The BEST DPS SPECS for Castle Nathria!! // World of Warcraft: Shadowlands

In this video I go through the rankings of the best DPS specs in week 1 of Castle Nathria, plus talk about how Blizzard's planned class tuning isn't enough to save some specs!
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[@enzy6434]

I think 80th to 90th percentile is a lot more realistic to look at. When you’re looking at 99th percentile you’re looking at the absolute pad-lords, and specs such as balance that have a ton of ability to pad with unimportant damage are going to stand out a lot at the very very top. If you lower it to even the 80-90% bracket balance begins to stand out considerably less and is below Unholy and roughly aligned with feral, shadow priest, close to affliction lock.

[@riotxcore6108]

^^^ THIS! ^^^ Looking at the 99th Percentile is such a small sample size and not realistic of your average WoW raider. These are the try-hard FOTM Mythic raiders that dont come to YT to see videos on this style of content. They simply test at dummies and re-run raids over and over again. They are also the type to have 2-3 max level characters of a single class so they can be ready to switch covenants faster when eventually nerfs or changes happen.

[@WoWDontu]

I took a chance as WW and so far this raid has been very good for me. I was totally surprised. I caught a lot of flack for playing WW but now I tell those people “how do you lose to a windwalker?”

[@juanrra1409]

I'm top dps in my guild as WW, it's soooo satisfying

[@NoobGamer-di1dw]

I started playing windwalker in PvP and I absolutely love it haven’t done much PvE yet with it.

[@BlackPokemon_]

I play fury warrior and worked really hard raid prepping. Makes sense why I felt like trash during raid lmao.

[@samurainads]

Same here with my havoc DH :((( Been trying to hard to up my DPS but I guess there is only so much we can do. Hope these buffs help you out!

[@minotaurito666]

Fr got into my first run with 185 il plus my 210 legendary and felt l ike sht

[@lenie11414]

i'm honestly thinking on alting a dk or a range just so i can kill sludgefist one day, that fight is awful for meeles,warrior prob be bench for life on that fight =(

[@maybecole]

@@lenie11414 I was playing Unholy, and Idc how good they are rn, it just feels weird to play. Frost feels like it hits hard, but it never translates except maybe in pvp. Really needs a rework.

[@lenie11414]

@@maybecole that's sad =(, i dont like too much DK UH anyways, i liked the idea of obliterate 2h frost but appearantly as you mention it doesnt translate, thats sad, arms has similar things, oyu feel you are smashing everything, but at the end , the dps isnt't there

[@Gniooo]

11:27 fun fact: arcane mages can use touch of magi on the add and hit the boss with the aoe for hundred of thousands on that fight, which counts in warcraft logs :)

[@benjaminafflerbach5089]

was gonna comment on that as well, you can definitely see some unique strat is going on when you look at the overall breakdown with those huge outliers on the high end.

[@yuletidenate]

Well wouldn't that mean that glacial fragments for frost would explode for a bunch too?

[@ashamancito4630]

Oh lol, I was wondering how arcane pulled ahead so much on a 2-3 target cleave fight

[@benwatson222]

@@yuletidenate they nerfed splitting ice pretty heavily

[@yuletidenate]

@@benwatson222 I know lol I play frost sadly 😬

[@diogonogueira8150]

Fury on The bottom just breaks my heart

[@hunterlong1820]

I figured that out during heroic dungeons being almost max ilvl pre raid and landing somewhere near the tank lol

[@maartenruyssen7470]

@@hunterlong1820 Noticed it during leveling already. They're way too heavy aoe on almost every ability due to how whirlwind works. Makes them hard to balance without making them broken in mythic + I think.

[@hunterlong1820]

@@maartenruyssen7470 yeah I was top DPS on every trash pack and bottom on the bosses. I switched to arms and it’s been doing extremely well in the raid. Boring spamming condemn half the fight but the damage is way better.

[@godlike69r]

Same I get 100/99 parses and still Basicly bottem 😂😂 I love it though and it’s so fun

[@godlike69r]

@@hunterlong1820 that’s not right I pre much never lose m+ doing min 4K but normally between 4.5-5k overall without my bis m+ lego overall dmg for whole dungeon

[@r1pp3dx]

As a ret pally, I do well in mythic+ and pvp(casual) but get beat pretty hard on the meters in raids.

[@vanguardreviewer4841]

Press F for fury!

[@igurkii4497]

Lol my execute/condemn is on the F key 😂

[@body_by_depuy]

As a Ret Pally, I'm basically a high school kid in the sack...12 seconds of furious action, and then nothing until my cds reset

[@lenie11414]

lol imagine playing venthyr warrior :P

[@tek512]

I love how they just couldn't leave a melee on top. Totally ignored boomkins, MM hunters, and spriests despite the fact that all three of them are overperforming as well.

