The Best Anime You Shouldn't Watch

[@SteveAkaDarktimes]

If you wish to venture into this amazing story you have to pay the true cost of the Abyss: weird Lolicon BS.

[@ButtCh1n]

Nah

[@Hawk7886]

I was prepared for the horror, but _that_ was where the real struggle started. I had to know more about the Abyss, I couldn't stop. Eventually, it happened... _the toilet chapter_ Edit: Oh just got to the end, apparently I'm in Group 2.

[@lloydgush]

Well, there's two ways of doing horror that tend to work, you either make things increadibly horrible (saw) or you make the monster unknown. Let's say it's a way to leave the audience unconfortable of the first kind that seems very effective.

[@lloydgush]

​@@Hawk7886the toilet chapter is pennies next to the vivicection chapter.

[@daniellewillis2767]

@@SteveAkaDarktimes Dun Da DAAAA!

[@binnes117]

The "loss of humanity" upon recieving the curse of level 6 reminds me of the end of the story "I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream"- being turned into an amorphous blob, unable to die or help itself

[@KiraKamiya]

Thankfully, most of the people who receive the sixth layer's curse are able to be killed normally. Mitty being indestructible was an irregularity due to the fact that she received double the amount of the curse from Bondrewd's experiment.

[@katback1678]

Thankfully, there is nothing unfair at level 6.

[@krokulridgestalker7007]

The thing with Bondrewd is that you don't just get to descend into the abyss and remain human, you can and will be driven mad sooner or later. While his actions can in no shape or form be described as being driven by love, he himself genuinely believes that he loves all of his children and the abyss itself accepts his feelings as such. It was explained, that in order for someone to receive 'the blessing of the abyss' two people have to actually love each other, that it doesn't work if one party doesn't reciprocate the feeling. Meaning that, whatever ruling force it is that decides whether two people care enough about each other to be blessed, recognised Bondrewds feelings towards Prushka. The whole reason people argue that Bondrewd genuinely loves his children is that he is a twisted man with a twisted wiev on emotion and the abyss is a twisted place where his feelings are validated. His feelings cannot in good conscience be called love by any sensible human being, but if you were a sensible person, you wouldn't be down in the abyss in the first place.

[@keybearer26]

Hot damn! That was perfect

[@krokulridgestalker7007]

@@misanthropicservitorofmars2116 I mean to be fair, I wouldn't say he genuinely loves the children either, because you don't do the things Bondrewd does to someone if you love them. Like, in the Mitty-pit/garden, he straight up just stomped on the children as if they were nothing more than weeds, while fighting Reg. That's not very loving father of him. He remembers all of their names, all of the hopes and dreams of the children he experimented on. All of the hopes and dreams that he stole and crushed, before dumping and abandoning their remains into a pit in the ground. These are not the actions of someone who cares, much less loves someone. What he feels is obsession, obsession for his research, obsession for his research subjects and a kind of twisted affection towards those who make his research possible, his victims. That being said, I don't think we can really judge him by human standards, considering that he's literally just a wandering consciousness, possessing the bodies of his followers and gripping on to any semblance of sanity and self-identity by the usage of a cool fit. As I stated in my first comment, he's a madman who believes that what he feels is love and if that's what he thinks then I'm not about to climb down to the deepest depths of literal hell just to hand him a self help book and tell him off. The abyss was never a home for humans to begin with and that Bondrewd lives so deep down there does not change that fact. EDIT: You know what? I just reread this comment and realised that I conflated my own words and said a silly thing. The affection he feels towards his victims? Definitely not parental love, but a type of love all the same. He loves his kids in the same way you might love the pig you've been raising for slaughter. They're super cute and personable and you want them to be happy and enjoy themselves, but ultimately, they serve another purpose as well.

[@Divalerie]

@@misanthropicservitorofmars2116 Luckily, we have a common definition of love to refer to and it doesn't include scenarios like "grooming children so someone can skin them alive, carve their guts out to reduce them to an agonising state worse than death, and use their remains to deflect a curse away from themselves." While it's swell that we have pretentious elitists to police the criticism of their favourite media and explain how this is love to the rest of us less smart folks who understand that it's clearly not, I would refer you to a handy reference book called the dictionary. Within its pages, where we list the meanings of words, you will see that indifference, neglect, and treachery are all antonyms of love. These words aptly describe the end result of Bondrewd's grooming and child exploitation.

[@wormwoodbecomedelphinus4131]

​@@krokulridgestalker7007 the depths of the human mind hasnt been fully explored. On top of that, even the neurally-atypical shy-away from thinking deeply upon what they may evolve into if kept at their lowest for prolonged periods of time. In a purely objective stand-point: Bondrewd can both love the children as a parent and not feel anything if they die. Thats simply how it is: besides its basic needs, the human mind is incredibly arbitrary and capsble of astounding feats of seeming hypocrysy. Of course from the human point of view, Bondrewd cant be considered human. He split himself across multiple bodies and has committed the unspeakable to children: removing both qualifications for human (the physical and the moral). That said: the Quokka has a reflexive action where if its being chased by a predator, it might drop its child. This isnt incompatible with parental love because even animal minds are likely capable of willfully not thinking about things if it provides an advantage.

[@krokulridgestalker7007]

@@wormwoodbecomedelphinus4131 See, you're talking as if a single thing you're saying actually deviated from the point that I was making. While it is true that the human mind is capable of breaking and coming up with plenty of horrible things, we don't talk about things like emotions and morals by using people with severe mental illness as the goalposts. What Bondrewd feels towards his victims is not parental love, because if that is what he felt, then he physically would not be able to do the things he does. Now, moving away from that for just a second. The fun thing about comparing humans to animals is that humans have developed beyond our base instincts, while most animals are very much driven by them. Humans do incredible things to protect their children. and even beyond that, most parents would be more than happy to give their own life for that of their child's. Not because of instincts, but because they love their children. Hence comparing human parental love, to the survival instincts of a kangaroo with a brain the size of a peanut isn't really compatible. Even IF we were to talk about Bondrewd in the same category as animals, he does not act without conscious thought of his actions. Unlike a quokka tossing it's pup away as a distraction, unlike a eurasian coot beating it's chicks to death and unlike a male hippo ripping it's step child to actual pieces, Bondrewd is not acting on instinct. He is not driven by survival strategies deeply ingrained in his mind over generation upon generation. He know exactly what he's doing, how inhumane his actions are and he chooses to continue. Because he is not someone who could not for the life of him fathom how someone could hurt their own child. Because he is not someone who feels true, genuine, unflinching love towards the children he himself tricks into handing themselves over to their future murderer. Because he is simply not capable of what any sane person would define as loving someone on that level.

[@nont18411]

Finding a dark anime, movie or show without sexual assault challenge: impossible

[@666kittycat666]

It’s really kind of annoying how people tend to chose that so eagerly as their “dark themes” to explore cause a lot of times the way writers treat it is shallow and has no real idea of why it’s so horrible to have happen to you. It’s why so much of the portrayals tend to swing into the “sexualisation” area…

[@dura_14]

I love a good dark story, but some of this is straight up just the author's barely disguised fetish. WHY IS THERE SO MUCH PEE.

[@Killgore-ip2yq]

​@@666kittycat666 Where looking at you Europhia 😂

[@warmtoastsarethebest8856]

@@666kittycat666 trueee.... Creators like that understand that rape is bad but they don't get *why* it is bad so, like you said, they often just. ignore what makes it so horrible and end up doing just sexualization instead, or they wholly gloss over the ordeal...

[@Blue-hx8qu]

Puella Magi Madoka Magica. The closest to SA it has is the trauma of one character that can be read that way.

[@koroconnell]

Calling the Abyss a "glory hole, perhaps" is willld, I almost spat out my drink

[@Chernobog1455]

On the topic of the letter, im a big fan of the theory that it was written by rico herself, with the time dilation of the abyss becoming so great at the bottom that it loops too moving backwards in some way. Their is some minor evidence for this, the bad handwriting being caused by ricos destroyed hand, the "paper" being a material similar too regs skin, only being able to be damage by the high energies relics we see, hence paper being seemingly burnt around the edges.

[@kennethsosa7542]

@Chernobog1455 im surprised at seeing this theory floating around. Im a big fan of it myself

[@crypty4074]

Oh man I was already getting strong Uzumaki vibes with the whole eldritch being luring people down into it thing, but what if just like at Uzumaki's center time stands still once you reach the bottom??

[@annamau-glicenstein7868]

It's interesting knowing that in the Divine Comedy, the very bottom of hell has time that spends faster

[@pleasekillyoursef]

The one time you can say you unironically seriously watch it for the actual plot

[@Zarathinius]

"10/10, Do Not Recommend" is about where I'm at with MiA.

[@dudep504]

Also the monogatari series

[@mittag983]

Same my girlfriend thought I was a pedo for some time for watching Made in Abyss I'm glad she now trusts me again

[@Mattzerater]

Couldnt agree more

[@williamt104]

I only watched the Anime but am I missing something? In terms of sexualization, I found it pretty much nonexistent. Though this could be the rose-colored glasses talking, I never really saw where the Lolicon really took place?

[@Zarathinius]

@@williamt104 I believe the anime successfully toned down some of the egregious stuff, which is why I was able to enjoy it. But stuff like Riko probing Reg while he was unconscious (and the attention given to Reg's body in a few other scenes), the "tie 'em up naked" thing that comes up more than once, frequent attention given to scatological/toilet-related moments for very young characters... it all adds up when you look at it in retrospect. Every person who's read it says the manga is worse about it.

[@rosebudsavesacat]

It frustrates me cus I’m a such sucker for world building and made in abyss has incredible world building. I mean the biology alone! I was so intrigued by the lore and the mystery, not only of the abyss, but the town above. However the “icky” scenes got harder and harder to ignore, and I eventually had to drop it. Ugh It’s unfair! This was such a good concept for a dark fantasy story…

[@MertKayKay]

Yes! An amazing story full of SUPER impressively designed characters and monsters. How does he come up with it??

