The American FAL: Harrington & Richardson T48 (w/ Larry Vickers)

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Today I am joined by Larry Vickers to take a look at his original H&R T48 FAL. The Harrington & Richardson company was awarded a contract to produce a pre-production series of 500 of these rifles in the mid 1950s when the United States was conduction trials to choose a new combat rifle. The Belgian-designed FAL (built by H&R with technical assistance from Canada, who was the first to formally adopt the FAL) was designated the Rifle, T48. By this time, it's only competition was the Springfield-designed Rifle, T44 - which would eventually become the M14.
Both rifles were put through a wide array of testing and trials, and in the end they were so close in performance as to be both deemed acceptable by the testing officials. The decision went up the chain of command to almost the very top before a decision was made in favor of the M14, on the basis of it being slightly lighter in weight and capable of being produced on existing M1 Garand tooling. This would prove to be a mistaken expectation, and the process of developing the tooling and production lines for the M14 would be one of the major problems with its adoption. Interestingly, the Belgians at FN had offered the FAL design to the United States royalty-free, but this was not enough to sway US brass to adopt a non-American design.
Only a handful of T48 FAL rifles exist in private hands today, and this one actually came out of the H&R company museum. Thanks to Mr. Vickers for sharing this fantastic piece of Cold War rifle history with us!
If you enjoy Forgotten Weapons, check out its sister channel, InRangeTV! / inrangetvshow
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[@jeffmiller4168]

The tension in the room spikes every time Ian says “FAL” and Larry says “F.A.L.”

[@anthonykaiser974]

@@Filip_Phreriks the Belgians aren't Americans, and we Americans like acronyms. (Ed: the definition of an acronym is a word made from initials of other words)

[@misombra]

NO GUN DADDIES DON'T FIGHT

[@lumbeewarrior5664]

I say F.A.L.

[@lumbeewarrior5664]

308.......

[@lEGOBOT2565]

@@anthonykaiser974 Initialisms into acronyms

[@re-gaming3913]

Fun fact: Luxembourg fought in Korean war with a total of 20 Soldiers.

[@sparkling925]

hey i mean the effort counts right

[@markrainford1219]

For the size of the population, a good turnout.

[@keithcarpenter5254]

Yeah,and 21 came back! True story.

[@kentuckyace1068]

*41

[@Julia-fc4mp]

In what capacity?

[@nemo6686]

'The Belgians offered it to the UK and US royalty-free.' It's weird how with some snippets of trivia you just know they're going to stick in your mind, so thanks for that.

[@dfwai7589]

Love how Ian just casually drops that he's fired not only an EM-2 but two EM-2's, one of which was in 7.62

[@danielwatters1203]

He has videos of each type. The 7.62mm video was one of the earliest, and the .280 was more recent, filmed on behalf of ARES.

[@dfwai7589]

@@danielwatters1203 I know, I just find it funny

[@ardenelenduil2334]

I have 2 FALs myself, a semi-holy grail Australian L2A1 for the Singapore Police Force (one out of a contract of 220) and a full serial matching Stg-58 I love those guns

[@bigbrowntau]

I used the L2A1 in my Australian Army days....loved it! It was old and had been shot for decades, but still loved it. (just cranked the gas regulator to completely closed to get a more reliable action)

[@chaddelong998]

love mine too. but its a Frankenstein.

[@martinmckowen1588]

The L2A1 was called the AR

[@stevenguy2630]

@@martinmckowen1588 you mean the SLR

[@martinmckowen1588]

@@stevenguy2630 no. The L1A1 was the SLR, the L2A1 was the Automatic Rifle (AR). The SLR was semi-automatic. The AR was selective between semi and full automatic and had a heavier barrel and a 30 round magazine.

[@klackon1]

As an army cadet in the late 60's I was occasionally allowed to play with wooden stocked L1A1 SLR's (UK version of the FAL). By 1971, when I joined the British Army, we were using the ABS stocked versions. Regimental armourers often had a collection of L1A1 wooden butts, which were polished and turned into cribbage boards for presentation purposes. It was a bloody good gat, I used to shoot mine out to 600m during competitions.

[@joshhill5932]

I have to thank the brit military for having 3 different stock lengths to choose from. I have a L1A1 and am 6'4''. First thing I did was order the long stock. Fits nice but does make an already long gun even more ridiculous.

[@katywalker8322]

We had SLRs for a weekend exercise in the Air Cadets in the mid 1980s. All but 1 had black ABS stocks, etc. I grabbed the one with wood instead!

[@davidstevens6117]

The FAL is my all-time favorite rifle, and this is a really rare one. Thanks to you both for sharing it!

[@gunner678]

I carried my L1A1 with great pride and effect until promotion landed me with an SMG (sterling) then the SA80 and finally the Browning Hi Power.... the FAL is a fantastic weapon, a true battle rifle and real stopper......I would go to war with one again now, if I could walk far enough!