[@EssenceOfTrance]

It's crazy. Now both raiding and M+ favors ranged, I am wondering why I am still on my sub rogue. And I am a rogue, the best melee for M+ except maybe for DK...

[@DocGamer99]

@@EssenceOfTrance sub rogue isn't the best. It's in the middle. Unholy is way better than sub. as of kzbin.info/www/bejne/mWm3ZKqOa66nfrc

[@alphanecha]

Its absolut stupid

[@plmPissekatt]

@@EssenceOfTrance Worst part is how they did rogues dirty in M+. I was expecting shroud to return to something like Legion levels of nice to bring, but it turns out you're scrounging for % even without one. [Edit] It might be good for timing the affix trigger on +10 keys tho... But I haven't heard anyone saying that's the case.[/edit]

[@EssenceOfTrance]

@@DocGamer99 Rogue still gets brought more because of the utility, that's why I said they're the best. We'll see how long that continues though, as UDK have a lot of utility too.

[@charlespaape2258]

The big thing with balance druid to is a ton of damage is also coming from a legendary synergizing with a covenant. So I hope they just focus on somehow balancing that without destroying the covenant for all the specs.

[@andreware2039]

You underestimate Blizzard.

[@Nizlopi12345]

Could you make a guide for the ember court?

[@yomommamonkey]

they did us warriors dirty in shadowlands

[@Aranyi123]

Facts

[@P4PKing]

Yeah, I dead ass just switched classes since Arms/Fury are trash.. Even if you want to tank you're still one of the worst specs as Prot is pretty trash in comparison with other classes.

[@incarnatedvoo5326]

@@P4PKing and yet there are peeps saying condemn is broken

[@anthonydallarosa8314]

Warrior DPS is pretty rough. Prot is fine with leggos but definitely not gonna make the meta this patch. I think once they unlock the 2nd legendary warriors are gonna see a MASSIVE boost. Just my opinion.

[@charlesrichard7715]

Cries in prot war

[@userphilman]

When will we see the new graphs after these buff/nerfs. Really interested to see where it all sits now.

[@Kitfox_]

“If you’re a frost mage, you’re probably feeling pretty bad.” Can confirm. Really went all in on it too. Nubkeks, how are catchup mechanics looking? Just would be behind on legos?

[@SawErKulbain]

not really, got a leggo on both char i leveled and geared, with soulash increase next week, you can and might get a leggo in a week.

[@foxxoboxxo1611]

I don't know how to make Survival really work which is a shame because I love the Melee-Range Playstyle more than any other dps class atm. I think it either needs another cooldown to help with ranged damage or Butchery or someother AoE baseline. It just doesn't get anywhere near the same amount of DPS Cooldowns that the other specs get which really brings it down imo.

[@ashamancito4630]

I woul really like an extra option in warcraft logs that allows you to sort specs, for example frost mages, after covenant taken to give you a more precise overview.

[@jonathonjollota8661]

This is a weird additional note, a lot of the heroic sire kills are lacking legendaries to allow for choice of nerds come. That could completely turn some of these specs on their heads.

[@sh1ni_]

hey nice video man, could you make one for m+ maybe?

[@markuslc1888]

after choosing my main during the end of beta, i never would ve thought frost mage would suck that much, and would ve even been further ignored by blizzard, after assa rogues, warris, affli wl got been buffed

[@EssenceOfTrance]

Yeah 5% damage is sooo much. Assassination does no damage and has a dull rotation now that azerite is gone.

[@markuslc1888]

@@EssenceOfTrance 5% more dmg is better than nothing

[@Auberry126]

I totally expected every if not most specs to get some balance changes this week. Including some legendaries. Im surprised.

[@alansmith4395]

Worth pointing out that Outlaw Rogue's best legendary, Celerity, drops in a dungeon so 99% ers will have it, whereas Sub drops from Denathrius, so they just got it at the end of the run. I'd check thta again next week just to measure evenly.

[@julianhischak7398]

Right. Does blizzard think casual players have time to wait in queue and run the same dungeons hundreds of times?

[@kluasvt828]

@@julianhischak7398 Legendaries have 100% drop in m+, just saying.

[@alansmith4395]

@@julianhischak7398 even it it did take that, the parse list is 99th percentile. So yea, those folks would have run it whatever number of times was required. Whereas you flat out have to kill Denathrius to have finality, so litteraly zero% of the sub rogues had it.