[@AC-dk4fp]

@@MertKayKay By being a pervert willing to research a lot of biology. I don't think you can really seperate the 'perverse' bits from the general body horror bits, even the organic bidet from the village is about the uncomfortability of human embodiment and the way the mutated denizen's self acceptance renders them physically inhuman makes sense as a expression of the author's self disgust with himself.

[@mickflick8133]

Check out Scavengers Reign!

[@sushimaster29]

Check out Dungeon Meshi! I've been selling it to my friends as "Made in Abyss if the author wasn't a creep!"

[@markinlife]

@@sushimaster29is it as brilliant emotionally? It looked like mostly a comedy to me, so I wasn’t too intrigued

[@reitheist]

looking at the title in my notifications: "this is gonna be about made in abyss isnt it"

[@littleladytoge5306]

I just want to read about kids going into Uncle Lovecraft's Fun Pit and not feel weird about it.

[@JLacay]

Do you mean Howard Lovecraft and The Undersea Kingdom?

[@daniellewillis2767]

Eww​@@JLacay

[@daniellewillis2767]

Hooray!

[@daniellewillis2767]

Me too. And I have no apologies to make for not being concerned for the abuse of cartoons.

[@ApocryphA420]

Your use of 'Uncle lovecraft' still makes it sound weird 🤣

[@blueberryofdoom1063]

It's actually been roughly 2000 years between the Ganja Squad and Team Riko descending into the Abyss, because the Abyss has weird time-dilation phenomenons

[@MertKayKay]

Oh wow! That's so cool.

[@halaska4278]

@@MertKayKay The 120 years mentioned, is more related to how long they have been on the 6'th layer, but as blueberry said they descended about 2000th years ago, supposedly shortly after the last event. I have only seen the anime, but at the start of the first episode of season 2, the 3 people on the boat really intrigue me

[@gatochick14]

There are NO antagonists, villains, bad guys I hate more than Bondrewd. That is how well he's written. I completely agree with your analysis here and with the fact that it's a sad, sad fact that the author can't or won't separate his degeneracy from his work. Like you point out, nothing is lost in the "clean" version. Honestly, I think the story has it's own "Call of the Abyss". The vast majority of people who read and watch want to also see what is past that Final Maelstrom, if Liza actually did call Riko down, and answers to all the other questions the story has posed. Nanachi mentions souls of those who die in the Abyss moving down instead of up like on the surface. With it's power to make people and beings immortal, it could be holding all those souls at the bottom. Maybe those lost souls power all the magic of the Abyss itself.

[@noemitamas4066]

While I don't have a source either, apparently it was the author himself who confirmed that Bondrewd genuinely loves the children (although this doesn't make his actions better or less calculated, but I thought I might mention it). And another small addition to the Dante segment: the author also denied basing the abyss on Dante's Inferno and said that he was more inspired by the Buddhist concept of hells the soul has to travel through in the afterlife (that being said I too think that there are connections with Inferno, but this could explain the deviations from it). EDIT: It's not my intention in any way to defend the author. The explanations for Bondrewd's behaviour may work in a 100% in universe sense where there is a mystical Abyss that can judge what love is and can drive you insane and force your hand to enact cruelty. But the truth is that considering the author's fetishistic tendencies, the fact that he prominently includes elements in his story that muddle the line between love and abuse and try to absolve the perpetrator of responsibility should be seen as concerning at least.

[@Inkcharm]

I feel like you're gonna run into the Thanos problem there, where I'd argue that if you deliberately and selfishly hurt and abuse someone you love, that's not, in fact, *actually* love. And furthermore a damn problematic message to send, which to be fair... seems par for the course with this mangaka.

[@Blue-hx8qu]

​@@Inkcharm The whole point is that love can take an abusive form. Abusive parents like Bondrewd "love" their children. It's just an abusive and toxic form of love. The mangaka proved that he knows how to write abusive and manipulative father figures.

[@Inkcharm]

@@Blue-hx8qu yes. and abuse + manipulation do not equal love. not to me. that person might think it's love, and their victim might think so, too. doesn't make it true. makes it fucked up and complicated, of course. you even just put "love" in quotation marks. because that's now what that is.

[@casseroledragon3277]

​@Inkcharm Bondrewd was Blessed during his fight with Reg, which confirms he had to have loved the children even if it was a sick and twisted kind of love. A person is only Blessed by sacrificing your own Haku, as the video pointed out, so the children had to be considered part of his Haku for the Blessing to work.

[@Inkcharm]

@@casseroledragon3277 so you think the fact that the author chose to make his narrative treat is like love means everyone needs to agree that it is love? by that measure 50 shades of grey is a healthy depiction of a bdsm relationship just because the author called it that. thanos's feelings for his "daughter" Gamora are also called love by the narrative, even though he kidnapped, abused and manipulated her since she was a small child. That still doesn't make it make sense. If someone abuses you, that is not love, just because they think it is, just because the victim thinks it is, or in the case of fiction, just because the writers says it is. we can agree to disagree on that. I will never ever ever call abuse and assault love though. if you wanna, that's your choice.

[@MinecraftRespawn13]

Bruh I am so grateful for this video. I’m super interested in body horror, but when I tried to watch the anime, the over-sexualization of the characters triggered the shit out of me.

[@parasitone0814]

I dropped it once because i just felt disgusted at myself to keep watching, I partly tried to think myself it was the way the series was trying to give itself a "curse of the abyss" in it of itself, as to creep the viewers out of it as to not delve in further but like dude, I want to enjoy a Mesopotamian inspired spelunking on a giant crater, not to get to see the entirety of icky scenes the series has, I've started to watch it again now it was worse than I remember

[@Name..........]

​@parasitone0814 just watch it. There's no way we watched the same thing. All in all are the dicks odd yes, but just push through them. It has more body horror and gore than it does dick jokes...it also never shows anyone fully naked, it hints at it. Yes but it doesnt show anything. Thats all in your mind.

[@brimstonesulfur5013]

The anime isn’t so bad (aside from that montage in the second episode and the part with Uncle Halbolg). The manga on the otherhand is so much worse

[@Absoluuttinen_Totuus]

@@parasitone0814 Tbh I didn't think the anime had that much "unnecessary" weirdness besides that one part in ep1 (I think?) where Riko was strung up naked and the "toilet scene" in season 2 (although it didn't really include nudity, but it was just kind of weird)... The stuff with Reg's p*enis and Riko talking about it was pretty normal to me, and even seemed realistic in their situation (although there was one too many testicle jokes in s1😂). Btw, the 'papa pole' thing in movie 3 that most anime-only people found questionable was not actually as weird as they think it was - that phrase was explained in the manga, and it was just a childish misunderstanding on Phruska's part. For some reason they left it in the anime and never bothered to make it less weird by explaining it... Everything else people call weird in the show just seemed like cultural behaviour to me since I, too, live in a country where nudity is not linked straight to sexualizing and where we often show our naked bodies in front of others. I thought it also added to the realism of the natural but unfamiliar world that the author clearly wanted to convey through the story, so I really don't get why some people make it such a big deal. I mean, I understand that CP is a huge problem, but this doesn't even come close to anything like that (I'm not hating on you or anything btw. I understand that nude scenes including children can be uncomfortable to people - especially if you're not used to that shit happening irl). Now, the manga is a whole other story😬 I think the author also has some... unique... fetishes regarding smell and some other things😅He can definitely be given the title of a weirdo, but most of his work is still done purely from a storytelling perspective, and that's why this story of his is so amazing. Weird people always have the best stories, oddly enough. If you are uncomfortable with those two scenes where the MC can be seen properly naked, I think that just tells something about your cultural knowledge. I agree that Kinema Citrus did leave a couple of unnecessary scenes in, and I'm not trying to make people watch something they don't want to see, but beyond the first episode's "strung up" scene it's really not as bad as you're making it seem. Maybe you should just go back and give the show another chance by not going in with the mindset that "every nude part is surely made for a podophilic audience and not for comical relief or realism". As an artist, the Abyss is one of the most interesting and creative story concepts I've ever seen.

[@alain.e]

We have toture, gore, death, brutal mutation, slavery, exploiting children and many more that even worst than lolicon and people only whining about lolicon content, In anime i barely saw any scene that is "over-sexualize "those character, barely at all, and nudity is not alway sexualize, and each anime have different in animation / art style, and you shouldn't have judge by it overall art direction, even the anime it self is way more tamer than the Manga version, and in the manga, the only scene that it somewhat sexualized that weird me out (even though i have no problem with lolicon-content), is not even adapted onto the anime yet. Overall the artist / author of this series is super talented at replicate the world before technology advancing, all of these problem death, gore, slavery, children exploit,... would happened like daily meal, if people still whining about anime being too catering to Lolicon then ye the gatekeeper is doing a good job keeping the tourist out :)) Bth this part "the over-sexualization of the characters triggered the shit out of me." make you sound like a tourist a lot, and you barely watch any episode of this series at all imo.

[@damienrosa384]

I'm so glad that someone brought this up. The manga's difference in uncomfortable gratuitous depictions of Riko was waaay higher. I loved the anime, and wanted to support the author, only to fear that owning the manga could put me on a watch list lmfao.

[@psionicdongpunch]

my gf introduced me to the anime last year sometime and i was able to mentally block out the weird sexual stuff enough to rate it one of the best pieces of media i've ever encountered in my life. then out of curiosity i went looking for the manga online. i don't think i made it to the end of the first chapter.