[@haydnroberts7434]

So True. It takes me all day to do what I used to do all day. When you put a round down Range with the SLR you knew it would be effective even at the end of its trip ...

[@scaleyback217]

@@haydnroberts7434 For sure even if you missed, the object of your ire would be checking the colour of the adrenaline freshly deposited in his trousers.

[@titiparisien7485]

A FAL made in the US... It's a FALUS..... XD

[@razgriz1258]

I really didn't expect dick joke so good job

[@logankincade661]

Excellent.........!

[@nuttex]

@@rriflemann308 Belgian French is Walloon. The Flemish are Dutch.

[@harrychung433]

God will get you for that one, Parisien. Or maybe one of Ian's trained ninja mice.

[@timbaskett6299]

It looks "FAL-bolus"!!!

[@123456gordon]

The FAL is such a beautiful gun. It's like the AK/M4 platform in a way, adopted by a wide variety of countries back then and still in use by many. Truly a legendary rifle.

[@kekistandept.offoreignaffa2863]

I love how you can hear the excitement in Larry's voice as he goes over the subtle differences.

[@AshleyPomeroy]

"It even has a watermark"

[@Perfusionist01]

Fascinating! I had heard parts of the T48 story before and I knew that the big problem with the T48 was "Not Invented Here" syndrome. I had never thought about the divergent time line; US adopted T48, then Stoner has no real market for his intermediate caliber designs. Plus with a rifle that functioned well, would the US Army and Marines has even given a second look to an intermediate cartridge for combat use? Great food for "what if..?"

[@ccfmfg]

The Kennedy Administration Made the Defense Dept adopt the M16 because Colt Industries was a Major Donor to their Campaign. Eugene Stoner was Selling the Armalite AR-10 in 7.62 x 51 NATO because He was a Marine in WWII and carried a M1 and knew what it took to Stop a Determined Combatant. Armalite Industries Management Only Down-Sized the AR-10 to the M16's 5.56x45mm to try and Sell it to some No Combat Experienced Newly Promoted Intellectual Officer Types recent placed High up in the Ordnance dept. who thought their Low Caliber High Velocity Bullet Theory was the Stopping Power Holy Grail as they Ignored 100 Years of Real Combat Ballistic Data. In 2010 SOCOM's 20 year study of the 5.56x45mm Stopping Power Concluded the Average # of Rds it takes to Kill a Enemy Combatant when shot in the Kill Zone is 3 to 7. That is Just FUCKING Stupid! You know how many of Our Guys the M16 has gotten killed because of that? That's why U.S.Army Special Forces 5th Group Invented the 6.8 REM SPC Cartridge.

[@monkeyboy48391]

As much as I love the M-14, America really screwed the pooch by passing up the FAL platform...

[@gunmonkey1185]

So true.

[@jamesmanning7510]

From what I understand it was people who were invested in the m14 succeeding who managed to get inside information on upcoming trials in order to prepare the firearm ahead of time to do especially well on those specific trials.

[@davehopkin9502]

No the US screwed up in refusing to accept the intermediate round - the FAL and the EM-2 were both originally designed for 280 intermediate and that made them practical weapons for full auto, the US demanded a 30 cal round, the EM-2 was not practical to beef up for it, the FAL was but in full auto with a 30 cal round every thing after the 2nd shot is anti-aircraft.... The US silently acknowledged that when they inhibited full auto on M14 and then went to a smaller calibre with the M16

[@davehopkin9502]

@The Judgemental Cat The good old US or A did!!!! See comment above and they confirmed it with the M14 which was full auto and 7.62 NATO.... lots of dead pigeons.....

[@hanzohattori755]

on full automatic it VERY QUICKLY becomes a 1 man anti-aircraft gun

[@TheWozWizard]

In the 1950's the U. S. Army still was using and training with rifle grenades (Check out the movie "Them"). The U. S. Army DID anticipate being able to launch rifle grenade from the T48! That was part of the requirement for the rifle! I call your attention to Report SA-NM11-3000, dated 21 September 1955, Notes on Development Type Material for Rifle, Caliber .30, T48, page 22, section VIII Accessories, paragraph B Launcher, Grenade, T142 and figures 9 and 10 (photographs 10963-SA and 10964-SA).

[@angrymetalhead]

That's one hell of a citation haha, good on you mate!

[@JohnRSrlie]

The FN FAL, what a awesome service gun, the history,the caliber.... The Belgium deserve so much credit for this bad boy

[@alanniederlitz6950]

The caliber is ALL AMERICAN, NON?

[@fergusmason5426]

@@alanniederlitz6950 Unfortunately, yes. It would have been a better weapon in the original .280.

[@hoppinggnomethe4154]

John Moses Browning must have been proud when he looked down from the sky. "My apprentice..."

[@evobsm2328]

​@@hoppinggnomethe4154...... uhm.... browning wasnt the godfather of these rifles my dude

[@kck-kck879]

Fabrique Nationale and waffles are really the only things Belgium has been good for.