[@plusRpm]

To be fair, it really plays into this data whether it is easy to correctly gear your class, whether the available trinkets synergize with your class or not, how you scale with gear, how you scale with primary, blablabla. That‘s the issue with only 2 weeks of data being available. For example, i‘m a sub rogue and i have had the worst kind of loot luck so far, because the gear i need drops from sources that also drop a lot of other stuff for me that i don‘t need, therefore significantly reducing my chance for goog gear. So it really isn‘t that easy to judge, statistically speaking.

[@JReyesTbn46]

I picked Outlaw rogue from the start because I wanted to do well and not be afraid of getting nerfed. Hopefully it stays that way.

[@7thNoodle]

Small correction, 99th percentile doesn't mean you're looking at the top 1% of parses. instead it means that when it's averaging out the dps for each spec, it's taking into account 99% of parses, excluding 1% of the parses that showed the highest and lowest dps numbers. This is a technique for studying statistical numbers that helps to see a more "realistic" representation of your averages, since edge cases of insane luck or bad luck in a rotation can throw off the averages. Similarly, if you look at the 97th and 95th percentile, you're looking at a even more "averaged" average, excluding the highest and lowest 3% and 5% of samples respectively, which might be helpful for getting a more "down to earth" look into DPS numbers for Heroic for example, as the top 2-3% of parses might be min-maxing mythic raiders, only playing specific classes/spects/leggys/trinkets, which then would not really represent the damage scaling the average raider would experience. Thanks for the video! I really needed a better look into how just plain average my ret paladin is :P

[@gorrjarmo1]

Happy my Blood DK seems to be in a decent spot. Now just to get my internet turned back on so I can even play :'(

[@fizzlefox1829]

I would be interested to see Feral Druids boss damage on a fight like Sire Denathrious. I wouldn't be surprised if they have the best boss damage on that fight of any spec with Apex legendary because the adds that come out feed you soooo many free bites to funnel the boss. They very well might be one of the best melee specs for that fight because they also have uncapped AoE to handle the adds while funneling the boss

[@plmPissekatt]

Ability damage % won't always translate exactly to dps aggregate %, tho..? As far as I understand it, there are some weird mechanics in game stacking on top of eachother. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not a theorycrafter and I'm all for learning.

[@mikecoble2001]

Do they take scaling into consideration? Some specs scale with gear better than others. Still early for crazy changes

[@ic3t3ap3ach]

but blizz dont care the do 1 nerf for 2-3years in the beginning then a spec is good or bad the whole expansion 😂

[@mikecoble2001]

Sad but true

[@typezer1]

Sub rogues are a bit low now because a lot of them are waiting for tuning nerfs/buffs before committing to a legendary. Also, not everyone has cleared sire denathrius for one of the bis legendaries.

[@__-fi6xg]

Nkt even guaranteed drop as far as i know

[@phillakai321]

@@__-fi6xg Yes it is

[@Psikick4]

@@__-fi6xg only thing isn't confirmed is lfr 100% drop rate, but normal is 100% drop.

[@tasteoftacos]

people are gonna be competing to get into mythic raiding and im just trying to survive exams and then get into normal raiding afterwards haha

[@christiannelson3416]

you have your priorities correct. Don't sweat it

[@DeathAndTac0s]

I never raid past normal and if I do m+ dungeons I never go over 5 cuz im not hardcore I want to be able to enjoy my experience and not get a migraine from high end content

[@mikejakubik]

Warriors def need more love, most of my dmg as arms is borrowed via Condemn.

[@ShadowknightEX]

To be fair, that is partly because even before it becomes condemn, execute hits like a truck. But still, I always imagined the majority of damage coming from mortal strike for an arms warrior.

[@incarnatedvoo5326]

Nerf condemn they said

[@mikejakubik]

@@ShadowknightEX Yes, i would agree.

[@mikejakubik]

@@incarnatedvoo5326 Im fine with that as long as base class abilities are properly buffed.

[@Valkaneer]

Ya, this is just straight up BS. BFA half your damage was Deep Wounds now they say they've fixed that and we are going back to normal play... Ya, and now Condem a stupid covenant ability is dong more damage than anything else.

[@skullyte6903]

im a little suprised about arms warrior. i play arms and i got consistantly in the top 5 dps on almost all boss fights. how would it have looked if i instead had played a balance druid or unholy dk?

[@Ace....]

Sounds like ur guild is dogshit :)

[@skullyte6903]

@@Ace.... mabe so

[@sethaxd]

Nice video, very cool.

[@ulrikow6077]

bro the video has been up for 1 min xD

[@DesiredHeadshot]

So balance druids are getting padded dps numbers with aoe but should get nurfed?