[@derpkipper]

​@psionicdongpunch oh dear Yeah my first experience was the anime too and even the apparently more subtle moments showing really weird shit made me go "wtf" but fortunately I don't have a personal trigger regarding those subjects and it was infrequent enough for me to just shake it off. Maybe I *will* want to read the censored version of the manga lol. I was thinking "could it really be that bad?" Starting to get the idea that "yes it is that bad"

[@derpkipper]

I do definitely want to read the manga one way or the other though, it seems like it goes into much more detail about a lot of the worldbuilding just based on what I've seen from the pages shown in this video

[@gosiaborzycka5641]

I started buying manga before anime came out. There are literally drawings of these characters naked under dust covers (idk how its called in english, its cover on the cover). I felt so weird everytime I took it off so I can read the manga without destroying the second cover

[@raptorboss6688]

it really sucks because his art is some of the best art i've ever seen in a manga

[@Zayl1016]

One of the instances where the anime exceeds the original, purely on the instance of dialing down the weird pervert shit. I hate that this is arguably my favorite anime in recent memories cause I have to think really hard on recommending it. My go-to comparison is like if you went to a soul-changing art exhibit that left you profoundly moved... Only to have a weirdo periodically jab you in the eye with a stick while you experience it. I'm like, "Yeah, it is an amazing experience, you just get your eye jabbed periodically, and if you can contend with that, I can recommend it." Edit: Also meant to add, Kevin Penkin is an amazing composer who elevates the story. Peace be upon him.

[@rosebudsavesacat]

This is the perfect analogy for watching the anime

[@BY-yi1kh]

thank god the anime dials down the weird shit, I might actually give it a try now

[@stormysoup1083]

That adaptation is amazing in so many more ways as well, like taking a layer that's only a single underwhelming chapter in the manga and greatly expanding on it for an entire episode, the Made In Abyss manga is very good as well but I'd never recommend it over the anime to a first timer for that reason you stated and many others

[@CrescentUmbreon]

KEVIN PENKIN IS A MUSICAL GOD. I have all his Made in Abyss tracks fffffffffuuuuuuuu, so good...

[@spacedino91]

Love this anime expect the overly sexual parts. There was no reason for it, it didnt add anything, and i felt the creator was trying to push his creepy agenda.

[@emilycrow8278]

This is one of my favorite stories that I can never, ever actually truly enjoy. I haven't read the latest chapters, but holy crap, I hope that cleaned-up version is able to process that, cuz I won't be able to. Thank you for this video though. You've added a ton of new perspectives and lore information that I hadn't really connected. The story captures the drive and desire into madness and the unknown so beautifully.

[@MertKayKay]

Thanks Emily! The addition of the twins was an extremely weird choice in recent chapters. God speed 😭 (also thanks for always watching my videos, I appreciate it)

[@emilycrow8278]

@MertKayKay No way, thank you for making great content. Your insight has always been incredible and well thought out. Always looking forward to your next video.

[@witchwaist]

it's ironic that a writer who can excellently portray a system of exploitation that especially targets children can then turn around and do exactly that for his own titillation. another banger of a video. I loved the in-depth analysis, and appreciated it more as I'm unsure I'll ever bother going to the trouble of reading/watching it all. but this essay serves nicely in its stead.

[@MertKayKay]

I completely agree Cloven! Thanks so much for watching, I'm really glad you enjoyed it

[@dRac_XII]

it is indeed ironic however it also almost makes too much sense unfortunately

[@flashholmwood9371]

This video and the comments here are carthartic. I went into Made in Abyss blind many years ago and was really into it. Like everyone says, the world building is fascinating, and I needed to know what happened to her mom, what was down there. I got all the way to the seventh layer when they reveal ANOTHER naked child character and i wanted to scream. It made me feel like i was encouraging an active pedophile. I felt ashamed that this man was potentially using his platform to encourage other pedophiles and betrayed that no matter how good the story was, it would always come back to naked children. I would get frustrated any time someone mentioned the show at all, like how on earth is it even legal to print this stuff, and yet i really did love the parts of it that weren't that. It's such a frustrating experience, and it felt like i was the only one who felt that strongly about that. Now i finally see the people with reason here who aren't just either complete apologists or absolute haters.

[@StarBoxz]

They are literally fictional characters why are you making such a big deal out of this?

[@faberquidam]

@@StarBoxz because fiction reflects reality, it's clearly part of the interests of the author and it's certainly able to affect his readers. It would honestly be fine if it only generated disgust but the amount of people I've seen calling the sexualization of these chibi children "based" is wild. I'm not even saying that MIA fans are encouraged to become pedophiles, just that any media that normalizes seeing little kids as sexual is weird and dangerous

[@SpecialInterestShow]

​@@faberquidamyeah you can't tell me those manga covers and last pages of each volume are anything a normal non-gross person would draw!

[@Cobalt360Degrees]

@@StarBoxz Because these fictional characters were drawn by a living, breathing person and _how_ that person draws a character can say just as much about them as it does the character. And the fact that the creator continues to draw children in extremely upsetting ways that are completely seperate from the content of the story says *a lot* about him whether he did it intentionally or not, and it's to the massive detriment to the actually pretty damn good _story_ he's trying to tell.

[@StarBoxz]

@@Cobalt360Degrees So you're saying the author is a pedophile then. By that logic, every lolicon artist is a pedophile. Fictional drawings are made by people everyone knows that, but that doesn't mean they reflect the author's thoughts and beliefs. These characters don't exist and can only exist in fiction, thus it has to be separated as such.

[@hyperspace4105]

In regards to your Dante’s Inferno comparison I believe in an interview Satoshi said he was actually inspired by Buddhist interpretations of hell which I find really interesting! It leads me to believe that the story will have a sort of “karmic rebirth” type ending which is already beautifully in line with the themes of mother and daughterhood

[@eden22.7]

So happy to hear someone talk about this, especially a woman. “Bang on” as they say

[@skybriel3503]

So after watching this video, I went ahead and took the dive and binged the anime. I honestly can’t say how much I absolutely adored the 95% of this show that wasn’t pedo-bait. I also can’t express just how fucking jarring the Lolicon is whenever it comes up. Yesterday, my friend and I were talking about anime so, having just watched the whole show over the span of the past two or three days, I couldn’t help but bring up MiA. I explained the premise and also warned him about the authors penchant for making non-lolicons extremely uncomfortable at a moments notice. He was interested. So while I couldn’t quite endorse the anime, I DID recommend watching this video essay on it first, so we ended up watching this video in its entirety. I felt like it was the best way to explain just how engaging the story is while also giving him an idea of how downright creepy it can be. But yeah, he was even more interested by the end of it and said he wanted to give the show a watch at some point. He laughed at all your jokes btw, we both love the bits of dry humor you throw in.

[@MertKayKay]

Skybriel this is so kind, thank you :'( it's flattering that you shared this with your mate. I'm also glad you liked the anime! It's so enjoyable, and the manga for me was edge of my seat material. Excited to see what you think of it as it evolves!

[@skybriel3503]

@@MertKayKay dude I honestly think it’s gonna be my next obsession for a little while, which is SUPER embarrassing, but oh well lol. I went and read ahead in the manga and now I’m caught up on everything. Literally praying to whatever higher power may be out there for Nanachi

[@ashmarten2884]

I just recently realized the MiA was what primed me to love Rain World. If I had a nickel for every time I enjoyed a piece of media about a character on a suicidal trip to explore a giant hole in the ground, I’d have 3 nickels. Which isn’t a lot but it’s weird it happened thrice.

[@CrescentUmbreon]

Rain World mentioned!

[@casg-zc6fy]

Could you please name the third one? As a MiA fan that intends to play Rain World and has already enjoyed exploration games involving depth such as Subnautica, I am very interested.

[@ashmarten2884]

@@casg-zc6fy the book ‘annihilation’

[@ashmarten2884]

@@casg-zc6fy Annihilation by Jeff VanderMeer

[@spookyjones6577]

I love how you went over all the great stuff in the story at first. It goes to show how unneeded the loli is at the end. Honestly, I’ve only seen the anime cause I can’t stomach the manga. Even the anime is too iffy for me sometimes 😭 Great essay by the way! This was fantastically written and spoken out, loved listening to it.

[@MertKayKay]

Thanks Spooky Jones! This story definitely needed credit where credit was due. Glad you liked the video

[@st4rz.of.perdition]

@@AN6_Miro being baffled by people not enjoying depictions of child exploitative material is crazy lmfao someone can hold two beliefs in mind at once; believing a story is good or intriguing in some aspects while hating seeing children naked and sexualized isnt baffling nor a western concept, not wanting to see naked kids being fetishized (no matter how intertwined it is within the media itself/whether or not the story can exist without it) is a pretty normal feeling to have the idea that someone cant have nuanced or conflicting feelings surrounding a piece of media is asinine, it isnt just westerners who would prefer to be able to enjoy a conceptual world without creators' fetishes and paraphilias permeating the art itself regardless of artistic process such explicit inclusion of ones attractions is a choice and one made consciously, when i write or draw of course subconscious things may leak out but i do not include things so blatantly without cognitive intention- having a certain philia or fetish can show in small ways but acting like its an unavoidable part of the artistic process is a little silly as if u are claiming he couldnt control whether or not to include it, that he simply couldnt help sexualizing child characters, or that the story/world itself couldnt exist in a form without it, yes the form we have has it because of his choices but (as is usual for many other forms of media in fandom thru things like fix it fics or rewrites to exclude certain aspects) it can be written without it while preserving the most important and compelling parts of the universe i am not someone who believes dark themes such as child exploitation and sexual assault shouldnt exist/should be censored or sanitized as u said, but there are ways in which to include/portray these themes that arent fetishized explicitly within the material itself (fetishization by the reader/viewer obvs cant be controlled regardless of proper/respectful portrayal in media) just having dark themes isnt a defense against censorship if the themes are handled poorly or arent even dissected/are present to be titillating to the viewer- especially when said material involves children

[@snubbiyu_biyu]

@@st4rz.of.perdition believing that drawings of fictional characters constitutes csm is also baffling. Do you also make the same argument for murder and extreme violence in horror? I doubt it.