[@itsconnorstime]

If America hadn’t adopted the M16, would Russia have gone with the 74?

[@thetosser5197]

No, definately not.

[@scullkrusher]

Probably not. The 5.45 was the Soviet response to 5.56. No 5.56 then the Soviets wouldn't have had any interests in changing their cartridge, at least not at that time.

[@Ideo7Z]

Kalashnikov himself said the AK 74 was developed because the Politburo wanted a response to the M16 in an interview he did with Eugene Stoner.

[@weasle2904]

@@ajttambo .308 was a ballistic copy of 30-06. 7.62x54r is VERY similar in power to. 308

[@SpectreDM]

They would have kept the x54R. Had we been in similar circumstances, we would have kept .30-06. 7.62 NATO was a slight refinement that Russian military leaders would never care for. We would basically have seen 20-round box magazines on SVDs - maybe shorter ones for infantry had they stuck with the full-power cartridge. However, looking at how old the AK-47/AKM development cycle really was, it would have never been that east and west each had a battle rifle. Best case for both fielding ballistically similar .30-caliber rifles: .300 BLK in the '60s, in a shorty M14/SuperM1 abomination. In this world, the M305A would be the AR47 of our timeline.

[@walkergarya]

The Canadian Service FAL had the folding winter trigger guard. I was rounder that what is shown here and went into the pistol grip with a small screw on cover that was not at all uncomfortable. The CDN FN also had the short dust cover that allowed you to reload with stripper clips and folding disk type rear sights instead of the sliding ramp seen on most FALs.

[@GeorgRavioli]

That's what stuck out to me when I saw this video, that T48 looks a LOT like a C1A1, probably because of the Canadian influence on H&R's building process.

[@frankmorel8853]

Yes. That emergency charger was part of the winter warfare requirements.

[@markdesjardins3153]

exactly right on the trigger guard, it had a folding cocking handle that was slick too.

[@kingerikthegreatest.ofall.7860]

I carried a c2, when I was a seaforth highlander. C2 is a heavy barrel, bipod , 30 round magazine , full auto light machine gun fal, not unlike a bar.

[@herauthon]

alike the FAL-O ?

[@audeamus1180]

Australian and NZ Armies used the SLR (Aust and NZ version of the FAL) to great success in Vietnam.

[@craigwan1]

They have some cool bush customised Lithgow Fal’s in Waiouru army museum in NZ

[@charity7006]

Success? The viets won

[@bensigl3766]

The more elite Aussie units even did chop jobs on their FALs to better serve jungle/ambush warfare. Chopped barrels, full auto, underslung early grenade launchers (US "Bloop Tube"). I had a book on weaponry of the Vietnam war that was part of q series and it had a section on those with a few pics

[@peterpiper_203]

iatsd Weren't allowed to Too much corruption Read A Bright Shining Light Paul Vance

[@Jeremiah90526]

"There's me, in me slouch hat, with me SLR and greens. God help me, I was only 19"

[@shauncharlesporter2589]

Used this for 10 years in the bush war, incredible weapon.

[@TJH1]

Love that somebody finally mentioned that FN/Belgium gave the license to make the SLR/L1A1 free to the UK, who was smart enough to say yes, and to the US who wasn't/didn't. Great video, thanks. I guess Larry has an even more amazing collection than I guessed.

[@MoswenMedia]

Trevor the top brass was more concerned with a match grade rifle rather than a rifle that would serve well in all environments. For all the M14’s weaknesses accuracy is not one of them. You may prefer the FAL, or G3 but they can’t be made as accurate as an M14

[@TJH1]

I don't see how that makes sense? They wanted a new rifle, they get the M-14 which, as stated in the video, they did have to totally re-tool to make.

[@TJH1]

The G3 made an accurate rifle, the MSG90 was an accurized G3. The SLR was never going to achieve that but it was designed as a combat rifle, not a marksman's rifle. The M-14 was supposed to be a combat rifle but it was poor in that role. If it failed in the job it designed for but was great in a totally different role, that is still a fail, mostly. It reminds me of the saying from WWI."The Germans came to war with a hunting rifle, the Americans with a target rifle, and the British came with a battle rifle." Swap British for Belgium and it sort of applies.

[@MoswenMedia]

Trevor the G3 uses a completely different locking system than it’s accurized counterpart. The roller lockers may be reliable but they can’t achieve the accuracy that large locking lugs can. Go do a little research about previously chosen service rifles. It’s the reason the Krag Jorgensen was chosen because it was an extremely accurate rifle that would prove nicely in a match contest. The m14 was a great rifle but it wasn’t as good of a battle rifle as the FAL/SLR. I’m absolutely willing to admit that. But as I previously stated it cannot reach the accuracy of an M14

[@ole-martinbroz8590]

and an army have never ever been that interested in accuracy. They've only been interested in accuracy for sharpshooter roles and they took whatever cause it was so low volume it was not even something you needed to consider. No point in defending a choice of national pride with a superiour accuracy which no army really cared much for. FAL,G3 are all well within accuracy numbers of rifles used previously... It was a stupid decision, and many countries have selected local inferior rifles because of national pride.