[@ic3t3ap3ach]

sadly i hope blizz doesn’t make a mistake. the raid is a bit aeo heavy and we are finally useful 👌 but for how long

[@filanfyretracker]

you would think they would make frost a powerful spec considering their hero mage character from the lore(Jaina) is a frost mage. or at least I seem to see her use frost more than any other spell set.

[@IkeMTG]

I main a Sub rogue. I'm not having a great time in the raid right now because of the lack of single target fights. Even then, in PvP; I'm starting to see as more players get gear, it's harder for me to burst them down as I did in previous weeks. I think Sub might be in a good spot in PvP, to be honest, but I think once we get our hands on the Finality legendary, Sub will look more competitive in the Raid.

[@iztunkiztunk6855]

nice try

[@Knightmxre]

Now hopefully blizzard doesn't forget about windwalkers as the patch goes on and leaves them in the trenches.

[@drewelric118]

WW is one of the top performing specs.

[@skipmcilvaine]

After all the Frost Mage hype during beta, I switched to Frost as my main and worked extremely hard in Torghast and M+ to upgrade my frost-only legendary to rank 2, and stock up on frost-centric gear. Even switching back to Fire I can't do as much damage as Frost because I've geared so heavily into frost lego and gear. Grrrr!!! 😡😫 Impartially blame you, nubkeks! 😜

[@canuckasaurus]

Denathrius is just a miserable fight as a hard caster.

[@jessepopovich1177]

what is that website you use?

[@peterkarlsson9053]

What is the site you're using called?

[@kluasvt828]

Warcraftlogs

[@makarzorklin8265]

Remember Balance druid relies on casting to generate Astral Power, so their damage will drop in Mythic Nathria with the extra and more punishing mechanics. The top one percenters are standing in the bad to finish their casts. In Mythic they would die. They should still be tops in heavy AoE fights since they can cast while moving during starfall, but should come back down to the pack in the rest of the fights. And to the same extent melee tend to do better with moving. So unless there are much more move out of range mechanics, they should catch up a bit.

[@EssenceOfTrance]

There are many mechanics where melee is heavily punished. Hungering destroyer's consume for example.

[@makarzorklin8265]

@@EssenceOfTrance mechanics like that will already force melee out even on normal and heroic. I'm comparing heroic to mythic, the less punishing ranged mechanics wont be able to be ignored on Mythic. Melee side stepping more isn't a dps loss unless something forces them out. But a sidestep for ranged is a big dps loss mid cast. So unless there are more mythic "get out" mechanics, melee should be have similar uptime. Where ranged will have decreased uptime since they need to move more.

[@Gworan]

I switched to arms because I was doing at least 20% more damage compared to fury, however I really hate playing arms...

[@Saiku]

"You know I've played DK since wrath, let's go fury warrior this expansion!" Well fuck me

[@TheKabukimann]

The only nerf resto shamans need is to necrotic wave because it is the only choice if you want to do purple parses on heal.

[@jonathanabgrall6075]

Best place to be is in the middle of these charts tbh. Lore already said on stream that more changes were being talked, and he targetted specifically Hunter. MM is about to get nuked. Much to the joy of everyone who really couldn't handle that it did well for the first time in 3 years for a couple of months.

[@glenndiddy]

MM needs a small nerf along with the other top classes, but the real thing that needs to happen is the bottom 10-12 specs getting generous buffs. 5% damage isn't going to save fury, it's still on life support even if you gave it 15%

[@MintyCoffee]

You mean to the joy of people who don't appreciate that a spec with more range than any other spec in the game could 1 tap you from stealth. At least against sub rogue you have the chance to trinket and fight back. MM is broken to hell and easy as fuck, there's no defending it.

[@glenndiddy]

@@MintyCoffee Mate against sub rogues if they play correctly you just die. I'm an arms warrior main in arena's and this is what I do. I pick the CC flag for 50% reduction. I pick disarm for obvious reasons and I pick the one that makes execute a charge to catch up to them. I start in defensive stance and I place my banner as soon as the first sap goes out. The rogue cheap shots me, I use my human racial and instant stun the rogue. He breaks it and I fear him. After that I disarm the rogue and try to chase him down. The rogue vanishes and 1 shots me or my teammate within 0.1 seconds after using it anyway. I outplayed him but it doesn't matter since he can just keep trying to get the free 1 shot over and over

[@TacBlades]

Such a shame for frost mage, i just don't enjoy fire any more. Will continue with frost as the rotation is just so smooth

[@EdNeaton]

Will have to play fire personally but fully agreed, it's crushing to see frost completely garbage again. I tried desperately to make it work through heroic week, but I felt like a real burden by the time we killed sludgefist. I can't believe we're getting missed in this round of buffs after being nerfed so goddamn hard the week before launch, when we clearly didn't need it.