[@st4rz.of.perdition]

@@snubbiyu_biyu there are places that legally consider drawn content as cp including in the US so yes i do consider it csm because it is depicting what are clearly children in sexual situations, which can not be compared to general violence and gore because it simply isnt the same situation at all and even then things get dicey legally if u depict real people violently but thats besides my point my point was that the media can exist without it and to consider it unfair censorship or a slippery slope towards censorship of all dark media is frankly disingenuous and a little silly, theres a difference between having things like child exploitation as a theme and depicting child exploitation in a way that is clearly meant to be arousing to/enjoyed by the viewer the fact i even have to defend "drawing kids sexually is bad" as a position is baffling cause anti-censorship or not its just not something we need depicted this way cause it serves literally no purpose other than something to get ur rocks off to there are plenty of examples of dark/controversial media that i personally enjoy that include child exploitation, including lolita as the most mainstream example, my issue is with defending something that is clearly only there to titillate/is completely unnecessary- i dont need nor wish to see kids being sexualized which shouldnt be a very hard to understand concept i love dark themes, i enjoy violent media, i dont enjoy sexualization of children and being told that not being okay with it is somehow being pro-censorship which i am not in a broad sense but i am not the type of anti-censorship person to think we should just have free reign to do whatever- moreso that there are moral/legal/social consequences to doing things that are disgusting which for me is depicting kids sexually for purposes of arousal no matter what form it takes do i think its lesser than child exploitative material of real kids? duh, obviously. but it being drawn/animated, while certainly less vile, doesnt mean it isnt portraying children and thus is subject to a similar experience of disgust and moral outrage i think its repulsive to have toys meant to be children, to enjoy/defend drawings of children that way, to be the one drawing it, and none of those things involve real life children i also believe people with philias like that need genuine treatment both for their sakes and others, im not one to hate someone for something they cant control, but i will hate them for not getting treatment or god forbid acting on it in real life like most things when it comes to morals its extremely complicated and nuanced but when it comes to children it isnt, every single adult who has/attempted to groom me used lolicon material as a way to desensitize me to what was happening which is an exceedingly common tactic- not only to use against potential victims but to desensitize others to the idea of portraying children sexually, that its fine because it isnt real that argument, while applicable to things like violent video games or horror movies, just doesnt stand when it comes to children being portrayed inappropriately. someone enjoying a shooter/dark game or a gorey horror movie is not comparable to someone getting turned on by the idea of a fictional child again i am not pro-censorship i just think its gross to depict children in such a way for nothing but gratification as well as finding the implication that its "part of the artistic process" or necessary to the existence of a piece of media a weird defense that is both factually inaccurate (not just cause its children portrayed in a sexual manner this applies to other things that serve no real purpose in pieces of media like fan service or gratuitous filler) and comes off like just wanting to see kids naked and sexualized or trying to be the edgiest lord at the ball idk if u misunderstood my comment or got caught on me calling it child exploitative material or what but 🤷‍♂️ (edit: just saw the person i replied to's comment is no longer showing which obviously causes lack of context if that is the case on ur end as well but id hope my point stands on its own regardless)

[@snubbiyu_biyu]

@@st4rz.of.perdition again, you conflate fantasy with reality. There is no “child exploitation” going on because there are no real children involved. It’s amazing how you water down serious issues because you consider it uncomfortable. It is a slippery slope to censorship because the minute something you like gets censored now it’s a problem. And this is a, YOU problem. Not sure how you think that lolicon drawings are illegal. Which they are not because they aren’t meant to be 1 to 1 with, oh idk, real children. All because you don’t agree that it’s necessary to the piece of media, the author did and thats why it’s in there. I don’t have any problem with you having an issue with lolicon content. I just have the problem with conflating it with real life and acting like it has less correlation that other forms of media that is illegal if done in the real world. No hard feeling against you btw 👍

[@Joey245]

"Trying to remove those scenes would be censorship, but if I see a gay character I will leave a pipe bomb in an amusement park" ...god, that should not have made me laugh as hard as it did. Genuine question - how much of the loli stuff makes it into the actual anime itself? Because the way you've described this makes it sound genuinely interesting, and despite the fact that you're saying you shouldn't recommend it I find it compelling all the same. The way you describe the Abyss reminds me a lot of the dungeon from Fear and Hunger - another dark fantasy thing with a lot of violence and sexual themes, this one an RPGMaker game made by a single Finnish indie developer - specifically how people who do manage to leave the Abyss are never the same person who went in. It's an interesting parallel I noticed, from my limited frames of reference. Awesome video as usual! Keep being awesome!

[@estebanaguirre965]

it has enough to attract the pedos... like trully go to any other forum where this is being discussed (just browsed through a couple of myanimelist threads) and they are rampant...

[@nixiesticks2754]

if any loli stuff at all would make you too uncomfortable then don't watch the anime they still have the weird stuff with reg, the implied assault scene with riko, the weird toilet scene, and the punishment at the orphanage however from what i've been told by my friends that read the manga(i haven't) it's toned down a lot there's also some stuff between reg and nanachi and how it's basically explicitly stated that reg is turned on by nanachi in multiple instances, however we never ever see any of the kids genitals. we do see them bathing occasionally however iirc riko's chest is covered by her hair and it's not really sexualized, just some kids takin a bath. season 2 is a lot darker and more graphic than s1. so if you're willing to try it out give the first season a watch, if it's too much for you don't watch s2 at all because that's where the toilet and implied assault scenes are. there's also a scene in the village where(without going into too many spoilers), one of the villagers explicitly states he had an orgasm to the children. and that's as far as the conversation goes. that's all i can remember off the top of my head, it's been a few months since i've watched the show and while i really did enjoy the story and plot i don't think i'm ever going to rewatch it(by myself at least) because both the loli shit and the suffering of the children(especially in s2) really fucked me up in ways no other show has done before. i would recommend looking up the imdb parents guide in case i missed some scenes, if you do decide to watch the show, make sure you've got some comfort items nearby and are in a comfortable space because i have never felt as viscerally depressed after watching made in abyss than i have after any other show/movie/game in my life. good luck to you

[@Shikcri]

The anime is SIGNIFICANTLY toned down, but there is still a frankly uncomfortable amount of scenes present that make me unwilling to recommend it. I haven't stopped thinking about this series since the first episode of the anime released, still cant recommend it. Fear and Hunger is actually a much darker tone overall, I think from the inclusion of eldritch type gods, but its a good allegory! Think of it like if the funger dungeons were all bright colors and sunshine so you can better see the horrors that take place within! If you can handle funger made in abyss shouldn't be too shocking, minus the ido front arc with Bondrewd.

[@1pokemonfan5]

Genre title suggestion: Katabasic Horror. Based on katabasis, loosely translating as "To Hell and Back"

[@RedSpade37]

​​​@@1pokemonfan5 Ooo, I like that! You've heard of Ergodic Literature, so get ready for... Katabasic Horror! You have my vote.

[@IDKLOL-qj7sl]

I would say there are one or two of the lolicon dubious scenes that I consider to be justified in a narrative sense... they're not a monolithic thing, and there are better and worse ones. and I am glad that the anime toned down several of these scenes (I don't remember Prushka calling it a "papa stick" even though the conversation about Reg's genitals still happened.) I think Reg having reproductive organs is one such narratively justifiable thing to include. maybe not the frequency with which it's mentioned, or the severity of the violation that is used to convey this information to the audience, but there is strangeness to the level of human detail that Reg's robot body includes. it's another little bit of mystery, especially because the other sentry units we come across in the deeper layers don't seem nearly as humanoid. another justifiable instance would be Riko's technical sexual assault of Reg via probing him. on the one hand, you could argue that she can't be blamed because he's a robot, and she might not have viewed her behavior as a violation. on the other hand, I think it's more interesting to take this as an early indication that Riko's particular brand of innocence might not be harmless. to me, this nods more toward the function of losing innocence within the abyss, or the way that this innocence doesn't absolve certain individuals of the actions they take. Riko's very innocent desire to know more, can lead her toward behaviors such as probing Reg... but also, treating Reg more like a robot than a person in some instances in general, heading into the abyss in the first place and leaving all the people who care for her behind, and forging ahead even once she knows that Lyza's note might not actually be from Lyza at all. when they're encountering Bondrewd, Riko is able to correctly guess what he did in order to obtain his white whistle... and Bondrewd comments that Riko has some element in her, which allowed her to make this deduction, with the same cold investigative logic that Bondrewd used to arrive at his current condition in the first place. in the abyss... you lose innocence so that you can grow up. and it's that cold, callous intellectualism that the abyss selects for, by ensuring that only those people survive. the abyss eats innocent children alive, with no hesitation. it is only those who shed their innocence quickly enough, that are able to weather the nightmare. they do it by changing into creatures that are suited to their environment... by acclimating to the abyss. they are changed by it, into something that can _only_ live there anymore... there, and nowhere else. and that's why the only adults you'll run into in the abyss are deeply troubling ones. a friend of mine, while viewing the show, mentioned that it seemed like the children were always able to find comfort with one another, and were always right to distrust adults. no encounter with an adult has ever gone quite well. she actually wondered if the author might've had some sort of childhood sexual trauma (something that can only be speculated on, and something that isn't an excuse for any of the loli stuff... just a possible explanation.) because it seems like children innocently exploring sexual concepts is treated with a general sense of harmlessness, while involvement from adults is generally treated as rightfully upsetting. this is not me arguing in favor of the inclusion of these things, especially considering the more voyeuristic framing of the art in the manga... but at least in some instances, it seems like the sexual investigation done by the children is accepted as safe and secure, while sexuality from adults is treated as threatening. there can be, and probably are, ulterior motives to this split... even depictions of sexual distress can be used for whatever appeal these things have to the folks who are into that. but it muddies things a little bit, because in this series, the gradual transformation of a person, from an innocent child into an adult with full knowledge and understanding, is a definite theme with a purpose. considering Bondrewd in particular... between the time dilation, the way his physical body has changed, the way his mind has changed due to the way he's fragmented himself, and the number of crimes he's done, which he sees no problem with, but which no one in the outside world would ever accept... I don't think Bondrewd can leave. the investigation he's making into the abyss as a phenomenon, is no longer for the benefit of anyone but himself. instead of being a person anymore, the abyss is making him into one of its own appendages... assimilating him, digesting him, and it all began with that ravenously curious mind. in many ways, the abyss feels like something addictive. the hungrier a person becomes for information about it, the more they go towards it, and the more it has the opportunity to consume them back. even the innocents that delve in are starting from a baseline that isn't well adapted to life outside of the abyss. Marulk says that he can't withstand large amounts of sunlight, so his body is predisposed to thriving in the abyss. Mitty, and especially Nanachi were unwanted children living in destitution on the surface, and the orphans at the orphanage are set up to want to dive in, in the way this video outlined so well. and the adventuring party of Wazukyan, Vueko, and Belaf was all made up of people who felt that this exploration was a better prospect than anything they had in the places they were from. these people were easy marks for this entity... they're psychologically predisposed to being sucked into this place, and it makes you wonder if their entrapment is a cause of their strife or a symptom. in this way, it's also interesting to consider innocence as a bit of a bell curve, and discuss the other half. as folks delve into the abyss, and lose more and more of their ignorance along the way, their standards change. once again looking at Bondrewd... there's almost a twisted naivety to the things he does. like he genuinely can't internalize why people think his actions are wrong. you could say that he "loves children" in the same way that a cat might prefer to hunt songbirds that it doesn't intend to eat, even while it is otherwise well fed. there is an essential use for the cartridges he makes, in the sense that he must use them if he wants to traverse the layers... but he doesn't _have_ to traverse the layers. it's not a need. to him, this is a form of play. and like a child burning ants on the sidewalk with a magnifying glass, he doesn't seem to understand what the harm is when he uses them, or why it matters. Riko, Reg, and Nanachi know that this makes him a monster... but they can't for the life of them explain it to Bondrewd, who just seems kind of intrigued as to why they'd think that. it's as though a piece of his brain has been carved out, or altered so heavily, that he no longer resembles a human in this way. or like the Iruburu villagers, who have since lost all concept of empathy for someone's pain, in favor of measuring tit-for-tat fairness via their value based bartering system... there's a certain innocence to their lack of understanding when the children see something and feel horror. why horror? if Maa is getting ripped apart, it's not horror. their value system says that this is fair. and they've since lost sensitivity to the empathetic discomfort of watching another creature being skinned in front of them. this is no longer horror. not if they can see there's justification to it. it's not hard to see the villagers operating as part of Irumyuui's body. a disruption to the body's system, such as unfair trade, will be attacked by the immune system indiscriminately. those attempting to cheat the system will be carved out. and the harmony created by their compliance becomes the system itself. extensions of the way the body is supposed to work. and when you pull the focus out, Irumyuui was transformed into a creature of the abyss, by the abyss. the things within her body are unaffected by the curse of the abyss, in the same way that the heart, lungs, and blood, are not punished for moving inside of a body at rest. why would the curse punish that? this is the stuff that survives in the abyss. you can only thrive down there if you let the abyss enter you, and transform you into an organism that is specialized for survival there. it strips away your human standards, and fills you up with something else. something base, and primal, and less thinking than even the most innocent people who entered to begin with. eventually, there is no distinction between the individual, and the abyss... you're part of its body now.