[@bobkohl6779]

First FAL was chambered for 7.92 Kurz

[@theguitarprogresschannel1907]

Don't be a sloth

[@vatanak8146]

Source?

[@OneShotNick92]

Well the first prototype that is...

[@JonManProductions]

I know some people have expressed dislike for Larry in some past videos, but this man to me knows his way around rifles just as well as Ian does... I actually quite love these crossover videos, especially when Larry talks about his personal involvement in some projects as well.

[@quietusplus1221]

Having never seen Larry before, he gives off a real bad vibe. I'm sure he's knowledgeable but cannot get passed his general demeanor...

[@Captain_Coleslaw]

Why cant i watch a video in peace without bumping into you Jon xD o7

[@unherolike]

It might because his voice sounds like he is going to Sell me Knives on QVC in the Late 90's Early 2000's

[@rdb8509]

If you got to know Larry you would like him. Remember don’t judge a book by its cover. He has a tough no nonsense delivery which can come off as self important but that is not the case and he is a really good guy.

[@broznkyra4853]

Larry is the REAL DEAL...

[@TheBitwise]

I love seeing you two collaborate. Your passion, and the time and effort spent learning the core information & also the context to it, really shows.

[@Spike-13]

You guys are a great fit together. The conversation just flows smoothly

[@kevinthorpe8561]

Ah the old L1A1 was what I trained with and carried

[@bulletheed1970]

Same ..

[@gunner678]

Same!

[@paulwooster3590]

Same, transition to M16 then Steyr Aug, wanted the SLR back after the Steyr. Oh and on a users note on the SLR ...matchstick anyone?

[@xXMapleVodkaXx]

Used the Indian-made 1A1 version. Preferred it over the G3 or AK by far.

[@aussiviking604]

Same! No matchstick for me, a piece of hardened comms cord !

[@gewishworm4724]

I've been on a FAL/G3 learning spree the last few days and the more i learn about the FAL in particular the more i think about what could've been with an .280 brit select-fire FAL as the standard rifle for all of NATO.

[@gregoryw70]

You two guys getting together and doing detailed gun videos is easily one of the best things to ever happen on KZbin! Bravo and thank you!

[@MrBigbri2011]

Can I just say that whoever came up with the tag "Gun Jesus" deserves a special recognition award.

[@briang530]

Of all the FALs I've gotten to play with, my favorite is a Canadian/Aussie/SA/Brownells rail top cover "frankenFAL". It is also really interesting to see the various modifications that different countries made.

[@Jo_Kuiper]

When we wanted to shoot the Belgian FN Fal in automatic, we just removed the selector completely from the gun. I served in the Dutch military in the seventies, and I liked the gun, had infra red gear also on it at night.

[@brookford5506]

These videos with Larry are some of the best recent forgotten weapon videos. Need some more Larry videos!!

[@Paelorian]

Messrs. McCollum and Vickers make a great duo. Two complementary gun nerds from different backgrounds and perspectives whose interests intersect in these historic rifles. Ian is the researcher with the huge library, Vickers is the master shooter and high-level collector with unsurpassed experience as a user of rifles. Both have extensive experience shooting international firearms both common and rare, and when it comes to his guns Mr. Vickers's knowledge holds it's own against Mr. McCollum's and they learn from one another, which is really saying something outstanding considering that Mr. McCollum's vocation, in which he is considered excellent, is to be a firearms historian who pretty much learns everything about every gun ever made. That's at least his internet reputation. I even like how they're both enjoying themselves but by natural disposition they have a different external demeanor. Chipper side-by-side with gruff. But both enthusiastic and good hearted. I get excited when I see they've paired up for a new video. I know the subject matter will be interesting, the presenters will be enthusiastic, and I'm going to learn.

[@kazkazimierz1742]

Thank your for referring to Canada as a major country! We are so often ignored.

[@GoViking933]

A great history lesson right here, thanks for teaming up you two! Really enjoyed this..

[@Flashblade]

Watching you and Larry together is incredible, keep it up!

[@Cohac]

Imagine if they had just adopted the FAL in .280. No M16 would've been needed!

[@ahorsewithnoname643]

And they wouldn't be searching for a new round that is between 5.56 and 7.62.

[@Cohac]

@Steve Johnson this project is from before 7.62 and 5.56 Nato were standard cartridges. Of course it would be a terrible waste to do the switch today.

[@Cohac]

Steve Johnson Which they have been doing on and off since the 80's, usually with ridiculous demands like "100 more performance than 5.56 with no more recoil" so nothing ever gets replaced.

[@johnc8910]

"The 5.56 is still much lighter recoiling," Agree. "it's also less than half the weight round for round" Also agree. " . . . and it's flatter shooting." Disagree. Check the ballistic tables.