[@TacBlades]

@@EdNeaton am lucky we can play whatever we want and are never benched, because we put people before content. Also my dps is great on frost and just average with fire so will stick with frost for now.

[@EdNeaton]

@@TacBlades Unfortunately the prevailing view in my guild, that I share, is that playing a weak spec and holding back your guild is putting yourself before the rest of the guild. We want hall of fame, so we have to play a spec that's optimal or very close. I'd expect the same from any of the others, if their spec became clearly the weakest. The damage check on heroic sludgefist was tight enough. On early mythic kills, I wouldn't be surprised if you can't bring a frost mage because they simply don't do enough damage to beat the enrage. That's on blizzard, not on my guild who'd love for me to play what I want but can't justify it because there are going to be fights that are far more difficult - or actually impossible- if you bring a frost mage :(

[@TacBlades]

@@EdNeaton if you are in a guild where the boss kills are important and competitive then you have to do what is necessary to get the kill which is why everyone is there. But i dont enjoy that kind of game play, so i choose to be in a place where we have fun quite relaxed, as long as we have fun and kill all the heroic bosses before next raid is release then we are happy, the journey and the people are far more important to us than any boss kill or any gear.

[@filanfyretracker]

they should make Frost Chipper from Torghast into a mage conduit ability.

[@Straggler8]

Fury Warrior needs somewhere near 15-20% boost :( My alt hunter with similar gear does almost twice the damage

[@laurenzstratka4962]

It makes me happy to see havoc so far below.

[@glenndiddy]

Same, it's been overpowered since it came out in Legion and is extremely boring with about 3 buttons to press

[@SnapandBoomGaming]

Lol, a few hours after this post Sub rogue and the Kyrian cov are nerfed to oblivion. Destro got a 22% buff to chaos hunters warriors rogues all screwed with Kyrian NERF

[@Colaschnittchen]

Feral druide isnt bottom? What sorcerie is this?

[@kylemccall4612]

Sadly after crafting my Raid and M+ lego for Frost, I’m switching to Fire /sigh

[@robinenbernhard]

Same but then with dest lock and look like i move to demon lock with Necrolord

[@MoFroze]

finally ferals is love

[@olefolde4428]

Too bad there's no reason to bring Feral when you can get boomkin

[@MoFroze]

@@olefolde4428 maybe because u are to picky when I do mythic plus I top dps yes balance is better or whatever but that doesnt matter when people not picky and just wanna have fun unless u wanna go world first then good luck I am having fun just playing feral.

[@Peden88]

cries in frost mage

[@Trostlos3]

Whats the problem of a melee spec beeing at the top again?

[@glenndiddy]

No problem with that, but this other melee spec here called fury warrior would like to do more than 50% of the unholy DK's damage please. No one wants to raid with him anymore because the unholy DK counts for 2 warriors. That is the problem, not that they're doing well, it's that no one else is doing well. AKA buff warriros a lot, nerf unholy DK a little

[@christopherboye5498]

How do people get so good with demo lock? I'm always low tier dps while having good gear

[@fenrir2188]

Talents, gear, proper tyrant setup with demonic consumption. Legendary, good trinkets, flask, battle pot. Just a couple things that can easily net you a big dps gain as demo.

[@LargeLadCharles]

I’ve never understood why they can’t just buff or nerf by flat percentages on a weekly basis to keep everything balanced

[@bobbytsarnas279]

Thought his shirt looked familiar turns out I’m wearing the same thing

[@exosky3753]

ok thats funny xD

[@Michaelolivermussi]

Well I guess my one week of being top dps as balance Druid will likely not reoccur based on your analysis :c

[@ic3t3ap3ach]

if they nerf us we will be trash again the hole expansion 😂it was sad in bfa to be mid tier and as feral at the bottom

[@Michaelolivermussi]

@@ic3t3ap3ach yeah I think if they nerf us as hard as this suggests I’ll probably just quit. Doesn’t feel great pouring a month into a character just so Blizzard can rickroll me for not doing it right the first time.

[@gamergirlandweirdo9264]

@@Michaelolivermussi lol if i'm not overpowered i'll just quit

[@jjericho3529]

Feels bad man, when nerfs just got announced for Balance and more Unholy and Marksmanship.

[@boredgamer7841]

so feral and balance has a difference in score of "10" 10 what? what does the score represent. What do the numbers mean mason!

[@Nptz43]

Definitely think that for videos like this in the future you should use the top 90th percentile. 99 is usually based on cheese numbers and crazy outliers more than it is the "top players". An example being that the highest parsing Ret paladin might be the player that is getting the most crusader aura procs, not the player that can push the spec to it's max potential.