[@anrandomthing7110]

This is the best comment I've ever read this month, good job!

[@IDKLOL-qj7sl]

@@anrandomthing7110 thank you! especially because it turned out so long... I appreciate that you took the time. ^_^

[@managodess]

I remember a good friend recommended the anime to me and we watched the first season together, but he also prefaced it with: it'll get gorey and there's some stuff that is entirely too weirdly focused on the protagonist being naked in some way. And you're right, there's so much good story and so many good themes, the worldbuilding is fascinating. But I couldn't continue watching after the first season because, as much as part of me wanted to know how the story continued, I wasn't willing to do so if it meant having to deal with the author's weird fetishes. I've checked in on plot summaries occasionally to see how far along the story went, but that's about it. Great video and a perfect summary of so many aspects of Made in Abyss

[@beedoesthings8037]

This feels like one of those things that you need someone to write up a detailed fanfic about that cuts out all the gross, deplorable shit from the author’s influence, like those rewrites of Harry Potter where Rita Skeeter doesn’t exist and Hermione is actually taken seriously when she tries to explain to people why slavery is bad. Maybe you can find something like that for this.

[@mashuchan7906]

One of the things i find scary is that in nanachi explaining about the curse of the abyss is that all the creatures living their can see it and because of it they can technically see or predict their preys movement

[@Raiethstar]

30:57 I believe Bondrewd DOES love the children. The cartridges and especially Prushka wouldn’t work without that bond. After all, lab mice are cute, entertaining and extremely lovable. But you still cut them open at the end to see if the experiment worked. You’ll feel a little bad, and you’ll miss them. But it’s for the greater good. Bondrewd is just that taken to its logical horrible extreme. He only used foreign orphans who volunteered. Those who were most open, malleable and not serving society in any other way. He didn’t even technically lie about what he was doing. I think it makes him even more terrifying. He is the pinnacle of ‘the ends justify the means’. Everything he does and invents is for the making the abyss safer to delve for everyone. Food, medicine, the knowledge of exactly how the curse works.

[@gwencere9383]

Made in Abyss is one of my favourite stories that I can never relax and enjoy because I never know when I'll get a creepy scene shoved at me 🤕 I'm glad you made this video, I've been looking forward to it ever since you mentioned it was in the works

[@dudep504]

Criticism : Despite how weird it sounds, bondrewd, as far as we can tell, DOES love children, and every single children he has exprerimented on. Its very twisted, yes and any sane person would not see it as "love", but in that very twisten sense, bondrewd does "love" the children. Thats literally the only way his experiments in harnessing what he calls the "blessing of the abyss" could have worked. The first example of this "blessing" we see is nanachi, she got turned into a narehate but still retains her personality, and this is explained to us as a result of the love between nanachi and mitty. Similiarly, when bondrewd gains the blessing in his bossfight, it is only possible due to the love between prushka and bondrewd. Ofc, i said "as far as we can tell" because this explanation of how the blessing works might be wrong. But if the explanation is indeed correct, it must mean that bondrewd does "love" the children he works on, albeit its a very twisted form of love.

[@HyenasandGin]

One of the best in-depth analysis of Made in Abyss I’ve seen, I loved your talk on the symbolisms of Dante’s Inferno and the themes of motherhood. A small detail in regards to the “loss of innocence” theme is that Riko is constantly under going physical changes the deeper she goes. Her arm injury, the scar on her face and now her short hair. It’s a series with such wonderful nuance despite me hoping once Tsukushi finishes the series, his house is raided. Love Made in Abyss. Will never watch it with my partner in the house

[@lunchmeat674]

Wow this video came out just as I was considering rewatching the anime lol. It's really refreshing to see a video about Made in Abyss that meaningfully analyses the show and *also* rightfully lambasts Tsukushi for being a massive hypocrite for how he portrays loss of innocence compared to the l*licon junk. It's crazy how easy it'd be to just... not include that vile stuff and have the series be way better for it. Either way, great video!

[@cheerfulsatanist]

Tsukushi actually stated several times that it's based on Buddhist hell not any type of judeo-christian Hell specifically. So it's not based on Dante's inferno at least not symbolically or in terms of the mythos. In fact if anyone wants to Google it you'll find that a lot of the not quite matching up or farther fetched ideas that she's connecting almost match up perfectly with information regarding the Buddhist interpretation of Hell....

[@Amber_Scarlet]

I had a theory that the Abyss was, rather than being a god itself, was the "absence of a god in the form of something Eldritch." Basically, the Abyss itself was the corpse of a long dead god, that had festered into something else, equally as powerful, but much more, let's say, malicious. By going down into the abyss, you are subjecting yourself to a presence that borders on Devine, and that presence is like a pressure. Leaving that presence subjects you to more or less the same consequences as the bends, just on a much more severe scale. As for the "blessing", I guessed that it was a result of pure, distilled faith. Assuming that the Abyss was the festering corpse of a dying god, it would theoretically be able to grant prayers and perform miracles.and we see those miracles manifest in the form of the relics. So then, when two consciousness, two "worshipers" are subjected to the withdrawal symptoms of the abyss, one of them is able to pray for the other's safety, and the abyss answers those prayers by giving the blessed a form that can endure the temporary withdrawal. This is an old theory, and there are some holes in the logic, but it's one I still tend to stick to when trying to theorize about the abyss and it's inhabitants.

[@juzo..]

Honestly was in complete awe this entire first hour of the video then complete dread and shock near the ending. Thank you for talking about this series, this was an amazing video!

[@jacobbesler3214]

I'd only heard of Made in Abyss before watching, and this video made me curious enough to check it out. After binging the manga and the first season of the anime, I have a couple thoughts. First and foremost, thank you for identifying Bondrewd as the walking atrocity he is; how so many people find him in any way redeemable is baffling. His warped, exploitative understanding of love makes him MORE evil, not less. Second, the underage nudity is somewhat paradoxical. IMO it's definitely unnecessary, yet removing it does virtually nothing to make the series feel less gross. I personally found the scenes depicting abuse, injury, mutilation, and mutation every bit as disturbing, and many of them are fundamentally integral to the plot. Lastly, I propose an alternative interpretation of the series main theme. Rather than simply losing innocence, it's about the struggle for innocence to survive in the face of defilement. Though Riko gains experience in dealing with human and Abyssal horrors alike, her personality is unchanged. She never loses faith in her simple goal and her childish optimism is only ever temporarily diminished. Grief and vengeance drive Nanashi and Faputa respectively, and as the story progresses they relinquish these more "mature" emotions to reclaim some measure of the innocence that was stripped from them. There is powerful narrative tension in juxtaposing the pure and the profane. Despite making it unfortunately obvious that he enjoys eroticizing this tension, the author has absolutely mastered how to utilize it for horror and pathos as well. Anyway, that's just my take on things. Though I agree this isn't a series I'll be recommending to anyone I know, I'm glad your video introduced me to it. Thanks

[@hydehg1441]

"gothic victorian panini press" is a great sentence lol.

