to take that sitting down and took ATF to court, and we won. It took 4 to 5 years, but we won ! In the case of RI, the club rolled over. Wth absolutely ridiculous rules, and who knows what else influenced what I call a takeover. WE, aircraft, drones, boats, anything that flies should have fought harder ! One other nasty, horrible change that drives me nuts...NO technical service, and I'll piont my finger at Herizon Hobby first. Have you tried to get help lately ? It makes me sick when it takes days to finally get a person on the phone, and they don't know squat. It was a joke. I had to inform her more than she helped me. Hay Herizon, I'll pay more MONEY to the small online owners I can call, and a person picks the phone up. Herizon used to have an OK service with people who knew something about their product. They are definitely making enough money... look at their ads. Move some of that money over to service. We know who you are.....

[@bob.w3984]

Forget the required remote ID as an attempt to put us in a small area to avoid enforcement

[@dmtbsquare]

Was a member as a kid in the late 80s. Was able to learn to fly from a veteran at the local AMA club. The way I knew about the AMA was from the hobby store where I bought my first trainer. Good memories of all of it.

[@terrylembke8100]

I say screw the ama and the clubs . I have my own insurance and fly on private land I was a member since 1977 , they started with the frequency issues then progressed to all the garbage today Your homeowners will cover you , mine does the ama has become a top heavy money sucking bureaucracy that doesn't give a shit about the modeler at all . If your in a club with 50 members or more inquire about private insurance as well .

[@JeffinLowerAlabama]

We always welcome new RC Flyers that want to enjoy the great hobby flying RC Planes. Jeff in LA USA

[@blueechodragon99]

One of the biggest things that my club does wrong is banning FPV.

[@BucketlistRC]

Great video. Wheeled clubs are cool, too. Know where and when and get general help.