[@jonathonjollota8661]

Ya balance and marks have been a bit nutty even as a fire mage ranking top 10 consistently. I still have trouble beating a 80th percentile balance Druid.....

[@enzy6434]

How do you think I felt in Nyalotha parsing 95% but losing to a 60th percentile fire mage?

[@jonathonjollota8661]

@@enzy6434 didn’t play the worst patch of a bad expansion, wouldn’t know. But very true, bad “balance” does happen from time to time

[@LakyChef]

Druid Balance Starfall damage reduced 6%. Balance of all Things [Legendary] now causes Eclipse to increase your critical strike chance with Arcane or Nature spells by 40%, decreasing by 8% every 1 second (was 50% crit, decreasing by 10% per second). Hunter Marksmanship Aimed Shot damage reduced by 5%. Arcane Shot damage reduced by 5%.

[@MakoTrevelyan]

I dont even want sin rogue to be on top. I just want it to feel okay. Even middle of the pack. Not just an execute phase spec.

[@EssenceOfTrance]

Assassin is really rough. SnD does not enhance the spec in any way. I switched over to sub, which I had never played before and the rotation is so much more dynamic. I won't ever go back unless assassin is way better.

[@Mattlife97]

Can’t see havoc getting too far in shadowlands without a rework. Yes it’s damage isn’t as low as some of the other specs but the class just feels incomplete. Personally I feel like it should have a slightly weaker glaive tempest by default as currently that tier is never going to be competitive. I’m still amazed they’ve not made demonic baseline too.

[@PersianGamer36]

Arms warrior here... great news

[@Deviantloverable]

well its good but as an arms warr my self..i dont care abour pve :D

[@ARSdmnWF]

I'm struggling btwn fire mage or arcane mage for play both M+ and Raid XD XP

[@ftu2021]

It’s pretty to switch around since both specs uses NF. As for stats both prioritize mastery and haste

[@sycamore2656]

How is frost here?

[@ARSdmnWF]

@@sycamore2656 venthyr frost are really bad :/

[@sycamore2656]

@@ARSdmnWF im new to wow, and i picked mage. Can you tell me what is the best pve spec and covemant for m+ and raids

[@ARSdmnWF]

@@sycamore2656 now the best spec for M+ and Rid seems to be nightfade firemage

[@arnodorian2662]

whats the name of site he is using

[@alphanecha]

Warcraftlogs

[@Curexe]

arms should easily be under affliction warlock and above windwalker monk, makes no sense a fist hurts more than a sword but gg i guess

[@KuroiRyuuGaming]

99th percentile desoen't really mean much to most of the player base. I think 75th would make more sense, 90th is as high as I think you should realistically go to have a decent idea of how people perform on those classes. Unless we're just looking to see what the pinnacle of each class can do...but that won't necessarily trickle down, imho.

[@MegaSlacker123]

Cries in fury warrior ... do I just drop it ? I’ve got a paladin should I just go ret

[@FrostySnow1000]

for me, im sticking with my fury warrior cause im having the most fun with it. And I'm pretty sure fury will get better as we get more into the expansion since we scale a lot with better gear. Also keep in mind of the added responsibility that comes with being a paladin because you offer lots of utility and so think if you want more or less stuff to do in groups.

[@WarMonkeyPlays]

Are you in a bleeding edge guild doing Mythic progression? If not, I'd just stay as w/e class you enjoy the most.

[@WarMonkeyPlays]

Having said that, my main is a balance druid and my primary alt is a ret pally (it's been that way for many years now). So yeah, I'm having a ton of fun right now.

[@MegaSlacker123]

@@WarMonkeyPlays we are wanting to go in to mythic at some point yeah , though I think it will be later in the expansion Am keeping my warrior as like frostysnow says above its fun to play but will gear up my ret pally too .. just incase

[@LA_3000]

as uh dk I can say that the adjustment is really justified, even if I have to wonder why Druids and MM are not touched. but will hopefully come soon xD

[@ShadowknightEX]

I personally hope they remain untouched and other specs get brought UP to their level. Marksman was kind of a joke in most of BFA, and feral has been a joke for a long time. Feral deserves a time near the top. And Balance... I don’t know. Feels right.

[@ic3t3ap3ach]

we were a joke in bfa. bring up warriors, mages and other classes

[@maybecole]

Frost DK needs love and some reworks or maybe new abilities. We can't keep using Breath of Sindragosa for god knows long its been. That being said, we don't hit hard, but Obliteration 2H feels pretty nice. Just lacking across the board.