[@bobbymacpherson3079]

Great vid! I've found online that a lot of people seem to think that Bondrewd operates on some alien set of morality and that while he commits horrifying acts, his remembering his victims names and dreams is some indication that he cared for and respected them and saw his experimentation on them as noble stepping stones towards a glorious future. However, as you astutely pointed out, in the world of MiA, bonds and ambitions are commodities, they're currency. Bondrewd isn't some complicated byronic Ubermensch with an alien moral code; he's pathetically human, a selfish exploitative capitalist pigman who grooms his workers with charm and superficial kindness, all the while extracting everything in them he sees as value for his own gain. Also, weeaboo's will try to bust over literally anything.

[@MertKayKay]

Yeeees!! I love this comment.

[@Bi0mega]

The fact that we never got a second Dante's Inferno game is an endless source of disappointment for me. The gameplay was so-so, they were absolutely phoning it in in the last third of the game, with all the endless 'kill X waves of enemies to progress' rooms they referred to as 'challenges', but visually? One of the best games on the system. FWIW, I imagine the big reveal will be that the Abyss requires someone to actually kickstart the extinction event - it requires someone 'pure' - most likely a young girl, possibly based on the artist's, shall we say 'preferences' - to get down to the final level and trigger it, causing the Abyss to grow. We'll find out that it's the latest link in the chain, revealing that the title was actually 'Maiden Abyss' the whole time and people will describe it as the absolute worst finale since Bleach and Naruto combined.

[@n3zumiii]

TYSM FOR THE CLEANED UP REDDIT VERSION thank god, I wanna rec this manga/anime for so many ppl bc it can be genuinely beautiful but equally disturbing in a good way, but the borderline cheese pizza always makes it impossible, like we don't need to see naked kids tf (wouldn't mind a pin-up image of Ozen or something though (just kidding...or am I))

[@TempestRequiem0]

Every time I think of Made in Abyss I feel a great sense of loss. It could have been perfect, but its irrevocably marred by such clear sexual deviancy. It is art I cannot share, and even feel shame in liking because I feel like I'm supporting someone who clearly wants to hurt children.

[@noheterotho179]

My god, I'd forgotten how much I love your reviews! An hour is positively a blessing. I've never found another youtuber who blends comedy and thoughtful analysis so well. Your ability to delve into the portrayal of loss of innocence and visual/thematic metaphor interspersed with "No one dressed like a gothic victorian panini press has any place on the good guys list" and "I'll be at the burger king up the block" absolutely floors me. Thank you for providing a way to interact with this manga without having to suffer through loli-hell

[@MertKayKay]

Omg this is the sweetest comment ever, thank you so much :'( it's a pleasure

[@scroptels]

btw, having just watched the golden city arc i think it also showed how faputa was able to lose her innocense by learning to decide her value for herself rather than be dependent on her mother's wish, that's basically what vueko tells her with how irumyuui was so clingy but faputa wasn''t, basically faputa learned to become independent by overcoming the trauma passed on to her by the adults in her life, i think that's very nice.

[@lenlordofknowledge]

Man, this was like a kick in the teeth, but like an oddly bittersweet one? Made in Abyss was my hyperfixation between 2019-2023, and it’s the reason my KZbin name here and my main OC I use on other sites was created. It’s my favorite anime and manga, and it’s inspired me to delve so much deeper into worldbuilding and immersing myself in the art of worldbuilding. I hate to say that it’s a main inspiration for me, but it‘s nice to see such a deeply analytical video on the series when it’s sadly understandable why that’s uncommon on here. I never considered the idea of Riko being Lyza’s Haku and that idea’s fascinating, though the comments on Ozen are a bit more confusing? If anything I’ve always associated her title of the Immovable with ox symbolism. Oxen sounds like Ozen, her whistle is shaped like a bull’s head, she’s a raw physical force like how an ox is, not that complicated, but then again the whole series is up for deep analyzation, and it’s fun to take in any new ideas that are posed. Definitely something for me to chew on

[@lucymarples3154]

Oooh I recognise that name!! I loved your Last Dive fic for reasons that seem very relevant here - it gave me so much of what's good about MiA without the problematic stuff! For many reasons I'm sure noone wants to know, I identify so much with Len. Now I'm curious though since you said 2019-2023, what's your latest hyperfixation? I'm neurodivergent and it feels like mine always find me, good or bad and I've had my share of both (blessings and curses if you will) and so the feelings the delvers seem to have towards the abyss are very relatable to me!

[@lenlordofknowledge]

@@lucymarples3154 Oh my god I never thought I’d be recognized in the wild ;0; legit this is an honor to me thank you! Len’s definitely been a special character to me even outside of MLD so reading what you said about identifying with him makes me so happy! ^^ As for my latest hyperfixation, it’s Baldur’s Gate 3, where I’m playing Len as an oath of devotion paladin, which I think fits him pretty well lol

[@DaydreamOrca]

I think in terms of the abyss being an allegory for Dante's Inferno, I wouldn't exactly compare it to a covers album. It's more of a mix tape. Filled with samples, snippets and echoes of other parts. When you remix an album you often change the pitch to alter and change the meaning. Layer Six is Greed but it uses the beat from Lust And Wrath. Layer 5 is Treason with it's frozen waste but it plays same tune as Heresy.

[@MertKayKay]

Love this analogy! Yes!!

[@rajaryan-fe1oy]

I agree with the title with every cell in my body

[@allisonbayley3224]

Thought the anime was beautiful and really atmospheric. Then I had kids, and the horror that I already felt in parts is now beyond what I can take. I mean, it was already riding the edge, but woof.

[@halaska4278]

Love the analysis, which you had gone even more in depth for some areas. I agree with you how it is really weird and sucks how the auther wanna draw kids in a sexual way. I just love the other parts of the story, how it feels like a descend down depression, how the deeper you go the more hopeless it becomes. How reality get more and more distorted, how it shows off trauma, and all the horrible things that the characters go through. How each and every characters develop. How Nanachi and Faputa was created and shaped by the abyss. How Faputa inherited Irumius wish to be a mother. I know you already had a very long script but in a way i do feel like you went a bit light on the world of this show and the characters.

[@ktktktktktktkt]

I was actually hesitant to start made in abyss because I thought based on the art style, it was meant for kids. About a year ago a friend recommended it to me so I gave it a shot and loved it.

[@ThatGreenMach1ne]

After learning more about Made in Abyss i felt too uncomfortable to continue. Certain sections of season 1 made me feel disturbed but not because they were well written, but because I was asking myself "am I going to catch a case?"

[@dizbrony3906]

Oof. I felt your opening preamble really hard. Like Made in Abyss, my favourite manga of all time has similarly problematic aesthetics but the story is more than worth reading deeper.

[@brimstonesulfur5013]

TeraFormars?

[@casseroledragon3277]

In reference to the Wiki comment that said Bondrewd truly loves the children he experiments on, while I get your reaction to that completely and would agree with you outside of the context of MiB, within this story that comment was absolutely correct. Consider your own words for evidence. For a person to become "blessed" the way Nanachi was, and the way Bondrewd was during his fight with Reg, a person must sacrifice their Haku. It's not themselves being the Haku that is important, it is their love for their Haku and the sacrificing of that which bestows the blessing. With that being the case, Bondrewd couldn't have been Blessed in his fight with Reg if he was not sacrificing his own Haku. Therfore, he MUST genuinely love the children and consider each of them part of his Haku, even if his idea of Love is twisted and sadistic. Thats the only logical way to explain him being Blessed.

[@ProbsNotABot]

It made way too much sense learning that the mangaka is a lolicon... I'm a fan of made in abyss and for its art style, music, atmosphere, and story. I'm on the ace spectrum, so some of the scenes were really uncomfortable for me, but I never saw them as inherently sexual. I just thought it was meant to make you feel uncomfortable at these kids put in awful situations or a part of japanese culture that I didn't understand - like mixed bathing and that weird finger butt prank. But, no, you're totally right that this is some fetish type thing from the mangaka. This realization has really ruined a big part of Made In Abyss as I can't help but see through that lens of sexualizing kids now...

[@duck2059]

gonna be dead honest, just the images and descriptions you provided for the body horror and gore in this manga were more than enough to put me off even without the added context of excessive sexualised depictions of naked children. and im not necessarily passing moral judgement for those parts of the story - i just have my limits - but with that in mind i think based on your description this series has QUITE sufficient depictions of loss of innocence, and that it will not in fact fail its message for lack of weird loli shit

[@SamuraiMujuru]

My familiarity with "tourist" used negatively in a fandom stems most from Warhammer 40,000, where chuds are currently declaring decades long fans and current/former Games Workshop employees to be "tourists" because GW had the audacity to kinda messily introduce womz to a faction.

[@SamuraiMujuru]

This vid actually piqued my interest enough that I started reading Made in Abyss. Hooboy, you weren't kidding about how sketchy the art gets seemingly at random.

[@lone_digger_2357]

Wazukyan´s dying speech hits different when you remember he is a prophet and can see the future.

[@kristophermichaud4467]

I just feel like the Abyss itself is a symbol of obsession, each layer forcing more sacrifice. Sacrifice that, of course, get exploited by those who use others that they keep naive.

[@dura_14]

I absolutely LOVE made in abyss! it's such a damn good story, and I'm just so drawn to the lore and worldbuilding of the abyss. I saw the thumbnail and IMMEDIATELY knew it was gonna be about made in abyss, haha. it has its flaws and problems (you know which ones), but I still love this series. it's horrifying at times, yes, but it can also be beautiful.

[@haroldgloom8637]

I am so glad my sister put down watching this with me else I had no one to talk about this. Made in Abyss is AMAZING but I never hated to recommend something like this ever before, and if only woth the biggest trigger warnings (And the Lollicon parts could really be cut out, they hinder the cruel and interesting story with weird pedo horniness)

[@lone_digger_2357]

Loved the video! *Made in Abyss* is definitely something special. I hope that in the future, they release a version of the manga without some of the more questionable content added by the author. At least in the anime, they censored some of those scenes, and I really hope they continue to do so, especially with the bath scene involving Sherumi and Menae. Speaking of the anime, I noticed you didn’t mention the incredible soundtrack! The music by Kevin Penkin is so evocative and enhances the emotional depth of the show. His compositions really capture the essence of the world and the journey. The soundtrack adds a whole new layer of immersion that complements the story perfectly. Looking forward to more of your insightful analyses!