[@neutronalchemist3241]

@Steve Johnson The 5.56 has issues. Not serious enough to really embark in the logistic nightmare of replacing it, but the Army is looking in new cartridges, to eliminate the 5.56mm - 7.62mm dualism, since its introduction. Had they introduced a cartridge in the 6.5mm range from the start, probably the 5.56mm would have never seen the light as a service round.

[@awesomepawn2]

They both have so much knowledge and things to say, you can tell they are actively holding themselves back to let the other guy talk

[@crispchaos]

My two favorite gun youtubers this was a treat. You guys are legends.

[@YaguPL]

Thank you guys for another great video.

[@jacobeberhardt1649]

I could listen to Mr. Vickers speak for days.

[@DaveSmiffy]

He's God to Ian's Jesus

[@DireAvenger001]

Running Fool no! Gun god the father is John Moses Browning you apostate!

[@DaveSmiffy]

Sorry. I should be stoned for my blasphemy 😂

[@donaldferguson9418]

He was getting on my damn nerves. I lost count of how many times he called it an assault rifle. I cringed every single time. What the hell makes something an "assault" anything?

[@jacobeberhardt1649]

@@donaldferguson9418 Do you know who Larry Vickers even is?

[@TrakesFangs]

In a parallel universe, the U.S. did adopt the FAL, then replaced it with the Stoner 63.... Wouldn't that be cool?

[@Targetpopper]

Hmmm... I dig it.

[@gabrielinostroza4989]

the Stoner 63 or some more developed AR-18, which would mean something G36-looking, just with billions produced and decades of development, imagine that.

[@leileijoker8465]

Are you talking about Fallout? Lol

[@joshhill5932]

Or the US goes from the FAL to the FNC.

[@jeffreyskoritowski4114]

Or the Army and the Marine Corp realizes there's nothing better and uses it to this day.

[@donaldneill4419]

I miss my FNC1. It had the folding winter trigger guard, but not a flip catch like the T48; you actually had to dismantle part of the pistol grip to fold the guard away. Awesome rifle, though. And the wood foregrips were perfect for drill - major props to anyone who slapped them hard enough to snap them during the 'present arms'.

[@jamesarness4692]

Awesome video. Thank you! Great insight on the T48 and FAL.

[@hytekrednekbama4400]

It was NOT the T44 that was adopted as the M14. It was the T44E4. There is a big difference between the T44 and T44E4. That is one sweet FAL. Thanks for sharing.

[@madacro5671]

Great stuff Ian, and thank you Mr. Vickers! You two should do many more vids together!

[@wayneparker9331]

Very, very informative video!! You two both a lot about the history of that firearm and those related to it, and it showed. Great work!!

[@luloadventure]

WOW!, another great story! Thanks Ian! Thank you again Mr. Larry Vickers for your knowledge! Merry Christmas!

[@BillMcGirr]

I could listen to these 2 gentlemen discuss firearms endlessly. Good stuff.💪👍🥃

[@mdd1963]

H&R made an FAL? GOod Lord, never knew that!

[@alexvogel610]

Ian: "You know, I've had the chance to shoot the EM2 in *both* 7.62 and .280"

[@bartcalder2791]

Excellent commentary with you two! More! More!

[@gymntonic]

Fantastic!!! I’ve been waiting for you to do a video on the T48!

[@squidbanter]

A Holy Grail FAL shown to us by the Holy Grail gun Jesus?

[@rifles_up2263]

Liam Mason yea,I’m glad I was sitting down😜

[@elguerito2943]

@liam mason This exact same FAL was used by gun jesus to drive fudds away from the range.

[@monkeyboy48391]

Praise be to Gun Jesus, his Way is the Way of Light, though sometimes the Light is in fact muzzle flash.

[@visi7754]

I take it you lot are talking about Ian not Larry? !!!

[@Gakulon]

@@jeffcarroll1990shock I'd've thought he'd use a whip and a table launcher, especially in the temples

[@johnfisk811]

Post Confrontation the British army was de facto standardising on the M16 for jungle environments e.g. Belize but retained the L1A1 for most uses. There was no official adoption but rather a series of ad hoc batch purchases. I helped burn a battalion's worth of L1A1 walnut stocks when they were replaced by the black nylon ones. Such a shame they could not be sold. Some were beautifully figured walnut. I never actually saw a wooden one broken or cracked.

[@gunner678]

@@blairbuskirk5460 i am ex british army also and served with the L1A1 for the first 8 years of 23 year career. I never saw any of the wood break, front or back. We would send batches away for routine REME servicing and they would return 'all black'. At the time as young soldiers, we thought it looked cool, but years later, i look on with nostalgia at the walnut...beautiful. A fantastic rifle!

[@Zorglub1966]

i agree, with wood furnitures it's a pure beauty

[@nigelwright1610]

So it's your fault they're rare as rocking horse shit in good nick!