[@ShadowknightEX]

@@maybecole good lord do I agree. The worst thing, I don’t actually mind Syndragosa. It’s a thematically cool ability. But I really have been wanting something different for a while

[@maybecole]

@@ShadowknightEX I don't dislike breath either! It is cool! I wish it was implemented differently though. There is so much fun and thematically cool stuff Frost DK could get. Maybe, Empower Rune Weapon gave us an actual crazy Rune Weapon that had new abilities for a short time like how shamans and warriors become avatars etc. Maybe we stack slows on them until they become encased and we shatter it for big damage. Just thinking of other things.

[@hvdiv17]

Enhancement shsman is doing better the people ever gave it credit for. It's kind of odd blizzard isn't nerfing the top classes.

[@MaethorDerien]

It isn't as far off as this makes it look. 1% parses are a horrible way to look at things because of padding and the fact that 1% parses are RNG so classes with procs tend to do well on them. Druids in particular are able to pad a lot better than most. If you actually look at the bar graphs for overall the nerf to DK makes more sense. The bottom 6 are kinda way low but and the top 5 are a little high but it honestly isn't horrible. It will also change massively as many classes didn't get their BIS leggos yet.

[@CatTank]

Me thinking affliction felt quite mediocre in instances on normal. Switching to destruction. Was actually having fun now... But worst dps it seems :'( well haven't made any legendary yet so I can stil switch

[@Pitanga990]

You say poor fury and assasination.. What about the class who only got 1 dps spec which is also at the bottom?

[@MintyCoffee]

The difference is no one likes Demon Hunter xd

[@dannyvue6595]

Arms gonna be on top watch :)

[@MasqSC]

good one

[@Cravior]

I cannot believe uhdk is finally on top of single target raids. It's actually a miracle. They got rid of our true god tier aoe status with festermight's removal and the target cap. But you can't chain a god!

[@seanomac792]

Im an arm's warrior. Think ima reroll to ww monk 😂

[@KrazzyKelsie]

By the time you get your monk up arms will be buffed lol.

[@glenndiddy]

@@KrazzyKelsie nah arms won't be buffed, but WW monk will also be bad by the time you get it ready. So then you have 2 bad classes ready. Ah but I see Enhancement shaman has been allowed to be good for the first time since it came out, let's make my shama-... it's already nerfed well uhm Frost DK looks good.... finally got my DK ready to raid and it's now also shit. At the same time the classes you didn't level got buffed and shat on you, that's what I usually go through in expansions. Always trying to get a class that is decent and always choosing the 1 that gets nerfed

[@leoking938]

Out of curiosity, why are you looking at 99th percentile and why didn't you look a bit wider like 95 or 90 percentile?

[@joelwillis2043]

He doesn't understand variance.

[@halrandei947]

Mostly because the top percentile represents the actual limit of the spec in game, rather than in a sim. So you get the best idea of what a class is capable of whilst being played by an actual player in a raid scenario as opposed to a computer. Obviously those hitting those percentiles are making few to no mistakes in rotation or mechanics and probably don't have any assigned jobs either but you get the idea.

[@kluasvt828]

@@joelwillis2043 Nothing to do with that, lol. Look at Liz Watty's comment.

[@donaldswenson7951]

Should make another chart for people who arent the very best of their class. Most will never make it to the top 1 percentile so how does this help average players.

[@kluasvt828]

@@donaldswenson7951 This helps people with understanding how good their class can do giving they learn how to play it at the peak level. This can however be missleading and make people feel their class is useless, which is not the case. Every case is indeed playable unless you are going for World first. If you are casual player or even slow mythic raider, do what you like.

[@jahuique1]

Even with a nerf you can’t stop the wheelchair paladins, lovin it in pvp

[@Malda123]

honestly BM hunter logs are a bit scewed, as most of good players play MM, im raiding as BM and doing fine, similar to MM

[@gravesvintage]

Totally agree

[@kaiquesilva535]

Yep... same for m+. But I’m a casual... so I’m still hoping for a MM to put me to shame in the meters.

[@stephenschober227]

What site is he looking at?

[@robinenbernhard]

Warcraftlogs www.warcraftlogs.com

[@jamesraab214]

Where’s this data from?

[@euterboy184]

warcraftlogs, overall performance. if you are looking for more accurate data look at individual fights, since cleave god classes are kinda getting super padded on some fights and do meh on single target (except for UH DK)

[@clout6209]

balance druid need their lego to do any kind of dps single target no ? from what ive watched

[@Frostshokula]

Exactly. Ppl say nerf the leggo but if they go overboard the single target and overall will drop by a lot.