[@SunnyAznable]

Honestly this analysis is spot on and like the show amazed me, filled me with guilt and small rages. It attacked me in a cathartic way. Unlike the show I can recommend it though- I haven’t felt so in tune with a video in forever. My thanks for your joy and suffering and for your time taken in expressing it. Edit: both the use of ‘glory hole’ and ‘meaty hole’ got an out loud “Excuse me madam?” From me. Well played.

[@nocturnalcove9736]

I never in a million years thought you'd cover Made in Abyss, but I'm not complaining.

[@exuviast]

I think you've summed up a similar issue I ran into with the Higurashi series. It's very aggravating to find a series with some genuinely fantastic ideas, only to realize that you can't engage with a good portion of it or recommend it to anyone else because of some frankly jarring authorial decisions.

[@exuviast]

Also unrelated/belated but FRANKEN FRAN ♥ excellent horror series

[@binkiebrew]

Yeah. At least it's appears less in ch 1 and 2 compared to 3 where I legit had to take a 7 month break because of how gross that team manager guy was. Imagine my horror when I found out he was a doctor.

[@lexa2310]

I cant watch Anime with anyone because of that. There are just half-naked school kids, boobs and butt shots etc. seemingly everywhere. 😑 Im slowly starting to given up on the medium honestly.

[@icravedeath.1200]

Is any of it featured in the anime

[@icravedeath.1200]

​@@binkiebrewwhat one is that one im

[@CourierSixGaming]

Something I've noticed every time I've watched this (I think I'm on 5,) the cartridges got even more horrifying for me. He cuts away every part of the child that he doesn't need and shoves it in there, but when they take the Curse of the Abyss, the thing that rolls out is the immortal body what's left of that child has become. So, they become furry, little rat looking things that just suffer for eternity.

[@rainbownotation]

I can't believe how long I've been waiting for someone to critically investigate this series without dancing around or outright denying/dismissing the effects of it's author's preferences towards children has had on the story. Will definitely be watching this video more than once.

[@MertKayKay]

Thanks Rainbow!

[@warmtoastsarethebest8856]

Ah just watching the video the term 'tourist' did not stand out to me at all, possibly because I am a warhammer 40k fan (I know. I wish I could leave too), where it's used, like the definition said, to mean people who join just to police the content/change it. In reality however, most people using the term are just mad about warhammer becoming more inclusive - they cannot fathom that a queer person, someone disabled, or a WOMAN (how preposterous!) would be a fan, so the only way they can rationalize those people advocating for more representation/less shit content is that they are posers who joined just to push their political causes. This is, perhaps unsurprisingly, often wrong, and the people using the term often have a poor grasp of the hobby itself (though not always). Most recently, a female custodes character was revealed - something significant, because up until that point they had all just been men, despite fans advocating for a fem custodes/space marine. So now there are thousands of angry blokes crying about retcons and 'muh elite group of warriors RUINED by even the slightest hint of estrogen", all the while ignoring the fact that in the original warhammer 40k the Custodes wore studded leather armor and were rather kooky lmao.

[@atoucangirl]

the second half of this comment just makes me hear "FUCKING PRONOUNS" in my head

[@warmtoastsarethebest8856]

@@atoucangirl those damn wokehammer liberals and their PRONOUNS!!! (meanwhile canon characters who use neopronouns. I love Mike Brooks haha)

[@h0ly208]

Ahh Made In Abyss. The anime my homie was so excited to watch with me for the first time. It was rough, but I look forward to exacting my revenge on the next unsuspecting soul I make my friend.

[@raspberrycyanide]

YEASSSSS MADE IN ABYSS VID!!!! VERY HAPPY TO SEE YOU TAKE THIS ON!!! I love this series from a plot and lore perspective but god damn so much of it just rub me the wrong way

[@coulterbaker4663]

I would counter that Bondrewd does genuinely love/care for the children he utilizes, as explained - the curse transference does not work unless both parties actually love/care for one another. Further, I do not think this in any-way is meant to mitigate Bondrewd's abhorrent actions or humanize him, if any it actually makes them worse - he does genuinely care for the children he plans to sacrifice, and is capable of forming connections but he's simultaneously so completely amoral and singular in the pursuit of his goal that he has no issue sacrificing them. This is what makes him one of the vilest antagonists ever. Plenty of villains view human lives as disposable, and think nothing of those beneath them, but its made clear that Bondrewd is capable of forming these emotional bonds, and seeing each person he sacrifices as a unique individual with their own hopes, dreams and aspirations - he makes a point to do so... but in the end he still sacrifices them all without hesitation.

[@granv3000]

I have only watched the anime but if I remember correctly it’s explained that both individuals have to truly care and love each other for the “blessing” to happen, so it’s pretty clear that bondrwed does actually love the children in a way. The way I see it’s like when some people confuse obsession with love, it’s obviously two different things but they truly believe it’s actual love.

[@artistna]

Was planning on reading the manga, got halfway through the first volume and had to close the book. Too many instances of sexualized children. I do like the anime though it’s a very interesting world.

[@skybriel3503]

HOLY SHIT MERT!! I'm waiting a bit to watch the video in it's entirety while I'm working on stuff later today, but I just checked out the description and noticed all the PMD music you used!!!! The OSTs of PMD Explorers and Rescue team were what originally inspired me to play and write music when I was a kid. Lately, I've been going back and listening to those OSTs at least once a week while I'm at work to get a better understanding of music theory as I try to write a PMD inspired soundtrack of my own. I'm so delusional about those games and soundtracks that, after seeing some of those songs in the description of this vid, I honestly thought it might've been a weird glitch and that, somehow, one of the PMD music compilations I had been listening to this past week had managed to fuse with your video. I even combed through some of those compilations to see if any of them matched the order of songs you used just to make sure I wasn't having a complete mental break from reality before I left this comment. Anyway, sorry to leave this long ass comment that has nothing to do with the video itself but like, this is the crossover of the century for me lmao. Super stoked to actually watch this video but I just needed to express how unreasonably excited I am about your choice in background music for this one

[@budlitebeer240]

you don't understand bondrewd, he does not care about softening the blow, he only cares about results like a robot. that why the energy rations taste bad, because he doesn't care about making them taste good he only cares about getting from point A to point B as efficiently as possible.

[@cheerfulsatanist]

For anyone interested is partially correct there is direct relation to hell and its levels however Tsukushi stated previously that it was actually the levels of Buddhist hell that were the direct relation not judeo-christian

[@yuurmom7644]

i understand wanting to include graphic depictions of this sort to get your point across (eg berserk) but at what point does it just become exploitative yk. always an interesting conversation

[@njalsand133]

Having the main character naked and tied up adds nothing to the series indeed.

[@nightlight2499]

Amazing video. I really agree with your take and it’s refreshing to see a video essay about this series that doesn’t defend all aspects of the series I do want to add on that by saying that I did kinda do a dive on the author and here are some things I saw that no one has really talked about So Tsukushi has shown up on Artist Naoki Saito’s video where him and many other artists meet at Naoki Saito’s house for a drawing event for a video. The prompts for the drawings were apparently written by Naoki Saito’s daughter and Tsukushi took the prompt paper home because it was written by a child (I will edit all of this if I am wrong, take this with a grain of salt cuz the original convo was in Japanese) Secondly, In one of the MiA anthologies, there is a comic about Tsukushi written by a possible friend (?) about how he “gets excited when he sees children and holds them like Habo held Reg” which is rlly icky… Thirdly in an interview, Tsukushi showed a plastic torso he has in his room. It is young looking and dressed in a school uniform, which he proceeds to undress. It came with underwear and everything :/ He claims to use it as a reference for character anatomy, but it’s incredibly weird still Fourthly, in a JP artist event where they played gartic phone, Tsukushi drew multiple loli/shotas, even when it was irrelevant and unnecessary. It was played off as “haha that’s just his personality” which is :/ Fifthly, in his art books that contain some of his concept art (I believe called Doorbeetle reco? Report? Something like that) he drew weird depictions of children as well. I won’t go into detail but it was pedophilic asf Also in one section, he talked about Skyrim and how he instantly went to the orphanage where there were children. Sixthly, Tsukushi said that children should read made in abyss if their parents aren’t watching. As a person who read this series when I was 11 or 12, I can say I’m disgusted by the way he said that and I feel manipulated and violated emotionally in a way (violated is an incredibly strong word that but I don’t have a better one to describe how I feel) All of these reasons are why I don’t wanna support tsukushi at all monetarily and why while I do enjoy the series, I cannot side with the creator at all

[@Oranalysis]

I started collecting the manga when it began publishing in English and after 5 volumes I decided to stop reading and sell my volumes. The content of the story was bad enough to have on my shelf but the bonus illustrations at the end of each volume that often depicted inappropriate imagery made them impossible to keep. I dreaded someone browsing a volume and questioning me on it. Good riddance.

[@MertKayKay]

ORANALYSIS SIGHTING

[@LoopyAnh]

He does love children. Its just that the zoaholic has destroyed him greatly. If anything hes a bad end for someone like Riko. Where the obcession of the abyss comes before everything else. As he used himself for his own whistle. There is hints that something major is about to happen for the 2000 year event. That he needed to get it done earlier than later with prushka. Prushka did somewhat know what her dad did. Its very fucked but his humanity is the least of his thoughts when compared to the Abyss.

[@GhostRavenFIN]

AAAAAAH! I've been putting this show off for years, but now I need to finally start watching it so I can watch the new Mert video without getting spoiled.

[@Ancusohm]

Wow. This is a great video, and I enjoyed it a lot, but wow I don't think I have the stomach for the anime itself.