[@johnfisk811]

Don't blame me. Blame MoD. I was even warned off when I put a Singlepoint red dot sight on one and halved my target acquisition time.

[@alanniederlitz6950]

The KNOWLEDGE between these 2 is AWESOME!

[@Nobody___]

Great video Ian, I especially love the videos with Larry and his awesome collection

[@jamesslick4790]

Hmph, The US should never have a problem with adopting Belgian guns, Intimate connection with John Browning and FN is enough for me.👍😘

[@masterchief8726]

Just when my morning was looking pretty boring, Gun Jesus has blessed my day

[@Galona223]

Wow nice score Larry Thanks for sharing it with us.

[@dougmoore5252]

Thank you for this very interesting take on FN FAL from H& R.

[@rogerwennstrom6677]

It makes you wonder: does Ian thinks about firing rates when he says "at any rate"? :)

[@WQuantrill]

Also, the entire video, I was considering that “what if” question with the M16. That’s really fascinating to consider

[@justnoob8141]

M16 is still dominate them, FAL is battle rifle in my book, it basically go better with semi-auto over full-auto

[@user-gl8yk8fn2k]

@@justnoob8141 It wouldn't, because the entire point of the "what if" question is whether or not the M16 would exist at all in a world where the FAL was adopted. Listening comprehension, work on it.

[@hdgehog6]

I LOVE the FAL.... I have always loved the platform. Very fun to shoot and hits great!

[@jwc00789]

Love the FAL coverage here! Great Vid! :)

[@chumccurry1765]

Two most cool guys on KZbin

[@donaldferguson9418]

I didn't think cool guys called rifles "assault" rifles. I guess Larry listens to the libtards enough to pick up their lingo. Nothing outside of politics makes a rifle an assault rifle. He's a fuckhead. Ian however is one of the coolest guys on KZbin. And not because he is "gun Jesus". That is blasphemous bullshit to say the least. But he is a very knowledgeable and cool guy.

[@chumccurry1765]

Assault rifle is assault rifle, Larry Vickers never call them assault rifle for certain politic reason.

[@donaldferguson9418]

Chu McCurry What makes it an assault rifle?

[@chumccurry1765]

Jez, man. You may find it on a decent dictionary. Assault rifle is a term , in order to define rifles that match certain specific. The political related bullshit word is ASSAULT WEAPON.

[@hytekrednekbama4400]

Ian is smart. Not so much cool though. I still like him though

[@SlimRhyno]

Ian = Awesome. LAV = Boss. Ian + LAV = Boss-ome. 💪 I would consider it an enormous personal favor if Larry were a more frequent guest on your channel (or vice versa, for that matter). ... And who couldn't use a favor from some "rando" in a KZbin comment! 😒 Honestly, though, you both are an amazing resource for all of us who yearn to learn & to pass that knowledge on to future generations; Lest We Forget. Thank you, and take care. 🙏

[@stargazeification]

Anyone else noticed that every time Ian gets with Larry Vickers, his (Ian) use of the word "slick" goes up 1000%??

[@pratiktandel5706]

this is serious quality stuff.love this channel.

[@gunner678]

Even the L1A1 could be fired full auto, by breaking the stock (as for take down) and over rotating the safety/change lever, then closing the stock again. I know for certain!

[@Average_Joe2]

Either your trigger group was/is fucked or the brits changed it in/or before 1959 because my surplus L1A1 cant. Just checked and id say you either miss remember or your gun was faulty

[@stevenhoman2253]

I'm told we Aussie's loved them in Vietnam. the major distinction it had was firinsilg through bamboo. the lighter 5.56 round, though of a higher velocity, would get deflected more easily through multiple layers of bamboo thickets. whereas the FAL round penetrated. a few guys were very happy with the M16 mind you. some troops even chose to continue with their familiar Austen 9mms submachine guns. the down side with the 9mms round, was that after a fire fight of consequence, of which we had many, due to our doctrinal policy of moving the population outside an established perimeter. within the perimeter, it was then a free fire zone day and night. our constant patrolling and movement discipline frequently led to us admonishing the enemy. so on the score of not employing Vietnamese, we were never infiltrated, a problem you guys were hindered by during the conflict I believe.

[@stevenhoman2253]

sorry for the typos, writing on a phone with man fingers is awkward. the 9mms rounds were often found stuck in bloodied webbing, all the enemy having scooted when they were getting creamed. after the war, I heard many a Vietnamese general report that that they did not likebfighting the Anzac's. at all.on one extraordinary occasion, when they decided to mount an in force attack on a base, the fire fight which ensued between 80-90 ranks of Australians against an. estimated 1000-1500 Vietnamese left them shattered, and another attempt was never mounted. we had many decades of jungle counterinsurgency fighting under our belts, and our discipline was rigorously maintained. men were issued odorless toilet kit could not smoke or listen to radios for entertainment while on patrol. plenty of cold beer back at the base the though. oh, in the above battle they were almost out of ammo and daylight. our helicopters flew out and managed to see a little of the right colour smoke, and by radio guidance from the ground managed to boxes of much needed ammo. all of it loose unfortunately and not in magazines. still the helicopter was taking brutal ground fire and ammo was distributed. at one stage the Australians call for artillery support from the New Zealand guys, until the grid call was their own position.the Aussie sgt Maj, advised were gonna be over run repeated the grid and called fire for affect. we had 5 killed and multiple firing wounded personnel at the conclusion of the afternoon and all nighter no the Vietnamese weren't fond of us at all.