[@tanner9658]

Convoke the spirits lends quite a bit to single target too

[@Frostshokula]

@@tanner9658 Because of the leggo

[@ic3t3ap3ach]

yep pretty much that. balance of all thing or what that is called is needed to be decent at single target

[@Mboyd203]

Eventually my fury dps will be competitive

[@leosippola5874]

Once we get mastery & and if blizz decides to change things up yeah

[@JohnSmith-yx8kf]

I love how Unholy, regardless of how melee unfriendly a fight is, just brute forces its way into be useful lol. It’s still going to be top tier after the nerf. My only issue with UH is that I find it’s not easy to play when you’re learning mechanics.

[@mack8668]

It's because UH DK damage is from minions.

[@andrewdiana7955]

@@mack8668 can confirm. I'm new to retail and made an UH DK 2 weeks ago and I'm still learning how to not get my butt kicked.

[@jeroenverschaeve3090]

Huntsman Altimore is basically useless to analyse because the stacking damage increase on the adds pads dps like crazy

[@alphanecha]

But they dont really count in logs. I did 11k in bossfight but logged just around 3.5 K

[@jeroenverschaeve3090]

@@alphanecha Aha that's interesting, good to hear that they adapted

[@TheKingRiku]

Demonology isn't in the bottom ten... honestly feels like a win at this point.

[@NatesMiniatures]

ikr!

[@robinenbernhard]

Haha

[@Camphouse_]

I've been beating out a lot of classes with demo. I do get beat out by balance and unholy though.

[@kevinhudson4919]

Sub won’t be broken as the hp and armor increases throughout the expansion

[@charlesborowski6491]

They need to just let sub be busted for an expansion after they absolutely gutted us last xpac

[@ziggs123]

🤣🤣 sub is absolutely broken, so much that every noob is rerolling sub. Your nerf is coming, just a question of time.

[@marcboulos]

@@ziggs123 what do you mean in pvp yes sure but in pve it is definitely not broken strong but not broken !

[@ziggs123]

@@marcboulos yes but he is talking about pvp. I dont really care if something is op in pve, they are in my team to kill a npc, why would I bitch about that 🤣

[@MintyCoffee]

@@ziggs123 But sub isn't a noob's spec, if you're shit at managing your shadow dance uptime you're going to get fucked over against any decent player.

[@ecirelyk]

Watch ret paladins the first week of mythic, the numbers they're putting out right now are WITHOUT their BiS legendary.

[@Wallcl0ck]

As a paladin, dont draw attention to us 👀 we good right now :) good enough to be brought, bad enough to not get nerfed

[@derwaat3623]

Which spec would you say is the best pally spec atm ? (from a raiders perspective, not really into PvP)

[@TheCaffin8ed]

I don’t see why they assassination needs a buff when they have two other specs with one near the top quarter. Warriors have no top spec. They are behind all other tanks and most dps on single target.

[@Curexe]

facts

[@mattbagley2496]

Not sure if troll

[@bi0lizard1]

Yup. I took a chance and rolled a warrior. I see an unsub in my immediate future!

[@HighgroundAnakin]

I just wanna play Sin rogue, how bout that?

[@Valkaneer]

Ya know, this is the kind of rhetoric I really dislike. /sarcasm no, not them, me me me me!!!! Seriously, STFU! Every spec that is doing poorly should get some balance buffs. Stop crying that some other spec shouldn't get buff and they should stay a mile behind everyone else.

[@Mahhdeus]

i have not faught against a sub rouge bc i could not even press a button before beeing completely deleted

[@mort6578]

Covenants dug them into another balance hellhole. My Frost DK AoE damage is off the charts rn because im Night Fae but stuff like this will not show in statistics.

[@Enavi94]

What's the name of that website?

[@paulwahtel7200]

www.warcraftlogs.com/

[@Suminod]

It might be like DH if say Prot was great like VDH is but all the warrior specs are pretty bad so it’s really why bring any warrior

[@tarheelskk]

I’ve been having a great time because I’m a shadow priest

[@odinmaveth6224]

Destro burst needs a buff as our sustain is awful

[@Kagarin05]

Im doing pretty well as arms war with condemn /shrug

[@findmyspot888]

Yeah with condemn doing around 50+% of your damage. Super good

[@keenzo1998]

you can look at the stats. They dont lie lol youre bottom tier /shrug

[@Kagarin05]

@@findmyspot888 just like my 2h fury war in classic warrior. execute reigns supreme lol

[@MintyCoffee]

@@keenzo1998 These stats don't matter when I'm consistently in the top 3-4 dps of raids I'm in.

[@keenzo1998]

@@MintyCoffee then your dps is garbage lol, rankings dont mean anything if your raid sucks