[@SinisterChris]

Having watch this, watched the anime, and then watched the video again, I think I would say you can recommend the show with the assumption that a person watches this first for perspective. You do a really good job of explaining the good without condoning the bad. I'm glad I found this channel, your video essays are always a treat

[@MertKayKay]

Thank you Chris

[@derpkipper]

Given the serious tone of the majority of this video, the very subtle and dry deadpan jokes absolutely sent me. "Non hostile mobs" 😂 Anyway back to finishing the video

[@inventor4279]

NO WAY NO WAY NO WAY, my favorite youtuber just made a video about my favorite anime, NO WAYYYYYYYY IM SO HAPPY

[@MertKayKay]

Hope you enjoy!

[@zerokaoningyo3509]

you discussing aristotle and aquinas is so wild because i am literally sitting an Alevel paper on their theology next month… watching this video is my revision yup yup

[@-chip-3651]

I think the term tourist is dumb especially from people trying to defend lolicon I enjoyed made in abyss but it had some very bad scenes that I disagree with and if the writing wasnt as good as it is to me I wouldve stopped. bottom key is if it looks like a child and you are attracted to it or find it "cute" thats weird.

[@SilverSaw988]

Great video. While I don’t agree with the everything, I think your thematic analysis was really awesome. I will repeat what some others have said though: Bondrewd did love the children in his own way. That’s the only way he could have become the hollow he did. He’s supposed to be a contradiction. He’s insane because he sacrificed his humanity. He’s morally questionable as all hell. But he’s not doing anything out of malice. Just for pure, scientific progress. That’s what makes him so fascinating. If he was just evil as you describe, that really would make a lot of his scenes make little sense. Such as his wish for the protagonists to make it to the bottom of the abyss after his defeat

[@whypothetical]

Yeah, my partner and I really enjoy this show 97% of the time and then random cuts to a tied up naked kid getting bdsm whipped by their teacher or characters pissing themselves in a "this is clearly meant to be a fetish" way really make us deeply uncomfortable and not in a good "we are uncomfortable because this is challenging us as art" way.

[@Mr.Silence.]

Excellent video, im still watching but so far your analysis is wonderful to hear. I think this franchise is absolutely incredible, but unfortunately i reached a point where it started to feel so blatantly pedophilic that i had to drop it. It was around the bit where the one little girl started molesting the other in the dark, and when they kept emphasizing that the rabbit girls fur smelled really good notably emphasizing her crotch smelling the best or something along those lines. I just couldn’t continue, but the art in terms of environment and monsters is so fantastic and the plot is refreshingly original and engaging. Its really a shame.

[@mittag983]

The "rabbit girl" isn't a girl. Nanachi is non-binary jfyi.

[@Mr.Silence.]

@@mittag983 oh, my bad. Thank you.

[@Dingobabee]

Honestly, when I was younger, I saw the nudity and such of the early chapters as rather innocent, it felt more like the idea of what a kid would think the worst punishment would be, an exaggeration But as I've gotten older it's become less and less comfortable to even think about those moments. I agree wholeheartedly that the manga doesn't need any of it and that it's only a detriment to an otherwise grand adventure with one of the most fascinating concepts I've seen Also, severely grossed out by the twins trying to seduce Reg That's crossing the line of deniability to me

[@boozados]

Finally. Fresh Made in Abyss content to let play in the background

[@jaydedepato6995]

I always found the manga so interesting, but as I got older I realised how gross some of the loli stuff was

[@imperialscout5566]

Ive met a few people who know of made in abyss. Its already hard to find people who watch anime out in the wild but every single one ive met who knew of the anime liked it. Ive even watched it with a guy and a girl friend, the guyfrined sorta new to anime himself and likes my suggesitons and the lady probably just watched it with me because we were dating. Niether of them made mention of the sus shit. The guy was super open and upfront about everything , hed often call riko a dumbass, reiterating that he didn't like her. However no mention of sus shit like getting strung up naked, and My girlfriend at the time really enjoyed the aesthetic and cute characters. Whenever wed get to the sus parts shed be more upset with in story elements( bondrewd or the weird alleyway narahate in the village). Nothing like 'Man this author is a lil weird' from neither of them.. As for people not IRL I use made in abyss character names a lot for games I play so every now and then ill get recognized and every time people say its one of their favorite Manga. Generally Akihito himself doesn't seem to even be a thought, people are so immersed in the story and honestly. i get it, it is what it is.

[@gwell66v2AnimeReviews]

Just reviewed the mitty scene as one of the best moments in anime history. 6:06 "Manga/anime...deliver horror just as well as any medium" Or outright despair, really any emotion. Manga/anime has a flair for the dramatic on a level that I think of as kind of broadway-esque. Instead of a dramatic monologue delivered at the edge of a stage, maybe you get a dramatic monologue where a character throws their hand out wide and spills their goals, dreams and traumas in one feel swoop. Every once in awhile you get something where the delivery of drama is a bit more subdued and real. I think watching Nanachi kind of shamble around the hut, reading stories at night to Mitty, quietly fishing while agreeing to Reg's terms, it very, very much reflects what most of us go through in the waning days and hours of a loved ones life. To have them line all the stuffed animals, too? The dignity of that, the clear love that went into that from Nanachi, knowing what was coming. That was it, my wife starting hysterically sobbing, my eyes tripped and fell into a barrel of cut onions and our pets all got ample hugs and affection almost immediately. But to let the drama unfold so quietly, it was uncomfortably real and human. Loved your review of the show and seeing everyone acknowledge the, uh...more immoral depictions in the manga that, like many, really turned me off of it and kept me from recommending it to many.

[@bagredecartola1289]

this anime is such a love hate relationship to me, the anime could just not have this creepy shit and it would be up there with berserk and girls last tour in my favorites

[@TheTarturo]

Yay! Welcome back Mert, hope the holiday was relaxing! I have final exams tomorrow, so I'll save this for after as a little treat.^^ Thanks!

[@doodlemunchkin2222]

WARNING: TED TALK AHEAD! I think a lot of us fans say what we do about Bondrewd because he’s proven quite a bit in his actions and words to the main cast to be pretty devoid of malice, deceit, or wrath-even when they’re literally harming him or trying to kill him-he simply deals with it or praises them, and at the end, was glad to see them succeed, despite the fact they destroyed half of his base and a body of his. In fact, his warped love for Nanachi is shown when she jumps on Reg who’s charging up that devastating shot and instead of turn tail to save himself, Bondrewd stays out of concern for Nanachi’s safety as he warns her of the danger of staying. If he was faking his love for her at any point, now would be the moment you’d think he would’ve dropped it to save his own skin. I think from using the Zoholic for so long is a big point of that. We’re told that it comes with a cost, and using it so many times, spreading his consciousness across different bodies, you tend to lose yourself mentally. So Bondrewd at this point of the story is safe to say isn’t all in his right mind to be considered just a mustache twirling selfish villain. To him, he genuinely thinks he IS loving. And because of that twisted sense of love, he’s able to still obtain the blessing from the abyss by the end. The only curtain of lies he puts up are ones really placed by the audience themselves when we think someone so polite and well-spoken and caring to Pruska beforehand couldn’t possibly do what he’s done, because it’s too confusing to us and disturbing to consider otherwise, but to him and his twisted logic and far-gone mind, that’s simply also an act of love. From Bondrewd’s point of view, he thinks nothing is worth holding back when it comes to scientific advancement for humanity. If he can handle the pain of an experiment and feel fullfilled and happy, so can anyone else in his logic. He quite literally sacrificed himself to get his white whistle, just so he can advance. It’s not that he’s selfish and only willing to sacrifice others to get what he wants, he’s proven he’s quite literally fine sacrificing himself to get closer to his goals for humanity too. Any experiments he does on others he hasn’t already likely done to himself before with the help of the Zoholic, so he just assumes everyone has the same viewpoint as he does when it comes to having a pidgeonholed mindset to advancing humanity. If he could continue to use the Zoholic to cheat the system to advance his goal by sacrificing himself for the cartriges, he likely would’ve, but his consciousness by that point is so spread out among the Umbra hands that using one likely wouldn’t register anymore as a full “person” like his original body was when he sacrificed it for the whistle, so he had to get “helpers” in the kids he recruited. He thinks he’s doing those kids a service and giving them something noble to do by joining him in his experiments and be temporarily loved in their shortened life instead of rotting alone in an orphanage with no grand purpose in their lives. In a world where Ozen claims many who are obsessed with the abyss claim it to be their god, Bondrewd seems to be the pinnacle of that thinking so far, to a deranged point. In that vain, if we can compare his disturbing mindset to that of religious zealots in our real world. In fact, his disgusting actions seem comparable to things like Aztec priest performing sacrifices of girls to their gods. The children aren’t looked down upon who are sacrificed, or even tricked, they’re praised, honored, taken well-care of beforehand, and seen as chosen by the gods to serve a grander purpose in the afterlife by being sacrificed. For, in their minds, the betterment of their society in one way or another. So they feel grateful to them for being “willing” participants. Except knowing Bondrewd sacrificed himself for an advancement towards the Abyss-just adds the extra zesty fact that THIS one Aztec priest had first ripped his own heart out as a sacrifice to the gods, and now living on as a zombie of what he once was, believes others are just as willing and should feel just as blessed to follow suit in his goal to draw closer to the gods... I don’t think anyone SERIOUSLY defends Bondrewd as a “good person”-at least they shouldn’t-but moreso a morally grey villain than an outright deceitful, evil one filled with hatred or joy in causing others pain, and thus feel the need to praise him for being such a complex, layered, and morally bizzare character. He is not a good or redeemable person, he is instead, someone who was so warped by his time in the abyss and the sacrifices he was willing to make to stay down there and continue towards his goal for mankind that he lost/sacrificed his own humanity along the way and is now a deranged, one-track mind consciousness left over of whatever he once was. He’s a unique type of evil, and it makes him more despicable, but also more fascinating. That’s why I think he works as an interesting parallel of what COULD happen to Riko with her tunnel-visioned goal and near unwavering drive to get to the bottom of the abyss no matter the cost. The Abyss has always sort of been like a god to her too, and as we found out with her origin, quite literally is with the way it gave her life.