[@MalikCarr]

I had read that your typical Australian patrol team in Vietnam would mostly have been armed with FALs but you'd often have two guys out in front acting as pathfinders and those guys would be packing M16s or Stens, and later CAR-15s/Colt Commando with the really stubby barrel.

[@mfree80286]

"the helicopter was taking brutal ground fire and ammo was distributed." Hopefully not too distributed...

[@clasdauskas]

@@stevenhoman2253 I think you just described Long Tan (for those who want to read more on it).

[@stevenhoman2253]

+Chris Cringle no. this was a frequent patrol hazard for the Aussie's. long tan was simply one highly notable battle.

[@baconx4]

Love the knowledge imparted in this video.

[@lindasanson3094]

Always loved the ring of ejected cartridges when firing - easy to maintain and just feels right

[@gabehartman6832]

MY two favorite presenters and my favorite weapon life is GOOD!

[@OneShotNick92]

The true right arm of the free world!! By the land of the free!!

[@rangerousdave]

Christmas came early again! Thanks, Gun Jesus!

[@rudyruiz9615]

2 amazing gun guys thanks for the detailed review

[@bobbyhood101]

Yep the us ordanace department screwed the US soldier out of a decent battle rifle and stuck them with a target rifle and a shitty cartidge ,we should have adopted this in 280.British ! But butt hurt egos ruled and we ended up with a target rifle and a target cartridge! History

[@RalphReagan]

Yep

[@HGRvSBG]

The most dangerous weapon in this video is Larry Vickers’ knife-hands. 0:26

[@Zencer45]

Collabs with Larry is always fun

[@bradmarthafocker4285]

Excellent piece.

[@alaskanhybridgaming]

Arguably we would still have some kind of problem with insisting upon using the .30 cal that became the 7.62 NATO. A FAL in a 5.56 minimum Caliber would be nice. Kinda like the FNC, an Improved upon design, FN CAL.

[@alaskanhybridgaming]

I realized that after I commented, but I do like rotating bolts for improved locking.

[@danielwatters1203]

The CAL also used a rotating bolt. It was a fat, multi-row lug affair, kind of in same vein as a Weatherby Mark V bolt.

[@sum-tingwong9936]

Weird, it looks like a metric lower on an inch pistol grip / upper. Or... I could watch the video before commenting where they explain its a mix of inch/metric lol.

[@anthonykaiser974]

Yeah, the FrankenFAL.

[@Paulnikon]

Fascinating. Thank you.

[@paulfryejr2918]

really like and appreciate Larry Vickers knowledge. Also like your channel.

[@briarus1000]

hears "they were going to give it to us royalty free" . it looks like the fn-fal and m14 were close in weight and both had a 20rd magazine. since the m16 was developed in the U.S. maybe it would have rolled out faster and without all the illegal B.S. that happened to try and make it look bad. maybe even cleaning kits would have been provided.

[@cycy9154]

They FALled for this one?

[@victorh7675]

Two of some of the best content creators on the internet.

[@simombreeds9501]

Great Show guys👍🇬🇧🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

[@centurian318]

The standard fal’s looked like they were needlessly elongated and out of proportion. Now the para Congo 🤤 Now I wonder if lav has a H&R contract HK33

[@andrewrobinson9825]

Why does Larry sound like he's yelling everything, is he hard of hearing?

[@thomas8535]

He was in Delta for quite some time. It can be assumed that he has hearing damage, like most men who see combat.

[@GrumpyoldPlumber]

He gave his ears for his country.

[@thegreenman2030]

WHAT?

[@williamprince1114]

Senior non coms generally are salty, loud, and assertive in their speaking style. Opinions vary as to why this happens.

[@509Gman]

Army makes you yell everything. Especially NCOs, you have to project your voice to be heard over battle or keep privates from falling asleep in training.

[@kenhelmers2603]

Great talk guys! Thanks :)

[@desroin]

Larry looks like he's in really good shape. Love your collaborate videos with him

[@benfennell6842]

I love xenonauts

[@gussie88bunny]

Sorry if someone's said this already ... mate's dad was in Vietnam with Oz army. He described small unit patrolling .... scouts out front with their M16s, gun group with their M60, and everyone else with SLRs (FALs) and a tonne of grenades. He thought this was a good mix of guns, the lighter M16s great for full auto blasting the scouts out of trouble, but the heavy SLR rounds great for splintering trees, thin sandbag walls, termite mounds and anything else Charlie was taking cover behind. He thought the M16 was much easier to get rapid fire on target, with the SLR requiring calmer deliberation to be effective. I get the impression the M16 would be a better fit for poorly trained soldiers .... or maybe better said ... the FAL shines when used by experienced and well trained professionals. Horses for courses.

[@jasonarmstrong5750]

When are you gonna take a look at the FN FNC?

[@jasonarmstrong5750]

Sciolist yeah but how many Americans have even heard of one?

[@KermitTheGamer21]

Not all of the guns on this channel are obscure.

[@jackandersen1262]

He did already.

[@SebastianHonsa]

@@jackandersen1262 I don't thinks so. FN CAL only. I would love to see FN FNC!

[@jackandersen1262]

Sebastian Honsa here’s the video kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJ-5h6SKfLN2j9E

[@GARDENER42]

I have a 1963 BSA made L1A1 that has the option to fold the trigger guard out of the way, though the "lollipop stick" cover needs removing from the front of the pistol grip first.

[@arthurpearce8539]

I don't know if you'll see this. I was in the Australian Army (Infantry) from 1977 to 1986 9 years. As regards the rifle grenades the SLR was used in conjunction with the ENERGA grenade launcher system, not a bullet trap system. This entails fitting a launcher spigot over the flash suppressor and locking it on the bayonet fitting. The spigot has a battle sight as part of the attachment. The gas plug is turned around so the non notched side is uppermost, blocking off the gas system and reloading manually. Balistite rounds are used instead of bullet cartridges. I had regular training with this system and had no difficulty in its use and certainly no damage to the release catch as you mentioned. the only drawback was resetting the rifle for regular use. it took a few seconds and you didn't want to keep switching back and forth during a battle.

[@Humble_Balaclava]

Indian Para Military forces who are combating the Communist Insurgency in the North-East and Western part of country, Use this L1A1 SLR manufactured by Ishapore arsenal still now, still in Semi-Auto Configuration, also Modern version of FAL in Full-auto is used too. Due to its Nato round it is prefered in jungle environment were it can punch through vegetation and foliage . there Normally Paired with AKM-47 Bulgarian AKs manufactured under licence.

[@GeorgiaBoy1961]

@ Project Blunt - Aren't Indian mountain troops issued with the SLR, too? Since India and Pakistan engage on some of the highest battlefields on earth, they are often high-up enough that heavy equipment and weapons aren't around, which makes the individual soldier's rifle that much more important. Since ranges can be longer in the mountains, the additional punch and range of the 7.62x51 is appreciated as well.

[@Humble_Balaclava]

@@GeorgiaBoy1961 SLRs have been replaced in army long back By INSAS 5.56 , also with Sig 716i to some extent mainly for troops in Strike Corps at borders with China and for Pakistan except in J&K and other non mountains areas will be getting locally made AK-203 and other domestic guns made by Indian companies, As you have suggested 7.62x51 provides Punch and Range in mountains areas but at cost of increased weight, reduced ammo.

[@stamfordly6463]

I don't think it was the M-14 that caused the M-16, I think it was the combination of 7.62 AND the M-14.

[@backyardboosters9128]

Pretty much. Had the fal been adopted in an intermediate caliber the m16 wouldn't have been adopted.

[@torbai]

No, neither of them. It was the combo of DoD and McNamara.

[@shawnr771]

@@backyardboosters9128 One thing to remember the M14 used 20 round mags. Seven mags is 140 rounds. Seven mags is standard for a line infantry soldier. The M16 started with 20 round but quickly increased to 30 rounds. 7 mags is 210 rounds. With the infantry you have to carry everything. More ammo is good. A mix of weapons in a squad is what is needed. A few long range, a few for close quarters etc.

[@drewberg1361]

@@backyardboosters9128 have you ever laid down sustained fire from a FAL? Its not much better than an M14 XD we still would have switched, not to mention the difference in size and weight. The FAL is a battle rifle, the M14 is a battle rifle and both have their pros and cons. The M16 is an assault rifle, its a completely different veast and in the use that its made for the FAL doesnt hold a candle to the M16/M4.

[@DarkSpar13]

The Entangled Trap Would we have switched to an intermediate round? Probably. Would we have switched to the M16? Probably not. Initially the FAL was designed as an assault rifle for an intermediate round, then re-chambered for a full power round. If we needed to switch to an assault rifle with an intermediate round we'd have just re-chambered the FAL back down (and probably thrown 30 round mag into it). No need to completely change tooling if a relatively minor modification is all we'd really need.

[@troy9477]

I never knew any US companies ever made test rifles. It makes sense though, to get an idea how feasible it is, and how difficult to set up a production line. H&R was a good choice. I have one of their Garands from the Korean War era, and it's a great rifle. Love the color of that wood, and the stock stamping/cartouche. Definitely a piece of history. Which needs to be test fired. Hope that is the next video. Great video as always. Thank you

[@kowalski363]

Great video. Thank you.